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My little brother just got in a fistfight outside my apartment building...

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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:06 AM
Original message
My little brother just got in a fistfight outside my apartment building...
Well, not "just" I should say a few hours ago. My Uncle came by to give me a ride to the store and my brother was in the bathroom when we left. After a minute or two he came out to find that we were gone, so he jogged outside and down my stairs to catch us to tell us something. Well, he turned around a corner and bumped into some guy who was walking with a girl (sister or gf? he wasn't sure) and a younger kid. My brother is 21, about 6' tall and maybe 160 something, and he said this guy was a few inches taller and 30 or so pounds heavier plus several years older. I might know who he is if it's a guy who lives in my apt complex. He said he was black too, and I see a guy around here who fits the description. Well anyway, my brother bumped into him and immediately says: "Sorry, dude." So the guy, instead of accepting the apology and moving on, starts making fun of my brother for saying "dude." So my brother tried to brush it off and said "sorry, man, I didn't mean to bump into you." Then the guy starts making fun of him because he said "man." Ok, my brother has fought in Mixed Martial Arts (cage fighting, No Holds Barred etc) contests before and is undefeated. He's not somebody to mess with at all. He looks kind of skinny and so on, but his skill is unbelievable.

Well, there is no way this guy could know that he was making a mistake like that so my brother is trying to apologize and move on with it. But the guy started daring my brother to fight him and saying he beats up white boys all the time etc. (we're Blackfeet Indian, btw, albeit pretty light-skinned) So it kept escalating and escalating and the guy told my brother to go into our little complex enclosure, where there is grass and a pool etc and fight. So they went in and fought. Not a good thing for that guy. My brother hit him a few times and knocked him down; he figured the guy would quit then, so he let him up. Well then the guy starts throwing punches again and my brother pummelled him pretty bad. He headbutted him three times and knocked him cold. By that time, a lot of people came out of their apartments to watch, as they had heard the argument and the guy when he kept calling my brother out to fight. So I get back to from the store and my brother is washing some guys blood off of him. It was scary as I thought he was hurt, but none of it was his. Then I went down to get the mail and which is right by where the fight was and the sidewalk was all wet from somebody wiping blood off of it.

The thing is, I get worried because sometimes you get stupid people around here. I have almost got into a few fights just going to the store next door. A few times people have said things to me, trying to start something. Most of the time you can get out of situations like that. You have to stick up for yourself, but it's never good to look for something like that. The guy made a mistake by trying to pick on my brother, that was just dumb luck. I mean 99 percent of the time you could start a fight and the guy isn't going to be someone who fights in competitions. It just isn't going to happen. However, what if a fight breaks out and somebody has a knife? Or a gun? That's a tough situation, one that I think can happen to anybody. Sometimes things happen whether you are looking for it or not, or starting it or not. My brother practically ran right into a situation he couldn't get out of, with somebody who was overly aggressive. Thank God it wasn't somebody with a weapon, but just somebody who wanted to settle it with fists, which is bad enough, I guess, but not as bad as getting shot at or stabbed. I suppose what I'm getting at is, we are all mortal, we are all susceptible and any one of us at anytime could get into a bad situation. And, I hope we can all recognize that and be careful.
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:23 AM
Response to Original message
1. Damn...
I was about ready to ask if your brother needed help, I'm not one to shy away from any physical fight!... :) But it sounds like he didn't need my help in the least bit...at least he is okay for now, but nowadays, whenever you get into fights, you have to look out for retribution, and what not...Hopefully this guy takes his licks, and moves on, but sometimes guys like that, dont' let shit slide...especially if he was made to look a fool in front of others(in this case the female)....
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. yes, I never worry about the
one's who will fight you straight up and that's that. It's always the cowardly ones who might jump somebody with several buddies or something. My family is pretty physical. I was an internationally competitive wrestler, boxed in smokers etc. He's our youngest and by far and away the toughest. Not even close. I have 3 other brothers too, so he had to grow up with three big brothers that he had to wrestle, fight and box around with, haha. We created something none of us can handle, lol. He's funny because he's just like an overgrown pup too. Until he gets into some action. Viciously competitive as well. I'm not against fighting. I never have shied away from one either. I think it's better than a settling something with a knife or gun, however there is a time and a place for fighting. If a person just goes out and looks for something, that's pretty gutless if you ask me. If you do it because you have to defend yourself or someone else, I think a person has to do what they have to do, you know?
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. Yep...
A person has to do, what they have to do... :) Damn, and your a wrestler too, one after my own heart...A few of my buddies, would always tussle around, and my friend Angel and I were big wrestling fans, because in most fights, after the first flurry of punches and what not, it usually ends up on the ground quick...My style of fighting, is bouncing your head off a damn wall, or off a curb... :) I'm a big man, but like all my friends say, "You may be big, but by god, you move so DAMN FAST!" I'm 6'4, 330...and I'm quick... ;) Football/wrestling/judo, under my belt... :)
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 02:04 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. I know a little
judo and jiu-jitsu. I adapted a lot of judo throws into wrestling throws when I was competing. I just always like to toss people, haha. Jiu-jitsu is something I became interested in when MMA first started coming around. I taught myself lots of jointlocks and chokes, how to use a guard etc. It's fun stuff. Hell, I'm small, I'm 5'1, I used to have to stick up for myself so I had to learn to fight when I was young. I'm from a reservation, we pretty much grow up having to learn how to defend yourself. I think sometimes fighting can be addictive though. It's a rush. Sounds sorta sick, but it is. :)
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. Ah...
Indian, huh? I think I talked to you before...I'm Haida, from SE Alaska...I'm not from the Rez though.. :) A short one too! :) I had to grow up fighting, because of my size, people would always test me, but when i started football, I didn't fight hardly at all, in high school, because every bad ass, played football, and knew, i was a mountain of man, and didn't want to be on my bad side...but like your brother, i'm a pup usually, unless someone really goes out of their way to cause me trouble... :)
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 02:16 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. yeah that's right
I was trying to think about where I saw your SN before. Yeah, you sorta remind me of my friend that I mentioned in my other reply. Huge, Indian guy, great football and basketball player, most people never messed with him much in HS. Older people would test him and stuff. He wasn't wimpy or anything, but he didn't realize he was a monster yet. So sometimes older guys would get away with messing with him. Then he got around 20, 21 or so and got a killer instinct. That guy is scary when he's mad too! Not good. :)
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enigmatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:28 AM
Response to Original message
2. "Let's be careful out there"
Edited on Sat Mar-04-06 01:40 AM by enigmatic
Truer words were never spoken.

I've gotten into my share of fights; I know it's a cliche, but I never intigated one, I had the dumb luck of being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Although I can always handled myself well, all it takes is one guy w/ a knife or gun, and it's bad, bad mojo.

Tell your bro we've got hs back, though :)
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:42 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. some people are magnets
for that stuff too. It really is dumb luck to be in the wrong place at the wrong time like that. The weapon factor is worrisome. You just never know who might be packing what. That's scary. For some reason or another, people try picking on him. They just see a tall skinny kid walking by himself or something and decide to test him. It happens sometimes. Like I said, he's the wrong guy to mess with. This big guy that lives down the street from us just got out of prison, he was in a Mexican gang and all buffed up from working out in the joint. Anyway, he was talking to a friend of ours one morning in the parking lot of a grocery store across the street. My brother went by and said hello to our friend. This guy just went ballistic on him, calling him a white boy, getting in his face. Hell, my brother didn't even know the guy. So he walks in the store and the guy follows him around trying to start something and punk my brother out. This is like 6 AM too. My brother kept trying to get some stuff (I was about to cook breakfast) but the guy wouldn't let up. So finally, some guy who works in the store said, you should just go outside and do what you have to do, this guy won't quit yelling in the store and I'm not going to call you guys in if you step outside with him. So they guy leaves and my brother walks outside a little later with groceries and this guy is waiting for him outside. Finally, they went at it. A couple quick punches and the guy was out like a light. My brother broke his nose bad, bent it to the side of his face. Not good. Our friend had to drag the guy unconcious home. My brother hit his so hard the guy sees him all the time now but doesn't even remember his name of who he is. Yeah, he's not somebody to mess with too much.

You better have his back, or I'm telling Mom. :)
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 02:03 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. I think you are on to something there...
I think, people start shit with your brother because of his size. Just hear me out. In my experiences, most people pick on someone that they think, they can beat up, and in this case, I guess your brother fits that mold because of his stature. I know, because of my size, that people avoid me, but on the flip side of that coin, I know my size CAUSED fights, because in some of my fights, they come up to me, because, usually I'm the biggest/tallest man in any given room...and some people make beelines for guys like me... :) But I don't dissapoint!... :)
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #12
15. hahaha
yes, my best friend all my life has always been big. He used to be a bit of a momma's boy until one day he realized that he was about 6'6 and 340-50. Pretty much all muscle too, quick as hell, he played semi-pro football for several years, played at a community college as well. He had a chance to try out for the CFL and could've gone to the NFL at least for a short time, but he got into partying too much etc. Once he realized he had those tools he started smacking people down hard. U was always amazed at how many people actually made it a point to go after him. So yeah, big guy's tend to draw stuff like that. I've seen that a lot too. I'm the exact opposite. I'm short, but I'm hypercompetitive, always used to be really muscular when I competed etc. I kind of can be grouchy too. People around my size never messed with me ever. Then because of my friend, usually big people weren't dumb enough to mess with me either. So I was pretty lucky that I never had to do much fighting. Just when I was backed into something that I had to do.
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. Yeah
Sounds a bit like myself... :) I usually am leery of anyone, that i'm going up against, because I know that there are guys out there, who are short/skinny who can throw down. My friend Angel is 6'1, 145lbs, and he is still by far, the roughest I have had in a wrestling match...its not that he can do anything to me, its just, that his holds on me, I can't do anything, its like a draw, unless i start ramming him into the walls and shit...sort of like how Andre the Giant was doing to Wesley on Princess Bride, but in matches like that, we are not aiming to hurt anyone...most of our wrestling matches, end up in stales, because we either get tired, or no progress is made...sort of reminds me of

Reed Richards(Mr. Fantastic) and Ben Grimm aka The Thing fighting one another...neither one can win, but they usually end in stales...I have gotten him 5 times, and he has never gotten over on me, but we have staled at least 20 times, if not mroe...he is very lanky, and I call him mr. elastic, because he just holds on for the ride...
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Robeson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:38 AM
Response to Original message
4. I hope your brother knows how to fight his fights wisely...
...a gun, is always a great leveler. He's lucky the guy didn't have one.
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:44 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. no kidding
he only does it if he has to though. He's pretty even tempered, takes him a lot to get all that mad.
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Floogeldy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:40 AM
Response to Original message
5. I'd like to hear the other guy's side of the story.
.
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:45 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. I'll be sure to ask him
:)
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Droopy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:55 AM
Response to Original message
9. If a guy were to pick a fight with me I'd tell him no way
I don't want to hurt anyone and I sure as hell don't want to get hurt. This doesn't sound like a clear case of self defense to me. Tell your brother to be careful. It's ok when he's in the ring, but outside of that there's potential for all kinds of harm.
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. yeah, I wish he'd let stuff go a little
I think he let this guy get to him a little. So finally he just went where the guy wanted to go fight at and they did it. He's not totally mature yet, a more mature person would be able to not let that get in their head, you know?
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Robeson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 02:05 AM
Response to Reply #11
14. A lot of that has to do with the fact that a more mature person....
...has come to the realization that they are not immortal. I really hope you brother calms it down.
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 02:19 AM
Response to Reply #14
19. yeah, he's 21
still in that stage when a person isn't fully grown up. He's better at letting stuff go then he used to be. Still needs to work on that though.
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obxhead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 02:24 AM
Response to Original message
20. your bro was right to stick up for himself, but
at the same time as a trained fighter he could have handled the situation much better....

A business card and a challenge to a good sparing match in a ring would have been much better. Give the card to the girl and toss out the challenge.... Where it would have gone from there is anyones guess, but it could have been handled in a much better (and dare I say professional) manner.

In the same shoes as your bro I would have done everything to avoid that fight (from your story it sounds like he did that for the most part), but as a trained fighter you need to watch yourself. As a trained fighter, you can be considered a "deadly weapon" without having any knives or guns on your person. Jail is no place for any person that is only standing up for themselves.

Your point of the other having a weapon is very valid as well. In this day and age of "disposable" firearms it really can be anyones guess.
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rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #20
24. A business card and an invitation?
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pokerfan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 02:56 AM
Response to Original message
21. When you said fistfight, I was worried
cause hitting human skulls with your fists is a great way to break bones in your hands.

Even before you said your brother was an expert in MMA, I was going to suggest that he take the dude down, put him in an arm bar and break his little finger. That pretty much ends the "fight/contest/sport" thing right there but without any expensive dental bills.

I wrestled in HS and I've since had some basic Jiu Jitsu training (certainly more than the average tough guy) and I will always take the fight to the ground and look for a submission hold. Or give him a snort full of pepper spray.

I've never understood the whole sportfighting thing when someone is seriously trying to hurt me or one of my own. It's as absurd as challenging the dude to a game of say, backgammon. I mean, we are going to engage in a sport "with rules" where you are trying to knock my teeth out? I don't think so.


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LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 03:19 AM
Response to Original message
22. Everyone is probably asleep by now
since it's now early am but I just don't get it, not being a man and all. WHY do males (some) want to physically hurt each other? When I was little and one of us (kids) would get into an argument with each other my dad would tell us to go to the back yard and work it out, he told us if we had to beat the hell out of each other to go ahead but not to come back in until we had worked it out, one way or another. :wow:

My mother would just look at us and say, now children, "love one another", :eyes: um no mom that won't happen either.

Is it plain old testosterone?
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Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 08:11 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. a lot of it is immaturity
but I think being raised by men from a different era, they have more of an idea that people should just settle something with their fists and let that be that. Before our society really had to worry about guns and knives etc. That and men have a certain instinct, be it from testosterone or not, to get violent in some way. Whether it's Dick Cheney pretending to be manly with a gun, or Bush standing up saying "Bring 'em on" or two guys, like my brother and the other guy, each escalating something they should be able to walk away from. It didn't help that the woman was instigating it a little. I didn't mention that in my op, but she kept telling the other guy to "Kill him" or "get him." Men are less likely to back down in a situation like that because we have some macho thing about looking weak in front of a woman. It's stupid, but it happens. Especially when a person is young, because things that aren't so important seem big to you then. 10 years ago I may have done the same thing my brother did. He's 21 and now I'm 31, and the biggest difference in how we would each react to something like that is I would be mature enough to let it go. He's not.
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LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 10:17 AM
Response to Reply #23
26. Don't get me wrong, there have been times when I was
younger that I would have gladly defended myself. :evilgrin: I noticed that my son and my husband (not my son's father) love to arm wrestle. Last summer they were outside until 11:00 at night just "play" fighting telling each other stuff that you hear matcom and DS1 say to each other. I just went in the house, (giggling to myself :eyes: thinking; I'm really glad my friends and female relatives don't want to arm wrestle for fun, especially at 11:00 at night). :D
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ucmike Donating Member (999 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
25. good. the guy got what he deserved.
sounds like a guy who has been in plenty of fights, mostly with people who had no chance. congrats to your brother for whipping the ass of a guy who probably really deserved a little kharma payback. he made the situation and paid for it.

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