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Halliburton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 05:49 PM
Original message
"Fitzgerald and his attorneys seem confident in whatever they are pursuing
http://digbysblog.blogspot.com /
From David Corn:
<snip>
For anyone following the matter, it's impossible not to guess about what's going on and what Fitzgerald will do. His grand jury expires at the end of October. He could impanel a new one and keep investigating. But all indications suggest he's close to done. One person who recently had contact with Fitzgerald and his attorneys says that they seem confident about whatever it is they are pursuing. The Miller matter was something of a sideshow that at times drew more attention than the central issue.
<snip>

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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 05:54 PM
Response to Original message
1. This should be an interesting fall.
Go Fitz!
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longship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Pun intended?
The bigger they are, the harder they fall, this fall.
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. There should be some interesting falls this autumn.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 07:06 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Well, now that ya mention it.
;)
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me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #3
19. Gives new meaning to the phrase, "fall line-up"
:D
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #19
25. :)
:D
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jsamuel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
2. Did what Fitz want to know from Judy have 0.1% to do with Libby?
Did he want to know something else?
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. Fitzgerald
has just completed a split: it's Libby versus Rove, the office of the VP versus the office of the president. We need to keep in mind that it is the grand jurors themselves thast return the verdict on indictments. But Fitzgerald has completed a work of art.

Did you notice what Chris Matthews said tonight? "Is this Haldeman and Erlichman?" He knows the score.
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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 07:29 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. I love how you think
Can you expound a little for me on the Haldeman/Erlichman scenario?
I was a tot during Watergate and still don't know the nuances of the players. Pretty please or else you will force me to do another appreciation thread for you? ;)
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NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:02 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Haldemann was Nixon's Chief of Staff.
...White House officials, including George Bush, had spent the
morning of that Monday, August 5, 1974 absorbing the impact of Nixon's notorious "smoking gun" tape, the recorded conversation between Nixon and his chief of staff, H.R. Haldemann, shortly after the original Watergate break-in, which could now no longer be withheld from the public.

In that exchange of June 23, 1972, Nixon ordered that the CIA stop the FBI from further investigating how various sums of money found their way from Texas and Minnesota via Mexico City to the coffers of the Committee to Re-Elect the President (CREEP) and thence into the pockets of the "Plumbers" arrested in the Democratic Party headquarters in the Watergate building.

These revelations were widely interpreted as establishing a "prima facie" case of obstruction of justice against Nixon...

Ehrlichman, Nixon's assistant for domestic affairs:

...John D. Ehrlichman, directed the White House "plumbers" unit. He also approved the break-in at the office of the psychiatrist of Daniel Ellsberg, the defense analyst who leaked the Pentagon Papers to the press. Ehrlichman resigned from his White House post in 1973; he was convicted of conspiracy to obstruct justice and perjury in the Watergate case and of conspiracy in the Ellsberg case.

Ehrlichman served 18 months in prison...

You should read All the President's Men and The Final Days both by Bob Woodward and Carl Bernstein. Both are good books.

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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Thanks!
Will add to list.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. Those two were
among the most powerful presidential advisors in history. By powerful, of course, I do not mean "good" and surely not "nice" or "honest." But powerful, as in the root of the word, or "posse" meaning to "possess the ability."

No White House secret could be whispered in a back room without their okay. They SCARED people ... and that includes the press. When Woodward & Bernstein went against Haldeman, people were shitting. I do not stretch the truth there!

But they painted themselves into a corner with their own lies. The small team of FBI men known as Deep Throat, led by Mark Felt, played an intense and deadly serious game of mental chess with them. And they busted them.

Once these two were forced out -- and if you read Woodward & Bernstein's first two books, absolute classics! -- you see Nixon was freaking out. He knew he was done. His White House had been knee-capped. It was a thing of beauty. And if you read it, and really look at how each player on the board was moved by the boys behind the scenes, you see that each player in the White House was set against the others! Very hard to do. Very difficult to achieve. But ask the best minds on here, men like Octafish and symbolman -- they will agree that these guys were set against each other. Classic. It's how good police bust the "mob."

Now, keep in mind that by yesterday, every fucking (excuse me) one of the defendants and potential defendents in the Plame case and the AIPAC case were talking with their lawyers. And any good lawyer would tell their client, "Shit's hit the fan. Take care of yourself." And each player knows the others are taking care of themselves! See the beauty? This is art. This is a couple Irishmen who play fucking hardball. Both cases are going great.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. A Masterful Move, Indeed!
And from many directions, so many things tied together here.

Why do I get the feeling that not only might we be surprised at WHO gets indicted, but that we may be quite surprised at how deep and wide the grand jury's investigation went?

There's a reason wants her testimony narrowly confined to the "Plame Matter" as I've seen reported. The Grand Jury may have moved on to investigate OTHER matters, and she may have been aware of that.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. Yep.
Also, the first round of indictments isn't the end of the show. This isn't a tv show, that wraps up in an hour. This is the real McCoy. I'd have loved it to have come to a head before the 2004 election, but good things take time.

You are certainly correct about the grand jury going beyond what it started as.
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WiseButAngrySara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #18
23. If this explains why Miller requested that her testimony be confined to
Plame/Rove, and not in her involvement as a proponent for the War, and falsification of WMD's, does it also explain the strange incongruencies about Libby stating that he gave her the 'go ahead' a year ago? Why on earth would she chose to stay in jail if that were the case? Someone is obviously lying, and I don't think that it's just a failure of communication or understanding...I think it was in order for them to arrange their game plan.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. Miller Was Saying That As Cover, She Was Not Protecting Her Source
She was protecting herself. She committed crimes, that's why she didn't want to testify, but she used source protection and her job as a reporter as a shield and excuse so she wouldn't have to testify and therefore reveal her crimes and/or lie about them. Fitz probably threatened her w/ criminal contempt and dangled immunity and she finally broke. The whole source permission thing was a ruse and cover. Libby is probably telling the truth in some ways about this one thing. She WAS released. He's not covering for her because very likely her testimony will probably be damning to him.
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WiseButAngrySara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. I believe what you say, but it's still just theory, right? ......n/t
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #28
38. Yes, It's My Theory
n/t
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bearfan454 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #26
37. What about when Bolton went to visit her in jail ?
I bet he is involved too.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 11:16 AM
Response to Reply #37
39. Could Be Many Reasons Why
But probably just trying to milk information or cut his own deal.
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DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #23
32. Maybe our damsel in distress
really thought that some knight in shining armor would get her out of this mess. Certainly before anyone would actually dare to put her is jail. After waiting anxiously by the phone for the last 3 months and with a little arm twisting from Fitz, Judy finally realized that no one was going to save her. All of a sudden, it was a real good idea to make a deal. That's why Fitz put her in jail in the first place.

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bunny planet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 09:07 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. I think she realized she was on her own and could be left to rot in jail
Edited on Sat Oct-01-05 09:08 AM by bunny planet
once Katrina hit and she saw the Bush crime family was vulnerable because of their bumbling response. Time to cut her losses and cut a deal.
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goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #14
20. Ahhhh...Yah give Woodward too much credit!...
He has been a good moderate propagandist in the last
five years.

And Nixon?.....Well, Woodward certainly helped expose Nixon for
what he was, but ya gotta remember that GHW Bush, Kissinger, Cheney
and Rumsfeld all worked under Nixon and are all cut form the
same cloth if not worse.

There is just too much consistency between 911/Niger/Iraq and
Watergate.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. Naw.
I don't care for Woodward. (One of my relatives is acquainted with him. He convinced my relative that poor Judith was honorable. We debated that heatedly.) Still, when he printed things about Haldeman, it tool big balls. No one else was. No one. And Bernstein wrote two classic books. That doesn't translate into my saying anyone should believe every word in them -- in fact, my posts regarding Woodward have been, for as long as I've been on DU, very clear about his not being open and honest.

There is a lot of similarity between Watergate and Plame/neocon spy/yellow cake forgery scandal(s). And even more with Iran-Contra. Comparing 9-11 and Watergate may be a stretch.
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symbolman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 10:42 AM
Response to Reply #14
36. Wow
to have H2OMan call me a "mind" is quite an honor, actually it's HIS posts I slaver over, thanks, now if only I could convince my wife :)

Been apologising for the Rove's War not being in the mail yet, for a couple of reasons - one, I was pretty sick for a month, and the other, I REALLY wanted to capture the best info I could, did a lot of research and within a few days I'll be shipping the Rove's War at about 150 minutes of what I consider good red MEAT on two DVDs..

It will open the eyes of some folks, but I think if nothing else it will clear up a lot of the mess you get from the media, so many talking and feigning and ducking, even those that know what's going ON are doing it.. so I've gone through hundreds of hours of TIVOd Hearings, the Downing Street Memo hearing I filmed, and this film will have a pretty large cast of characters..

Once I've shipped to everyone that donated (and yes I know some folks are pissed, and I do apologise publicly here, sorry, sorry - two emergency rooms visits are not my idea of fun and cramp my style :) )
I'm going to kick out a huge press release getting the word out that I've created with nearly a year of research what I think is the definitive story of Rove & Co and their nefarious plans..

For instance I compare the breakin in Rome just about the time Bush was being sworn in, to Watergate and how ROVE who just happens to have been using the FBI as his personal Gestopo since Texas, once "broke in" to Dixon's office, stole his letterhead and printed out party favors which he delivered to the Red Light district of Chicago and soup kitchens to come on over to Dixon's office and get Free Beer and Free women, etc - don't you think it's possible in Rove's position to have "plumbers" of his OWN?

I don't think that's tin foil baby, THAT is his Modus Operandi, he just gets grander with every cheap trick, having been suckled by "Mr Willie Horton" himself as a mentor..

This will be a must have for political junkies and I've put everything I have into it, there are some fun moments too, brought to you by Jon Stewart himself, and graphics to break up the filth being presented and get some perspective back while watching..

Be really glad to hear what you think of it H2O :)

Finishing up the soundtrack (writing it all myself) and if I haven't mentioned it yet, did a Satirical version of "Secret Agent Man" called "Secret Agent Plame" which is a mambo version for the credits with some fun lyrics..

Nearly there, nearly there -- couldn't let that compliment go without a thanks :)
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PurityOfEssence Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #36
42. Well, Rove's mentor WAS Donald Segretti...
Nixon may have thought G.H.W.B. was a lightweight, but this current mob would and does do things that would make the proverbial maggot gag.

Sorry you're illin', and I look forward to seeing your opus.
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hootinholler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #36
43. Dude, I had no idea...
How much and where? I would like a copy.

-Hoot
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NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. Key players of Watergate.
I just found this link at the Washington Post.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/onpolitics/waterga...


Haldemann


Ehrlichman


Key Players in Alphabetical Order:
Howard Baker
Robert Bork
Pat Buchanan
Archibald Cox
Charles Colson
John Dean
Bob Dole
John Ehrlichman
Sam Ervin
H.R. Haldeman
E. Howard Hunt
G. Gordon Liddy
Jeb Magruder
James McCord
John Mitchell
Richard Nixon
Charles Ruff
Donald Segretti
Earl Silbert
John Sirica
Hugh Sloan
Maurice Stans
Fred Thompson
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thinkingwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 07:26 AM
Response to Reply #10
31. whoa, I didn't know that
I can't stand Hardball anymore--gives me a headache. But Matthews asked if this was Haldeman and Erlichman?

Wowie.

Can't wait for the show to start!

:popcorn:

want some?
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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 01:34 PM
Response to Reply #10
45. I think you may be correct, have you seen this?
There was a thread today about Libby's email to Judy, here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

The E&P article it cited contained some quotes from said email, here: http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_di...

Most in the thread mocked the personal touches libby added but I found this quote particularly interesting:

Then, several paragraphs expressed his surprise that she has not acted on his voluntary offer of a year earlier to waive his rights to confidentiality, since it served my best intereststhis is the rare case where this source will be better off if you testified. He dubbed this the Miller corollary.

Seems to reinforce your theory.
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satya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 03:13 PM
Response to Reply #45
47. Am I reading too much into Libby's email:
"Out West, where you vacation, the aspens will already be turning. They turn in clusters, because their roots connect them."

Could he be telling her that some of the others have already flipped?

:tinfoilhat:

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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #47
50. Very interesting
That sure does play into H20 man's splitting of the camps theory. Rove and Cheney are both from the west too. OMG, I think you cracked the code.
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kstewart33 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
4. Sounds like good news is forthcoming. nt
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. Rove and Libby could
stand trail and be found guilty of a serious crime.

This article is a difficult read but worthwhile.

http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0812-22.htm
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WiseButAngrySara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #9
24. Thanks for the link Disturbed!.............n/t
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 07:20 PM
Response to Original message
7. Arianna thinks he will ask for an extension of the grand jury
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 07:22 PM
Response to Original message
8. Whatever it is it'll be good
He wouldn't keep this case going on for two years if he didn't have something. :popcorn: I can't wait.
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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:10 PM
Response to Original message
16. Diogenes can rest for a while. I think we've found his honest man.
Fitzgerald, whether the outcome be for better or worse, is a man of integrity. He may very well change the course of history, for the better.
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crispini Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #16
34. Your post, and this whole thread...
is making the hair stand up on my arms.

Please please please please please let it all be true!
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
17. Yes, Miller Was Probably Icing
Edited on Fri Sep-30-05 08:13 PM by Beetwasher
She finally agreed to talk after she was threatened w/ the criminal contempt and additional jail time and Fitz probably offerred her some kind of immunity for whatever crime(s) she committed. He's got his ducks all lined up and she probably just smoothes it all out.
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mbee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #17
27. If Miller was the last item on his agenda there would be no reason
to extend the GJ. I think they will indict soon!
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 06:59 AM
Response to Reply #17
29. It's showtime.
The grand jurors need to step up to the plate. I'm sure they realize that they have seen something that is absolutely criminal within the bowels of the administration. I am thinking of how the judges hearing the journalists' appeals all were convinced that Fitzgerald has something big, very big.
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HereSince1628 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 07:21 AM
Response to Reply #29
30. Yes, that is the one issue that makes me think Fitz' is on the scent
The judges' behavior is intriguing.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #29
40. That's Actually One Of The Most Encouraging Signs
Edited on Sat Oct-01-05 11:24 AM by Beetwasher
That the judge(s) who ruled on Miller said something to the effect that the severity of the crime and it's consequences made her case quite special and that's why he felt compelled to rule against her.

I've always had a sneaking suspicion that agency assetts were not only compromised, but eliminated as a result of Plame's cover being blown.
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DemReadingDU Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 10:38 AM
Response to Original message
35. very interesting
waiting for Fitzgerald...
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0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
41. Goddamn I think this poster is on to something.
"Can we assume that the administration is already ahead of us on where the grand jury is going? If so, then is it not possible that they figure they might need the Supreme Court firmly on their side? Suppose indictments are handed out and suppose Bush is named an unindicted co-conspirator? And then Bush tries to pardon all his indicted henchmen? Kids, can you spell constitutional crisis?

And who would sit in judgment? Why, I think the SCOTUS.

Which is now, with Roberts as Chief Justice, firmly in Bush's court.

Suppose, however, that Judith Miller had testified BEFORE the confirmation and indictments came down suddenly and queered the confirmation? Why, the SCOTUS, which would be the final arbiter in any constitutional crisis, would be at best deadlocked 4-4.

So, maybe the timing of Judy's folding her hand is NOT coincidence. I can imagine her telling Bolton, "I will stay til you guys get the Court under control--NOT ONE DAY LONGER."

Don't blithely assume coincidence in the timing. Roberts in, Judy out.
unirealist | 10.01.05 - 8:13 am | #
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Turn CO Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #41
46. I thought Presidential pardons only apply to convictions, not
indictments? And I thought that there is something about 5 years after conviction and serving of sentence in Title 28, as well.

Hello, law buffs on DU? Clarification, please.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 01:08 PM
Response to Original message
44. The White House seemed to be in disarray during Katrina. Bush Jr. ...
seemed to be out there floundering around in public all by himself--for instance, getting caught on camera eating cake while Americans were dying of starvation and dehydration and a big chunk of the country was getting blown off the map. Where are his handlers?--was my thought.

Then, afterward, Rove comes out with this newsturd about having had kidney stones and being in the hospital during Katrina. I guess other people noticed, too. Where was he? How could he let Bush blunder so badly, so blatantly?

Another thing: Bush is a dummy--and a basket case--and probably didn't even know that FEMA had been gutted. He trusts his handlers to set up his phony successes, and cover for him when things don't go well (for instance, in the 2004 election campaign, and the Iraq war). So, when the shit hit the fan in NO, he really did not have a clue what was going on, and found himself WITHOUT COVER--everybody AWOL, most critically, Rove.

Why?

I got to thinking about Treasongate lurking in the background of Katrina, and, putting 2 and 4 together, I figure Rove went on strike during Katrina--withdrew his services from Bush Jr. until he got some kind of protection (promise of a presidential pardon?) from Treasongate. Where did I pick up that, some time back, Rove threw a fit, because HE had been hung out to dry on Treasongate (by Libby, i.e., Cheney)? (I know I read this, but I can't remember where). I think they were using Rove's reputation for political revenge and punishment as a cover story for the outing of Plame--that he was punishing Wilson for his political dissent--and that outing Plame was all HIS idea. A believable story, that he would break a federal law, in a fit of pique, to get back at someone.

But untrue, I think--and that's how the split developed in the WH. This was a far more serious matter than punishment of a critic of the war, destruction of a CIA agent's career, and the breaking of a federal law--all of which Rove had been (probably quite willingly) drawn into as chief war propagandist.

I was thinking, during Katrina, that the split was between the indictable and the unindictable, and/or between pro-Cheney vs. pro-Bush. (When Daddy Bush and Clinton came out and stood behind Bush Jr.--a really weird event in the midst of Katrina--I was thinking that it was a Cheney coup that was being threatened, and it may yet have been--I'll get to that in a moment.) But Rove vs. Libby also makes sense--since it appears that Libby was setting Rove up to take the fall.

I read a Wilson interview--I think it was Raw Story--in which Wilson said he'd called Condi Rice to get the regime to back off on the Niger yellowcake story (after that allegation got put back in Bush's State of the Union), and Condi told him, through intermediaries, that she wasn't interested in his information, but, if he was so concerned about the matter, why didn't he publish it? (That's nearly word for word what Wilson said.)

Sure sounds like she was baiting him--AND, that they knew full well his article was coming. It was not a surprise. Why, then, did they risk the entire administration to get Plame outed THE NEXT WEEK? (--week of July 6-14, 2003).

This Condi statement (why don't you publish it?) also gives the lie to Rove doing anything in a fit of pique--and it also suggests that WILSON was being set up--that they WANTED him to go public, to be used as an excuse to "get" the CIA, to disable its entire WMD monitoring capability, and discredit the agency as, oh, politically motivated, and/or as being wrong, as having bad intel on Iraq nukes.

Let me back up. I think what this entire scandal is about is a Bush Cartel plot to PLANT nukes (or other WMDs) in Iraq. The WMDs were to be "found" by Judith Miller (all set up in Iraq to "find" them; embedded with the U.S. troops who were searching for WMDs after the invasion-- an embed contract signed by Donald Rumsfeld himself--and, from the Bush Cartel's point of view, well deserving of such a "scoop").

Can you imagine the political cache this would have given to Bush and Blair? (They'd be in Iran by now.)

With the public all primed to expect a find of WMDs in Iraq, do you think this Cartel was just sitting around HOPING that Judith Miller would find some? Not likely. (There were several credible-sounding reports of covert U.S. arms shipments into Iraq, in March 2003--in Pakistani and Iranian press--one by an Iraq Governing Council member in Basra, and another by a Pentagon whistleblower, who had gotten reports of a covert arms shipment onto Iraqi soil that met with "friendly fire.")

The plot to plant WMDs was foiled, obviously. And this may have been the reason for the death of the Brits chief weapons expert David Kelly (four days after Plame was outed by Novak). This may also have been the reason for the SECOND Plame outing, on July 22, 2003--the outing of the entire Brewster Jennings operation (also by Novak)--an item that analysts of this affair tend to ignore. It was this second outing, of BJ, that led me to suspect that the Bushites were in a panic when they outed Plame. Why out BJ--if the point was merely to punish Wilson? It compounds the risk of treason charges. It appears to me that they were risking everything--contacting at least SIX reporters, circulating the Plame memo on AF-1, putting many top Bushites at maximum risk of treason charges--not to punish Wilson but to disable the CIA WMD weapons monitoring capability, and shut it down, AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE.

I think what may have happened here is that they had intended to CONFIRM the Niger yellowcake allegation with a phony "find" of yellowcake in Iraq--and no protestations of the CIA or anyone else, about the obviously forged documents, would be able to overcome the FACT of yellowcake IN Iraq (given the lapdogism of the U.S. news media). But they were found out, maybe by David Kelly. And four days AFTER his death--after his office and computers were searched--they outed the Brewster Jennings operation (the entire CIA weapons monitoring program--an outing that put numerous covert agents at grave risk).

I think what is striking about the Plame outing is the stupid, risky and precipitous way that it was done. There are MANY ways that the Bush Cartel can punish people, inside and outside of government, and many, many ways to plant news items untraceably. They do it all the time. This was a hasty, panicky, botched job, with, it seems, barely time to invent and coordinate cover stories.

Here's the time line:

May 22, 2003: After the invasion (which he had supported), Kelly starts whistleblowing anonymously to the BBC about the Brits' "sexed up" Iraq intel (espec. the nuke allegations).

July 6, 2003: Wilson publishes his article.

July 7, 2003: The Blairites ferret Kelly out, interrogate him at a "safe house," and report to Tony Blair that Kelly "could say some uncomfortable things." Not HAD said. COULD say. (Hutton report.) (My surmise: Blair calls AF-1 that day, and warns them.)

July 14, 2003: In a flurry of panicked phone calls, the Bushites find their news patsy Novak and get Plame outed.

July 18, 2003: Kelly is found dead, under highly suspicious circumstances; his office and computers are searched.

July 22, 2003: Brewster Jennings outed (also by Novak).

(Note: In between, on July 21, 2003, Judith Miller writes Kelly's obit for the NYT, and fails to disclose her close connections to Kelly. They had written a book together. And it was to Miller that Kelly had written his last email, warning of "the many dark actors playing games." I suspect her of having outed Kelly to his bosses, and also of putting words in his mouth, in his obit, criticizing U.S. troops for not looking hard enough for WMDs in Iraq. This does not fit his state of mind at the time--that of whistleblower. But it does serve HER interests.)

Cheney: I think he wanted the CIA weapons monitoring capability disabled--for personal war profiteering purposes--and that there was a long term plan toward this end,involving the Niger forgeries. I think Wilson was used opportunistically toward these ends, but that David Kelly was a wild card in this situation. His knowledge of the plot to plant nukes (or other WMDs) in Iraq was UNEXPECTED.

Wilson article (7/6/03) expected. David Kelly knowledge (7/7/03) UNEXPECTED. Thus the panic to out Plame and BJ, within a two-week time frame, uncarefully, putting all the perps at great risk.

Fast-forward to Katrina: Cheney has the goods on Bush Jr., probably in many different ways. But given the one that a grand jury is investigating, the key issue may be, did Bush Jr. set eyes on the Plame memo on AF-1? Or some similar complicity (possibly deliberately set up). Cheney goes into hiding during Katrina, and doesn't come out until Halliburton gets the first billion dollar contract, and until after Bush Jr. has gone to NO to try to strong-arm Gov. Blanco to get total federal/WH control of LA and martial law. What I suspect is that Cheney was blackmailing Bush Jr. at this point. (That's why Daddy Bush and Clinton came out and stood behind Bush Jr.)

The method used on Gov. Blanco was really raw--trying to extort control of the state with her people dying of hunger and neglect, by withholding and obstructing aid (of which there is a mountain of evidence). It smells of desperation, and also of ineptness (of Bush on his own). Also, it's not the sort of thing presidents do IN PERSON. They send emissaries. Where were Bush's emissaries? He went in person to Blanco and did this, sweating bullets, I think--because it was the price of his own immunity from Treasongate. That's my guess. (Cheney to Bush Jr.: "Give me LA, or I rat on you, punk.")

Whether or not Cheney would deign to negotiate a presidential pardon (since he IS the president), I'm not sure. Possibly that was part of the bargain. (--maybe that's where Daddy Bush and Clinton came in.)

With the Iraq war in disrepute, the Gulf coast is the new cash cow for Halliburton, Bechtel and the whole gang--their last opportunity to loot the federal treasury. That was Cheney's price. (--and possibly a presidential pardon was a foregone conclusion in his case, arranged long ago, maybe signed by Bush Jr. at the beginning, with the list of indictable crimes left blank, to be filled in.)

Meanwhile, Rove gets over his "kidney stones" and the Rove P.R. machine gears back up, and starts trying to repair some of the severe damage to Bush's reputation (that occurred with Bush Jr. out there on his own). Rove has his pardon. He also got put in charge of the booty in the Gulf coast. (Peace treaty between Cheney/Libby and Bush/Rove?)

The putrid stink in the Gulf coast is not the bloated bodies of the poor and the black.

I don't know what part of the tail of this raging tiger Patrick Fitzgerald has hold of. Some significant part of it, for sure. Things may have turned around on Libby, so that he's the fall guy now. I doubt if we'll see Cheney in an orange suit.

And it's no wonder that Judith Miller wanted her testimony "limited"--if my scenario here is more or less what really happened. She may have even been privy to the plot to plant WMDs in Iraq (she was sure disappointed when none were "found".) Her other negotiating point was, according to her, absolute, personal assurance from her source, Libby, that he was releasing her to testify against him (probably that he used her to launder Valerie Plame's identity to other reporters), and was not being coerced. Listening to her, yesterday, I was thinking that she knows that Libby is now the fall guy, owes him, and wanted to be assured that he won't fall too hard (or that he, too, has negotiated his pardon).

The more important story--from the point of view of the American public and the future of our democracy--may be the part that she will not be asked about (due to agreed upon "limits" to her testimony): WHY all this happened. The REAL REASON that they outed Plame and BJ.

..not to suppress dissent, but to suppress the crime of moving dangerous weapons, covertly, into Iraq, to hoodwink the American people and the world about their bloody, illegal war.

They slaughtered 100,000 innocent people (according to the British doctors' report) in the initial bombing alone--under the flag of WMDs. And they almost got away with it--but for two people whom we don't know much about: David Kelly, and either Valerie Plame or someone in her CIA covert network of eyes and ears upon WMDs around the world, whose name we will never know, and who is probably now dead (as a result of the outing).

If my scenario is generally correct, it is these relatively unknown or unknowable people whom we have to thank for the opportunity we have been given to stop a Mideast holocaust and to restore democracy in the U.S. If Bush/Blair had "found" their planted WMDs in Iraq--and no one had been able to expose that fakery--we might, even now, be experiencing Carl Sagan's "the cold and the dark," that is, the destruction of our planet's atmosphere that even a limited use of nuclear weapons will bring about. (Planted nukes in Iraq might have quickly led to planted nukes in Iran and/or Syria, with the possibility of the Bushites or Israel preemptively nuking them, or of nuke accidents in the covert handling of the weapons.)

One thing we do know about David Kelly is that he thought the whole controversy surrounding him would blow over in a week (had he promised his bosses that he wouldn't reveal the worst?), and he was looking forward to his daughter's wedding and returning to Iraq. We know this because he wrote it to Judith Miller (--in emails that were later released by his family, not by her).

We now have the chance to clean up our election system (Diebold and ES&S election theft machines into 'Boston Harbor,' I say!), and get a decent, lawful government again. I hope we don't settle for only that (--we need a BIG BROOM!), but it would be a relief just to have sane people in the WH and mere corporate business corruption. (Is that what the global corporate predators are counting on? Yikes.)









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fooj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #44
48. Miller was the last person to speak with David Kelly, right?
:smoke:
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randome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-05 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #44
49. Wow.
I very much like the way you put all this together. It sounds entirely plausible.

If I were a betting man...
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