Sure, the Matthew Broderick Godzilla film sucked...

[Orrex]

But it's not as though Kurosawa directed the Japanese films, either. I've seen just about all of them, and with the exception of the original original (ie., sans Raymond Burr), all of them together add up to about two stars.

Not that I'm recommending the 1998 American "blockbuster;" I'm just saying that it isn't all that much worse than the canonical Gojira films.

[Danger Mouse]

1. The sequence with the baby godzillas was entirely pointless.

It was overlong and stupid. It got boring after awhile...which is a shame because it starts off interesting. It desecrated a classic Zeppelin tune by letting PUFF DADDY of all hacks cover it.
I'll take a Japanese Gojira any day. At least they're good, clean, corny fun.

[Orrex]

4. Also desecrated Bowie's Heroes, while we're at it.

And, yes, the babyzillas were stupid.

[Danger Mouse]

5. Babyzillas = poor man's velociraptors. And the raptors were cooler.

Yeah, but the Wallflowers are more respectable than Puff friggin Daddy. Slightly.

[Orrex]

6. But Jimmi Page was complicit in Puffy's crime

Hell, he's endorsed it, and he performed it with him on SNL!

At least Bowie had the decency to sit back and count his royalty checks.


I'd put the babyzillas above the raptors in JPII but below the ones in JP and JPIII.

[Danger Mouse]

8. Yeah, fuck Jimmy Page for helping Puff Daddy violate the only great Zeppelin song

There is only one Jurassic Park in my book. :)

[Orrex]

10. I'm still so mad about it that I'm deliberately spelling his name with two I's

Though I suspect that he was smarting from the failure of Coverdale/Page, so he sold his soul to Puffy in an attempt to ease the pain.

[elshiva]

7. Yes, it was a Jurassic Park rip off scene.

Also, remember the mayor looks like Roger Ebert? A very cheap shot.

[Orrex]

9. In fact I don't remember, but I believe you.

There was, IIRC, a sort of Aliens vibe to it, as well. I'd say that they ripped off a whole range of stuff.

[elshiva]

11. The whole nest with the eggs was an obvious Aliens rip off.

Also here's a screencap of mayor Ebert giving the two thumbs up:


DARN THAT PICTURE IS NOT SHOWING. Go to the bottom of this page:
See this link for the source:
http://www.agonybooth.com/recaps/Godzilla_1998.aspx?Page=3

[Orrex]

12. Too subtle!

Actually, that's pretty funny.

Do I remember correctly that no one actually died on-camera in this fine piece of celluloid?

[elshiva]

13. I don't remember.

It's been at least 6 months since I've seen this movie.

[Orrex]

14. Well, drop what you're doing and watch it right now, dammit!

How are we supposed to discuss big lizard movie trivia at one in the AM if you won't commit?

[elshiva]

19. I would, but I got a dial up connection and I only have

this Godzilla on VHS. The VHS player is upstairs. Sorry.

[Forkboy]

20. No, but to be fair, most of the G movies deliberately avoided it too.

Though I would love to see a G movie that revels in it. 2001's Godzilla, Mothra, King Ghidorah - All Out Monsters Attack (whew) had some great scenes of a very evil Godzilla frying people for the fun of it. :)

[Forkboy]

18. The mayor was even named Roger, and his assistant Gene.

I bet Gene was more upset than Roger, who actually has a sense of humor. :)

[coyotespaw]

2. You're just trying to get Forkboy's attention, aren't you?

[Forkboy]

17. It worked.

:D

[bicentennial_baby]

3. *paging Forkboy*

Forkboy, would you please pick up the white courtesy phone?

[Forkboy]

16. I'm on it...see below.

You know me far too well. :rofl:

[bicentennial_baby]

22. But of course, my dear friend

I knew you would be on the task. :rofl:

:loveya:

[Forkboy]

24. It's my duty as DU's biggest (hell...only) resident Godzilla geek.

It's a dirty job slogging through thread after thread every day looking for that odd Godzilla reference that I can seize on and write a damn thesis of a post about, but someone has to do it. I mean, you don't actually think I give a shit about politics do you? :D

And BTW, I hope things calm down for you soon. I know the feeling of being overwhelmed and it sucks. And things only got worse when I turned 12. Been all downhill since then. :)

Make you sure you take care of yourself, or there'll be hell to pay. You think Godzilla does damage when he's angry? You ain't seen nothing like a Forkboy worry rage!

:loveya:

[Forkboy]

15. Actually, yes, it is worse.

And thanks for bringing up my favorite topic. :)

The reason why the other G movies are better is because they have a fantastic sense of fun and a naive innocence that is completely missing from GINO. Are they great film miking? Not at all (though I'll argue that the craft of the miniature work is way underrated, and once one learns how they did some of the stuff they did one gains an enormous amount of respect for Eiji Tsuburaya and his team. For much, much more on this, see the 68 minute documentary Bringing Godzilla Down To Size, which is a special feature included on the recent release of the Rodan/War of the Gargantuas split DVD).

GINO has none of the sense of fun that marks all the G films (even the really bad G vs Megalon and G vs Gigan), and none of the feeling that captures those Saturday afternoons spent watching Godzilla movies on Creature Double Feature. It was a typical shallow Hollywood movie that equated FX with fun, whereas the FX in the G movies was often meant to be humorous and light hearted, and not the main thrust of the movies. The FX were to further the story, not to be the story.

As a Godzilla movie, GINO is an epic fail of monstrous proportions (heh). As a remake of The Beast From 20,000 Fathoms it works better (Beast was clearly their inspiration, as it was for Gojira back in '54), but it still has way too many glaring bits of stupidity that aren't even funny enough to rise to the level of camp (GINO coming to NYC for privacy, as Broderick's character explains, for instance).

Seriously, how many times during it did you smile because you were having fun, and not just laughing at the badness of it? How many times during a regular G movie do you smile at the fun silliness of it all?

I wish more people could see the original Gojira and compare it to the American version. One will note the much heavier and somber feel, and how the US version omits almost every single reference to the bomb, turning it into a regular "monster on the loose" story that was a mainstay of the 50's American monster flicks. The characters in the original are well realized, even with sparse diologue, and their motivations are perfectly understood. Emiko's betrayal of Dr Serizawa after seeing the victims of Godzilla's rampage is a very powerful scene. It's not just a great monster movie, it's a great anti war movie (Honda said all the scenes of destruction were based on what he saw as he returned home after the war and bicycled through Nagasaki and Hiroshima. The path of Godzilla's attack is the same course the Enola Gay took over the city, and the ship at the start of the movie is a direct reference to the Japanese fishing boat Lucky Dragon 5 that was hit with radioactive fallout after a Pacific nuclear test in March of '54. The number of the boat in the movie is also #5, and it was no coincidence)

And speaking of Kurosawa, he may not have directed them, but he considered Ishiro Honda, who worked as an assistant under him early on, to be one the very best Japanese directors. They both worked for Toho (both Gojira and Seven Samurai were released in 54, saving the studio financially, and both finished in the top 10 of that year), they both used many of the same actors and crew (often during overlapping productions), Honda collaborated on numerous Kurosawa films, including Ran, Kagamusha, Rhapsody in August, Madalayo, and Honda wrote several segments of Kurosawa's Dreams. When Honda died Kurosawa gave his eulogy.

The whole history of Toho Studios is fascinating, and their "Golden Age of Sci-Fi" movies in the 60's are about as close as we'll ever get to the innocence of our youth, when rockets and monsters and spacemen were an everyday topic among young boys. :)

And yes, I realize this is far more interest than any sane human adult should have on this topic. :D

[Orrex]

21. Well, I'm poorly equipped to go mano a mano with you on it, you crazy geek!

:P

I deliberately excluded the original Gojira because it's frankly a different breed of film IMO.

And miniature-based film making is an all-but-dead art, and it truly is an art; when done correctly, it's far superior to most CGI to date. I mean, compare any SFX sequence in The Empire Strikes Back with any sequence in any of the prequel films--there's simply no comparison. It's amazing that a two-foot-tall plastic walker could look and feel more "real" than $150M worth of CGI 25 years later.

[Forkboy]

23. There's a split between G fans who want to keep the miniature and those that want CGI.

I agree with you that's a near dead art, but it's such a tradition in the G films that Toho is very reluctant to stop using it (not to mention they're a cheap company budget wise. Most G films of the 90's and Millenium have been under 5 million).

I'm torn on the issue. I love the miniatures and the guy in the suit stuff, but after seeing this cameo by Godzilla in the movie Always Sunset on Third Street 2 I'm no longer so sure CGI wouldn't work nicely. I just doubt Toho would pay as much as they would have to to do it right.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEEXydQc9KE

And what do you mean "crazy geek"? Oh sure, just because I have a little spare time on my hands to investigate such matters ....

:D

[Orrex]

25. That clip looks very cool--and it's the first I've heard of it

But YouTube is killing me--every four seconds or so, the feed freezes for eight seconds or so. Killing me, I tell you!