Surviving the Bird Flu

[ck4829]

Take it from me, I am aspiring to get a degree in Biology, so I believe I know what I am talking about.

People are really panicking about the flu, but it is actually quite easy to survive it, just remember these things.

1. Wash your hands on a regular basis
2. Don't get up in the face of people with the flu, try to give them about a sneeze range of extra personal space

If you get the flu

1. Drink fluids
2. Get lots of rest
3. Relax (no, really, relax. Getting stressed out about these kinds of things will compromise your immune system)
4. Don't panic if you think you get a MUTATED strain of flu (because it seems as though there are some people who DO want you to panic). If you have ever got the flu, chances are, it's probably a very mutated strain to begin with

People will survive the flu, but if Bush declares martial law because of it, I'm not sure our nation will.

[Skittles]

1. I work in a job requiring me to use lots of different keyboards and phones

I keep some of that hand sanitizer stuff around - do you think that stuff does any good?

[ck4829]

4. Yes

Is the sanitizer anti-viral?

[Skittles]

23. yes, I do look for anti-viral

I work 12 hour shifts and nightly I wipe down the phones, keyboards, work spaces, etc.

[in_cog_ni_to]

2. But this particular strain of the flu

attacks the respiratory system like gangbusters and that is what's so problematic about it. People's lungs will fill with fluid and nothing can help them. The medications won't work.

[eShirl]

9. exactly

People who have contracted it from birds are walking around perferctly fine, then within a matter of hours passing out and too weak to help themselves very much. It hits fast and it hits much harder than any flu in recent memory.

[meow mix]

35. brain too

there are victims who died with healthy lungs. its pretty scary

[Mnemosyne]

3. I've been reading a bit about elderberry

as a natural protector/possible treatment of flu. I'll see if I can find the bookmark. I can't trust any vaccine they may create for it. Have you heard anything on this?

I'm with you on your last statement ck, I am not sure our nation would survive * and his further power grab if it hits. He's caused such suffering already, but is capable of so much more. Do anarchy and chaos ring any bells?

[Mrs. Overall]

25. Sambucol is an elderberry extract that is both anti-bacterial

and antiviral. You can find it in several different forms through Nature's Way, an herbal and vitamin company. It greatly reduces the effects of the flu and shortens the time you are ill. If you take it before you get the flu, it strengthens the immune system.

[Mnemosyne]

26. so I'm on the right track with this then pax? Thanks!

But does it help with ANY kind of flu?

And a belated welcome to DU! Sorry I've missed you before.:hi:

[Mrs. Overall]

28. It is my understanding that it does help with any kind of flu,

but, of course, it's not a cure--it just reduces the duration and the symptoms. It also helps with other types of upper respitory ailments, like sinus infections and colds.

Thanks for the welcome. I've actually been a DUer for a number of years--I just mostly read and rarely post!

[Mnemosyne]

29. Thanks much for the info pax. The

worst parts (respiratory) of the flu are the most dangerous and the best ones to ease. It could help save a few lives anyway. I'm going to try to stock some, just in case.

[Mrs. Overall]

31. The best (most inexpensive) place to purchase Sambucol

is on iherb (www.iherb.com). Their website setup and search engine aren't the greatest, but if you just type in Sambucol it will take you to the products. Also if you have an order of over $40.00, the shipping is free and usually arrives within two days of the order.
Good luck!

[Mnemosyne]

32. Thanks so much, great link!

I definitely need as low cost as possible with the coming natural gas bills.

[mzteris]

34. echinacea and goldenseal works with everything else

like colds, etc......

Maybe I should break the old herb book out.

[Paradise]

5. Home-grown terra (sic)... n/t

[Vanje]

6. Very good advice, but more important.......

Avoid spending time with sick birds.

So far the disease is not readily transmissable between persons. Most sick people have gotten the bird flu from working with poultry.

[noonwitch]

7. Also, take your vitamins and eat healthy all year round

If you get plenty of vitamin c in your diet and other important nutrients, it will boost your immune system and help you fight off any virus you do catch.

If you work with kids, make sure that they and you frequently wash hands. Wash hands in very hot, soapy water after changing diapers. Don't go swimming with sick kids (I caught a nasty virus from my brother's kids that way once)-all that chlorine still doesn't kill all viruses.

[whatever4]

8. I agree, with what you said

But from what I understand, the fatalities from this flu are high, high even with healthy people who do all the right things. This strain seems to be particularly hard on people, and, that's why they're so worried about it. It's not a typical strain of flu. Not only do we not have the immunities for it, but, the fatalities have averaged higher. I forget the number, but what it means is they're expecting many deaths from it, even from those that would make it through a normal flu season.

As you say, all normal rules for avoiding contact and spreading of germs applies. It's just that, more people are going to die, no matter what.

I agree VERY much with your last statement,
"People will survive the flu, but if Bush declares martial law because of it, I'm not sure our nation will". I agree wholeheartedly.

Can I just add, anyone that ever had thoughts of emigrating, getting away from our crazy nation, permanently or until the madness subsides...get out now. Now is the time.

When "they" start to whisper rumors that they won't LET you leave...is the time to leave. The time has come. All those that were thinking about it. I'd say, my humble opinion, is that THAT was the warning shot you were waiting for. It is time. Run. If you have a mind, and a will to do it, run. Save yourselves and your children. Remind them of us, and what we once were. Don't let them forget what was done, in our names, to the world. Keep the history. Don't feel guilt over it, don't feel unpatriotic or less American; if this admin has it's way, you might be the only "true" Americans left; they'll have no place for us HERE but jail or six feet under. If we get decent burial. Feel no guilt, no shame, you ARE true Americans if you flee for your lives and welfare of your families. You might be the only true Americans left, one day, if they have their way.

If you had a mind to run, now is the time, is how I really feel. Have no shame.

[mzteris]

18. Except

**Can I just add, anyone that ever had thoughts of emigrating, getting away from our crazy nation, permanently or until the madness subsides...get out now. Now is the time. ***

Where's the safest place to go?

We're seriously considering a job offer in Taiwan - but I'm not so really concerned if that's the best place to be. I mean, it's VERY crowded and not so hygenic anyways and their medical system is so-so at best. With the very crowded conditions, transmission would be like wildfire, wouldn't it? Hubby says I'm worrying needlessly but I'm not so sure. (I've been reading SF/doomsday books for a very long time.)

At least here, I can live pretty isolated in my house, stock up on canned goods and just stay away from people as much as humanly possible. Though how the bills will get paid is another question, isn't it?

[whatever4]

21. Thats my biggest question as well

It's easy to say, just get out of the country, but to do it? Not so easy, and very expensive, and in the end like you said, where to go??

I know exactly what you mean, about staying here. What worries me is, they might not let us STAY safely in our homes, isolated and not involved with anything. That's what bothers me. We're all numbers in this country, most all of us are IN the system...we won't be impossible to find, to account for, to question.

Allowing us to live safe, with food stocks, it might not be what they have in mind. And, if it's legal to rip us out of our homes, to cart us away somewhere else, for ANY reason (Katrina, disaster anyone, floods, droughts, can I count the ways, flu...gotta go...now GET OUT! with guns pointed...like Katrina) we'll have no recourse. I'm not up for fighting our own armed troops, and, I never will be. They'll always have strength, superior weapons, and numbers on their side. And the law. There will be no fighting them. Only losing to them.

If they lied and tried to quarantine for no good reason, will the rest of the nation know what's going on, or will they get away with it?

I look at Katrina. I think they'd get away with it. I say, if you have a mind, folks, GET OUT OF HERE if you've got a place to go!!

I don't know what to tell you about Taiwan, because I'm sure I know less than you do. Culture shock for sure. But safer than here? I have no idea. No idea where to run. I'm afraid of running to Canada. I don't think they'll be able to hold the US off, if they have a mind, and if the US wanted anyone "back", I think they'd hand us over. Even if we were there legally, if the US complains, I think Canada will give us back. In my paranoid mind.

[trotsky]

10. What about fever reducers?

Does high fever cause a lot of flu deaths and injuries, or is it other symptoms? For me, I've found that tylenol works best to bring my fever down, any other products you can recommend?

[Bridget Burke]

12. Fever reducers can make you feel better...

Here's a pretty good discussion of "normal" flu: Anywhere from 24 to 48 hours after infection, flu symptoms suddenly begin. Common symptoms are body aches, headache, high fever, chills, and fatigue. Body and head aches can be severe enough that the infected person wants to stay in bed. As the fever subsides, respiratory symptoms begin with a sore throat, mild cough, and runny nose. However, the cough can become severe and long-lasting. Flu complications, or secondary infections, include bronchitis, sinus or ear infections, and heart and lung problems, particularly in the elderly. You should see a doctor when symptoms include high fever, chest pains with breathing, and a cough that brings up thick mucous. It can take weeks for the patient to recover from the weakness and fatigue brought on by the flu.

www.hmc.psu.edu/healthinfo/i/influenza.htm

Flu vaccine is the best bet to prevent this year's flu. If you get it, staying in bed & treating the symptoms are your best bet. If you have the flu, you will WANT to stay in bed. Watch out for secondary problems, especially if you're high risk.

The 1918-19 flu often had more serious symptoms from the onset--even in the young & strong. Nobody's exactly sure how the Avian flu will operate, after it's mutated to be a widespread threat. Let's hope that other preparations are being made than SENDING IN THE ARMY!

[trotsky]

15. I get my flu shot every year now.

Well, except for last year, of course. I'm young enough that it doesn't pose a serious threat to my health, but I have limited sick/vacation time I can take and two small children to take care of so I just don't want to risk it if I can help it.

Got the flu right after Christmas in 1999. Was sicker than I've ever been in my life. Fever hit 104 a couple of times. I've "religiously" (heh) gotten my shot every year since.

[Bridget Burke]

22. Even the "regular" flu is no picnic.

I'd rather not waste a couple of weeks feeling that bad.

Some people still confuse flu with a bad cold. Are they stocking Tamiflu? If so, will they know whether they REALLY need to take it?

[Mojorabbit]

30. I think I'd wait

till it happens (if it does) and it is on the news and they are setting up quarantine areas in this country because it has been confirmed. Otherwise I'd leave it in the drawer.

A good manual by a doc on caring for flu victums which is still being revised. Here.. http://fluwikie.com/index.php?n=Consequences.PandemicPreparednessGuides
read The Coming Influenza Pandemic (I think it is the second link) by Dr. Woodson

Lots of other good info there.

I had a monster flu in the seventies. My boyfriend at the time found me unconscious in my house with a 105 fever. A regular bad flu can be pretty nasty on it's own.

[rfkrfk]

11. avoid travel to Bird Flu hot spots: Toronto, the EU n/t

[Bridget Burke]

13. Outbreaks in Toronto? The EU?

Please, share with us!

[rfkrfk]

16. Torontonians, weakened by SARS, are the ideal temporary host ...

for Bird Flu.

Be sure to stay as far away as possible
from the uncollected corpses the streets.

about Romania, not sure if it is in the EU,
best strategy, avoid the EU

when travelling by air,
do not be seated adjacent to a
deceased victim of BIRD FLU

[Bridget Burke]

20. If I were you....

I'd be more concerned about Mad Cow Disease.

[NNN0LHI]

14. The military gets a vaccine for H5N1. Bush gives us martial law

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5050172&mesg_id=5050172

[DemBones DemBones]

17. I have degrees in biology and I'm not as blase about avian flu as you are

Epidemiologists and infectious disease specialists are divided in their opinions about this particular strain of avian flu but virtually all believe we are overdue for a flu pandemic. It's NOT just "the *administration trying to scare us." The probability of a flu pandemic was being discussed by public health officials long before * took office.

You claim "it is actually quite easy to survive it" when what's being discussed is a strain of influenza that differs from any we have known before, a strain that, in fact, has a very low survival rate so far. Last I heard, there had been 60 deaths out of 116 human cases to date -- you can just LOOK at the numbers and see that's about a 60% mortality rate, 40 % survival rate. If it were "actually quite easy to survive," we wouldn't be seeing that high a mortality rate.

Let's try to strike a happy medium between naivete and panic. Let's realize that we're eventually going to be hit with a nastier-than-usual strain of influenza. Although everyone claims to "have the flu" any time they're sick, I suspect many people have never had influenza, only other viral infections.

Influenza lays you flat on your back for two weeks, followed by two or more weeks of feeling wobbly. And that's if you're young and healthy. If you're older and/or less healthy, you may develop pneumonia or other complications and you may die. Thousands die from influenza in the United States every year. Avian flu is feared to be far more virulent and thus it could cause far MORE deaths. Don't underestimate the danger.

[mainer]

36. I'm convinced civilizations have fallen because of influenza

History has talked of a terrible "plague" that befell the Roman empire, killing a large percentage of the population. In Central America and the southwest US, archaeological sites remain of civilizations that suddenly "vanished" for unknown reasons. Around the world, such sites are found. Some say it's because they outgrew their resources. what if there's another explanation?

What if a flu pandemic wiped out 60% of their population, causing society to crash?

this is what scares me -- that a pandemic will cause society to implode, and we'll be left to forage on our own.

[Nikia]

19. Have someone take you to the emergency room

I don't know how you would distiguish between normal flu and bird flu, but bird flu is extremely damaging to the lungs.
One of my coworkers caught a stronger rarer version of the flu a while back. She needed to have fluid drained from her lungs and a respirator. This will probably be key to surviving bird flu. Unfortunately, if many people get it, most hospitals will be unable to provide this level of support for all patients.

[whatever4]

24. And for those already compromised

by other diseases, lungs already having wear and tear, bronchitis, etc etc etc...there may be no hope at all. Unfortunately. Unless I'm mistaken, and I could be, bacteria lives just fine with viruses, and fluid filled lungs easily lead to pneumonia. Very dangerous.

For those already dealing with winter, and maybe not enough heat in their homes? On top of a lousy economy, maybe not as much food and medicine available and affordable for how many of us, potentially? I'm ready to shut down with numbness over it. Whether they quarentine or not.

[DemBones DemBones]

27. If you think you're in an "at risk" group,

ask your doctor about a pneumonia shot as well as a flu shot.

[gkhouston]

33. Strongly recommended!

if you've got lung issues or chronic health issues, please do ask about getting a pneumonia shot. They're good for several years and I've seen them offered at grocery stores and drugstores along with flu shots. Secondary (bacterial) pneumonia is a big flu killer.

[whatever4]

37. Thank you both

uh...I didn't even know there WAS such a thing as a pneumonia shot. Cool Thanks! :)

[halobeam]

38. I had no idea.....

you know... "those with lower lung capacity" def. frightens me. I'm a smoker, yeah.. I know everything you could possibly tell me about how bad it is. I battle with patches, and every trick in the book so often I smoke about half a year out of every twelve months. Both my kids have asthma, and hubs just got off interferon eight weeks ago, so he's completely wiped out. We all take vitamins, echinecea, vit. c, etc... but my point is this:

Are smokers more at risk?
Are asthmatics more at risk?
Are cancer patients, those with immuno def. diseases.. more at risk?

Obviously by these questions, I'm not in the medical field. To me, it seems these would all be "greater risk categories", but I don't want to assume, I want to be educated.