He died because he was afraid to go to the hospital with just medicare.

[caty]

This is a quote from an e-mail we received regarding the death of a relative:

"John started hurting about 1pm Tuesday and would not let Anne call the doctor or ambulance. He was hurting in chest and down right arm and died on his couch with his dog Max beside him between 4-5am wednesday morning. He had told us about a week ago that if anything happened to him bad he would just have to die cause he did not have any supplemental insurance to go with medicare cause they could not afford it."

How many Americans die everyday because they are so afraid of getting into dept and won't go to the doctor or hospital? We live in what is supposed to be the greatest country in the world, and this goes on and on. I am angry. I am disappointed in our country. I am disgusted with myself and all Americans who haven't found a way to "insist" that all Americans can afford to have decent health care.

[Rhiannon12866]

1. Jesus. Words fail me.

What a terrible tragedy that this had to happen in the richest country in the world...:grr:

I am so very sorry.;(

Rhiannon

[supernova]

2. Incredibly sad

My condolences caty.

That's increcibly angering that he felt he'd rather die than get treatment for his heart attack because he couldn't afford it.

:cry: :grr:

There are people already who don't take care of their chronic conditions as they should because they can't afford the supplies, diabetes testing for one.

[DS1]

3. I could've sworn I read this email a month or so ago

[caty]

4. There are probably

many similar tragedies that happen everyday. This is what just happened to our second cousin.

[TheProphetess]

5. I"m terribly sorry

What a tragedy - and it keeps happening. Either the government's lack of concern kills them or the hospital's mistreatment kills them. Both happen much too often.

[Midlodemocrat]

6. Foolish. You can make arrangements with hospitals and pay them

as little as $10 a month as long as you are paying something. Going into debt is not a reason to risk death.

[caty]

7. I realize that.

But, John was a strong southern man who worked hard all his life to support his family and stay out of debt. Some people just don't understand that they can work out a payment plan. They just see that huge debt that is owed. And, if he didn't believe he could afford supplemental health care coverage, he probably didn't believe he could afford a payment plan either.

[supernova]

8. I'm familiar with the type

of person you are talking about. I grew up with them.

Extremely proud doesn't begin to cover it.

[caty]

11. People who grew up

during the depression have a whole different outlook on debt than we do. Debt to them is something to be feared. We figure we will pay it off eventually, but they see debt as something that will never go away.

[Lady Freedom]

10. Not so! I tried and they turned me down flat! They said I either had to...

qualify for a special bank loan ( I didn't make enough for the loan) or pay the whole thing at once!

[Midlodemocrat]

12. Every state in the union has laws that if you go to the ER

with emergency symptoms, they have to treat you regardless of your financial status. This also applies to women in labor.

They HAVE to treat you. Or refer you to a neighboring hospital that can treat you without endangering your life. It is the law.

[Lady Freedom]

13. Oh yes they have to treat you, then they get to cause you...

Bankruptcy!

[pitohui]

16. lady freedom is correct

an example i might give is of a man in new orleans who had brain surgery in the 70s at charity hospital when he had no money, not that he ever did have any, they were still hounding him for the money in the 90s, they hounded him until the day he died

there is no payment plan any more, they take everything, and if you are down as under or uninsured, the bill is higher because you are not charged the lower prices negotiated by the insurance companies

the uninsured actually subsidize the health care of the insured, it's crazy world

[Midlodemocrat]

21. If the situation is an ER situation, they have to treat you

even if you can't pay. It is the law.

My best friend's mother had heart surgery about 15 years ago and they put her on a payment plan of $15 a month. She doesn't have it paid off, but she doesn't care. She is still here and paying that amount monthly.

[pitohui]

22. yes i understand that happened 15 yrs ago

unfortunately it sounds like "john" took sick last week

yes, the ER will treat you but they will impoverish you, after a certain age where you know you can't make the money back it is not necessarily a stupid choice just to quietly go off and die somewhere

[Midlodemocrat]

24. Is dying preferable to debt?

Of course not. When I had my youngest, we had an insurance switch mid pregnancy and I negotiated the same rate with the hospital where I delivered her as the hospital where I was told to go to be fully covered.

Of course, I understand the lack of healthcare in this country and the unfortunate things that come from it, but I would go into debt in a minute if it kept me or one of mine alive.

[Gormy Cuss]

19. They are required to treat you in an emergency unless they can dump you

on another hospital and some of the for-profit chains have perfected the art of doing the latter. They have an economic incentive to do so for uninsured or underinsured patients.

The treatment, when they are forced to take an uninsured patient, is limiting to stabilizing the patient so they can transfer him/her out. And they do go after the patient for payment in the most aggressive manner possible.

This is one of the reasons why more Americans are waking up to the problems of a privately managed health insurance strategy. Our system is broken. We need national health care NOW.

[pitohui]

15. not any more you can't

this is pretty dated information, the hospitals have figured out all those financial advisor of the 80s gave such advice and they have hired pit bulls for collection agents

the choice is you can die or you can destroy your family and put your spouse in a position where she might as well commit suicide too because she can never pay off the debt

have to admit i might very well make the same choice as "john" rather than impoverish my spouse who is much younger than myself

health care comes w. no guarantee, "john" may have gone to the hospital, run up a big bill, and died anyway

that was prob. what made the decision for him

he was a hero

but it's pretty shitty we live in a country where a person has to be that kind of hero to protect their family

[hippywife]

18. That's not universally true.

I have a hospital bill of almost a $1000 (my after insurance portion) and a doctor bill of $200. The doctor is working with me but the hospital insists I must have them paid in full by March and have sent me info on a loan program they participate in that will charge me 18% interest and a $10 fee.

The same hospital turned us over to collections when my husband had back surgery there even tho we were paying them what we could each month.

They got the damn lion's share of the charges from the insurance company and they even write off a good size of it for them. But they had enough money to hire Gallup to call me to push poll me on the service I received there.

[Midlodemocrat]

20. Actually. Yes it is like in cases like the OP's cousin.

The ER has to treat you. By law. If it isn't an ER situation, then it probably varies, but I know my next door neighbor was on a very minimal payment plan for 10 years when her son contracted cancer and they couldn't pay for his care.

This more do to the fact that dad is lazy and pretty much refused to work full time, so they had no insurance.

Their payments were very small $25 a month or so. After the child got sick, his mom got a job with full benefits and from that point on the care was covered.

[Lady Freedom]

9. I am one of those people!

I do not make enough to get any coverage,and I make to much to get help.I am a part timer so work won't pay for insurance on me. so I either have to go in dept of suffer.
Yes Virgina(Repukes), There is working poor!!!

[Karenina]

14. I would dare conjecture

this scenario is being reapeated throughout the U.S. on a scale that if ever documented, would cause riots. However, TPTB have learned well from their predecessors. No data, no nasty pictures, no boxcars or gas chambers... just deny lifesaving measures like access to medication. One by one they are sent off to the great beyond...

[Wapsie B]

17. Oh gosh doesn't it feel so wonderful

to live in such a civilized country? :sarcasm:

[pitohui]

23. question about your parrot

did you create that yourself? i would like to posterize (is that even the right term) a picture of my own parrot like that, any tips on how it was done?

it looks v. nice

[Wapsie B]

25. Thanks.

No I didn't create it myself. It's the Tiger-Hawk emblem, an official symbol of the Iowa Hawkeyes, created in the late 70's. But I forget who did it.