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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 11:59 AM
Original message
DUers from Kansas need your help.
This state is full of bright and inquisitive folks who adamantly oppose what the state board of ed is doing. It is incredibly disheartening to see all the make fun of Kansas posts here on DU on the last few days.

We KNOW these board members are kooks. Here is a great article about the most vocal member:
http://milkriverarchive.blogspot.com/2005/08/com-unmask...

Here is a statement from our Democratic governor regarding the change in the science standards:
This is just the latest in a series of troubling decisions by the Board of Education. If were going to continue to bring high-tech jobs to Kansas and move our state forward, we need to strengthen science standards, not weaken them. Stronger public schools ought to be the mission of the Board of Education, and its time they got down to the real business of strengthening Kansas schools.

Here is a LTTE from today's Kansas City paper:

Evidence is ample

Tuesday was a sad day for Kansas.

Yes, there is controversy surrounding evolution, but only among non-scientists. Those who reject evolution present no arguments scientists havent heard (and adequately countered) again and again and have no special knowledge that scientists have overlooked.

Organic evolution is so well established that to allow room for doubt is to misrepresent science. Evolution is supported by population biology, comparative anatomy, cell biology, biochemistry, genetics and artificial breeding, and by observations of how bacteria and viruses respond (over time) to antibiotics. Computer algorithms invoking simple Darwinian rules are being used to solve a wide range of previously intractable problems. Important biochemical molecules (including RNA and DNA) have been improved in astonishing ways in test-tube experiments using Darwinian principles. Any one of these mutually corroborating approaches could stand by itself as strong evidence for evolution. Together, they are indistinguishable from proof.

Non-scientists have no business meddling in the content of science classes. Intelligent design is not science.

Congratulations to those on the board who voted sanely.

Bryce M. Hand
Emeritus Professor of Geology
Syracuse University
Syracuse, N.Y.

http://blogs.kansascity.com/unfettered_letters/kansas /



If you want to make fun of Kansas, go to some other site that is more likely to be frequented by idiot fundies who promote creationism. We DUers from Kansas need your help promoting the viewpoints expressed by our governor and the professor from Syracuse.

Thanks :hi:
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rocktivity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
1. Yesterday, a caller from Kanas told Randi Rhodes
Edited on Thu Nov-10-05 12:08 PM by rocknation
that the ruling wouldn't go into effect until 2007, and that the four of the biggest supporters of the ruling were up for re-election next year. He also mentioned that teachers would have to read an anti-evolution disclaimer. All they need to do is follow it up with a disclaimer of their own!

Until then, mass ridicule is the answer. Randi surmised that Kansas-educated doctors will be telling patients that their symptoms are caused by their organs being haunted!

:headbang:
rocknation
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Demoiselle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Please no mass ridicule!
Kansas duers...you should mount a campaign to oust those school board members.
The citizens of Dover PA (70% registered Republicans) just dumped their entire school board over the Intelligent Design thingy said school board had instituted. You know your state best....I'll bet you can mount an argument that makes sense to your fellow Kansans.
I promise right now to send money to the campaign.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. We're working on it
Believe me, we are trying.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. Another point to keep in mind is that
the state standards are NOT mandatory. The school district where I live is not changing its curriculum to reflect the new standards.

The worst consequence of this is the damage to the reputation of the state and its schools.
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #5
32. I think with how the country views Kansas
their reptuation for denying this ruiling will make them like hero's. I don't think they should worry about reptuations but more so what's right for the kids education's and going onto colleges.
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:25 PM
Response to Reply #1
30. Cute on the doctors
LOL.
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
2. Yeah, true...
I'm in the four state area, border area of ks,mo,ok,ar....we get our local news from Joplin, which also plays news from the three other bordering states. Since the ruling was past, the local news stations have had countless examples of resident of kansas (primarily Pittsburgh) saying the descision was horrible...aka, live action interviews and reactions. The Prof's from Pittsburgh state seem to be the most active against the ruling...
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. KU profs are speaking out too.
And they are not all seen as idiots by their fellow scientists
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Missouri is beginning to get concerned as well
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Yay, go Jayhawks!
My wife is an alum of KU. Well, i'm glad people are standing up, i dont' catch much real time news, except local uhf crap...i try to follow things, best that i can... :) thanks for the missouri concerned link...i got some reading to do... :)
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Here's a great website for Missouri concerns:
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #8
16. thanks...
I am always caught up in local events, i hardly have time to look at things in missouri, as a whole state ISSUE. I'm in McDonald county, probably...one of the most backwards thinking/theology place i have ever been...we just got smoked by Jack Goodman's campaign for senate...he beat Nolan McNeil...soundly...still working though... :)
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scarlett1 Donating Member (427 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #3
50. Here is another LTE from KC Star today
All of the Star LTE today were on the subject of intelligent design and evolution in Kansas public schools

Philosophy, part II

As a teacher of philosophy, I find it encouraging that Kansas will be encouraging the teaching of St. Thomas Aquinas proof of the existence of God, called Argument from Design. I wonder if they will also be teaching or explaining the many arguments of later philosophers who have found it to be an example of the fallacy of Argumentum Ad Ignorantium, which can be explained as stating that we dont know something, from which it follows we know something. (We dont who designed the universe; therefore, God designed the universe.)

K.D. L
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:42 PM
Response to Reply #2
18. Do you have reciprocal college fees between the four
states? It would seem to me that Kansas colleges will probably lose big time if you do.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. I don't think so
except here in KC, you can attend UMKC at resident rates if you live in KS in the KC area. And you can go to grad school at KU right here in the KC area and pay a flat rate - there are no discounts for state residents.

But I don't believe those programs are duplicated anywhere else in the area.
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Selatius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
6. I don't need to make fun of Kansas
The world already rejects their religious fanaticism masquerading as science. That's enough ridicule generated right there to last Kansas the rest of history. The only difference between these guys in Kansas shoving their religion down the throats of people and those guys shoving their religion down the throats of others in, say, the House of Saud is that one is not above resorting to violence. In every other case, they're exactly the same in that they wish to impose their own way on others regardless of what others may think. They have made the judgment that others should not be given the free will to disagree, that it should be taken away in favor of their choice.

Science and religion are not the same thing. One is based on empiricism. The other is based on faith. Intelligent Design is proper in a philosophy class setting, not the biology lab.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. Thanks
for a thoughtful post.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #6
19. maybe empiricism is another religion
isn't it based on faith?

How is shoving a religion down somebody's throat, (which I am having a hard time seeing where that happened) different than shoving Darwinism or empiricism down somebody's throat?

"He loved solving problems. He loved finding the answers. He thought the answers he found were the answer to everything. Then one day he found out that the stuff he was doing was killing people." from the movie "Real Genius"
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. I don't see evolution being shoved down anyone's throat
anymore than I think we are shoving US History or Geometry at our kids.

Evolution is a proven fact. Creationism is speculation.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #21
28. have you read "Lies my teacher told me"
in regard to US history? Most students get through school without learning very much geometry. Perhaps they could survive without evolution too.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:34 PM
Response to Reply #28
36. Yes I have read that book
and I don't agree with a lot of what the author says. He makes SOME valid points, however.

And I believe this evolution battle is most dangerous in its effects on our state reputation. I agree it probably won't harm a lot of kids if we don't teach it, but what about the reputation of our state universities? What about kids from KS who want to go to schools like MIT? That is where this will hurt our kids.
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #6
35. Exactly
On another Christian board I frequent from time to time a lot of people on there thought that if they want to teach ID it should be in a different class and not science but in a class where people can learn about all types of religious beliefs and stuff.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
10. nice of that prof to play the sanity card
disagree with me? - well, then you are crazy.
Logically, if I call you crazy for disagreeing with me, that proves my point, doesn't it?

"Non-scientists have no business meddling in the content of science classes. Intelligent design is not science."

Why does that sound so dogmatic? "In my opinion, science has become a superstition for both the mass of the people and scientists themselves. For the mass it has the power of magic. For the scientists, it has the exclusive virtue of an orthodox theology."

Doubtless, anybody who disagrees with Emeritus Professor Hand is going to be called a 'non-scientist' or 'crazy'. His proof is by authority and statement. Professors and scientists are never wrong, correct?
Disagree? Talk to the Hand.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. Well ID is NOT Science
It is not based on scientific principles. It is rejected by evolutionary experts worldwide.

We need tough talk like this to get rid of the creationists and their damage to our schools.

Teachers in western KS are actually already teaching creationism and rejecting evolution. That scares me.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #13
25. I thought I read that the current vote
did not mention ID, it was only about criticisms or questions about evolution. Scientific dogma is not to be questioned? Or it is insane to do so?

Tough talk sounds unscientific to me, like verbal violence, and "the person who hits first is the one who has run out of ideas."

It is hard for me to worry about some small schools in western Kansas, considering that there are probably many more learning all kinds of dogma from RW private schools and home schooling. Maybe if we mention some Foma in public schools, they will be encouraged to send their kids there.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. It is ignoring well-established and proven scientific principles
to tell kids to question Evolution. Would we tell them to question Geometry?
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:25 PM
Response to Reply #26
31. I read in a biography of my man Karl that he was part of a group of
intellectuals whose ideal was "ruthless criticism of everything existing." When you question something, you have to examine evidence, so I think that is a good thing even if it makes multiple choice testing difficult.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #31
34. Well then I think we can make a point for
creationists ignoring the evidence supporting evolution. Perhaps they never ruthlessly criticized it. :)
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:15 PM
Response to Reply #13
45. Right
Even Bush's on science advisor was quoted in a "Newsweek" article saying that ID was not science. They're trying to disguise it as science and as another theory when you can't prove God exisits but you can't God doesn't exist either. That's why it's called faith for a reason.
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. Doesn't sound dogmatic at all to me...
Edited on Thu Nov-10-05 12:42 PM by SidDithers
"Non-scientists have no business meddling in the content of science classes. Intelligent design is not science."

The problem is that the ignorant have no understanding of how the content of science classes is derived. If you don't understand science, then you get no say in how science is taught. Sounds pretty simple to me.

Sid

Edit: for really poor wording
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. the tragic flaw of democracy is that the people get to decide
This prof seems to prefer a scientocracy where decisions are made by the scientific elite.

So every non-scientist is ignorant? The only way to become knowledgeable is to memorize the current dogma?

Can EF Schumacher say this? "The sciences are being taught without any awareness of the presuppositions of science, of the meaning and significance of scientific laws, and of the place occupied by the natural sciences within the whole cosmos of human thought."
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:14 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. Boards of education set policy.
They are supposed to set GLOBAL standards and stay out of the nitty gritty day to day school operations. What the KS board has done is very unusual. I have served on the MO state curriculum task force. We most certainly do consult experts in each academic area to write our state curriculum. So yes, scientists do normally make these kinds of decisions for our kids.
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #22
41. If enough people decided to vote that 1+1=3
that still doesn't make it so. Science is not a democracy, but it is, however, built from the ground up. Everything taught in a science classroom has its foundation in an earlier, simpler principle, all the way back to 1+1=2, a+b=b+a and ab=ba.

Scientocracy? Ah, now your bias is showing. When you're used to orders coming down from on high, like in a theocracy, the I can see how you might not understand how science works.

Sid
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #17
40. Exactly.
:thumbsup:
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padia Donating Member (355 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
11. If this does not go into effect until 2007
then it seems that the constructive thing to do is to oust the school board, overturn their decs ion, and offer if need be creationism as an elective philosophy class. It sounds like all the people are in place the Governor, Professors and the media is willing to cover the story. It sounds like the same old dem problem we have not found our voice. May I suggest a little Jung psychology that Dr. Phil has made popular "So has that working for you?"
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. Welcome to DU
Great advice :hi:
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 12:35 PM
Response to Original message
15. How nice to get home and see this post.
Proud, you are so right. Remember folks, the ONLY people supporting this are fundamentalists or other "christians" who are off their nut about getting religion back into schools. I have not talked to one single person who pushed for this who was not tunnel visioned. They almost did a Janet Parshal, "I can't hear you."

Did you know that the board hired a state commissioner who has never taught or administered a school to the tune of $140,00.00/year? Sound familiar? "Corkie, you're doing a heckuva job." He has to have a tutor, also hired by the board, to help teach him how to do this. Did you know this person is against public education? YET, this is the person hired to be the education commissioner. Today they are discussing vouchers as the answer to our "problems".

You might ask why we voted these people in. I live in the capitol city, you would think information about elections would be easy to find. Every election we, like most of you, get an insert in the paper before the election explaining who is running for what and how they would govern. I searched and made phone calls for 2 or 3 weeks before the election. Never once was I able to come up with anything on those running for school board except their personal information. I voted for whoever did not mention that they went to church 7 times a week, taught Sunday school and was involved in local religious youth groups. Hell of a way to make a choice huh? If I worked that hard and had to vote like that what do you think the more mainstream voter did? **Check here, I don't know who any of them are and I am bored and just want to go home and have dinner.**

I, and many others are on to them now. Our SoS is not terribly responsive, hell he doesn't have to account for anything here in the land of if it's Republican it has to be the truth. Next year it will be different if I have to plant myself in front of a TV station with a sign for a month I will. We are being Mega Churched to death. Most people west of Salina have probably never even met a Democrat or heard one either except for our Governor. We are flying apart at the seams because the "plan" of using social wedge issues work really well in a place like Kansas.

Rather than deride us, rather than tell us to take that derision and chill about it, help us. I know we have been out there cheering for every one of you in your states but when something happens it all begins again. WE BLAME YOU in those states because 1. You did not work hard enough 2. You have not picked up and moved elsewhere 3. You must not be a real liberal etc. etc.

Remember, these people are not stupid and anyone anywhere can be brainwashed. It always starts somewhere and here it seems to have taken hold. It would seem to me that it would be in your best interests to stop with the cute dumbass comments and help us figure a way out of this.

Once again I will post this for anyone who is interested in helping before this spreads and DON'T think it can't happen where you are, that is how you get to this point. http://www.ksalliance.org/
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #15
23. Well said!!
We also need to tell these folks that we didn't vote for Connie Morris and the other conservatives on the board. The rep for my area - who got my vote - is NOT a conservative and she voted against changing the standards.

We don't vote for the whole board - only our regional rep.

With the exception of the kook from Olathe, I believe all the conservatives are from western KS. (Don't get me started on Olathe, home of Kay O'Connor.) My dad grew up in Goodland. Bob Dole is from Russell. I doubt very seriously there are ANY liberals out there and there damn sure aren't any DUers west of Manhattan. (If there are, let Muse and I know you are there - we need to connect).

Just as there is a great cultural difference between New Yorkers who live in the big apple and those who live in the rural areas upstate, there is also a difference here in Kansas between the heavily populated eastern side of the state and those who live in the wheat farm belt out west. We are usually able to outshout the fundies out west but they snuck up on us this time. But we'll get em. :)
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. Oh yes, I left that out.
I forgot about that part of the voting issue. You are correct, we only have a small say in it.

I found this in an LTTE the other day.

"As things stand, four board districts comprised of only nine counties total an estimated population of 1,250,000, or nearly half the population of the state. The remaining estimated 1,485,500 are spread throughout the remaining 95 counties. District 5 alone is made up of 40 counties of disparate interests and needs. In that district, a representative of limited education and experience can hardly be expected to know the educational needs of the scattered population of nearly half the state's land mass.

Such a large district's population can hardly make a well-informed decision as to its best choice of representative. This is the situation in most of the six districts in which social and religious conservatives purport to represent accurately the preferences of their large constituencies."
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #27
33. And they get pissed about school finance as well
They expect us to carry their districts on our back. So we have to close schools and avoid giving teachers raises because so many districts in western Kansas want to stay open while serving fewer than 100 kids.

I am about over these people.
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #33
37. No, don't say that.
We can't be over those people because that is how this kind of thing happens. We have to engage them as equals and we don't. That sets this entire thing up.

I would be with them on keeping their little schools open. Nobody wants or should have to go 30 miles to school, especially with a farmers hours. Their lives are different, much different and we can't all live by the same rules because of that. We have to find better ways of doing things rather than alienating each other all the time.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #37
42. It is too expensive to keep those small districts going
They can support their school with their local tax revenue. But it isn't fair for them to expect Johnson County to carry them while we have to close schools here. I agree the state funding formula is a mess. And I think we have been unfairly penalized in the eastern highly populated area of the state.

What kind of tax breaks are those wealthy farmers and ranchers in western KS getting? My dad used to talk about that - and how many of them paid such low taxes. I think they have the money to support their schools. If they want to keep those small school districts open, then let them pay for it themselves.
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. Honey, the folks your Dad talked about
are mostly gone. I don't know the statistics but I don't think that there are many wealthy farmers/ranchers out west anymore. There are wealthy Agro Businesses. This should not be a class war, it is about education and until someone comes in and shuts down the unfair way things are now and sets it up fairly we in the east will always have to pay for it. I would rather pay more for them to be educated than have them not have it. It sounds like the Blue states bitching about us Red states getting all the money from them. Things work that way sometimes. Apparently no one is doing anything about it so we should be doing that.

As a farmer/rancher I know no one who gets tax breaks, at least not the family farms. No one. There are precious few of them left anyway. It is another wedge issue here I think and serves no one. I would look into the tax breaks the big Agro Business is getting.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #44
47. Thanks for educating me
I do think there are some wealthy farmers and ranchers out west not paying their fair share. My boss's father discovered natural gas on his land and gave up farming to sit at home and count his money. He is just south of here but my boss says there are plenty ranchers and farmers just like him all over the state.

I do think we should focus some energy on fixing the state funding formula. I don't mean to start a war but the current formula is inequitable. (And then again, maybe I have been living around all these moderate Republicans for tooooo long. Could be I am starting to sound like one of them. LOL)
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #47
51. No No No
I looked back at my post and just now realized how uppity it sounded. I am so sorry. You have your thing and I have mine but that does not mean we don't have some knowledge of the other. I am sorry.

Things have changed very quickly out there. Most of everything you are saying was true not too long ago and there is no doubt that some of it is still true. What I see and hear (I spend a lot of time just gabbing in the feed store) is that it isn't really like that anymore.

We need to change the entire thing. I does us no good to do us against them in a state this small population wise, it just makes it worse. It should be equitable everywhere but the discussion of the different life styles has to fit in there because there are huge differences.

You do NOT sound like a republican, I am just a circle kind of gal. Probably closer to a socialist in some ways than I would be comfortable with, not that it is all bad. I actually admire some of it. I always look for the joining of hands first and that is not always practical. There is very much a need for the practical here but being practical does not make you Republican!!!!

The thing that most people are not aware of about farmers/ranchers is that the vast majority of them would work their farm from dawn to after dusk even if they had a bazzilion dollars. It is much more than some way to earn a living. The ones that don't are like the ones that your father knew.
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scarlett1 Donating Member (427 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #23
53. I live in Olathe,
Don't get me started on Kay O'Connor.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #53
59. That model of feminism?
And intelligence?

Kay O'Connor is truly a piece of work.

I student taught in Olathe 30 years ago. It was this small town with a fabulous school district. It sure has turned red. Sad, I wasn't surprised to see Kay get elected out there.

Did I hear she is not running for re-election? Any prospective Dem running for that seat?

You ought to come to our meetups. Next one is Tues at 7:00 pm at the Flea Market in Westport.

:hi:
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #15
39. there are registered democrats in every county in Kansas
also, Hays seemed to be pretty liberal. At least their newspaper wrote and editorial and published letters 3-1 against the marriage amendment.
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #39
43. How did I miss that about Hays?
Thank you for the information. I tend to forget all about Hays. I hear they are having problems with their dinosaur museum now. Something humans and dinosaurs being pals? LOL, just more sticking Sunday School noses where they don't belong.

I do know Democrats who are out in the boonies who refuse to tell. I doubt it is really a secret but they keep that info close and don't talk about it.
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scarlett1 Donating Member (427 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #43
54. Hayes is a College Town
It may not be Super liberal Lawrence, but College towns have more educated populations because of the Professors and people who stay in the City after college.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #39
60. That's good to know
but the other side still seems to be winning at the polls.
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:25 PM
Response to Original message
29. Hopefully Kanas democrats
can get motivated to get on school boards. That's apparently what the republicans did. They got people who believed like them to get onto the boards of the schools. These people don't care about what professionals say, what's good for the kids or anything like that.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #29
38. I live in a very Republican county in eastern Kansas
but the Republicans here tend to be more moderate than conservative. We have a Democrat in Congress. He beat a staunch conservative in 2004.
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dubyaD40web Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #38
46. Don't forget, Kobach got indicted too!
proud2Blib - I'm in Gardner. You?
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 07:35 PM
Response to Reply #46
58. Thanks I did forget to mention that
I am in NE Johnson County.

We're neighbors :)
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:34 PM
Response to Original message
48. Tell me what I can do from California and I'll do it
And beleive me I know its possible to reverse Kansas politics.

Look at Iowa. Same part of the country, same interest in religion, same history. Different politics. Iowa is a blue state with a capital B.

So how can we Iowa-ize Kansas?
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #48
57. You can try this site
and see if there is something. http://www.ksalliance.org/
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MarsThe Cat Donating Member (978 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:41 PM
Response to Original message
49. Help for the people of Kansas-
Edited on Thu Nov-10-05 02:43 PM by MarsThe Cat
here's a link to a site that's a great resource, and should be of TREMENDOUS help to those jayhawks who see themself as more of a "blue-state" kinda person-
Help for Kansas blue staters
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scarlett1 Donating Member (427 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #49
55. Realtor.com
pretty funny
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #49
61. Most of us have families here.
Kansas is our home. I think we would rather stay and fix it.
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MojoXN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
52. My sympathies...
I'm from West Virginia, so I know ALL about what it's like to be the butt of every joke, particularly those insinuating that I have less than a full complement of teeth, am of low intellect, and copulate with family members and/or animals.

Don't worry. Sooner or later, SANE people will be on the state board of education, and all of this will be rectified, and eventually, nothing more than an unpleasent memory. Trust me. :)

MojoXN
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atommom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
56. It's frustrating, but we'll get through it.
I just hope the tide starts to turn soon ... everything has been such an uphill battle around here lately.
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