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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:14 PM
Original message
Poll question: Economic collapse

Sorry, polls are turned off at Level 3.

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spindrifter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
1. I'm hearing more and more
people around the country talking about how real estate is starting to belly up. That is going to kick us over into economic decline big time.
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sexybomber Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:17 PM
Response to Original message
2. How severe are we talking?
If the economic collapse you refer to is, say, caused by Bush's War, then... uh... 18 months. If you're talking about the inevitable Peak Oil Economic Implosion, I give it ten years.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. 10 years seems too lengthy a period.
Especially with costs as they are now.

The longer the better, just so long our corporate friends remain American enough for us rather than encourage the government to use OUR tax dollars to be used against us (which they're already doing...)
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sexybomber Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. You think?
Yes, fuel costs are astronomical right now, but there is still technically enough oil to keep the vital transportation lifelines of the United States (container ships, big 18-wheelers, etc.) running. If need be, rations could be imposed on personal cars to keep the lifelines flowing.

The economic collapse I'm talking about is when those lifelines can't fuel themselves. That collapse will be absolutely catastrophic, barring some new miracle fuel.

And I figure (given my very limited knowledge of the subject) that that's about 10 years away.
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justabob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:25 PM
Response to Original message
4. I think winter is going to stretch a lot of people
Edited on Mon Dec-19-05 09:26 PM by justabob
to the breaking point simply paying for utilities, gas and groceries AND rent/mortgage. I see things coming apart next summer into fall. There are way too many people already who are just days away from total ruin. By this time next year it will be much worse. Oil and related costs will rise, the bankruptcy bill is going to do its part, social programs are being slashed... there is so much more. I admit I am no economist, but really, how long can people be expected to hold it all together?

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newscott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #4
6.  Since gas prices went through the roof in August and September
I've been scraping by. Had to borrow money from my in-laws to get my first oil delivery this year. And I've never made as much money as I have this year. It's just not covering the bills anymore.
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justabob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. I know what you mean
I don't have the heating issue, but I am working part time only, living on less than 600/mo. I don't have to worry about being homeless, but I do have to worry about going hungry and having enough gas to get to my job. Christmas isn't going to happen at my house this year either. I have only a couple of small gifts for my son, but I had to tell him it just wasn't going to happen this year. To his credit, he is handling it well and is very understanding for a nine year old. That has never been the case before and I am not happy about it.
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blonndee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. "just days away from total ruin."
Myself included. And my parents, who are doing well right now, but whose income depends upon real estate (my mother is an agent and my dad builds houses). I am over $50,000 in debt for student loans, have no savings (never had enough to save, always lived paycheck to paycheck), will be graduating in May, and have no idea how I'll get a job that will pay for the cost of living and those loans. I really hope we all can make it.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. cost of living
With corporations offshoring as an excuse for "globalization", you'd think the cost of things would follow. I mean, Canadians and other countries' peoples get meds for dirt cheap prices compared to us. And the same meds are made in the very same countries being pissed on by those who want to make laws barring "foreign" drugs into the US.

What a fuckin' crock of steaming cattle cack. x(
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sexybomber Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. You could always steal things.
I don't really see anything ethically wrong with that, provided it's done from Walmart or some place like that.
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cherokeeprogressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. "don't really see anything ethically wrong with that"
Huh? What if it were your car? Your identity? Your bank account? Stealing is stealing and it's always wrong.

I live from paycheck to paycheck just like most. No savings to speak of, and I don't own much to be proud of at all. But. I've never stolen as much as a candy bar when I was a kid.

What store, pray tell, would you NOT condone stealing from? Nordstrom? How about Circuit City?

What would you condone stealing from Walmart? Televisions? How about DVD players?
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blonndee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. Well, I don't believe in thievery, okay? Just because *co and WM
Edited on Mon Dec-19-05 11:47 PM by blonndee
do it to me, I don't think it's okay for me to do it back to them.

If you're kidding, okay. I actually would NOT have a problem stealing from WalMart, exCEPT that it would ultimately cost the consumers and workers, since the profit-makers wouldn't take the cost on themselves.

Fuck Walmart and all them anyway. I don't shop there and I hope the motherfuckers go bankrupt. I never appreciated being treated like a criminal every time I walked out of the store when I DID shop there. My local shops, and even Albertson's, don't treat me like a fucking criminal.

edited for grammar
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The Gunslinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:28 PM
Response to Original message
7. I vote other
They can say what they want on the MSM, but the economy is collapsing now.
The stock market looks pretty good, but the only problem is that its the rich 1% are the ones investing that are doing great. The middle class isn't , and thats a true measure of an economy.
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unkachuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:29 PM
Response to Original message
8. after....
....2008 election, especially if Dems take congress in 2006....until then, the repugs will prop this thing up with 2 by 4's and duct-tape while marveling at the great job they're doing managing the economy....
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entanglement Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:31 PM
Response to Original message
10. not likely IMHO
n/t
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dweller Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:36 PM
Response to Original message
13. well, i just checked the kitty
and i have 12 cents to my name. I kid you not.

so i guess my answer is yesterday.

:(

dp
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MrMonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. I just checked the kitty
and, economic collapse or not, she demands to be fed.
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 09:52 PM
Response to Original message
14. Already too late
You know all that wealfare subsidies they cut. Well it is taken out of circulation you know the circulation flow of money. You know all that money send to Iraq, well it wont do America anygood when you need to keep the spending to keep the amount of cash circulating in the country to keep the economy afloat.

A lot of goverments try to kick start their economy by increase spending. Well all I can see is cut cut cut. And spend spend spend but gee in Iraq.

Taken the fact that most of the money would end up in oil and heat spending and the huge import bills on this. You dont have much real dollars floating around.

Worse US be broke and wont have money left to kick start the economy later.
Consumers earning power shrinking.
Less money to spend on others stuff cause of oil and heat.

Going to kill a lot of the local market
Meaning less jobs
Outsourcing whee

Does he have a single grey cell that is not drunk all the time?
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MrMonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 10:30 PM
Response to Original message
17. I vote other . . .
There are degrees of failure.

If you mean a depression, we're probably a year or so away.

A catastrophic collapse will depend on external events, such as,a rapid runup in oil prices, broadly-based commodity shortages, or demands to repay U.S. debt. If the U.S. does fall, the waves will swamp the rest of the world economies.
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Conan_The_Barbarian Donating Member (404 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 11:04 PM
Response to Original message
18. Well you know what they say
If you ever think the next big economic implosion is just around the corner invest in alchohol and entertainment company stock, seems like logical financial investment move to me, that is if you're in such a postion to be making investments.
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 11:23 PM
Response to Original message
20. Only 6 months.
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KayLaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-20-05 05:37 AM
Response to Original message
22. I voted within the year
I've read lots about the stock market crash and people of all walks of life who bought stock in the twenties and bought it on margin. It sounds so much like today with the housing speculators and flippers. My b-i-l and his wife live in a small town and have middle-class, middle-income lives and are quite young. Suddenly, they have a big waterfront house with a pool and own another house a few blocks away. My m-i-l says they have to hold onto it for two years. You know what that means.

If you go to sites like Housing Panic dot com, Housing Bubble 2 dot com, Another F""ked Borrower dot com, you can follow along with the coming crash and see where where all this crazy speculation and irresponsible lending will lead as the inventories grow and sellers and speculators become nervous and buyers back away. Prices will have to fall and goodbye the the 3/2 ATM.
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