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GUNS IN THE NEWS--October 7, 2003

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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 07:42 AM
Original message
GUNS IN THE NEWS--October 7, 2003
As CO Liberal sez: "feel free to add any CURRENT stories to this thread by replying to this message. Stories should be posted to the 'Net within the past 24 hours, or a follow-up to a story that was previously posted on the J/PS board."
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 07:45 AM
Response to Original message
1. Student Shot On School Bus
"A ride on a Detroit school bus took a frightening turn Monday when a gun went off, injuring a student, Local 4 reported.
Police say a 17-year-old student was shot in the leg while riding on a bus en route from Randolph Vocational Training Center to Detroit City High School.
Police say it did not appear to be an accidental shooting, based on the angle that the bullet entered the teen's leg. "

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ibsys/20...
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 07:45 AM
Response to Original message
2. Gun Owner Kills Grocery Guard
"PLANTATION -- It was after midnight when Broward Sheriff's detectives showed up at Nativida Barthelemy's front door. They told her that her husband had been shot to death in a grocery store robbery.
"They said, `Ma'am, I'm sorry. They killed your husband,'" she recalled. Everything else was a blur.
Saturday was the second day on the job for security guard Yonel Barthelemy, 42, a father of three. He had been on duty for only a few hours at Stile's Farmers Market, at 5920 Oakland Park Blvd. in Lauderhill, when two gunmen arrived at 8 p.m. Barthelemy was shot during the robbery, and two other employees were hurt.
Investigators issued a "be on the lookout" alert for three armed men carrying a Tech-9 gun and heading toward Inverrary."

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=416&nci...
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 08:55 AM
Response to Original message
3. Child Shoots Up Bridal Shower
"ROCHESTER, N.Y. -- A 15-year-old boy has been charged with assault, accused of playing with a gun at a baby shower that fired and hit a 14-year-old girl.
"They were showing off the gun, according to witnesses. All of a sudden, a shot rang out," Capt. Bob Johansson told the Rochester Democrat and Chronicle. "It was totally accidental."
Johansson said he had no idea why people were passing the gun around at the bridal shower. "

http://www.newsday.com/news/local/wire/ny-bc-ny-brf--sh...

<sarcasm>Why, doesn't Captain Johansson know? Guns make families SAFER!</sarcasm>
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
4. Gun Owner Kills Fellow Hunter
" A Stephensville man was killed in an apparent hunting accident Sunday on Avoca Island.
St. Mary Sheriff David Naquin said deputies responded to the 4:23 p.m. call and were told that Jacob Gros, 19, was accidentally shot in the chest by another member of the hunting group."

http://www.nola.com/newsflash/louisiana/index.ssf?/base...
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
5. Gun Owner Solves Domestic Dispute
"Authorities say an incident in which a Lauderdale County man was shot to death this weekend stemmed from a domestic dispute.
Robbin Morgan, 46, was shot with a handgun and was pronounced dead at the scene near his home about 1:55 a.m. Sunday, coroner Clayton Cobler said."

http://www.clarionledger.com/news/0310/07/m12.html
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RoeBear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Thanks for the...
...defensive gun use story.
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. Yeah, Koresh forbid
the landlord call the cops or anything...
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DoNotRefill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:16 AM
Response to Reply #9
15. When did the cops get teleport devices?
Do you know how easy it is to kick in the door of a mobile home? If he'd called the cops and waited for them to respond, she'd probably be dead.
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. Why not just start blasting, eh?
"Do you know how easy it is to kick in the door of a mobile home?"
Not as easy as it is to dial 9-1-1.
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DoNotRefill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:54 AM
Response to Reply #18
22. Look...
the woman had been beaten badly enough to have to go to the hospital, left her house, went to another house, sought sanctuary, was given sanctuary, and then this idiot tries to break in to get at her. If that's not a case of defense of others, what the fuck IS? Did the guy have to let her die before he did anything?
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. 9-1-1..
....but hey, that's not as much fun as plugging somebody, is it, refill?
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DoNotRefill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 07:08 PM
Response to Reply #23
36. How long would it take for them to respond?
and would the woman have been dead by then?
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-08-03 07:42 AM
Response to Reply #36
37. Let's not ask that, refill, let's just start shootin'
<sarcasm>After all, YOU can tell who deserves it and who doesn't</sarcasm>

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demsrule4life Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-08-03 07:45 AM
Response to Reply #37
38. In my neck of the woods
average time for police response is 45 minutes. So I will call 911 and keep the line open, and if I have to shoot I will have that much more protection in court.
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-08-03 08:16 AM
Response to Reply #38
39. And do you live near this trailer park, dems?
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DoNotRefill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 10:06 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. I guess you think the proper response....
was to let the man break into the landlord's home and beat his wife to death?

Sounds like the right guy got shot...and I doubt the shooter (a third party to the dispute) will be indicted.
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. "Sounds like the right guy got shot"
And if not, so what, eh, refill?
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DoNotRefill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. Are you suggesting that domestic abusers....
who are trying to break into another person's house to harm a woman are somehow unworthy of being shot to prevent the death or maiming of that woman?

I have no sympathy for slack-jawed yokels who think it's ok to beat their wives...frankly, they deserve to be shot if they will not stop. A woman's life is every bit as important as her male abuser's life. If one of them has to die, I'd rather it's the abuser.
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. Gee, refill...
Tell it to Tim Emerson....

"I have no sympathy for slack-jawed yokels who think it's ok to beat their wives..."
Unless they've got guns, evidently. Then the rKBA crowd holsds them up as posterboys.

"A woman's life is every bit as important as her male abuser's life."
And calling the cops is never an option in RKBA fantasyland.
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DoNotRefill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. The cop's job...
is to collect the bodies and then make an arrest. They've never been proactive.


BTW, are you saying Tim Emerson beat his wife?
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. Surrrrrre, refill
<sarcasm>Cops NEVER deal with domestic disputes. </sarcasm>

Who are you trying to kid?
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Spoonman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 09:58 AM
Response to Original message
7. Great new gun control law
The new law makes it a misdemeanor for law enforcement to disclose names of holders of concealed gun permits issued by Missouri sheriffs starting Oct. 11.

http://www.therolladailynews.com/articles/2003/10/06/ne...
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 10:53 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. Amazingly irresponsible
""There is no need for the public to know who has a permit," said NRA spokeswoman Kelly Hobbs. "
Yeah, koresh forbid that somebody find out that the mentally disturbed ex-employee or klan member or domestic abuser they know about is now packing heat. They might tell the cops what sort of specimen is wandering the streets armed.

By the way, isn't it nice to know that the gun industry and the GOP will break laws, spit on the voters and rewrite the laws for as few as 60,000 neurotics?
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. Let's pick your remark apart into bite-sized pieces
Edited on Tue Oct-07-03 11:08 AM by slackmaster
Yeah, koresh forbid that somebody find out that the mentally disturbed...

People who have been ADJUDICATED as mentally disturbed are prohibited from owning guns, but background checks are supposed to pick up that information, so those individuals will not be issued permits.

...ex-employee...

Unemployed people are not prohibited from owning guns.

...or klan member...

Klan members are not prohibited from owning guns.

...or domestic abuser...

Domestic abusers who are under restraining orders are prohibited from owning guns. A background check is supposed to pick up that information, so people under ROs will not be issued permits.

...they know about is now packing heat.

Note that every example MrBenchley suggests hinges on an ordinary citizen's personal opinion that someone is mentally disturbed, a political pariah, or a domestic abuser and therefore should not be issued a permit. That's not how we do things in the USA. We live under rule of law, not rule of quasi-Stalinist denouncements.
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #12
17. Chew on it, slack.
"People who have been ADJUDICATED as mentally disturbed are prohibited from owning guns, but background checks are supposed to pick up that information, so those individuals will not be issued permits."
Yeah, but pretty much everybody knows somebody who hasn't been adjudicated as mentally incompetent and who yet ought not to be paccking guns. I know people who are so demented as to insist blind people ought to be armed, for example.

"Unemployed people are not prohibited from owning guns."
But disgruntled ex-employees sometimes turn up at their former workplace and begin shooting at other workers at random. It would be a shame if those current employees got a heads-up when someone like that showed up....they might be able to at least take cover and where's the fun in that, eh, slack?

"Klan members are not prohibited from owning guns."
Hell, they clog the aisles at gun shows. I doubt there's many more fervent defenders of phony "gun rights" than the Klan. Who doesn't feel safer knowing they're also packing heat? Well, pretty much every decent person doesn't feel safer.

"Domestic abusers who are under restraining orders are prohibited from owning guns."
And domestic abusers who are not can run around with a hidden gun, and the family members can be kept clueless...until its too late.

"Note that every example MrBenchley suggests hinges on an ordinary citizen's personal opinion that someone is mentally disturbed, a political pariah, or a domestic abuser and therefore should not be issued a permit."
Whereas you have the Pollyanna-ish suggestion that the sort of lowlife disturbed person who seeks to carry a gun will be, in fact, not the ones that will be carrying them....

"That's not how we do things in the USA. We live under rule of law"
Gee, which side was it that violated Army regulations and overturned a referendum to arm 60,000 loonies and lowlifes? Oh yeah, that was the RKBA crowd and the GOP...
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:51 AM
Response to Reply #17
21. Nice try, but you haven't addressed any of my comments
Yeah, but pretty much everybody knows somebody who hasn't been adjudicated as mentally incompetent and who yet ought not to be paccking guns.

Read my comments again. We live under rule of law, not rule of MrBenchley thinks you're crazy therefore you can't get a CCW permit.

I know people who are so demented as to insist blind people ought to be armed, for example.

Cite, please.

"Klan members are not prohibited from owning guns."
Hell, they clog the aisles at gun shows. I doubt there's many more fervent defenders of phony "gun rights" than the Klan. Who doesn't feel safer knowing they're also packing heat? Well, pretty much every decent person doesn't feel safer.


OK, so your agenda is all about feeling safer. Let's all sing along:

Feeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeelings...

"Domestic abusers who are under restraining orders are prohibited from owning guns."
And domestic abusers who are not can run around with a hidden gun, and the family members can be kept clueless...until its too late.


And lack of a concealed weapons permit is going to discourage someone who is determined to commit violent crimes against his or her own family... ...How?

"Note that every example MrBenchley suggests hinges on an ordinary citizen's personal opinion that someone is mentally disturbed, a political pariah, or a domestic abuser and therefore should not be issued a permit."
Whereas you have the Pollyanna-ish suggestion that the sort of lowlife disturbed person who seeks to carry a gun will be, in fact, not the ones that will be carrying them....


This begs the question - Are you saying that it's not possible for background checks to screen out people who shouldn't be issued concealed-weapons permits? They seem to be working quite well in about 42 states right now. Where is all the violent crime being committed by people abusing their permitted, concealed guns MrBenchley?

"That's not how we do things in the USA. We live under rule of law"
Gee, which side was it that violated Army regulations and overturned a referendum to arm 60,000 loonies and lowlifes? Oh yeah, that was the RKBA crowd and the GOP...


No Army regulations were violated. Get over it.


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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. Addressed them all, slack...
and it's wonderful to see a member of the RKBA crowd sticking up for scumbag Republicans AGAIN.

"State Sen. Jon Dolan, a Republican and a major in the Army National Guard, had been serving at Guantanamo Bay for only two weeks, and military regulations say a newly deployed soldier must be on duty at least two months before getting a leave.
Also at issue is whether Dolan violated federal law and military regulations by performing duties of his political office while on active military duty. The rules apply to a reserve officer serving on active duty under a call to active duty of more than 270 days. "

http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGANL2GUIKD.html
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. A gratuitous denial and a Red Herring to boot
Nice attempt at distraction. I doubt anyone besides you is buying it.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #25
29. All your post that "bit" required
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #29
32. Third time's a charm
I knew you could post something that didn't violate the board rules if you tried hard enough.
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Spoonman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #17
31. You are right,
and a I see your anti RKBA logic in this.

We should disclose the names of abusive spouses and disgruntled ex-employees with permits.

This way everyone with any concerns can make sure they are equally armed!

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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #31
33. Tell it to google, spoon...
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a2birdcage Donating Member (275 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. Yes, nice to know!
"By the way, isn't it nice to know that the gun industry and the GOP will break laws, spit on the voters and rewrite the laws for as few as 60,000 neurotics?"

By the way, isn't it nice to know that the anti-freedom lovers continue to make efforts to disarm the law-abiding firearms owner (which there are millions of) because .000033% of the US population is murdered with a gun each year. A good percentage of these people were convicted criminals shot by convicted criminals.

It sure is nice to know.
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 01:45 PM
Response to Original message
26. Gun Owners Wound Two, Shoot At Kids
"A group of men shot a father and son outside their home, then opened fire on a park filled with children during the weekend, police said.
The father and son, identified by friends as John Salcido Sr., and John "Pee-Wee" Salcido Jr., 20, were expected to survive.
Both men were shot in the shoulder at about 5:30 p.m. Sunday as they were standing in their front yard, according to Madera County Sheriff's Department reports.
The assailants then drove into the city and shot into McNally Park, near where a group of children were playing."

http://www.bayarea.com/mld/cctimes/news/6951726.htm
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
30. Shooting Near God's Bible College
"Police are looking for suspects in a shooting late Monday near a small college campus in the Tri-State.
The shooting happened at about 10 p.m. on Ringgold Street in Mt. Auburn near God's Bible College, WLWT Eyewitness News 5 reported.
The victim's name was not released. Police said he was shot in the leg and stomach. "


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ibsys/20...
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 03:52 PM
Response to Original message
34. Gun Owner Shoots Up Hospital
"MURFREESBORO, Tenn. - An employee opened fire in an office at the Veterans Affairs medical complex Tuesday morning but no one was hit, authorities said.
The man was taken into custody after he fired three shots inside the personnel resources office of Alvin C. York Veterans Affairs Medical Center, left the building and fired again outside, VA spokeswoman Molly Reynolds said.
The unidentified man is a VA employee who doesn't work in the building where the shooting occurred. "

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20031...
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MrBenchley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-07-03 04:19 PM
Response to Original message
35. Gun Owner Kills Kansas City Man
"Police said a man was shot several times in the 2900 block of Prospect Avenue Monday night.
The victim, identified as Larry E. White, 24, died Tuesday at a hospital. No arrests have been made in the case. Anyone with information on the killing can call the TIPS Hotline at (816) 474-TIPS. "


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ibsys/20...
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