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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:37 AM
Original message
Clark or Kerry (that's what I have come down to)....
Barring any major changes, I have narrowed
my top choices down to two blokes:

1.) Clark
2.) Kerry

To me, these are the only two individuals that have
a chance of winning, mainly because they can be seen
to have the knowledge and experience to protect us
during a time of international distress. In order to
change anything for the better, we have to win -- first
and foremost. When people are dying as a result of
soft-core fascism, it is not the time for symbolic gestures.
Aside from that, they both seem like statesman, especially
Clark. I wish Kerry would stay away from negative attacks.

3.) Edwards

He's a little too smooth for me, and somewhat plastic.
I think he will be an excellent candidate in the future.
But to be President, he would need to buff his credentials
on foreign policy big-time. Though I am not a fan of trial
lawyers, he seems to have his heart in the right place.

4.) Dean

Was in my number 2 spot until this week. The CF issue
and yesterday's comments sealed the deal for me. He has
been a negative campaigner but I will give him a pass
on that because the rest (except for CMB and Clark) are
doing it. His outright dumb statements in the last few days
doom us all if he wins the nomination. He can't beat Bush.
If I am wrong, meaning he wins the WH, then I will pleasantly
eat crow.

5.) Gephardt

Not very exciting. Pandered too much to the President until
just recently. Hedges his political bets too much for
me, which has definitely hurt the party.

6.) Al Sharpton

I love his message, but I am not sure he has proven
he can really run the country if given the task. He
needs to be in a position of power and I think
he would change things for the better. I am very glad
he is in the race.

7.) Kucinich

Ideologically, I agree with him almost point for point.
But if 100% agreeability was the issue, I would vote for
myself. First, he is not electable in any stretch of
imagination. Second, he seems like a command-and-control
type liberal rather than a "groovy" liberal. He does
not seem very benevolent, though I think what he stands
for is the most benevolent of all. He gives me a push-pull
reaction. I am attracted to him and repulsed at the same
time. Even if he won the Presidency, he would just galvanize
the opposition. You just can't slap people in the face with
the correct answer all the time, they don't like it.

8.) Carol Mosely Braun

I have not seen anything I don't like. However, I haven't
seen her express anything that reassures me she could lead
us all. I need to learn more about her.

9.) Lieberman

I don't like him at all. From stem to stern, he is
just terrible. I can't believe he and I occupy the
same tent. He is a catty opportunist who hung Gore
out to dry. Yuck. He and Zell Miller need to strongly
consider changing party affiliation for the good
of the rest of us. If they cared, they would leave.

---

So that's it, my list will probably change but maybe it
won't. Who knows. I am pretty damn sure Clark will always
be on top and Kerry #2 unless one of them does something
unethical or stupid.

No matter whomever wins the nomination, I am going to vote
for them and donate $500 to their campaign. This election
is too important and will be hard to win. We can't gamble
for the sake of our own egos.
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La_Serpiente Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:39 AM
Response to Original message
1. Pretty good choices
at least you arrived at your decision yourself.

I respect that and I hope other people will also.
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bowens43 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:40 AM
Response to Original message
2. I agree with you on Kerry
but not Clark. I think our best shots are Kerry and Dean. I don't see the flag thing as an issue. He didn't support the confederate flag. IMO the entire flap was nothing more then desperate candidates attacking the clear front runner.
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quinnox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:43 AM
Response to Original message
3. Dean would be disasterous
You are right, his mouth would sink him in a general election, among other factors.
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Justice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:43 AM
Response to Original message
4. Clark or Kerry
What about Clark and Kerry? I like that ticket.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. I'd love it...
Just put the younger guy in the VP slot
so we could have 16 years of peace and prosperity.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:58 AM
Response to Reply #4
12. I have wondered that. How about Clark-Lieberman '04?
OK, that's a joke. Kerry was my #1 pre-draft Clark and #2 until the MTP appearence. He dropped but he is back now. There are good things about Kerry. I am not sure if I see him in the VP roll. I want someone that is fresh, smart and active as VP. I used to think that was Richardson. Then I began to think that was Dean. Now I think Dean needs to be kept away from the big ticket until further notice. Richardson is still very good. He is from NM. He is hispanic (yep, I'm pandering for votes), he is very popular in his state. His problem was the China stuff in the Dept. of Energy. I think most people will be willing to let that go. Hispanics will go for him big time, and they should. He is a smart, fresh, thoughtful guy. Imagine the debate on energy and the environment between him and Cheney. It woudl be well thought out and probably well executed. Dean might be good in that debate if his head doesn't explode. I hope th enominee handles this correctly.
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Armstead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:45 AM
Response to Original message
5. Good post.
After all of the disagreeable flame-baiting around here, it's good to see a reasoned explanation, even if I don';t agree with your assessment totally.

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democratreformed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:46 AM
Response to Original message
6. Doc
I found this to be an impressive unbiased opinion. Thank you for sharing it.
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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:51 AM
Response to Original message
8. Great set of points.....I had to laugh out loud at this....
(because Dennis' views also mirror mine the most - 100% in an online test!).....

But if 100% agreeability was the issue, I would vote for
myself.


I also like the potential of Edwards....

But Clark has been my Number 1 since rumor of his running, and will remain so unless he does something really stupid.....

:kick:

DemEx
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CWebster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:52 AM
Response to Original message
9. Not Kerry
Not in a thousand universes.
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chaska Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
10. Welcome aboard.
About Dean, a lot that happens in politics doesn't make sense. Perception is everything. Facts often mean little. It's not fair -- the spirit of what Dean said was correct. The perception of what he siad is another matter.

Dean has lost the black vote (crucial in the South). Even should they not vote against him, they will be more likely to stay home in the general elction. Not good for us. This flag stink is his albatross. And he won't pick up the poor white vote. Those guys are firmly with Bush. He's made a huge mistake. Because he's not Southern (I am, incidentally) he didn't understand this issue. Only Clark has a chance with that crowd. Again, because of perception. He is percieved as being more conservative (among other things) than he is.
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quinnox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 09:07 AM
Response to Reply #10
16. I agree
I also think this flag flub will be with Dean a long time, and while not a knockout blow (at least he was smart enough to finally apologize), will prove to be detrimental to his chances of winning the nomination.
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farmbo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
11. Considering you've been posting for Clark for weeks now...
...your tag line might just as well read: "Dog Bites Man"

:eyes:
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #11
15. No, I have been posting for Clark for months....
So my tag line might as well read:

I told you so.
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Brucey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 09:04 AM
Response to Original message
13. I respectfully think you are wrong about Clark.
He seems too light weight to me. Too inexperienced or something. I don't get the feeling that people will view him as substantial. Perhaps that will change as he matures on the campaign trail. Remember, he's never run for anything before. It takes time to be a good campaigner. Kerry is a bit stiff and has not been good off the cuff, in my view. He is not catching on. But he does have experience and is very tall - that impresses people subconsciously, makes him seem like a responsible, tough leader. His talk is shallow and empty (his delivery, mostly) however, and I'm worried that his NE liberal image will hurt. Dean will do better than many people think because he motivates lots of people. His CF comment was well-intended, but did not go over well and will make black people very reluctant to support him. The Dems might be in trouble. I wish we could mold a candidate from the good parts of all those now running, plus throw in Hillary! Perhaps one of them will emerge as Clinton did. I will vote for whoever it is, of course.
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hilzoy Donating Member (62 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #13
17. Clark? Lightweight?
Inexperienced as a politician, maybe, though I think he's better at that than we had any right to hope he would be. But I don't see how he can be called inexperienced, period.
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #13
18. Kerry does very well off the cuff- see any of TV the interviews
Kerry is brilliant. He always has well informed answers, and he always makes sense... if you listen to him.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 09:04 AM
Response to Original message
14. I'm Kerry or Clark
They're the only two who can beat Bush for the reasons you stated. If Clark has the edge because he's from the south and is actually a better communicator, so be it. He'd do an awesome job and I think he's really trying to learn and grow and I really admire that. But Kerry is still my first choice because I know exactly where he stands on domestic issues and it's not much point to win the foreign battle and lose the homefront.
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hackwriter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 09:34 AM
Response to Original message
19. Kerry has behaved despicably
I used to think he was an honorable man. Now he's shown himself to be not just a weasel who won't admit he was wrong about Iraq, but one willing to destroy his party if he can't be the nominee. I will NOT support him.
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 09:43 AM
Response to Original message
20. I shifted my list dramatically as well after CF. Dean was an easy #2
But moved now to the end behind Gephardt (who moved behind Lieberman after his PBA and 87 Billion votes + bush kiss-up)
Kerry used to be just above Lieberman (because of the 2000 election comments & war). But he is definitely now my comfortable # 2 - the spot where Dean was.
Comfortable #2 in my book means - if I cannot have my guy, I'll both vote and work for #2 if nominated.
As for the last spot - it really challenges my commitment to ABB.
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Blue_Roses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 10:25 AM
Response to Original message
21. well said
and I agree.
:kick:
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 11:12 AM
Response to Original message
22. I'm with Clark, then
Kerry,then Edwards....

Clark, however, is the only one that can stand next to Bush and make people want to vote Democratic. The thing that Kerry lacks is Charisma....and in 2004 America, that is important.

Edwards has no foreign policy experience, so he's a long shot.

Dean is the REpug pick....and I refuse to have them choose my candidate.
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