Voting Green/Progressive? Masturbating? Is there a difference?

[Psychoblues99]

Just an inquiring mind? I vote Democratic. I consider my votes Green/Progressive and also consider them real/sustainable/responsible. I don't consider many Green/Progressive votes likewise. But I can dig the platforms. I can only wish a majority shared our views.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,,.,,,.,..,,,.,,,,,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,,..,.,.,.,.,.,,,,,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,,.,..,..,.,.,.,.,.,.,..,.,,..,.,.,..,.,

[Pompitous_Of_Love]

1. The difference is...

that masturbation usually leads to a very satisfying outcome.

[fshrink]

14. ... and protects against prostate cancer!

nt

[salin]

2. Why the distinction between "progressive" and democrat?

what about when I vote locally for progressives who are democrats? Of course there was that last election when in the democratic primary two progressives won - and the two dems (one who hadn't run for relection, the other who was beaten in the primary) started talking down the democratically elected (primary) democratic party candidate, and eventually wrote to the paper in favor of the business/development republican candidates, and stooped so low as to participate in republican fund raisers for those two repub candidates? On the way they also helped raise funds for a county council seat that suddenly went republican.

So why am I masterbating when I vote for the progressive democrat, when the former office holding democrats go against the progressive democrat to give the republicans a majority on the county council? They are the pragmatic one?

My point is your distinction between "progressive" and "democrat" doesn't always hold true. There are some progressive democrats. And there are some democrats who will undermine the party and work for the republicans. Not always such clear distinctions, eh?

[Psychoblues99]

3. Oh dear salin, do you think I, Psychoblues, am not also a "Progressive

Democrat"? Certainly I am. Additionally, I will not vote for a Progressive Party candidate that is a sure loser to the Democratic Party candidate that has a prayers chance in hell of winning. Can you dig that, salin?

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,,.,.,,,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,..,.,,.,,,.,.,.,.,..,.,.,,.,..,.,.,..,...,.,..,,.,..,.,.,.,.,.,

[salin]

7. hmmm

those WERE safe democratic seats, in a democratic city.

So, you are saying that in order to defeat the "loser" democratic progressive candidate you would endorse what the two council members did - in terms of working to elect the republicans and turn the seats (and majority) over? That I surely don't understand.

Who knows if you are or are not progressive - I was reflecting the dichotomy you set out (a distinction between democrats and progressives) in your thread title.

[Psychoblues99]

9. My actual purpose is to expose the similarities, salin, betwixt the

parties. I still think the Democratic Party represents them all to my satisfaction. Insofar as your depiction is concerned, I cannot comment as I don't know all the facts and circumstances. Just from your description, however, I would have to side with your assessment.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,..,.,,.,.,.,.,,,.,,,.,.,.,.,,.,.,,,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,..,.,..,.,.,,..,.,,..,.,..,,..,,..,,..,,.,..,.,,..,,,.,.,,

[salin]

12. you refer to them as seperate parties

I don't. Progressives are, well, progressive be they democrat or green, or in the rare case (such as Lowell Wiecker in Connecticut, who was, when he was defeated by Lieberman, more progressive than Lieberman) republicans. It is more of an outlook and position on issues than a party affiliation. I have not ever seen a "Progressive Party" primary, or candidate on any ballot anywhere where I have lived. I have voted for progressive democrats (Carl Levin of Michigan, and Barbara Boxer of California) and less progressive democrats (Diane Feinstein of California) and some downright barely ever progressive democrats (Evan Bayh). We are not going to have more progressive democrats unless we work for them, and start making sure that they have political/office experience. So when people write them off as "loser candidates" (paraphrase from an earlier post in this subthread) then we dont even see if they can win, we don't work to build grassroots level support, and to inform/educate/excite enough to vote the voters even before they have run. This self-perpetuation leaves many progressive democrats (such as myself) incredibly frustrated - as the less progressive marginalize the issues, and beliefs of the more progressive in efforts to prevent the progressives from having any ability to start moving public opinion back a little to the left (where most surveys on actual issues show most americans are in terms of stance on most issues).

Trying to marginalize those within the party, and those who have voted in the party in the past and might again in the future, does nothing for either the democratic party cause (in terms of elections) or the progressive cause (in terms of increasing the number of experienced, electable progressive democrats).

Alienating part of the base that is already increasingly alienated (this didn't happen overnight - but more over a period of about fifteen years) may seem like a great crusade to you (as it does seem to be a common theme of yours) but it is one of frustration for others. Makes working within the party (the same one I described above where the defections were pretty demoralizing) to try to revitalize it - if one is continually demonized as the problem - makes it damn hard to stay motivated and keep working. I see as many old time democrats turn turncoat/defector as I do progressives. Indeed didn't more registered democrats vote for bush than greens or progressive dems vote for Nader? Don't they deserve as much scorn as you heap on the left wing within our party who voted for Gore?

This is getting really old.

[Psychoblues99]

18. DU has become such a gathering of losers, but I'll try my best to

address your questions.

As in the case of Wiecker, I've never heard of him before now and can only trust your judgement, I tend to examine attitude and propensity. Advertising, sadly, plays a significant role in that.

As to why you've never seen a "Progressive Party" primary, I would suggest it is because there is not a significant "Party" there excepting a few zealots and a few more uninformed followers that are much like the dittoheads that we have so much fun with here in DU.

My own elective experience, both as a candidate and as an office-holder, would indicate that popularity (democracy) is the key. Your experience as a voter/sideliner/critic is much different than my own. I can't say that I never made a vote that I didn't regret. And I don't think even a common election day only voter can claim any differently. I voted as much for strategy as I did ideology. In the common voter sense that is simple, or one would think, but in the legislature it is compound, forward thinking, convoluted, difficult and final.

While I certainly don't intend to alienate any part of the intelligently voting left base, I also don't intend to coddle those that claim leftist ideals but proudly proclaim their failures to advance it. Can you dig that, salin?

I'll be voting, promoting, and advancing leftist ideals 'till I pass on, salin. If I don't achieve anything else in my life, I still don't think my life has been wasted, at least politically. Some here would like to destroy that.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,.,.,,,,,,...,.,,.,.,.,,.,.,,.,.,.,,.,.,,.,.,,.,.,.,,.,.,.,,.,.,..,,.,,..,,.,.,.,.,,..,.,..,,.,...,,.,..,.,..,,.,.,

[salin]

25. I have done more

than be a whiner and a critic, thank you very much. Have worked on numerous campaigns, done the ungratifying door to door, the oh so enjoyable phone banks, stuffing mailings and the like. The implication that I am a sidelinevoter/critic is insulting.

It is hard to draw people into becoming actively involved - as in doing the grunt work to support candidates - when the tenor of the discussion is insult after insult.

Sorry that you have come to believe that DU is a place of losers. Insult duly noted.

[mdmc]

4. I dont enjoy

voting for death penalty, drug war supporting Democrats. I'd rather have the real deal. Voting for Conservative Dems is like masturbating

[Psychoblues99]

6. Then pleasure yourself, mdmc

I disagree on many levels with all Democratic candidates. I also disagree with my wife on about as many issues. I've been married to her only about 30 years and I hope to get another 30 from her. I really don't expect you to understand.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,..,..,.,,,.,,,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,....,.,,,.,,.,.,.,.,,.,,,.,.,.,.,.,,.,,.,..,.,,.,,.,.,,,.,.,.,.,,.,..,.,.,,..,.,,,,..,,.

[mdmc]

26. no, I think that I do understand

I'm a 2000 Nader voter that is supporting Dean in 2004. I have Sharpton and Kucinich to support on the issues, but Dean and Kerry are our best bets to unseat Bush.

Patch your bones, and get back truckin on'.

[leftofthedial]

5. there is a BIG difference

Masturbation is a good thing.

[Khephra]

8. Please forgive me my Green friends, but I have one I have to use

(Consider this a joke from Jon Stewart if it makes this go down better. There's no mean feelings behind this joke.)

Q: What is the difference between voting Green and masturbating?

A: With masturbation you're only screwing yourself.

[Psychoblues99]

10. That was not mean, khep!!!!!! But is more true than the faux green/

progessives want to admit. I think the real Green/Progessives are much more attuned to the political equation we are now challenged with to argue the point.

Carry on, my brother.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,.,.,,,.,,.,.,.,.,..,.,.,,..,,,,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,,,,,.,.,.,.,.,.,..,,.,,.,,,.,,.,,.,.,.,.,..,,.,..,.,,..,,.,..,,.,..,,.

[Khephra]

16. BTW, did you get my mail?

About Aug 7th?

[Psychoblues99]

19. Sure did, khep. I'll be in Orlando on that date.

But we shall meet as Brothers sometime, someplace. I consider this as appropriate as any. I'd give anything to raise you.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,..,,,.,,,..,.,.,.,..,.,.,.,,.,,,.,.,.,.,..,..,.,,.,..,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,,,.,.,.,.,..,,,..,.,.

[Khephra]

23. Well, my closest Brother has told me that we were going to be doing a bit

traveling together soon...maybe we'll get to you neck of the woods.

[Jim Sagle]

11. I sleep better after masturbating.

[Psychoblues99]

21. That's strange, my wife keeps me up all night when I masturbate

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,

[vision]

13. I vote democratic

I have voted democratic since I have been able to vote and I have generally been living in Kansas. There a democratic vote is worse than masturbation it is usually just like getting a case of "blue balls."

But I am now in MO, which isn't that much better, but I tell you I would rather "masturbate" and vote third party than continue to get reamed by Democrates that praise Bush with evry other apperance. The current crop of canidates are pretty good and I think I can vote for any of them except Lieberman. His voting record may be closer to what I like but his kissing up to Bush the past two years is more than I can take. As Popeye said, "That's all I can stand, I can't stands no more !"

[Eddie Current]

15. most people live lives of quiet masturbation

on edit: spelling

[Terwilliger]

17. masturbation? like your posts?

if there's any self-gratification going on around here, it must be you

[Psychoblues99]

20. Your eyes are rolled back in your head, Terwilliger

Stop that or you'll go blind.



Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,.,,.,.,,,.,.,.,,,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,..,,.,.,.,,.,.,.,,.,.,..,..,.,.,.,,.,,,..,.,,.,.,.,.,

[Kurovski]

22. One hath a fine ending. T'other doth not.

*

[Iverson]

24. not one you're willing to see

n/t