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Anyone seen this Freeper mail on Texas vs NOLA response?

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bonzotex Donating Member (740 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 04:42 PM
Original message
Anyone seen this Freeper mail on Texas vs NOLA response?
I got this at work. I'm building a flame-fest reply. If you've seen this and have debunked any already, any help would be appreciated!

mail as follows:

2 States, 22 Observations


Things I have noticed while watching media coverage of the recent hurricanes.

1. Texas: Productive industrious state run by Republicans.

Louisiana: Government dependent welfare state run by Democrats.



2. Texas: Residents take responsibility to protect and evacuate themselves.

Louisiana: Residents wait for government to protect and evacuate them.



3. Texas: Local and state officials take responsibility for protecting their citizens and property.

Louisiana: Local and state officials blame federal government for not protecting their citizens and property.



4. Texas: Command and control remains in place to preserve order.

Louisiana: Command and control collapses allowing lawlessness.



5. Texas: Law enforcement officers remain on duty to protect city.

Louisiana: Law enforcement officers desert their posts to protect themselves.



6. Texas: Local police watch for looting.

Louisiana: Local police participate in looting.



7. Texas: Law and order remains in control, 8 looters tried it, 8 looters arrested.

Louisiana: Anarchy and lawlessness breaks out, looters take over city, no arrests, criminals with guns have to be shot by federal troops.



8. Texas: Considerable damage caused by hurricane.

Louisiana: Considerable damage caused by looters.



9. Texas: Flood barriers hold preventing cities from flooding.

Louisiana: Flood barriers fail due to lack of maintenance allowing city to flood.



10. Texas: Orderly evacuation away from threatened areas, few remain.

Louisiana: 25,000 fail to evacuate, are relocated to another flooded area.



11. Texas: Citizens evacuate with personal 3 day supply of food and water.

Louisiana: Citizens fail to evacuate with 3 day supply of food and water, do without it for the next 4 days.



12. Texas: FEMA brings in tons of food and water for evacuees. State officials provide accessible distribution points.

Louisiana: FEMA brings in tons of food and water for evacuees. State officials prevent citizens from reaching distribution points and vice versa.



13. Louisiana: Media focuses on poor blacks in need of assistance, blames Bush.

Texas: Media cant find poor blacks in need of assistance, looking for something else to blame on Bush.



14. Texas: Coastal cities suffer some infrastructure damage, Mayors tell residents to stay away until ready for repopulation, no interference from federal officials.

Louisiana: New Orleans is destroyed, Mayor asks residents to return home as another hurricane approaches, has to be overruled by federal officials.



15. Louisiana: Over 400 killed by storm, flooding and crime.

Texas: 24 killed in bus accident on highway during evacuation, no storm related deaths.



16. Texas: Jailed prisoners are relocated to other detention facilities outside the storm area.

Louisiana: Jailed prisoners are set free to prey on city shops, residents, and homes.



17. Texas: Local and state officials work with FEMA and Red Cross in recovery operations.

Louisiana: Local and state officials obstruct FEMA and Red Cross from aiding in recovery operations.



18. Texas: Local and state officials demonstrate leadership in managing disaster areas.

Louisiana: Local and state officials fail to demonstrate leadership, require federal government to manage disaster areas.



19. Texas: Fuel deliveries can't keep up with demand, some run out of gas on highway, need help from fuel tankers before storm arrives.

Louisiana: Motorists wait till storm hits and electrical power fails. Cars run out of gas at gas stations that cant pump gas. Gas in underground tanks mixes with flood waters.



20. Texas: Mayors move citizens out of danger.

Louisiana: Mayor moves himself and family to Dallas.



21. Texas: Mayors continue public service announcements and updates on television with Governor's backing and support.

Louisiana: Mayor cusses, governor cries, senator threatens president with violence on television, none of them have a clue what went wrong or whos responsible.



22. Louisiana: Democratic Senator says FEMA was slow in responding to 911 calls from Louisiana citizens.

Texas: Republican Senator says "when you call 911, the phone doesn't ring in Washington, it rings here at the local responders".

What if state and local elected officials were forced to depend on themselves and their own resources instead of calling for help from the federal government? Texas cities would be back up and running in a few days. Louisiana cities would still be under water next month. Republicans call for action, Democrats call for help. What party will you be voting for in the next election?

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Catherine Vincent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 04:45 PM
Response to Original message
1. Louisiana is a poorer state than Texas.
Besides, Texas did have to evacuate the poor that weren't able to leave.
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Montauk6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Then again, how much more federal pork, if any, does Texas receive?
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melissinha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #1
21. its true
Property taxes in Louisiana are so low, it makes you wonder how they pay for anything. I remember seeing LA escrow accounts and seeing such a LOW tax amount, HOWEVER the state of Texas is not an overly wealthy well to do state either.... the worst case is Las Colonias on Texas borders which is worse than the poverty of Louisiana.
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davidinalameda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
2. first of all
New Orleans' mayor was in NO

I didn't see anything about him leaving for Dallas

and it was FEMA which blocked the Red Cross
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05246/565143.stm

it would be hard for the NO mayor and the LA governor to issue any statements on TV since there was no power in the areas hit by Katrina

the area hit by Rita was much smaller than the area hit by Katrina-so of course it was more managable

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ET Awful Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. What part of Texas is below sea level and had money for reinforcing
it's levees shipped to Iraq instead?
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I Have A Dream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. Yeah, if there ever was an example of comparing apples...
and oranges, this would be it! It's the same thing that they're doing with Mississippi and Alabama in reference to Katrina. The freepers keep saying how well the Republican governors in Mississippi and Alabama handled things during Katrina. The situation in Louisiana wasn't even close to the same thing as what happened in those two states. Do freepers think that we're dumb? Does this actually work for them with some people? :shrug:
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haydukelives Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. Yes and yes
They do think we are dumb and
A lot of people fall for this crap
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eallen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
4. It's pretty much nonsense. Louisiana is a conservative place.
Both Texas and Louisiana rank low in their welfare programs compared to the national average. The notion that Louisiana is a welfare haven is just plain nonsense. The Houston evacuation was a miserable failure. The roads quickly jammed and much of the city never exited.

The crucial difference is one of geography: New Orleans was below sea level, and flooded.
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sdfernando Donating Member (421 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. Jammed roads
I kept thinking about all those people jammed on the freeway with no escape. Then I thought, what if Rita made landfall with all those people and cars on the road. It wasn't a pretty scenario. Texas was lucky and had the benefit of knowledge & wisdom gained from Katrina.

Way too many differences between the two situation to be able to fairly compare them. Just because they were both caused by huricanes, doesn't mean everything was equal.
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
5. Fascinating
Gridlocked highways full of people running for their lives is an orderly evacuation?

I vote for "delete it".
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Catch22Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
6. So flawed
If Katrina hadn't hit NOLA, would TX have taken Rita as seriously? If Rita had been half the destructive force Katrina was, would TX have been as lucky? Here, let me compare apples to oranges and put it in an idiotic chain mail. F*cking morAns.
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tanyev Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 04:53 PM
Response to Original message
8. WHO authors this bilge?
Is there any way to trace these things back to the original sender?
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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. No way to trace them. I'm sure the RNC covers their tracks well.
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bonzotex Donating Member (740 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 07:24 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. Techniguy is the author
You can look at his website. I won't link to it. Right wing hack stuff...
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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 05:01 PM
Response to Original message
9. Complete horseshit from top to bottom
First, Louisiana was hit by a Cat 4 hurricane that was a Cat 5 as winds began coming ashore. It was hit by an overwhelming storm surge that caused the failure of a levee that Louisiana had been begging for help to modernize for years. Over a million people were evacuated in two days, following plans drawn up well in advance, and modernized weeks before the evacuation.

Texas was hit by the outskirts of a Cat 3 hurricane whose main damage was in Louisiana. Over 2 million people were told to "get out of town," with no evacuation plan or destination route in place. This led to 36 hour long traffic jams which killed 24 people. Tens of thousands did not evacuate, even from Galveston Island, the most danger-prone region of the Texas Coast. A direct hit on Galveston and Houston could have killed hundreds to thousands who had not evacuated.

The federal government decided to prove it really could react to an emergency with Rita, and brought National Gaurd troops, ice, water and food to the region to be ready to distribute as soon as the hurricane was over. If they had done this after Katrina, 90% of the catastrophe in New Orleans could have been prevented. Ice, water, and National Gaurd troops would have prevented all of the suffering after the hurricane, and would have provided the tools to stop the looters and rescue those stranded--as was done after Rita, when just as many people had to be pulled from rooftops.

In short, Bush's response to Rita proves his failure to respond under Rita.

And for the record, Mississippi is more conservative than Texas and is run by Republicans, and THEY also blasted Bush and his derelict response after Katrina.

Bush should be tried for negligent homocide and fraud for hiw failure to apoint qualified people to run FEMA and Homeland Security. People died because the Feds didn't do the job we paid them to do. And these RNC scripted emails don't change that.
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bonzotex Donating Member (740 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 07:26 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. Thanks, nice points! All stuff I'm including
I'll post my reply on here for others to draw from, but you already know the answers. This crap doesn't deserve careful refutation, but I'm going to do it anyway. This is the first time i was ever forwarded crap like this from a co-worker and I'm gonna squelch it right off.
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FVZA_Colonel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 11:43 PM
Response to Reply #9
22. I hope somebody sends some of these responses to the author
of that tripe.
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melissinha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
13. Here's the truth, freepers:
1. Texas: Productive industrious state run by Republicans.
Louisiana: Productive industrious state run by Democrats.


2. Texas: Residents with vehicles take responsibility to protect and evacuate themselves, residents without vehicles ride out the storm because their mayor told them he has no plan for them.

Louisiana: 75% of Residents take responsibility to protect and evacuate themselves, those who have no means to evacuate are sent to the a pre-determined shelter location to wait for the Federal EMERGENCY Agency to live up to their NAME and the reputation of James Lee Witt.


3. Houston Texas: Local officials order citizens to evacuate themselves, for those without vehicles, people with vehicles are encouraged to help their neighbors.
Louisiana: Local and state officials use all available resources.. i.e. a depleted National Guard and depleted force of bus drivers, upon determining that it would not be enough, they ask for help in advance. Privat bus companies contracted FEMA opt out of providing assistance.


4. Texas: "Command and control" is aslogan spouted by republicans, whilst they put no one in charge of the evacuation of poor people. Louisiana: "Command and control" is exhibited by the Governor and Mayor who followed all the protocol given to them by FEMA.


5. Texas: Law enforcement officers remain on duty to protect city.
Louisiana: Some Law enforcement officers do not show up for posts to evacuate their families.

6. Texas: Local police watch for looting.
Louisiana: Local police have more than looting to work on, saving lives is a priority. Some policemen take survival items from stores on behalf of victims.


7. Texas: Law and order remains in control, 8 looters tried it, 8 looters arrested.

Louisiana: Anarchy and lawlessness break out, afterall FEMA took their sweet time, people were starving floodwaters were rising.



8. Texas: Considerable damage caused by hurricane.

Louisiana: Considerable damage caused by hurricane and breeched levees which were underfunded by the Federal Government.



9. Texas: Flood barriers hold preventing cities from flooding, because Texas is the homestate of the President he'd never underfund his state.

Louisiana: Flood barriers fail due to lack of funding by the Federal Government, local contractors go one year without compensation for the work they did do to prevent breeches.


10. Texas: One million people clog the highways, wasting millions of gallons of gas....

Louisiana: 80% are evacuated successfully, but the remaining 20% wait for the most powerful nation in the world to show its might.


11. Texas: Citizens evacuate with personal 3 day supply of food and water, in restrospect of the failings of the PREVIOUS hurricane.

Louisiana: Citizens with 2 day supply of food and water, do without it for the next 4 days cause George Bush doesn't give a rat's ass.



12. Texas: FEMA brings in tons of food and water for evacuees. State officials provide accessible distribution points.

Louisiana: WalMart and private industries bring in tons of food and water for evacuees but are prevented from delivering to evacuees by FEMA. FEMA prevents citizens from reaching distribution points and vice versa.



13. Texas: Media cant find poor blacks in need of assistance they don't look hard enough.

Louisiana: Media focuses on poor blacks in need of assistance cause they were the victims. Believe your own eyes.

14. Texas: Coastal cities suffer some infrastructure damage, Mayors tell residents to stay away until ready for repopulation, no interference from federal officials.

Louisiana: New Orleans is destroyed, business community of NOLA convince Mayor to allow residents tio return home as another hurricane approaches.


15. Louisiana: Unknown number killed by storm and flooding. Brownie and Bush's negligence is criminal.

Texas: 24 killed in bus accident on highway during evacuation, 4storm related deaths.


16. Texas: Jailed prisoners are relocated to other detention facilities outside the storm area.

Louisiana: Jailed prisoners get free.


17. Texas: Local and state officials work with FEMA and Red Cross in recovery operations.

Louisiana: FEMA obstructs Local and state officials from aiding in recovery operations.



18. Texas: Mayor of Galveston demonstrates leadership in managing disaster areas. Mayor of Houston does not.

Louisiana: The President, Chertoff and Brown fail to demonstrate leadership as is stipulate by the National Response Plan, requirin state government to draft former FEMA Director to manage disaster areas


19. Texas: Fuel deliveries can't keep up with demand, some run out of gas on highway, need help from fuel tankers before storm arrives.

Louisiana: Motorists flee from affected areas and are stranded wait till storm hits and electrical power fails.



20. Texas: Galveston Mayor moves citizens out of danger. Houston Mayor tells residents that evacuation is personal responsibility.

Louisiana: Mayor remains in city for weeks, but moves his family to Dallas.


21. Texas: Mayors continue public service announcements and updates on television with Governor's backing and support in hindsight of previous disaster.

Louisiana: Mayor cusses, governor cries, senator threatens president with violence on television, afterall the Federal Governement doesn't give a damn... look at the people in Mississippi and Alabama who still don't have enough food.



22. Louisiana: Democratic Senator says FEMA was slow in responding to 911 calls from Louisiana citizens.

Texas: Republican Senator says "when you call 911, the phone doesn't ring in Washington cause there's only an answering machine, FEMA was an entitlement program before Dubya arrived" now its just a strawman to make people think they are safe.
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bonzotex Donating Member (740 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 07:29 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. Nice! and fast too! I'll use some of this with your nod. N/T
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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #13
19. One correction: On point eleven, Texas evacuees did NOT have food
They evacuated to regions they expected to buy food in. I live in one of those areas. All bread and water were cleaned from the shelves to feed the Houston evacuees at shelters. FEMA managed to get food and water to the shelters BEFORE the hurricane during Rita, but not until two days later after Katrina.

Many evacuees were stuck on the highways and interstates in Texas for over 36 hours. One of their biggest complaints was that they HAD NOT been told to bring food, and expected to buy it along the way. All stores en route had been cleaned out, so many TEXAS evacuees went without food for a day, too. There was no planning to the Texas evacuation. In Louisiana, on the other hand, and in Mississippi, Democratic AND Republican leaders have had evacuation plans drawn out for decades, and are constantly updating them, and even plan their road budgets around maintaining and building evacuation routes.

There was no planning in Texas, and things went horribly wrong. If the hurricane had moved at the same speed as Katrina, and if it had hit Houston, thousands would have been trapped in their cars as the hurricane came ashore.
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melissinha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 11:20 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. thanks you are right
I wrote it pretty quickly and didn't keep in such detail with respect to Rita evacs.... I had heard that provisional supplies was getting scarce here in Austin.... I certainly was not impressed with the evactuation, it was disastrous... Although I only know he left in the middle of this fisasco, my cousin was caught up in this...


Very good point about the speed of Katrina vs Rita, very good. Thanks for the info.
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Booster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-05 08:23 PM
Response to Original message
18. I'm bookmarking this thread because I know I'll be getting this
stupid email from freeper friends. Thanks for all the ammo needed to respond.
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