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Isome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 04:55 PM
Original message
Rules for Democrats:
There are no rules!

The following excerpted blog entry, from Rude Pundit, best articulates the frustrations many liberal Democrats, like myself, are feeling and draws the same conclusion about the absence of any "rules of conflict".
...if youre gonna bother fighting, fight to win, to be the one who walks away. The guy on the ground is only fit to be pissed and spit on by the gathered crowd.

See, Republicans understand this. They know that you dont bring a knife to a gun fight. They understood this when they went after Bill Clinton. They threw everything they possibly could at him ...

... the evil Tom DeLay, the corpulent Dennis Hastert, and others conspired to leave the voting open until the Republicans had enough votes to win...The Democrats were incensed. How dare the rules be so stretched? ...That's the kind of thinking that gets you shanked in the ribs. ...Bill Frist may as well have been standing over the curled-into-a-fetal-position still warm corpse of Tom Daschle, wiping his shiv on his pants and cackling madly as he disappered into the White House.

The advice to Democrats is this: the rules are that there are no rules. ...They will stop at nothing to demonize you, Democrats, and they will smile at you and call you friend even as they slice off your nuts.

It's time to not question all the hate against Republicans that's going around. Embrace that anger. Channel it into a real opposition. Republicans will suckle at the teat of Richard Mellon Scaife-funded foundations until they are engorged to bursting with filthy fascist lucre, ... You'll want to talk about the economy and they'll say you want gay marriage so who cares what your economic policies are. So you can't win. Instead, degrade them. Make them seem like the corporate lackeys and hate mongers that they are.


It's past time we grew a spine. There are no swing voters worth considering any longer.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 04:58 PM
Response to Original message
1. No argument from me
I've felt that way for a long time, I've not been able to put it into words so eloquently though.
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sistersofmercy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 05:12 PM
Response to Original message
2. Kick!
It is true that Republicans are ruthless, they will step on whoever they need to in order to feed the machine. Conversely, I believe Democrats have a hard time being ruthless because their agenda is utilitarian in nature. You are correct that Democrats need to stop trying to do things the nice way, I'm just not so sure it can be done.
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jbm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
3. I have a question...
this blog entry actually does represent how I feel,but there is a part of me that says this is the wrong approach. It's almost impossible not to react with anger and emotion to the harm that's being done to the country,particularly when the people doing the harm have created an atmosphere that encourages that group of people who derive their sense of self from hating others...to hate us.

I keep thinking though,that allowing ourselves to be drawn into some sort of crazy competition where our focus shifts from the goals to counter balancing the ridiculous environment they've created is counter-productive. I still do have faith that the majority of people see through-either literally or instinctively-false premises. I'm torn between the argument that fire must be fought with fire,and the argument that says we can best disarm these particular tactics by totally dismissing them. If we disregard their nonsense,rise above the anger and competition..and simply relate to the american people what changes we would make and how we would acheive them without falling into the rhetoric trap,maybe the differences between the liberals and the conservatives would become so distinctive that we'd damn near start a new religion!

So anyway,my question is...which approach is truly most effective?
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Isome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Which approach is truly most effective?
I'd have to answer your question with a quesion: look around you and tell me which approach is most effective? Is it the mealy-mouthed approach we've (Democrats) have taken thus far unnecessarily conceding distorted points of an issue the rethugs highlight and then taking a scattershot approach to defending our stance? Or, is it the take-no-prisoners tactic of the GOP repeating a lie until the lie is all the public remembers?

The beauty of it for us is that we won't have to lie, not even by omission, because the truth is the perfect weapon to bludgeon them mercilessly about the head and shoulders.
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jbm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 06:45 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. and again...
I'm tempted to agree with you,but I'm not sure that we're limited to those two choices. I think it is possible to be strong and passionate about our goals and ideals while remaining totally above the mindless chatter coming from the coulter/rush/hannity crowd.
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Isome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-29-03 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. Where's the suggestion to engage in mindless chatter?
Calling a liar a liar isn't mindless chatter. Refusing to concede to distortions of an issue isn't mindless chatter.

Passion is good; strong is great. Playing by the "the Marquis of Queensbury rules" in a street fight with rethuglicans is just stupid!
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yowzayowzayowza Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 05:32 PM
Response to Original message
4. Been the case since...
the constitutional crisis over a blow job. They just get more and more brazen.
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pansypoo53219 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 05:49 PM
Response to Original message
5. the repugs declared war
TO THE RAMPARTS!
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Isome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 06:36 PM
Response to Original message
7. It seems some in the party are catching on:
From E.J. Dionne about the Medicare Reform Bill
If Democrats wanted to give Bush a political victory, they could have insisted on a much better deal. Instead, their negotiators sold out for a bill full of subsidies to the HMOs that will make it harder to control drug costs. The moral, yet again, is that Republicans are much tougher than Democrats and fight much harder to win.
In the same article, Sen. Clinton described Republicans in this way
"on an ideological march. They have no intention of playing fair. They want what they want when they want it."


Come on people... get with the damn program!!

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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 06:39 PM
Response to Original message
8. Only ONE rule...
Paraphrased from Ronnie Raygun's 11th Commandments for the Party of Nixon:

Thou shalt not speak bad about a fellow Democrat.

Let's get our internal act together folks.

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Kanary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Thou shalt not speak bad about a fellow Democrat.
Could we pleeeeeez have this engraved on plaques and stones and displayed everywhere?

Even here?

Pleeeeeeeez?

This is the one thing we could well learn from the right wing!

"Let's get our internal act together folks."

How right you are, ClassWarrior! Wish it was possible to get the Dems to listen to this one...

Kanary
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calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-28-03 07:28 PM
Response to Original message
11. How about some STRATEGERY?
Folks, we need to start creating and spreading some new MEMES. Like Republi-CONS and Republi-CONMEN and Republi-CON-ARTISTS and Republic-CON-JOBS and Cheap-Labor Conservatives and Red-Ink-Republi-CONS and Charge-and-Spend-Republicans.

We need stuff like this to roll off the tongue as easily and frequently and automatically as those schmucks derisively say "the Democrat Party."

They're having a great time because nobody and I mean NOBODY is hitting back. It's BEYOND high time that changed.

We need to slither stuff like this into the national mind-set. REPETITION WORKS!!! Soon, it will spread on its own, but WE have to get it jump-started.

So here are some suggestions:

1) WHEN (not IF, WHEN) you write or email some columnist or reporter or editorial board or whoever, slip one or two of them in. Make this a habit - EVERY TIME. I wrote to one Canadian reporter about an excellent article she'd produced. I made reference to "The Silenced Majority" to describe the many many legions of us critics of this "So-Called Administration" (there's another one) who've been forcibly silenced and marginalized. She picked up on that in her response and said that it was a good one. AHA! Perhaps she'll be likely to use it, herself, then.

2) If ever you get through on somebody's talk show, MAKE DAMNED SURE you repeat one or more of those several times. Further planting seeds and then giving them water and nutrients. Same is true if you email some TV show, on the chance it might get used on the air.

3) Use that terminology with friends and "watercooler" pals at the office. Just casually, BUT RELENTLESSLY!

4) WHEN (not if) you call your congresscritter (TOLL FREE TO CAPITOL HILL: 1 800 839 - 5276 - you KNEW I was gonna sneak that one in again, too, 'eh?), use these when you speak to Democratic office staffers. Encourage them to spread it, too. I started using "when bush lied, people died" or "bush lied and soldiers died" and a couple of 'em remarked specifically on that and said they liked it. WHILE YOU'RE AT IT, encourage them to start using this, too. Encourage them to suggest it to their bosses. Tell them it's the new rage where you live (keep it up enough and it's very likely to be!).

The objective is to plant these as seeds as far and wide as though you were Johnny Appleseed. Do it repeatedly yet casually in conversation and in writing. If enough of us do it, and spread the word, and maybe drop hints to Democrats.com and Buzzflash and some other friendly folk, perhaps takebackthemedia.com and such, it'll start spreading. Folks like Guy James and Randi Rhodes and Mike Malloy should be doing this, too. Suggestion needs to get to them as well. The objective here is to influence the national dialogue and the national consciousness and implant - or let's use the lexicon - "embed" this stuff in people's minds so it just starts automatically popping into their heads. Soon enough, the average Joe will start hearing this, and subconsciously connecting the concept of "Charge and Spend" or "republi-CONS" whether he/she wants to or not. It'll just pop in there, the same as the shamelessly-pounded-into-the-ground memes about liberals being so bad.

FOLKS, YOU CAN BET THERE ARE WRITTEN AND EMAILED MARCHING ORDERS AND TALKING POINTS ISSUED FAR AND WIDE BY THE LIKES OF KKKARL ROVE AND RALPH REED AND ROGER AILES AT THE FAUX NETWORK EXHORTING PEOPLE TO DO JUST THAT. YOU CAN BET THAT EVERY TALKING HEAD, EVERY REPUBLI-CON OFFICE STAFFER EVERYWHERE, EVERY RIGHT-WING THINK-TANKER, EVERYBODY EVERYWHERE IN THE BAD-GUY CAMP IS GETTING THESE ADVISORIES. NEWT GINGRICH YEARS AGO ACTUALLY DID IT, ISSUING LISTS OF WORDS TO USE WHEN DESCRIBING DEMS AND REPUBLI-CONS. WE NEED TO DO LIKEWISE, ONLY BETTER AND MORE HONEST.

Don't mean to shout, but then again, actually, YES I DO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Guys, my dad was very successful as a salesman. He was a specialist in stuff like this, and it worked-worked-worked. I grew up watching this and seeing it work, repeatedly, with my own eyes. PLEASE DO IT!!!!!!

-----------------------------------------

By the way - about Tom Daschle - it wouldn't surprise me a bit if he got more anthrax letters than we know about - like maybe to his home and against his family. Note that it was he who engineered the Jim Jeffords defection and was apparently a VERY shrewd guy who got things done - UNTIL 9/11 and the anthrax scare. After that, he became a paper tiger. I think we need to understand that. And, that said, WE NEED TO MOVE ON WITHOUT/BEYOND him. Acknowledge his limitations and then grab the steering wheel, at least in the grassroots. Realize he's not going to be of much help. It also wouldn't surprise me if others got anthrax letters, too, but were too frightened by the threats to their families and very likely their kids. It wouldn't surprise me at all. Remember who we're dealing with: an incredibly ruthless enemy who will stop at NOTHING.
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Isome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-29-03 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. Terrific ideas...
I try to use "cheap labor conservative", but I could put much more effort into it.

You can also slip in the new terms when signing an online petition (they normally have space for your own comments), and of course when emailing your elected representatives. The more we put the new terminology out there, the greater likelihood that others will pick it up.

It wouldn't hurt if we learned to pick out one or two major points of an issue, reduce them to their simplest, yet most memorable terms, and drive them into the ground, a la' the GOP. When we fail to do that, our less aware members aren't prepared to refute the lies coming from rethuglicans, and consequently tend to concede the point. And, again, the difference is we won't have to rely on distortions; the truth works just fine!
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Ecotopian Donating Member (36 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-29-03 12:38 AM
Response to Original message
13. Do unto them as they did unto Clinton
Hang them by the balls with their own conscience and play coy at the same time. Repetition is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT! Repetition is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT! Repetition is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT! Repetition is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT! Repetition is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT!

There's nothing worse than reflecting their own ugliness back at them. Make sure it's not ugly in the sense that we think of ugly but in their own sense of ugliness. So when they strike back with harsh words, respond as a victim to the bullies they are.
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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-29-03 01:00 AM
Response to Original message
15. Call Bush a "Liar". Use that word. Then bring up 10 examples.
Even a child could have thought of this, but DEMS are more frightened than children.
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