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*Spoilers* Star Trek (2009): UHURA

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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-14-09 11:08 PM
Original message
*Spoilers* Star Trek (2009): UHURA
May I just say I was fuckin' disappointed in Uhura. Every other character was given love and represented well. Meaning the men. This is an issue I have two-fold. She was Black Woman and she was totally objectified. Honestly the issue I had was mainly the fact of her role as a woman than more so the fact she was Black.

Even Winona Ryder's character as Spock's mother had more importance than Uhura could have shown in the amount of she was given.

Now I love the character of Uhura. For several reasons. She opened the door for Blacks in Scifi genre and given some credence more than just looking good. She was actually worth more in importance than Christine's character (Christine is the nurse who hooks up with Spock--sorta). In any event...she also made it a point where Black women are almost always featured in scifi genres. More recently you have the character of Teyla Emmagan played by Rachel Lutrell in Stargate Atlantis. You have Zoe Alleyne Washburne played by Gina Torres in Firefly/Serenity. You have Dr. Allison Blake played by Salli Richardson-Whitfield on Eureka.

These are just the few of many strong, important (if not second main character), significant, intelligent powerful Black women, of many, featured in scifi recently. And yet...this Uhura was a disappointment.

Now I was already worried when I saw the commercials. While many of the males who were shown like McCoy, Kirk, Spock who were shown in the commercials seemed to have something important to do. But when I saw Uhura she was taking her top off. Thanks, but no thanks.

Then I got to watch the movie, which was superb--minus Uhura---by the way, she really gutted me. I reached a point where I just wanted her out of the film. I was like you're a bloody disappointment to women---and in consideration of all your forebears, in particular Nichelle Nichols, you're a damn embarassment.

I was looking for feedback by others here on her before I went to see it. I was gutted since a few of them managed to snuff my concerns. Well when I saw it I wanted to smack something.

She was completely objectified by Kirk---which was too be expected. The problem I had was the implied sort of sexual relief she wanted to give to Spock, after the death of his mother. Besides not really providing any emotional support, like just a deep hug would do. She had to add a kiss to it that was completely unnecessary and then her phrasing, "Is there anything you want me to do? Anything....Anything." <--- :WTF: Get out of the way and sit somewhere is what I want you to do!!! Dear God.

I'm going to be crude but I was pushed to this...It was like she was ready to bend down and *get* him to chill out by other means, if you get my drift.

Ugh, it was gutting. She had these high qualifications where she can speak 6 languages. She was moved up because of her skill and yet...and yet...she did nothing in the way of not only providing comedic relief but at least playing a significant role. She was nothing more than a glorified character. The token Female/Black person all rolled into one. This was a massive slap in the face to the role of women----when she could have done a lot more. Sulu was given massive love and I adored him. Chekov was brilliant, so was Scottie. Spock (including Leonard Nimoy) and Kirk were masterful. Uhura?! A waste of damn film.


*End of Rant* :argh:

P.S. Other than Uhura the film was genius and I hope there's a part two to basically redeem Uhura's character for all women and black women kind in Scifi.

I can now totally believe in this:

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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-14-09 11:22 PM
Response to Original message
1. I totally agree. (spoilers)
I adore Nichelle Nichols for the dignity she brought to the part. I'm not sure how much of the current Uhura disaster to blame on the writing, how much on the directing and how much on the actress, but there was none of that dignity and self-assured competence that Uhura personified in the original series and subsequent movies.

It was the biggest problem with the film, by far. All of the other stuff was either to be expected from Star Trek (dodgy science, questionable plotting) or relatively minor (the car chase scene, that annoying cutesy alien of Scotty's.) But the weird treatment of women (tarting up Uhura, killing off Amanda, leaving out any other women of note in the series) was definitely problematic.
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Catshrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 12:18 AM
Response to Reply #1
9. Astronaut Mae Jemison said she became an astronaut because of Uhura.
She and Nichelle Nichols did a seminar together or spoke together at a conference. I can't remember the details. I just think it's cool that Jemison credits Uhura with her career choice.
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Sebastian Doyle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-14-09 11:35 PM
Response to Original message
2. Well, one thing was evident in this Uhura character
She may know linguistics in however many languages, but apparently Starfleet didn't teach her much else about the various cultures on the Federation planets, or she would have known that Spock (like any other Vulcan) only gets laid once every 7 years. Maybe they'll have to write Pon Farr into the next movie so they can take the Spock-Uhura hookup to the "logical" next level.
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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-14-09 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Well, Pon Farr is the irresistible drive to mate
But who's to say they can't get busy whenever they want in addition to that?
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Sebastian Doyle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-14-09 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Only if Spock lets his human side out to play
And he doesn't do that very often either.
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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-14-09 11:51 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Only when his planet's been destroyed maybe?
Or after a good dose of euphoria-spores, perhaps?

:evilgrin:
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jeff30997 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-14-09 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. My Pon Farrs only occurs once every...
...70 years but boy oh boy do I enjoy err... Star Trek Threads. :hide:
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Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #2
12. Spock's half-human, and was obviously affectionate.
Objection overruled. Abrams is bending over backwards to humanize Spock. If anything, I expect to see him trying to distance himself from Uhura in the next movie--trying and failing, of course.

It would make sense for them to cool it a little, temporarily. We can't have them actually screwing on the bridge, even if they manage to find less obvious ways to steam up the main viewscreen.
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NYCGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 09:52 AM
Response to Reply #2
18. It was never specified that Vulcans ONLY mate during Pon Farr. It was said
they MUST mate during Pon Farr, though.
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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-14-09 11:41 PM
Response to Original message
4. Great post!
And IMO many of the preview commercials are edited in such a way as to suggest that, after stripping down, Uhura winds up in bed under Kirk. Of course, he's actually with Uhura's equally perfunctory roommate in that scene, but the commercial takes full advantage of the dim lighting.
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krispos42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 12:15 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. But now we know the origins of Kirk's love of green-skinned women
:-)
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targetpractice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. According to the writers...
Edited on Fri May-15-09 01:24 AM by targetpractice
Deleted scenes will fill in the blanks...

Uhura's roommate was a computer specialist at Star Fleet Academy, and Kirk was sleeping with her to gain access to the Kobayashi Maru simulation program.

:-/
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krispos42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. I saw the green-skinned woman;
I think the Kobayashi Maru access thing was just an excuse! :-)
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targetpractice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 07:34 PM
Response to Reply #11
31. Gotcha... ;-)
I like your motive better... But apparently, there is a deleted scene where Kirk sends an email to his green-skinned friend... She opens it and a virus patches the Kobayashi Maru simulation.

http://darthmojo.wordpress.com/2009/05/14/trek-scribes-...
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Coventina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #10
38. Pretty sad that "deleted scenes" on a future DVD release are
required for the movie to make sense.
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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-16-09 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #38
46. The scene makes sense as-is, given what we know of Kirk
The Kobayashi Maru backstory just fleshes it out, but it works fine already.


ST:ENT established that Orion females are in fact the rulers of that slave-trading species, though. If this fact is known in 2248, then I wonder if the planet itself is part of the Federation, or does the academy just have a small sampling of independent Orions.

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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-18-09 01:51 AM
Response to Reply #38
73. Hah...no wonder...n/t
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Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 08:38 AM
Response to Original message
13. There was zero time for the characters to use their intellectual skills in this movie.
I hope that we will see them allowed to think in the next movie. Uhura, given precious little to do in the first flick, is positioned well to lead all those testosterone-soaked men in situations that require some cerebral skill.

Wouldn't it be nice to see her and Spock team up intellectually, and gently guide the headstrong Kirk toward doing the right thing? I want Uhura to lead some, even if she is outranked. She's a damned officer, not a secretary.
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Rabrrrrrr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. And zero time for the audience to use intellectual skills, too - except for constant "WTF?"ing
in the plot holes.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #15
27. Agreed. Time travel is something extremely sensitive.
And I don't know what the fuck they're doing. I just finished watching Terminator: Sarah Connor Chronicles and they shot anyone's idea on time travel straight to Goddamn hell as this film did.
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jeff30997 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. "Uhura and Spock team up intellectually"

Just imagine what a hot mind meld they could have together! :)

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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #16
26. Yeah...and then they'd 9 months later I'd see Obama. n/t
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EndersDame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-18-09 01:37 AM
Response to Reply #16
68. I have always thought that Spock was hotter than Kirk
must be those pointy ears
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #13
25. In actuality...Chekov did...
Scottie not so much but they laid the ground work. Kirk was far more superior than I expected. Spock was tous normale. Sulu was great and they gave him fighting skills, so that was something new.

Uhura was the shit piece of the entire film. A fuckin' disappointment of the greatest proportion. I would love to see Uhura do that...I would have loved to see Uhura speak a stupid dialect instead of wanting to get to Spock's Optimus Prime...but I didn't get that.
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EndersDame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-18-09 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #25
69. you do realize you mixed in Transformer references
perhaps yhou are thinking of Prime Directive
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Rabrrrrrr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 09:04 AM
Response to Original message
14. Well, you see, here's the problem - Abrams took out everything good about Trek: thoughtfulntess,
Edited on Fri May-15-09 09:07 AM by Rabrrrrrr
characterization, intelligent writing, social commentary, stories that mean something, characters that have depth and diversity and who work together to bring a round sort of holistic wholeness to the ensemble...

and he replaced all that was good with Star Trek with everything that makes a summer blockbuster movie: tits, explosions, speaking in cliche easily-memorized phrases, more explosions, an easily hate-able bad guy with a motivation that's so trumped up and unthoughtful as to be ludicrous and who is so one-dimensional and vapid even Carrot Top looks like Plato next to him, more explosions, some more tits, and in the end, a lot of explosions and the tits go to the winner.

Uhura had a place in Star Trek - the real Star Trek - because the writers back then wrote intelligent (most of the time), thoughtful, introspective philosophical pieces in which a black woman communications officer could actually have a role that was meaningful, inspired, nuanced, and intelligent.

The new Star Trek - which is really just Die Hard In Space (or maybe Lethal Weapon in Space) - unfortunately has no place for an Uhura, and the writers have no concept how to use a woman - any woman - but especially not a woman like Uhura, except in the action-movie cliche role of 'tit-bringer.'

Sad, but that's what Trek is now, I guess.



* please note, my use of "tit" here is not me trying to misogynist, but me sarcastically using the language/symbology that I feel the writers and producers of this shitfest, and other similar action-at-the-expense-of-story shitfests, are using.
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jeff30997 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. It's sad that you had to write a disclaimer a the end of your post.
Edited on Fri May-15-09 09:32 AM by jeff30997

But I guess that some peoples are really sarcasm deprived.That's why I have to

use the :sarcasm: smiley more often then needed,just to avoid a clueless DUer to start the flamethrower. :)


*Disclaimer: I'm in no way bashing on sarcasm deprived peoples. :P

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Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #14
21. Well, given the scripts of previous movies...
...not having the space to think about what the characters were saying would have been a blessing. The Shatner movies, particularly, were incredibly awkward in places.

Abrams' version, whatever its faults, had wonderful urgency to it. I would have appreciated a little more space to ponder events, but then I would have fallen into one of the many plot holes. As it is, the experience was as exciting for me as it seemed to be for the characters. I call that a success, but it's a very different sort of success from any previous Trek movies.

I could do without seeing aging actors stuffed into too-small uniforms for quite a while.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #14
24. +10. God...you're right!!
It's after sleeping over it, I got even more disappointed.
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GaYellowDawg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-16-09 05:31 AM
Response to Reply #14
42. I didn't see any tits.
Did I miss something or will they be in the director's cut?
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GaYellowDawg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-16-09 07:05 AM
Response to Reply #42
44. Forgot the
:sarcasm: :sarcasm:
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DS1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 09:58 AM
Response to Original message
19. Objection! (pun intended)
Salli Richardson-Whitfield was part of the "Let's get all of the women (who also happened to be toned enough to see abs) to strip down because it's too hot in the room" episode or Eureka.


Not that I was complaining.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #19
23. That's true...but she also happens to run the entire program at Eureka, was a doctor
Edited on Fri May-15-09 05:17 PM by vaberella
and was head of the DEA if I remember correctly. She's no joke. She didn't spend her time making out with Jack Carter or anyone else for that matter in every ep and having no purpose.
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meegbear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 10:11 AM
Response to Original message
20. Winona Ryder is Spock's mother??!1?
Thanks for ruining the movie for me! x(
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. It's your problem if you ignored the *Spoilers* I put on the thread...n/t
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Sequoia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #20
34. You were warned.
I haven't seen it but I'm glad I read the bit about Uhura. You know, these MEN today who make movies haven't learned a damn thing....Women HAVE to be sex objects. At least in the original Star Trek Uhura was a woman to be recokend with and when ole Sulu tried to get frisky with her in that episode where he was bare chested and throwing swoards around, well I thought for sure she was going to belt him.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #34
49. Not in this film unfortunately.
She was nothing more than window dressing from what I could tell. The scene with Spock in the elevator...I was like, "Spock just told you to get back to work and leave him alone." without saying leave him alone---he did say get back to work in his way. It was pretty insulting that scene...but then he's trying to be all unemotional and all so, whatever. In any event, she was a real mess in this film for me.
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 05:30 PM
Response to Original message
28. Ok...I haven't seen the movie yet; but...
could this apparent miscasting actually be the result of a dysfunctional script?
It sounds like the movie plays up Uhura's sexiness without addressing her amazing persona. Is it the actress' fault?
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-16-09 02:54 AM
Response to Reply #28
40. No, I don't think that the actress is at fault here
the script lacks anything of substance for the female characters in the film...there's not a lot of substance for the male characters either, but it seems to be intended as a summer action flick marketed for young men and little more. I found it entertaining, but it lacked that essential "Trekiness" that made the original series the cult classic that it is. Roddenberry was thoughtful, insightful, and always had a message to pass along to the viewer. There's nothing at all thought provoking about the new Trek. The old series gave us all that hope for humanity that just isn't quite there this time around. Hopefully someone who truly loves and understands the series will be involved the next time around.
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FloridaJudy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
29. What I want to know
Is why women in the twenty third or fourth century have reverted to wearing those grossly uncomfortable micro-mini skirts and go-go boots that were de rigeur in the 1960's. Shouldn't female Star Fleet uniforms at least allow one to bend over a pick up a pen - or a tricorder - without distracting every (human) male in the vicinity?

I won't even go into the scientific improbabilities.

But they sure did blow stuff up good. And the spaceships were gnarly.
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MedleyMisty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Because the show was created in the 60s?
And Star Trek has never had the most realistic science.

Personally I feel like Uhura got to do more in this movie than she did in any of the others. I did watch a couple of TOS episodes the other day (which, by the way, have a lot of fights and coincidences - like finding a planet exactly like Earth with a species just like humans who just happen to speak English in the part they beam down to) and in one of them she did get to be all kickass and take a phaser away from another woman who was threatening Kirk and Spock. But in the movies pretty much all she did was directly related to her job. "Hailing frequencies open, Captain."
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FloridaJudy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 08:08 PM
Response to Reply #30
35. The outfits passed muster in the sixties
Because we all dressed like that back then. But wearing a uniform that impractical looks bizarre today. As to the English-speaking humanoids, I always assumed Star Fleet had some sort of inconspicuous translating chip in their tricorders, or even sewn into the collars of those uniforms.

Even the Klingons have evolved since then.

But the sensor reading are always unlike anything we've seen before!
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pokerfan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #30
36. She was actually given more to do in the animated series
Edited on Fri May-15-09 08:57 PM by pokerfan
which actually had some very well-written stories. Worth a look if you've never seen them before.

On stardate 5483.7, the male Enterprise crew was incapacitated by the "siren's song" of Taurus II's female population, necessitating Uhura to take command of the ship. She and Nurse Christine Chapel led a landing party to rescue Captain Kirk, first officer Spock and Dr. McCoy. (TAS: "The Lorelei Signal")

Later that year, on stardate 2291.2, the Enterprise revisited the Shore Leave Planet where Uhura was abducted by the planet's computer, which had taken charge of the planet upon The Keeper's death. Uhura reasoned with the computer, which felt that it was being taken advantage of, and convinced it to cease its hostile actions against the Enterprise crew. (TAS: "Once Upon a Planet")

In 2270, Uhura was again temporarily in command of the bridge when the Enterprise lost contact with Kirk and Spock, half of the ships' contact party, while exploring the surface of Delta Theta III. Per Kirk's orders of avoiding unnecessary risks, she ordered engineer Montgomery Scott and Sulu, the other half of the contact party, to reboard the ship, contrary to their attempt to locate the Spock and the captain. (TAS: "Bem")

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Uhura


The writing in the {animated} series benefited from a Writers Guild of America, East strike in 1973, which did not apply to animation. A few episodes are especially notable due to contributions from well-known science fiction authors.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek_The_Animated_Ser...
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 12:26 AM
Response to Reply #29
50. Yeah, I'm supportive of women in the future being dressed like, "7 of 9".
:eyes: I think space always makes a woman look slutty except for Aliens where Signourey Weaver just looked like she ate heads for dinner.
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FloridaJudy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 01:03 AM
Response to Reply #50
55. Or any of the "Serenity" crew
With the exception of Inara. Since she's a professional sex-worker, it makes sense for her to wear those flimsy transparent outfits. The rest of them dress more practically. It's tough to rebuild a warp-drive while dressed like a courtesan.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 01:50 AM
Response to Reply #55
56. ain't that the truth.
But let's be serious. In BDM she managed to be the ONLY one to come out unscathed---I was like Princess Athena, if you don't have a gun or a knife you're worthless. Yet, in the end she proved that being a high priced "sex worker" is the best bet.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 07:38 PM
Response to Original message
32. Did Abrams really look at the lines and scenes of previous Trek flicks and shows?
Or where there ghostwriters, for as I linked to, Abrams himself said he never liked Trek, nor did he understand it.

And based on what's in that movie, it's all shallow reinterpretations set in an "alternate timeline" so he doesn't have to be encumbered with what Gene Roddenberry's reasons for making it "Star trek" and not "some generic piece of shizzle".

The new movie is garbage for that reason alone.

it's weird; many people didn't like the new ship design. I love it. Trouble is, I look for more than pretty images when it comes to media.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #32
51. Hah...so that was it. I was under the impression that might be the case.
It's the same shit I had with the idiot who did X-Men films it was obvious this person or persons did not like Storm or know a damn thing about her because she was worthless and totally wrongly cast and just a mess all around.
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DU GrovelBot  Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 07:38 PM
Response to Original message
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jeff30997 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-15-09 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #33
37. You know what Mechanical Dunderhead ?
If I was always begging for money on every bloody thread like you do,you Blundering Bag of Bolts,I would

be TSd faster than the speed of light you Cybernetic Simpleton!






Now live me alone,Fugitive From a Junkheap! Ohh the pain...


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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 12:31 AM
Response to Reply #37
53. OMG it's Dr. Smith-- My mum LOVES Dr. Smith.
To this day she watches the show and quotes Dr. Smith. ^_^ I love that guy.
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fortyfeetunder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-16-09 01:59 AM
Response to Original message
39. Also disappointed in the 2009 Uhura character (spoiler alert)
They played her to one type of female Black stereotypes. I was bored with her character almost immediately.

IN general, I was not crazy about was the implicit sexual undertones in the movie. This is not a family movie.

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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 12:30 AM
Response to Reply #39
52. Agreed.
However, ST was always a naughty tv show as well so that was a given. I saw her as a sexualized Token, nothing more. I was bored and I actually wanted her off the show and just leave it for the men. They did not make her equal to the men in any way.
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EndersDame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-16-09 04:37 AM
Response to Original message
41. Shatner stole most of Nichele Nichols' Lines
Well that is what I read in an interview with her anyway that Gene and the other writers had given her alot more lines and importance but Shatner threw a fit and took most of her good lines.Gene wanted to push boundaries but the network only let him go so far. As for the current incarnation of Uhura I think that Abrams made the classic mistake of Strong Woman = Bitchiness.But also the show was really all about the chemistry between Kirk Spock and McCoy all the rest were secondary characters
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GaYellowDawg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-16-09 05:35 AM
Response to Reply #41
43. I didn't think 2009 Uhura was "bitchy" at all.
She didn't want anything to do with Kirk, and blew him off. She didn't treat him with respect because he didn't treat her with respect. Good for her. She demanded and got an assignment she deserved. Good for her. That wasn't "bitchy." That was a woman asserting herself.
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EndersDame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 02:02 AM
Response to Reply #43
57. I guess I am just a bit nicer when blowing off dudes
Edited on Sun May-17-09 02:02 AM by EndersDame
But it wasn't just that.I thought that she was being a bit on the bitch side when making snippets at Kirks command abilities.While Kirk is an arrogant son of a bitch he does have the shit to back it up. no one else save for Spock was critical.I think that Jadzia Dax and Guinan were the best example of being a strong assertive and wise woman
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GaYellowDawg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 04:32 AM
Response to Reply #57
60. Well, think of this...
While Kirk is an arrogant son of a bitch he does have the shit to back it up.

At that point, she wouldn't know that, at all. All she'd seen from Kirk at that point was a womanizing barroom brawler who cheated on an Academy simulator. I think her doubt was well-justified.
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EndersDame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #60
64. I will give you that but
Edited on Sun May-17-09 11:26 PM by EndersDame
Surely he must have also displayed good leadership at the academy . Sorry big nerd here :)
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munkie Donating Member (25 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-16-09 10:50 AM
Response to Original message
45. I would like to disagree with the OP
Perhaps I need to see the movie again, I really enjoyed it . Not being math savvy the plot holes went over my head. But I thought the connection between Spock and Uruha was a genuine intergalactic relationship. Not unlike that of Spock's father and mother. I can't believe anyone would objectify a person who was part of a "real" relationship. Theres always the lover and the lovee, that dynamic can make things interesting.

Spock legitimizes the union by saying "I didn't want anyone to think I was playing favorites". Yes, the man legitimizes most unions. If your man doesn't tell you that you are the center of the world then what kind of relationship do you have?

I can imagine young children not being able to pick up this subtle clue and if they did pick it up going "Yuck". Remember when you were a kid waiting for the yucky, kissy face part of a movie to get over so that you could enjoy the rest of the movie. Ah, I remember it well.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 12:20 AM
Response to Reply #45
48. Actually the idea of the relationship doesn't bother me.
Edited on Sun May-17-09 12:24 AM by vaberella
Or the many scenes they had together. My issue overall was the fact that Uhura played no REAL fundamental role. She wasn't even enough for Spock in his time of need--and her only way of communicating with him was to make out with him. A hug wasn't enough, during his time of emotional need she seemed to be offering him something more on the sexual side. It was unnerving. But besides that the real issue is the fact that I saw NONE of her skill.

Sulu who in the tv show never showed that much combat skills (in the rare ep sure) came out a winner in this film with not only being able to fly the ship well but also managed to save Kirk's life when they were on that satellite thing. So his character was a fundamental in a the sense it contributed something and added to the character of Sulu that might have been missing.

This was found with many of the other characters. Don't get me wrong, there were plot holes and I won't get into the issues I had with the whole time continuum space thing which was totally done poorly. But overall my issue was in her real contribution---not so much her relationship with Spock. I thought the relationship wasn't stellar but it wasn't something horrible either. I just was not into the character overall as an individual, irrespective if she's in a relationship or not.
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EndersDame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 02:08 AM
Response to Reply #48
58. Maybe it is because John Cho is a bigger star than Zoe Saldana
I think that is why they gave him a better part. Also the fencing bit was a nod to the orginal series (the crew goes mad and Sulu charges half naked through the ship with a foil.) I think they kept the same dynamic in movie that was in the TV series. Uhura was awesome but she had less of a primary role (see above post about Shatner stealing lines)I as a minority woman do not find a problem with this.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #58
61. Huh?
Edited on Sun May-17-09 10:22 PM by vaberella
I'm sorry I don't agree with that argument at all. As a minority myself, I know all the minority actors fairly well. Zoe Saldana and John Cho is one, and she's pretty well known. From my knowledge Zoe Saldana has been around for a while in actuality and her films are pretty well known. John Cho that was his real claim to fame was American Pie. Even if I allow the thought that maybe it's because she was less known...I have to ask about the character of Uhura.

Uhura is no second rate character. She was toe to toe with the males on ST. This is what I cannot abide in this film. She was crap here. I don't care what actress they chose to play her...it's the characters purpose that I couldn't stand and basically what she did overall. If they put Halle Berry or (my girl) Angela Bassett, to the point where they even put someone like Nona Gaye (who would have been a good pick for Storm or carry the presence of Uhura well)---they would ALL have failed in this film because Uhura was stripped of any worth.

I didn't find her awesome, because she did nothing nor represent anything that was awesome. Had she done something besides kiss Spock or walk around...then I would say she was awesome. But she offered me nothing in the role and as I said before, I just wanted her to get off the screen and leave it to the men---because she was making the women look like rags considering the other women were just for dress up. She was for dress up and kissing Spock.
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EndersDame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #61
63. John Cho played Harold in Harold and Kumar series
Edited on Sun May-17-09 11:21 PM by EndersDame
Kal Penn who plays Kumar actually works for Obama now !Imdb says she had a role in Drumline but seriously the Harold and Kumar movies are alot bigger/. I know she also had a bit part in Pirates. I would find it logical to give more screen time to a actor who is better known. I agree with you that Uhura was stripped down but I also cut the writers a little slack since they had to pick and choose who to give screen time to since the movie only lasted for a certain amount of time.And I would be equally as pissed if they gave more screen time to Chekov than Kirk Spock and McCoy (the big three.)Really for me thats what the original series was about their great friendship and chemistry.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-18-09 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #63
70. Uh...
In relation to their IMBD things, I'm fully aware of their background. Their resumes are actually posted on the Star Trek official website as well. She was in other films as well, but that's neither here nor there. As I stated in my post the problem I had was not with Zoe Saldana, but with the character of Uhura in general.

Further more it had nothing to do with screen time. You mention Chekov, but even he was commendable and pretty damn enjoyable to watch. Actually he was my third favorite after McCoy and Scottie. But Uhura was not. This is an issue I would have when I watched Stargate Atlantis. People would talk about screen time, or actress/actor, or whatever. My issue was first and foremost the character. It will always be the character...and as I stated I find the excuse of the background of the actress to be one of the weakest I've seen in defense of this destruction of a brilliant character.

Uhura was not given any quality and was far from awesome. Nothing about her stands out besides the fact that she has a relationship with Spock. This is further insulting because, that's what she's remembered for besides her qualifications which were given NO consideration except for the fact that Captain Pike found out she spoke 6 when the officer previously only knew 3. That's about the only damn difference, but she never displayed the skill, she never even said any snarky. She has absolutely no combat skills shown in the film. She wasn't even extra sassy when dealing with Kirk. In the end she was just a beautiful lady in love with Spock (with "supposed" undisplayed skill).

As I stated before. Everyone else was shown to have some skill or be adept at something and they displayed those skills even if in minute instances. Uhura, nada.
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EndersDame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 11:30 PM
Response to Reply #61
65. I think that maybe it was Zoe Saldana
Who didn't add that extra bit of life to her. If Gina Torres of firefly/serenity fame would have been a better choice if she were a little younger (not saying that she is too old as an actress just a little bit over the age of the character )
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-18-09 01:45 AM
Response to Reply #65
71. I'm not about to go and attack the actress on this.
As I stated before no matter who took up the role they could not do anything in light of the writing for the character alone. She was nothing more than window dressing. If she was Caucasian, Asian, or Hispanic, any woman would have failed in displaying Uhura properly because she was given nothing to really do. In some instances she did something (but it wasn't anything even really note worthy). She was a failure.

I listed Gina Torres in my favorite list of recent scifi ladies...and unfortunately it would not have mattered. Gina, irrespective of age..would only be seen as macking with Spock and I wouldn't even want that for her. I find the writing for Uhura an insult to the character and unfortunate for Zoe, because if written well she could have had real presence because she was the ONLY female really in the film.

If she was able to have some sort of discussion in a twisted language, or even take on Kirk in that bar fight---or if they had her do something on Nero's ship or something. She did nothing but kiss Spock and walk around. I thought individually Zoe is a decent choice and I have no problems with the girl...I have problems with the writing of Uhura overall.
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distantearlywarning Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-16-09 11:41 AM
Response to Original message
47. I completely agree.
And said as much to my husband when we were walking out of the movie. It was a very sexist part.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 12:32 AM
Response to Reply #47
54. +1. n/t
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Kitty Herder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 02:42 AM
Response to Original message
59. Just got back from seeing it. I totally agree with you.
Other than that and the fact that I wasn't really feeling Zachary Quinto as Spock, it was awesome!
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-17-09 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #59
62. Ain't that the truth.
I'm telling you and I told my friend last night. Zachary Quinto just could not pull off the ridiculously comedic gravitas that comes from Leonard Nimoy's portrayal. He left me cold, but nothing, nothing like Uhura.
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InvisibleTouch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-18-09 12:40 AM
Response to Original message
66. I really don't see this.
Uhura was shown to be highly skilled, intelligent, and competent, and also very poised and sure of herself. She intercepted one of the messages that was a key element in getting the action moving. She turned down (turned down!) Kirk and got to make out with Spock. I must say, it appeals to the fangirl in me. :) Those who feel she was portrayed in a sexist or irrelevant matter, are to my mind searching very very hard for something to take offense to. Chekov's role in the story was much smaller. Maybe Russian fans should take offense?
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EndersDame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-18-09 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #66
67. Thank you!!
I totally agree. You responded to this in a calm cool and collected manner.I am reactionary in the defense of Trek! I also take into account that they didnt have more female roles because it was based off a 60s tv show. I know that if they had done what they did in Battlestar (make a main character a different sex) heads would roll.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-18-09 01:49 AM
Response to Reply #66
72. She wasn't shown to be...she was SAID to be.
Massive difference. Poised, however I'll give you. As for turning down Kirk, I don't get the big deal; but okay.

Actually, I'm not searching anything to do take offense too, but whatever. I actually thought Chekov was extremely brilliantly portrayed. He turned saving lives into a video game, which was awesome to see and he saved lives. He was hilarious when he was doing his password and overall he was given some death when he couldn't save Spock's life. Uhura, kissing and walking around didn't do much.

She was extremely irrelevant. There were many people working in that area, if Kirk was friends with any of those guys---something similar could have happened if it was written. The woman did nothing extraordinary. Seriously.

I'm so shocked I'm considered to be searching. Normally I'm thrown over the coals for defending the minority women in scifi shows---as someone once pointed out---because I'm a "minority female with aspirations."

She's the one I was aiming to love...she turned out to be the one that jumped off my fave list horribly.
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