Is the WSJ Editorial Staff Insane?

[dkamin]

what planet are they on?

http://www.opinionjournal.com/columnists/bminiter/?id=110004368

"There are other issues too. The Bible is the most influential book of Western civilization, yet it's not taught in the nation's public schools. Christians are routinely discriminated against and told they can't talk about their faith in the classroom. Christians have increasingly become involved in politics over the past 30 years because they've seen the moral underpinnings pulled out of civic institutions from schools to courts to social services departments."

Dude, I have yet to meet a Christian who was discriminated against. "Talk about faith in the classroom"? I would guess that also applies to Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, etc.

This is the biggest myth of the Right Wing right now. How many white male Christians do you know that are discriminated against? What complete horse$hit.

[grannylib]

1. Somebody put something in their water??? This is ridiculous...

the Christian Wrong has a habit of picking fights it knows damn well are not going to be upheld by the Constitution, then whines about persecution when they don't get their way; it's one way to 'prove' the Armageddon-is-coming-we-mean-it-this-time theories they keep howling about (Christians are supposed to face persecution, so they manufacture it to be a self-fulfilling prophecy).

[La_Serpiente]

2. Extremely naive

they like to post from Democratic Underground sometimes.

However, I think they are looking at Bush's presidency in the wrong way. They are looking at it too much from Karl Rove's perspective - political.

[Midwest_Doc]

3. From the Civil Rghts Movement ...

...those in power cannot be persecuted.

[tom_paine]

6. I disagree with yoru premise, but the idea of White Christian persecution

is ridiculous for other reasons.

[wryter2000]

4. WTF?

They've gone totally 'round the bend.

[Atman]

5. I am SO sick of the poor, downtrodden Christian whiners.

There are twelve churches on every corner, entire teevee networks devoted to Christian programming, Christian bookstores everywhere, televangelists everywhere, Jesus concerts at the local Civic Center, even mainstream television shows with God themes. The president invokes God into everything, it is on my money, my kids have to pray to him before school starts (pledge allegience, anyone?). Oh, and Bush wants Christians to get MY tax money to spread their good word.

Yet all you ever hear is the Christian extremists whining about how they are repressed and not allowed to get their message out.

Shut the fuck up and go to church if that is your bag! Quit trying to force the rest of us to go along with you!

[Melsky]

8. I agree

To them, discriminated against seems to mean that there are still some facets of American life they are not controlling. Give me a break!

[GOPFighter]

20. A m e n !!!!

You're spot on!

[Loonman]

7. WSJ Edit. staff is uber-rightwing

I'd bet these idiots and David Limbaugh have NO CLUE what it's like to really be persecuted.

[Cocoa]

9. Is this guy related to Richard Miniter?

Richard Miniter wrote a book called "Losing bin Laden", which blamed Clinton for Sept.11, and he's also a Christian Right guy.

[IrateCitizen]

10. They've ALWAYS been insane

Ever want to know what the next hare-brained scheme of the right is going to be? Just scan the WSJ editorial page. You'll find some doozies -- like the one in which they described people making less than $18k per year as "lucky duckies", because they didn't pay income tax.

I remember in one of the first episodes of NOW, Bill Moyers had the editor of the WSJ on -- I can't remember his name, a crotchety old white guy (surprise there!) -- and absolutely played him like Sega. At the end of the interview, he actually got the guy to admit that he believed that those with more money should have more say in our democracy!

[BootinUp]

11. Its a warning

for what is to only get worse.

[Skittles]

12. they are conservative whores

they lost it a long time ago

[sable302]

13. Persecution? it rarely happened.

Back in the day, Christians would confront the Romans practically begging for martyrdom and persecution, preferably Jesus style, and would just get kicked in the ass and sent back on the street. There were times when you couldn't get martyred for nothin, which really stuck in the craw of folks who followed a religion that instructed members to 'pick up your cross and follow me.'

(I'm an Episcopalian. We find things like martyrdom and persecution to be a bit tacky and in poor taste. Plus, it doesn't go well with the wine and cheese reception. :9 )

[DeepModem Mom]

14. They want more and more fundamentalist Christians...

because they vote, and they vote for right-wing Republicans. It has nothing to do with religion - it has to do with power.

[Atman]

15. Power, not religion?

What is the difference?

Religion is just a tax-free form of government, exerting control over its "citizens." Power.

[IrateCitizen]

16. Because it's still the moneyed class that holds the real power

The people within the "hierarchy" of the religious right are, for the most part, bullies and shysters. They love power themselves -- but they will also suck up to those over them in order to hold onto their power. That's the way their brains work, being as driven by simple hierarchal power structures as they are.

It's still the moneyed class that holds the power, and it always will be. Any of the RR folks who try to stand up to them will simply be swatted away, and replaced with someone more compliant.

[DeepModem Mom]

18. My observation was specific to the way in which...

right-wing Republicans in the U.S. use fundamentalist church-goers as their base voting bloc, assuring their election, in many areas of the country. I have no idea of the true religious beliefs, if any, of anyone who writes for the WSJ editorial page, but I know their political beliefs for certain -- and my point was that my guess is that their advocacy of Christian fundamentalism has little to do with their own religious beliefs, and a lot to do with keeping right-wing Republicans in power.

You're right that some churches use their power and tax-free status to exercise control over their members. The church I belong to, however, hasn't a prayer of controlling its members, including myself.

[Onward]

17. Article a Warning?

I thought this was a strange piece when I first read it. It seems to be warning Bush not to "waffle on marriage," citing a mysterious phone call that caused Mass Gov Romney to "waffle."

Tell me this. Why would we ever think Bush would go any way but directly to the Christian Right on this issue. Has he ever said or done anything to support gay rights? If he hasn't, then why is Miniter concerned about it?

[NashVegas]

19. Most Influential in Western Civ - You Be the Judge

a. Pythagoras
b. the Bible

I go with the guy who taught us to build. And if you'd like to get an idea of where the early Christians got their ideas of what women should be doing, you might check out Pythagoras' Trousers. A heavily disputed book, but interesting nonetheless.

[11 Bravo]

21. Not insane,

just your fairly stereotypical collection of wingnut assholes.

[kodi]

22. flip side is expect the falacious foundation of christianity 2be attacked

christianity begins with "christ rose from the dead"

i challenge anyone to prove this can happen.

oh, it was a "miracle."

yeah, right.

if christians want a place at the table of objective intelligent discussion for their premises then they can not bleat out "discrimination" when their basic tenets of faith are attacked as nonsense by logical and rational analysis.

the separation of church and state actually protects their religion against critical analysis in the markerplace of ideas and prevents an objective discussion of their fairytales.

pointing out that it is physically impossible to rise from the dead, that no one can walk on water, that no one can raise the dead, is not an attack on christianity or religious discrimination. it is the application of human reason.

if christians want that, so be it, and so too they will be revealed as those who can not be trusted as rational, objective people to have logic rule their lives.

[damnraddem]

23. The Bible can be taught ABOUT in public school classrooms.

It just cannot be taught as truth, cannot be favored, cannot be used as a scientific reference work (as many Creationists would have us do).

But regards the WSJ? The answer is: 'yes.'

[BootinUp]

24. Well I might agree

if it was in a general course about world religions. That would be similiar to a course I took at a catholic high school in SoCal.

[Military Brat]

25. So many Christians, so few lions

:evilgrin:

[JHB]

26. Yes, and have been for years, decades even.

Now what's your question? :evilgrin:

[Archae]

27. I sent in this reply to that jerk.

Subject:
Re: How Bush Can Lose

"There are other issues too. The Bible is the most influential book of Western civilization, yet it's not taught in the nation's public schools. Christians are routinely discriminated against and told they can't talk about their faith in the classroom. Christians have increasingly become involved in politics over the past 30 years because they've seen the moral underpinnings pulled out of civic institutions from schools to courts to social services departments."

My answer:

What PLANET are you on? Guess what, Mr Holier-Than-Thou. Of all the countries that do NOT have a government-mandated religion, the US is the most religious country on Earth.
What has been challenged, and mostly stopped, is not "public displays of faith."
It's coercive, exclusionary Christian displays and forced Christian rites.
Tell you what, first, pray.
Tell me how many people try to beat you up or arrest you.
Then, look up in your Bible what Jesus had to say about Holier-Than-Thou public religion pushers like yourself.
Otherwise, take your Talibornagain "We is a CHRISTIAN NATION" religious bigotry and simply go away.