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Folks, We're Witnessing Nuclear War In The White House

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writes2000 Donating Member (481 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:18 AM
Original message
Folks, We're Witnessing Nuclear War In The White House
I'm stunned. A few weeks ago, there were reports that there was a war brewing in the White House between Karl Rove and Andrew Card. Then we heard that there was a war between Rove's team and the Cheney folks. I dismissed both as an exaggeration.

The past few days have proven me wrong.

Think about what's been leaked to the press.

"Cheney is a focus of the prosecutor."
"Libby never admitted to a June 23rd meeting with Miller."
"Cheney was IN meetings of the WHIG and discussed Wilson there."
"Cheney aide #1 has flipped."
"Cheney aide #2 has flipped." (today)

These leaks are attacks. They are blows against Cheney and his staff. While it is possible that they are coming from Fitzgerald, Fitz is known for not leaking. No, these leaks are coming from somewhere else. And who else could know these things except someone else in the White House?

Today's leak was a counter-attack. It was retribution.

Today's "Bush Whacked Rove" article doesn't protect Bush. The headline may look that way but it's really a political nuclear time bomb aimed directly at King George.

It absolutely implies that he lied to the American people.
It suggests that he has aided in obstruction of justice.
It implicates him in acts of political revenge.

And it ties him to the entire conspiracy.

Just look at the part where the article claims that a previous leak was a LIE designed to protect the President! This is an attack!

Fitzgerald has all of them by the balls. Each day, he applies more pressure by sending out details that threaten them.

"An announcement will be made in D.C."
"He has no plans to file a report."

And each day more damning info comes out that implicates someone else higher up on the food chain. Today, President Bush has been significantly implicated in this crime.

It's about to get even more bloody.
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
1. Shades of Dr. Strangelove:
"Gentlemen, no fighting in the War Room!"
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Mr_Jefferson_24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #1
54. One of my favorite movie lines ever. nt.
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NNadir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #1
109. Big Smile.
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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
116. The definitive chickenhawk exhortation, if ever there was one!
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goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #1
147. OMG!!!....I saw this movie for the 1st time a year ago!! It was right on!!
It portrayed the characters perfectly as the ones
we have today!!!

Great quote!!

Another movie that is another right-on portrayal is ....
SIN CITY!!!
Y'all gotta watch it!!

I wish Peter Sellers was still alive.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
2. Like the genesis of Watergate, it's internecine warfare among the repukes
but they'll blame it on partisan democrats.
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QuettaKid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. I must've blinked and MISSED something...
who flipped today!?!? Wednesday the 19th.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Raw story has it, still developing
I agree with some other DU'ers, my money is on Scooter, for the same reason Haldeman flipped way back when
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Sydnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #2
32. Just like Watergate
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 11:48 AM by Sydnie
They can't figure out who needs to be sacrificed to save the game. They have no clue how to apply a pressure to stop the bleeding. It's not the crime that does them in, it's the cover up ... they are just NO GOOD at it ... even with the press firmly in their pocket, they still couldn't keep it together long enough.

The lies that brought about this war were bad but they were given a pass on that because most of the dying was being done by someone else (the Iraqi citizens) but Katrina blew a whole in their press "pass" because the horrors were happening to our citizens and we all got to see it live, up close and personal, and those positions held by incompentants were exposed for all to see. Once you see that it happened in this department it gives you the idea to look around a bit more and see where else it might be happening. Miers was the noose that he could have avoided but instead, he stepped right up to the gallows voluntarily, just to see if the executioner would really show up. Joke is, he did. Now the public is waking from a long coma and they are not happy that they were duped.

Once this puzzle is finally put together and the true big picture is exposed (the war, the plans for war before they were even elected, the profits for the friends, the dismantling of our entire structure of government etc.) there will be no place left to hid and no one left to shelter them. Just as they are now, they are feasting on their own hoping that they can save themselves from the wrath of the people. It will not be pretty at all.

I don't think most will sit quietly by this time while pardons are handed out, certainly not if the signature at the bottom says "GWB".

Heads have to roll. They are just having trouble deciding just which straw is actually the shortest. Even that they are spinning against each other.

Bet blivet** wishes that he had gotten an 8-ball and a blowjob instead, right about now.


edited to add - This is not just exposing a corrupt administration, it is exposing a corrupt MOVEMENT, preplanned and signed on to by some other major players that don't like it when they lose on their investment. World dominance is at state, not just the current government of our country. The PNAC backers and their money men can't be happy that they are now stopped, dead in their tracks, when their plan was so profitiable for all of them. Think about it!
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PurityOfEssence Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #32
55. Well said, dammit; that pretty much covers it.
Lingering fear says that they might be able to weather it yet, but boy, it doesn't look good. Toss in some high gas prices, ongoing failure in Iraq, a stumbling economy and the internal squabbling of the reactionaries, and it all feels like ridiculous incompetence served up with a tangy sauce of monarchic greed.

It's going to be fun watching people jockey for survival, but there's going to be a bad taste in the mouth with the ongoing realization that these people can destroy the world and many of us extras in their grand opera.

This could get VERY messy.
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stevietheman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #55
154. People eating dog food & turning into popsicles this winter...
may become, at long last, the final straw for the American people.
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samsingh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #55
155. the crime in this case is pretty bad
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Burried News Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:00 PM
Original message
Glued, screwed and clamped. Great post.
"This is not just exposing a corrupt administration, it is exposing a corrupt MOVEMENT, preplanned and signed on to by some other major players that don't like it when they lose on their investment. World dominance is at state, not just the current government of our country. The PNAC backers and their money men can't be happy that they are now stopped, dead in their tracks, when their plan was so profitiable for all of them. Think about it!"
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Raster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #32
110. I have thought about it. You don't go play RISK on a global level without
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 02:06 PM by Raster
the acquiescence and support of some VERY POWERFUL people. Not only did bushco* blow it big time, they broke the first cardinal rule: they got caught! And now middle America is starting to suspect the worst. These bastards have had a free pass for years, partially because no one wanted to believe things could be this corrupt. All bushco* had to do was (1) play the terra and patriotism cards; and (2) dismiss anyone who got too close as a conspiracy nut. No more. Every day more and more and starting to believe that "Yes, it really can be this bad." And "Yes, bushco can really be this corrupt." It is trying to stuff the proverbial gennie back in the bottle. This can no longer be contained. Every new snippet or whisper leads to more substantial allegations.
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Uncle Joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #32
130. Those poor bastards.
:popcorn: :toast:
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stevietheman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #32
152. I've been thinking/saying for some time that the U.S. is about to...
undergo a great catharsis. The magnitude of this scandal is going to occupy the media for a very long time to come as it all sorts itself out. The MSM won't be able to ignore this any more, without putting their own existence in peril.
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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #152
173. Well Stated, StevieTheMan!
They sure won't.
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Carni Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #32
174. My boss asked me today about *plamegate*
Because I told her that people in Cheney's office were probably going to be indicted...she didn't vote for bush but knew nothing about all of this.

I started to lay it out in the most layman manner that I could.

She had heard of nothing regarding Wilson or Plame or the forged reports on Niger or any of the rest.

Her comment after I got done was... "My God this sounds like Watergate"

I responded with this is WORSE the Watergate--they shut down a CIA W of MD's operative and very possibly an entire CIA unit (dummy company) in able to go to war because they didn't want their forgeries exposed.

I really think even IF there are no indictments that the fat lady is singing--the public knows about watergate and they won't need all the details to understand this intrigue.
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Sydnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #174
176. I agree with you Carni
Even those that "haven't paid much attention" are starting to buzz about it. Once the connection is made that this is WORSE than Nixon's antics and that people (the troops that EVERYONE wants to support) have died because of a group of greedy bastards and not because of any terrorist act, they will rise up and demand answers.

As someone responded above, a cold winter with hard choices (food, heat, medicine, etc.) that effect both ends of a family (the youngest and the oldest) as well as the caregivers of those two groups, it will be tough to drown out the voices.

Indifference is breathing it's last. I say, 'bout time!

BTW, here we are on the night shift, just as we predicted we would be. Great to see you! :hi:
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Carni Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-20-05 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #176
183. Yeah but unfortunately here I am today STILL WAITING!
I have the day off today after all (event got cancelled) but now I have to sit and play the *waiting game* again--arrggghhh!

If the Grand Jury doesn't do something soon I am going to give myself an ulcer!
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:21 AM
Response to Original message
3. We were told this was MAD, well it is
and the Crisis will make Watergate look like a walk in the damn park

Alo remember, they DO have real nukes... that is the part that worries me

Of course if the whole lot goes to jail, they;d better place them in TWO different jails
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electropop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #3
7. "TWO different jails" LOL!
They'll be yelling from cell to cell all night long: "It's all YOUR fault!" "No, it's YOUR fault!" "Mom, he's touching me! Tell him to stop touching me!" "OW! Cut it out!" "Are our sentences over yet?"
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. No I fear shanks
and real backstabing.. I want them to ahem enjoy their full time in the slammer
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Divernan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #7
16. These jerks will go to the Club Fed country-club prisons, if any.
those are the prisons where people like former West Virginia governor, Arch Moore, were sent. They don't even have to wear prison uniforms, although the guards are known to wear blazers.Their fights will be over who gets prime tee times. They will never be put into one of the godawful, privatized prisons with next to no medical care, crappy food, etc.
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electropop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #16
36. They keep telling us how cushy Gitmo is.
Perhaps we could put them there. :evilgrin:
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jilln Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #36
57. that's right, wasn't it TWO kinds of fruit?
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bunny planet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #36
65. I hear the chicken is delicious there. Perhaps they'll serve them
chickenhawk just to add a little variety to the menu.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #65
68. You have a good recipee for chickenhawk?
And how long do you cook them?
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bunny planet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #68
70. chickenhawk sushi, yum.
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stevietheman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #36
156. Yeah, they can all choke on Noodles Jefferson. n/t
n/t
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #36
177. I was thinking Abu Gharib...
since we've made all that progress in Iraq and all.

Now bark like a dog.
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unblock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #7
53. "are our sentences over yet?" lol
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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watrwefitinfor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #7
135. It occurs to me that they don't know who will be the last one standing.
So they have no idea if anybody will be there to pardon them or not.

If the split within the administration is all we suspect it is; if Cheney goes down, why would he be expecting Bush to pardon him? Especially if he thinks, say, Rove maybe has done some flipping, too. Does that mean Cheney might try to bring down Bush, in some scheme to put someone more favorable in position to issue presidential pardons? Can Bush/Rove be worried about this, too, and about having someone in office who wouldn't pardon them?

And even if you're on Bush's side, can you be certain Rove wouldn't rat you out as quickly as he would, say, one of Cheney's guys? If all your guys are flipping, what makes you think the other side isn't flipping, too. And are your guys flipping against the other side, or against you?

Can you just IMAGINE how flaked out & freaked out all those guys and gals must be - not knowing who to trust, where to turn. All these rumors! No wonder we keep hearing about flipping. Last one to flip is IT.

Oh. And who do you suppose has their finger on that there button these days?

Wat
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notadmblnd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #7
148. Shut up you Mulpas.....
don't make me come in there!


Your post made me think of me and my sisters when we were kids and my mother would shout out "shut up you mulpas". Anyone know what a mulpa is? I think it is polish for demon or devil. anyway...
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Guaranteed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #7
160. Where they are served TWO kinds of fruit
during meals.
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kohodog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #3
12. Abu Garib for the Bushies; Gitmo for Cheney et al! n/t
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electropop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
5. No honor among criminals.
When push comes to shove, they will push each other over the cliff if there is any possible personal advantage in it.
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Ishoutandscream2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #5
128. Ain't that the truth.
The M.O. of the common criminal.
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
8. Rats will trample other rats when the building is on fire. It's every rat
for himself!
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Search Party Donating Member (570 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:26 AM
Response to Original message
10. Nominated. Great post. eom
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Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #10
22. i'll second that and again nominate
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marylanddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
11. So its Cheney vs. Bush at this point?

Savor the moment...
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lutefisk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #11
15. Unfortunately, we are all along for the ride
Bush and Cheney, convicted drunk drivers, are in the front seat careening down the highway to hell stabbing each other in the back. The bad thing is, we are all stuck in the back seat with doors that won't open, hoping the state patrol can pull them over and arrest them before the otherwise inevitable crash. At least that's how I feel.
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marylanddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #15
20. I hear ya

I know these guys are worse than Nixon, but I'm old enough to remember how there was that same feeling as Watergate was about to break...and somehow, justice prevailed. More power to Lady Justice.
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lutefisk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #20
25. I remember Watergate, too- I feel hope for justice
But it never crossed my mind that the Nixon WH would bring down the country along with it, or worse. The "drip, drip...here it comes" tune has been played so many time over the last 4 years that I am hoping for the best, but expecting somewhat less. Now we see if the system works, I guess.
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #25
89. i remember Watergate, -- but this is ramping to a WH Cat 6/7
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rzemanfl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #20
149. I remember the day before Nixon resigned I had two FBI guys in
my office doing a background check on a lawyer in our firm that was looking for a job with the Justice Department. They asked me if he was "loyal to the government of the United States." I replied that he was "loyal to the Constitution and laws of the United States." I guess that was okay because he did get the job.
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mrdmk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #149
175. Good answer! eom
:think:
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #15
24. THEN WE SHOULD DO THIS:
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pokercat999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #11
63. I prefer kettle corn to the regular or butter.
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kath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-20-05 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #63
179. fresh-made caramel corn like they make in the popcorn stores in Chicago.
Mmmmmmmm.
<drools onto keyboard>
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displacedtexan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
13. I blogged about this very thing this morning.
My headline:

Bush Knew.

You're absolutely correct to point out that today's leak fingers George W.!

(I also cite George's quotes from the past 2 years on the "leaker" in the WH.)
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Boredtodeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #13
59. Where's your blog?
I'd like to read those quotes!

(Maybe it's in your sig line, but I have sig lines turned off. Please post a link.)
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displacedtexan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #59
111. Here you go.
http://www.ascrivenerslament.blogspot.com /

I also write the DU Blog Box column (every Friday on the DU homepage).
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Boredtodeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #111
143. Thanks.
Great blog. Great quotes.
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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
14. It just gets better every day!
Please Fitz, kick some butt!

:bounce:
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bee Donating Member (894 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:33 AM
Response to Original message
17. umm. Its nukular. get it right. (sarcasm) n/t
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Walt Starr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:34 AM
Response to Original message
18. I love how Fitz leaks little bits and makes short, to the point statements
to add fuel to this fire.

:evilgrin:
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Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #18
105. Fitz doesn't leak ANYTHING.
What's the saying I heard the other day? His office is "tighter than an old nun's asshole."

I worked in the legal battle for court access for the press during the Clinton/Lewinsky nonsense, and Starr's office leaked often and openly. None of the reporters covering the story could believe Starr's brazenness.

I think it speaks volumes that Fitz is the complete opposite.
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uncle ray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #105
124. i think walt's right
Fitz is now leaking things that many here have known/suspected for a year or two. it can't be a coincidence that every day of the last couple of weeks of the GJ major bits are "leaked". he's baiting all of us for the big kill.
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writes2000 Donating Member (481 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #124
126. I go back & forth on that. Both you and Walt may be right.
Certainly if Fitz was leaking, he's being very clever about increasing the pressure.

For some reason, I'm doubting that he would go through the press. A simple call of their attorney sharing what he has would work just as well.
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Walt Starr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #126
132. I think Fitzgerald knows there's a split and has info from both sides
and is leaking in drips and drabs to further divide the criminals in order to incite mistakes.
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writes2000 Donating Member (481 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #132
137. It would be a brilliant tactic on Fitz's part
The great thing about Fitz is that he's so unpredictable, so mysterious, none of us know what to expect.

Imagine how these bastards (who are obsessed with control) feel.
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Lena inRI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #132
163. Agreed. . .divide and conquer the cabal. . .
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 07:31 PM by Lena inRI
. . Fitz is letting them squirm under the anticipation. . .his silence speaking volumes in the Bushies' guilty minds.
:evilgrin:
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Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #124
129. Nope. If you read the stories closely....
....they hint at where the info came from, and it's not Fitz's office. Fitz is as straight-laced as they come, and he just doesn't leak (because it would be unethical for him to do so, not to mention the possibility that it might damage his investigation and his credibility). Fitzgerald doesn't "bait;" he doesn't need to.

The only comment I know of that can be attributed to Fitzgerald is the bit about no plans to write a report (translation: he'll be issuing indictments).
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Walt Starr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #129
138. I'd say most are not coming from Fitz's office
but every now and then, a tiny bit is being leaked, IMO. Mostly to set one side against the other which results in several leaks from one or both sides in the White House.
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cassiepriam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #124
142. yes, I think Fitz has been behind some of the stuff hitting the press.
Maybe even Judy's recent nonsensical article in the NYT. Fitz's wheels are still turning.
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GreatCaesarsGhost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:35 AM
Response to Original message
19. the mother of all october surprises
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WiseButAngrySara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #19
94. Sad to remember that about one year ago, another 'October Surprise'
was speculated to occur on DU, and it never materialized. Instead, I learned about Diebold, ES and S, election fraud, exit poll data and analysis, and remain convinced to this day that B* has NEVER been elected, certainly not by a MORAL majority! SCOTUS 2000 and Diebold et al 2004. I hope this October is different, but these slimebags have so much to loose, and they pump their lies to the media endlessly...I'm just waiting and hoping that this nightmare will end justly. (But I'm not counting on it 100%. SCOTUS 2000 was the end of Democracy as I know it; the end of a dream that became a nightmare of the past 5 years.)
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Dora Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:39 AM
Response to Original message
21. Don't forget about Cheney's JINX!!! A must-read article!
The Curse of Dick Cheney
The veep's career has been marred by one disaster after another
By T.D. ALLMAN
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/_/id/6450422

.... The Cheney jinx first manifested itself at the presidential level back in 1969, when Richard Nixon appointed him to his first job in the executive branch. It surfaced again in 1975, when Gerald Ford made Cheney his chief of staff and then -- with Cheney's help -- lost the 1976 election. George H.W. Bush, having named Cheney secretary of defense, was defeated for re-election in 1992. The ever-canny Ronald Reagan was the only Republican president since Eisenhower who managed to serve two full terms. He is also the only one not to have appointed Dick Cheney to office.

-snip-

"Cheney's manner and authority of voice far outstrip his true abilities," says Chas Freeman, who served under Bush's father as ambassador to Saudi Arabia. "It was clear from the start that Bush required adult supervision -- but it turns out Cheney has even worse instincts. He does not understand that when you act recklessly, your mistakes will come back and bite you on the ass."

-snip-

In his first test-drive at the wheels of power, Cheney had played a central role in the undoing of a president. Wrote right-wing columnist Robert Novak, "White House Chief of Staff Richard Cheney . . . is blamed by Ford insiders for a succession of campaign blunders." Those in the old elitist wing of the party thought the decision to dump Rockefeller was both stupid and wrong: "I think Ford lost the election because of it," one of Kissinger's former aides says now. Ford agreed, calling it "the biggest political mistake of my life."

-snip-

Halliburton was Cheney's first real chance to get rich; he grabbed it with both hands. His principal action was his acquisition of a subsidiary called Dresser Industries. Dresser struck lucrative deals with Saddam Hussein; Halliburton did business with Muammar el-Qaddafi and the ayatollahs of Iran. By the time Cheney left in 2000, Halliburton's stock was near an all-time high of fifty-four dollars a share. Then it turned out that Dresser had saddled Halliburton with asbestos lawsuits that could cost the company millions, and the stock plummeted to barely ten dollars a share. Even with the bounce Halliburton stock has received from the war, an investor who put $100,000 into the company just before Cheney became vice president would have less than $60,000 today.

-snip-

There is so much more than this at the link. It's an old article, from last year, but it's certainly worth reviewing again.
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natrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #21
30. uh yea and like other sociopaths
he has no remote rcognition of right and wrong
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Dora Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #30
35. Uh yea, but unlike other sociopaths...
...Cheney has a track record of failure on a colossal level.
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natrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #35
37. sure did put haliburton back on track
bot really the best type for public service though :)
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kywildcat Donating Member (529 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #30
106. actually he has the intellectual
capacity to know right from wrong. He simply does not care.
He has never been made responsible for his lack of conscience, and even if he is (indictments, loss of public status) it will not effect him in any way. He simply does not have the depth of emotion, or the conscience to care.
That makes this entire blow up between the VP and the P quite a bit more dangerous than even we can consider.
We as a population used to be collateral, we are no longer even that.

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stevedeshazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #21
44. That article deserves it's own thread! I just read the whole thing.
A great rundown of Cheney...everyone should read it.
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cliss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #21
46. Thanks for pointing this out, D.
I, too, was fooled by Cheney. In last year's vice-presidential debates, I was surprised by his professionalism and seeming knowledge. He seemed like a really smart man. I'd never heard Cheney speak before (lucky me!!!).

He sounded good, but when I started paying close attention, I noticed it was all bull-shit. It's like he kept repeating a lot of boilerplate phrases, but it didn't really mean anything.

Cheney's smart, but he's stupid.
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madmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #21
49. well ya all know cheney is really a part of the vast...
left wing conspiracy to bring down the honorable christian right. :evilgrin:
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Burried News Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #49
79. Ohhh that's dirty - and I like it.
Let the Freeps wrap their squirrely minds around thatun.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
23. The HOUSE of Cards are Falling...at last...
Could it be fate that a Card is there too...how ironic.
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electropop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #23
62. What's the Tarot card for "miserable failure?"
Is it the Andy Card?
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #62
90. The Hanged Man symbol for all
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #62
151. A very good possibility..the Odds Makers are betting on him
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Skarbrowe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:41 AM
Response to Original message
26. I had a dream the other night about Judy Miller and she was about to

well, in the dream, I had just heard she had been killed! I was shocked, thinking things were much worse than I had thought. Then, I was whisked away by some strange men to this mobile home way out in the country and Judy Miller was there. The guys who took me there were the "good" guys in the government ( who could that be? ) and they had to fake Judy's death so she could tell ALL and the ALL went all the way up to the top and spread out to many, many people in power. Judy Miller knew it all and was just about to tell me the whole sordid story when my roommate turned on the light and woke me up. DAMN, I was mad!!

Yeah, I do agree there is a war going on between several people and at several levels. I think Judy is an odd "Oswald" type patsy that knows way too much and was let in on things she should have never known simply because they knew it made her feel so friggin' important and she would be too stupidly loyal and/or too afraid to tell anyone at all other than what "they" wanted in the papers.

Just my take.
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Burried News Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:42 AM
Response to Original message
27. The NeoCON Paleocon civil war makes it's way to the Whitehouse.
http://www.newsfollowup.com/leakgate1.htm
"# Plamegate, Treasongate, Cheneygate...It's just a minor story mixed into the decades-long run-up to the Iraq invasion / occupation...and very much related to events surrounding the Downing Street Memo of July 23, 2002. It's about the neocon push to the Iraq War versus the 'old guard' CIA that wouldn't go along with the Bush administration intelligence manipulation...and see Miller / WMD (Herbert L. Adams). It's about the neocon / Israeli push for regime change in Iran and influence in the Middle East. See Franklingate.com and links to other supporting sites.
# The journalism source id issue is just a smokescreen. Who (Libby?) was Judith Miller protecting and what facts are not (now) being revealed by her being in jail and released? Why was so much effort put into limiting Fitzgerald's questions to Miller to just her conversations with Libby? ..and ... See David Fiderer and "Abort the Plame Investigation Act" also known as "The Free Flow of Information Act" In October of 2005 the surprise 'appearance' of Miller notes about her conversations with Libby in June of 2003 will that will unravel Miller's and Libby's credibility....and the surprise 'appearance' of the email (Newsweek) that sparked Fitzgerald's focus on Rove.....Miller connections to Whitehouse?
# When the American public finally connects these three events: (1) Plamegate, the (2) AIPAC / Franklin / Rosen /Weissman Pentagon mole indictment and (3) Bush's 2003 State of the Union lies and the real sources of Niger yellowcake forged documents, then finally we could see the impeachment of Bush. That's what this website is about. and see Franklingate.com."
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donkeyotay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:54 AM
Response to Reply #27
39. The aspens are turning
I'm wondering if Libby has a shank buried in Cheney's back... not that I'm going to feel sorry for the defense industry that has done the indefensible.
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Burried News Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #39
81. Maybe it's a harpoon? Who's holding the rope?
At this point I don't care - hold it tight till my friend gets a bite.
This ones for you SwampRat.

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SledDriver Donating Member (699 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
28. I hope it gets uglier...
I want leaks on just how bad Cheney's health really is.
I want reprisal leaks on shrub's alchohlism, and cocaine abuse.
I want leaks on Cheney's business dealings and how much $ he's made during his time as VP.
I want reprisal leaks on shrub's closet homosexuality.

:popcorn:
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #28
40. ask for the sky I guess
Pass the popcorn

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Boomer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #28
45. Ooo, now THAT would make for great entertainment
I would definitely need a HD flatscreen TV for that show.

:popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:
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tblue37 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #28
58. His Halliburton stock options have increased in value by
well over 3,000%!!!!!
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hvn_nbr_2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #28
122. I want film of Gannon's overnighters in the WH. n/t
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IntravenousDemilo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #28
166. Now, now...
As a gay man, I find the idea of Bush being gay repellent. It was bad enough that people were saying Hitler might be gay, but Bush? :puke:
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
29. I can dream can't I
Time to buy the big screen, keg of pigs eye beer and lots of ribs, roasts and steaks to cook on the big green egg. :party: time is near.

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Burried News Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #29
34. This has got to be the closest thing to tha "Rapture" that I will ever
get to experience.
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #34
91. Ha ! LOL
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Pithy Cherub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
31. ABSOLUTELY! Watergate redux and there should be mass firings
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 11:51 AM by Pithy Cherub
any minute now.(History repeating itself and all.) Onesies is just not going to cut it. Andrew Card is potentially collecting some serious resignation letters and they are having succession planning conversations like you would not believe. My money is on the fact that the really secret conversations are taking place in the White House residence. Who will be Bush's Mr. Fixit on this? (Baker is my guess)

:wow: :popcorn: Am so ENJOYING just the self-inflicted spectacle of it all!
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hang a left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #31
47. No shit...Baker must be in a guest bedroom at the WH holed up.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:46 AM
Response to Original message
33. I can't help it, I'm getting goose bumps
:popcorn:
Ship's a sinking and the rats are turning on each other. I could not have written a better script.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #33
41. Yes you could
and you could NOT have sold this script, by the way, trust me I have tried
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Bethany Rockafella Donating Member (916 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
38. Good!
Someone should play that clip of Bush back when he said "Somebody is sweating bullets!" It was directed at Al Gore's people when one of Bush's practice debate tapes were somehow mailed to the Gore people. Some staff was blamed for it but we all know it was KARL ROVE's doing!
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Botany Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
42. It is begining to look a lot like Fitzmas
:popcorn:

but the sad facts are all of the dead in Iraq & the stolen elections
which are bills that we will be paying for years.

bush/cheney are going down!
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lancdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
43. This is an excellent post
I just found out about the DeFrank article about a half-hour ago and was struck about how huge it seemed to have something out there about Bush knowing. It's all been Rove, Libby and Cheney - till now.

It's no coincidence this came out the day after all the Cheney resignation stuff hit. It does look like a counterattack.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:09 PM
Response to Original message
48. You've laid this out very nicely. Wow! Recommended !!!
:)
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
50. Ahhhh It's MORNING In America!!
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AgadorSparticus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
51. talk about a SPECIAL Halloween this year!!! the REAL monsters are
going to be trotted out for spectacular viewing. Just warms my heart. It will be a much needed breath of fresh air.
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #51
93. A Very Special White House Fitzmas...handcuffs for everyone!!
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Ganja Ninja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:18 PM
Response to Original message
52. "bloody" Interesting choice of words.
KKKarl is messing with Dick Cheney. Underlings are selling out the big fish. It wouldn't surprise me if somebody doesn't literally end up bloody.
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Mr_Jefferson_24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
56. Astute observations. I think you're right. nt.
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npincus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:28 PM
Response to Original message
60. my G-d, we have waited so long for this...
could it be true?

My (our)hopes have been dashed so many times...
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
61. Mr. Oogie Boogie is unraveling and
all the vile things that are let out seem to be crawling up Bush's** pantlegs.
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amb123 Donating Member (764 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
64. I wonder . . .
I'm getting the feeling that Karl Rove is pitting Dick Cheney and Andrew Card against each other to get rid of both of them and to cover Rove's own butt. Am I right or wrong?

Either way, the downfall of the Bush Administration is definitely underway!


:party: :patriot: :toast:
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flamin lib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
66. Excellent dot connecting. I'm borrowing this in it's entirety to send
to my extended family.
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:45 PM
Response to Original message
67. I hope in the end that...
the American people are the winner! The entire government has needed a shake-up, for a long, long, long, time. Our political parties have been owned by the BIG corporate contributors for TOO LONG. The CEOs are the real dictators. People like Bush are just their tools. Maybe soon America will belong to the people again and we can finally, "GET ON WITH OUR LIVES!"
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Dangerously Amused Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
69. Once we get them out of power here...


...can we hand them over to the Hague?

Please?


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Hardrada Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #69
72. But I want to see them wearing orange jump suits
and working on a chain gang until 2050!
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #72
74. Oh you will see them earing orange
and they won't get the death penalty if they go to the hague becuase they don't do death no more... even thought the gang that could not shoot straight belongs in the docket at Nuremberg
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Hardrada Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #74
78. A Nuremberg stint for them would be ideal
Too bad they tore down the Spandau prison where Rudolf Hess was all those years. Alcatraz could be put back into use though or some good way-lower-level castle dungeon.
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
71. Isn't it true that pardons are not issued until a president's final day in
office? that might mean even the pardoned will have to do some HARD TIME!

Bwwwaaaa-hahahahaah!
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #71
75. Check on bush, he pardoned Weinberger
well before the end of his term, after he was indicted
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RedEarth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
73. Great post......let,s hope george get,s taken down with some of the others
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Jose Diablo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
76. It'd say the circular firing squad is in place
Fitz has said, Ready, aim.." and he is just about to say, "Fire!"

After that smoke clears, the peace made between the corporatist and the RW Fundamentalist will be sorely tested as Abramoff steps-up to the plate, and don't forget we still have DeLay and Noe on deck.

I'd say stick a fork in the Republican party, it will split in 2, maybe more pieces. I count the paleocons, the corporatist and the fundies, that's 3. And who is there to reunited them? Nobody. They are just about done.

They should have heeded our advice and tossed Bu$h over the side when they had a chance. Generally, these guys have a history of overreach.
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goodboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
77. It's NOOK-YOU-LER ...mistakes like that ruin nice posts...(nt)
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Hardrada Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:10 PM
Response to Original message
80. Sentence them to galleys like in Ben Hur.
"Ramming speed, damn you White House dogs!! (Pound, pound, pound)(lash, lash)!
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redacted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
82. Self delete -- just answered my own question
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 01:15 PM by redacted
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writes2000 Donating Member (481 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #82
85. Rawstory says that it's David Wurmser
Who has been involved in other corruption charges, btw.
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #85
95. so the "WORMser" has turned
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sofa king Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #85
118. So you might say, "the Wurm has turned."
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 02:36 PM by sofa king
Edit: I see that katty has beaten me by a mile.

My condolances to you, katty. It seems as if we both suffer from Sullen Infantile Disposition Syndrome.
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mopaul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
83. never kick a man UNLESS he's down
that's what my mom always said
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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:16 PM
Response to Original message
84. The bloodier, the better.
If Bush and Cheney have turned on each other, the fur is indeed about to fly. Honey, about that HD flat-screen...?
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TomClash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
86. "No, these leaks are coming from somewhere else."
No, it's not the White House.
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writes2000 Donating Member (481 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #86
87. It could be the CIA but...
It's hard for me to believe that they could confidently assert what went on/goes on in the White House.

JMO.
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:25 PM
Response to Original message
88. Concur w/your assessment-the war within the WH
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:30 PM
Response to Original message
92. I hope so
Those who are involved don't want to go to jail or anything like that, so they're probably turning. Don't forget the "civil war" in the White House and calling Fitzgerald a "bully". I loved that. Heh heh. Now they know how it feels. But I do think as the case gets closer and closer to getting done it will get more bloody for sure.
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Nimrod2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:39 PM
Response to Original message
96. Dios te escucha!!!
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GayCanuck Donating Member (170 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:43 PM
Response to Original message
97. Hate to
pour cold water on all this; but as an outsider interested in US politics, I can't help but think that your prosecutor surely realizes that much of this Wilson vs bush fiasco is simply hard core politics. Political opponents have tried to destroy each other for decades. Plus I don't see bush or chenegang showing much emotion over any of it.
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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #97
119. You mean...kinda ... criminalising politics....?
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GayCanuck Donating Member (170 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #119
120. No
that sounds freeperish.
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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #120
133. Funny. I thought so, too.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #97
125. That's NOT Cold Water, That's STEAMING BULLSHIT
Fitz realizes that outing an undercover CIA operative who is working to stop WMD proliferation is NOT hardcore politics. It's a crime and a treasonous one at that.

Hard core politics my ass. The reason why your talking points sound "freeperish" is because they are pathetic.
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IntravenousDemilo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 08:15 PM
Response to Reply #125
169. Be nice, now...
GayCanuck is not your enemy.
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GayCanuck Donating Member (170 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-20-05 08:25 AM
Response to Reply #125
182. hey
cool it there, Beetwasher; I think the prosecutor is doing his job well and I think lest we look at all possiblities, we could be sadly disappointed with the results.
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-20-05 04:37 AM
Response to Reply #97
180. Yeah kinda like Watergate was just hard core politics
Edited on Thu Oct-20-05 04:38 AM by rman
Nothing much came of it, and boy were they showing emotions while the case was developing (not - they pretended it was irrelevant until the tapes came out).
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Fla Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:51 PM
Response to Original message
98. What article are you referring to?
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 01:54 PM by Fla Dem
It would be much more informative if folks would provide links when referring to news releases and articles. Then we might understand what all the excitement is about. Thanks

:shrug:
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writes2000 Donating Member (481 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #98
101. Here you go.
http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/357107p-304312c....

Will remember your advice for the future.
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Fla Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #101
136. TANKS.....much appreciated. Interesting article, the house of cards
is crumbling.
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whatever4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
99. And I'm ashamed at how much I enjoy it Great post! nm
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WiseButAngrySara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
100. Excellent! K & R. Does anyone have a link to the DeFrank article?
:kick:


:kick: :kick:


:kick: :kick: :kick:
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writes2000 Donating Member (481 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #100
102. Link
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WiseButAngrySara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #102
103. Thanks! I just noticed that you had already posted it.....n/t
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joytomme Donating Member (62 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:00 PM
Response to Original message
104. Bush Doesn't Whack Nuthin' But Sage Brush
The proof that the "Bush Whacked Rove" article is a plant from the GOP side is that it says,"an angry President Bush rebuked chief political guru Karl Rove two years ago for his role in the Valerie Plame affair, sources told the Daily News," and other nonsense like, "He made his (Rove's) life miserable about this."

Bush may piss and moan and throw little fits and tantrums but his piques and frets aren't taken seriously enough in the WH to make anyone's life miserable except his own. Only George W. Bush thinks he's POTUS...everyone else knows he's a clown.

Joy Tomme (http://ratbangdiary.blogspot.com )
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writes2000 Donating Member (481 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #104
107. I kindly disagree. Whoever leaked this did Bush no favors.
Just check out today's White House press meeting with Scotty M. He was dancing all over the place trying to discredit the article. And the press smelled blood.
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joytomme Donating Member (62 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #107
139. That's true...it does Bush no favors
I realize it surpasses Machiavelli at his best (worst). But I believe the GOP is so eating its own that they are Bushwhacking Bush.

Joy Tomme (http://ratbangdiary.blogspot.com )
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Nothing Without Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
108. Two assertions in the NY Daily News article are absolutely DEADLY for *:
They come from two "well-placed sources" and let's hope the sources will testify under oath:

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/357107p-304312c....

But the President felt Rove and other members of the White House damage-control team did a clumsy job in their campaign to discredit Plame's husband, Joseph Wilson, the ex-diplomat who criticized Bush's claim that Saddam Husse{i}n tried to buy weapons-grade uranium in Niger.

A second well-placed source said some recently published reports implying Rove had deceived Bush about his involvement in the Wilson counterattack were incorrect and were leaked by White House aides trying to protect the President.

"Bush did not feel misled so much by Karl and others as believing that they handled it in a ham-handed and bush-league way," the source said.



There's much more that strengthens the story: Bush knew, he approved of the "mission" to discredit Wilson, and he was angry only because it wasn't handled well. PLUS, you have those "leaked" stories from WH aides "trying to protect the president" who were falsely claiming that Rove had deceived Bush.

And then you see Bush's priorities all too clearly:


"Karl is fighting for his life," the official added, "but anything he did was done to help George W. Bush. The President knows that and appreciates that."



If these statements can be verified, that's the whole game right there. Bush committed treason and has continued to lie about it ever since. His only concern is to protect himself and his useful puppet-master.
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Kablooie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:10 PM
Response to Original message
112. Bush had a golden opportunity to play Superman ...
but he decided he'd rather play Lex Luthor.

Doesn't he realize that Lex always loses?
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MellowOne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:13 PM
Response to Original message
113. One lie uncovered could cause an avalanche of exposure
Like a domino effect. Kool!
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BReisen Donating Member (107 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:14 PM
Response to Original message
114. Smells like Watergate
This whole thing is really, really starting to remind me of Watergate - I feel like I'm having a flashback! Of course, what Nixon was trying to cover up wasn't treason....
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Nothing Without Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:15 PM
Response to Original message
115. ***OLBERMANN WILL REPORT ON THIS TONIGHT*** MSNBC 8 pm ET
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 03:01 PM by Nothing Without Hope
This is from today's emailed newsletter from Keith Olbermann's "Countdown" show;

His show repeats at midnight ET. He cites both the NYT article about the "no report expected" from Fitz and also the huge Daily News article that states that Bush has known all along about the Plame outing and was angered only at how ham-handedly it was done.


------------------------------------------------------
Tonight on Countdown
------------------------------------------------------

The special counsel in the C.I.A. leak case has told associates he has no plans to issue a final report about the results of the investigation, heightening the expectation that he intends to bring indictments, lawyers in the case and law enforcement officials said yesterday. http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/19/politics/19leak.html?...

An angry President Bush rebuked chief political guru Karl Rove two years ago for his role in the Valerie Plame affair, sources told the Daily News. "He made his displeasure known to Karl," a presidential counselor told The News. "He made his life miserable about this." http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/357107p-304312c....

Countdown w/ Keith Olbermann broadcasts LIVE at 8 pm et, and the count is never complete without you. Join us.

(snip - see the link in the thread cited below for the whole newsletter)


I have posted this as a separate thread here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
Thread title: MSNBC/Olbermann tonight: the huge Plame leak case news re *s involvement
I will post video and transcript from the show itself in that thread when they become available.
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 02:32 PM
Response to Original message
117. Its some good news at last...
Accountability and Karma has come full circle to bite these idiots right where the sun doesn't shine....
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lavenderdiva Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:15 PM
Response to Original message
121. okay, someone help me out here...
I know I must sound ignorant, but please help me thoroughly understand this post. For the most part its clear, but I want to be certain. Andrew Card is Shrub's Chief of Staff. Karl Rove is Shrub's Deputy Chief of Staff & Senior Advisor. Cheney is Vice-President. Ok I think that covers the OP's cast of characters.

Karl is going after Andrew, and Andrew is going after Karl.
Karl is going after Cheney, (and probably Cheney is going after Karl).

Today's "Bush Whacked Rove" article doesn't protect Bush. The headline may look that way but it's really a political nuclear time bomb aimed directly at King George.

so who is going after 'King George'? Who is blabbing all this? I know 2 of Cheney's underlings have flipped, and are helping the prosecution. Are they all just going to (hopefully!) cannibalize one another until there is noone left?

I am popping lots of popcorn, and hoping for a great show! (but would love to completely understand what is going on... -sorry to be slow on the uptake.)



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writes2000 Donating Member (481 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #121
123. I wasn't clear. There has also been talk of Bush vs. Cheney
It's possible that someone (Cheney) wanted to directly take down Bush.

Or it could be that people under Cheney are working overtime to protect him while people under Bush are working overtime to keep him clean.

In that scenario, striking Bush also hits Rove as well since Rove's ultimate goal is to save his boss.

All speculation on my part.
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lavenderdiva Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #123
127. thank you for clearing that up...
I was wondering, as your original post hinted as much, if it might indeed be Bush vs. Cheney, and Cheney vs. Bush. That would be the nuclear option for sure! Cheney has been AWOL for quite some time now, and it would make sense that he was deep in his bunker scheming some grand plan. It would also make sense that Rove would be scheming his retaliation against Cheney. This makes a whole lot more sense than Andy vs. Karl, etc.

Thanks for the additional info!
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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:30 PM
Response to Original message
131. I agree we are seeing Rove & Cheney & Bush scrambling
trying to save themselves!!!
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0rganism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 03:40 PM
Response to Original message
134. Could you please find a different metaphor?
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 03:41 PM by 0rganism
"Nuclear War In The White House" makes me nervous. It would be unsettling with any administration, but with these clowns, it's downright terrifying. That button's gonna look awfully tempting to dubya after half his staff is gone.

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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #134
140. A drunken, desperate Bush staggering around with the football
is quite a chilling thought. Hopefully he'll consult the paintings around the White House before he does anything rash. :scared:
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0rganism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #140
145. tha picsher uv Prezdent Gahrfeild told me ta nuke tha Phill... Philip-eens
Somehow, I don't find the notion of bush's consulting inanimate objects to be comforting. For most of us, it would be a meditative time of silent reflection. For bush, it would be an intense dialog, in which he could be outreasoned by a genocidal bowl of wax fruit.

"Aafter... after con-con-con-consultin mah closest advisers..."
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notadmblnd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
141. don't you just love it when they begin to eat their own
:popcorn: I'm on the edge of my seat.
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Bernardo de La Paz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:43 PM
Response to Original message
144. Which Bush crony will be the last one to hold out for a lie?
After enough flip, the prosecutors don't need any more flippers and will start arresting.
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Historic NY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
146. Its like a Mad magazine comic strip........
Spy vs. Spy.......when you actually sit back and really think about it, one has to wonder who is benefiting from all of this. The press is surely burning paper & ink to report them.
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:08 PM
Response to Original message
150. An astute observation...good post!
Thank you for your very astute observation into the backstabbing going on in the White House as they flail about trying to cover up the coverup, and fail miserably in the process.

What weve seen in the last two weeks out of the Plamegate case is a glaring case of political meltdown in the White House. Cheney is a focus of the investigation; Rove, Libby, and Hadley are facing indictments; two of Cheneys aides (Hannah and Wurmser) have flipped and are singing to minimize the charges that will be leveled against them; and, to top it off, the Propagandist has been caught in another lie.

But yet the Bush-God fanbois in the House and the Senate fail to hold the administration accountable for its deception and to start the impeachment process. How much longer can they keep their fingers in the dam?
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callady Donating Member (554 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:18 PM
Response to Original message
153. Dick Cheney


Vice President Dick Cheney

FITZGERALD FOCUSING ON DIRECT CHENEY INVOLVEMENT: Bloomberg reported, A special counsel is focusing on whether Vice President Dick Cheney played a role in leaking a covert CIA agents name, according to people familiar with the probe that already threatens top White House aides Karl Rove and Lewis Libby.

CHENEY INTERVIEWED BY FEDERAL PROSECUTORS: Vice President Dick Cheney was recently interviewed by federal prosecutors who asked whether he knew of anyone at the White House who had improperly disclosed the identity of an undercover C.I.A. officer. Mr. Cheney was also asked about conversations with senior aides, including his chief of staff, I. Lewis Libby . In addition, those people said, Mr. Cheney was asked whether he knew of any concerted effort by White House aides to name the officer. It was not clear how Mr. Cheney responded to the prosecutors questions. was not questioned under oath and he has not been asked to appear before the grand jury.

CHENEY SEEMS TO BE THE COMMON DENOMINATOR: Four members of the Vice Presidents staff Scooter Libby, John Hannah, Mary Matalin, and Catherine Martin have either been implicated in the leak or testified before the grand jury. In addition, Stephen Hadley worked under Cheney at the Defense Department and is considered by some to be his eyes and ears on the NSC staff.

CHENEY AND LIBBY PRESSURED CIA ON URANIUM: Cheney and Libby visited the CIA headquarters to engage the CIA analysts directly on this issue of uranium acquisition in Africa, creating an environment in which some analysts felt they were being pressured to make their assessments fit with the Bush administrations policy objectives.
http://www.thinkprogress.org/leak-scandal
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connecticut yankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:37 PM
Response to Original message
157. You've forgotten something
If Bush and Cheney go down, we'll have Hastert as President.

I'd like to have it wait until after the 2006 elections.

Wouldn't "President Pelosi" sound neat?

:woohoo:
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YDogg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:46 PM
Response to Original message
158. Seems too good to be true.
I hope to god/goddess it is true. This could mark the first step in the return of our country from a very dark place.
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kurth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:58 PM
Response to Original message
159. The revolution devours it own children
The revolution devours it own children.
- Georges Danton (Leader of the French Revolution, sent thousands to the guillotine, executed April 5, 1794. Famous last words: "Show my head to the people, it is worth seeing.")

He who makes only half a revolution digs his own grave.
- Maximilien Robespierre (who sent Danton to the guillotine; Robespierre was guillotined July 28, 1794)
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Ilsa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 06:19 PM
Response to Original message
161. My husband thought the Bush Whacked Rove article was a
puffpiece for Shrub. I disagreed because it indicated Bush*'s complicity with the leaking of classified material.

Thanks for your post. Excellent.
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TheMadMonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 06:45 PM
Response to Original message
162. Elect a new Prez.
Just how far down the list do you lot have to go before someone has to say "Well Dang, we's gonna hafta have ourselves a new 'lecshun for Preznit."?

DeLay is currently disqualified, so if Scrubby and Cheney both go, where do you look for the next president? Not the other House Majority Leader, he seems to be in a little hot water himself.


And one has to wonder if (some of) these folk are stupid enough to try issuing bullets and roobars in an attempt to plug the leaks.


It would also be interesting to know if this and/or other inquiries, are turning up evidence of other maelefesance. There's plenty to chose from. Will/can Fitz, recommend/request further Grand Juries be empannelled to investigate possible wrongdoings that fall outside the scope of the original inquiry?


Just how hard would it be (for some public spirrited individual) to obtain a DNA sample from Gannon and settle that particular rumour once and for all? The tragically unfortunate upshot of this one proving out however, might be a trail of dead bodies including a large number of children.
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Lena inRI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 07:18 PM
Response to Original message
164. So it could become President Dennis Hastert sooner than later. . .
The original Constitution provides that if neither the President nor Vice President can serve, the Congress shall provide law stating who is next in line. Currently that law exists as 3 USC 19, a section of the U.S. Code. This law was established as part of the Presidential Succession Act of 1947. There, the following line of succession is provided:

Speaker of the House of Representatives
President Pro Tempore of the Senate
Secretary of State
Secretary of the Treasury
Secretary of Defense
Attorney General
Secretary of the Interior
Secretary of Agriculture
Secretary of Commerce
Secretary of Labor
Secretary of Health and Human Services
Secretary of Housing and Urban Development
Secretary of Transportation
Secretary of Energy
Secretary of Education
Secretary of Veterans Affairs
Secretary of Homeland Security (not yet set by law)

The only exception to the line provided in the law states that to ascend to the Presidency, the next person in line must be constitutionally eligible. Any person holding an office in the line of succession who, for example, is not a naturally-born citizen cannot become President. In this case, that person would be skipped and the next eligible person in the line would become President.


http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_succ.html

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TheMadMonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #164
165. Secretary of Education: Of course....
Shades of Battlestar Galactica.

Now would Starbuck and Appolo stop dicking around with the bloody Cylons, and start doing something about the real threat to humanity.
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many a good man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #164
170. We could be electing a new President in the Midterm elections !
The Framers didn't intend for Congress to control both branches for more than half a president's term (or an appointee).

Remember, the Constitution is a living breathing document.
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IntravenousDemilo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
167. So many holes in the dike.
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 08:08 PM by IntravenousDemilo
And they're running out of fingers. They'd better have water wings.
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adigal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
168. But Joseph Wilson is the one who should be indicted
according to the nutjobs over at freerepublic.com - don't ask me why, I am still trying to figure out what the hell they are talking about! But somehow, Wilson and Plame should be arrested, and Rove/Libby/Cheney all knew that Plame was NEVER a covert agent.

Spinning, spinning, spinning, right into their graves.
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newscott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 09:06 PM
Response to Original message
171. I never thought I'd live through something like this twice
let alone once.

When will America learn to never trust the right.
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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #171
172. Honestly! You Said it!
When? What an excellent, yet sad question. Suppose as long as "arrogance," "ignorance," and "bigotry" exists.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:54 PM
Response to Reply #171
178. think of the poor people who also lived
through McCarthy...
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NewJeffCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-20-05 04:51 AM
Response to Reply #178
181. It seems like the major scandals are Republican
Treasongate under Bush
Clinton had a pseudo-scandal in Whitewater that was really nothing.
Iran-Contra under Reagan
Watergate under Nixon
Joe McCarthy in the 50s
Teapot Dome under Harding

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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-20-05 10:33 PM
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184. Kick
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