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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:12 AM
Original message
Welfare?! Are you kidding me? Is THAT why they support * ?
I just visited a site I used to frequent. I was encouraged in that it didn't seem that the Repubs there were still maintaining the reign of terror they had before BUT I was confused by one of their posts.

One guy went on some tangent about welfare and how it is wrong, and we need Repubs in govt. to prevent this, blah, blah, blah. Did they miss Clinton imposing welfare reform? WTF?

I mean this just sounds like such a very OLD, outdated reason for someone to still cling to being a repub. Are they just being stubborn? Or clinging to old ideals?

Someone w/any insight please enlighten me...
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msgadget Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:17 AM
Response to Original message
1. Some people think taxes go directly to lazy recipients of welfare
and no one disabuses them of the notion.

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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #1
7. Or if they try they are immediately labeled "liberal" or
'Democrat.' Two of the biggest evils of the world according to the GOP spin machine (sigh)....

Geez, can ANY of these people THINK for themselves? I mean, just basic human logic?

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realisticphish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 05:34 AM
Response to Reply #1
20. love your avatar
huey is the man!


:hippie: The Incorrigible Democrat
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msgadget Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:06 AM
Response to Reply #20
22. Thanks, wish I could take credit for it
but it was in the DU library. I am a Huey fan though and have been using his '...suicide voter' quote all this week. ROFL!
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Left Is Write Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #1
27. Oh, people try.
I've seen good efforts to explain to the idiots just exactly how small a portion of their taxes goes to support welfare recipients - most of whom are CHILDREN - especially compared to other uses of our tax dollars.

And none of them seems to mind corporate welfare one single bit.
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NervousRex Donating Member (958 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:18 AM
Response to Original message
2. They're Dumbfucks.
n/t
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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. LOL!
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hickman1937 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:23 AM
Response to Original message
3. They think they got abortion on the run,
so their circling back. Social services hasn't actually been killed yet. Repukes are going after the Welfare Queens again. All those Black women living the good life, having tons of babies, while they have to go to work.
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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:57 AM
Response to Reply #3
9. Riiiiight--only black women utilize welfare...
These social stereotypes of The Right really piss me off!

X(
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CO Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:26 AM
Response to Original message
5. "Welfare" Is Simply A Code-Word for Racism
Those ignorant Repugs operate under the mistaken impression that welfare goes mainly to minorities, when in fact over 80 percent of welfare recipients are white. They don't like welfare because they thing they're supporting blacks, Hispanics, and other that are undesriable in their narrow-minded view of the world.
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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 01:01 AM
Response to Reply #5
10. when in fact over 80 percent of welfare recipients
are white.

Thank you, CO Liberal.
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msgadget Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:05 AM
Response to Reply #5
21. And, someone even called Social Security the "soft underbelly
of the welfare state." And, since welfare is a code word.... Can you BELIEVE in '05 people are so malleable, selfish and racist?
:wow:
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CO Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #21
34. I Can
I work in a virtual cesspool of malleable, selfish racists - Colorado Springs.
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msgadget Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #34
36. Check. Just crossed it off as a vacation destination!
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guitar man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:27 AM
Response to Original message
6. Until they need it
My Repug Sister in Law was going on about her daughter the other day. Now mind you, the 19 year old daughter of this Christian, right wing woman is currently pregnant out of wedlock, by a convicted felon no less who has no intention of taking care of the baby.

So this paragon of virtue I am unfortunately related to by marriage starts in about all the "programs" she thinks her daughter will qualify for to help her along. My response was: "You're welcome."

her: "Huh?"

me: "You're welcome, I thought I heard you say thank you"

her: "Why would I do that?"

me: " It's because of liberals like myself that we have these *programs* to take care of your bastard grandchild. If it was left up to people who vote your way, they would be out in the cold or in some slave labor camp somewhere. But that's ok, just keep cussing and damning us to hell and voting like you do, you people will manage to destroy everything we built in this country. No, don't thank me, I wouldn't know how what to think about that anyway."

her: <dumb look, cue crickets>
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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 01:05 AM
Response to Reply #6
11. I LOVE that you said that! Good for you!
She must have pissed her pants! LOL!
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American Tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 02:44 AM
Response to Reply #6
16. Awesome!!!
:yourock:
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #6
25. Wow
:yourock:
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tjwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:34 AM
Response to Original message
8. Ronald Reagan's real legacy...
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 12:36 AM by tjwash
Welfare queens driving welfare Cadillacs, and buying fillet mignon and champagne with their food stamps.

If you repeat a lie often enough, right wing dumbasses will believe it. Back then, it diverted public attention from insider traders in their limousines who were stealing thousands of times more from the American people than the mythical "Welfare Queens" ever could.

Remember when Bush Sr. bailed out the Savings & Loans industry with $500 billion of the taxpayer's money? That was enough to fund 20 years of federal AFDC.
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hickman1937 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 01:06 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. You mean Neil Bush's Fun With Money?
He violated the family moral code, Never Get caught. He doesn't get to be president till 2016. Jebbie gets the next at bat.
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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 01:17 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. Um--they've painted a pretty rosy picture of a welfare life-
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 01:25 AM by bliss_eternal
style. Have they not?

Admittedly, I've seen some welfare recipients(women and men) that spend their paltry checks on clothes for themselves and do nothing for the children. But even they aren't 'well off' or wealthy by any means!

I worked with a young woman that had a small child and was on welfare. I was constantly in awe of her. She was an incredible, loving, hardworking person. Yes, (hello--repukes) she did WORK, too!

She shared with me that it did anger her to assist the women that were welfare recipients that shopped in our store and spent all their money on themselves, as she knew from personal experience the money did not go far at all. She told me that honestly the money she recieved wasn't a lot--and every dime went to her son. She said the money from her job ALSO went to her son as welfare WAS NOT enough.

This woman owned TWO outfits. Consisting of two different tops, a blouse and a sweater she switched off w/ONE PAIR of pants--and we worked in a retail store. She sacrificed for her son. She also worked part time so she could go to school part time--to earn a degree to make a better life for her son. Yes, social services paid for her education--but again, she never saw a dime of it. It went directly to the school.

I wonder if these butt munches have ever even KNOWN ANYONE on welfare?
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lazarus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 03:26 AM
Response to Reply #13
18. known anyone?
Most of them, the ones that live in red states, are on welfare, they just don't realise it.
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #8
24. The most racist thing any POTUS has ever said in public
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 10:15 AM by underpants
Calvin Trillin wrote a great article about how all the Republicans sitting in the audience for the SOTU speech in which Reagan said that were clapping and nodding their heads thinking that "Cadillac" means the newest model and don't understand that SOME Cadillacs are two toned and the paint is peeling away and so forth. He added that Reagan should gone ahead and said they were bouncing basketballs and eating fried chicken to make the picture that he was trying to paint complete.
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EC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 01:55 AM
Response to Original message
14. anyone watch Street Smarts...?
I've got to believe the people on there answering the questions are all Republicans...they are just so...dumb.
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Melynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 02:30 AM
Response to Original message
15. They are behind the times
The old idea behind being a repub was to be against welfare. That was until the welfare reform act (that Bill Clinton signed into law).

The new idea behind being a repub is to stop the gay people from running amok and making everyone gay.
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tjwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 03:08 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. They do love those wedge issues don't they?
There is no way the neo-cons are actually going to do anything, as far as constitutional amendments either. These issues are far more valuable as "boogeymen" that unite right wingers against democrats, and translate into scare votes for the cons. Hell, the Gay Marriage amendment has disappeared off the face of the earth after the election ended, but don't worry, it will make a comeback as an issue during the 2006 elections. Just like the attempt to reverse Roe v. Wade will.

If the right didn't have something like these to scream about, they might actually have to talk about the raping and pillaging of Medicare, the attempted theft of social security, the failing of our educational system, large Corporations using their tax break money to offshore American jobs, a 500,000,000,000 trade deficit, the failure to capture Bin Laden, soldiers coming home in body bags, etc.
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KT2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 04:28 AM
Response to Original message
19. They call us Commies too
that is pretty dated as well. I think they just parrot what they hear.
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Fleshdancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:09 AM
Response to Original message
23. There's a lot of those crazies down here in TX
All the repubs are so anti-tax and the first thing they bring up is welfare. My first response is always "so what can you tell me about the Welfare Reform Act of '96?" I have yet to meet one person who knew what the hell I was talking about. From there the conversation disintegrates to a mumbling "...well, it's just not fair, that's all I'm saying". :eyes:
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Mizmoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:24 AM
Response to Original message
26. I was actually on welfare
for one year in 1989 and again in 1990. I'm willing to answer questions if anyone wants to know what it was like.

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fnottr Donating Member (365 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #26
31. Must've been nice having lobster and champagne every night
and then crusing around in your brand new BMW? :eyes:


Seriously though, what was it like?
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Mizmoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #31
32. This is the way it is ...
YOu get to the point where you don't have any food left, they've turned off your electric cause you couldn't pay, and you don't have a penny to your name. Your family has helped you so many times that you can't even ask again. So you go to the welfare office hoping that maybe they can help. I was in the boonies, so getting to see someone only took a day, but I heard that in the cities it could take weeks.

So you go to the office and they show you a typical dirty government waiting room - and you wait. In comes a woman (white) with two babies in the same carriage. She and the kids are so dirty that you could write your name on their cheeks using a wet finger. They go in to see someone. Others, mostly white but some blacks too, come and go. No one says anything to you or calls your name. Your baby starts getting fidgity from boredom so you ask quietly at the window if they know how long it will be and they tell you to SHUT UP AND SIT DOWN AND WE"LL GET TO YOU and you start to cry because your whole fucking life is shit and no one even cares and every jerk in the world takes his chance to kick you around.

eventually your time does come and the interviewer says she can give you some food stamps today and get you going for next month, but you need to bring in papers ... your birth certificate, baby's too, marriage papers, divorce papers, letter from your landlord, copies of bills, proof of residency, etc. and if you don't have it in the next two weeks then they will stop your application.

The lady asks you what you want to do with your life and you tell her you want to go to college but you don't know how you can with the baby and all ... and they tell you about their daycare program where they will pay your daycare expenses if you are a student. YOu tell them you want to start at the community college in September and they help you arrange it.

In the meantime you take your foodstamps to the grocery store and try to buy food and diapers. Sorry, you can't buy diapers ... food products only, please. And you sigh. What can you do?

When things get settled in general and your life isn't so shitty anymore, you can take the time to look around you. You can see people glare at you when you buy groceries. See ... if you buy ANYTHING other than meat and veggies people give you the evil eye. Sorry, my kid likes Cheerios - we're getting them, and you're going to have to deal with it. It's not too much to ask. And no, I don't drive a fucking cadillac. I can't afford a car at all. I rely on people who are nice to drive me to the store once in a while. But you'd be surprised how few nice people there are in the world because there is one fact I know above them all - everyone HATES poor people. They sure seem to hate me and my baby, I'll tell you that.

Eventually you graduate from community college and get accepted to four year school. But you will no longer be able to get welfare because they don't help people who aren't in "directly employable majors". In other words, because you are majoring in a liberal art, they won't help you anymore. But it's okay, because you can use your student loans and whatnot to make it. See, in your state they have family housing right on campus to you can use your financial aid money to pay the rent and utilites.

SO eventually, because of the kindness and generosity of people you didn't even know, you are actually able not only to get a good job, take good care of your kid, and be a productive member of society, but to pay taxes so that the next Mizmoon who comes along will be able to get help when she needs it too ...
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. WOW
just wow
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #32
35. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
msgadget Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #32
37. You made it, Mizmoon!
Welfare was intended as a leg up, a temporary aid for people in your circumstances. Damn, I'm proud of you.

When I first moved to the town I live in now, there were lots of foreclosures and women in line with foodstamps. They were all white, many the wives of contractors who had no work, underemployed (like part-time school bus drivers) or generally unemployed. Often, I'd be the only person with a check or cash to pay for food. Later, when my first child was born I was all these onlies: the only person of color in the waiting room, the only person with private insurance and the only married woman.

Sooo, when I listen in on conservatives online and they go on and on about welfare, without explicitly saying aloud - those triflin' black folks - I do a sloooow burn thinking about women like YOU, who needed a little help and were able to get it. And, I resist wishing them ill because...well, I AM a liberal and we are generous.
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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 07:03 PM
Response to Reply #37
43. Mizmoon and msgadget--you guys are awesome!
You both remind me of my favorite success story--a fave relative. Forced to get married as a teen(by her mother) because she was pregnant. After later divorcing her husband and raising her kid alone--she got her hs diploma and eventually a college degree.

Anyone that has ever actually attempted to live on welfare (or knows one who has) knows the reality of the situation.

I was never on welfare (didn't qualify as I didn't have children), but I've been poor and on my own. It was no picnic by any means. My heart goes out to ANYONE that ever lived close to the way I did--add kids to the equation--wow.
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fnottr Donating Member (365 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #32
41. Damn
That's a pretty impressive story, way to go :)

I don't see how any person could possibly want to live like that permananetly. The inherent shittiness of that situation seems like good enough motivation to try and get out of the system. Seriously, who in there right mind would want to go through that?
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txaslftist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:28 AM
Response to Original message
28. The biggest welfare queens of all live in Lubbock, Texas.
They are all cotton farmer's wives. Did you know that the federal govt. pays nearly fifty percent of the price of a pound of cotton in federal "farm subsidies"? A farm subsidy is when they take tax money and give it to the farmer to support an inflated price for a farm good he has raised. It is also wealth redistribution. You could also call it welfare.

I guarantee you that a medium scale cotton farmer makes about three times the money in farm subsidies in a given year that any inner-city 'welfare momma' ever made.

And they are damn near all republicans.
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fnottr Donating Member (365 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
29. Don't people understand
We need welfare programs, if for no other reason than because when a large number of people become truly destitute, and can hardly eat, they tend to get pissed off and start revolting. I mean, it'd be nice if they could realize that not letting people starve is the moral thing to do, but there are real, pragmatic reasons to provide these services as well.
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #29
30. Howard Zinn:Taxing the middle class to pay for the poor
and thus creating the conflict between the two groups to divert attention or anger from the wealthy.

Now THAT is class warfare.

I don't agree with Zinn on a lot of things but that one is dead on.
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fnottr Donating Member (365 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #30
42. Because of that
I don't think the people calling the shots for the neo-cons are actually going to stop all social services, they'll cut them back and make life much shittier for the poor, no doubt, however they will stop short of cutting them back so much that people are starving in the streets, people have a nasty habit of waging violent revolution when in that situations. What their real objective is to make the middle class resent paying for social programs with 'their tax dollars'.


Yet bombing third world countries is an acceptable use of 'their tax dollars'....maybe I'm just not supposed to understand it.
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LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
38. Remind them that the Red States are the biggest welfare states
meaning they take more in taxes then they pay. Whereas states you'd think would be big Welfare states like New York & California, actually pay more money to the fed gov't then they receive back.
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jswordy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
39. Just remember, folks, every cut in welfare...
...means a cut in jobs! Welfare funds products from the raw materials through the retail seller. Cut that cash, and you cut American jobs to make, deliver and sell those products. I'd rather have Bush prop up the economy with welfare deficit spending than Iraq deficit spending. At least our own people will be benefiting, all the way through the process of cycling those dollars.
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LSK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 01:12 PM
Response to Original message
40. correct me if im wrong but THEY HAVE REPUGS IN GOVT!!!!
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 01:14 PM by LSK
I have seen this argument a lot. Usually the person spewing it is TOTALLY UNINFORMED, IGNORANT AND STUPID.

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