Hey P.E.T.A! I just ate a big fat ass steak for lunch! YUM!

[trumad]

[phillybri]

1. Right on....

I know PETA's heart is (usually) in the right place, but man, they act like morons sometimes...

[DrWeird]

2. People who don't eat meat are siding with Osama?

[tom_paine]

3. I'm beef-less due to Mad Cow, but eat ALL sorts of meat

Once I am satisfied that Mad Cow isn't spreading (the Busheviks say it ain;t but of course they also said the post-9/11 Air Quality is NYC was FINE and DANDY.

So I'll keep my own counsel as to when it's safe.

But when it happens, it'll be BEEF for breakfast, BEEF for lunch, and BEEF for dinnah!

[redqueen]

6. If you've got the money

you can always buy organic or grain fed.

I'm trying to stay away from it but it's so hard to do!

[TheMightyFavog]

14. Wouldn't Kosher beef be pretty well much safe?

I don't think they;re allowed to feed their cattle parts of other cattle.


mmmmmm.... Brisket.......

[Taverner]

32. Niman Ranch as well

you can get that at some Trader Joes and Whole Foods.

And I agree - I stopped eating beef which I was unsure of it's diet due to Mad Cow.

[lapfog_1]

11. Uhhh

It can take up to 7 years for symptoms of Mad Cow to show up.

I won't eat any more beef until every cow in the US (and all
products allowed import) are tested for BCE.

I'm quite sure that there are already existing cases of Mad Cow
in the US.

[ohiosmith]

23. BCE does not infect muscle tissue (steaks) but rather organ meats

especially that brain and spinal cord. Ground beef can be contaminated if mixed with deceased organ meat.

[Taverner]

33. Doesn't matter - same utensils

The butchers use the same utensils to sever the spinal cord and process the dangerous parts as they do to process the muscle tissue.

So although the risk may be lower, we really have no idea how the prions can infect other meat. Better to be safe than sorry - get some Niman Ranch beef - it's better (grass fed) and its safer.

[BritishHuman]

35. Best take no chances

After all, 169 people out of 6 billion in the world have caught variant CJD from infected beef.

I suspect that stepping outside your house ever entails more risk than that.

[aquart]

4. Not till they test them all for mad cow, sorry.

I miss beef!

[robbedvoter]

5. In about 20 years you'll know for sure if you got mad cow or not

I stay off beef since BFEE is handling the security of the food.

[trumad]

7. Quit eating Cow... Get hit by a Truck...

When it's your time it's your time!

[MadHound]

8. So, are you thanking them, or simply ridiculing them?

After all, it is due to the efforts of PETA that your meat supply is safer.

[trumad]

9. ridiculing them.,..indeed I am

pretty much in the same way they ridiculed Mike Moore for being overweight.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4908305

[LeftCoast]

10. Hope it was grain fed, not brain fed.

[Karmadillo]

12. Dessert

http://www.ivu.org/history/northam20b/singer.html

<edit>

People often say that humans have always eaten animals, as if this is a justification for continuing the practice. According to this logic, we should not try to prevent people from murdering other people, since this has also been done since the earliest of times.

Even in the worm that crawls in the earth there glows a divine spark. When you slaughter a creature, you slaughter God.

As often as Herman had witnessed the slaughter of animals and fish, he always had the same thought: In their behavior toward creatures, all men were Nazis. The smugness with which man could do with other species as he pleased exemplified the most extreme racist theories, the principle that might is right. - Enemies, A Love Story

In his thoughts, Herman spoke a eulogy for the mouse who had shared a portion of her life with him and who, because of him, had left this earth "What do they know - all these scholars, all these philosophers, all the leaders of the world - about such as you? They have convinced themselves that man, the worst transgressor of all the species, is the crown of creation. All other creatures were created merely to provide him with food, pelts, to be tormented, exterminated. In relation to them, all people are Nazis; for the animals it is an eternal Treblinka." - "The Letter Writer" from The Seance and Other Stories

The same questions are bothering me today as they did fifty years ago. Why is one born? Why does one suffer? In my case, the suffering of animals also makes me very sad. I'm a vegetarian, you know. When I see how little attention people pay to animals, and how easily they make peace with man being allowed to do with animals whatever he wants because he keeps a knife or a gun, it gives me a feeling of misery and sometimes anger with the Almighty. I say "Do you need your glory to be connected with so much suffering of creatures without glory, just innocent creatures who would like to pass a few year's in peace?" I feel that animals are as bewildered as we are except that they have no words for it. I would say that all life is asking: "What am I doing here?" - Newsweek interview, 16 October 1978 after winning the Nobel Prize in literature

There reposed within me an ascetic who reminded me constantly of death and that other's suffered in hospitals, in prisons, or were tortured by various political sadists. Only a few years ago millions of Russian peasants starved to death just because Stalin decided to establish collectives. I could never forget the cruelties perpetrated upon God's creatures in slaughterhouses, on hunts, and in various scientific laboratories. - Lost in America

more...

[trumad]

15. "you slaughter a creature, you slaughter God".

So Sue me....

[Karmadillo]

17. OK

http://www.elyrics.net/go/j/Johnny%20Cash%20Lyrics/A%20... /

My daddy left home when I was three
And he didn't leave much to ma and me
Just this old guitar and an empty bottle of booze.
Now, I don't blame him cause he run and hid
But the meanest thing that he ever did
Was before he left, he went and named me "Sue."

Well, he must o' thought that is quite a joke
And it got a lot of laughs from a' lots of folk,
It seems I had to fight my whole life through.
Some gal would giggle and I'd get red
And some guy'd laugh and I'd bust his head,
I tell ya, life ain't easy for a boy named "Sue."

Well, I grew up quick and I grew up mean,
My fist got hard and my wits got keen,
I'd roam from town to town to hide my shame.
But I made a vow to the moon and stars
That I'd search the honky-tonks and bars
And kill that man who gave me that awful name.

Well, it was Gatlinburg in mid-July
And I just hit town and my throat was dry,
I thought I'd stop and have myself a brew.
At an old saloon on a street of mud,
There at a table, dealing stud,
Sat the dirty, mangy dog that named me "Sue."

Well, I knew that snake was my own sweet dad
From a worn-out picture that my mother'd had,
And I knew that scar on his cheek and his evil eye.
He was big and bent and gray and old,
And I looked at him and my blood ran cold
And I said: "My name is 'Sue!' How do you do!
Now your gonna die!!"

Well, I hit him hard right between the eyes
And he went down, but to my surprise,
He come up with a knife and cut off a piece of my ear.
But I busted a chair right across his teeth
And we crashed through the wall and into the street
Kicking and a' gouging in the mud and the blood and the beer.

I tell ya, I've fought tougher men
But I really can't remember when,
He kicked like a mule and he bit like a crocodile.
I heard him laugh and then I heard him cuss,
He went for his gun and I pulled mine first,
He stood there lookin' at me and I saw him smile.

And he said: "Son, this world is rough
And if a man's gonna make it, he's gotta be tough
And I knew I wouldn't be there to help ya along.
So I give ya that name and I said goodbye
I knew you'd have to get tough or die
And it's the name that helped to make you strong."

He said: "Now you just fought one hell of a fight
And I know you hate me, and you got the right
To kill me now, and I wouldn't blame you if you do.
But ya ought to thank me, before I die,
For the gravel in ya guts and the spit in ya eye
Cause I'm the son-of-a-bitch that named you "Sue.'"

I got all choked up and I threw down my gun
And I called him my pa, and he called me his son,
And I came away with a different point of view.
And I think about him, now and then,
Every time I try and every time I win,
And if I ever have a son, I think I'm gonna name him
Bill or George! Anything but Sue! I still hate that name!

[Skip Intro]

30. Wow - awesome post

Bookmarked.

Thanks!

[CatWoman]

13. Tru -- you are so BAD!!!!

[bicentennial_baby]

16. Thanks

Just what I wantred to see today on DU...not. ...fucking savages...

[phillybri]

18. Savages....oh man...

That makes me hungry for MEAT!!!!

[RebelOne]

19. Yep, agree.

And it's supposed to be funny...not.

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

20. People Eating Tasty Animals

That's the only PETA I belong to.

[AlienGirl]

21. And people say carnivores aren't overly defensive/militant

[Lorien]

42. My thought exactly

n/t

[Padraig18]

22. I *love* animals!

They taste good!

[Skip Intro]

24. Ohhh, and a picture too

How thoughtful.

Maybe for summer vacation you could visit a slaugher house (what a charmming name, eh?) and actually watch one go from grazing to being ineffectively shocked and then skinned alive. Take the kids, too, 'cuz that's great family fun. I hear they flail and moan loudly as they die, so be sure to take the camcorder.


Here are a couple of "before" photos for your album:

[trumad]

26. Ahhhh...the final product.

[Skip Intro]

27. Well what's a little torture compared to that?

especially when you don't have to feel it or see it, eh?

[Screaming Lord Byron]

31. We had a blood-pool behind our school.

Flies were three inches thick in summer.

[Karmadillo]

41. Maybe they'll let the kids work the belly ripper

http://www.factoryfarming.com/beef.htm

<edit>

Prior to being hung up by their back legs and bled to death, cattle are supposed to be rendered unconscious, as stipulated by the federal Humane Slaughter Act. This 'stunning' is usually done by a mechanical blow to the head. However, the procedure is terribly imprecise, and inadequate stunning is inevitable. As a result, conscious animals are often hung upside down, kicking and struggling, while a slaughterhouse worker makes another attempt to render them unconscious. Eventually, the animals will be "stuck" in the throat with a knife, and blood will gush from their bodies whether or not they are unconscious.

This is detailed in an April 2001 Washington Post article, which describes typical slaughterplant conditions:

The cattle were supposed to be dead before they got to Moreno. But too often they weren't.

They blink. They make noises, he said softly. The head moves, the eyes are wide and looking around. Still Moreno would cut. On bad days, he says, dozens of animals reached his station clearly alive and conscious. Some would survive as far as the tail cutter, the belly ripper, the hide puller. They die, said Moreno, piece by piece...

"In plants all over the United States, this happens on a daily basis," said Lester Friedlander, a veterinarian and formerly chief government inspector at a Pennsylvania hamburger plant. "I've seen it happen. And I've talked to other veterinarians. They feel it's out of control."

The U.S. Department of Agriculture oversees the treatment of animals in meat plants, but enforcement of the law varies dramatically. While a few plants have been forced to halt production for a few hours because of alleged animal cruelty, such sanctions are rare.

more...

[Zorra]

25. Proud to be 'murican! Eat more beef! Wear fur! Drive an SUV!

Kill the Planet!

"The way that we breed animals for food is a threat to the planet. It pollutes our environment while consuming huge amounts of water, grain, petroleum, pesticides, and drugs. The results are disastrous." David Brubaker, Project Director, The Center for a Livable Future-John Hopkins School of Public Health, Baltimore, MD.

By comparing the daily water requirements of meat-eaters and vegetarians, the environmental benefits of plant-based diets become clear. It has been estimated that 2,500 gallons of water are required to produce one pound of beef, while only 25 gallons of water are needed to produce one pound of wheat. Astonishingly, a day's production of food for one meat-eater takes more than 4,000 gallons of water, compared with only 300 gallons for a total vegetarian.

A primary reason for the high water requirement of meat is the amount of grain consumed by livestock; it takes more than 15 pounds of plant protein to grow 1 pound of edible meat. Not only does the grain consumed require water, it also requires land space. To supply a year's worth of food for a person on a meat-centered diet requires more than three acres of land, whereas the equivalent supply for a person on a vegetarian diet requires only one-sixth of an acre of land.

Scientific evidence has overwhelmingly confirmed that native ecosystems pay a steep price for the presence of livestock. Worldwide, grazing is a major cause of desertification -- the creation of desert-like conditions rendering soil incapable of sustaining natural productivity -- and has done more collective damage to western public lands than any other single activity. Grazing also affects wild animals directly because livestock competes with native herbivores for forage and often consumes the most nutritive plant species. Fencing, a fundamental livestock management tool, also causes problems by creating obstacles for many native wildlife species, such as pronghorn antelope. In addition livestock can transmit disease to native animals, and the livestock industry deliberately kills thousands of native predators each year in misguided attempts to protect their livestock

http://www.chooseveggie.com/default.asp?id=920

[Taverner]

29. At the risk of sounding freeper...did you know the cow would be extinct

If not for cattle farmers?

[Skip Intro]

34. Oh come on

We're doing them a favor then - ???

[Taverner]

36. No no not a favor

But it's something to keep in mind.

Granted, I do think we should eat less beef as a suggestion. Cows do wreak havoc on the environment and are very inefficient sources of meat, whereas chickens and turkeys are way more efficient in terms of resources to meat ratios.

But I just like playing with the black/white attitute (some) vegetarians have towards the beef industry. From the way some paint it, cattle ranchers are selling crack on hooves.

[AlienGirl]

37. Risking too much philosophy in the Lounge

But this is a fundamental difference between those who see the animal as an individual being and those who see the animal as an extension of a species.

To one who sees the animal as an individual being with interests of his own, of course it is no favor to raise him for slaughter.

To one who sees the animal as solely a member of the species, of course it is a favor to Cow-as-species to raise individual cows for food.

I am of the former group; most people, I believe, are of the latter: incapable of perceiving the animal as animal, rather than as group-representative-of-animal-type.

Tucker

[Taverner]

39. Excellent point (although I disagree)

Have you ever read Peter Singer? He really dives into this and makes an EXCELLENT argument for your point of view. I read "Writings on an Ethical Life" and he really made an excellent case for vegetarianism.

Where I didn't agree, however, was that if you extend his arguments far enough, one takes a point of view that meat eating itself is unethical, which would classify carnivorous animals as acting unethically.

True, we do not *need* to eat meat, but then again neither does a cat, or a wolf. We could separate all the wolves in the world from prey and feed them all a vegetarian mix which hits all the nutrients they need - but this would be huberis in its own right. By doing so we would be claming that we were better to design ecosystems than nature.

[AlienGirl]

46. Except that carnivorous animals re not moral agents

And therefore, cannot be expected to behave ethically toward moral patients. Humans, theoretically, *are* moral agents and are capable of choosing an ethical act over an unethical one.

However, "ought implies can," and since carnivorous animals cannot make a moral decision, they are under no ethical obligation to do so.

I don't like Peter Singer, btw. He's too Utilitarian for me; I'm more of a post-Kantian, or even a neo-Buberist.

Tucker

[Taverner]

47. I'm a bit of a utilitarian, but with a lot of nihilism thrown in

And I'm not so sure we are moral agents - most people don't think about morality or ethics, and perhaps even ALL ethics can be explained by selfish needs.

[Taverner]

28. Was it slow smoked over mesquite?

mmmmmmmmmmMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Of course some steaks should never be altered in any way. Omaha Steaks Filets are a dang fine example.

[sus]

38. HAHAHA!

that is so wrong.

[ChickMagic]

40. Wah!!!

Its only crime was being born delicious.

[Delano]

43. I had lo-fat turkey hot dogs

Technically still meat - yum!

I only like steak on occasion - too heavy.

[Delano]

44. Funny thing...

How animal rights/vegetarian extremists are so offended by the consumption of any meat, and how some meat eaters are so defiant in their overconsumption of meat. The truth is somewhere in the middle. If we don't cut down on meat consumption, we will do serious damage to the environment and our own health, but meat is a valuable source of nutrition and a part of many cultures, and meat is NOT "murder"


At least that's how I see it. The extremes on both sides of this are just comical.

[TXlib]

45. So, you like tossing Grenades, huh?

Grenade isn't actually a Warrior, per se, but he is an ordnance so widely employed by combatants that no Flame Warriors guide would be complete without mentioning him. When lobbed into a discussion forum Grenade instantly reduces any semblance of reasonable discourse to smoking rubble and sets in motion the forces of war. Grenade can be loaded with different explosives depending on the forum, but some common detonating materials are Clinton, gun control, homosexuality, Reagan, abortion, taxes, conspiracy theory, the NEA, welfare reform, etc. When beleaguered and facing certain defeat a Warrior can deflect even the most determined attack by triggering a diversionary explosion. Grenade is a particularly destructive weapon when wielded by Evil Clown, Issues, Troglodyte and even Weenie, but almost any Warrior can use it to gain a temporary strategic advantage. Grenade is the preferred weapon of Troller and L'Enfant Provocateur. Eagle Scout has been known to throw himself upon Grenade to save the forum.

http://www.winternet.com/~mikelr/flame65.html

[SmileyBoy]

48. Animals have rights...

...They have the right to be tasty and delicious!!!