Question..decisions, decisions. (re: investing in an eco-friendly vehicle)

[Dover]

What is the most likely NEXT technology for fueling/running auto vehicles beyond the current hybrids?

I ask because I've heard differing opinions about fuel cell technology although it seems that we certainly have invested in those companies pretty heavily for it to all be a ruse.

But biodiesel is the real puzzle for me. It seems as though it should be the next best step because it can be made for use in existing diesel vehicles and could easily be sold at existing stations... and from what I can tell is not so costly to produce that it could be competitive in price to existing fuels.

So what am I missing here (beyond the current auto-industry's resistance to full out change)?

[No Mandate Here.]

1. According to * and his Corporatist Aliies,

you should be getting a vehicle that weighs at least 6,000 pounds and gets gas mileage in the teens (going downhill). These are the vehicles that get you the best tax advantage. Screw those pinko, seventh generation environmentalist types! (sarcasm off)

More seriously, the same corporatists are publishing these warm and fuzzy ads and press releases touting hydrogen vehicles. The photo op that Ahnold was in was a sham- the hydrogen powered Hummer would only go a few miles between fills. That will sure solve a lot.

I am a remodeling contractor, and gave up the big pick up truck, because I realized that I was only going for materials when I forgot something on the deliveries, and switched to a Passat wagon. This doubled my mileage from 15 to 30, so I feel like I was doing my part.

The longest of journeys begins with but a single step.

[papau]

2. Federal welfare makes corn, etc cheap - bio diesel with bio via

crops that do not suck up federal and state welfare might be an interesting item to price out.

Of course transporting the crop for conversion, converting, and transporting fuel to stations, with graphs and energy input/output audit, and economic profit/sales projections, sounds more like a book than someone working on a PHD!

I have not seen any full system reviews for other than fuel cell via H - and here they indicate that H is a crazy, stupid idea!

But I like the college kids running cars on used fast food place french fry cooking oil!

:-)

[htuttle]

3. Diesel is the most flexible fuel-wise

You can substitute an awful lot of different fuels for proper diesel: Regular fuel oil, bio-diesel, blended vegetable oil, etc... Supposedly, they've been made to run on even more unusual fuels during desperate times (cf. stories of pouring Russian vodka into the tank during WWII).

Modern diesels get pretty good mileage, too. One important thing, however: get a European diesel, preferably a Volkswagen. American car manufacturers never really did 'get' the diesel engine. If you live in a northern climate, this is critical since American diesel engines in cars are notorious for being unstartable between December and March. German diesels have never had this problem (in my experience working in and around an auto shop in WI).

[Kellanved]

9. One addition:

Get a Diesel with one of the (relatively) new French ceramic filters. German car makers were forced to adopt those, I guess that also applies to the models for the American market. The filters reduce the carbon-particulate matter emitted, removing the major ecologic drawback of Diesel-engines.

[Dover]

10. Wasn't there a law passed recently regarding the use of diesel filtration?

I seem to recall hearing about that earlier this year.

I wonder how a good filtered diesel measures up to biodiesel as regards pollutants?

I sure wish someone who has knowledge of all these things would do a comparative study of REAL potentials of all these things.

[McGonigle]

11. Biodiesel

Biodiesel does not contribute to increasing atmospheric carbon dioxide.

[Lefty48197]

4. PZEV's (Partial Zero Emission Vehicles)

These don't use a new type of fuel or anything. They use a better catalyic converter, which combines with a better fuel handling system to greatly reduce emissions. I've read that pzev vehicles, while operating with California grade fuels, yields an exhaust that has fewer particulates than the air around Los Angeles.

http://www.driveclean.ca.gov/en/gv/vsearch/cleansearch_result.asp?vehicletypeid=16

[Bamboo]

5. Microcars

America is fascinated with "overcapacity" we want an oven in the kitchen big enough to hold a giant Thanksgiving turkey,the rest of the year it is used for a casserole.We want a giant honeymoon bathtub which is used rarely because we do not have time for a honeymoon since it requires overtime to pay for the tub.We claim extra power is needed to avoid trouble on the road while we are distracted by cell phones.Even lawn mower engines are larger since riding mowers need to haul a fatter owner.If you have too much of everything then your sense of perspective is distorted and reality becomes quite a shock.Microcars are quite shocking to Americans,the technology is not as complicated as hybrids which are a complicated solution to an easy problem-just go on a diet.I got a Prius to let people know that I expect $5 gas and I consider American drivers to be on their final parade lap.Microcars will fit into the food chain for those that like their simplicity and hybrids will attract those that like complexity.I find the latest SUVs to be the last grasp at greatness before the fall like the ending of the movie "Scarface"

[YankeyMCC]

6. I like the idea

of microcars, particularly for the city.

I just don't know if I'm willing to be among the first to drive around in one of these things surronded by all the giant SUV's and Minivans.

In an accident I'm surely to loose. :)

[rustydad]

7. If

If our social order stays intact ( a BIG if) I would see small very light diesels like those sold in Europe and India. They can get close to 100mpg and are cheap to build compared to hybrids. Fuels cells are a complete scam. Snake oil. So is bio fuel. We would need all cropland in the world to produce just a fraction of the oil we burn. No way. For in town short commuting electric vehicles can work. That supposes that we will find ways to keep the grid up and running as natural gas goes away on this continent. Best bet, live in a warm place and ride a bike. Buy cheap blankets while you can. Bob

[cprise]

8. Have a look here

http://www.lupousa.com/

[rustydad]

12. Yes

I had the Lupo in mind. I have gone a bit further for my own transportation needs. I work at home but must attend meetings a few times a week in town wich is 30 miles away. I got a well engeneered motor assist for my mountain bike. So far I have put 2500 miles on it with no problems whatsoever. It uses a high end 25cc 2cycle motor manufactured by Komatsu in Japan. It is very clean meeting CARB standards for 2010. I get between 250 and 300 mpg and travel at 30mph with ease, even up highway grades. It has three speeds for steeper hiles and around town. Weighs 12 pounds and attaches and detaches with ease from the bike. Bob in SoCal where bike riding is a year round possibility.

[Dover]

13. WOW! Why won't they sell it here? With gas prices sky high what better

timing could there be to introduce it in the States?

I like the Polo 5 door too! Thanks for posting!!!

http://www.lupousa.com/vw_polo.htm