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Hey Rummy, have you ever read Article. I., Section. 8., Clause 1?

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paineinthearse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 10:08 AM
Original message
Hey Rummy, have you ever read Article. I., Section. 8., Clause 1?
Edited on Fri Sep-30-05 10:33 AM by paineinthearse
If the shrubbies are such proponents of a literal interpretation of the Constitution, why do they insist that we are at war?

Article. I., Section. 8., Clause 11: The Congress shall have Power To declare War...


The earliest instance of spin that our country is at war is a pentagon propaganda/misinformation piece dated March 7, 2002.

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Mar2002/n03072002_20020...

Rumsfeld Hits Home at Pentagon Town Hall
By Linda D. Kozaryn
American Forces Press Service

WASHINGTON, March 7, 2002 --

<snip>

When a young woman identified herself as a student, Rumsfeld asked, "Of what?" Replying that she was a high school student, the secretary chuckled and asked, "How did you get in?" To which she cheerily replied, "Never mind," drawing loud laughter from the spit and polish military audience.

Explaining that one of her teachers claims the country is not 'at war,' the student asked Rumsfeld how he'd respond to that. "Are we at war and how is that measured?" the young woman asked.

Pausing briefly, Rumsfeld said, "Some people think we're not at war unless there's a declaration of war." Yet there have been a whole series of conflicts without any declarations of war by Congress. "An awful lot of people have been killed," the secretary said, "and that has to be one of the characteristics of war."

He went on to explain how the war against terrorism is indeed a "war." He said there are people who are not associated with a country, who do not have armies, navies or air forces, and who are determined to kill not soldiers, sailors, airmen or Marines, but innocent people "to obtain some goal they believe is in their interest."

"I personally think the word 'war' is appropriate," Rumsfeld said. "It is something that engages the entire nation. It engages other nations of the world who are vulnerable." The only way to combat terrorists, he said, is to take the battle to them.

Then, leaning closer to the microphone, Rumsfeld concluded, "So I'd go back to your teachers and tell them THEY'RE WRONG." To this, the audience erupted with whistles, cheers and applause.

more...


Constitution of the United States of America, Article. I., Section. 8., Clause 11: The Congress shall have Power To declare War...


"The country is not at war, the military is at war."

Senator Robert Byrd, Tue Sep-13-05
See http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Help stop the Orwellian spin. Each time you hear someone say "the country is at war", remind the speaker that the Constitution gives Congress the power to declare war. Ask "Can you tell me when Congress declared war, and on whom?"
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MildyRules Donating Member (739 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 10:09 AM
Response to Original message
1. Congress
Never declared War during VietNam either...
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Sydnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. You are correct ... but
Vietnam became known as a "police action" rather than a war, even though it was referred to as a war in the mainstream media.
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MildyRules Donating Member (739 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Actually, Korea became known as a "police action."
Not VietNam
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Sydnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 08:56 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. Actually, Vietnam WAS known as a police action
I wasn't around during the Korean "conflict", but I was front and center for Vietnam. Just as Iraq was never "declared" neither was Vietnam.

Check out this google search and see for yourself.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22vietnam+police+...

:cheers:
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derby378 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 10:11 AM
Response to Original message
2. There are "declared wars" and "undeclared wars"
Edited on Fri Sep-30-05 10:12 AM by derby378
Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan, and Iraq are all undeclared wars. I think Chechnya is, too, on the Russian side.
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paineinthearse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Of course, I understand that
But for the US Congress to declare such gives it a mark of moral justification. Otherwise the use of power is illigimate.
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julianer Donating Member (964 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 11:11 AM
Response to Original message
3. Duh. Of course it's not a war
It's a Global Struggle Against Violent Extremism.

Do try to keep up. ;)
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proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
7. not war , but PNAC
it's a "project" for Global Domination IMHO.

The Geneva conventions would apply were we at war
so as long as this administration attempts to avoid
follow the "rules" of war we are not at war .

It is sad but it is a legal term and has nothing
to do with bloodshed .
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paineinthearse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-05 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Sorry, I forgot to use the 9th edition newspeak dictionary.
Edited on Fri Sep-30-05 04:54 PM by paineinthearse
Of course it is an "action".

Duh, how stupid :spank: of me!
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