Van Halen's last worthwhile effort

[southpaw]

Feel free to disagree. Some would argue the '1984' album qualifies, while others would dare to defend 'Van Halen III.'

Hey, that's cool.

For me, this was the end... and it rocked!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OAf8rGapm0

[hobbit709]

1. What was their first?

[southpaw]

2. What sayest thou?

I say it was the debut album, but I suspect your opinion differs! ;-)

[hobbit709]

28. Worthwhile effort that is

[mikeytherat]

3. But this song contributed to the making of "Twister."

No matter how good, that disqualifies it immediately.

mikey_the_rat

[southpaw]

4. Pay no attention to the horrid movie behind the curtain

The song must be allowed to stand on its own.

And as for Twister, that's one of those that had a decent cast, but still horked.

I mean, you had Helen Hunt, Philip Seymour Hoffman, Alan Ruck and that guy who played Hudson in ALIENS and Chet in Weird Science!

[mikeytherat]

5. And it had Cary Elwes, whom I love as an actor, and he was awful.

Best "bad" line from the movie:

Bill Paxton (aka "Chet" from Weird Science) about Cary Elwes and his crew:
"They're in it for the money, not the science."

Presumably because Cary's team all drive black Chvy Suburbans. To this day when Mrs. Rat spies a black Suburban, she'll say, "They must be in it for the money, not the science!"

mikey_the_rat

[southpaw]

7. Yeah, Cary Elwes too...

What got me about Twister was how the tornadoes would dissapate as soon as they were done fucking with Paxton and his crew.

It was as if the storms only existed to torment Bill and Helen, after which they went away.

I do recall enjoying the FX...

[GreenPartyVoter]

44. I love that song, and my kids can't get enough of "Twister" We watch it every couple of months

[ghostsofgiants]

6. I'm with Hobbit709, I didn't know they had a first.

:P

[southpaw]

8. Well, not as auspicious as the first RUSH album, of course!

But then, who can compare! :evilgrin:

[ghostsofgiants]

10. Hahaha, of course, of course!

:P

[CreekDog]

9. ousting David Lee Roth was certainly worthwhile

i realize there is considerable disagreement in the Hagar v. Lee Roth camps. :eyes:

[southpaw]

11. DLR had run his course

They were due for a change, and all the internal strife resulted in the departure of Dave and the beginning of the Sammy era.

I was not a huge fan of Van Halen in either incarnation, but I enjoyed some of their songs from both the Dave and the Sammy years.

Gary Cherone... not so much.

I understand that the current quivering abortion they have been parading around as 'Van Halen' is trampling on the legacy to an appalling degree.

[KatyaR]

35. Why does everyone hate Sammy Hagar?

I never liked Van Halen until Sammy came on. Roth was too campy for my tastes. I thought Sammy was a real rocker.

And, uh, I'll be right over THERE if anybody needs me . . . .

[Alexander]

38. He can't drive 55, but he can drive around in a gas-guzzling Hummer...

I don't think many DUers like him.

[southpaw]

40. I don't like Sammy's right-leaning tendency

Never much cared for his testosterone-fueled machismo, either.


That said, some of his music, with Montrose, solo and with Van Halen, is pretty good.

DLR was capable of rocking in the early days, but turned to cheeze-whiz somewhere along the way.

[Zavulon]

12. Their fourth album was decent.

Diver Down was a disgrace and a ripoff, and once I heard "Jump" on the radio I gave up on the band entirely.

[southpaw]

14. Was that 'Women and Children First' or 'Fair Warning?'

I reacall liking some songs from both of those, but I can't remember the order of release.

And the Cradle Will Rock was pretty cool.

"Have you seen Junior's grades?"

[Zavulon]

15. Fair Warning.

Women and Children First was the third album. I actually liked the third better than the fourth ("Take Your Whiskey Home" was fucking KILLER), but both were good.

From there, it was all downhill. Their fifth album (Diver Down)was about a half hour with five covers. Inexcusable.

[southpaw]

17. As an album, Diver Down was sucky

I did enjoy their take on 'Dancin' in the Street' though.

My understanding was that Dave was the one who pushed for all the covers.

[Zavulon]

18. Dancin' in the Street

might have been okay to me had I been expecting something like that, but the way their third and fourth albums made up for the second one led me to believe I'd be getting some really good hard rock when I bought that record.

I swear, I was so pissed off that by the time they were singing "Happy Trails," with the laughter at the end, I almost thought the band was mocking me for being stupid enough to part with six bucks for that shit.

Then to hear "Jump?" No fucking way. I gave up on them for good after that. They may have had some good sings since then, but by then I had turned a deaf ear to them.

[southpaw]

19. Sweet Jesus! "Happy Trails" was an insult!

Bom Ba Dee Da, Bom Ba Dee Da...

[Westegg]

13. I sense some Metallica envy in this one...

...and I don't like to see classic bands trying to keep up with trends. But VH did that a lot, and while I admire some of their Sammy stuff, I too draw the line at "1984."

[southpaw]

16. Metallica envy???

I don't know. This sounds nothing like Metallica to me.

It was pretty in line with VH's sound from that time... check other songs from the 'Balance' album... Ed's guitar sound had evolved a wailing tone on top of his trademark 'brown sound.'

I'll give it another listen with Metallica in mind... but I'm not sure I agree on that assessment.

Though Sammy did look a bit like Hetfield, with the black clothes and glaring delivery.

[Westegg]

45. Your last sentence is what I mean...

...and also the start of the song. I would say "growling" as opposed to "glaring," and that's where I first picked up the Metallica vibe. The choruses were traditional VH, agreed, but my Metallica comment is just the overall feeling I got. I sense you know that you're talking about, though, so I will take another listen.

[flvegan]

20. 5150.

Yes, I admit that I liked this album.

[southpaw]

22. I thought 5150 kicked ass

Sammy had to come out strong if he was going to win over any of Dave's fans, and this was a pretty strong album overall.

'Summer Nights' sounded mean pumping out of a set of Jensen 6x9's!

On edit... the stuff from that album does seem dated by now... but I enjoyed it at the time.

[AngryAmish]

21. That isn't Van Halen

Sorry, VH died when Mr. Roth left.

[southpaw]

23. There are many, many people who agree with you.

They became a different band, that's for sure.

IMO, they truly died when Mr. Roth came back for a nostalgia tour with Wolfie on bass.

[Alexander]

27. Van Hagar makes me want to puke every time I hear them.

[Joe Fields]

36. It was a horrible mix. Sammy was much too good for that band.

Kind of like Joe Walsh joining the Eagles.

As for Van Halen, IMO, Van Halen II was the apex of the band.

[lildreamer316]

24. I agree, although I saw the tour after that....

VHIII had some moments that could have been a step foreward if Sammy had been at the helm...Ed had some new sounds. But Gary just ended up sounding like he was trying to hard to be Sam. It was what it was.

Balance was the best sonic album they EVER did. Front to back, it was thunderous.

[southpaw]

25. I agree RE 'Balance'

That album sounded HUGE!!!

Ed was playing through those custom Peavey amps by that time. I don't think he had yet switched to the Peavey guitar he was plying in this video (Humans Being), but the Music Man that preceded it was pretty much the same instrument.

Balance was really a great Sammy-era VH album. I need to get some of those songs again. I haven't owned a copy of that one in several years.


I heard VHIII, but I kept thinking that Eddie was trying to sound like Nuno Bettencourt! I guess when you hear Gary's voice and a guitarist who plays like Eddie Van Halen, it sounds like Extreme!

[lildreamer316]

31. Yea, see

I always thought Nuno sounded like Ed, although of course he developed his own flare after awhile. I dunno, I guess it goes both ways. ;)

[southpaw]

41. That's what I'm saying...

You take Gary Cherone and put him in a band with a guitarist who sounds like Eddie Van Halen (even if said guitarist actually IS Eddie Van Halen) and you gut music that sounds like Extreme.

[Alexander]

26. No love for "Fair Warning"? I thought that album rocked.

"Unchained", "Sinner's Swing", "So This Is Love"...lots of good stuff on that album.

[Arnold Judas Rimmer]

30. Absolutely the best Van Halen album

followed very closely by the first one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7P1d8BVvY-I

[carlyhippy]

39. every thing before sammy hagar

I LOVED Sammy Hagar when he was solo, saw him 2 different times in concert, but the VH years, I preferred the Diamond Dave years.

VH1, VH2 and Fair Warning are my favorites huge huge VH fan, seen them several times.

I have the whole catalogue.

[Arnold Judas Rimmer]

29. As far as Van Hagar songs go, that one wasn't awful

Eddie played well on it anyway. Sam's lyrics were horrible as usual. But it proves one thing... Eddie NEEDS creative tension in order to make worthwhile music, which is why 100% of Van Halen was better than 90% of Van Hagar, when he and Sam were buddies, and as a result, made music that sounded like a Hallmark card commercial.

[TK421]

32. The one before Sammy Hagar joined....then they really softened up

and almost resembled a type of pop group.

[southpaw]

42. Listen to '1984' again

That being the last David Lee album...

To my ears, it sounded very much like 5150, keyboards, more poppy, more top-40 hook oriented...
The big difference between those two albums was that Dave sang on one, Sammy on the other.

Again, I view Van Halen w/ Dave and Van Halen w/ Sammy as two very different bands. But it seems that Eddie was steering the band toward the Van Hagar sound even while Dave was still in the band.

[DU GrovelBot]

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[TK421]

34. Apparently, GrovelBot agrees with me n/t

[skygazer]

37. Their first album

It was all downhill from there.

[southpaw]

43. Really?

Most Van Halen purists at least give props to 'Fair Warning'