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Isn't Abu Ghraib a crime scene? What about forensic evidence?

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Syncronaut Seven Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 10:53 AM
Original message
Isn't Abu Ghraib a crime scene? What about forensic evidence?
Didn't they spill Nick Berg's blood on those floors?
Shouldn't we preserve the prison for the inevitable war crimes tribunal?

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Tim4319 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 10:58 AM
Response to Original message
1. I'm sure it is spotless now!
I am sure any evidence that may have been left behind is all cleaned up by now.
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gatlingforme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-04 08:13 AM
Response to Reply #1
7. Lane McCotter is one ot the contributors to this fiasco at this
prison please read: this is a story of Lane McCotters stunt in an American prison
From: Charles Sparks ( )
Subject: Ensure - Utah inmate's last meal
This is the only article in this thread
View: Original Format
Newsgroups: misc.headlines
Date: 1997/04/07

Penn-Pals Prison Inmate Service Network

Dear friends, please excuse me but I have a great need to inform as many
people as I can and will do whatever means nessessary to do that.

The following was sent to me, it is genuine and true. I have
not divulged the senders name for fear of reprisals which after reading
this you will understand why. The following is not easy to read. It was
not easy to type. Your personal effort to rebroadcast this is vital.

Pray and work or work and pray, take your pick.

Thank you
Charles Sparks

Received from within the Utah State Prison, Draper Utah.

Received: April, 1997

Enduring the Tortures of Prison

As I was in the process of writing this plea to the world when a
sad thing occurred
here in the Utah State Prison. In fact it had to do with the very thing
this paper is about.

On March 21, 1997, Michael Valent, who was a prisoner, died
shortly after being
released from "the chair" after spending what the prison officials say
was 16 hours in it.

Four days in this instrument of torture are not uncommon.

Well we all know that after committing a crime of whatever degree,
a person
enters prison by way of the justice system. At this time the prisoner
usually pleads guilty
thereby saving the courts time and the taxpayers money. Punishment is
then affixed, a
certain number of years, fines, etc.

In the Utah State Prison this is not the case. The punishments
continue to be
assessed long after a person enters the gates. The prison officials (O.
Lane McCotter;
Director, and J. Terry Bartlett; Deputy Director) have instituted a very
mean little behavior
modification system. The whole prison system is so obsessed with
control that it has
affected and changed personalities to where they have become anal
retentive in nature.

We all know that the 8th Amendment of the United States
Constitution says "nor
cruel and unusual punishment be inflicted". The Utah State Constitution
is in line with
this. Only Utah further states that "persons arrested or imprisoned
shall not be treated with
unnecessary rigor". Very humane isn't it? As we all know preaching and
practicing do not
often coincide.

I'm in the Utah State Prison's (USP) Control Unit, Unita I,
prisoners are treated
unnecessary rigor and cruel punishment daily. Let me give you some
examples of what we
are experiencing in The Control Unit.

Prisoners housed in the Control Unit are subjected to sensory
deprivation, no
human contact except for speaking that is allowed during the few hours
out of cell time
during the week. Two sections don't even have this.

When a prisoner goes out to see a caseworker, doctor's assistant,
or clergy
member, he is handcuffed behind the back, shackled at the feet and
chained to the wall.
There are no television or radios unless a person can afford it, few
can. They are denied
newspapers, magazines and books. There is no type of motor activity. We
are talking about
people who spend years in this type of environment. Communication with
the outside
world has been steadily cut off.

I have witnessed the Nazi like actions of the goon squad, with
support from the
other guards and administrative staff. They run in on a prisoner, who
most of the time is
non-violent, and tackles him. They then handcuff, shackle, put a hood
over their head, hook
a leash to them and finally drag them off to Section 4.

It's not finished this is through. When the prisoner is brought
here he is stripped
naked and placed in a cell that is completely enclosed. The only thing
visible is the inside
of the cell.

The unlucky ones get placed in one of two torture devices called
"The Chair" or
"The Board". These instruments come right out of those 19th Century
insane asylums. A
person is strapped in so that the only moveable part of the body is the
head. The person is
kept in these for many days. They are feed liquid Ensure, water three
times a day, maybe 6
ounces, and often must live in his own excrement. The A.C.L.U. is
attempting to file a
civil action against the D.O.C. for this type of torture as you read
this. Not to mention
investigate the death of Michael Valent on March 21, 1997 who wasn't
able to endure the
torture of "The Chair".

(Note: A diagram of the "The Chair" accompanied this report and it
illustrates that the
person strapped in is reclined slightly, apprx. 30 degrees, the torture
is the lack of head
support that must be sustained for the duration. The same for "The
Board" only the victim
is laid flat with no head support.)

Mass punishment is also practiced by the officials in the U.S.P.
For instance, if
one or two persons cause a commotion, the officials will turn off
everyone's water, block
the windows, put everyone on short rations of food (denying liquids to
drink) and not give
showers. I was involved in just such a situation that lasted three days.

You must also be made aware that in this control unit only one
person is out at
any given time. Not much chance for a major disturbance or riot. And it
is common
practice to punish prisoners enmass. Added to this is the sleep
deprivation caused by
guards who bang on doors and shine lights in the eyes during the middle
of the night.

It has also been reported to me by several of the prisoners in this
control unit that
a form of psychological manipulation is being performed on them called
This manipulation is often augmented by psychotropic drug enhancement.

Many of the prisoners currently housed in this Control Unit, and
who are subject
to these punitive and degrading measures shouldn't be here. This is
suppose to be for the
troublesome, violent and out of control. I contend 30% - 40% do not
belong or fall under
this category.

There is plenty more but I will stop here. Affidavits can be
produced. The things I
relate here are well known and supported by prison policy. And of
course, the A.C.L.U.
should have many reports on the abuses.

I wrote to the Salt Lake Tribune about these same things, as well
as "The Chair",
but they ignored my pleading's and warnings. This was some two months
ago. They did,
however, cover the story on the chair after a death occurred.

I guess what I'm looking for is that the public not support these
types of human
rights abuses. Not only here in Utah, but all over the U.S. It used to
be that we only heard
of such maltreatments of prisoners in countries we saw as our enemies.
Countries like
China, South Africa, Russia or some in South America. Have we turned
into the enemy

If you have questions or concerns please direct them at those

1) O. Lane McCotter, Director
2) J. Terry Bartlett, Deputy Director
3) Hank Galetka, Warden

c/o Utah State Prison
P.O. Box 250
Draper, Utah 84020

end of transcript

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seventhson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 10:59 AM
Response to Original message
2. Yes - Check out my poll on the subject here:

Almost all agree with you...

I, as an attorney and investigator, certainly do
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Veggie Meathead Donating Member (999 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 11:02 AM
Response to Original message
3. In my opinion, so was Ground Zero..Look what happened to the
evidence there.
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fryguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 11:05 AM
Response to Original message
4. why do you think shrub said he's going to buldoze it?
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mark11727 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Yup... I think Sharon's got the contract on it, though.
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namvet73 Donating Member (294 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
6. 'W' Specializes in building new prisons.
Prisons and executions are part of his resume.

History is just repeating itself.

Two of the things that scared me most about 'W' before he was (S)elected
were his refusal to answer the "did you do drugs" question (accountability and candor)
and his record of use of prisons in Texas.

Why so many people (even Republicans) ignored these ominous signs is totally beyond me. It was very prophetic!

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