(Jon Benet post). Wow, the handwriting in ransom note matches yearbook.

[bling bling]

Or at least that's my opinion after looking at them both. If that yearbook page was really signed by Karr it seems more plausable now that he really might be linked to the murder.

Though, I'm not a handwriting expert.

Has anybody else already compared these?

Yearbook (see bottom of page)




Ransom Note: (look at the word "and" in the ransom note and the word "and" in the yearbook. They look the same to me.

[tanyev]

1. Look at those ornate capital letters and the signature. Wow.

I'd love to hear a handwriting expert weigh in on that.

[LostinVA]

3. They said it doesn't look like the same handwriting

[tanyev]

18. I'm just referring to the yearbook entry.

That by itself is a very unusual handwriting sample.


Edit--quick internet search found this:

Vanity : It is easily identified in the ornate, and frequently otherwise unmeaning, flourish beneath the signature. The capitals, too, tend to exaggeration in form and over-elaboration.
http://www.astrojyotishi.com/Graphology.htm

[LostinVA]

2. Secret Service expert has said it doesn't

http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/08/18/karr.questions/index.html

nother piece of Karr's writing that has been passed along to authorities is a yearbook inscription he made in 1982. In capital block letters, his closing words were, "Though, deep in the future, maybe I shall be the conquerer and live in multiple peace."

The ransom note found in the Ramsey home had demanded money for JonBenet's return and had ended with the word "Victory!" and was signed "S.B.T.C." Authorities want to know whether those letters might stand for "shall be the conquerer" and whether they could have been written by the same person.

John Hargett, who once ran the documents section of the U.S. Secret Service, told CNN the letters represent "a very interesting coincidence." But he said he saw "no similarity" between the handwriting used in the ransom note and that in the yearbook.

***********

I think the authorities are really stetching.

[jobycom]

24. You left off the next line in the article, by the same handwriting expert

However, the handwriting in the yearbook -- with flourish, in an artistic style -- also was not likely Karr's normal writing style at the time, Hargett added.

[LostinVA]

40. No, I didn't "leave it off"

Three paragraph rule.

[az chela]

4. The writing in the year book is much fancier than the note.

He might have scribbled the ransom note which would make sense

[rumpel]

5. looks different to me

check the "g" and "f"

[Whoa_Nelly]

6. I don't think the handwriting you're showing looks anything alike

All of these lower case letters while similar in style, are not written even remotely by the same hand.

c, a, e, w, s, o, b, f

And the letter "r" in the yearbook is always capitalized, while it's not in the ransom note.

I see absolutely no similarities between the two samples.

[MercutioATC]

7. There's absolute NO similarity.

d's, S's, g's, r's, e's, etc...

All completely different.


I'm no handwriting expert, but I don't see the most distinguishing letters having anything in common.

[Beausoir]

8. Not even close. They have the wrong person. n/t

[starroute]

9. Doesn't look that way to me.

I agree the yearbook and the note are similar in that both use certain letter-form that are more like those of printed type than of most people's handwritten letters. For example, the "a" has an upward line in both and the "t" has a curve at the bottom.

However, the style of the writing does not seem at all similar. The yearbook writing is much more curved -- the upward line of the "a" loops over and down, the final upstroke of the "w" curves back towards the middle upstroke, etc. The ransom note has more straight lines, and rather than the final strokes of letters curving smoothly inward, they often angle outward, away from the main body of the letter -- for example, various occurrences of t, n, d, h, u, e.

Those things are far more intrinsic to an individual than mere letter-forms, and I'd put far more confidence in them.

[bahrbearian]

10. You forgot the Sarcasm Icon. N/T

[Bjornsdotter]

11. Nope

The yearbook script slants to the left, the note it slants to the right.

Just my opinion...

Cheers

[bling bling]

12. The words "and" and "the" are spitting images.

Look at the word "And" in line 8 (first word of line 8) of ransom note, looks just like the "and" in the yearbook, same d, same style a.

Look at the word "the" in line 4, (last word of line 4) of ransom note. The t, h, and e, matches the t, h, and e's in the yearbook.

[Whoa_Nelly]

31. "and "& "the" are not even remotely the same

maybe by style of writing, but not in formation of the words or letters.

The ransom note looks nothing like the yearbook writing.

[flyarm]

13. a profiler who looked at the note very carefully said

the ransome note was like it was copied from something else....gosh i forget the words she said, but it was like a transfer from something underneath it..
as if you put a page underneath a paper and copied it like sketching over another document.

she said no way could this guys writing be used to find proof of involvement...she also said it couldn't be used because it was already deemed by the DA to match the mothers handwriting..so they can't now say..oh no ..now its not Patsy's..when they already deemed it was..

thats what i saw yesterday of a profiler who worked on this case.

fly

[elehhhhna]

15. yes, traced from a typed doc w/ a certain font (which one I can't recall)

[L A Woman]

27. huh? it was NEVER deemed to match the mother's handwriting

handwriting experts said they could not RULE OUT patsy as the author of the note. That is not the same thing as saying it matched her handwriting. They couldn't rule ME out, either. it was inconclusive.

[LostinVA]

39. OMG! I hadn't heard that -- how interesting

[johnnie]

14. Sorry, not even close

I see two totally different styles of writing. Even taking into account that the ransom note was written by someone in a hurry or anxious, there is no similar style at all in my opinion.

[uppityperson]

16. excellent!

first one of these I have posted on, only checked a few and I wanted to say yours is the best so far.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

17. WOW! . . . .

not. Don't quit your day job.

[MysteryToMyself]

19. I have to agree with Bling Bling

Try writing in print with your left hand if, you are right handed. Most people would do something like that to disguise their handwriting.

Remember there have been many years passed since his high school days and now. I learned to print and write twice as well as I did as a student, when helping the children with their homework.

But then again, that may be a recent writing of his in the yearbook of a student.

They have retracted that he said he picked her up at school and also retracted that he said he drugged her.

One of the neighbors said they saw a flashlight beam in the kitchen at 2 a.m that night. That sounds more like what an intruder would do. They had 17 people that had keys to the house. They also had an open house not long before that happened. They had Christmas Decorators to decorate their house. Mr. Ramsey had something written in the paper about him. Sometimes someone up to no good will unlock a window if they get a chance then slip back later. Someone could make a key replica and sell it to a crook... There was a man that rented the basement across the street that left town the next day they told ten years ago.

400 children are murdered every year, but 99+ per cent of them are killed by their parents or other relatives. It is rare for a pedophile to kill. When they get one they ought to study his environment, his dna and every tiny detail.

[jilln]

20. The yearbook writer seems crazy and grammar is weird, but can spell...

The ransom note has better grammar and is less weird, but the writer cannot spell. It could be intentional.

In any case, my handwriting now looks nothing like my handwriting in high school. So many things can happen to change someone's handwriting.

[WinkyDink]

21. "A Mother Gone Bad" analyzes the print, and determines the note to

have been traced over a computer page with a particular font. The letters are aligned in columns.

[bling bling]

22. eH? wonder why this was moved to the lounge.

Not that I don't think the lounge is awesome. But this was an investigative/attempting to get to bottom of unsolved mystery thread. It's business, not pleasure.

I don't get it.

But anyway, hello to all the lounge folks. I don't come here that often accept for when I need to relax and maybe have a laugh.

[Proud2BAmurkin]

23. Nope. Lower case "a" and "t" are less common formations but overall not

close

[jobycom]

25. There are a few interesting similarities

The way the letters slant (look at the "b"s, the way he forms "a," and capital "I" with long lines over top and bottom.

The ransom note was ten years or so later, if I did the math right, and his writing would have changed through school and life writing. The handwriting expert who said it wasn't the same writing also added that he was probably not using his normal style in the yearbook.

I think people are too ready to dismiss him. I'm not convinced, but I'm not dead certain he's innocent, either. There are little things, like the pretentious style of both the letter and the yearbook. And more details are coming out about the confession and the wife's alibi. The claim that he confessed to drugging her and that he said he picked her up from school have been refuted, for instance, and the wife now says that she doesn't remember a Christmas when he was away, rather than that she remembers the Christmas when JonBennet was killed.

Isn't this the craziest case? The parents denied any involvement and everyone was convinced they did it, and now someone is swearing he did it and everyone is convinced he's lying.

[bling bling]

34. It is crazy.

I think that's why I'm interested in the story (despite the fact that I don't like how it's been in the spotlight and sensationalized way too much). It's kind of like a mystery novel to some degree. It just gets curioser and curioser. It's kind of intriging in that way.

[L A Woman]

26. shall be the conqueror - jon benet's note was signed SBTC

i don't know, folks! my handwriting looks very little like it did when i was in high school. i'm sure a handwriting expert could see the similarity, but ...i don't know.

CNN is reporting that investigators are interested in the yearbook because of the phrase "shall be the conqueror." The ransom note ended with, "Victory! S.B.T.C."

And I think they have some evidence we don't know about yet. And his ex-wife doesn't remember what state she was in at Xmas 1996, (she thinks it was Georgia or Alabama) so I am not sure how much her word means....

I wouldn't count him out just yet! He's sure a nutter, no matter what!

[Floogeldy]

28. Don't quit your day job.

}(

[bling bling]

35. I won't. But I don't really have a day job.

I take care of my baby all day. Pays like shit but the benefits are outstanding. :D
I do have to admit that I get most of my desperately needed mental stimulation by reading/participating in news/political discussions. But maybe I got carried away with this little detective bling bling bit. However, IMO, I still think there's some striking handwriting similarities......

[johnnie]

29. How about this?

This is from the ransom note



This is from Patsy Ramsey:




Check out the "y" in each

[L A Woman]

30. shit! *I* did it!

that's exactly how my y's look!

And I can't remember where I spent Christmas 1996!

damn!

[johnnie]

33. LOL

Well, maybe you did. John Karr's on the other hand looks nothing like that.

[bling bling]

36. Her writing looks like girl writing, ransom note looks like guy writing.

But that's just my unprofessional opinion. They y's look very much alike. Wierd that she uses one style "a" in her first name and a different style "a" in her last name.

[Proud2BAmurkin]

44. The "a" is even more remarkable.

It's definitely her

[frogmarch]

32. I see no resemblance

between the suspect's handwriting and that on the so-called "ransom" note.

I do, however, see a resemblance between Patsy Ramsey's handwriting and that on the note.

Law enforcement required Patsy to write the words from the note so they could compare her handwriting to that on the actual note. Try as she might, and it's obvious she tried, she couldn't make her writing differ much from the writing on the note

Check it out:

[MysteryToMyself]

37. I can't get the image link to work

Most would try to disguise their handwriting by using their left hand and deliberately changing some letters, wouldn't they? Or do I have a criminal mind?

[MysteryToMyself]

38. This is very unscientific

But I have noticed that relatives usually have a lot of similar handwriting. It may be that they had the same writing teachers or their mother helped them to learn to write. Or it may be the writing was fashionable in their time.

[Pithlet]

43. It's not scientific, but

my handwriting looks a lot like my dad's. I have the same horrible chicken scratch handwriting he does. And my sister writes beautifully, just like my mom.

Personally, I don't think handwriting evidence alone is solid evidence. My handwriting certainly doesn't look the same as it did in high school. It was actually much neater back then.

[frogmarch]

42. Sorry - Try this

http://blabbieville.tripod.com/

The image I used was the first one in the second row.

[New Earth]

41. i'm not a pro

but i'm pretty good at 'analyzing' handwriting and to me, this certainly looks like Patsy's handwriting.

[Lex]

45. Interesting link to an analysis of the Ransom Note--

Not saying I agree or disagree with it, but it's interesting (and longish):

http://www.forumsforjustice.org/forums/showthread.php?t=6404