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Obama and the Gun Lobby: A Policy of Appeasement?

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beevul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 10:23 PM
Original message
Obama and the Gun Lobby: A Policy of Appeasement?
Obama and the Gun Lobby: A Policy of Appeasement?

Brady Center Vice President and Author of Lethal Logic (Potomac Books 2009)
Posted: September 15, 2009 11:31 AM

Is it a stretch to envision President Obama as the Neville Chamberlain of the gun issue? Consider the record so far. The President broke his campaign pledge to seek repeal of a set of Bush-supported appropriations riders (the "Tiahrt Amendments") that have weakened the Brady Act and other federal gun laws. Despite his personal commitment to voting rights for District of Columbia residents, Obama was silent as the NRA held the voting rights bill hostage to its vision of the District with virtually no gun laws. With not a syllable uttered in protest, the President signed credit card reform legislation laden with Senator Coburn's ridiculous amendment to allow loaded guns in national parks. When Attorney General Holder and Secretary of State Clinton suggested that strengthening U.S. gun laws may well help to reduce the arming of Mexican drug cartels with American guns, they were silenced. Then, in surely the most bizarre example, when protesters started showing up near the President's speeches with loaded guns, instead of condemning the practice, the White House responded that it had no problem with it as long as local laws were not being violated.

The guiding principle of the Obama gun policy seems to be: whatever happens, don't rile up the gun guys.

Of course, it is worth noting that the gun guys are determined to get riled up, no matter how weak the administration is on guns. The NRA's "Obama is coming to get your guns" message has continued unabated, inspiring record breaking gun sales despite the administration's "do nothing, say nothing" approach.

The real problem, of course, is that there is no end to the gun lobby's demands. The more you feed the beast, the more it will want. Yesterday, it was eviscerating D.C.'s gun laws and allowing guns in Yosemite; tomorrow it will be limiting ATF's power to crack down on corrupt gun dealers. The forces of reason in the Senate narrowly blocked the NRA's attempt to weaken state restrictions on carrying of concealed weapons, but this wretched proposal will no doubt be back in some form.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dennis-a-henigan/obama-an...


The "Tiahrt Amendments" have weakened the Brady Act and other federal gun laws? How so, I ask.

Beyond that...unless a person or organization is convinced that the gun lobby is the cause of the gun violence that the brady bunch is supposedly against,
(and lets be real here, it ISN'T) WHY would the gun lobby need any staring down?

And note the nice touch referring to nationwide concealed carry reciprocity being a "wretched proposal".

Oh, and the fearmongering about incrementalism.


They aren't even making an honest effort to hide it anymore, folks.


Its about the guns, not whats being done with them and more importantly what isn't - as far as the bradys are concerned.

Just as it is with the brady report cards:

They're all about the peripherals rather than particulars.







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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:40 PM
Response to Original message
1. K&R Was in the process of a reply but Firefox crashed. (n/t)
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Irreverend IX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 01:04 AM
Response to Original message
2. Face it, antis, Obama needs you like a fish needs a bicycle.
No one will withhold their vote for Obama because he didn't ban any guns. Well, okay, maybe two or three of the Bradys' most die-hard true believers. But most people who want more gun restrictions have a bunch of things higher up on their political wishlists. If Obama does promote and sign a new AWB or somesuch, he'll lose a lot of votes. It's easy to do the math.
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DonP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 08:48 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. "Well, okay, maybe two or three of the Bradys' most die-hard true believers."
But then again that accounts for their entire dues paying membership though.

You hit it right on the head.

With crime still going down steadily he's smart enough to realize that there's no political profit in attacking a large and politically active part of the voters for no real gain.

His administration has carefully avoided the rush by the gun control "true believers" to try and use every incident as an excuse to push for more "90's style gun control. He may not convert the hard core gun owners, but he won't give them anything real to push against either.
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Euromutt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 02:26 AM
Response to Original message
3. Pot, meet kettle
The real problem, of course, is that there is no end to the gun lobby's demands. The more you feed the beast, the more it will want.

Oh irony, thy name is Henigan!
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GreenStormCloud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 09:00 AM
Response to Original message
5. The "Gun Lobby" is composed of millions of voters. N/T
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DonP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. That is an excellent and often ignored point.
The anti gun people seem to be stuck on the simplistic idea that the Gun Lobby consists of a lot of huge, multi Billion $ corporations that are trying to sell more guns and reap huge profits from the ensuing violence that always results when people buy guns - supposedly anyway. The same way they seem to refuse to accept that crime and violence is at a 20 year low.

It's a very small industry by any standard with only a handful of companies supporting their lobbying group the NSSF.

I guess it's easier (if you're ignorant or just plain stupid) to demonize some amorphous corporate entity than accept that it's really made up of the people that live next door to you, teach your kid, staff your local firehouse, work at the local hospital, does your accounting and taxes etc.

The real political power behind the "gun lobby" - the NRA, GOA and all 50 of the individual State rifle or gun associations, comes from a growing and very active membership that votes like clockwork.

Here in Illinois we had over 5,000 people in Springfield in March representing 1.6 million Illinois gun owners. That was one of the largest demonstrations they had in three years down there the local police told us. The gun control folks may not like it, but they ignore all those voters and all the people they influence at their own political peril.
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TheWraith Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. The gun manufacturers would probably prefer a new Assault Weapons Ban.
It would give them an excuse to hike prices through the roof, just like the "Obama is going to take your guns" fearmongering did. Nobody's going to pay $1000 for an AK knockoff and $1500 for an AR-15 if they're not panicked.
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Treo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. The problem W/ a new AWB
Is that the grabbers learned from the last one. The current bill, which keeps dying in committee, would effectively ban all semiautomatic weapons based on action not cosmetics. There would also be no guarantee that such a ban would allow for a grandfather clause if Diane Fienstien had anything to say about it, it wouldnt.

Not to say that you, in any way, support a new AWB I just thought the above was worth pointing out

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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-18-09 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. That will work, attempt to ban all semi-auto action firearms...
Edited on Fri Sep-18-09 06:01 PM by spin
that would piss off probably 70 million firearm owners who own semi-auto firearms in one form or another.

If those seventy million people showed up at the polls at the next election, the result would be a blood bath for many Democratic Congressional candidates. Those from the ultra liberal anti-gun sections of the country might survive.

Even the rumor of such a ban would spell total disaster for the Democratic party.

Now I like revolvers although I own several semi-auto pistols. My rifles are bolt action. I am current thinking of buying a 12 gauge shotgun called a coach gun for self defense. It's far from semi-auto, in fact it is about as simple as you can get.





I like simple. But I also respect the opinions of other gun owners, most of whom prefer semi-auto weapons.

edited to reduce size of shotgun graphic
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Treo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-18-09 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Hopefully it wouldn't be a strictly Democrat bloodbath
I would hope any representative that supported it was voted out
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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-18-09 07:03 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. I believe that most politicians of either party...
who voted for a ban on semi-auto weapons would be booted from office, with the exception of those from very liberal anti-gun areas.

The republicans have often acted like friends of gun owners but they often speak with a forked tongue.

John McCain was never popular with gun owners.

Sen. John McCain Trying to Kill the Armed Pilots Provision
-- Tell him to renounce his anti-gun ways
Gun Owners of America E-Mail/FAX Alert
8001 Forbes Place, Suite 102, Springfield, VA 22151
Phone: 703-321-8585 / FAX: 703-321-8408

(Wednesday, November 14, 2001) -- Gun Owners of America warned you last month about Sen. John McCain of Arizona who was trying to kill the armed pilots amendment. He failed then, but now he's at it again.

As you know, both houses of Congress passed airline safety legislation with an armed pilots amendment. Under normal circumstances -- when both houses agree in principle on an issue -- that guarantees that the provision will remain in the final version of the bill. Unfortunately, Sen. McCain is on the conference committee which is tasked with ironing out the differences between the two versions, and he is reportedly trying to strip out the armed pilots language.

It is imperative that EVERYBODY get in touch with Sen. John McCain. Normally, GOA does not encourage people to contact legislators from other states. It only makes sense to lobby the congressmen that represent you. But in this case, it is appropriate for you to contact McCain. Even if he tells you that he doesn't answer mail from other states, remember one thing: John McCain is a Presidential candidate. He has national aspirations, and that means he wants to represent you no matter where you live.

ACTION: Please use the pre-written letter below to help direct your comments to Sen. McCain.
http://gunowners.org/a111401.htm


I suggest you read the letter. Blunt and to the point.
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Treo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-18-09 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. I've read it. I don't trust ANY of them
To be perfectly honest I voted for George the second twice. Then I got smart. Bush would have signed the AWB2 I mentioned above and stated so publicly. Personally, I dont trust anyone whos in office right now from either side of the aisle. Thats why Im a single-issue voter. No matter what else you do as long as I have a gun I can fight back if it gets too bad.
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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-18-09 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Politicians and used car salesmen are very similar...
only reporters on the main stream news are lower on the ladder.
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SteveM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-21-09 01:05 AM
Response to Reply #13
21. That looks somewhat like a Stevens. I have a Model 311D...
got it for $240, in excellent shape. They made a "law enforcement" type which had a short barrel like the shotgun pictured. Very reliable, no looseness (even though made in 1955). Can handle "max" loads and slugs if you can.
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Treo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. The "Gun Lobby" is composed of millions of voters, from BOTH sides of the aisle NT
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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 01:49 PM
Response to Original message
10. Obama might be anti-gun but he is also pragmatic...
He has far more important items on his plate than pushing gun control.

Now is not the time or the place.
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Euromutt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Bingo!
Obama, very simply, has better things to do, and he's not interested in squandering political capital on gun control that isn't going to achieve anything except placate a segment of voters who aren't going to vote Republican anyway, while losing a bunch of swing votes and turning 2010 into 1994 II: Return of the Newt.
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gorfle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-18-09 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
12. The best quote of the article...
"The guiding principle of the Obama gun policy seems to be: whatever happens, don't rile up the gun guys."

This is why I smile every time I write my check to the NRA. It works.

Thankfully, President Obama has enough on his plate with health care rather than taking on firearms.
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GreenStormCloud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-19-09 08:24 AM
Response to Original message
18. Appeasement? Nope. It just means that Obama isn't stupid.
He is having a hell of a fight getting badly needed helth care. Trying for greater gun control would be guaranteed to fail and would cost him support in the next election.
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Euromutt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-19-09 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Appeasement isn't even the right word
That is, I presume Henigan uses the term "appeasement" in the sense of "making make overtures and often undue concessions to satisfy the demands of someone with a greed for power, territory, etc." as with Chamberlain at Hitler. But when an elected official is forced to bow to the desires of the voters, we don't call that "appeasement," we call that "democracy."
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GreenStormCloud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-19-09 08:15 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Truth indeed. N/T
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