"My son told us 2 weeks before he died that war was not worth it"

[kpete]

A Black Hole
NYT
By BOB HERBERT
Published: December 5, 2005

Every morning, when Mr. Shroeder awakens, he feels normal for the first 5 or 10 seconds. And then it dawns on him that his son, Augie - Lance Cpl. Edward August Shroeder II - is no longer around. Then an awful sadness descends, like a black curtain, over the rest of the day.

Corporal Shroeder, 23, was one of 14 marines killed last August in a roadside explosion in Haditha, in western Iraq. Just two days earlier, six marines from the same reserve unit - the Ohio-based Third Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment - had been killed in an ambush.

In Mr. Shroeder's view, President Bush's war policies have been both tragic and futile. "Staying the course," he said, is like continuing to pour water into a hole in the sand at the beach, "a process that gets you nowhere."

"My son told us two weeks before he died that he felt the war was not worth it," Mr. Shroeder said. "His complaint was about having to go back repeatedly into the same towns, to sweep the same insurgents, or other insurgents, out of these same towns without being able to hold them, secure them. It just was not working, and that's what he wanted to get across."

He took issue with the public officials who insist that his son died for a "noble cause," however comforting that might be to believe. On the contrary, he feels that Augie's life "was wasted."

http://select.nytimes.com/2005/12/05/opinion/05herbert.html?hp

[sniffa]

1. he was undermining his own moraLe

and his parents now need to be swiftboated, or sheehaned.

[Mr_Spock]

18. Oh, the irony.

It's not even remotely funny in a sardonic way any more - this whole situation is becoming more and more pathetic on a daily basis.

Down with Bush.

[upi402]

29. yep, still hate all Republicans with a white hot passion

i absolutely hate all those fuckers.
first time in my life i've hated an entire group.
i HATE those pricks and i hope we, as Democrats, never extend another courtesy to them again.

never forget

[Binka]

2. What A Fucking Shame! Shame On Bush! Shame On Prez FuckFace!

I almost lost my oldest son in October and I can't imagine how these folks are coping. I can barely make it through the day without collapsing in tears at least once! And I Am LUCKY!!!

Arrrggghhh. :cry: :cry: :cry:

[trogdor]

5. Shame! Shame! Shame! Shame! Shame!

Fucking bastard. That's all I have to say about George Bush and those who continue to defend his sorry ass.

Once in a while I run across a news story about some military spouse who's all philosophical about the lost of her husband, usually in the company of some neocon bastard, media slut, or whoever. I'll never understand people like that.

[Binka]

9. This Little Girl Almost Lost The Love Of Her Life

Four year old Peyton adores 24 year old Big Brother Ben! I could not imagine having to explain that she would never see him again.



How many other small children will be forever scarred because of this shit pot of lies and misery?

[trogdor]

11. She's pretty.

The thought of her having to go through life without her dad breaks my heart. :-( :-( :-( :-( :-( :-( :-(

[Binka]

14. Nah Ben Is His Sister I Have A 20 Year Break In My Oldest To Youngest!

Peyton has helped me so much since Ben was wounded. She said on Thanskgiving.."well at least Ben is out of the WINE RACK!" Out of the mouths of babes!

[Lochloosa]

12. Hey Binka..how is Ben doing..

Sending everyone my love. :grouphug:

[Binka]

15. Ben Is Walking!!!! Fully Two Months Ahead Of Schedule

Thanks for your warm thoughts.

[Lochloosa]

17. Thats GREAT!

Strong Moms help....*S*

[FreedomAngel82]

27. That's good news!

I'm glad he's healing well! :hug:

[Ilsa]

33. That is so cool.

Please let him know that many of us have him in our hearts. I 'splained his situation to some friends on another board and they send their best also. (And they hate Bush* too.)

[Ilsa]

34. Mr. Schroeder better get ready to duck, change his phone #, etc.

The Freak-Republik cowards will be calling him unpatriotic any moment now. They'll be saying his dead son laments his father and is ashamed of him. Assholes. CLueless assholes. Has anyone over there lost a loved one to this filthy war?

[FreedomAngel82]

26. I remember sometime late last year

reading that there was a high number of children now orphaned from this war. I want to say 900 but I'm not for sure.

[driver8]

35. I have a four year old daughter and the thought of your Peyton

losing her big brother breaks my heart. A child should never have to suffer such pain.

She is a cutie!

[formercia]

16. I'm sorry that happened to you.

I'll try to restrain my sick sense of humor.

[LaurenG]

3. This is heart wrenching

I find it very difficult to keep from screaming reading this.:cry:

[TallahasseeGrannie]

4. An American Tragedy.

[Davros]

6. An absolute outrage

Our government has failed not only the civilians but also the military by invading Iraq WITHOUT AN EXIT PLAN. It is costing us our children and tearing apart families.

I wonder why we don't have enough protests like the 1960s. Is it because of the type of war that we're in? Are people afraid to protest because the media will label them as "anti-soldier" and "anti-american" when they're really not?

[Gato Moteado]

10. it's because they haven't started drafting people

if they were drafting people and forcingthem to go fight halliburton's war, then the complacent draft age people would finally wake up and get their heads outta their asses.

i say DRAFT FREEPERS NOW.

[FreedomAngel82]

28. Bush totally flipflopped on that one

"Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is."
-Governor George W Bush (R-TX)

[Just Me]

31. Have you been to any of the protests in the last three years?

I ask because,...I have,...and they have been HUGE!!! Moreover, there are protests every damn week across this continent, especially where the BushCO/neoconsters are "fundraising" or progandandizing.

The FUCKING media ONLY attends to stuff that is fear-inducing or includes violence or provocation. NEVER have I witnessed our media giving the expansive, pervasive, persistent and massive non-violent protests across this nation their DUE ATTENTION AND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT!!!

[Patiod]

7. During the Army-Navy game: "fighting for our freedom"

The tailgaters, people going into the game, all kept saying "there are people over there fighting for our freedom."

Like hell they are.

They are young men and women who are doing their duty, who are keeping the promise they made to our country, and our fascist leaders are betraying them by sending them out to die without a good reason - they're there and they AREN'T fighting for "our freedom" and that's a sin.

And sorry to offend any converts, but anyone who voted for this moron either time shares some of the blame for the needless deaths and maimings.

[VaYallaDawg]

8. My heart goes out to these poor wrecked souls. n/t

[Lochloosa]

13. Destroy a town to save a town.....sounds familiar...

[gratuitous]

19. Sounds like another entry for O'Reilly's enemies list to me

Bill should have Mr. Shroeder on his show so that Bill can tell him all the wonders of the Bush administration and its benevolent policies. And if Mr. Shroeder doesn't see the light, Bill can scream at him to shut up and cut off his mike. Then trash the guy for a week afterwards in absentia.

[Binka]

20. He'd Treat Him The Same Way He Treated Jeremy Who Lost His Dad

9/11. He told the young man to shut up and pronounced him unfit to talk about his father....because Jeremy dared question Prez FuckFace. It was a new low in American culture. The fact that OLiarHead kept his job after that stunt was fucking criminal in my book. If I had been that kid I would have put a bull...eer I mean piece of candy in OLiarHeads Mouth!

[texpatriot2004]

21. I have a letter just like that from a cousin who died in Vietnam nt

[Autonomy]

22. I keep thinking of the guy in Fahrenheit 9/11

who lost his son in Iraq. He said (paraphrased), "I feel bad for the parents who are losing their children right now."

That brings up John Kerry's famous quote, "How do you ask a man to be the last man to die for a mistake?"

I know every life has incomparable value, but every death over there is worse than the last.

[Itchinjim]

23. Why does Mr. Shroeder hate America?

He needs to support the troops by supporting our pResident and the war!
:sarcasm:

[jbnow]

24. I remember that pain

I bet all of us who have lost a loved one, especially too young, remember it.

Waking up and remembering all over again that they are dead, that we will not touch their face, their hand, see their smile. We lose them again on every waking.

We continue this war and damn too many parents and spouses and children to that same fate, grieving anew with every waking. Thousands in America, countless more in Iraq.

And what a bitch to know your kid knew it was no worthy cause. I almost understand the parents who insist it was worthy, some consolation that the loss was for some higher, worthy, noble reason.

Not the pile of crap and lies they were sent there for and the mismanaged war they are fighting.

[FreedomAngel82]

25. I hate it too

Greedy bastards.

[Just Me]

30. *choke*

:cry:

The only ones "getting something" from this fucking war,...are the ones waging it.

I. AM. SICK. OF. THIS. SHIT!!!! :grr:

:cry: I am sick of this shit.

[Tsiyu]

32. So NOW the NYT is interested in the senseless aspects of the Iraq War

How convenient.

Do they print a little paragraph at the bottom of each story apologizing for their help selling this FUBAR'd death hole of a war to America? or are they pretending they just now heard of the war?