It's official. Louis Farrakan is batshit crazy!

[Archae]

I mean, :crazy:

Farrakhan: Levee May Have Been Bombed To Flood Black People

POSTED: 7:58 am CDT October 14, 2005

WASHINGTON -- Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan said it's up to the government to prove that a levee wasn't bombed to flood poor black people out of New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina.

Farrakhan said he's heard that military explosives may have been used to blow a hole in the levee, resulting in what he said would amount to "mass murder."

Quoting the Bible and the Quran, The Rev. Farrakhan said he suspects there was a government conspiracy behind the New Orleans flooding, but is confident that God will reveal the truth.

http://www.themilwaukeechannel.com/news/5098327/detail.html

[FranzFerdinand]

1. i stopped listening to him

after the whole "ufo" vision...

[blm]

30. I stopped after RevMoon roped him in with the Million Family March

Farrakhan has declared that RevMoon is the "Great Prophet from the East" and joined Moon with one of his mass marriages at the March in DC.

Moon pretty much ingratiates himself with a number of black Christian preachers, too. Especially iaround the DC area.

I don't trust Farrakhan and his motives because of his alliance with Moon.

I think Bush WANTS a black leader like Farrakhan to come out with attacks on him because it helps his white Christian base to come out more emphatically in support of him while neutralizing the charges raised against Bush with the moderate voters because of their distrust of the messaenger.

[Monkey see Monkey Do]

76. Wow, I didn't know that. nt

[blm]

89. Hey...nice to see you.

And you know that Moon is closeasthis with the Bush family.

My theory is that they USE Farrakhan to speak against them and pose the exact scenarios that they are capable of having committed, just so people can always TRACE the charge back to him and deem it conspiracy talk from a crazed black man bent on destroying Christianity.

THAT'S how cynical I am about the BFEE.

[meganmonkey]

2. It happened before, why wouldn't it happen again?

I'm not saying I think it it did, I am just saying it is possible :shrug:

[Howardx]

4. yep

not a stretch for me to believe

[TomInTib]

17. I saw an interview with a resident of N O and he was quite

emphatic about this.
He lived right next to the levee and said he heard an explosion right before the levee gave way.
There were later reports of explosive residue-laced soil and metal structures beneath the water line.
I don't know how legit any of this is but I watched WTC7 collapse.

[Beelzebud]

23. I have a feeling a levee of that size collapsing would be LOUD.

[TomInTib]

41. I have witnessed a levee collapse and it was more of a roar

but then, of course, it wasn't the same magnitude as the one in N O.
Was on our family farm and I will tell you the damage was awesome and total.

[Zhade]

49. Take a poll - most here probably have no clue what you're talking about.

Heck, I didn't know that happened until a recent New Yorker article!

[TallahasseeGrannie]

3. I'm glad he said it

because it has been "whispered" and I needs to be dealt with openly.

I don't think it happened and I'd like to see the government address it.

[fredtaylor]

13. Nah

If the gov'ment addresses every crackpot theory, it give legitimacy to them and those who are proposing such theories.

[Tomee450]

55. Why is it a crackpot theory?

The ninth ward was flooded before to save white districts of New Orleans. Knowing this, why is it unreasonable to believe it was done this time. I've heard reports that the levee should have held and people are wondering why it did not. They called it a crackpot theory when blacks complained about syphilis experiments being done on black males. Turned out to be true. The black business district of Tulsa Oklahoma was deliberately bombed and a prosperous black community was wiped out. The reason? A reported rape of a white woman which turned out to be untrue. They used the rape as a reason to get rid of blacks who had become quite wealthy. In fact, the black district was so successful it was called the black Wall Street. This occurred around the beginning of the twentieth century. Again thousands of blacks were scattered about the country. It was so traumatic, elderly black people have a difficult time discussing it today. Only recently has this appalling story of the black shopping district of Tulsa become known. So no, it does not have to be a crackpot theory.

[oasis]

61. I first read about the Tulsa "riots" in the "Nation" magazine 5 or 6 years

ago. There was a PBS documentary about it around that time. Before that, NOTHING.

This should have been in every history book in America. It was a big deal. The "powers that be" choose to glorify bullshit events.

How many movies have been made about the O.K. Corral?

I have made mention of the Millions More March on a few DU threads during the past month. Zero replies.

[Tomee450]

73. The political leaders of Oklahoma tried

to erase any memory of the "riots" and still have not given reparations to the residents who are still alive. It was even difficult to find newspaper articles about the incident.
There are people who have blind hatred of Farrakhan and they are dismissive of any good that he does. He is as hated has David Duke and has never done anything that can compare with the actions of Duke.I hope the Millions More March is successful. It seems that the leaders are really focusing on how to find solutions to many of the problems faced by minorities and poor whites.

[BronxBoy]

84. They don't f**kng get it.....

I'm assuming that all of the people dismissing this out of hand are White. They fucking have to be. A lot of Black people, especially in the wake of what went down after Katrina, believe this. We certainly feel that we were left out to dry during one of this country's worst natural disasters. So it's not too much of stretch to believe that that some bullshit such as this went down.

Hey someone told me that a Sheriff's department blocked an evacuation route out of NOLA and fired gunshots over the heads of fleeing hurricane victims. But that's just a crackpot theory and we should crucify whoever said that. Because, that's just BATSHIT CRAZY

[Tomee450]

114. When it comes

to the truth about the difference in the way blacks and whites are treated, many people prefer denial.

Last weekend on Book TV a black author, currently on a book tour, said African Americans are really talking about Katrina. I have not talked to any black person who is not upset about Katrina and all believe something funny went on in NOLA. A lot of people believe that the levee was tampered with. People are also upset about the nasty, racist comments that have been uttered about the black victims. I don't think this latest outrage will ever be forgotten.

[BronxBoy]

121. Because.....

if you had any, just any, small illusion that this country would at least try to do the right thing by Black folks in the midst of a major natural disaster, you got more than disappointed, you got butt fucked. I hate to be crass but that is what it was. It was a crude and unforgivable act that has been seared into the consciences of most Black Americans. It was made very clear to us how we are valued in this country.

And the OP doesn't even have a clue. All he sees is that Farrakhan is BATSHIT CRAZY. Doesn't even make the effort to look below the surface.

[goclark]

129. BronxBoy welcome to DU!

If White Americans from Malibu would have been hanging off of the cliffs and no one came to rescue them for days, that would be an American fairy tale.

It ain't gonna happen.

When Black AND White America and the WORLD sees Black Seniors/babies/our poor left to die and all their hopes and dreams destroyed,that is somehow different.

And to think that the Rev. Farrakan does not have the right to rally his people and build awareness of how we can better ourselves is beyond me!

He is not trying to put our youth in prison!

I heard him say on CSPAN that "Prisons are on the NY Stock Exchange, they are big business and they must continue to be filled."

He knows, and all of us know, that Black America is not making millions off of Prisons -- RICH WHITE MEN are the money makers and Black Men are the means to that end.

He is trying to wake up our youth and make them realize that they MUST get an education and stay out of jail and raise their children to be productive citizens.

OUR CHILDREN NEED TO HEAR THAT MESSAGE and they ain't going to hear it from Ann Coulter or GWB!

Speak BronxBoy! Speak!

[BronxBoy]

136. Thanks

I've been around awhile. I just try to listen more than I speak.

I'm on the fence as far as Farrakhan is concerned. He does say some some illuminating things about the Black condition. But he's also uttered some pretty bigoted shit as well. One of the most chilling things I ever read was a story in the Village Voice about 15 years ago (Back when it was a great investigative paper) The story detailed how the Fruit of Islam showed up at the deathbed of one of their members and basically ex-communicated him. On his fucking deathbed. His crime: He had full blown aids and they felt that he had to have engaged in some unholy behavior to get it.

I have no problem with people hammering Farrakhan. I just have a real problem with White America being dismissive of Black apprehensions. There is a LOT of talk within the Black community that some of the events in NOLA were not the result of a natural disaster. And several posters have provided historical references to suggest that sabotage to a levee system has happened before. But that all gets rolled up into a blanket statment that about BATSHIT CRAZY.

[goclark]

111. Thank you Tomee ~ this story has been circulating

in the Black community for weeks.

I don't know if it happened or didn't happen.

But, it is real to the Black community.

I regret that it was deleted as a concern here.

[butterfly77]

156. I get so tired of hearing a about it is a conspiracy theory...

thats their way to say the person is nuts. Why not look at whats going on in the government now. What about the smallpox blankets given to the Native American? I can come up with more that were proven to be true. They will do anything to hold on to power the evil lying ....

[Archae]

16. How?

How could the government "address" this bullshit charge Calypso Louie pulled out of his ass?

No, Louie made the charge, *HE* needs to frikkin' back it up.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

22. Well you have a point

but it is just going to get worse because he's down there telling everybody how this was done to them.

Sad, really...he said some things recently that actually made sense to me.

[Tomee450]

58. Please get your fact straight.

The rumor about the levee was NOT started by Farrakhan. That rumor was going around before he made his statement and in that statement Farrakhan repeated what he had been told. In fact on Washington Journal yesterday I believe he said that Mayor Nagin had repeated what he had heard, that is, that people believed the levee was damaged deliberately.

[Tomee450]

57. He pulled nothing out of his

ass. He is repeating what he has heard. I've heard the same thing and not all of the people who believe something funny went on are black. This country has a history of doing things to black people that they would not be done to any other group. During the late fifties and sixties, the government went through black areas demolishing districts that had been in existence for years. These were stable areas, many with well kept homes. The blacks were removed and scattered about other black areas of the cities causing great housing shortages and other problems. New housing was supposed to be built but none was built for decades and even today in some areas, that land is still not developed. Black people have good reason to be suspicious.

On the Nixon tapes, one of his aides, who seemed to believed that blacks had ruined Washington Dc. suggested that it might be a good idea if the blacks be moved out. I thought that was a stunning statement but the media conveniently kept quiet about that comment.

[Scurrilous]

67. Calypso Louie?

I'm curious, why do you call him Calypso Louie?

[MrSlayer]

99. Because he used to be a Calypso singer back in the day.

Before all this Nation of Islam malarkey he was a nightclub performer.

[Scurrilous]

131. OK

Thanks!

[IndyOp]

21. I am glad too - and for exactly the same reason.

Last weekend Janet Parshall accused Randi Rhodes of believing the 'conspiracy theory about bombing of NO levees' - which Randi has never discussed. Whenever something is whispered, and not discussed publically, the truth does not come out and the right uses peoples' reasonable concern/suspicion to bludgeon the left into silence.

SAY IT OUT LOUD - then tell the people ALL the facts and let them decide.

:kick:

[itzamirakul]

167. What government would you like to have address the levy

collapse rumor? The Bush government? What do you think they will say? Who else is in a position to find out the truth? Do you really think the plight of so many lower income blacks is important enough for the "government" bring in another independent prosecutor? I mean the same "government" that wouldn't stand up when asked to stand by their black colleagues in the 2000 voting theft debacle in Congress?
Do you really think that people like Mary Landrieu care what happens to those black people? She is a Dem but she stands with her Repub statesmen.

I mean why should I believe any of them more than I believe Farrakhan? Just because it seems like such a cruel act makes it no less possible.

[Richard Steele]

5. Why does this seem so farfetched to you?

It's been done before, you know.

That being said, I do think the guy is a bit loony.
A very LARGE bit!

[Maraya1969]

6. It wasn't a conspiracy it was just that they didn't care. Spending

26 Billion on new roads in Illinois was more important that fixing those levees that I'm sure Bush was informed about.

[400Years]

35. The LIHOP part would be not funding the levee building

you know, when bush redirected that money to go to iraq.

[LatinoSocialist]

7. I'm not following Farrakhan anywhere

He is batshit crazy...the whole Nation of Islam is. It's totally based on a warped, bullshit story about some black withdoctor called Yakub making evil white people. Malcolm X left it when he realized that Elijah Muhammad was a fraud and a womanizer, and he discovered real Sunni Islam.

I would like to see an investigation, just to dispel the rumors.

[watrwefitinfor]

14. "I would like to see an investigation, just to dispel the rumors."

Funny thing - that's exactly what I heard Farrakhan say on NPR yesterday.

Wat

[LatinoSocialist]

42. hah

but I mean it differently. I think the rumors that should be squashed is all that tin-foil hat conspiracies about blown levees.

[Tomee450]

59. Before you start calling people

names, perhaps you need to do a little bit of history reading. The deliberate flooding of the ninth ward has happened before. I heard an author by the name of Barry discussing this a few weeks ago on C-Span. Farrakhan talked about Barry's book, the Rising Tide, on Washington Journal yesterday. Sometimes what you think is a conspiracy is anything but. I saw a professor from LSU who helped to developed a plan for NO that would have prevented this catastrophe, interviewed on CNN. He was quite puzzled as to why the levee did not hold. He said his group wanted to take a piece of the levee and send it to a forensic lab but was denied permission to do so.

[bumblebee1]

119. Unfortunately,

Malcolm X was assassinated shortly after that discovery.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Tomee450]

60. It's amazing how you know so

much about what Farrakhan is doing to black people. I think as a black person I am more worried about police beating by white cops, voter disenfranchisement, racial profiling, discrimination in housing and employment, attacks on Affirmative Action, unfair drug laws. I don't think Farrakhan can be held responsible for any of those evils. All Farrakhan does is tell black people to rely on themselves, to care about each other, to become educated, be moral, go into business for themselves. He offers a positive message. Some people just need to find a reason to hate him.

[noiretextatique]

65. "keeping a lot of black men hating america..."

:puke: black people have excellent reasons to hate Amerikkka and be far more constructive while doing so than most...considering what we've survived.

[oasis]

70. Recent events surrounding Katrina and New Orleans say more to "black men"

than Farrakan could ever articulate.

[harrison]

9. Great Book entitled Rising Tide about the Miss. River and

the flood of 1927. Details all of this. Thoroughly researched and documented.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

10. If Farrakhan announced a perfected unified field theory

it would not be believed, simply because he has worked so hard over the years to destroy his own credibility, with his race-baiting and anti-semitism.

I despise a racist in all forms and L.F. is little more than Rush Limbaugh with a great tan.

[Neocondriac]

11. Louis maybe slightly whacked........

but I would never doubt anything regarding the current regime.

[unrepuke]

12. Don Quixote said something like, "If you believe the windmills are

giants you'd be crazy. But to be sane you must be able to think that they might be."

I would not not put it past this government to do exactly that. After all, they did it in 1927.

[jobycom]

15. That's the MIHOP conspiracy theory of Katrina, and more than him are

saying it.

And it's no more wacko than all the 9-11 "controlled demolition" stories. The levy break on the poor side of the Canal would have kept the city side from breaking, which would have prevented New Orleans from flooding if the rest of the levees had held. It makes sense, something similar was done in 1927. You can find evidence to support it.

I don't believe it, nor do I believe the 9-11 stuff. But it's no crazier.

[pauldp]

27. One difference however would be that

there is no "Katrina Commission Report" with dozens and dozens of baffling omissions and distortions.

[BronxBoy]

85. You're right...

but we're Black and we've come not to expect a Commision Report with dozens and dozens of bafling omissions and distortions

[pauldp]

96. The first step would be to get a real impartial investgation. n/t

[BronxBoy]

101. LOL

:rofl:

Yeah....Wake me me it starts.

Real Impartial Investigation: Black Victims: Republicans:

:rofl:

I know: It's Friday night, what are you drinking (smoking, snorting, injecting)?

[pauldp]

152. I didn't say it would happen...

just said that would be the first step. We never got one with 911 either. So In both cases were still waiting to get to square one.

[TheFarseer]

18. They don't need to flood black people

they were pretty content just ignoring them I thought.

Does everyone realize, this is the type of crazy BS that turns off alot of moderate voters? People HATE being generalized and hit over the head with the label of racist, homophobe, bigot. Most people don't really give a crap if you're gay or black or white or whatever.

[400Years]

33. Yeah, but now they can clear out those areas and build condos

that is probably the reason they created such a diaspora by sending people all the way to Utah. Don't want those poor people coming back and getting in the way of Halliburton.

[TheFarseer]

36. On the plus side

Omaha might be getting a Cajun restaurant out of the deal(no joke, a couple survivors are supposedly building one)

[400Years]

38. A big plus for Omaha, no doubt

bon apetit!

[Rolexman]

125. Yea..

Like we need more restaurants... There is one on every freaking corner...

[BronxBoy]

87. Yeah

Whoop Dee Fucking Do

Thousands of Black people get displaced but OMAHA gets a cajun restaurant.

Why didn't you have one before this?

[Tomee450]

64. Exactly

They deliberately send the residents all over the country. There is an army base nearby where many resident could have been sent but it was decided to send them elsewhere.

[NorthernSpy]

43. are these the same "moderate voters" who didn't care in the first place...

... that poor people got left behind to face the flood alone?

Does everyone realize, this is the type of crazy BS that turns off alot of moderate voters? People HATE being generalized and hit over the head with the label of racist, homophobe, bigot. Most people don't really give a crap if you're gay or black or white or whatever.

Yeah, right. If it weren't for that dreadful, dreadful levee sabotage rumor, these "moderate voters" would abandon their indifference and rush to the side of the dispossessed, loudly demanding justice on their behalf -- just like they never do anyway.

:eyes:

[TheFarseer]

50. What do you think the average American should do?

Donate to the Red Cross? take up a collection at church for Katrina relief? Watch in horror the images of hurricane victims on the TV? That's what most people around here did. Don't let Brit Hume and his greedy bigoted mouth ruin your perceptions of anyone except Brit Hume.

[Tomee450]

63. Baloney

Any "moderate voter" turned off because of these suspicions probably was far from moderate to begin with. It seems that some here are absolutely blind to the different manner in which blacks are treated in this country. Just because this would never happen to a white area doesn't mean it would not happen to blacks. It's just shocking to find such ignorance on a forum such as this. What does it take? Rosewood, Greenwood Businessess district of Tulsa Oklahoma, the flood of 1927, just few of the instances in which actions were taken which displaced thousands of African Americans. Given this history, why should anyone be surprised that many people might believe that history has repeated itself.

[Sterling]

93. Some white people live in a sheltered world.

I know, I am as white as you can get. Unless they have been in a comparable situation, like being abused by police or something along those lines many never seem to be able to empathize with what people who are not white are up against in this country.

Many suburban whites especially live in a fantasy land insulated from the real world and only see the rest of the world through the eyes of propaganda tools like CNN.

Just look at the way the old black man who was beaten is being addressed. People on CNN actually have the balls to assert that he may have had it coming.

[Tomee450]

116. If only people would

open their eyes. Sometimes I think certain people just don't care. There have been so many reports of police brutality, racial profiling, tasering,handcuffing five year old black child, laws passed that negatively impacted African AMericans yet some people still keep their heads in the sand. It's very disheartening. With everything that has happened to black people during the past few years, it is not at all unreasonable to believe that something was done to break the levee.

[HamdenRice]

143. What planet have you been living on ?

You wrote: "Most people don't really give a crap if you're gay or black or white or whatever."

Is this a joke?

[noiretextatique]

173. yes, ignorance is bliss

don't bring up anything remotely controversial so i can pretend that everything is as fine in the rest of the country (and the world) as it is in my lily-white enclave. anti-gay marriage initiatives passed in 11 states in the last elections, and the republicans continue to exploit race and sexual orientation to gain the votes of whites who have no business voting for them. and i am sure most people really don't give a crap if you're black or gay or whatever, but that certainly doesn't seem to be reflected in how they vote.

[spuddonna]

19. I will not comment on Farrakan himself...

However, the fear that the levees were blown on purpose has historical backing.

From Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Mississippi_Flood
"As the flood approached New Orleans, Louisiana 30 tons of dynamite were set off on the levee at Caernarvon, Louisiana and sent 250,000 ft³/s (7,000 m³/s) of water pouring through. This prevented New Orleans from experiencing serious damage but destroyed much of the marsh below the city and flooded all of St. Bernard Parish. As it turned out, the destruction of the Caernarvon levee was unnecessary; several major levee breaks well upstream of New Orleans, including one the day after the dynamiting, made it impossible for flood waters to seriously threaten the city.

By August 1927 the flood subsided. During the disaster 700,000 people were displaced, including 330,000 African-Americans who were moved to 154 relief camps. Over 13,000 refugees near Greenville, Mississippi were gathered from area farms and evacuated to the crest of an unbroken levee, and stranded there for days without food or clean water, while boats arrived to evacuate white women and children. Many African-Americans were detained and forced to labor at gunpoint during flood relief efforts."

There's a lot of history there. I can understand how these people might believe they blew the levees on purpose.

[walkon]

28. Thank you for the post.

Remarkably similar to Katrina. Experts have said that the storm surge did not top the levees and cannot explain the failure(s). Saving the corporate/elite areas just might have been a priority for somebody and just as in 1927 it was likely unnecessary.

[spuddonna]

40. No problem! :)

I am not taking anyone's word that the levees were blown after Katrina. However, I don't trust that they wouldn't blown them either...

I read a piece somewhere that a Army Corp Engineers diver had found 'weird burn marks' on the storm walls that failed. Is it true? No idea... Will we ever have an investigation into it? Doubtful...

Ok, I just scared myself there because I started to sound like Rumsfeld... lol

[walkon]

52. That is scary!

I agree we will never know. All the physical evidence is destroyed. I can't imagine any witnesses coming forward. It would take hundreds of honest reporters / investigators years to unravel all that has gone on under the Neocons. I

[ArkDem]

53. It's nothing like Katrina in which the LAKE levees were breached

not the Mississippi River. In the flood if 1927 the levees were blown north of New Orleans to DECREASE the flooding in New Orleans.

[The Stranger]

45. Interesting parallels, aren't they?

Last time this was posted, all of the "batshit crazy" posts disappeared faster than a criminal going on vacation to Camp David.

[H2O Man]

20. Louis is a con man.

He is a greedy, evil parasite.

[BronxBoy]

157. So GWB

And He's President and half of White America supports him. Go worry about that. Seems like Black folk have Farrakhan in check.

[H2O Man]

175. You're silly.

Hard to take silly serious.

[IndyOp]

24. Disagree - It is not batshit crazy to

suspect that the levies were bombed -- it is a genuine concern and must be dealt with by collecting and analyzing all available information from all witnesses and letting whatever the truth is come to light.

You contribute to a culture of silence and passivity when you attack someone (Farrakhan) who has a suspicion of foul play -- that is exactly how the right bludgeons the left over and over. Dismiss all concerns as 'conspiracy theory' -- and no one is allowed to question ANYTHING.

:kick:

[goclark]

122. Thank you IndyOp

Funny how so many at DU would entertain the notion that Lee Harvey Oswald DID NOT act alone.

Yet, when it comes to the levees, it could not possible happen that there may have been a bit of foul play!


I heard Rev. F on CSPAN state exactly what the Black Community had suggested. He did not start that rumor/truth!

Blame him for a lot of things but I will not blame him for that one.

Again, I posted that article about two weeks ago because I was shocked when I received it by email from some friends that lived in NO for years. They loved the city!

I did post it and it was immediately deleted. I was shocked and to this day do not understand why.

[whatever4]

25. Okay, time for my batshit crazy post of the day

cause it's Friday and all

You know what? I'm to the point now where...even if it's not true...I just about don't care, if this theory or ANY theory sways the American public into not trusting the admin. Since they shouldn't. Yesterday, I learned that Japan has screwed us over on computer chips, and China practically owns our banks. And that was just yesterday and THAT is just one little damn problem in with far too many other ones. YOu know what I mean? Hell, LET the American people think they bombed them. Even if it ISN'T true, I mean really, it's as plausible as fair elections, WMD and Katrina relief.

What the hell. Support the idea, support him. Go with it. Build the rumors. At this point, they've told so many lies, it's hard to tell what's the truth anymore ANYWAY. Was New York ever really in any danger, or not? Is this flu possibility a real threat, this year or next...or not?

Frick it, use the willingness of the American people to believe lies. Go with their strengths. You know? *sigh*

[in_cog_ni_to]

26. I don't think that's batshit crazy. The levees being blown up

is a real possibility. I don't doubt for one minute that they would do that. Farrakhan may be crazy, but not for believing this happened.

[CatWoman]

29. Give me a fucking break

I suppose the Tuskegee experiments were figments of the imagination as well?

[applegrove]

31. This is old. Older than me. And I am middle aged.

[wrathofkahn]

32. I hate to burst your bubble...

...but he's been officially batshit crazy for a LONG time now. In fact, I think that the DSM-V is supposed to have a new "Farrakahn" sub-section in it, under the heading of "batshit loons."

[Tomee450]

69. Every black leader has been

called names: Paul Robeson, Marcus Garvey, Martin Luther King, Dubois and others. It's an attempt to silence them. Martin Luther King was hated and called a trouble maker and a communist and he was a man of peace. A black man, unfraid to speak the truth, will offend many people in this country if he tells the truth about racism and thus will be villified. More hatred is directed at Farrakhan, Sharpton and Jackson than is directed at David Duke, the former head of a racist organization responsible for the deaths of thousands. Farrakhan has not called for the defacement of synogogues or for violence against anyone. He just speaks his mind and is hated for doing so.

[goclark]

123. Speak Tomee450! Speak! nt

[Kurovski]

170. CYNTHIA MCKINNNNEY! They tried to say she's nuts, BUT...

oh, no she ain't.

You'll know when someone is crazy when they start killing huge numbers of people, when they can't see reality and start saying how great things are even though people are dropping like flies all around them.

Yes, George is nuts, Dick C is nuts, etc.

[Mandate My Ass]

34. It works for Bush and repubs all the time

Bush: "Saddam, prove to me you have no weapons or we'll invade."

Fill in your own examples at will.

[NorthernSpy]

37. so go ahead and investigate, I say -- it's no crazier than other rumors...

... that came out of New Orleans.

In the aftermath of the storm, a lot rumors about the hurricane survivors were spread, and the result was a widespread hysteria of fear and loathing directed against them. This happened despite the fact that many of those stories -- which have since proven false -- were plainly absurd from the beginning.

I want to make it clear that it's no "crazier" to spread rumors of evil on the part of whites than it is to spread rumors of evil on the part of blacks. Keep in mind that this particular rumor that Farrakhan is promoting is just one of many. It stands out only because the main targets of the accusation are understood to be white rather than black.

I advocate approaching the rumors of levee sabotage with the same caution appropriate with all of the Katrina rumors. Look into the matter, demand actual proof, and keep track of how the story mutates.

[tsuki]

39. To me, he makes as much sense as

Pat "God Did It" Robertson.

[SoCalDem]

44. The media LOVES him, because he's presentable(looking), yet

speaks of outrageous things..

Every time you see him on tv think about this:

Why is HE there instead of:

Tavis Smiley
Joe Madison
John Conyers
Maya Angelou
Oprah (yes even Oprah)
Cornel West


there are many more...my point is that the media only covers the most radical and "off-kilter" spokespeople of any group of which they disapprove .

It's about the marginalization of black people..The media does this so that when Joe Public tunes in, he can say to himself "Those black people are all nuts...I have nothing in common with them"..

[Catherine Vincent]

46. Farrakhan doesn't get that much coverage, imo.

He has his set following but the majority of blacks do not see him as a leader.

[SoCalDem]

48. I know that, but when white people tune in and see HIM,

THEY make a judgement about black people from watching HIM..and by using LF on tv and NOT the MANY MANY others who SHOULD be on tv, it's a real shame.

[noiretextatique]

66. i agree...his purpose is to scare the shit out of white people

who then make ridiculous statements, like several in this thread :hi:
i mean really...the NOI is not really significant in black america, let alone america, so why bother even giving him a voice? of course i don't mind hearing what he has to say, but i agree with your assessment of how he functions for the neocons.

[Tomee450]

As a black person

I am often offended by many non blacks I see on television who are nothing but racists. If those kind of people can repeatedly be seen on television, why not Farrakhan. I am not a member of the NaTION of Islam, don't always agree with Farrakhan but I would still like to hear what he has to say. There are a lot of people who are not Muslims who feel similarly. They do not always agree with him but find him worth listening to. Pat Buchanan, Ann Coulter, Michael Medved, David Horowitz are always on television. Why not Farrakhan who really is not on most of the time. Also, I don't buy this business of whites being negatively influenced against blacks because of Farrakhan. Anyone who judges African Americans my one man, probably were already inclined to be racists. That's like blacks judging all whites by the likes of David Duke and George Wallace.

[SoCalDem]

72. If there was a steady stream of the "balancers" , I would agree

BUT..we rarely see the others...and when we DO, they are merely pawns to be pounced upon by the ever-present rightwingers who gobble up all the airtime they can:(

[goclark]

127. As another Black Person I agree with you!

I am not and have never been anyway related to the Nation of Islam.

I do not know anyone personally that is a member.


Do large numbers of Black Americans(of all social classes) want to hear what Rev. Farrakhan has to say? YES!


Why? To be perfectly honest, I believe it is because he confronts racism and has the nerve to say what other Black leaders are afraid to say.

All my friends will be watching the March. We will be watching for a variety of reasons.

I was surprised to hear on CSPAN that after the last Million Man March, 3 percent more African American males VOTED in the next election.

Hopefully we will be able to increase that number this time.

Thank you Tomee for adding a voice of understanding and reason to what could be a hot button discussion.

[Tomee450]

159. Thank you for your

contribution to the discussion. Unfortunately, I fear there are a lot of deaf ears around.

[Tomee450]

71. deleted

[BronxBoy]

154. Well maybe White people

should broaden their horizons

[itzamirakul]

168. I watched C-Span from about 5 Am until after 7PM and I can

tell you that Cornel West, Sheila Lee, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, were among the many, many well-known blacks who attended and spoke.

Tavis Smiley does not compute in my register of African Americans that I hold in high esteem and truly, neither does Oprah, despite her popularity among whites and her great wealth and generosity, especially toward whites.

I was impressed when my 92 year old soror and esteemed leader, Dorothy Height spoke.

[seabeyond]

47. this govt is capable of anything, why not flood the poorest of areas

to save the rich areas. why should that be like, out of reach. they give to the rich, allowing poor to go hungry. not a stretch here. i personally want to be assured that our govt didnt do exactly that. it was said immediately people had heard explosives

i ask, why you pin farrakan as batshit crazy, and not look at what bushco has reduced us to? point the finger at our own govt at the possibly they allow us to die. hm, lets see, how long did it take fema and bushco's govt to go in for the people of no?

[NaturalHigh]

51. Farrakhan is a racist jackass.

If he ever did make a good point, most people would probably ignore it just because it was him making it. He's no better than Fred Phelps or David Duke in my opinion.

[Tomee450]

74. How ridiculous

David Duke headed an organization that killed thousands and still supports white supremacy. I have never heard Farrakhan advocate violence nor do I know of any members of the NOI going around defacing property. Farrakhan certainly has his faults but he is nothing like David Duke.

[NaturalHigh]

75. Farrakhan runs an organization that teaches white people

are evil and were invented by a mad scientist. Ever heard the term "blue-eyed devils"? As for murder or defacing property, read up on the history of the Nation of Islam. Farrakhan himself was allegedly involved in the Malcolm X assassination. Also, don't forget that Farrakhan is buds with Qaddafi, a mass murderer himself. Sorry to rain on your parade, but Farrakhan is an evil man who hates everyone who isn't black.

[CatWoman]

77. *sigh*

I'm quite sure Muslims don't believe that crap anymore -- that was Elijah Muhammad's bullshit.

[NaturalHigh]

78. NOI has nothing to do with mainstream Islam.

It's a cult that preaches hatred of anyone not black.

[oasis]

79. I've heard Farrakan's most recent speeches on public access television.

No hate message. What counts is what he's been promoting for the past few years.

Sen. Robert Byrd, Rev. Al Sharpton and Arianna Huffington all have had political views that have changed over time.

[CatWoman]

104. thanks, Oasis

for the sanity :D

[KamaAina]

110. Add Hillary Clinton to that list

ex-Goldwater Girl, she.

[goclark]

128. Yes Oasis

I have not heard any recent hate messages coming from him for a long, long time.

Thank you for your voice on this issue.

[0007]

108. That's plain bullshit!

[peacebaby3]

161. Actually, it seems they still do believe in that crap. Please see post

#160. The SPLC does a very good job of keeping up with hate groups.

[Tomee450]

106. You have no proof whatsoever

of Farrakhan being responsible for the death of Malcolm X. And I still can find no report of Farrakhan advocating violence against whites or Jews or of members of the Nation of Islam defacing or destroying the property of whites. There is no way that Farrakhan can be compared to David Duke who headed the Klan and who still preaches white supremacy. The Klan murdered thousands and to this day still acts to intimidate blacks by burning crosses. I've listened to Farrakhan many times and has yet to hear him refer to whites as devils or call for violence against them. He is far from perfect but certainly not in the category of David Duke.

[H2O Man]

140. I think that

a number of things connect him to Malcolm's death. Obviously one of Malcolm's daughters was convinced of this. I'm curious what evidence of Louis' involvement you are aware of, and how you view it?

[K-W]

54. This article does not provide many quotes

I'm certainly no Farrakhan follower, but I've seen too many people unfairly smeared by media paraphrasing.

[Balbus]

56. Batshit crazy would be a step up for Louis - eom

[ultraist]

62. I wouldn't put anything past this administration.

Consider the LIES they told to take us to WAR!

Further, as others have mentioned, there is a historical precedence here on which that theory was based.

They DID leave thousands to drown and die for fuck's sake in NOLA, why is this so outrageous?

Farrakhan is not the only one saying this.

[sendero]

68. I think Farrakan..

... might be a bit nuts.

I'm also glad he said this. And I hope every black person in the USA believes him, in which case the truthfulness of the story is moot.

Some of you are so far behind the power curve, I don't think you'll ever "get it".

[RepublicanElephant]

80. meanwhile, back at the oval office...

rove: i think it's great that farrakhan is saying this stuff about the levees. distraction, people, distraction. who cares about the truth when people rather focus on the messenger. speaking of "rather", how's dan doing these days?

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

81. Farrakhan has been pimped heavily by FOX and RW hate radio, in

an effort to increase "noise" and confusion and discredit anti Bush viewpoints in general.

My opinion.

[blm]

90. Read my posts above, MM.

I'm in sync with you on this.

[BronxBoy]

82. Well then.....

A lot of Black folks are batshit crazy because this is an issue that is being talked about by a lot of Black folks.

Disparage the messenger all you want but a lot of Black folk believe some that some vile, nasty shit went down in NOLA.

I got no problem with you slamming Farrakhan but isn't it interesting how a lot of conversation regarding NOLA lately has been centered around how New Orleans is never going to be a "Black" city again. Hell, there were quite a few threads on DU about it. I've seen the tinfoil raised in this place on less shit than saying the levees were bombed to get rid of Black folk.

You know it's funny, there's a big thread going on about how one poll revealed that Bush's support among Black's has dropped to 2% and all you hear is cheers. But when Farrakhan speaks about a topic that I suspect most of us Black Folk believe, right or wrong, then the topic turns to him and how when he speaks a message that resonates with a lot of Black Americans, he's BATSHIT CRAZY.

You know why Blacks feel taken to granted by the Democratic party, it's because of Bullshit like this. If Farrakhan had the ear of the majority of Black people in this country, he would be a major political force. He doesn't and he isn't. So why do you White people waste so much time and energy on him? A lot, probably a majority, of Black folk probably believes that the government bombed the levees. And in light of all the bullshit that's been heaped upon us in the days since Katrina hit, it would be hard not to buy into that if you're Black.

So what do you do, you speak to the messenger and not to the message. You know what Democrats better fear: that the 98% of Black Americans who detest Bush don't decide to sit on their asses in 2006 and 2008 because they think the Democratize party is run run by a bunch of pussies who couldn't put up when one of their most loyal constituencies was under fire.

Farrakhan is going to have the ear of millions of Black Americans this weekend. Millions of Black American's ears after Katrina. And you write a post about how is Farrakhan BATSHIT CRAZY. BATSHIT CRAZY after the thousands of images of Black suffering after Katrina. BATSHIT CRAZY after all of the horror stories of gang rape in the Superdome and kids getting their throats cut and stacked on freezers. BATSHIT CRAZY when Bill Bennett speaks openly of aborting ALL Black babies to reduce crime. BATSHIT CRAZY after the HUD director says NOLA will never again be a Black city.


Do me a favor, buy a fucking clue!

[Karenina]

83. You GO BronxBoy!!!

:toast:

[Catherine Vincent]

94. ....

:thumbsup:

[zanne]

95. Yes, Bronxboy!

Don't let them tell you there's no racism on DU.

[Marleyb]

97. BATSHIT CRAZY is a government who kills their own people....

and then uses it to make money, steal resources and kill more innocent people.

Farrakhan seems to know where it's at... "When you have people who politically feel that they get their advantage by killing people and blaming it on somebody else, then it makes us wonder what really happened to the Twin Towers (in New York City)," a reference to the terrorist strikes against the U.S. four years ago that brought down the World Trade Center.

"Was the heat from fuel from two airplanes sufficient to compromise the steel in that building? (sic) People had said they heard explosions and the buildings came down like we see old buildings in Vegas or in Florida or in other places, implode," Farrakhan said. "So who was the victor there? Who got the advantage there? It wasn’t the American people."

After 9/11, we all know what this government is capable of. Still, I wouldn't have been suspicious of foul play in New Orleans until I saw the purposeful holding back of resources by FEMA that could have saved lives, the way they treated people in the superdome and convention center, the way they collected the compassionate donations for victims and then sat on it(people still don't have the basic necessities), the immediate hiring of Halliburton while people were still dying, the hiring of the body snatcher company to do the body count, and yet after the official count people are still finding bodies, and then there is the separating of victims and sending them all over the country so that they will never come back. It sure seems like they were trying to make the flood such a hell on earth that no one would ever want to come back. And then you hear Nagin saying only large casinos will be allowed back in because the city needs the tax revenue. It seems clear they want a new playground for the rich.

There is something VERY FISHY about what went down in New Orleans. It seems like it was planned to me. The levees didn't break during the hurricane. The water did not rush over the levees. How exactly did they break? Has there been an investigation?

[ultraist]

103. BronxBoy:

:yourock:

[Robeson]

105. Great post BronxBoy. Your post ought to be put on the Greatest Page.

[Tomee450]

109. Thank you. You've

said it all and so well. I couldn't agree more.

[CatWoman]

112. Marry me, Bronx Boy!!!!!!

:D

damn good post!!!!

I'm giddy :D

[goclark]

133. I hereby nominate each and everyone of your posts Bronx Boy

I wish I could hit the recommend button on all your posts to this thread!

"Farrakhan is going to have the ear of millions of Black Americans this weekend. Millions of Black American's ears after Katrina. And you write a post about how is Farrakhan BATSHIT CRAZY. BATSHIT CRAZY after the thousands of images of Black suffering after Katrina. BATSHIT CRAZY after all of the horror stories of gang rape in the Superdome and kids getting their throats cut and stacked on freezers. BATSHIT CRAZY when Bill Bennett speaks openly of aborting ALL Black babies to reduce crime. BATSHIT CRAZY after the HUD director says NOLA will never again be a Black city. "

That is EXACTLY how Black America feels!
We are BATSHIT CRAZY about the way that our people have been treated right before our very EYES!

We don't have to inspect the levees, we have been sabotaged on national TV, crying to be rescued and treated like BATSHIT by our government!

[HamdenRice]

144. As they say in South Africa: Bua Mobuti!

That means "speak brother"!

If only 2% of black people support shrub, doesn't that mean that black people as a result of their direct experience of American reality, have a more accurate perception of this country and its politics than the majority?

[goclark]

150. Bua Mobuti !!! nt

[laruemtt]

86. i put NOTHING past this government

and its capacity for and willingness to do evil.

[LittleClarkie]

88. Well, hell, then some of the folks here are too

as they were saying the same.

[BronxBoy]

91. But Obviously

He has his own agenda...

[LittleClarkie]

92. oops, wrong thread

forgot where I was, sorry

[MrSlayer]

98. That is a perfectly sane theory compared to the "mothership" bullshit.

And the white man was made in a test tube drivel he spouts. Still, crazy as he may be, I enjoy the way he speaks. His speech about the Iraq war awhile ago was really good.

[JerseygirlCT]

100. This is news to you? He's a thorough whack-job. nt

[ultraist]

107. Regardless of what you think about Farrakhan

The theory is not "batshit crazy." I think it's very possible and probably likely. We already know that there was gross negligence that rises to the level of manslaughter in NOLA. Would something like this be out of the question? I think not.

BTW, I kinda like Farrakhan because he does scare the shit out of some whites. The Batshit crazy whites who are in denial need a little shaking up. Racist fucks.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

102. I'm Not A Big Fan Of His But Calling Him Names Is Unhelpful

Oh, if we can't criticize folks who say things we like to hear from time to time doesn't that make us hypocrites....

[CatWoman]

113. you know, reading this thread

it's obvious that a lot of you don't know jack shit.

I keep seeing these comments about the spaceship, test tubes, yadda, yadda, yadda.

Farrakhan comes on here frequently on local access cable.

In 10 years I have not hear any of that shit come out of his mouth.

NOT ONCE.

[Tomee450]

117. Thank you.

I've been listening to Farrakhan the last few years too and I've not heard any of those comments either.

[BronxBoy]

120. And these are the same people......

who get bent all out of fucking shape when we call Condi a fucking race traitor, uncle tommin bitch.

"Oh no" the posts say "We won't attract the Black vote if we use language like that!"

Give me a break! Farrakhan is going to have the ear of millions of Black folk (directly and indirectly) this weekend. If you support his message, you're grinning ear to ear. If you have problems with the man, then you better be hammering all the White people who support Bush because he has given Farrakhan a tunnel to people who wouldn't have given him the time of day before.

[goclark]

132. Tell it like it is CatWoman!

I sure wish everyone on this thread that says he is "crazy" would take a deep breath and really LISTEN to what he has been saying.

Really listen to what he says tomorrow, without the blinders and see if he says anything that is that scary.

It is amazing to me that once we have been conditioned by Bill O'Reilly that someone is "CRAZY' we believe him.

I think just the opposite. When Bill tells me that someone is crazy I laugh and say to my TV, " Look In The Mirror if you want to see "Crazy" Bill!"

I do not allow Bill OLielly and the MSM to control my mind.

If you asked me about Sen. Byrd ten/twenty years ago I would have dismissed him as a racist. I would not do that today.

I want my mind to continue to GROW UP. I don't want a Kindergarten mind forever. :)

[RebelOne]

135. Sorry, but I heard him speak yesterday.

Hannity played a tape of Farrakhan speaking about how he was taken up into the mother ship and met his long-dead teacher.

[oasis]

137. Sorry, but you should have read post #113 before responding to it.

Are you suggesting that the "tape" was recently recorded?

[CatWoman]

148. you sure it wasn't George Clinton or some member of Parliament?

[BronxBoy]

155. LOL

I gotta go roll a joint on that one!!!

:rofl:

[CatWoman]

158. bwahahahahaha

make my funk the p-funk :D

[BronxBoy]

162. Farrakahn...

ain't BATSHIT CRAZY.

He's got the BATSHIT CRAZY SHIT

The BC Shiznet!!!!

No wonder his hair was flying over the place this afternoon

[TahitiNut]

151. "Sorry"?? Really?

"Hannity played a tape"??? Well, golly! I guess if it was reported by Hannity it just has to be true, fair, and balanced!

[walldude]

115. I have heard Farrakhan speak on many occasions

and while he's no fan of the white man, many things he says are blown way out of proportion. I used to do satellite hookups for a local Muslim organization so they could watch his speeches. I had a pre-concieved notion of what I was going to hear and I was way off base. Especially after 9/11. He made a few speeches that could have been rants on DU. Mostly what Farrakhan is espousing is for black people to be more self reliant, more responsible, more self sufficiant and proud of their race. Nothing wrong with that.
Most white people can't even wrap their brains around what it's like to grow up poor and black in this country, and without a frame of reference I for one would certainly never attempt to judge anyone when I have no idea where they are coming from.
As far as the Levees are concerned Farrakhan is not the first person to make this claim, and I for one will not put anything past this government. You have to wonder when certain areas like the French Quarter had 1/10th the damage some of the other parishes did.

[Catherine Vincent]

118. Yes, a lot of folks are off base with what Minister Farrakhan says.

When my sister first joined the NOI, I would tell her some of the things that I hear about him and ask if it's true, and she would get upset and say that she have never heard him say such things.

[goclark]

134. Great post walldude! nt

[ralphwiggum]

124. interesting

what a crazy dude

[mountainvue]

126. It happened once before in 1927. n/t

[bluedawg12]

130. Yup, and in 1927 they flooded the poor wards.

Now, there is no proof of this, but still about 75% of the people in the shelters believe it happened thanks to Brownie and that great uniter Barsboy.

[JackRiddler]

138. What is the purpose of this post?

Calling a view crazy does not make it so.

Where's the argument that it's crazy that elements of a government that had done the same thing before in 1927 wouldn't do it again in 2005?

Smearing anything Farrahkan says as crazy. Smearing those who see Katrina as an induced exodus of the poor from an urban center with the Farrakhan label.

[CatWoman]

153. The author of this thread is proud that he voted for Ronald Reagan

over, as he refers to Jimmy Carter, Captain Peanut.

[Solly Mack]

139. reactions to Farrakhan amuse me greatly

Farrakhan is a surface scratcher - people are made up of layers of surfaces - ya never know what you might find (though sometimes you do - so you scratch - peel one layer off and then the next)

He does this with words - and words are a tool (sometimes a weapon)

You can listen or you can react - either way, he's got you...there is no avoiding him.

the more you excoriate him, the deeper he scratches
the more you ignore him, the longer he scratches

and since it's not him being scratched, it's not his surfaces being exposed

[earth mom]

141. So if you don't hear it from the Corporate Media whores it ain't true?

:sarcasm:

Frankly, this looks like another case of shooting the messenger, instead of the message. :eyes:

Gotta admit I know little of Farrakhan, but I believe his message TOTALLY. It's beyond possible especially in light of the despicable way they've treated the NOLA victims ever since Katrina.

I guess we should be grateful that the media AT LEAST honestly let the world see what was really going on in New Orleans before they put the lid on Pandora's box once again. Yeah, we should be grateful for that...I guess. :eyes:

Except...Pandoras box is alive and kicking....but the powers that be aren't willing to let us see it because then the truth about all the evils that they have perpetrated for YEARS upon the people of this country would be exposed for all of innocent, oblivious Middle America to see.

God forbid! Can't have that now can we?! :sarcasm:

[HamdenRice]

142. Farrakan may be crazy but even a broken clock is right twice a day ...

I agree Farrakan is crazy and has been for a long time. I also believe he was a conspirator in the murder of Malcolm X, so it is amazing to me that people give him any credibility.

But there are a lot of people who believe the levees were purposely breeched to save other areas. Historically this has happened before.

Most chillingly, in the week after Katrina, the Pacifica Radio network did a lot of interviews with survivors in NO who claimed to have heard explosions. Even the timing of the levee breech, after the storm had passed is strange.

Finally, the official engineering reports keep changing as reported in the MSM. By this I don't mean that the engineers are "conspirators"; it's that investigators are basically saying we can't figure out why the levees failed the way they did.

I personally don't believe that the levees were destroyed; but it certainly isn't crazy for a person to believe that they were, given the conflicting evidence out there.

[callady]

145. In 1927, the government did indeed explode the levees

And yes Louis is a bit of a megalomaniac. Both can be true.

Who owned the Barge?


In 1927, the government did indeed explode the levees to flood low-lying poor (read: black) neighborhoods in downriver New Orleans in order to save the uptown

The Great Mississippi Flood of 1927 was the most destructive river flood in United States history until the Hurricane Katrina flood of 2005.

The Mississippi River broke out of its levee system in 145 places and flooded 27,000 square miles or about 16,570,627 acres (70,000 km²). The area was inundated up to a depth of 30 feet (10 m). The flood caused over $400 million in damages and killed 246 people in seven states.

<snip>

As the flood approached New Orleans, Louisiana 30 tons of dynamite were set off on the levee at Caernarvon, Louisiana and sent 250,000 ft³/s (7,000 m³/s) of water pouring through. This prevented New Orleans from experiencing serious damage but destroyed much of the marsh below the city and flooded all of St. Bernard Parish. As it turned out, the destruction of the Caernarvon levee was unnecessary; several major levee breaks well upstream of New Orleans, including one the day after the dynamiting, made it impossible for flood waters to seriously threaten the city.

By August 1927 the flood subsided. During the disaster 700,000 people were displaced, including 330,000 African-Americans who were moved to 154 relief camps. Over 13,000 refugees near Greenville, Mississippi were gathered from area farms and evacuated to the crest of an unbroken levee, and stranded there for days without food or clean water, while boats arrived to evacuate white women and children. Many African-Americans were detained and forced to labor at gunpoint during flood relief efforts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Mississippi_Flood_of...

[Solomon]

146. The thing that did it for me was when I saw pictures a New Orleans

resident posted of the hurricane on the internet. The tv coverage made it seem like the hurricane really devastated New Orleans, but I was taken aback by the pictures. The hurricane itself appeared to do little structural damage. All the buildings were still intact, etc. Not even roofs blown off of buildings downtown. The crisis was over. A lot of the pictures were taken before the levees "broke".

In fact, if you remember, it was actually before the flooding when all the reports of the looting became "important". It was important to them because there was actually no structural damage to the buildings in New Orleans. Everyone thought the crisis was over. People were in the streets. But then the flooding came after the levees "broke".

From looking at those pictures I became convinced that the hurricane did not actually cause the kind of damage that the tv coverage implied. And I knew in my heart that something wicked could be easily achieved with the hurricane as the excuse. In fact, I call it, the same as with 911 - "Disaster in the planning". They been waiting with bated breath for a hurricane to come near New Orleans. They got their wish. Another major oil port seized, and military combat operations authorized on US soil. Fat contracts to re-build, etc. In fact, they got so much out of the flooding, that it's hard not to see that them helping it along.

[DemonFighterLives]

147. No matter what you think of Farrakhan

This is a complete possibility. I heard the rumors before and they kind of subsided or were buried. Farrakhan gives the rumor a little more credence and exposure. Just yesterday on Big Eddy's show, a caller thought it funny that Condi and many of our helicopters were in Pakistan just days after the quake, but it took these same assholes a week to reach NO. That is screwed up and shows where dubco places it's priorities. After the danger has passed now dubya can't get enough of NO.

Some here ought to listen to Farrakhan instead of repeating the Hannitys of the world. He is intelligent and I won't even go so far as to call him crazy. Occasionally he slips into his own state of racism, but I can excuse that just to hear the rest of what he has to say.

He has the ear of millions today and I hope he crashes dubby's party. It is time to reveal that the worst people exist in the administration and not in the opposition.
:dem:

[goclark]

149. Millions of People Share Your View

and they will be listening closely to what he says about the Bush Crime Family.


The enemy is not Farrakan,don't get it twisted, the enemy is in the WH.

[peacebaby3]

160. Nation of Islam is listed as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law

Center because they are separatists, etc.

Here is a little about what they have regarding Nation of Islam and Louis Farrakhan.

Louis Farrakhan and Race-Based Hate
In an April 1997 interview, Nation leader Louis Farrakhan made it clear that he had renounced none of the anti-white, anti-Semitic, anti-Catholic or anti-homosexual views of the previous Nation leader, Elijah Mohammed.

Those beliefs include the view that Yacub, a renegade black scientist, created whites 6,600 years ago as an inherently evil and ungodly people — "blue-eyed devils." Farrakhan describes Catholics and Jews, who he says practice a "gutter religion," as preying on blacks. He regrets the "tone" of a principal subordinate who calls for slaughtering white South Africans, but agrees with the message. He calls for racial separatism and inveighs against interracial relationships.

If a white group espoused similar beliefs with the colors reversed, few would have trouble describing it as racist and anti-Semitic. We hesitate with a group like the Nation of Islam because we recognize that its racism is largely a response to white racism.

But as Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. once said: "Violence begets violence; hate begets hate; and toughness begets a greater toughness. It is all a descending spiral, and the end is destruction — for everybody. Along the way of life, someone must have enough sense and morality to cut off the chain of hate."

If we seek to expose white hate groups, we cannot be in the business of explaining away the black ones.

<http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?aid=448>

He also was in a very pleasant relationship with Tom Metzger, a well-known white supremacist and leader of the KKK, because they both had the same goal. Farrakhan even accepted money from Metzger and the Klan.

I have met Rev. Farrakhan in person and while I can appreciate some of the things he says and does, there is no doubt he is a racist. If you are going to speak out against racism, then speak out against all racism.

As far as the levees go. I have stood by the levees and wondered how the hell they were still standing. When those waters from the storm surge from Katrina (I saw it myself living on the Gulf Coast) hit those levees, there would be no need to blow them up. It was a disaster waiting to happen. Racism and poverty definitely played a role before and after with regard to how those levees were maintained and the response to the disaster but no bombing was needed. Hurricane Katrina storm surge took care of those levees.

[noiretextatique]

172. i think the splc got it right about the NOI

"we recognize that its racism is largely a response to white racism"
but that doesn't mean the the NOI is any way the equivalent of the KKK, a group that was once a manistream organization in america and was allowed to do its business (murdering and terrorizing blacks and anyone who wasn't white) with the approval of law enforcement and politicians. as we know now, in some areas, law enforcement WAS (and is) the KKK.

in contrast, the NOI has never had the kind of acceptance or legitimacy in america, not among blacks, and certainly not among whites. that makes it a very differernt animal than the KKK. having said that, i agree the the splc.

[pattim]

163. What I'm most shocked about is that some DUers believe him.

No proof whatsoever, no evidence whatsoever, nothing other than "you can't prove they DIDN'T!"

I submit that Democrats blew up the levees so as to use memories of the ensuing chaos as fodder in the '06 elections. Prove that this assertion is more ridiculous than Farrakhan's. If it is submitted that "Bush hates black people and Dems don't," I submit "Democrats want to keep blacks poor so they keep voting for them" in response, as I find the statements of an equally vapid intellectual calibre.

[oasis]

164. What I'm most shocked about is that some DUers believe it couldn't be.

"Couldn't be"???? hmmm. Let's see now.Stolen elections, lying about WMD to invade Iraq, Lying about 9-11.

There seems to be quite a list of events that "couldn't be" before the era of the Chimperor.

[Robeson]

166. It's not fair to bash DU'ers, just because some of them don't trust....

...Republicans as much as you do.....

[HamdenRice]

169. No proof whatsoever???

I think you mean to say no evidence whatsoever, because the question is whether this is a debatable by reasonable people or just "crazy."

In fact, there is evidence, even if it is not conclusive proof. The Pacifica Radio network ran lots of on the ground coverage in the wake of Katrina from NO. They interviewed people live, on air who said they heard explosions before the levees failed.

I don't believe that the levees were purposefully destroyed, but I don't believe it is crazy to believe they might have been. There is evidence for both sides.

Unless of course, you believe that what poor black eyewitnesses have to say has no credibility value whatsoever, which is what you seem to be suggesting.

[noiretextatique]

171. do you believe bush, inc?

as someone mentioned, they are the folks who stole at least one election, either let 911 happen on purpose or made it happen on purpose, started and illegal war based on complete lies, endanger the life of a covert operative to get back at her husband, continue to fill the coffers of cheny's companies with no-bid contracts, etc., etc., etc. and given their lack of response to the victims of katrina, that anyone still supports this regime is evidence and proof of dumb far too many americans are. vapid intellectual caliber, indeed.

[halsaxby]

165. I wonder if he's not crazy like s fox.

He knows that if he keeps spouting off bizarre BS, none of the powers that be are going to take him too seriously. Look what happened to Malcolm X and MLK.

[DemBones DemBones]

174. THAT is the sort of statement I associate with

ignorant, racist, white Republicans. So why is it here on DU???

Black people who suspect that the levees were dynamited to flood the Ninth Ward may be wrong but they are neither "batshit crazy" nor paranoid. When you belong to a group that's been treated badly by another group, you can't help but be suspicious of the actions of that group. (For that matter, many whites, myself included, are suspicious of all that happened in NOLA.)

When you know that the government deliberately flooded the Ninth Ward in 1927, why wouldn't you suspect them to be capable of doing it again? It's not as if the government hasn't done anything to harm blacks -- and the poor of any race -- in the years since. The entire government doesn't have to be involved in such an atrocity, either.

It wasn't the entire government that failed the people of New Orleans, that left them for days without food, water, sanitation, or medical care. But it sure as hell happened. And it happened to the poor and overwhelmingly to the poor who were black.

Has it occurred to you to ask WHY the black evacuees have been scattered across 40 states, hundreds of miles from their homes? Are you unaware that they lived in Orleans Parish, the only solidly Democratic parish in the state? Connect the dots.

[Tomee450]

176. Exactly!

"THAT is the sort of statement I associate with
ignorant, racist, white Republicans. So why is it here on DU???"

It appears that some posters on this forum share some of the same views as those Republicans you describe when the issue involves race. They don't care to listen to the blacks who post here. They are not at all interested in seeing the world from an African American perspective. It doesn't matter what facts you present, what history you tell, it is all dismissed and they go right on with their spiel which often reflect bias and/ or cluelessness.

[Karenina]

177. assumptions of superiority and/or white privilege.

:SIGH: