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after 4+ years on DU, i've come to the conclusion that

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KG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:47 AM
Original message
after 4+ years on DU, i've come to the conclusion that
there is no issue that some on this board won't justify the dem party just surrender on. 'wrong fight', 'dems can't win this one', 'we'll fight the next one' etc.

or my fave 'it will turn off voters that never vote for us anyway'.

so, i was wondering, is there any issue dems shouldn't comprimise on?

surely there's is a rock bottom. or maybe not. :eyes:
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grytpype Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
1. Slavery.
Dems should take a firm stand against involuntary servitude unless that would cost us votes in Mississippi.
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cally Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:54 AM
Response to Reply #1
7. No, we would lose donations from Abramoff and
associates. Just talk against slavery as if it's all in the past. :sarcasm: (Delay and Abramoff support the Marianas Islands 'capitalism' where slevery is rampant.)
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jonnyblitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:50 AM
Response to Original message
2. and THIS is why people run to the arms of a Nader type...
but of course they don't see that...they are too concerned with the illusory "centrist, fence sitter" vote who they fear might get turned off if we put down our tea and crumpets and actually raise our voice over an issue.. DU "ACTIVISTs" MY ASS.. :puke:
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acmejack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:54 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. So what would you have us do?
I notice you take a gratuitous shot at the DU activists. WTF? I am sure you have a much better plan for us to pursue, please share it with us. I am sure we can all use your enlightenment, oh wise one.
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jmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:58 AM
Response to Reply #2
12. Exactly
The lesser evil can only get so many people to the polls. Nobody wants to vote for a person or a party that gives them that you can't do any better than me attitude and tells them to just deal it.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:50 AM
Response to Original message
3. We have September
to reveal this nominee as all the facts come in. If we don't yell now, the media will have to quit republican strategic coverage and be left with Treasongate.
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Ripley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:53 AM
Response to Original message
4. Torture.
It has it's redeeming values after all. :eyes: :sarcasm:
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OrlandoGator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:53 AM
Response to Original message
5. Contrast that with the GOP NEVER backing down from their message.
That's why memes like "flip-flop" stick.
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:54 AM
Response to Original message
6. "some on this board" can be
anyone

I'm merely pointing out the obvious.
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OnionPatch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:56 AM
Response to Original message
9. Perhaps
Different people are willing to compromise different things. Not every Democrat can be exactly the same. How many people are Democrats? I don't know the numbers but I don't see how you can ever get 100% of all Dems to agree on one particular issue. There will always be some who consider this or that issue "not worth fighting."
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:57 AM
Response to Original message
10. I would have thought
support of a war (clearly illegal according to the Nuremberg War Tribunals) would be the bottom line, but I was wrong on that also.


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KG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:58 AM
Response to Original message
11. surely there's an issue the dem party can draw a line in the sand on?
haven't seen one on the last 20 years or so....
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Stevepol Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 08:07 AM
Response to Reply #11
17. The one issue is FAIR AND TRANSPARENT ELECTIONS!!!
If every Democrat would come out four-square for paper ballot print-outs and fair and random audits FOR EVERY ELECTION where electronic voting machines are used to count the votes, the Repubs would begin to think before they do and say the ridiculous things they do, and Dems wouldn't be so afraid of standing up for their principles (where they actually have principles). This issue is as serious as the Civil Rights issues of the 60s. On it hinges our whole democracy. Do we want a democracy or not?

As things stand now, Repubs can say or do anything they want because they've got a sense or know (if they're Delay or Rove) that it doesn't really matter; there's no way they can lose an election anyway since the machines are so obviously rigged.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 07:59 AM
Response to Original message
13. and after many years, I've concluded most DU'ers are reactionary screamers
who, in the end, are much less effective then they think they are because their inability to see the big picture ensures that Democrats remain divided.
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 08:03 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. keep in mind though
that there are various perceptions of what the "big picture' actually is.
One version may be quite different than another's.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 08:09 AM
Response to Reply #16
18. taking any larger view requires one put a check on the emotions...
and objectivity.

Neither of which are strong points around here.
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ulysses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 08:18 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. what do you expect that objectivity would bring us?
:shrug:
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Ripley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 08:26 AM
Response to Reply #18
21. So. Putting a check on the emotions on an anonymous message board is...
A noble, society-changing thing for liberals to do?

Did you think you were in a DLC chat room by mistake?
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 08:02 AM
Response to Original message
14. Individual freedom of choice vs. government mandated intrusions? n/t
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 08:02 AM
Response to Original message
15. it is chronic isn't it?
fighting risks losing and despite years of steady losses by failing to fight we keep coming up with new reasons why risk-avoidance is always the best path.

That said, I think that senate Democrats ought to ask Roberts about his position on Roe v Wade and other contentious issues and stand against him only if he refuses to answer or his answers are so far from the norm as to make him clearly a radical right-winger.
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ramapo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 08:22 AM
Response to Original message
20. The fairly useless party
Maybe it should be the totally useless party. I don't expect anything from the Democratic Party and I'm never disappointed.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 08:33 AM
Response to Original message
22. done with dems, dems do nothing, dems useless, dems yada yada
yada


ya, right, you have it going in the right direction. things dont go your way, bush does something with all his power and control and dems dont stop it, blame the dems. not bush who actually did it. blame the dems. walk from the party. throw a tantrum. say how bad the dems are. say how bad the fellow dems on the board are. throw a fit

that is the right way. i understand now. being the fighter that you all are. point the finger right at the dems and say how worthless they are

that is the right attitude

being on this board the amount of time i have i have learned, inevitably, doesnt matter the work the dem does, they are going to be dissed by a group. they are going to be the one villified even though they arent the ones in decision making position

so much better just to yell at dems and say how worthless and useless they are and you are no longer going to support them
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