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malachi Donating Member (653 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:40 PM
Original message
Government Flood Insurance Program Called into Question(STUNNING!
Saw this on ABC World News last night. Outrageous. The chimp admin is totally fucking evil. Check out the 3rd paragraph. der monkey and anyone in his admin that perpetrates these kinds of acts on the citizens of this country should die long, slow, painful deaths.

Victims of Hurricane Isabel, (2003!), Say FEMA Flood Insurance Didn't Come Through.

Sept. 20, 2005 More than 100,000 Gulf Coast homeowners who are expecting help from the federal flood insurance program may be in for a bitter surprise, according to victims of a hurricane that hit the state of Maryland two years ago this week.

"Pennies on the dollar. And they'll be unable to rebuild their homes and lives just as victims from numerous storms across the country have been subjected to for the last years," says Steve Kanstoroom, founder of FEMAINFO.us, a Web site advocating for flood victims, including those whose homes were damaged when Hurricane Isabel triggered a flood surge in the Chesapeake Bay.

snip
Even before Hurricane Katrina hit, the Bush administration had quietly sought to cut back the flood insurance program. In a letter to Congress, the administration said it was only a form of "aid" and a "misconception" that the policyholders' homes should be restored to pre-flood conditions.

According to a former program administrator, that is at odds with the program's intent.

http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/Investigation/story?id=114411...


"My first thing was, 'We have flood insurance,'" recalled Jennifer Dieux of Shady Side, Md. Her home was hit by the Chesapeake Bay flood surge. "It's not going to matter. We're covered. We're going to be fine," Dieux remembers thinking.

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hedda_foil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
1. Astounding!
We HAVE to push Anderson Cooper, Aaron Brown and Keith to cover this even though ABC broke it!
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 04:00 PM
Response to Reply #1
46. FEMA gets involved-especially in flood plain events...
more FEMA facts/history at:

http://www.totse.com/en/conspiracy/the_new_world_order/...
excerpt:
-FEMA's duties and responsibilities have expanded geometrically over the years. The agency's name is now found on numerous mortgage documents, especially if land on a flood plain is involved. Flood insurance is a field which has been taken over by the agency. In 1992 FEMA funded the New England States Earthquake Consortium to-gether with insurance industry groups. In many instances where people were unable to qualify for low-interest loans or reconstruction assistance, free grants of public money were made by the agency. How better to build gratitude while providing disincentives to prepare? In the Midwest, FEMA launched a prototype Geographic Information System to mix commercial and custom software designed to map and analyze data.

FEMA is no stranger to the art and science of relocating people, whether or not they want to go. In 1983, a chemical compound thought to cause cancer, dioxin, was found in soil in and around the community of Times Beach, Mo. FEMA engineered a federal buyout and removal of the town's 2,400 residents.

But what is the true nature of this seemingly all-purpose agency, which has been given responsibility to save us from quakes, refugee situations, toxic spills, excess rain, home heating emergencies, forest fires, ur-ban riots and the like? This parallel government, as some have termed it, makes no public disclosures and operates largely off budget.

Executive Order 12148 authorizes a president or his designate, the director of FEMA, to assume virtually unlimited powers in the event of a civil emergency, defined as 'any accidental, natural, man-caused, or wartime emergency or threat thereof, which causes or may cause substantial injury or harm to the population or substantial damage to or loss of property.

Translated, it means FEMA can intervene 'at will.'

Although the director of FEMA was originally subject to oversight by the secretary of defense and the National Security Council, such was not the case for long. One day in the early 1980s, a colleague of this writer attended a joint meeting on the bottom of a five-level deep FEMA installation near Battle Creek, Mich. As the regional director lectured, a USAF colonel half-dozed. But when the speaker explained that in the event of a major civil emergency, the Joint Chiefs of Staff would report to the director of FEMA, the full bird instantly came to life. Eyes shining like those of an eagle, he nearly came out of his chair.

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Sanity Claws Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:44 PM
Response to Original message
2. What part of the word "insurance" does the * Administration not
Edited on Wed Sep-21-05 12:49 PM by in search of sanity
understand?
If this were a private company, it would be sued for false and deceptive practices. i.e. fraud.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:56 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. this is not aid, we pay for this special insurance
we pay for flood insurance separately

it is not "aid" or a hand-out

however there is a whole crew of cheats led by john stossel, who i assume is paid under the table by the gop, to pretend to believe that flood insurance is some kind of hand-out & we are not entitled to the benefits we PAY for under contract!
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Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #10
16. For this "aid"
I pay an additional $700 per year, on top of my homeowners insurance. And that's just for the structure. No contents coverage.

And my mortgage company requires me to carry it.
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TheDebbieDee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:45 PM
Response to Original message
3. Now that I think about it, weren't there a lot of complaints
regarding slow emergency response to this storm, too? The only difference being that there weren't nearly as many deaths as there were with the Katrina storm.
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Der Blaue Engel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:48 PM
Response to Original message
4. I HATE, HATE, HATE these bastards!
Even before Hurricane Katrina hit, the Bush administration had quietly sought to cut back the flood insurance program. In a letter to Congress, the administration said it was only a form of "aid" and a "misconception" that the policyholders' homes should be restored to pre-flood conditions.


They've even made "aid" a dirty word. They deserve to burn in hell.
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Trevelyan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 05:05 AM
Response to Reply #4
44. The Letter to Democrats at the top of DU Homepage was great
The Bush Regime is destroying every protection they can get their hands on. Skull and Bones, Illuminati means what their subname says THE BROTHERHOOD OF DEATH. Please be at the Sept. 24 March or support one of the groups sponsoring. Code Pink, Million Reasons, PDA, United For Peace, ANSWER.com

A Sound of Distant Thunder
By William Rivers Pitt
A Progressive Call to Take Action
"I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. 'Tis the business of little minds to shrink, but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death."
--Thomas Paine

It seems a million years ago that I stood on the steps of the Capitol Building in May of 2001 with thousands of other activists to protest the illegitimate ascendancy of George W. Bush. This was the first significant demonstration against the Bush administration to take place in Washington DC, but it was not the last. I remember listening to the words of Ronnie Dugger, founder of the Alliance for Democracy, as he raged into the microphone. "We will label these four years of Bush illegitimacy as the Lawless Years," declared Dugger, "the tyranny in American history, the Tyrannical Interlude."

It is difficult to quantify, now that more than 1,500 days of lawlessness have passed, how correct Dugger was when he spoke those words. History will place these days of darkness we have endured among the most corrupt, base, senseless, violent passages of time ever endured since the birth of this republic.

http://www.pdamerica.org/articles/events/sept2005/overv...

souls lost on a bright Tuesday morning, who would be alive but for the negligence and staggering ineptitude of those tasked to stand watch, have been used deliberately and with intent as an excuse to deliver tens of thousands more innocents to the dust of an early grave in Iraq and Afghanistan. Two thousand soldiers, almost all of them young American boys and girls, have had the life blasted out of them because they were sent by their commander-in-chief to find weapons of mass destruction that did not exist. Those soldiers who remain, those soldiers who have been redeployed into the war zone two or three times already, wait with grim resolve to be brought home to their families whole, sane, and safe.

The occupation of Iraq is almost a thousand days old now, and as the self-serving justifications for invasion wither in the desert sun, as the neo-conservative "Bush Doctrine" collapses in a swelling flood of blood and total failure, as more and more people see impeachment as a moral necessity, as those who stand in opposition wonder what they can do to thwart a corrupt and crazed administration that exists entirely without checks and balances, there remains one act of defiance, strength, and solidarity which cannot be ignored.

We need to take it to the streets. All of us.

On Saturday, September 24th, there will be a massive public protest on the streets of Washington, DC. Let's make this gathering dwarf all previous demonstrations against this administration and fill every street and every avenue until the entire nation is forced to stop, and turn its face to the truth. Be there. Bring your friends, your family and your neighbors. It is a moral imperative.

That weekend will involve far more than a protest. On the 25th, Progressive Democrats of America will host a wide-ranging strategy session at the David A. Clarke School of Law on Connecticut Avenue. Join PDA activists from across the nation as we prepare progressive legislative and electoral strategies for the 2006 midterm election. Speakers at this event will include long-time activist and PDA advisor Tom Hayden, voting rights advocate and PDA advisor John Bonifaz and PDA Director Tim Carpenter. Come meet with other organizers in your state to plan for 2006.

On Monday the 26th, Progressive Democrats of America, United for Peace and Justice and a host of allies will work to send a battalion of activists up and down the halls of Congress to demand a withdrawal of troops from Iraq. We will not take no for an answer, and we will have the support of hundreds of thousands of protestors at our backs.

Let the word go forth from this time and place that the progressive movement in America does not accept failure as an option; that the streets of Washington, DC and the halls of Congress will be ours come the close of September; that we are the ones we have been waiting for; and that our time is now. Be there with us. Stand and be true. Working together, we will make a difference.

http://www.unitedforpeace.org /

Map and info http://www.unitedforpeace.org/article.php?id=3091

Schedule, Route Map http://www.unitedforpeace.org/article.php?list=type&typ...
Dear friend,

Given the current political climate, these are critical times for us all to unite efforts on behalf of peace and justice everywhere.

United for Peace and Justice (http://www.unitedforpeace.org ) is a coalition of more than 1300 local and national groups throughout the United States who have joined together to oppose our government's policy of permanent warfare and empire-building.

I want to encourage you to sign up for UFPJ's action alerts: http://www.unitedforpeace.org/email .

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Carolab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:51 PM
Response to Original message
5. My brother's home in VA was damaged by Ivan and he's still fighting FEMA.
Said they aren't worth a damn. Said there has been an ongoing fight between his insurance company and FEMA. And he hasn't been able to get enough to totally repair the damage caused by the flooding in his basement when a tree crashed into the foundation and the winds tore off part of his roof.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. that isn't a flood insurance claim, carolab
when the water damage is the result of a tree crashing into yr home & opening it to the rain water, that is a homeowner's claim & should be covered completely under normal homeowner's

been there, done that, got the t-shirt, my homeowner's paid off w.out complaint

flood insurance is v. limited compared to what homeowner's covers, if you have a choice, you always want to bill yr homeowner's insurance first

do you have an insurance commissioner in yr state to settle this dispute, from yr brief description it sounds open & shut to me but of course there are facts i do not know

other than that i wouldn't know what to suggest other than litigation aga. the insurer because this sounds like the homeowner's insurance is at fault if you ask me
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Carolab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. As I understand it, it was both.
Edited on Wed Sep-21-05 01:00 PM by Carolab
The flooding and the tree were somewhat interdependent but the flooding would have occurred in any case because their home sits in a "basin".

But thanks for the feedback; I'll pass it along.
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converted_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
6. Assholes.....
Us people in Florida are completely screwed. Between this and the back door legislature they passed a month ago (in Florida) that shifts burden of "proof" of where the water actually came from to the home owner, on top of some insurance companies (both ours and our neighbors, we both have different companies) going to 25% deductible on hurricane damage that cannot come off the back end of the check, we are completely unprotected.
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gulfcoastliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #6
14. And dems in the FL senate helped pass it! VICHY DEMS!
There is NO opposition! Just like Reid saying he'll make sure the Dems don't "obstruct" (filibuster) Roberts! Thanks, Reid - you good for nothing minority "leader".
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:55 PM
Response to Original message
8. Saw the report on ABC News
And I was appalled but not surprised that the administration was once again ducking its responsibilities. What was jarring to me is that ABC immediately reported that the administration letter was in fact bullshit. Unfortunately, they didn't go for the home run by actually having an administration figure on camera to explain why they wrote the letter to Congress in 2003, or how the administration could be so wrong.

Now, we can debate the propriety and the wisdom of whether there should be a federal program to guarantee people replacement of their homes in the event of a natural disaster. That's a valid discussion that our lawmakers should have, free of the corrupting influence of corporate interests.

But as the law stands now, government freely made a promise to its citizens. Now that the cost of honoring that promise threatens the massive transfer of Treasury money into the pockets of the overrich, suddenly the government would like to just forget the obligations it signed up for.

Despicable.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. they didn't "Freely" promise anything, we BOUGHT COVERAGE
we pay for flood insurance

it is not welfare

it is not financial aid

it is an insurance plan for which we pay money & receive a contract every freakin' yr

oh & it does NOT guarantee replacement of yr home, it is capped, if you think only the rich should be able to afford to have homes & a secure future, & that the middle class should lose everything & never be able to catch up after a natural disaster...then i think perchance you need to take this discussion to a less progressive site cuz i think you're in the wrong place

some things just aren't debatable

we pay for a service, we should receive it

end of debate
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:12 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. I stand corrected
I didn't mean to imply that the government freely made a promise, but rather that it freely entered into the agreement. Nobody coerced or forced Congress to do this, it was an obligation the government took on for its citizens.

Now Congress and the Bush administration are looking to weasel out of that obligation because to honor it would interrupt, however slightly, the transfer of wealth to the overrich they've been working so hard on.
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shoelace414 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #13
22. Dont; forget
you CAN'T BUY flood insurance from anywhere but the federal government.
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ellie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:55 PM
Response to Original message
9. Insurance is such a scam
You are forced by law to have it, then these companies (and the govt.)refuse to pay. All hail the powerful insurance lobby!
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
11. Saw the report and well thought to myself
Edited on Wed Sep-21-05 12:58 PM by nadinbrzezinski
these boys are gonna bring the next great depression through many means, this is one of them... and they don't even get it

OTOH many folks who voted for them now may wake up to their evil.... but don't count on it. Then again they may, and may decide that it is time for a revolution if a leader comes forth.
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satya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 11:11 PM
Response to Reply #11
41. We Are the Ones We've Been Waiting For...
We have been telling the people that this is the Eleventh Hour
Now you must go back and tell the people that this is the Hour
And there are things to be considered.

Where are you living?
What are you doing?
What are your relationships?
Are you in the right relation?
Where is your water?

Know your garden.
It is time to speak your truth
Create your community.
Be good to each other.
And do not look outside yourself for the leader.
This could be a good time!
There is a river flowing now very fast
It is so great and swift that there are those who will be afraid.
They will try to hold onto the shore.
They will feel they are being torn apart and they will suffer greatly.
Know the river has its destination.
The elders say we must let go of the shore, and push off and into the river,
Keep our eyes open, and our head above the water.
See who is in there with you and Celebrate.
At this time in history, we are to take nothing personally.
Least of all ourselves.
For the moment that we do,

Our spiritual growth and journey comes to a halt.

The time of the lone wolf is over, Gather yourselves!
Banish the word struggle from your attitude and your vocabulary.
All that you do now must be done in a sacred manner
And in celebration.

"We are the ones we've been waiting for..."

The Elders, Hopi Nation, Oraibi, Arizona
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walkon Donating Member (919 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:04 PM
Response to Original message
15. Anyone who believes the Bush gang
is going to do anything to help anyone but themselves is psychotic. There is no money. It is gone. Bush is playing a PR game and every dollar promised is long since gone. Just wait for the States to ask for their Federal reimbursements - not there.
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Xithras Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
18. FFI DOES need to be overhauled.
Sorry to disagree with the masses here, but when some fuckwit builds a million dollar mansion on a sandbar and expects ME to rebuild it when it gets knocked down in a storm, something is wrong. We have developers building homes in areas that NEVER should have been developed, simply because FFI has eliminated the financial risk of doing so.

IMO, FFI shouldn't rebuild anything. If your house is in a floodplain, it should pay you a value equal to your property value so you can buy elsewhere, but you should lose the right to rebuild on your property forever. If you WANT to rebuild in a flood plain, do it on your own dime.

FFI was originally intended to help people out in desperate situations, but it's turned into a subsidy for wealthy developers. They buy land in floodplains because it's cheap, build houses on it, and sell them knowing that they won't be liable when the homes eventually flood. It's a scam, pure and simple. And you and I are paying for it.

Anyone who doesn't believe it should come out here and look at all of the development around the California Delta. Walk into the showroom of any of the housing developments and ask them about floods...the first thing out of the salespersons mouth will be "Don't worry about that, the federal government offers insurance on all of these homes". Some of these newer developments are in 10 YEAR FLOODPLAINS and have been underwater a half dozen times in my lifetime. In one development, several thousand people now live on land that I used to FISH every spring!

It's stupidity, and it needs to be fixed NOW.
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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. That's correct
while I distrust anything that a bush gang member does, I do understand that the NFIP is really a subsidy for the wealthy coastal homeowner.
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #19
28. as someone who owns one (1)
two bedroom, 60 year old home in the barrier beach City of Long Beach NY (along with several thousand - NOT RICH - other people) I object to your tone, and the sweeping generalities....

I have bought NFIP insurance for years, thinking that it would help cover what the homeowners doesn't in case "the big one" ever hits... for the first time since 1938...

This news about NFIP is very unwelcome...
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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. yes, you are right
let me be more specific. This is the type of subsidy that does, in fact, assist a group of homeowners like yourself, but unfortunately its used as a finance strategy for those who really don't need that government assistance. What I meant to say is that its a well intended program that is deeply flawed insofar as it a handout to another group of homeowners who don't need it. Zat make sense?
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. yes, thanks..
What's needed is some serious loophole repair!
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kcass1954 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #19
32. Nobody's getting rich on flood insurance claims...
We all know there are abuses in the system. But the maximum coverage available is $250,000 for the structure, and $100,000 for contents. With real estate values what they are these days, you don't need much of a house to max out the policy.

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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. that's exactly right.
But the premiums are nowhere nearly enough to cover claims in the long run. SO what you get is basically a guaranteed payout of up to $250,000 home (that may be valued in the millions) in exchange for miniscule premiums. It shouldn't be called insurance because insurance is designed to cover the unexpected. Floods are expected. The losses are expected. So million dollar homeowners should not benefit from this windfall. I haven't looked at an NFIP rate for some years, but the premium is negligible compared to market rates. Its a subsidy that helps the middle class, but disproportionately helps the rich because they will typically have higher losses.
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kcass1954 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. Then maybe the premium structure needs to be reviewed and updated. n/t
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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. there is no means testing in insurance premiums
Direct assistance to homeowners is the simplest and most cost effective method, but that would make too much sense.
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highplainsdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. That ABC story showed a middle-class home, not a mansion.
Federal flood insurance was offering to pay less than half of estimated repair costs. The family was still living in a trailer, unable to afford the necessary repairs. They'd been cheated by our government.

As I recall, the main FEMA excuse was that they'd cover damage only up to the water mark, so they wouldn't pay for repairing/replacing walls when rooms weren't flooded to the ceiling, only halfway up. But it's rather hard to replace just the lower half of a wall.
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Xithras Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. My original point still stands.
Should FFI pay off that house? Yes, but they should be forced to hand the deed to the government in exchange. It is NOT the taxpayers job to subsidize their decision to live in a flood plain.

FFI should pay off the value of the house in cash. That way, the homeowners can buy elsewhere. Eventually, most coastal areas will become parkland and act as a buffer against big storms. The few diehards who remain will do so at their own risk and expense.

Oh, and FFI should be cut off NOW for all new development.

Whether the home costs $1.5 million or $150,000, the point still stands: Homes shouldn't be built in areas where the statistical risk of flood is 100%. That means beaches, riversides, canyon bottoms, and other areas where water is present. If people want to live there, they either need to assume the risk themselves, or build their homes in such a way that they won't be destroyed when the inevitable flood occurs.
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CitrusLib Donating Member (748 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Exactly. An excellent pair of posts. Thank you.
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nomatrix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #25
42. Let's examine this statement......
Should FFI pay off that house? Yes, but they should be forced to hand the deed to the government in exchange. It is NOT the taxpayers job to subsidize their decision to live in a flood plain.

In the Billions offered by SantaCongress, what $$$ go to damaged oil rigs/refineries?

How will insurance (taxpayer) pay for refinery damage in LA/MS/TX?

With the govt land grab, no fuss with permits etc.
Land is condemned anyway.
Funny, did Kuwait know this when it offered to build a refinery on U.S. soil?


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DS1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #18
23. I was just thinking to myself
aside from all the homes grandfathered in, no new home built on the coast should cost more than 60,000. That way, the homes will be built accordingly, or not - at the homebuyer's risk.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:27 PM
Response to Original message
20. Why the surprise? Republican voters even think this is appropriate.
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blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 01:45 PM
Response to Original message
24. flood insurance is not about insurance
It is about selling houses. It undoubtably started out as a good thing but got hijacked, in the Reagan (may he rot) years I think, by the real estate industry. By extending it to all sorts of new construction it allowed those greedy fucks to build on marginal land, filled wetlands, with the understanding that you could have that beautiful backbay sunset without worries if the backbay came to visit. It has been the ruination of a lot of exquisite lowland habitat and it looks like it will be the ruination of a lot of people too. All the while those greedy bastards are laughing all the way to the bank.

In a sensible world it would have been offered to existing structures at the inception of the program but NOT to new structures in flood prone areas. As they say, Mother Nature bats last.
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dcfirefighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
27. Revise FFI, no grandfathering
I like Xinthras idea of FFI being a buy-out. We'll (we the people) will pay for your damages, but we're keeping your land as greenspace.

No grandfathering. Then it's first come first keep: "oh, the hampstead Smither's, they bought back in the '90's, lucky them, with the new laws, they've practically got this island to themselsves." Well, I say, if the Smither's house stands, they can keep it. If it gets washed away, we'll pay them for it, but keep the land.
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kcass1954 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 07:03 PM
Response to Reply #27
34. And what are you going to give me for the value of my land?
I'm in south Florida. My house is worth somewhere around $300,000. Of that, the land itself is probably worth $120,000 or so. This means my flood policy will only pay me on the $180,000 value of the structure, or up the the amount of coverage that we've designated on the policy. Am I supposed to give my $120,000 land equity to the community? I don't fucking think so! And the $180,000 I'll get for the structure won't be nearly enough for me to purchase a comparable property.

There are very few areas in south Florida that are NOT located in a designated flood zone. There are a few "pockets" in every community that are just enough above sea level that flood insurance is not needed. I'm 15 miles west of the beach, and in a flood zone "A".

BTW, we're not "rich" by any means - we just bought in the right community at the right time.
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Jose Diablo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 05:43 PM
Response to Original message
30. Yes, the gov should buy the land
and then go after the developers, banks, real estate companies and general contractors that built on these flood plains. If the developer has closed the company, then go after the private individuals assets that did own the company at that time. Treat then to the freezing asset features of Patriot Act, just like terrorists. That will teach the politicos to not stamp on the constitution.

While we are at it, find out what politician recieved campaign money from these guys and then go after the politico's assets too until every cent is recaptured.

If they cannot pay, then send them to prison on contempt of court until they do cough it up, just like the new Bankruptcy laws allows. Of course I imagine that would include most politicians, especially the republicans, probably a lot of judges too.

The corruption in this country is BS.
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troubleinwinter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 07:54 PM
Response to Original message
37. People are required to purchase FFI...
and believe it is supposed to COVER FLOOD damage! WTF is it supposed to be for, but to cover damage!?

I hate the fuckers, too.

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splat@14 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 08:58 PM
Response to Original message
38. I find this amazing. My family and I flooded twice and were covered
Edited on Wed Sep-21-05 09:01 PM by splat@14
by the federal insurance. This was back in `94 and again in `98 in SE Texas (I'm on high ground now, in the same area waiting for Rita to get here!). I have to say that our experience with FEMA and the flood insurance people were great, no problems. FEMA was there the next day (James Whitt (sp?) term) and the insurance people showed up later as they had to bring in adjusters from out of state. They really worked with us to get our problem resolved. My only complaints over the whole ordeal, both times, were (1) with local government allowing unrestricted building before and since that aggravate the flooding down and the thieving contractors. Sorry to hear of your problems, only I change I know of between then and now is Bush.....

I hope you get the situation fixed, flooding is a mess beyond the heartbreak of the personal loss. No one knows `til they have been there. I don't mean to say its worse than any other catastrophe, its just unique. All the best.
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 10:03 PM
Response to Original message
39. The crap NEVER ends with the Bush regime.
Has there EVER been any group of people in the WH who actively, daily damaged Americans and America more than this group? And I'm talking real damage, not the "damage" of ideological claptrap.

Why are they still in our White House?
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Trevelyan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 05:15 AM
Response to Reply #39
45. We Have At Least One Champion, Rep. John Conyers, Don't Let Him and Your
Edited on Thu Sep-22-05 05:18 AM by Trevelyan
Families, And America and The World Down, NOW IS THE TIME TO PARTICIPATE IN CONYERS' TRULY COURAGEOUS STEPS TO HOLD THIS REGIME ACCOUNTABLE FOR ITS ACTIONS AND TO PROTECT OUR VOTE!!!

http://www.johnconyers.com /
http://www.conyersblog.us /

Tuesday, September 20th, 2005

Good Start on Defeating Photo ID Proposal

We made very good progress on the first day, thanks in no small part to your help. We recieved lots of press, including an AP story. We got great editorials in both the New York Times and the Washington Post. The New York Times was particularly strong, writing "the bombshell recommendation is for the states to require voters to
have drivers' licenses or a government-issued photo ID. That would not be a great burden for people who have drivers' licenses, but it would be for those who don't, and they are disproportionately poor, elderly or members of minorities.

These voters would have to get special photo ID's and keep them updated. If they didn't have the ID's, their right to vote would be taken away. The commission recommends that the cards be free. But election administration is notoriously underfinanced, and it is not hard to imagine that states would charge for them. Georgia is already charging $20 and more for each of its state voter cards."

I also participated in a press conference today with Senators Obama and Dodd and Rep. John Lewis where we announced our resolution opposing the ID requirement.

Our petition to the Speaker and Majority Leader is going well, with approximately 4,000 signatories already. Please let your friends and family know about this so we can keep the momentum going in this critical fight. :hi:
**************
http://johnconyers.com/index.asp?Type=SUPERFORMS&SEC={9...

:thumbsup: Please Sign the Letter to Congressional Leadership. :patriot:

Dear Mr. -Speaker/Majority Leader-:

The advances our country has achieved in voting rights over the past half-century have provided a model for democracies across the globe. Recently, we are sad to say, there are proposals being readied that would set us back in that struggle. In particular, the Baker-Carter Commission Report includes a proposal for a national ID requirement to vote that could disenfranchise over ten percent of eligible voters.

When voting rights legislation is considered in the , we strongly urge you to exclude this provision........

:kick: :pals: :applause: :applause: :thumbsup:
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Sgent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-21-05 10:21 PM
Response to Original message
40. I don't like
the NFIP system for a variety of reasons -- I think the feds should reinsure insurance companies, who would have to include flood as a basic coverage. This gets them out of this completely.

That being said, THE NFIP IS NOT DIRECTLY SUBSIDIZED. Look at the facts -- they have collected 21B in premium to 13B in claims. Even with Katrina & Rita, after payouts they will still be in the positive after a year or so.

The only indirect subsidy is that it has a credit line with the Treasury that must be repaid with interest, and that its implicitly gaurenteed payment by the US Treasury. Those are powerful advantages to be sure, but its never taken advantage of them in the past.
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IrishBloodEngHeart Donating Member (815 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 12:42 AM
Response to Original message
43. Flood insurance is stupid
the government subsidizes people living in high risk flood areas and offers them insurance for less than a market rate.

All it does is encourage people to build and rebuild in areas that have a high propensity to flood. Its a really stupid program.
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