OK. So Who Ordered The Soldiers To Lie?

[ProfessorGAC]

In an earlier thread, the following facts were set out:

1) The photo-op appeared scripted.
2) The satellite feed of the rehearsals were discovered.
3) The MSM is now hammering that they KNOW the thing was scripted.
4) Prior to the release of that video by MSM, soliders told reporters it wasn't scripted.
5) The White House has admitted it was scripted.

So, the following blank is not yet filled. How could soldiers who were reading from a script and rehearsing the bit, not know the thing was scripted? The answer is they can't.

So the big questions: Who ordered those soldiers to lie to the reporters and how far up the CofC do those orders go?

Somebody tried to lie to the press and the whole of the american people and ORDERED soldiers in Iraq to participate in the lie. I want to know "WHO DONE IT?"
The Professor

[Debau2005]

1. According to the Today Show this morning

Supposedly the White House knew nothing about this being scripted!
:spray:

[ProfessorGAC]

3. Then The Other Thread Was Wrong

Sorry, but that was one of the points in the other thread. If it's wrong, then it's wrong.

However, how could they not know it was scripted if they rehearsed it? What exactly were they rehearsing, aside from the script? How to use a microphone?
The Professor

[Debau2005]

9. No, I am not saying that

the I think the WH did not know, I was just repeating what the WH told the Today show. I absolutely believe that * knew. One of the excuses given to have it scripted, was the time difference and the satellite delay, so that soldiers would know what to expect.

[Neecy]

15. Then why was Bush reading from a script?

If you watch it again (hard, I know - it was so gruesome) you'll see Bush looking down at pages on the podium before every "question" and in one case he read directly from his notes.

It was certainly "scripted" from the WH end of it - and given the prompting of the soldiers beforehand, they too were "scripted". Had nothing to do with the satellite feed - it was another dog and pony show, period.

[Debau2005]

16. Well

You don't expect the WH to admit they are idiots even when caught? Look at Scotty's attempt at a Press Conference yesterday!! hahaha

I finally had to turn it off, I laughed so hard I had the hiccups!

[Neecy]

22. I know...

I kept waiting for someone to ask Scotty if DoD had given Bush his script. I mean, he was reading directly from it. How can the White House claim ignorance that it was entirely scripted? It's like, who will the public believe, Scotty or their lyin' eyes?

They really do think we're stupid.

[notadmblnd]

28. exactly, how can he have his answers ready.....

if he doesn't know what the questions are? Spokespeople for the WH tried to say it wasn't scripted, just choreographed. Doesn't seem to me to be much of a difference. Besides, how many people do you know (other than bush) that stumble over words that contain more than 4 syllables when they are speaking naturally?

[ProfessorGAC]

17. Ah! I Misread Your Other Post

Then we're in complete agreement.
The Professor

[Debau2005]

21. He could not even

keep the earpiece in his ear for heavens sake. He is just a buffoon!

[shoelace414]

4. they also said they knew nothing about the mission accomplished thing

until they were finally caught red handed.

[peekaloo]

6. Yes. They wanted the soldiers to prep so they could appear

"articulate" before the Commander In Sleep. I laughed out loud at that excuse.

This was after showing that Pentagram witch telling the one guy how to breathe, as if to appear natural. It was also funny that they prepared a go-to guy in case the Dunce went off script.

:rofl:

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

29. Since Bush had to deliver the scripted questions, it's not possible for

the White House not to have known. That's ridiculous on its face.

[CottonBear]

2. My guess is the WH spoke w/ Rummy who gave orders to the military command

to order the soldiers to cooperate with the organizers of the staged event. The soldiers did what they were ordered to do, which apparently included lying to the press when asked about the staging.

[ProfessorGAC]

5. Not Blaming The Soliders

Not at all. But, somewhere, someone must be accountable for intentionally lying to the american people. Remember during the late 90's, "It's not about the sex, it's about the lying." Well, the shoe's on the other foot now.
The Professor

[SoFlaJet]

8. or risk

ending up in GITMO or next to the soldiers who were ORDERED to torture Abu Ghirab detainees

[matt819]

7. You think we'll see a CNN website poll?

Here's the question:

Who do you think scripted and directed the * teleconference with the soliders?
*
Rummy
Some low-level enlisted person in Baghdad - we don't know who, but he is no higher than a Pfc - who did this on his own and did not clear it with his superiors, who knew nothing - we repeat, nothing - about the scripting of the event, even though everyone was caught in rehearsals. And, besides, the American people are stupid.

[Birthmark]

10. A more interesting and perhaps more important...

...question is who allowed the rehearsal to go out into the ether to be picked up by the news organizations? The answer to that might be quite interesting and informative. :)

[LynnTheDem]

31. REUTERS. THey're not very happy about all their dead reporters

shot by US troops, and the 3 Reuters reporters bush ordered "disappeared" in Iraq.

Fuck with the media at your own risk.

:)

[emulatorloo]

53. whoever did it probably is getting fired. . .EOM

[HereSince1628]

11. The WH is NEVER going to risk a live unscripted

conversation.

Frankly I think its more interesting to ask why the press would make a big deal of this now.

The reality is that these things have been going on for years and years. Every Sunday the talking heads show up with practiced lines and intended messages, and it is passed off as a live unscripted interview.

Why does the media need to look tough now? Is this a response to Katrina's pulling back the curtain? Bush's low poll numbers? Or is the press setting themselves up to look able to handle a coming storm from Plamegate?

[ProfessorGAC]

14. Blood In The Water, My Friend

This idiot has been given a free pass since 9/11. If that hadn't happened, he would have vilified in the press for the buffoon he is. That free pass extended all the way until so many things got so screwed up that the american people are, in great majority, no longer fooled.

The press is now free to be the press, because the puppet masters at the media conglomerates now see no profitability risk in dumping on Silverspoon. The risk of being complicit is greater than the risk of dumping on a Repub prez.

Besides, these companies are not doing particularly well in cash flow and P&L analyses. So, maybe some of the bean counters have figured out that there is no advantage, business-wise, to having a Republican empty suit in office.
The Professor

[HereSince1628]

20. Follow the money is always good advice...

is it for advertising profit (which I guess is where my earlier questions fall), or because the pay-offs stopped, or are now being paid by someone demanding to hear a different tune?

[ProfessorGAC]

25. I Don't Buy Pay-offs

The profitability cannot be compromised by being complicit. I'll even give them a pass for the truce after 9/11. OK, it went on WAY too long, but i at least understand that they could not risk seeming hostile, because of the competitive risk.

Now, they can look at their own statements and see that playing nice with this gang has not benefited their bottom lines. They can look at the polls and see 62% (5 out of 8) are not supporting this idiot.

There's now money to be made from exposing this gang of thugs, and they're going to operate in their own self-interest.
The Professor

[catmandu57]

23. This has been the most staged

bunch I've ever seen, from the time someone decided to run the chimp* they have done nothing but write scripts, many have backfired, but, they've been able to dodge the bullets so far.
Up till now anyway.

Have you noticed someone put the term choreographed out instead of staged? maybe because the American people understand that staged implies a scripted fantasy, made to order.

You're right Professor we need to follow the lie up the ladder, maybe there is a special group like whig that people should know about, instead of follow the money we follow the lie.

[ProfessorGAC]

26. Empty Suit

Anybody who still thinks Silverspoon is in charge, or ever has been, is dumber than dirt, and they'll never get it.

The best we can hope for at this point, is that, at least for a while, the major parties will learn that they need to run a real leader and someone who understands and is interested in the mechanics of government and society.

No more dim-bulb puppets would be a good thing.
The Professor

[PA Democrat]

12. Who was the woman who was coaching the soldiers?

I didn't catch her title. Was she part of the DOD or the White House staff? Anyone know?

Also I noticed that Bush apparently strayed from HIS script which really threw the soldiers off. There were a number of questions that he asked, to which the soldiers responded with answers that really didn't match the question. Very odd.

And that Iraqi soldier who said, "I likes yous" was a hoot. The whole thing came off like a SNL skit, complete with the part where Bush loudly drops his ear piece.

[Ilsa]

24. Her last name is Barber, and she is a Pentagon

DoD Rumsfeld flunkie. Understudy PR person.

I can understand that they need to choreograph who needs to speak when, in what order, etc. But to claim it was unscripted was absurd. These people are bad actors. ANd you guys are right: they should never let Bush have a mike without a script.

[ProfessorGAC]

27. Why?

Sorry Ilsa, but i don't buy it. They could give the soldiers, in an unscripted, unrehearsed session one direction: When the director ("This guy right here") points at you, ask your question. That's it.

That requires no rehearsal, no scripting, nothing. Of course, that would mean the soldiers were allowed to ask their own questions, and we know that didn't happen either.
The Professor

[annabanana]

39. the soldiers weren't asking..

they were "answering" ..

[ProfessorGAC]

41. Same Question

That a distinction without a difference. You know what i meant.

When a question is asked, the director points. The soldier he points at answers. End of direction necessary. No rehearsal are required no matter who's asking and who's answering.

The only reason to have a rehearsal is to go over the script.

The Professor

[whatever4]

13. I watched that press conference with Scotty, DOD done it

And he said, repeatedly, DOD. I don't know how many times, but it had to be at least half a dozen.

In fact, he was asked, repeatedly, and kept on trying to insist there was no scripting. He was hounded over it, and, it's pretty telling that the story is the scripting, and not of how hard the WH tried to deny it. It's a story all by itself; THEN WHY DID YOU TRY TO LIE ABOUT IT SCOTTY???

I don't think he actually ever admitted to it, in fact. I didn't hear him admit to scripting in that conference. I hooted LOUD and LONG when CNN came out as said they did. Said it anyway. Near as I can see, they never did actually admit to it, and I'm left wondering if CNN, since they had footage of the soldiers being coached, just went ahead and said they admitted to it? Did CNN climb out on a limb with this one?? Did CNN hit them with their own "I'll lie and you go ahead and try to prove me wrong...but I'm CNN, fat good luck on making America believe WE lied and YOU told the truth.." Because I never heard them admit to the scripting of it, did anyone else hear the WH admit to it? Seriously, I never heard Scotty fess up. He went WAY out on trying to NOT admit to it. They tried REAL hard to lie about this, it ought to be attacked as well.

What he basically said, was, DOD done it. Ask them. Ask the DOD. And that's all he would say. He point blank denied it was scripted, and said DOD, ask them.

So, who told the DOD, or, did they dream it up themselves? That's the question for me.

Aside from Scotty lying about the scripting, trying so hard to lie even though the facts were right there. Front of god and everybody; why lie Scotty?

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

45. It couldn't be just the DoD because BUSH delivered half the script! (the

questions)

[whatever4]

54. yup

But that's exactly what he said, old Scotty, at least half a dozen times in front of I don't know how many reporters.

He flat out denied the WH scripted the interview, and he said the DOD did all the selection and any prep for the soldiers.

While he was busy being mad at the lovely Ms Thomas, and saying how very qualified MS Miers is, and religion is a side issue, side issue, side issue...and he forgot what pejorative meant

[lpbk2713]

18. Herr Goebels is alive and well.

[ProfessorGAC]

19. Apparently

Or at least some of his disciples.
The Professor

[BrotherBuzz]

51. Splitting hairs here, but they are disciples of Leo Strauss

Never mind the fact that Leo Strauss lifted the blueprints from Herrs Hermann Goering and Joseph Goebbel. I'm just saying.

;)

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

30. Basically, here's my guess on how it works. Senior officer, likely some

Col. or General, picks a group of officers and enlisted that he KNOWS are wingnut shrub supporters already.

Calls them into some private meeting. Tell them he has something important for them to do for the emperor, and goes over what they want out of the briefing.

Wingnut soldiers happily memorize and deliver their lines.

Because the selected soldiers are dedicated wingnuts, they will never narc out the scheme, even when it's exposed like this, they'll say stupid shit like it's spontaneous, my own thoughts etc.

Nothing on paper (heh, script sheets shredded by now). No orders or anything.

Not that complicated really.

[ProfessorGAC]

34. And Who Told Your Colonel Or General

I'm shooting high. I don't care about the soldiers involved. I'll assume they did just do what they were told/asked. Who set it up? Who told the General what to do? Who was willing to set up this deal that would have had to, from moment one, involve lying and deception?

Who's the general? Who gave him his orders? Someone needs to be accountable.
The Professor

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

37. Rove thru Rummy. All telephone/verbal. Nothing in writing.

[ProfessorGAC]

38. Then The Reporters Should Be Doing Their Jobs

Get one person, off the record, and corroboration. Put it in the papers. The people need to know this was a high level deception.
The Professor

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

40. The thing is, Prof, that everything in the whole shrub presidency has been

fake and scripted like this. Everything. Example all the fake town hall meetings on Social Security etc.

The big difference with this one is that:

1) The charade was actually exposed, and on TV no less, to show the actual rehearsal, revealing "the man behind the curtain"

2) Big media, both network and cable, actually REPORTED on the fakery and exposure.

All the other fakery has been exposed and discussed ad nauseum here and on various blogs etc. but has had very little exposure to the wide wingnut audience.

It gets a little harder to deny when you are staring at video of "Allison" telling Capt. Kenny or whoever, that if the questions run off script, "that'll be your chance to shine. And that won't be a problem for you, will it?"

[ProfessorGAC]

42. Perhaps I'm Not Making My Real Point Properly

The story isn't the scripting. The story is WHO SET IT UP! Now that the blood is in the water and the reporters are now able to report the warts, it's time to get off their 5 year vacation and do some real reporting. Find out WHO did this, all the way to the top.

The blood is the water for these people. Time for them to attack without worrying about access. Access to felons, liars, and thieves is nothing on which to base a career. Exposing felons, liars, and thieves is the basis for a journalism career.

My primary point is, time for the reporters to finally do their job. It's all laid out for them. They just have to follow the trail.
The Professor

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

46. Now I understand your point. The answer is, most likely some group that

has been the same people all along, who've scripted the town hall meetings, carrier landing, all of it.

Almost certainly headed either directly or indirectly by Rove, since he's the politics/PR/image/Goebbels guy in a propaganda presidency.

It would be logistically very difficult to run these events with a different group each time, so there's little doubt that Rove probably has a smallish group of people with one or a few key lieutenants to coordinate these things and take care of logistics.

One way to crack into this would be through the Armstrong Williams scenario. Since it's been declared that law was broken there, and U.S. taxpayer money fraudulently spent in this propaganda scheme, there would be grounds for an actual investigation, judicial or congressional, that could start to uncover some of the bugs under some of the rocks.

[ProfessorGAC]

47. Plenty Of Vermin Under Those Rocks

The Professor

[goodboy]

32. Here are the TWO biggest LIES>>>

LIE: "You've got tremendous support here at home," Bush said.


Just days before Iraqi voters cast ballots on the draft constitution, 50% of respondents told Pew the decision to go to war was wrong -- up from 44 percent in September.

Roughly the same number said the United States should bring home its forces as soon as possible -- 48 percent -- as keep them there until Iraq is stable -- 47 percent.
__________________________________________
LIE: On the training of Iraqi security forces, Master Sgt. Corine Lombardo from Scotia, N.Y., said to Bush: "I can tell you over the past 10 months, we've seen a tremendous increase in the capabilities and the confidences of our Iraqi security force partners. ... Over the next month, we anticipate seeing at least one-third of those Iraqi forces conducting independent operations."

WASHINGTON (AFP) - The top US commander in
Iraq disclosed that only a single Iraqi battalion is capable of independent operations and acknowledged conditions may worsen there even if a constitution is approved.



http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20050929/wl_mideast_afp/usiraq

[spanone]

33. Who else? Their commander-in-thief

[Ganja Ninja]

35. It wouldn't surprise me if the soldiers used in this photo op ...

were blackmailed. They probably waved their transfer papers in front of them promising them a chance to go home in exchange for cooperation.

[whatever4]

36. Here's a couple articles about it, "choreographed to match his goals"

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/101405Z.shtml
Bush Teleconference with Soldiers Staged
The Associated Press

Friday 14 October 2005

Washingotn - It was billed as a conversation with U.S. troops, but the questions President Bush asked on a teleconference call Thursday were choreographed to match his goals for the war in Iraq and Saturday's vote on a new Iraqi constitution.

"This is an important time," Allison Barber, deputy assistant defense secretary, said, coaching the soldiers before Bush arrived. "The president is looking forward to having just a conversation with you."

Barber said the president was interested in three topics: the overall security situation in Iraq, security preparations for the weekend vote and efforts to train Iraqi troops.

As she spoke in Washington, a live shot of 10 soldiers from the Army's 42nd Infantry Division and one Iraqi soldier was beamed into the Eisenhower Executive Office Building from Tikrit - the birthplace of former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein.

"I'm going to ask somebody to grab those two water bottles against the wall and move them out of the camera shot for me," Barber said.

A brief rehearsal ensued.

***********************************************
http://www.rawstory.com/ link
Compliments to Bush were entirely staged

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051013/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_iraq_8
WASHINGTON - It was billed as a conversation with U.S. troops, but the questions President Bush asked on a teleconference call Thursday were choreographed to match his goals for the war in
Iraq and Saturday's vote on a new Iraqi constitution.

"This is an important time," Allison Barber, deputy assistant defense secretary, said, coaching the soldiers before Bush arrived. "The president is looking forward to having just a conversation with you."

[ProfessorGAC]

43. So, Now The Troops Are Props For Silverspoon

That's even worse.
The Professor

[charlie]

48. They always were

Even if they have to be press-ganged into doing it. The carrier that was used for the Mission Accomplished deck landing had its home port call rescheduled to accomodate Dubya -- family reunions for 1000s were delayed. Hundreds of soldiers had Thanksgiving MREs when Bush shut down the Baghdad mess hall for all but the preselected, who got to enjoy his Plastic Turkey extravaganza.

[ProfessorGAC]

49. You're Right! Doesn't Make It Less Sickening

Actually makes it more sickening, now that i think about it.

So, supporting the troops and HONORING THEIR SERVICE includes using them as political props. Interesting definition of honor, wouldn't you say?
The Professor

[charlie]

52. The dissonance

should've been scraping metal off the mental gears of anyone who's paid the least bit of attention. These years of Playalong With the Leader remind me of nothing less than the mass insanities of the Mao regime -- the Great Leap Forward, Cultural Revolution, et al. It's been fucking frightening.

[Whoa_Nelly]

44. When the female Specialist began speaking, she was thrown off script by *

<snip>
On the training of Iraqi security forces, Master Sgt. Corine Lombardo from Scotia, N.Y., said to Bush: "I can tell you over the past 10 months, we've seen a tremendous increase in the capabilities and the confidences of our Iraqi security force partners. ... Over the next month, we anticipate seeing at least one-third of those Iraqi forces conducting independent operations."

My words here:
It was at the beginning of Lombardo speaking that she mentioned the Nov. 11, 2001 New York event. Bush caught her off guard by asking if she had been there. She momentarily looked confused, stumbled twice in trying to stick to the script, said her scripted lines, and then Bush asked her again if she had been at the 2001 event. She responded she had. He followed this with the stupid response about her looking familiar, and then, per egocentric usual, Bush had to turn the whole thing back to himself by "joking", "I bet I look familiar to you, too...hahahaha!". It was at that point when it became extremely clear that the entire teleconference was disingenuous.

<snip>
Lombardo told the president that she was in New York City on Nov. 11, 2001, when Bush attended an event recognizing soldiers for their recovery and rescue efforts at Ground Zero. She said the troops began the fight against terrorism in the wake of the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks and were proud to continue it in Iraq.

"I thought you looked familiar," Bush said, and then joked: "I probably look familiar to you, too."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051013/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_iraq_8&printer=1

[catmandu57]

50. Somehow the name andrew card

keeps popping into my head, isn't this his venue? He's probably keeping kkkarl's chair warm right now, someone should be looking at who he's been keeping company with.