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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 06:35 PM
Original message
my mother is freaking narcissistic bitch.
If she weren't my mother, I would have nothing more to do with her!!! :eyes: :eyes:

I know there are people starving, children dying, and bad things all over the world.
My life, I guess, is really easy, when put into perspective. But that doesn't make dealing with her any freaking easier. :banghead:

I had a GREAT Christmas. :toast:
Know why?
Because she wasn't part of it.
And perhaps that would, in the past, make me sad...or drive me crazy because of her freaking insanity all over the holiday.
But this time, my husband and I had the best two days, EVER. BY OURSELVES. :think:

THANK goodness my husband sees through her and has my back.
Here's to good husbands (and wives). :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Sorry for the rant, but it feels good to get it off my chest in an anonymous forum. :rant:


Love you guys.

Hope your New Year is free of narcissistic bitches and slimy assholes....and I really mean that. :fistbump: :hug:


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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 06:38 PM
Response to Original message
1. that is so sad. but with all the hugs, cheers, fistbumps and thumbsup, yea
for you
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Bunny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 06:49 PM
Response to Original message
2. I'm glad you found some peace for the holidays.
I have someone like that and I feel obliged to spend time with him over the holidays. It can really suck the fun right out of the room.
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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. yep...
and for those that haven't had to deal with this kind of situation...
it can really be hard to understand.

It's not popular dislike your mother.
But if any other person treated me the way she treats me, I would never, ever speak to them again!

I hope you have a good 2011.
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Bunny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. You have a good 2011, as well.
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Tikki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 06:51 PM
Response to Original message
3. Oh I understand...and when she left, I felt slightly....
bewildered by the fact that I wasn't sad....just kind of relieved.

Boy and do I know what it's like to have a husband have your back...makes all the difference.
Here, here (or is it hear, hear) to good and kind husbands....

I promise you...you'll find a way to handle this in your heart and brain.

Tikki
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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 06:54 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. thanks...
I'm good. just needed a little DU rant.

Happy New Year
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hippywife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 07:05 PM
Response to Original message
7. The last few years
my mom didn't make the holidays pleasant for anyone. She was very grouchy and mean. Now that I look back on it, it was due to her health which was causing her severe depression, unknown to us at the time.

She died last month and I would give anything to have her back.
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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 08:08 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. I am so sorry for your loss.
Edited on Mon Dec-27-10 08:21 PM by MrsBrady
I don't wish my mother ill will.
If she were gone tomorrow, I would be sad for sure.
But I would probably be sad for what could have been.

I would love nothing more than to have a mother who is compassionate, caring, understanding and emotionally available.
She has never been any of those things to me.
I don't hate her. In fact, I feel sorry for her.
If she wants me to care, then she needs to actually treat me like she gives a crap.

I have tried everything to be a good daughter to her.
I've even gone along with her acting one way in front of everybody and another way when we are alone.
It was very confusing as a child to have your mother go on and on about you in front of others, singing your praises.
How everything is wonderful and beautiful...what a good daughter she has and how she's so lucky to have me.
Be nice to you in front of others. Say all kinds of things about what her plans were, what the two of you were going to do, etc...
But behind closed doors, I could do nothing right. I was not working or studying enough. I wasn't cleaning enough. I had to wait on her hand and foot.
I was Cinderella to my own mother. She would spend thousands of dollars on clothes for herself, while I was walking around with holes in my shoes.
And that's the mild stuff.

Everyone loves my mother. She's the life of the party.
She can be fun, if it's good for her and makes her look good.

No one would have believed me if I told them what she was like with me, when we were alone.
There's only so much a person can take. I've had enough.
In fact, she has gone out of her way to sabotage success in many areas of my life. It's very frustrating for her now that she has so little control over my life.

She's slipping and recently started treating me this way in front of my husband.
He really loved and respected her (like everyone else), until he saw how she's really treated me all these years.
And she recently attempted to sabotage my current employment, with my husband as a witness.
His exact words today were: she's damaged our friendship (meaning the two of them), and I can see now that she will not try to make it right.

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DoBotherMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. I understand
Edited on Mon Dec-27-10 10:39 PM by DoBotherMe
I get the "she's your mother" admonishments. And I reply, "so what?" Abuse is abuse. No one would expect me to stay with or 'understand' an abusive mate. I will do my duty to help her as she ages, but there is no relationship with her.
(((Hugs)))! Dana ; )
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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 12:17 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. agreed. and hugs back at you :)

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siligut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. About treating you one way in public and another in private
It took me until I studied psychology to realize my mother actually had a dissociative disorder. She was similar to yours, and yes it is very confusing to a child, where she wouldn't let anyone else see her cruelty toward me. She had to be this great mother, but she had a deep psychological pain, that she had to release, and she took it out on me. I didn't believe that she really didn't remember the things she said and did, not until I was an adult and saw her dissociate in response to an irrationally stern man. Her father was very stern, and there is more to that but I won't say it here.

What I had to do, is acknowledge that it wasn't me who she was destroying, it was an image, like a serial killer who chooses the same sort of victims, she was trying to alleviate some psychological trauma or experience. I wasn't born some horrible thing, and neither were you, and I can tell you realize this from your post. I also will very much empathize with you about how sad it is ones mother could seek to destroy her own child and then that child not even being able to get support because no one believes you, they think it is your problem. This is because no one wants to believe a mother could treat her child that way. Mothers are supposed to love and cherish their children.
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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 12:31 AM
Response to Reply #10
16. exactly what you said --
yes, I do believe that she has some kind of dissociative malady.
I don't know if it's narcissism...I really haven't tried to analyze it too much... because it doesn't really matter.
But she's 'never' wrong, so would never admit to a problem - so would not ever get help because of course, there's no problem.

What surprised me what that she pulled some crap on my husband, and not just me. She ADORES him.
And well, he is adorable. That's why I married him.
She NEVER wants to look bad to other people - ever.

But I think the temptation/addiction to f with my situation must have overridden her need to be liked by him. Sick and sad.
My husband was sooo sooo surprised at her behavior.


Thanks to my husband and some friends, I have good shoulders and ears. One of my aunts is coming around as well.
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hippywife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #8
28. I do understand how that feels.
Sounds like my dad, but he treats me like crap in public, too. :hug:
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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 11:39 PM
Response to Original message
11. That's where I'm lucky
I can't really complain about anyone in my family, except that my Dad gets a bitch grouchy, but he's old enough where he's allowed. There's no manipulators, selfish people or anything like that.
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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 12:32 AM
Response to Reply #11
17. yes, that is lucky
and I'm also lucky that I was able to mary a guy who's not like either of my parents.

whew!
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quakerboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-10 11:42 PM
Response to Original message
12. Fuggidaboudit
"If she weren't my mother".... Then don't. Like you seem to have, maybe? Why torture yourself? Genetics and family peace are nowhere near good enough in my view.
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murielm99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 12:14 AM
Response to Original message
13. I have a mother like that, too.
And I have a father who enabled her for her entire life. He has dementia now, so he is out of the picture.

My brother and I have about seventeen years of therapy between the two of us. Our youngest brother was the golden child. He sees our parents for who they are, though.

I call my mother once a month. I see her only when with a large group of people. Often, this means meeting at a restaurant or some other place that is not her turf. I set very firm boundaries for her.
Any time I make the mistake of letting down my guard of relaxing the boundaries, she does something to harm me. She is eighty-one, and still trying to be an abusive parent. She tries to treat me like I am a rebellious teenager. It does not work.

I, too, have a very understanding and supportive husband. He saw through her years ago. My adult children are only beginning to see the situation for what it is.

Only recently I learned that many of our relatives have been aware of my mother's mental illness and her abuse of us for years. No one did anything to stop it. I don't hate her, but I am not sure I like any of my aunts and uncles any more. They never said or did a thing. A cousin told my brother, after a recent blowup on my mother's part. This cousin saw through my mother when she was very young. She remembers her parents and some of the other relatives talking about my mother.

My father probably will not live much longer. He is 85 and in poor health. When he is gone, I may break off all contact with my mother. This is for my own mental health. She is already a part of my life less and less.

I understand what you are going through and I sympathize. Therapy helped me a great deal. Maybe some form of therapy might help you, too. And you might find that there are more people out there than you think that know you and her and know that you have gone through pure hell. Stay strong.... :hug:
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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 12:46 AM
Response to Reply #13
19. thanks...
lots of therapy and al-anon here.

I just had a bunch of stuff 'click' lately - about her treatment of me.

I guess I expected her to try to mess with me, but I never expected her to try to mess with my husband.
I won't allow that. And he is sooo done with her.

I knew that she's been treating me badly for years, but somehow seeing her treatment in light of my husbands perspective
gave me new insights. It's really been much, much worse than I ever really realized.
I had a bunch of flash backs a few months ago, remember stuff that I hadn't thought of in years.
It was actually a relief to see things as they have been. All of the separate events over time were somehow finally viewed as one
big event in my mind. Kind of hard to explain, I think.

Anyway, I'm done with her. I'm not really angry...just not willing to be treated like crap. Sooo not willing.

hugs to you.


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Gold Metal Flake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 12:22 AM
Response to Original message
15. Congratulations. You have won a victory for yourself.
I hope you find more peace in future.

Family is optional.
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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 12:50 AM
Response to Reply #15
21. thanks
happy new year
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 12:37 AM
Response to Original message
18. I'm fortunate that I like all my relatives, LOL!
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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. I miss my grandmother.
I just occurred to me the other day that I think my grandmother
let me come stay with her during the summers so that I could have a break from my mother.

This only dawned on me the other day, as I remembered that my grandmother, at one point, wanted
me to come live with them. At least my grandmother did what she could.

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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #20
22. My grandmother died just over a year ago!
My dad's mom. I miss her so much! :-(
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thirtiesgirl Donating Member (148 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 01:46 AM
Response to Original message
23. To the OP:
I can really identify with what you've written. I love my mother, but I don't like her has a person. She's mindlessly conservative, bigoted, homophobic, racist, repressed, and deeply mistrustful of men. She's also very narcissistic, hyper-critical, manipulative, and unable to tolerate anyone else's opinion if it differs from hers. As happens to every child as they grow up, they start developing their own opinions and personalities, separate from their parents. My mom did her best to squash those tendencies in me when I was a young child, and was pretty successful until I was about 13, when the need to differentiate from your parents becomes stronger. My home life during middle school and high school was nearly intolerable because she wouldn't let me *be*. By that I mean that she both wouldn't leave me alone (she constantly violated any privacy I tried to have), and literally wouldn't let me be myself. My thoughts and feelings had to mirror hers or she'd make my life miserable. And since she was a miserable, fearful, repressed woman, I had to lead a pretty miserable, anti-social life in high school.

I left home as soon as I was able and moved some distance away. I still include my mother in my life, but I limit the amount time I spend with her. I talk with her on the phone once or twice a month, and visit her once a year. But I keep my limits and don't spend more time with her than I can stand.

My mother has borderline personality disorder, untreated. She's never had it diagnosed herself since she doesn't trust mental health professionals. I diagnosed her myself (I'm a mental health professional), along with help from my personal therapist who has a lot more experience in the profession than I do. She agrees that my mom has BPD.

I share this here because your mom could be dealing with it, too. I'm just taking a guess, but based on what you've written here, which sounds so similar to things I've experienced with my mom, BPD could be a possibility.

If all you know about borderline personality disorder is Joan Crawford in Mommie Dearest, you're partway on the right track. Borderline personality disorder can manifest in lots of different ways. Meaning, there are lots of different symptoms and people with BPD don't all behave in the same way.

I'd suggest doing some research online and seeing if what you find fits with what you've experienced with your mom. Also check out Christine Lawson's book, Understanding the Borderline Mother, a book for children of mothers with BPD. Lawson divides BPD behaviors into four easily understandable categories, and you may find that your mom fits somewhere among Lawson's four categories.

Again, I could be completely wrong, but I think it's worth looking into, just to see if anything clicks for you. And it may also help you gain understanding into your volatile relationship with her.
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nadine_mn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 04:38 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. are we long lost sisters?
My mom is flat out narcissistic (when I was in therapy my therapist said my mom had a lot of those characteristics). I have borderline personality disorder - from a childhood full of physical, sexual and psychological abuse.

I manage. My maternal grandparents for the most part raised me (I lived with my mom but my grandparents lived across the street and were my daily salvation of normalcy. Shortly before my grandma died, we were talking about my mom and she said "where did we go wrong" I said you raised me too and I came out ok - there was nothing you did.

My mom has alienated her 5 brothers, has been married and divorced 5x, and I am only child. My grandma was worried that my mom (who has legitimate health issues) would be alone, so before my grandma died she made me promise to be there for my mom. I was able to cut all ties with my abusive dad decades ago. I couldn't do that with my mom because I knew it would hurt my grandparents to have us estranged despite how abusive my mom is.

So I limit my contact and remind myself that my mom is not well and no matter what I want in a parent - she can never be that and I was lucky to have 37 yrs of unconditional love from my grandparents.
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rainbow4321 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-10 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #24
34. Toss me into the lost sister ring
Because mine is right up there with both of ya'lls.


There is not a family get together or event that she has not ruined with her self absorbed, attention seeking ways.

We can't think of a family event that she has not try to destroy with her hissy fits.

You know it is bad when you can predict right down to the day (six months in advance) on when "mother" will "become sick".

10 yrs ago my sister was pregnant and when she was about 3 months along we started wondering out loud to each other how our mother would try to ruin things when the baby arrived. I predicted "she will have one of her 'I'm sick, I'm sick, I have to go in the hospital NOW and everyone must pay attention to ME' the week you have the baby".

The ***DAY*** after the baby was born, mom calls my sister who had literally JUST got home with the baby, saying that she was running a 103 fever and was swelling all over and couldn't breath and needed to go to the hospital ASAP...never mind that there were **6 other adult relatives in town** she could have called for help, she calls the family member who just popped out a baby less than 24 hours ago.
When sis said "look, I cannot be around someone who has a fever like that and come back home around a newborn". All of a sudden, mom suddenly decides "um, I don't have a fever...".


The list goes on and on and on..there is not a wedding, birth, birthday party, 4th of July, t-ball game, that she has NOT tried to ruin when she knows that a few of us will get together and be having fun elsewhere. If she is invited to a birthday party, she will keep interrupting the birthday person's special moment of opening presents by getting onlookers to talk to only her and not watch the birthday person.

Two years ago on the 4th of July, sis asked her to dog sit for sis' teeny tiny dog so the dog would not get scared by fireworks at sis' house. Mom goes "gosh, I hope the dog doesn't get into those sticky pads that I have laying around the house, the ones I use to catch bugs". Sis assured her that the dog is about as active as a stuffed animal, she doesn't wander.

Middle of me and sis enjoying fireworks, mom calls in a panic "the dog is stuck to a sticky pad and it's ripping her hair and paw skin!"

We go over there in a panic, sure enough, she is holding/squeezing the dog on her lap along with the sticky pad. I get a bottle of cooking oil to help loosen the sticky pad that was about to rip off the crying dog's paw skin and hair. Some of the oil I poured on the dog got on mom's PJ top and her wooden floor.

What was MOM angry about for days afterwards?? That I got cooking oil on her PJ top. Sis and I couldn't quite get over how mom "predicted" (cough, cough) such a random thing with the sticky pads would happen.


It is to a point now sis and I don't even TELL her when I will be in town. It is the ONLY way that we can have a peaceful visit without some "emergency" happening because mom knows that sis and I are having a visit with each other that is not 100% mother-centric.
















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nadine_mn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 05:12 AM
Response to Original message
25. I feel your pain
sometimes its just so nice to bitch and moan and get it off your chest. I can only handle my mom in small doses. I got the book Adult Children of Narcissitic parents (some title like that) I just laughed - it was like someone had watched me grow up.


love and hugs - its the only way to get through it
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murielm99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. There is a lot of insight in this thread.
I wish I had known some of this twenty years ago. It would have saved me a lot of pain.

Therapists and mental health professionals are cautious about diagnosing anyone they have not met. However, my brother's therapist and my therapist, with caution, have made a guess at my mother. My brother's therapist thought she might be narcissistic. Mine suggested borderline personality disorder. Whatever it is, it is a mental health disorder, and we have to accept that she will never change and never get help. We can only change how we react to her antics.

My brother and I have read Toxic Parents, Will I Ever Be Good Enough, and Children of the Self-Absorbed. It helps. But if I am not careful, I sit and cry. I am not sorry for myself so much as I am sorry for what might have been, what kind of family I might have had.
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thirtiesgirl Donating Member (148 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. I can so identify with what you've written here
about feeling sorry for what might have been. I feel much the same way much of the time. I constantly look at other people who I grew up with, friends and co-workers in my age group, and see how well adjusted they are in comparison to me, and I desperately wish I'd had a different parental experience growing up. I think you're even doing better than I am, having found a partner and created a successful marital relationship with him. I can't say the same for myself, and I attribute some of my lack of success in that area to my mother.

Keep in mind, though, that borderline personality disorder is *not* a mental health disorder. It's a personality disorder (as the name implies), which is different. In other words, it's not a disorder of the mind, but a disorder of the personality, which can be much harder to diagnose. BPD can often seem very much like narcissism and is often mistaken for it. Again, I'd recommend doing some research on BPD, checking out Christine Lawson's book, and seeing if anything you read strikes a chord with you regarding your mother's behavior.
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murielm99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-10 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. Thanks. I will look for that book.
At the moment, I am going to read the nice things my kids got me for Christmas. Then I will dive back into other things.

I know that I am lucky. My husband is not perfect, and he drives me crazy at times. But I am not perfect, either. We grew up around the corner from each other. His family is not as bad as mine, but they have their villains. His father was the problem in his family. But there were people in his family who kept things under control.

My brothers are not as fortunate. My middle brother, who was abused in different ways than I, allowed our mother to destroy his marriage. He is just now beginning to reconnect to his children. They are in their twenties and early thirties. I am glad he is finding his way back into relationships with them. My youngest brother lives as far away from our parents as he can get, while still living in the same country. He is gay, but if he is in a relationship, he hides it from our family. He does not want any interference. I think he will not come out fully until our parents have both died. But both of my brothers have had lonely years, while my husband and I raised a great family together.

There was only one time when I thought my parents had found a way to undermine my marriage. My mom, as usual, assigned Mr. Enabler, my dad, to do the dirty work. He tried to imply to my husband that I had been a wild girl with a bad reputation while I was in high school. I very firmly denied all his statements and challenged him to back up what he was saying. I reminded him that my husband had grown up as a neighbor of ours, and would surely have known all about me if I had been a wild girl. I told him that it would be the last time he ever tried to come between me and my husband. He saw how serious I was and backed off.

We have been together thirty-two years. I guess things will work out after all.
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 06:50 AM
Response to Original message
26. I had a toxic mother, too. I hear 'ya!
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DeadEyeDyck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 08:58 PM
Response to Original message
29. I feel so lucky
I am home for Christmas and I love my whole family. My Mom and Dad are the greatest. Used to fight with the Sis when I was younger but we are good friends now. Actually she has become a fox while I was at school. Kinda wish she wasn't my sis, anymore. LOL

O am sympathetic to your relationship. I do hope it gets better.
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Ilsa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-10 10:42 PM
Response to Original message
31. Good for you! I know people who have had to divorce or minimize their
Company with a parent. It works better by not spending holidays together. You aren't alone!
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Dappleganger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-10 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
33. Big hugs to you, I feel the same about my father.
Right now we're not even on speaking terms. It's not what I envisioned how things would have turned out but he absolutely refuses to respect my boundaries or our family's.
So it is what it is. It has helped that I can separate myself (somewhat) from the situation knowing he has a mental illness and had a very shitty life growing up, as well as early onset ALZ--that is a reason but it doesn't make the results any less difficult. My sister has to deal w/him because she has medical/durable POA but he gives her the same treatment--I just won't put up with the abuse as an adult.
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