59% of Europeans consider Israel as the greatest thread to peace

[HaThorAtor]

To us this seems quite normal but obviously not to Rabbi Marvin Hier of the Simon Wiesenthal Center in Los Angeles. He assumes a paneuropean anti-Semitic conspiracy behind. As an answer he composed an urgent petition and called on all supporters to sign it and to send it to Romano Prodi, president of the European Commission, before the complete results should be published today, Monday.

The wording of the petition:

I join with the Simon Wiesenthal Center, and its supporters around the world, in expressing outrage and deep concern at the results of a special European Commission poll which indicates that the State of Israel presents the biggest threat to world peace.

These shocking poll results defy logic and demonstrate a racist flight of fancy that only proves that a systematic campaign vilifying Israel by European institutions, leaders, and the media has embedded antisemitism more deeply within European society than in any other period since the end of World War II.

If the results of this survey are as reported, then Israel should draw the only conclusion possible: that such blatant bias disqualifies the European Union and its members from any future role in the Middle East peace process.

Original source: http://www.wiesenthal.com/social/press/pet1.cfm?petid=91

I have taken the liberty to answer him, wording:

Dear Rabbi Hier,

I am European in Germany. I do not think or believe in racist
categories. But I am part of the nearly 60% of Europeans, who think,
the state Israel with it's seemingly never ending civil war is a
permanent thread to world's quite relative stability and peace.

Can you seriously cause a "racist flight of fancy" or "defying logic"
from this statement? The question was not "Which country should be
wiped out next?" after all. The fact that Europeans feel more
threatened by the situation on Israel than by the situation in Iran
or North Corea, is not unlogic but quite the contrary. To us Israel
is a focus of permanent perturbation just around the corner. It's far
closer to us than New York is to you in Los Angeles.

People in Europe want peace in and for Israel. Sharon's policy in
militaristic and colonial terms against the Palestinians does not
have many friends in Europe and is regarded as highly responsible for
the raising coil of violence for the past years. Most people I know
share the opinion that both Sharon and Arafat - "angry and dogged
doters" - should retire to their reserved property to make the way
free for a solution of rationality both sides can live with. What is
"racist fancy" about that? What is "defying logic" about that? What
ist "anti-Semitic" about that?

Just nothing!

And - please remember: you are US-American citizen, not Israeli.
Maybe it's thatfor you are double outraged. In the European poll
US-American politics concerning Middle East is given a clear
countermand. But instead of writing hastily outraged petitions with
questionable content to Romano Prodi it might be more useful to think
about, what the true reasons for the poll results might be
considering the European point of view instead of following blindly a
"blatant bias".

What you do as an US-American citizen is what we use to call "swaying
the anti-Semitic mace" against any critical voice directed to the
Israeli government. Noone has voted "against the Jews" after all. At
last you would not get almost 60% of the European people for a vote
like this.

Please stop perverting the facts. A French "Chevalier en Ordre
National du Merite" should not do so.

best regards,

You find the original poll results under:
http://europa.eu.int/comm/external_relations/iraq/doc/flashiraq_1024en.pdf

Until now the passages concerning Israel are still not published.


Greetings from Good Old Europe

[DuctapeFatwa]

1. Israel is a US weapons depot cum gangsta paradise

The emotional and religious aspects of it are on the part of the people who pay for it, not the playas who count the money.

Take away the weapons, the gunrunners, the European immigrant mafiosos, and you have a nice little Middle Eastern country that is not a threat to anybody.

The US is the threat, not only to world peace, but to people who sincerely want to live in a nice little Middle Eastern country.

[HaThorAtor]

7. US *are* considered as responsible for instability

> The US is the threat, not only to world peace, but to people who sincerely want to live in a nice little Middle Eastern country.

This is also part of the officially unpublished passages of the poll the Spanish magazine "El Pais" reported it. I don't know the exact percentage in that case yet.

Greetings from Good Old Europe

[DuctapeFatwa]

8. Old Europe should form a coalition and come disarm US

We need regime change, liberation, new elections, and the number of new prisoners we have for the Hague would mean a big boost for the Netherlands economy.

[Hieronymus]

2. Thanks for the post

and the link. 59% of Europeans, WOW. Actually, I'm not totally surprised at the figure.
I'm glad to see people from Europe contributing to this board.:toast:

[Paschall]

3. Greetings, HaThorAtor

This topic has been discussed on this DU thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=196054

Because of the sensitive nature of the Israeli/Palestinian question, DU has developed special rules for posting on the subject.

This item should be moved to the Israeli/Palestinian section of the Foreign Affairs/National Security forum.

If you hit the Alert link on your post and ask the Moderators to move it for you, they will do so when they get to it (which may take a little time).

Please review the Guidelines for discussion of Israeli/Palestinian affairs.

Cheers from another European DUer!

By the way, your point about Israel being far closer to us than New York, is very well made. Americans seem to view Europe and the Middle East as far disparate entities, whereas the cultures in countries surrounding the Mediterranean have been geographically bound for millenia: after all, we do call it the Mediterranean, the "center of the Earth," for a reason.

[HaThorAtor]

9. Duped...

I'm sorry I can't read all the threads here. Sometimes I still have some other things to do. :crazy:

> This item should be moved to the Israeli/Palestinian section of the Foreign Affairs/National Security forum.

Don't you think it is more a European Foreign affair? Focussing it on the Israeli/Palestinian difficulties to me means distracting it from the more important aspects of the poll.

Thanks for your hint with the Alert link. I didn't know that yet.

[Paschall]

12. I'm not sure how I'd categorize this story

European foreign affairs or whatever.

The DU rules, though, I think were set up simply to better control the flame wars. So I'd guess that Israel/Palestine section of DU is probably the best place for this thread--a certain amount of flaming is allowed within those confines. If you have a look over there you'll see what I mean. ;-)

[Forkboy]

4. Excellent letter

thanks for sharing it.

[rman]

5. Israel interprets this as anti-semitism being on the rise

but what else is new

[Paschall]

6. I'd qualify that and say "Likudniks" rather than Israel

There are many Israel leftists, progressives, and peaceniks who contest Sharon's policies.

But it's the same type of psychological warfare that is being waged against American opponents of the Iraq invasion. Those who dissent are "un-American."

These strategies are effective because there is a certain amount of collective guilt over the Holocaust and a certain amount of knee-jerk patriotism that can be tapped in the US. But as someone remarked to me yesterday, the Palestinians had no hand in the Jewish genocide, so they can speak out more easily about the oppression Sharon's Israel is exerting against them.

By the way, an Israeli soldier--one of several hundred who have refused to serve in the Occupied Territories--addresses this issue in the John Pilger documentary I linked to in this thread. Have a look. Very enlightening.

[Resistance Is Futile]

10. US - Israel similarities

There are many similarities between the brands of propaganda used by the Israeli and American right wing. The fostering of a victim mentality is a very large common issue. In Israel, the population is made to think of itself as the victim of rampant antisemitism, non-Jews wanting to live on their own land, and of course the holocaust. In America, the undereducated majority are made to think of themselves as victims of liberals, terrorists, equality, and of course September 11. It's the same propaganda only with a different aim--which is not particularly surprising given that the Israeli and American right wing movements are welded at the hip.

[CWebster]

16. Agitation of the same fear that spurs anti-semitism.

Always assuming the victimization role by choosing the appropriate scapegoat to attach blame. So in Nazi Germany the Jews were blamed, they controlled the wealth, etc., and the poor Germans were victimized by the Jews?

[Muddleoftheroad]

13. On the rise?

It's not like European anti-Semitism is a NEW story.

[Paschall]

17. Not a new story at all

Anti-Semitism has existed ever since the Jews began settling beyond the borders of Palestine. It is as at least as old as Christendom. Certainly older than Islam.

[Classical_Liberal]

11. I agree with this unfortunately

It breaks my heart that so many prominant jewish organizations seem to have neocon views despite the fact that most Jews in this country aren't neocons.

[Kamika]

14. Was this poll aimed at original europeans or muslims aswell?

Just curious, Europe has a large muslim population

[Paschall]

15. The survey says:

"Each national sample is representative of the population of 15 years and above."

Not all EU countries have "large Muslim populations." France has the largest and it accounts for only 8-15 percent of the French population (60 million).

(The exact figure is unknown because French law prohibits gathering data on citizens' religious affiliations. Regardless, one fact is undisputed, only a small minority, 25-30% of French Muslims practice their religion.)

[GabysPoppy]

18. Locking thread

All threads having to do with the I/P conflict belong in the Foreign Affairs forum.

I am locking it because it does not meet the requirements for posting in that forum.

GabysPoppy
DU Moderator