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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:08 PM
Original message
So, what makes a person an alcoholic?
Edited on Sun Aug-20-06 09:09 PM by GirlinContempt
Well?

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datasuspect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:09 PM
Response to Original message
1. it can be a number of things
but for me it was lots of practice.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Practice, eh?
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datasuspect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. you don't go in a barbershop unless you want a haircut
actually, alcoholic isn't that effective a descriptor for ALL the MANY different people who have substance abuse issues.

some people are binge drinkers, some can stop on their own, some drink in response to a terrible life event.

the "true alcoholic" of AA fame (from what 12 steppers call the "big book") is someone who has no effective mental defense against the first drink.

so, although they realize the calamity that drinking entails, and although they swear off and quit and curse their maker over and over, they find themselves trapped by what bill wilson calls "a mental blank spot." and anything can set it off. they find themselves drinking again.

in the depths of my struggle with booze, i likened it to having two people living in my head: one that wanted to do good and succeed and another that wanted to destroy me.

but i see that all as a royal mindfuck.

i drink because it accomplishes things i cannot accomplish by myself emotionally and coping wise - and because at times i actually like it. and because i am afraid of perceving reality without that short circuit.

but the press of the devastation and the reduction in my quality of life is causing me to rethink much of this and start to use some responsibility to not actually go over the deep end or to stop entirely.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. Well, I'm glad you're
working that out, or have worked that out.
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NewJeffCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
2. Alcohol?
I think.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. So alcohol is a disease?
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #5
34. Alcoholism and substance abuse of various kinds are
long considered as diseases. Google alcoholism
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #34
43. I get that some people consider alcoholISM a disease
but to say that alcohol makes you an alcoholic isn't enough i don't think
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Blue_In_AK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #43
49. If you drink and it causes you problems
you have an alcohol problem. Otherwise, you're just a heavy drinker.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:13 PM
Response to Original message
3. alcohol....
:shrug:

and the propensity for it above all else ;)
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. So a preference for alcohol
makes you a habitual drunk?
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #6
20. moi? a habitual drunk?
I have truly misrepresented myself on here :P



thing is: that alcoholism is baffling and complicated and compounding and substance abuse is just a blanket term...alcohol is the particular drug of choice in this instance


but, now onto the bigger and better subject of UFO's

is it a conspiracy?
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. That was a general you, not YOU you. I don't know YOU you well enough
to slander you in such a fashion. Give it a while.

So, UFOs, or as I prefer to think of them, Serious Business Flying Saucers, are totally a fucking conspiracy. I'm just not sure which one yet.

Thoughts? Feelings?
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. k
I am all for serious business flying saucers or UFOs as I prefer to type it.

thoughts: well, scientifically ...have we proof of their existence?

feelings: Hell yeah they ROCK and I so totally want to fly in one!
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. They all look sort of cramped, you know>
It makes it pretty hard to feel threatened. You know anything that comes outta there has got to be fucking tiny. And unless it's ebola, I'm not exactly shitting myself in terror at the thought.

However, they are pretty serious in the sense that they seriously produce chemtrails.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
7. This thread sort of reminds me of this book I saw the other day
titled Flying Saucers: Serious Business
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datasuspect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:25 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. now you have opened a can of worms there
shit. UFOs.

damn.

shit.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. Flying saucers are fucking serious god damn business
Don't you start with me
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Fox Mulder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. Damn right they are.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. Glad we're on the same page
Edited on Sun Aug-20-06 09:33 PM by GirlinContempt
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datasuspect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #12
22. talk about UFOs kinda freaks me out
takes me back to the time of my abduction: "we have reached the limits of what anal probing can teach us."
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. What's the limit?
Larynx?
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:25 PM
Response to Original message
10. Depression, obfuscation, abandonment, excommunication...
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Oh?
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. You did ask...
When you say "Oh", are you being sarcastic, or are you looking for me to adumbrate the details further?
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. maybe more details or something
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. Okey doke. From my perspective:
A person so overwrought with depression, or events that would cause depression (such as rejection - typically job loss, relationship problems, self-esteem issues having gone down because of a string of incidents...)

I also believe some minds are more vulnerable than others. Not all people respond to alcohol with a feel-good form. Myself being a case example, alcohol merely elevates my ambient mood. I do not lose any inhibitions at all. Or maybe I have not ingested a sufficient quantity of the alcoholic beverages in question. (at age 16, two long island iced teas was sufficient to make me feel "carefree". Today, two of them do nothing, and I do not drink alcohol very often at all. Nor did I back then either. :shrug: )

Dunno. But alcoholism is much like drugs, television, unsafe sex, politics, you name it. An addiction.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. So like
getting really really drunk a few times isn't alcoholic behavior. Only if it becomes an addiction.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. right....
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #19
23. those are just "things" it is the abuse of them that is the problem
tv is just a box with wires

it is when a person lets this patciular substance take control of thier live that the problem arises. Moderation in all things is key.
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graywarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:32 PM
Response to Original message
17. A thousand drinks are not enough, one is too many
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hyphenate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:42 PM
Response to Original message
27. Genetic disposition
is one theory, and while it doesn't answer all the questions, it answers many of them.

Another theory is that there is a region in the hypothalamus (sp?) part of the "pleasure center" which emits certain chemicals when activated by a substance, and in those with addictive personalities, it is on an amped up basis. As a result, the addictive personality gets addicted sooner than someone who doesn't have the same chemical response.

Other than that, I couldn't say, even though there are alcoholics in the family.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #27
38. Hmmmm... ok
Yeah like, my dad is an alcoholic, and his dad was too. But then my mum is, and neither of her parents were (as far as I know)
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idgiehkt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #38
41. yikes
both parents are alcoholics? bless your heart.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:59 PM
Response to Reply #41
44. Yeah but I mean really
they aren't the like, get falling down drunk and kick each other around alcoholics. They just get drunk every day, and it can make them a little unpredictable and weird, but like, they weren't ever dangerous or violent or whatever.
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hyphenate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #38
47. It isn't necessarily a direct link,
but a familial one. In my family, at least three siblings in my father's family (sister and both brothers) were alcoholics. My mother's brother was an alcoholic as well on that side of the family. The family profile includes all "first" relatives: aunts, uncles, cousins, grandparents and on backward. It can skip a generation and manifest itself in a grandchild, or go to a first cousin or such along the way. My mother could have been an alcoholic, but when we were teenagers, she stopped and never really drank much after that.

On the other hand, an adopted brother, who recently died at the age of 43, was a diehard alcoholic and his family had an enormous amount of child abuse in it from the father who was also an alcoholic. His sister is my sister in law (she married my brother) and she has always told me of the abuse they all suffered. (There were 8 of them, and after both parents died, they scattered to the four winds.)

There are quite a few studies out there on alcoholism, but you might just want to check out the al-ateen website or al-anon site. (They're associated) They have literature available for young people and relatives of alcoholics and how people need to learn to deal with them. There is usually a meeting schedule in most big cities with their own chapters where you can also pick up literature as well, or have something mailed to you. Just a suggestion--it helped me years ago when dealing with some of the alcoholics in my own life.
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Omphaloskepsis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:42 PM
Response to Original message
28. I would like to pass the buck...
Hearing the gunshot my mother fired into my father helped put me onto the road of drowning my thoughts.
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idgiehkt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. wow. so sorry.
Edited on Sun Aug-20-06 09:56 PM by idgiehkt
thats tough. I know you can get predispositioned to not be 'present' from traumatic stuff, I was.

edit: i should also add it's possible not to commit slow suicide over it too.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #28
36. Holy Fuck...that is worthy of some drinks...I don't give a shit what
Edited on Sun Aug-20-06 09:53 PM by wildhorses
the professionals say...just know that your mom and dad's story is only part of your story. Only YOU can write the rest of your story.
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:54 PM
Original message
Yeah, I could see that.
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MsKandice01 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:48 PM
Response to Original message
31. I've been wondering this myself...
I drink very frequently but never get "drunk". I like my wine but I know when to stop. I like the taste, I like a slight buzz, but I never get to the point where it affects my speech, my actions or my judgment. No one around me can ever tell I've been drinking, yet the frequency and the fact that I "crave" wine makes me think I might have a problem. Can you possibly be an alcoholic without it actually affecting your daily life?
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #31
40. I dunno, I mean, I crave say like
soda pop. That doesn't mean I'm addicted to soda, it means I *like* it and want it. Same with, I dunno, chips or curry or whatever. Sometimes, I get cravings for Fule or broken rice that just WONT go away. I'm hardly an Ethiopian or vietnamese food addict that needs a 12 step program, I just like those things. SO I somehow don't think craving something you enjoy is a definitive point of alcoholism. I wouldn't worry.
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Courtesy Flush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:50 PM
Response to Original message
33. See pic for answer
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. LOL
hahahahhahahahahahhahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhahahahahahhahahahahhaaaaaaaaaaahahaha
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Guava Jelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:54 PM
Response to Original message
37. Bigotry and label's
I mean can't a man destroy his liver in peace ??
:rofl:
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GirlinContempt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. No shit man
Fuck all ya'll, I'm drinkin' my fuckin' 26, and you can all be squares with the saucers.
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datasuspect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #39
42. rock and roll all nite
and party every day.
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reyd reid reed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
45. When it takes precedence over everything
else in your life. When it changes your life. I see it as being like an allergic reaction. Some people can drink and have no problems at all...some people take that first drink and it takes over. The rest of the world ceases to exist and it becomes all about that next drink.

But...what do I know?

:shrug:

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bridgit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 10:09 PM
Response to Original message
46. i think that for 'normal' folk, the ball can get rolling and they maybe...
Edited on Sun Aug-20-06 10:10 PM by bridgit
can't stop it somehow...for others it will be seen as an amalgam of ill fitting circumstance, or societal dynamic, as mentioned above; for yet others there can be a chemical predisposition; not unlike Kim Basinger alluded to in her roll in 'blind date', i've known them :eyes: oh boy...

but 'alcoholism' as but one on a tick-list of addictions in the pantheon of sorrows? absent the chemical component? can be fed back around and into itself by way of, to put it into a phrase; a broken heart and the desire to mend it...imo many garden variety additions start as a need to self medicate around an intractable sorrow

on the way to the store today there was a guy with a piece of plywood he was holding up for whatever reason just staring at it, round the backside as we drove by we seen that his pants had fallen down to his socks, and he didn't seem to have a care or a clue about the happenstance, but he was clearly looped, though on what it is hard to say...

on the way back, he had laid it down and was snoozing on it, with a little bag of something or other he had picked up from somewhere else

what a world
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Initech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 10:18 PM
Response to Original message
48. I picture alcoholics like Billy Bob Thornton on Bad Santa
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MoseyWalker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 10:23 PM
Response to Original message
50. Rain, leaky roofs and a genetic predisposition
that's how it happens.
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