High School Suspends Wicca Student For Makeup

[matcom]

<snip>

In what is shaping as a battle between conformity and self-expression, Pacific High School suspended a ninth-grade boy Monday for wearing lipstick and eye makeup.

Officials are calling it a violation of school policy, which they seemed unable to find in writing.

James Herndon, 16, repeating his second year at the school, and his mother, Valerie Wallace, say James has been wearing black lipstick and red eye makeup since he enrolled at Pacific. He also wears his hair in a dyed-red Mohawk with the sides shaved, but that was not cited as part of the reason for the five-day suspension.

The youth said the makeup expresses religious beliefs he shares with his mother, a Wicca priestess in the neo-pagan religion based on northern European beliefs in the supernatural.

James also said the suspension is sex discrimination and violates his constitutional right to free expression.

"If I can't wear makeup, then the girls or the staff can't wear makeup either,'James said,

He said the makeup is not an expression of sexual orientation. The boy also dresses in black clothing in the fashion of self-styled Goths, familiar figures among students on high school campuses for several decades.

http://www.whittierdailynews.com/Stories/0,1413,207~24637~2813235,00.html

[ret5hd]

1. while i support this kid in his efforts against conformity...

i still think he's going to cringe at any pictures taken of him during this phase of his life.

[zbdent]

3. Ever see any Goth teens?

They wear makeup - male, female, and hard-to-tell . . .

[mongo]

2. I don't see how wearing black lipstick to school has anything

to do with Wicca. These folks are making Wiccans look bad.

Really, you don't have a right to free expression in a school setting. Schools go overboard in squashing expression and demanding conformity, but would you support the right of a kid to wear a t-shirt that said "I hate fags"? Schools generally ban any clothing or apperance they deam "disrupting".

[maddiejoan]

4. while I agree --

--that lipstick and eyeliner has nothing to do with Wicca, the kid has a point. If girls are able to wear makeup to school, he should also be allowed.

The comparison of a boy wearing makeup and a kid wearing an "I hate fags" T-shirt is pure strawman tactics.

The concept that a boy in makeup is disruptive is gender-biased nonsense. Discipline should be something directed towards his peers who might balk (or worse) at his appearance.

I fail to see, however, how the action of applying color to one's face makes "Wiccans look bad".

It's high time freedom of expression was demanded in public schools. Who exactly is this kid hurting?

[DrGonzoLives]

6. It's not a strawman, necessarily

It might be a bad analogy, but it's no strawman. If you are going to let in one kind of expression, you have to let them all in; you can't let people wear pro-gay shirts and kick out the kid with the "I hate fags" one on.

"Discipline should be something directed towards his peers who might balk (or worse) at his appearance."

How is this any better than telling the kid he can't wear makeup? Do we punish people for thoughtcrime because you don't like it? Sheesh.

[maddiejoan]

7. It is a strawman.

A boy wearing makeup does not represent hatred of asnother group.
Freedom of expression is not the same as representing hate.

And yes --you CAN allow pro-gay messages and disallow anti-gay messages. A pro-gay message does not state an anti-hetero position. If a child had a shirt that said "Down with Breeders" you'ld have a point.

Discipline can and SHOULD be directed at those who employ actions hurtful to another. Can you demonstrate that a boy wearing black lipstick as a form of self-expression is being hurtful to another?

I certainly don't advocate punishing people for thoughtcrime -- your argument is in fact yet another strawman.

[DrGonzoLives]

8. Let's look at what you said again

"Discipline should be something directed towards his peers who might balk (or worse) at his appearance."

You are saying, then, that people who don't like the goth kid's appearance and say something about it should be punished. What is that if not thoughtcrime? I would love to hear you worm your way out of this.

[maddiejoan]

13. uhm simple

a THOUGHT crime would consist of a kid THINKING about how much he didn't like the kid's appearance. It ceases to be a THOUGHT crime the minute he takes action (ex. "saying something" insulting)

I don't need to "worm" my way out of your nonsensical argument --and I certainly don't like your tone. I know exactly what I'm saying.

[DrGonzoLives]

20. Oh no, you don't like my tone

OK, so we punish students for saying mean things. Does that include anyone who says anything mean, or only for people who say mean things to groups you like?

I guess it's not tyranny if you do it, eh?

[maddiejoan]

21. you certainly like to--

--put words in my mouth don'tcha?

As I said , a kid wearing a T-shirt that said "I hate breeders" would be just as offensive as a kid wearing a T-shirt that says "I hate fags"

Punishing a child for intolerant (tyrannical) behaviour makes sense to me. Punishing a boy for wearing eyeliner and lipstick does not.

My not liking your tone is not meant to be a threat, just a stated fact that your attitude towards my posts seems unduly hostile, and I'm having trouble figuring out why you;re acting out.

[maddiejoan]

14. delete dupe

[maddiejoan]

15. delete dupe

[orleans]

9. it ain't necessarily so

"If you are going to let in one kind of expression, you have to let them all in; you can't let people wear pro-gay shirts and kick out the kid with the "I hate fags" one on."

not true.

my daughter's school policy is to promote tolerance and acceptance of people. the kids (high schoolers) have started an after school club that is a gay/straight alliance--they are printing tshirts with their "logo" to promote an environment of tolerance/acceptance on the gay issue. the shirts were approved by a teacher who is overseeing the club.

if a student showed up at school wearing a shirt that was promoting hatred or discrimination toward anyone they would not be allowed to wear it (also banned are swear words and tshirts that advertise cigarettes or alcohol).

[mongo]

10. Using the excuse of freedom of religion

when your religion (Wicca) has nothing to do with wearing lipstick to school makes Wiccans look bad.

The argument is not a strawman. The school is banning black lipstick on boys and "I hate fags" T-shirts on the same grounds - that they cause a distruption in the school.

[maddiejoan]

17. I don't see them --

as the same level of disruption, and I already told you I agree using Wicca as a reason is ridiculous.

To compare a hate T-shirt to a bad makeup job is certainly setting up a false dialectic.

[Abelman]

5. Right on

"which they seemed unable to find in writing..."

Morons.

Quite frankly, I hate make-up on anyone but if woman can paint themselves up I don't see why men can't either. Yes, I know not all women "paint" themselves up and some just wear very little make-up, but I know very few people personally that don't look just as pretty without make-up. My ex actually looked better without make-up. So fresh, so natural. Man, that dredges up memories I need to forget.

ANYWAY, this is news? My Dad has something to say on the subject of Goths. He says they were just called beatniks when he went to school. He actually had one act pretty thrown off when treated normally.

Anyway, ontopic: The school board is idiotic. And as far as Wicca goes, I know very little of it so I won't comment on that aspect.

But I agree with the poster who said this kid will wince when he sees pictures of him now in the future.

[amazona]

11. do they allow girls to wear that much eye make-up?

You'd get sent home at my public school for that too, but that was back in the day. I'd say if the girls are allowed to do it, what is sauce for the goose and all that, but really if no one else is allowed to wear ghastly Cleopatra eyes, who dyed and made him special? Excuse me, who died and made him special, the unattractive hair got me all confused.

The conservation movement is a breeding ground of communists
and other subversives. We intend to clean them out,
even if it means rounding up every birdwatcher in the country.
--John Mitchell, US Attorney General 1969-72

[LeftCoast]

12. Uh, I'm Wiccan and I know of no Wiccan group that requires

black clothing and "red eye makeup". Now I'm all for this kids right to wear whatever he wants, but religious freedom? Not sure I'm sold on that argument...

[JohnKleeb]

16. He sounds more like a goth than a wiccan to me

He should wear what he wants to wear that side, though this is something I'd never do.

[ucmike]

18. blech.

okay kid, we paid attention to you, now move on.

i agree with expressing yourself, but i get the feeling this kid and his mom are just after attention. he's probably disruptive in other ways too. note that he is repeating his grade. i know that's not an airtight indictment, but where there's smoke.......

[JohnKleeb]

19. I noticed that he was 16 too

I was 14 freshman year and the older people in the class were 15, I am one of the more younger people in my class as a whole since my birthday is in summer.

[mondo joe]

22. I saw this in HAIRSPRAY!

Geometry Teacher: Tracy Turnblad, once again your ratted hair is preventing another student's geometry education.

Tracy Turnblad: It's feathered, not ratted.

Geometry Teacher: Whatever you call it, it's a hair-don't.