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Which dogs are the worst for biting? (hint: it's not Pit Bulls)

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cliss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:37 PM
Original message
Which dogs are the worst for biting? (hint: it's not Pit Bulls)
Study: Rottweilers are now responsible for the most fatal dog attacks on humans.

Rottweilers have passed pit bulls as America's deadliest dog breed, according to a study released Friday.

The large dogs were involved in 33 fatal attacks on humans beetween 1991 and 1998, the American Veterinary Medical Association said.

Pit bulls, which had been responsible for more deaths than any other breed, were involved in 21 fatal attacks over the same period.

Rottweilers, first bred in Germany, surged in popularity during the 1990's as more people sought them for protection, said Jeffrey J. Sacks, an epidemiologist with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

"People are more in fear of crime and violence,and this has led to a selection of bigger dogs", he said "If you start selecting bigger dogs, you'll get bigger bites".

http://archives.cnn.com/2000Health/09/deadly.dogs.ap /
-----------------------------------
On a related note, some more dog statistics:
Here are the most dangerous dogs, in order of bites:
1. Rottweilers
2. Pit Bulls
3. German Shepherds
4. Huskies
5. Alaskan Malamute
6. Doberman pinscher
7. Great Dane
8. St. Bernard
9. Akita

Dog bites are an epidemic, and they are on the rise. Currently, there are 5 million victims annually - about 2% of the entire US population. Of these, 800,000 needed medical attnetion. Most of the victims are children, who are almost always bitten in the face by the family dog or a friend's dog.

Approximately 35% of American households own a dog. The dog population is over 52 million. It's time we took a good, hard look at this problem.
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Clark2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:39 PM
Response to Original message
1. The only dog that ever bit me was a Rottweiler.
eom
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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. German Shepherd got me in my right upper thigh.....
:scared:

DemEx
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ProgressiveConn Donating Member (820 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. Same here. nt
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
149. Rottenweilers. Hate them. Sorry folks.
Learned this from a vet I worked for for a couple of years.

He was just before retirement, had practiced for 40 years, and said that when they reach about two, they get "squirrely", in his words. And my experience bore this out; we had one that was terribly aggressive and hard to handle once she reached sexual maturity, and she had the best, most devoted owners in the world. He had been her vet since puppyhood, but things went sour once the hormones kicked in. In the case of Rotty's, I don't think the "bad owner" theory applies.

This is the only dog that we absolutely could not handle there, and our vets had handled everything. One came in for a simple rabies vaccination and the vet we had that was unphased by everthing else was completely unable to give him a simple sub-q rabies vaccination, and she tried for about a half an hour.

Rotty owners love their dogs and swear by them. I have owned a half-pit bull, and I learned about them too. The danger in pit bulls is their short fuse and the power of their jaw, I think it's about 1200 or 1800 #'s of pressure per square inch. 1800 is like a large bear, so it might be the lower number. I love pit bulls because they are some of the most quietly intelligent dogs there are, however, when you have a dangerous dog like this you need to look at it like it's the same thing as owning a 20 foot python or a lion or tiger. You keep it confined, away from children and other animals unsupervised. Or pay the penalty.
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Seabiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #149
151. I think any Rottweiler owners are "bad owners".
Edited on Sat Jan-29-05 02:36 PM by Seabiscuit
There's something seriously wrong with anyone who owns an attack dog.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #151
153. what I mostly see about are half breed and poorly bred specimens
from animal shelters. So you have to proceed with caution. The two rottys' that I was taking about were registered pedigreed dogs.
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prodigal_green Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
2. My dog
but he's getting better with training. Got him from a rescue organization. He was in pretty bad shape when I got him.

btw: cocker-spaniel/poodle mutt
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Sanity Claws Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:48 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. I was bitten by that kind of dog
I was just running and the little mutt next door bit me on the leg. My pants were ruined but he just scraped my leg. My experience is that the smaller dogs bite more often but their bites aren't as bad. This is exactly what others in this thread said.
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #9
98. Their teeth are SHARPER when small
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Shopaholic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:01 PM
Response to Reply #2
22. Dachshunds are like little land sharks
I love the breed and have owned two but their motto is "Bite first, ask questions later."
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Runcible Spoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:14 PM
Response to Reply #22
76. wow. we've had dachsies all my life...we have 2 of em now..
never a single bite from any of em...
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Sinistrous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #76
90. I once had a Dachshund/Beagle mutt.
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 09:57 PM by Sinistrous
She had a bark like a doberman, but the most dangerous thing she would do was lick you silly.

She had to be the sweetest dog that ever lived.
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Shopaholic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #76
148. I honestly wonder if there's not a difference in dachshund temperment
according to coat/sex. Both mine were black and tan males. They were sweet and loving to our family but boy they sure didn't like too many other people!
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candle_bright Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:42 PM
Response to Original message
3. I think it's important
to clarify that this info refers to fatal bites (and possibly bites that result in serious injury).

I'd be willing to bet that small dogs bite more often, but those bites don't result in fatalities and/or very serious wounds.
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DBoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. True - Cocker Spaniels are most likely to bite
Their bites rarely result in injury.

Wife once worked for a law firm that handled "dog bite" litigation. That's where I got this factoid.
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prodigal_green Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. I've bled but good
but I doubt my life has ever been in danger. Problem is, he's so cute, total strangers just shove their hands at him and he REALLY hates being pet behind the ears. All but once I've been able to warn people off before they got to him. The person who got bitten approached from behind so I didn't see him before he bent down to scratch my pup behind the ear. Don't EVER do that to a strange dog.
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yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #12
157. All animals bite
I was attacked by a supposedly "sweet" St. Bernard when I was a kid, but the worst bite I've ever had was from the neighbor's cat. Totally unprovoked attack. Four deep puncture wounds that got infected.

I've taught my kids - always ask first. Never go up to a dog or cat and start petting them. Ask their human first. And be careful around all strays and any animal roaming free. Any animal will bite if it is startled, scared, or angered.
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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Since Holland banned Pitbulls several years ago, fatal
dog attacks have decreased significantly.....

DemEx
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candle_bright Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. Our points aren't mutually exclusive
I was making the point that I'd be willing to bet that small dogs bite more often than big dogs do. Also, the bigger the dog, the more serious the bite will be.

Pit bulls are not by nature human-aggressive, they are more prone to be dog-aggressive. The breed got tarred and feathered by sorry excuses for people who trained them to be aggressive, to bolster their own macho-ness. It's very sad.

I have 2 pit bull mixes who are rescued, and they have never shown aggression towards humans. On the other hand, if a stray animal gets into the yard all bets are off.

Lastly, I've been bitten by 3 dogs in my life. One was a small terrier mix a friend had, and it snuck up under my chair *several* times, heh, and bit me on the back of my calf. Another was a dachshund who used the same technique, only it was creeping up in stealth mode under a pool table and bit the front of my calf. The third was a pomeranian who just flat out bit my arm (no sneak attack on that one.)
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DBoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. The prob is, pitt bulls look at small children like they are another dog
I'd never let a pit bull near a child for that reason.
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candle_bright Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #18
26. Where did you get that?
Not only do I have 2 mixes now, I grew up with purebreed pit bulls. This was back in the 70s, before the breed was used, abused, and maligned.

My brother and I and our friends constantly interacted and played with them, as they were the family pets. No one ever got bitten.

Frankly, very young children should be supervised with ANY dog.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #26
150. it's true. there are tons of dead children to bear this out.
Edited on Sat Jan-29-05 02:28 PM by jdj
one killed in Charlotte several months ago by his dad's three pit-bulls. one girl down the road from here almost fatally mauled by two pit bulls, two passerby stopped and pulled the dogs off of her, one had her head IN IT'S MOUTH.

I have owned a part-pit bull, I love them, I respect them, and the best thing that people like me and you can do for this breed is to STOP DENYING what they are capable of and what their predator nature and physical capabilities drive them to do.

I strongly believe every city should have strict laws with regards to the confinement of dangerous dogs. Registered for at least $100 per liscense, mandatory rabies vaccination, six-foot high fence or kept exclusively inside.

If dangerous dog defenders had had the gumption to accept reality long ago about their beloved breeds, we large-dog lovers wouldn't find ourselves in the scenario we are in now.
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:10 PM
Response to Reply #18
32. What?? I don't think so.
My best friend has a pit bull. She has been with her since she was a puppy and her son was an infant. She is the most gentle and loving dog anyone could ask for. Don't perpetuate steyotypes against this breed just because you don't care for them ok?
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radwriter0555 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:50 PM
Response to Reply #32
59. It's a nice idea, but I know a guy who's dog tore the face off his best
friend, after the friend had known the dog since it was a puppy. At 1 1/2 years of age, completely unprovoked, the animal literally jumped up in the friend's face and tore it half off.

We had had numerous reports about this guy and this aggressive dog. The dude was mister fashionable tough guy who believed he had control over the dog off leash, but it was fierce and menacing, but never actually hurt anyone in the 1/2 year we were dealing with complaints about it.

Then one day the friend called me to tell me the guy had it put down because he'd had his face torn off, to start, had over 100 stitches.

From a rotty he'd known intimately since it was a puppy.

NEVER trust a child with a dog big enough to harm (the child), when the animal was bred to kill.

EVER.
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:57 PM
Response to Reply #59
64. No dog should ever be off leash outside unless it's in a fenced area.
It doesn't matter if it's 10 pounds or 100 pounds. That's a matter of safty for other people, pets and the dog itself. it's a matter of common sense.
My point is, ANY dog can be aggressive. It's not fair to classify an entire breed as such.
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Nikia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 08:42 AM
Response to Reply #64
140. I agree
One of the biggest reasons that we don't let our dog run unsupervised is that I am afraid that he'll get hit by a car. He has also shown agression towards other dogs and I'd fear for other dogs' safety as well as his own if he picked a fight with a large dog.
Larger dogs due tend to be more damaging when they attack, especially to children, livestock, and smaller pets who can't defend themselves as well.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #64
152. Yes, it is very fair. The "bull" part in the name comes from
bull baiting. If they are tough and fearless to go up against a bull, then their psychology makes them a danger to humans and small defenseless animals.

Poor pit bulls, someone started a thread on rottys and here we are back on pit bulls. The best thing that could ever be done for the welfare of pit bulls is for owners and lovers of this breed to snap the fuck out of fantasy-land, accept what these dogs are CAPABLE OF in comparison with other breeds, because of the outstanding force of their bite due to their unique jaw structure, and then proceed to keep them and advocate for them while keeping a firm grip on reality.
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candle_bright Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:06 PM
Response to Reply #59
71. The dog owner
by your own description is "mister fashionable tough guy."

I believe therein lies the problem. Just as many of us have been saying here, the OWNER is the problem.
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MrsMatt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #71
147. Not always the dog owner
I knew a very competent dog trainer who had a beautiful Beauceron puppy that was extremely friendly (the breed is noted for being aloof). The puppy grew up to be a very well adjusted and delightful adult. Sadly, one day while Tom was taking Sade for a walk, Sade attacked a woman quite severely, and had to be put down. The owner in this case, was not at fault - the dog just viewed this woman as a threat to Tom (which is funny, since Tom is about 6' 5" and well built) and was protecting him. Dog was put down very shortly after that.
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ornotna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #59
106. Sorry to hear about that guys face, that sucks
However Rottweilers were not bred to kill. They were bred to herd cattle and pull carts.
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Cyndee_Lou_Who Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #59
172. I know a guy who was attacked in same manner by a LAB!
Pits were not "bred to kill"...

http://www.pitbullsoforegon.com/faqs.html#3
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DrWeird Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #18
34. pff
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DBoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 12:18 AM
Response to Reply #34
117. I apologize on behalf of all pit bulls
I asked an expert (photo below) and was assured that this is not the case:

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radwriter0555 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #18
55. All dogs are like that. Dogs don't identify humans from dogs, and
treat humans in the alpha/pack manner. Therefore, the poster is correct when saying that pitts look at kids as other dogs, but so do other types of dogs. Dogs don't distinguish size, they distinguish behavior and placement in the pack.

Now, pitts are indeed bred for fighting. They absolutely have an innate button for attack and fighting, just as some dogs are bred for hunting, for sight, for tracking and for running -- or for size specific to hunting certain animals, for example, the irish wolf-hound or the deer hound.

You will find the largest number of bites within the largest population of dogs, hence, in Los Angeles, most bites are reported from CHIHUAHUAS.

The most SERIOUS bites are, however, from pittbulls and rottweilers, and catching up VERY fast, chow mixes.

Chow mixes have replaced shepard mixes in terms of numbers at large.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #55
154. chow-chows are very popular in the mountains where I am from
I HATED, HATED dealing with those dogs.

I mean HATED. Because the folks who brought them in to be bathed and groomed where I worked, with the exception of exactly one, groomed them only once a year. So they had to be muzzled, and it took hours of matt-splitting and combing to get them right again, because of course the owner would never consent to shaving them down. My arms would be sore for days.

The chow-chow is essentially a hillbilly poodle, I think.

And the @#$%rs don't bark before they bite, which is the worst thing. NO warning whatsoever...Just... CHOMP!.
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RebelOne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 04:48 AM
Response to Reply #18
129. You are absolutely correct.
I had a pit bull at one time and anything within their eye level they consider prey. I never allowed my dog around little chilcren.
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Phentex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 05:46 AM
Response to Reply #3
133. Exactly! Most fatal and most often are two different things....
An ant is more likely to bite you than most dogs.

I think the person who posted this should change the title.
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dogman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:45 PM
Response to Original message
7. How many of each breed are there?
I wonder what these numbers work out to as a % of that breeds total number.
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HeeBGBz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:49 PM
Response to Original message
10. Chihuahuas
They are some biting little mofos, but it's usually not fatal.
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Wcross Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. All dogs bite....make my attacker a Chihuahua any day!
That made me chuckle a bit HeeBGBz!
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Born Free Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:58 AM
Response to Reply #13
127. "All dogs bite....make my attacker a Chihuahua any day!"
Heck, our new house guest, a friendly stray cat, bites me, but it is not bad. The key to it all is the damage of the bite, that is why we always chose smaller dogs. Our pugs are/were hopelessly stupid and unable to even think of anything other than food, even it they would ever think of biting they would probably bite your shoe, not knowing enough to bite the skin. Watching two pugs fight over food or something like a toy is like watching the Keystone cops, it's unbelievable how stupid they are. However, they are friendly and great lap dogs if nothing else.

I was surprised to seee Saint Bernards on the list, they along with Newfoundlands generally have very pleasant personalities.
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yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #127
159. I was viciously attacked by a St. Bernard when I was a kid in 1971
I heard that they had been inbred or improperly bred and had become unstable. This one had a moran neighbor who abused the dog in an effort to make her a "guard dog."
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Boosterman Donating Member (515 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #10
114. Usually?
do you have a number for chihuahua bite fatalities?
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HeeBGBz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 04:58 AM
Response to Reply #114
131. No, but if you encounter a feral pack
I would run like hell.
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NightTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:51 PM
Response to Original message
11. My roommate's dog is a pit bull.
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 07:55 PM by NightTrain
And she's the gentlest, friendliest, most loving, afectionate dog I've ever known! Of course, Patrick raised Mystique to be a loving house pet, not a vicious attack dog.
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DBoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:55 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. We have a pit bull mix
He won't even bark at the mailman.

Many of our neighbors also have pitts - mainly rescue dogs. They are generally very well behaved and very friendly to humans.

I think the problem with pit bulls is the owners. To many macho-types who want a mean dog to compensate to their inadequate manhood.
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Cyndee_Lou_Who Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #17
163. To all pit-haters..... you are dead wrong and do not know what you
are talking about, nor missing. My pit was raised by a cat and had a Maltese as a best friend. There is so much media-hype, dogs who are NOT pits being called such only after an episode... and you people who perpetuate the myths are doing a serious disservice to the general public.

ANY dog can be bad... and ANY dog can and will bite, given cause. Pits DO NOT have a locking jaw, another myth. No bad breeds, just bad BREEDING and bad owners.

Here's a baby pit with his brother:


Oh, and here are some links to several myths surrounding the breed:
http://www.realpitbull.com/myths.html
http://www.badrap.org/rescue/myths.cfm
http://www.austinlostpets.com/kidskorner/2October/pitbu...
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candle_bright Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #11
20. Right on
I'm glad to see people who understand pit bulls' true nature. They are awesome dogs.
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NightTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. I've been sick as hell for the last 24 hours. I think Mystique knows...
...that something's up with me, and has spent hours at a clip lying quietly in bed with me, resting her head against my chest. God, I love that dog! :loveya:
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kskiska Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #25
171. My son-in-law had some surgery
and wanted to just lie quietly on the couch. He showed the dogs his abdominal stitches and they seemed to understand and let him rest, lying close by.
He had gum surgery once, too, and must have smelled the blood and were protective of him.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #20
155. oh how many times have I heard this song and dance.
Til all of a sudden the one time that something goes wrong.

I had my mix for eleven years, and I took alot of precautions. I never let children get near her, when I walked her in parks that allowed leashed dogs I told people not to approach her, and when people illegally let their dogs run off leash, I had to stop and leash-muzzle her if the dogs came near her, even though THEY were the one breaking the rule of the park. I would tell people, 'please restrain your dog,' and they would say 'but my dog is friendly'...I would always get the strangest look when I would say 'but mine isn't'.

She was mixed with lab. retriever, by the way, so it was definitely her pit nature. But what matters is not just short fuse but brute force, and capacity to do harm. She had plenty of that, as well, which is why I watched her so closely.
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Cyndee_Lou_Who Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #20
169. Count me as another who's sick of the perpetuation of the myths
Pits ROCK!
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:53 PM
Response to Original message
14. My Westies have never bitten anyone but they sure try to
lick you to death.
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phylny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:54 PM
Response to Original message
16. German shepherd bit me years ago.
My insurance company always asks what breed of dog we have - it makes a difference in how much our homeowner's insurance will cost.

Our Cavalier King Charles Spaniel is very low on the "biting" list :)

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oregonjen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:01 PM
Response to Reply #16
23. Nice to see another Cavalier owner!
We have a Blenheim little girl named Gracie. :hi:
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phylny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. Ours is a Blenheim girl named Kelly.
She turned 10 the other day. Mitral valve prolapse, takes enalapril to reduce her blood pressure. She's slowed down, but she's still going strong! No problems breathing, no coughing, so no congestive heart failure yet.

Right now, though, she's perplexed about the chest-high snow. Doesn't like it. My husband cleared a patch for her, but she's wanting "cleaner" pastures for number one...and really po'd about finding a place for number two ;) Don't even discuss the sweater I have to put on her - it was 16 below zero this morning.

If I could figure out how to attach a pic here, I would.
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oregonjen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. We think our girl has Syringomyelia
It's become quite a problem with this breed. Have you heard of it? I belong to a Yahoo group for owners with Cavaliers who have it. :(

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phylny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:14 PM
Response to Reply #30
36. check your inbox n/t
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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:57 PM
Response to Original message
19. Personal experience - German Shepard and Cocker Spaniels.
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98geoduck Donating Member (590 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:59 PM
Response to Original message
21. I've seen the friendliest Rotts, and the most ferocious Labs...
It's a nurture /nature thing again. The AKC and breeders are responsible for overbreeding and incestuous breeding but aren't the only ones to blame. Petowners are extremely negligent in proper care and training and share a greater responsibility. Having worked at a vet clinic for a couple of years, I could tell a lot about the pet owners by just witnessing their dogs behavior.
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:15 PM
Response to Reply #21
37. That's right. 99.9 % of people probably SHOULD NOT breed dogs
simply because they have no clue what a huge undertaking it is. It is an enormous responsibility ethically and financially. Most people that "breed" their dogs just want to make a few bucks. Generally, truly ethical breeders are lucky to break even if they are doing it properly and not gouging the buyers.
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MisterP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:01 PM
Response to Original message
24. this is irrelevant without documentation as to what breed these dogs
really are: none of the shelters I know of can affix appropriate breeds: the label says "beagle" and I'm, "I'm looking at a lab." If it's going by news reports, the problem is that "if it bites someone, it's a pit bull."
pits and rotties are the current "hood" dog: it might be St. Bernards by 2015 for all we know
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DrWeird Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
28. It's not the breed, it's the owner.
The friendliest dog I ever met was fifty percent rottweiler, and fifty percent pit bull. The other half was grizzly bear.

:smoke:
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Mr Rabble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
29. Not my dog!
My 9 year old Rott is the most docile dog ive owned yet. Their behavior really depends on how they are raised.

Sad to see these great dogs get a bad rap-
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proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:09 PM
Response to Original message
31. My 2 cents ...IT'S THE OWNERS NOT THE BREED OF DOGS
It really upsets me when I hear breeds get
scapegoated for being owned by BAD people.

Bad people are more likely to go for certain
breeds but the is as far as it goes .

Any Dog can be trained to be Ferocious and any
dog can be trained to be good social dogs .

I'm more likely to trust a pit bull or German Shepard
then a poodle Dalmatian or schitzu
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sweetheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 12:45 AM
Response to Reply #31
118. Sounds like 100 cents to me.... absolutely true
Dogs pick up the imprint of their minder. I say minder rather than
owner as some people "own" dogs and spend less time with them than
a dog walker or someone who minds them. People who have violence
in their attentions... subconscious even... the dog reflects it.

Always be wary of a person who's dog bites. The dog is showing you
something about the real person that likely the human would not show.
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:22 AM
Response to Reply #118
122. excellent point
"Always be wary of a person who's dog bites. The dog is showing you
something about the real person that likely the human would not show."

It's very true.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 07:02 AM
Response to Reply #118
137. Generally, yes .... but:
all dogs have the potential to bite people. A dog's owner clearly plays a role in raising a nice dog versus a mean dog. Still, as all human service workers who work in the community know, there is a "post man syndrome."

A dog sees the mail man walk up to the house, sometimes leave something, and sometimes steal something. The mail man rarely speaks with the owner(s), and avoids the dog. The dog identifies the mail man as an unfriendly intruder.

From years of experience, including having mean and nasty people let mean and nasty dogs out to attack me (and co-workers) when we came a knocking on their doors, two things stick out: Labs will always sneak up and bite you from behind as you walk away from a house; and shepards will come and bite you when you are approaching the house.

In those years, there was never a single dog that I was very concerned about. At most, a couple puncture wounds, versus disabling the dog. But once, I was at an impassable & long driveway, at the end of a dead-end dirt road. I was on a child abuse investigation, and started walking from my car. The hillbillies let seven (7) large & vicious dogs out of their house. I literally ran to my car. Some of the dogs left teeth-imprints on the riubber section of my bumbers. While I could disable any one dog, I think those 7 would have killed me. I went back the next day prepared slightly different.
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sweetheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #137
142. Well that's an extreme case indeed
I worked a job once in college doing door to door work, and i carried
a large sample case that i used to deflect any dog with aggressive
approach. That said, most i found to be intimidated by a big dog (me)
holding up a hand and shouting to back off.... and only the trained
attack dogs (very few) would be undeterred and require a block from
the sample case.

However i'd wager that, like i said in the post, those with the nasty
dogs had consciously or unconsciously trained them to be viscious, in
defense of the pack... whereas my pack of 4 here, will only come and
give you kisses... they love people. Perhaps you'll meet them one day
and get a happy dog reception.

Sad about your hillibility incident, i guess i'd need a cattle prod
for something like that... what did you use?
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classof56 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:12 PM
Response to Original message
33. I have a pit bull/bull terrier mix (or so they tell me)
rescued from the Willamette Valley Humane Society almost 13 years ago. She is absolutely the sweetest doggie you can imagine, but when she gets her hackles up and turns on the bark, she can be quite intimidating. I warn strangers that she will "love them to death". Maybe it's a nature vs nurture thing. Not long ago I was bitten by my neighbor's schnauzer, and a couple years ago another schnauzer bit me. Think I've learned my lesson! A while back some pit bulls got loose from a nearby farm and were bearing down on me and my sweet l'il 13-year-old doggie who would not hurt a flea. I was scared spitless. Managed to intimidate the free-running PBs by raising my arms and shouting (me, an elderly pacificist lady), and fortunately they went on their way. I was ready to die for my doggie, so glad it didn't come to that. I always give a strange dog a wide berth--guess I've watched too many Judge Judy episodes about these kind of cases.

Looks like it's a pleasant evening in Portland. Have a good one!

Class of 56
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Lisa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
35. our neighbour's little terrier cross has acquired the nasty habit ...
of running up to people and snapping at them. She's already nipped a couple of folks on our street -- "play bites", and it didn't break the skin, but we're becoming concerned about what could happen if the dog (which often runs around loose without the owner in sight) does this to a child, or to one of the strangers who parks around here. She's still rather young, and this combined with poor discipline means she can be unpredictable. Various people have mentioned being scared after the dog comes into their houses uninvited via the garage or cat door, and suddenly starts barking at them! (Happened to me as I was coming down the steps with a load of laundry, and I only just avoided tripping over her.)

I have taken to keeping my hands in my pockets when I see the little dog, as a signal to the dog and particularly to the owner (if she's around). Last time, she expressed disappointment that I didn't want to pet or cuddle the dog. I explained that I would do this when the dog was trained to sit and behave -- and she was totally shocked. She suggested that I am wimpy about animals. Actually, I used to work at a vet clinic, and have learned that even small animals can hurt you, or worse, themselves, if they are freaked-out enough. When I explained that I didn't think reaching down and grabbing a frantic, hyper animal would be a fun experience for me or the dog, she claimed that she is unable to discipline her pet because she "doesn't know how to do it without hurting her".

While the dog is too small for anything as drastic as a choke chain, I know there are plenty of positive-reinforcement techniques that can be used -- for sure there are people out there with well-behaved tiny dogs. And big ones -- the neighbours on the other side of us have an enormous wolf-Alsatian "hybrid" that used to be in a hospital "pet therapy" program and is very gentle. (Also his fur is so thick that the little terrier can nip at him all day and not penetrate it!) But it seems that there are lots of people who don't know about dog-training or are unwilling to spend the time and effort required.
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MisterP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #35
39. we use the Spray Commander (no, it's not a urinating canine superhero)
it's a good remote-control citronella spray collar; a variant for barking also works well
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hollowdweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:21 PM
Response to Original message
38. I shot a rottweiler right in the head with a .22 rifle and it bounced off
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 08:24 PM by hollowdweller
He killed my 17 year old cat and my friends 13 year old dog and I can't get the county to do a damn thing about him. He also bit my wife, but there has to bite 2 people before I can get the sherrif to shoot him.

I'm hoping I can catch him in the woods when I am carrying a pistol and shoot him.

Another Rott that one of my neighbors ended up killing resulted in 200 bucks worth of vet bills for me when he came up in my yard to eat my baby goats and my border collie intercepted him. I heard screaming and my wife was on top of the rott beating him on the head with her fists and he was on top of my dog and wouldn't let go. The neighbors ran up and pulled him off before I could get inside and get a gun. Luckily my other neighbor eventually nailed him. He also ate one neighbors cat off of his porch.

Rotts are the redneck white trash dog around here. They buy them cause they are bad but don't have the intelligence to train them and let them run loose eat deer and terrorize the neighborhood. I'd like to shoot every damn one of them running loose!
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #38
41. Maybe you should keep your unattended pets inside where they belong.
Then it wouldn't have had to die such an agonizing death. As for the rest of your post, the ignorance speaks for itself.
"I'd like to shoot every damn one of them running loose!"
Are you for real??? I'm calling bullshit on this one. :eyes:
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hollowdweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #41
48. The cat was in my yard, the 13 year old dog was on a lead in my friends
yard. You lose an animal that you have had for 17 years and see how you feel about it.
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #48
50. How did the dog get the cat then? nt
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hollowdweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #50
57. The owner pumps water from a well on my property and he brought his dog up
with him. The Rott and his killing buddy, a chow went up the hill to the cabin on my place and ripped the throat out of my pals dog. The owner heard a commotion up there but didn't check. My friend was at work. Same day my cat was killed. My neighbors also caught them killing my chickens which DO run loose sometimes and ran them off too.
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #57
61. The perfect example of why pets should never be left outside alone.
You again prove my point......and knowing that there is an aggressive dog running around?? :eyes: And by the way, I have lost pets that I had for many, many years. I know how it feels....you seem to be asking me to sympathize with you but the only one I feel sorry for is your cat.

You OP was just reprehensible. As far as I am concerned you shouldn't be within 30 feet of ANY animal.
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hollowdweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #61
66. I've got 2 livestock guardian dogs, 12 dairy goats, 3 border collies,
2 cats, about 30 chickens and a donkey. I live on a farm.
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:01 PM
Response to Reply #66
67. And what's your point? That doesn't excuse not taking care of them.
eom
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hollowdweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:05 PM
Response to Reply #67
70. Define taking care of them. Keeping them inside their whole lives?

My last 3 cats lived to be 14, 15 and 17. My last dog that died was 13, I have 12 year old goats. I think I'm doing pretty well actually.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:12 PM
Response to Reply #70
75. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #70
160. Then you damn well are doing something right.
This bullshit right here is more harmful to "certain" dog breeds than any bad statistical p.r.

People who wax martyristical about dangerous dog breeds are helping seal these dogs' doom. A breed like a rotty should NEVER run at large.

I am getting pissed and pisseder.

So what if folks have the one or two totally trustworthy specimen from a dangerous breed...I don't care, and the parents of the kid that just had their face taken off by one don't give a damn either. I am so sorry to hear about your pets, this is very upsetting to me in that you and your friend were responsible owners and completely within the law.

The heartbreaking thing about this is that dangerous breed lovers who cling to the "bad owner" theory are helping to seal the eventual demise of these breeds, not to mention what happens to single specimens like the rotty who is now getting shot at because of lack of owner supervision. Next time it may be a human child that is killed. An animal like this needs to be euthanized and it's owner prosecuted. I'm fairly certain you have grounds for a civil suit regardless of animal control's lack of action, if under grounds of "destruction of property" if nothing else.

By the way, when my pit had to be put down because of a angiosarcoma that ruptured a disk in her spine, the x-rays showed her behind to be full of at least 10-20 bb and birshot pellets.
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idiosyncratic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #61
81. I don't get why you can't understand hollowdweller's situation
hollowdweller has no control over the neighbor's irresponsibilty beyond protecting his/her own animals.

I defend hollowdweller's right to shoot a dangerous, threatening dog.

When I was in college, my roommate had a small husky that was constantly running loose killing animals. It brought home a baby bunny once, and then it was caught killing turkeys that were used in research at the University. That incident cost her a LOT of money.

Finally the dog was shot and killed by a farmer when the dog was chasing his sheep.

If a dog owner won't be responsible and keep their animal under control, what should the victim of that animal's vicious behavior do? In a rural area, there probably isn't an Animal Control officer anywhere nearby.

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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #81
85. Perhaps keep his animals inside where they are safe? nt
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Patchuli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:33 PM
Response to Reply #85
94. Goats are not housepets
but I do agree about keeping cats in. They get hurt in the country
as easily as the city. 85 acres would be nice but I wouldn't want
to wait for them to come home every night in fear.
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #94
96. I wasn't talking about the goats. nt
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Tsiyu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #94
101. I guess we view animals more pragmatically in the country
They are utilitarian rather than mere amusement or companionship. ( not to dismiss the important role pets provide to urban and suburban folks- please don't think I'm that cold).

They protect our property and our livestock. The "good dogs" around here pretty much stay close to home and guard "their" goats and horses. The cats keep mice out of hay and grain and garden. The horses mostly eat and provide fertilizer but are ridden and can be relied on when and where no car can go.

Some are butchered and eaten.

This is where it takes understanding and tolerance. It's nice when people care very much about animals. It's also nice when people care more about PEOPLE.

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RebelOne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 04:57 AM
Response to Reply #94
130. Goats, believe it or not, can be housepets.
I had a friend who had a pet goat which she let stay in the house. She also had a Doberman and a pit bull and they all got along fabulously.
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Patchuli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #130
143. Was it a minature goat?
Somehow I can't see a full sized goat in the house! :silly:
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Tsiyu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #85
95. OK, smbolisnch, you obviously live in a subdivision/city
I have stayed out of this fray. My favorite dogs are German Shepherds. I lost my White Shepherd last year. She was my best friend.

That may have been the case but I did not trust her around my eleven year old. She was teased by children as a pup and never trusted them. I DID trust my eleven year old with our half pit bull. She was a mush to babies, but like another poster said, all bets were off if a cat or other animal came around.

When I first moved to the mountain, the half-pit, who was terrified of thunderstorms, ran off after a particularly bad storm. She was penned but got loose. She killed a neighbor's wildlife ( illegal for them to have but I'm not a frickin snitch ) I paid the neighbor $500 and had the dog put down. Why? I live in an area of farms. I own horses myself.

Farmers don't bring the pigs and the chickens in for the night, Hon. The cows don't come in either. Neither do the goats or the turkeys or the sheep. Chastising the poster because somebody's Rottweiler is running around like a lunatic doesn't make sense.

NO DOG is completely domesticated. All people can turn to the darkside; all animals - whether by disease, lack of training or genetics - can become vicious.

If that Rott took out one of my horses legs, I'd kill it too. AS fast and as cleanly as possible.

Next, people around here will be telling parents to never let their kids outside.

Hint: GO VISIT A FARM!
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #95
97. You must be joking. You really should have just stayed out of it.
:eyes:
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Tsiyu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #97
102. No, not joking at all
Your responses seem, well, naive to me. Perhaps I misread you.

Rather than making your exclusive feelings known, why not address what I said?
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #102
104. Naive? How did you come to THAT conclusion?
Your post was so ridiculous and condescending that it does not even warrant a response from me.

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Tsiyu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:59 PM
Response to Reply #104
108. You suggest a man bring goats in the house?Not naive?
At least, you never addressed his particular situation. I assumed you were a bit out of the loop on the rural lifestyle. If I'm wrong, and you milk a dozen goats every morning, I sincerely apologize.

If you're looking for a fight, friend, you've got the wrong party. If you want to discuss it, let's discuss it. Like grownups sometimes do

If you're looking to tell me I have no business posting, who died and left you the Posting Overlord?



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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #108
109. You continue to put words in my mouth.
When did I say he should bring the goats in the house? I said TWICE that I was not referring to the goats. If you can show me otherwise, please, by all means do.

Your posts to me have been unnecessarily rude and condescending, as I said before. I am more than willing to have a discussion with you, but only if you stop putting words in my mouth and get rid of the god damned attitude. I assure you, I am not out of the loop on anything here.
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Tsiyu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #109
111. You weren't clear if two people had the same misunderstanding
about what you said.

Your presence on this thread has not displayed the cheerful, non-patronizing, non-pejorative, tolerant demeanor you seem to demand of others.

Done.
G'Night....

peace to all
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Tacos al Carbon Donating Member (326 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:38 AM
Response to Reply #104
123. I thought his post was thoughtful and informative
and warranted a reply. I think that your inability an/or unwillingness to reply is telling.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:07 AM
Response to Reply #81
119. I think any dog will kill a baby bunny if it can find one
and turkeys too. Those are natural dog food. My oldest dog found a baby bunny once and her tail was just a-wagging as she sniffed at it. Of course, I prevented her from making it a snack.
Also, I found out, when attacked by a rottweiler (actually it attacked my 35 pound beagle, but he emerged unharmed so I am thinking that the big dog was just playing around. I tried to keep my dogs behind me as the rottweiler charged but they would have none of that.), that you should not hit them in the head. They are not vulnerable there - try for the back or the legs.
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idiosyncratic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #119
158. I had a German Shepherd that wouldn't have killed those turkeys
She grew up with my cat, and the first time she saw chickens and acted like she wanted to chase them, I disciplined her. She was fine around them after that.

All bets are off once a dog tastes blood however. That husky was bad news. The fact that she was owned by an irresponsible person made it worse. The dog didn't have to get shot, but my roommate refused to walk the dog or put her out on a chain. Either the dog pooped in the house . . . YUCK!! . . . or she opened the door and let it out to run.

Her irresponsibilty, once she knew her dog had a problem, is why it was finally shot.

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yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #41
166. I'm seeing a rural-urban disconnect in your communication
People who live in the country raising farm animals have animals "running loose. Actually, the animals aren't "loose" - they are doing their jobs, which include herding, defending the herd, and reducing rodents around the farm.

In rural agricultural communities owners who allow their large dogs to run wild are the irresponsible ones, not the people whose farm animals get killed.

Where I grew up, in rural Ohio among a lot of sheepherders, farmers shot stray and roaming dogs on sight, and nobody blamed them. One dog can kill dozens of sheep or goats in a single attack.
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KnowerOfLogic Donating Member (841 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #38
44. Every one should keep their animals secured; then this stuff
wouldn't happen.
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hollowdweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:44 PM
Response to Reply #44
52. Exactly. All my dogs are fenced in unless we are home. They never run
loose. We used to leave our cats out during the day cause we live on 85 acres, but I am afraid too with this rott loose.
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idiosyncratic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #44
62. But some people don't, or the animals somehow get out
Recently a friend was nearly attacked by a neighbor's pitbull mix that got out of the fence. My friend will not hesitate to shoot that dog if it attacks her or her black lab or her granddaughter . . . which is possible because the dog is so aggressive.

The dog owner's daughter said it killed all but two of their chickens
the day it got out.

I would never own a dog like that.
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Delarage Donating Member (716 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #62
112. I was prepared to kill a Pit Bull
That got out and ran across the street toward me and my dog. I carry a pocket knife while out on walks just for such occasions. I had my hand on the knife just as some trashy woman came out and assured me that her dog wouldn't bite. Had it, however, and I would have filleted it on the street.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:32 PM
Response to Reply #38
47. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
hollowdweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #47
49. What would you suggest doing? My wife was walking one of our dogs on a
leash at night when she and the dog were attacked by the rott, who was running loose.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #49
51. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
hollowdweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:45 PM
Response to Reply #51
54. Nothing I can do to make you understand I guess if you haven't been there
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ultraist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #54
74. Remember the case in NYC where the woman was killed by a dog in her hall?
The defendent was an attorney, and tried to keep the state from putting the dog down, but the dog had brutality attacked and killed a young woman in the common hall of the apartment building.

I'd take precautions to, to protect my family from stray and vicious dog if I thought it might attack my children.

Have you called animal control? That dog needs to put picked up or chained up!

85 acres? WOW! That's sounds really nice.
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #74
77. Try Again
That was in SF and the dogs were being raised for prison fighting by the attorneys. They were doing a favor for an inmate named "Cornfed".

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronic...

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candle_bright Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #77
83. Cornfed
I'd forgotten about that name!

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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #83
84. Yep, very odd story all around!
And tragic. The breed that was involved are pretty unusual, but I "met" a couple at the animal hospital where I used to work. Very beautiful and gentle dogs. Just goes to show, it's all about the owner/raising.
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ultraist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #77
103. RIGHT! I had the WRONG city, it was in SF not NYC
San Francisco -- The San Francisco district attorney's office said this morning it is considering filing homicide charges against two attorneys whose dog mauled a woman to death -- an option that had not previously been discussed publicly.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronic...
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yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #49
174. I can't believe some of the personal attacks on this thread!
There is nothing unreasonable about shooting a dangerous animal that trespasses on one's property.

It makes me sad to read some of the biased and unfriendly comments on this thread. It's one of the things that contributes to the resentment that some rural and/or southern people feel toward liberals.

We aren't going to convince people to support liberal causes if we say "peace and love" with one side of our mouths while berating and ridiculing farmers with the other side of our mouths.

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idiosyncratic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:45 PM
Response to Reply #38
53. A long time ago a man shot nine dogs bringing down a deer
It happened near Vail, Colorado. After he shot the dogs, he called the sheriff and told him what he had done and why.

The incident caused a real uproar. The dog owners in the area didn't understand why they couldn't let their dogs "do what comes naturally."

If I remember correctly, the sheriff kept the man's name quiet and they tightened the leash laws in the area to prevent more depredation of the deer herd.

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MisterP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #53
78. what was the mighty hunter's explanation?
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #78
164. I side with the hunter on this one. Dogs run dear to exhaustion.
Edited on Sat Jan-29-05 03:21 PM by jdj
A dog out running dear is a pathetic site.

A dog that threatens you should have it's owner cited by animal control, then if that doesn't work the first time, be taken away and euthanized.

I am an animal lover from way back, but in hollowdweller's case I would shoot the rotty,our use a hav-a-heart humane trap.

Once my family trapped a viscious white shepard and had animal control come get it. We had no choice as the city had no leash law at the time, now they do. We got the trap from animal control, the dog came in the back yard that night and crawled in the trap the next day and we called animal control to come get him. The owner picked him up, but had to pay a fine.

People have the right to protect themselves and their pets from dangerous breeds allowed to run at large.
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idiosyncratic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #78
165. The deer herd is sort of property of the Fish and Game Department
The herds are highly managed and hunters pay a lot of money for permits to shoot the deer during hunting season only.

The Fish and Game Department, and ANY hunter, doesn't want a bunch of dogs running loose killing deer for the sport of it --- and killing them in a brutal, agonizing way by tearing open the deer's gut --- all summer long, which is when this incident happened.

I think any hunter witnessing the brutal killing of a doe might have done the same thing that man did.

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ultraist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #38
56. We have a negligent neighbor with insane dog
My neighbor has a mentally disturbed Shepard and they only use a wireless fence. He has bitten several people and they do not keep his collar battery replaced, according to their kids.

I have no tolerance for pets like that, especially here in a suburb on a cul-de-sac with lots of small children. If some small child wandered into their yard or the dog decided to run through the zapper area, it could be tragic.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #56
167. it's terrible to be terrorized like that and I encourage you to act.
It's the same thing as if their is a disturbed child who sits in the yard and fires bb guns at passers-by. Do whatever you can to document the threat caused by the dog (photos of him off the property etc), and continue to hound animal control. Get the neighbors to call as well. After a certain number of reports they are bound by law to act in most cases.

It WILL happen, that is the sad part. Why take the chance?

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double_helix Donating Member (65 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #38
68. You did the right thing. Don't expect the owners of these predators
and their sympathizers to see things your way.

Living in the city, I've had a few incidents with pit bulls over the years, and with their owners. Let's just say I wasn't the one who lost those battles.

If the law won't protect us and our's from these predators, we can't be blamed for protecting ourselves.
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AngryAmish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 07:17 AM
Response to Reply #38
138. .30-06 should do the job
Probably get much better info in the gungeon.
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KnowerOfLogic Donating Member (841 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:26 PM
Response to Original message
40. Dog bites are epidemic??!! Stupidity is epidemic. Sure, we all
hear about the *few* really horrific incidents where the victim was totally minding their own business, and a wild dog comes out of the blue and attacks them. I have a pit bull and he is without a doubt, one of the greatest, sweetest, most lovable dogs in the world, and i am very, very careful with him, so that he never has the opportunity to get loose and attack somebody. But a whole lot of people can't read signs, don't tell their kids not to tresspass, or stick their hands inside a stranger's vehicle, or tease and/or hit a dog, etc. 90% of dog bite's are the victim's fault, and there used to be a time when people took responsibility for their own actions; now, if an uninvited stranger tresspasses inside private, fenced, clearly marked with "Beware of Dog", "No Tresspassing" property and gets bits, the owner gets sued and the dog gets killed. Okay, flame away.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:46 AM
Response to Reply #40
124. Mostly good points
but I doubt the 90% "statistic". As a former paperboy I know that there are plenty of dogs who will attack just because you come to their house and plenty of owners who do not control their dogs (and I have to roll my eyes at the owners who "think" they can keep their unleashed dog from chasing after a boy on a bike)
I have a big fenced yard for my dogs, but I am constantly seeing kids throwing things at my barking beagle or kicking the fence or yelling at my dogs. I say they better "beware of owner" because I can and will go right over that fence. Also, I am going to call the local electric company to find out if they have a policy or training about going into people's fenced yards when dogs are present.
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Bryn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
42. My Service Dog is Half Rott and Half German Shepard
Her name is Shane. I found her abandoned near a dumpster at approx. 3 months old. She was sick and starving. Nursed her back to health and trained her to become my hearing dog (I am totally deaf since I was little child). She's almost 4 now and is well-loved by employees at where I work. There is no mean bone in her. She even loves cats. Two of them sleep with her!

It's not the breed...It's the OWNER!! The more time you spend with your dogs and expose them to people, children, pets , the better they become, more socializable, too.

Bryn :)
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #42
45. Welcome to DU!
:hi:
That's such a sweet story!
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ultraist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #42
63. Great story!
Welcome! . :hi:

For the most part, I agree with you. But there are some mentally disturbed dogs, often due to inbreeding. And animals can develop mental conditions.
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doodadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
43. Any particular breed's doom is aligned with how popular
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 08:39 PM by doodadem
Count on it--if a breed becomes popular with the public, the breed goes in the toilet. Unscrupulous breeders/puppy mills are in the game for quantity, not quality. A good, responsible breeder of any type animal, whether it's dogs, horses, cats, whatever, will always breed for good personality first, looks second. The other problem with the puppy mills, is that sometimes they are churning out several different breeds in their backyards, and they end up intermingling. It's been a nightmare for the AKC to sort out.
Remember when everyone had to have a Collie because of Lassie? They bred the brains right out of them. I'm serious. They bred for extreme type, with more narrow skulls. We started getting real schizoid Collies, when they hadn't been that way before. I had my first one in high school, and he was a dream, showed in in 4-H obedience classes, in local parades, so forth. My second one, I bought as an adult, I paid a ton of money for, champion parents both sides. She was a total lunatic. Beautiful, but no brain at all, and a wealth of bad traits.
My preference now is Sighthounds. Love all of them. These are the breeds that hunt by sight, such as Greyhounds, Salukis, Whippets, Irish Wolfhounds, Borzois, etc. All of these dogs that I have ever met, and I've met alot because we use to be in a coursing club, had phenomenal personalities. Over the years, we adopted 3 Greyhounds off the track, something I highly recommend. We worked with a wonderful racing kennel in the midwest, that always tried to place their pet quality retiring dogs into good homes. We placed alot of dogs. Not all of them are pet quality, ie, would bite, or could never be housebroken, physical problems, etc. It is much better to put them down humanely than for them to go to people who will end up abusing them. Nothing used to make me madder than these do-gooders who would go down to the tracks in Florida, pick up a load of Greyhounds that the owners thought had been put down, bring them back up north, and hand them out in parking lots to anyone who would take them. You'd end up with Greyhounds running loose, killing cats/chickens, whatever. Worst of all, they were not neutered first. So you'd get these goons who thought it would be so cool to get one and cross it with their coonhounds to get really fast huntin' dawgs. Our adoptees were always neutered, got their shots, had been housebroken and socialized before placement, and we ALWAYS followed up on them.
Right now, I have a Saluki (a rescue), a Miniature Dachshund (ASPCA adoption), and a cross bred (one half Borzoi, one half Great Pyrenees). That last one is the love of my life. She was a mistake by a small time breeder that raised both breeds. She is absolutely gorgeous, super intelligent, and the most loving personality I've ever seen in a dog.
I am curious as to why the Chow is not on this list. They have been THE breed most likely to bite for just forever.
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idiosyncratic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
46. I've been bitten by a Chihuahua, Border Collie, and Doberman
I've owned two wonderful, gentle, people- and horse-loving German Shepherds that would never have bitten anyone.

The last German Shepherd I owned was attacked twice, the first time when she was just a puppy by a female Rottweiler and the second time by a very aggressive female German Shepherd.
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:50 PM
Response to Original message
58. I'm glad you listed Great Danes!
Everyone tells me they don't bite, but I can tell you firsthand that some of them do. I had to go on business to this house last year and the lady had 3 of those monsters at her house. Well, I expressed my concern to her about whether her dogs would bite or not, and she said they wouldn't, although one of them might get frisky with me. Frisky? I guess so! Soon as I walked in, they all started jumping all over me but Frisky began to maul the shit out of me. Good thing I had a heavy coat on. She kept saying, "Oh she's loving you to death", but then she saw for herself Frisky clamping down with both jaws on my arm more than once. OUCH!!
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #58
65. ANY dog can be aggressive.
Great Danes are one of the most gentle breeds I have ever been around. If the lady had 3 pugs would you say pugs were vicious too??
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #65
72. Oh, I agree. That's why I was surprised when the one actually
went after me.

Hey, I don't know what pugs are, but if one of them took a chunk outta me and had intentions of dovouring my flesh, I would think that particular pug was vicious, too!
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #72
80. This is a pug :)


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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #80
87. My next dog, if I ever get another, could very well be a pug!
Cute picture!
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smbolisnch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #87
89. They are adorable huh?
A good friend has a little pug, Eugene. He is the most adorable little ball of rolls. He gets so excited when I go over for a visit he just snorts and wiggles, snorts and wiggles. lol, he's precious!
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Greylyn58 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 08:52 PM
Response to Original message
60. Any dog can bite you
if it is mistreated. People get a puppy thinking it's cute until it begins to grow. This is when the problems begin and it is mistreated, ignored, or forgotten by the very people who thought it was cute when they got it.

That is why many dog clubs hate to see their breed featured in a movie. Take the Dalmatian for example. When the movie 101 Dalmatians came out with all those real cute puppies people bought them in droves. Unfortunately they didn't read up on the breed and when the dogs started to grow and they couldn't handle it anymore people dumped them in shelters all over the country.

Also unscrupulous people wanting to make a buck bred different popular breeds simply for the money...not caring that they are prone to hip problems, cancers, eye problems, etc. producing dogs with all kinds of health and behavior problems.

I own a Golden Retriever and even these people loving dogs if bred improperly or mistreated, will bite.

So it's not the dog...it's the ignorant owners not taking the time to research a breed or take the time to socialize their dog with other dogs or people that cause the problem.

:eyes:

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ultraist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #60
69. Dogs can be mental just like people
Particularly inbred dogs. Some dogs ARE aggressive by nature, regardless of training. Dogs have DNA-genetic personality traits and/or mutations too!
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:09 PM
Response to Original message
73. Ruth Rendell's new mystery is "Rottweiler," about a killer who bit

his first victim. I looked it up on Amazon to see what people were saying about the book and one guy had posted a long rant about Rottweilers getting a bad rap, how wonderful Rotties are, etc. (Like this relates to a book review how?) Hmmm, maybe I should post this article there as a "review"?

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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:00 AM
Response to Reply #73
125. Unless the murderer ends up being from the town of Rottweil
the title itself is a slur against the breed. Also naming Rottweiler as the most dangerous dog based on the number of severe incidents ignores two things - the number of Rottweilers out there, and the way those Rottweilers are trained.
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DianeG5385 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
79. My daughter was bit in the face by a dachshund in 1989
at the exact moment of the Loma Prieta Quake as I sat to watch the SF/Oakland world series. Al Michaels at the mike, everything goes black, my daughter and her friend come screaming into the house and she is covered in blood!!! I am almost 9 months pregnant due in less than two weeks, we race to emergency where she is stitched up (a very belligerent and angry 10 year old now 25!) I watch the coverage of the earthquake on the TV monitors at the hospital. Talk about a weird day!
We made contact with the dog's owners, all we wanted is that her uncovered medical bills were paid by them, we were very civil and they were very apologetic. The sad thing is they put the dog to slepp because he was a multiple offender and I felt sooo bad!!! If they had properly restrained their dog that did not need to happen!
I have a Jack Russell who can be very territorial and bite if threatened I NEVER leave him loose among small children!
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ultraist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #79
86. OMG! That's horrible
There are some brutal stories of dog attacks, some dogs SHOULD be put to sleep:
5447890&refid=ink_pubnews&skeyword=&teaser=" target="_blank">http://www.highbeam.com/library/doc0.asp?docid=1G1 :7544...
A 5-year-old boy was mauled to death by his foster parents' caged rottweiler over the weekend, the latest in a string of children dying while in state DSS custody.

http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2004/Feb/23/b...
Kaua'i boy dies after dog attack
Associated Press
KILAUEA, Kaua'i A 17-month-old Kaua'i boy died after being attacked by a dog, county officials said today.
The attack was reported at about 5 p.m. Saturday, Kaua'i County spokeswoman Cyndi Ozaki said. The boy suffered severe injuries to his head, neck and chest and died later Saturday at Wilcox Memorial Hospital.

Ozaki said it was not known what type of dog was involved or the circumstances of the attack. It occurred outdoors on or near the Moloaa area property of the victims family.

http://www.fresnobee.com/local/story/9697147p-10579796c...
Clovis boy dies in dog attack
6-year-old kindergartner found with multiple bites.
By Marc Benjamin / The Fresno Bee
(Updated Monday, January 3, 2005, 6:56 AM)
A 6-year-old boy died Sunday afternoon after being attacked by at least one dog near his home east of Clovis.

The boy, identified by neighbors as Tyler Babcock, had not been seen for at least 30 minutes before he was found unconscious in a pasture at the rear of a home in the 5100 block of North Leonard Avenue, just north of Shaw Avenue. Tyler, who attended kindergarten at Cedarwood


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primavera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #79
88. I was once bitten as a child and have wondered what happened to the dog
I'd been bouncing around like an ass, as six year olds are apt to do, and, not looking where I was going, landed squarely on the tail of the older, deaf dog who belonged to the people who were babysitting me. Understandably, the dog took a rather dim view of me jumping on his tail and spun around and bit me on the face. I got a few stitches and had a slight scar there for a few years but was otherwise none the worse for wear. But I've often wondered whether anything happened to the dog on account of that episode. I'd hate to think they put him down because of something stupid I did. It wasn't the dog's fault, after all.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #88
168. in this case it was the owners fault.
Just like all the folks on this thread who refuse to accept the nature of the breed they have, and take a chance on something like this happening. This is why special standards for the confinement of a dangerous dog is a very good thing, because it ensure things like this don't happen, and the dog gets to live.
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RBHam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:35 PM
Response to Original message
82. The Fascist Terrier
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98geoduck Donating Member (590 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:59 PM
Response to Reply #82
91. Now, thats a true BITCH!
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livinginphotographs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #82
110. YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP! YAP!
Ugh, someone repost that pic of the pug that was further up this thread. I need something to clean my eyes with.
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:06 PM
Response to Original message
92. It's rarely the dog, but the way the owner trained them!
All dogs are born pleasers, and they want to do what their owner wants. Most of the time, the owners don't know how to communicate with the animal, and the dog does what he THINKS the owner wants him to do. I'm sure all of us have known dogs of every breed that have contradicted the common beliefs. My grandmother had a pitbull when I was a toddler. My cousins and I crawled all over that dog, pulled his ears, tripped over him, and all the other dumb things toddlers do. Cotton NEVER even growled. Many of my friends have had German Shepards, Dobermans, Rotties...and never a problem. I've also known many people to be bitten by Poodles, Westies, Scotties, etc.

If dogs are corrected by being hit and yelled at, they never learn any response except agression.

Blame the owners...not the dog.
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sweetheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 05:32 AM
Response to Reply #92
132. Helping them with their genetics
Each of my terriers had a sheep chasing instinct, which got me in
trouble with local sheep crofters. Well, i took the ancient advise
of the farmer lore, and put them in with a tupp (male sheep)... that
pretty much runs after the dog in the very opposite of the ewes. Sorta
like the bull runs of barcelona, the doggies have since learned a
certain respect. :-)

As well, i rub them down top to bottom every day checking for ticks
and making loving cooing noises, that they start making cooing noises
and breathing heavy... oooh please hug me some more.... and really
there is no limit to the power of love.

That said, hormones and a pair of balls are the trouble behind so much
stupidity in this world... and if ya don't need 'em, sometimes the dog's
better without 'em.
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resist Donating Member (224 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
93. You're wrong
1The worst dog for biting is the dog cursed with a bad mom and dad. properly socialized and trained dogs do not bite except in absolute necessity.
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cidliz2004 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #93
99. Some dogs are bred badly and are "mentally ill"
That explains why some dogs are really bad news too.
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blonndee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #99
105. I agree, and that's one reason breed-specific legislation is such a bad
idea. If only criminals and BYBers are breeding pits and other "banned" breeds, the genetic predisposition toward agressiveness will only be compounded.
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ultraist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #99
107. Dogs do have innate/genetic traits
Not all genetic traits can be removed through environment (training). Just like humans, they have certain genetic traits.

Animals' genetic structure is not all that different than humans. In fact, pigs for example have very similiar DNA.

Some dogs are smarter than others, due to genetics. Some dogs have a bad mix of genes, due to inbreeding. Some dogs are calmer while others are aggressive, much due to genes. Environment is only half of the picture, genes are the other half. (Nature/Nuture)

Inbreeding also caused a lot of mental illness in blue blood families. After they figured this out, they realized, it's a better idea to spread out the gene pool.

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Haymare22 Donating Member (133 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:45 PM
Response to Original message
100. The Dog Whisperer, National Geo channel..........
This guy is great.
The main reason dogs become a problem is humans do not know how to provide dominance and submission.
Dogs are not unlike horses who always need to know in disciplined gentle consistent manner who the boss is.


People treat their dogs like children and their children like cripples.
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American Tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
113. I was mauled by a yellow lab when I was eleven
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 11:18 PM by American Tragedy
The owner had invited me to her house, and as I approached her property, the dog confronted me, snarling. I wasn't stupid - I knew I was in trouble. I froze, cast my eyes away, and slowly inched away. The dog charged and knocked me on the ground, digging in its teeth and shaking me like a rag doll. For about five minutes I wrestled with the dog, pushing its jaws away from my face, until it lost interest. I've still got considerable scar tissue on my arm to mark the experience.

Of course, the owner never really believed me, despite the obvious medical evidence, and I dealt with a great deal of skepticism from everybody else too, like "But yellow labs are such sweet dogs, I just can't believe it". As if I stabbed myself and crushed my own tissue to make it look like a dog bit me. :eyes:

Any breed of dog can bite, and any animal can become aggressive when it feels threatened. Volunteering at an animal shelter, I've been bitten too many times to count, though never to the extent of the above situation. However, as that list above implies, a small dog is far less likely to put someone in the hospital. I can't emphasize that enough.
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ultraist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #113
115. How frightening for an 11 year old!
I think some owners love their dogs so much, they don't think about the fact they are ANIMALS and do have an attack instinct (fight or flight). Even with the best training, sometimes the fight instinct takes over.

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tinonedown Donating Member (329 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:42 PM
Response to Original message
116. Chows must have had a strong lobby working in their behalf
In regards to this research/list. I've crossed paths with maybe twenty in my lifetime - 19 of them came after me, and the 20th looked like he wanted to.
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BikeWriter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:19 AM
Response to Reply #116
121. Chows have to be raised to respect you or they can be dangerous dogs.
I was raised with them and have bred and raised dozens. Only one of them have bit and it was a young gyp putting a man out of our fenced yard after dark.
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spinbaby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 05:55 AM
Response to Reply #116
135. Chows are extremely protective dogs
VERY territorial and will protect their owners at all costs. Our neighbors have a chow who I've known since she was a pup. She's a very intelligent and gentle animal, but when I go over to talk to her owner, she stands in front of him and kind of leans against his leg gives me that look that says, "He's mine and I'm protecting him." My understanding is that they were bred as companion animals and that that's where the fierce loyalty comes from.
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:11 AM
Response to Original message
120. Soooooooo.... over seven years, 33 rot owners died.
And how many were just bit? Oh, a lot.

PANIC!!!! Not.

Go take a look at auto accident stats before you go to work tomorrow. Then enjoy your commute. ;)
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Phentex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 05:50 AM
Response to Reply #120
134. Our rott was a Yugo in the body of an SUV.....
the typical lovable big baby a rott can be.

FOR GOD'S SAKE, DON'T get in a car! A car can KILL you!
:thumbsup:
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ConsAreLiars Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:18 AM
Response to Original message
126. Lightning, Reptiles and Horses each kill more people than dogs
See http://danger.mongabay.com/injury_death.htm for other numbers.

The hysteria about pit bulls and such is obviously based on something other than a real danger.

That said, the smartest and most gentle dog I have ever known is a street-rescued pit bull. She will not fight even when attacked. The only aggression she has ever shown is when her human was threatened by another animal (a hissy fit by a cat when the person was intruding into the cat's territory on the other side of a window - the cat's a bit of a pussy, pardon the expression, when actual confrontations are involved). Lucy (AKA "the Gentle Pit Bull") was determined to intercede, although whether the intervention would have gone beyond beyond a good scare and a severe tongue-lashing if I hadn't seen the conflict emerging and grabbed her collar is pure speculation.

Lucy also served as a therapy dog in a transitional housing program serving formerly homeless mentally ill folk, some of whom were wary of dogs (she kept her distance), some of whom wanted the kind of non-possessive affection that pets can provide (she kissed up appropriately), and some of whom wanted to give her a good kick (she evaded but did not respond otherwise.)

The point is that any generalization about breeds of dogs is stupid, and the hype about the dangers posed by dogs (and especially certain breeds) is simply insane. And the call to exterminate whole breeds (ban is the preferred euphemism) is utterly vile. People who think about dogs in such ways probably think about "other" people in similar terms. How people treat animals is a pretty good predictor of how they treat people.
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RebelOne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 04:47 AM
Response to Original message
128. No way. I have a Rottweiler and she wouldn't hurt anything.
My dog is a big baby. My son has a cocker spaniel that is more vicious than any Rottie. This is my second Rottweiler and all I can say is that they have been given a bad rap. I still say it all has to do with the owners.
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idiosyncratic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:13 PM
Response to Reply #128
162. You should have heard the Rottweiler story on CarTalk this morning
A woman said she picked up a six-month-old Rottweiler puppy she found abandoned.

She went in a store for 13 minutes and when she came back out the air bag had deployed, the gear shift knob had been destroyed, and the seat belts in the back seat were shredded.

It was a very costly puppy rescue.

My German Shepherds loved my cars and would never have destroyed their favorite mode of transportation.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #128
173. the people bitten by them don't care who owns them
a bad owner is going to make you look bad regardless.

keep them at home and confined and supervised, and comply with dangerous dog confinement laws, or we WILL end up being one of the countries that, in city by city, eventually starts requiring dogs of certain breeds to be put down.

People need to realize that advocating for special laws for the confinement of the hot-three or hot-four breeds, (I would include chows, and maybe sharpeis, which are just bald chows) is what will eventually save these breeds from being banned in certain cities or from being the victims of mass euthanasia in the future.
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Cooley Hurd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 06:00 AM
Response to Original message
136. Take it from me - Airedales have an oral fixation...
...they love to bite. Fortunately, they don't bite hard...

...and they don't like camera flash, either. :)
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HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 08:12 AM
Response to Original message
139. Most frightfully biting dogs of all: GOLDEN RETRIEVERS!!!!
It's just that they don't close their jaws after they put their teeth on your hand!
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Maine-ah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 08:46 AM
Response to Original message
141. it's training
yes, some breeds are more likely than others to bite, but alot has to do with how/if the dog was trained/treated. Example, at work my boss brings in his dog that is half black lab and half rottie. He saved this dog that was a stray, and the town was going to shoot her because every time they tried to catcher her she was quite nasty. The dog was obviously abused. You couldn't touch her ears, or her tail. Now, after having her for about five years, in a good home, with kids and other pets, she is a wonderful dog and she loves to have her ears rubbed. She weighs in at about 130 and she has this gigantic block head. Beautiful dog.
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Paranoid_Portlander Donating Member (823 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 01:03 PM
Response to Original message
144. Pomeranians ALWAYS attack me...
Edited on Sat Jan-29-05 01:27 PM by Paranoid_Portlander
... the second they see me, but they are too small to be dangerous to adults. Every pit bull I have met has seemed relaxed and friendly (just lucky). I have never met a rottweiler. On edit: Does anyone else have problems with Pomeranians?? Or is it just me?
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Paranoid_Portlander Donating Member (823 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
145. Paranoid Portlander's Problem: Pomeranians.
.
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madison2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 01:48 PM
Response to Original message
146. My only dog bite was from a chow chow
but my dog has been bitten twice by german shepherds. I don't trust them at all.
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Dzimbowicz Donating Member (911 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 02:57 PM
Response to Original message
156. I've been bitten four times in my life
Edited on Sat Jan-29-05 03:24 PM by Dzimbowicz
1. Basset Hound
2. Cocker Spaniel
3. Shepard/Collie mix
4. Cocker Spaniel

I love friendly dogs of all types, but I am somewhat shy of them at first because of my experiences. I can usually tell (I think) by a dog's face whether it's friendly or not.

As an avid bicyclist, I have been chased by many different types of dogs, mostly labs. Since they are usually barking and such, I don't know if they're friendly or not. It just scares the heck out of me, the adrenaline pumps and I take off; and, labs can run really fast for long distances. I guess this helps me keep in shape.
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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
161. Basset hounds!
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ElectroPrincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:30 PM
Response to Original message
170. Whoa! Rotties, Dobies and German Shepards
What a surprise!?! /sarcasm off

I didn't think Pitt Bulls were or would stay the deadliest due to their smaller stature, i.e., hard to get at the jugular vein in the neck.

BTW anyone remember (or can forget?) that scene in "The Boys From Brazil" with the Dobies attacking Gregory Peck? Nasty.

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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:37 PM
Response to Reply #170
175. I remember, the scariest part was the freaky blue eyed kid watching
it with no emotion.

An untrained, uncut dobie is just a big goofy looking hound-dog.
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Fridays Child Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
176. All of the miniature schnauzers I've known tended to become vicious...
...with no apparent provocation.

Just out of curiosity, if you crossed a schnauzer with a poodle, would the puppies be schnoodles or a poozers?
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American Tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-30-05 04:30 PM
Response to Reply #176
177. Interesting. My mini schnauzer is just very territorial and protective
I dunno if that's typical schnauzer neuroses, but it's been characteristic of the schnauzers that I've had. Stanzy's a very, very sweet dog, but she really doesn't like people outside of her inner circle coming into her house or yard. She does sometimes try to bite when she sees somebody touch one of us, as she is tenaciously possessive, but she's never hurt anybody - being bitten by her is like being stabbed with a feather duster. She's harmless.

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