Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

This is thier plan ...

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
 
OhNoTheyDidNot Donating Member (412 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 12:42 AM
Original message
This is thier plan ...
They won't take away Roe at first, they'll tighten underage abortions first, then, manditory consent by parents, then 4 months illegal, then 3 months illegal, etc. They won't do anything drastic at first, it will be a slow, strategic carving. Dems are going to go along with this - then boom, then they'll drop it. Illegal. You watch - this is the way it's going down
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
tuvor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 12:47 AM
Response to Original message
1. Hey, ONTDN...
Welcome to DU!

:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OhNoTheyDidNot Donating Member (412 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. thanks man
Scary time
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NorCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 12:49 AM
Response to Original message
2. Greetings Comrade. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Syrinx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 12:50 AM
Response to Original message
4. I think that's about right
Unless Stevens retires or dies. Then Roe will be reversed soon.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tweed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 12:56 AM
Response to Original message
5. makes sense, why take away your biggest fundraiser?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 12:59 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. It's a fundraiser on both sides.
Politicians just NEVER kill cash cows.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ultraist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 12:56 AM
Response to Original message
6. It may go down this way...
Edited on Wed Jul-20-05 12:58 AM by ultraist
Since they have already been carving away at a woman's right to privacy (allowing pharmacists to refuse to dispense birth control, putting more restrictions on abortions, etc), they will OVERTURN Roe to appease their fundie base. THEN, each state will have varying laws on abortion. (Remember, Roberts did work for Rehnquist).

Since, the MAJORITY of Americans do not believe abortion should be illegal, there will be a backlash to the SCOTUS decision and conservative move, whereby most of the states essentially leave the existing laws alone, which of course do not conflict with Roe.

A few very conservative states, will place more restrictions on abortions, likely redefining viability (putting it at 3-4 months rather than six months). But, all in all, there will not be drastic changes in most states.

Just a thought, I could be way off here.

edit to add: Consider too that in many "red" states, the state legislatures are Dem controlled, such as in my state of NC. I really couldn't see my state outlawing abortion. We also have a Dem governor.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mcctatas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #6
11. Damn...
I guess great minds do think alike, I couldn't have said it better myself, although if i typed faster I might have said it sooner. :toast:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ultraist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:17 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. A belated welcome to DU!
:hi: And thanks!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mcctatas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. Thanks for the welcome...
DU is my new addiction, I wish I would have discovered it sooner.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Booster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
31. I totally agree with you and believe this is the way it should be.
Then if the fundies want abortion to be illegal, they can move to a state that makes it illegal. Problem solved. Matter of fact, maybe we'll get some of the undesirables out of my state.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
firefox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #6
32. Overturning means abortion is murder
I disagree with this train of thought. Overturning Roe v Wade means abortion is murder. States cannot legalize murder.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mcctatas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:01 AM
Response to Original message
8. It all depends on what cases they bring out first...
Parental consent will go first, but I really think they will do one of three things: Let Roe stand (I seriously doubt it), overturn it altogether, or return the decision to the states (most probable). I'm sure operation rescue et. al. have been working on test cases for a long time so they will only bring one if they think it will succeed, and to challenge Roe incrementally by gestation will undrmine the argument that life begins at conception. We talk about this alot at the clinic I work at, and it seems likely that this is the way it will go down. But I could be totally wrong, in which case, I apologize for the time you spent reading this that you will never get back. :hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TimeChaser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:01 AM
Response to Original message
9. Agreed
I don't think they'll be able to outlaw abortion in one blow, but most Americans would never notice if they did it piece by piece.

Welcome to DU :hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NAO Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:08 AM
Response to Original message
10. Their Plan - In Chilling Detail - We will long for the 'coat hanger days'
When Bush and the Religious Reich have advanced their plan, I think we will YEARN for the days of wire coat-hangers

Some have speculated that with the resignation of O'Connor, who was the swing vote protecting Roe v. Wade, we will soon see the overturning of that decision. Predictions for this scenario have ranged from ideas about abortion being unavailable in some states, and available in others, to the return to the 'coat-hanger' era before Roe.

I think that it is going to be MUCH worse than that. The anti-abortionists see their situation as being historically parallel to the abolitionists. They have used Dred v. Scott in their rhetoric for a while now.

***

What I predict for the post-Roe US looks like this:

- the overturn of the decision;

- Bush makes a speech deliberately designed to mimic the Emancipation Proclamation, declaring the 'end to the genocide' and affirming the Constitutional Rights of Unborn US Citizens;

- a Constitutional Amendment is passed affirming the Citizenship and Equal Protection under the Law for the Not-yet Born.

***

Consequent to these actions, performing, seeking, or assisting an abortion in any way will be an act of FIRST DEGREE MURDER. It will be legally construed as pre-meditated murder. It will be see as no different than hiring a mafia hit man to take out an 8 year old child whose care is interfering with the career of his mother.

I think they will also seek to establish by legislation or precedent or both, that the first-degree murder of an unborn US Citizen is a capital offense which more than merits the DEATH PENALTY. If they can get the death penalty for doctor, mother, driver, and financier, I think they will feel that justice has been done. They will seek the death penalty for abortion (not called abortion any more, now known as the 'pre-mediated murder of an unborn person') in every case for all culpable parties.

Under this scenario - which may sound extreme until you have spent some time immersed in Christian culture, and read the writings of the Dominionists - people will YEARN for the good old days of the 'coat-hanger' when the only risks of abortion were from a botched procedure and there was no risk of being indited of a capital crime and sentenced to death.

****
****

Dominionism's Theocratic Designs and Radical Clerics


Fundamentalist Radical Clerics such as Falwell, Dobson, and Robertson are not merely medieval throwbacks or misguided religious hacks. They are part of a well organized subversionary movement known as "Dominionism". Dominionism constitutes a serious threat to American Democracy. These Radical Clerics have developed and are executing a detailed plan to gradually replace the free, secular democratic society of the United States with a Theocracy.

It is critical that people become aware of the extreme agenda these people have for the United States and ultimately for the world. The results of the 2004 Presidential Election were not a fluke or something that was drummed up over a period of months. It has been in planning for over 20 years, and what we are seeing take place now is, in the words of Katherine Yurica, "the swift advance of a planned coup".

The Swift Advance of a Planned Coup: Conquering by Stealth and Deception - How the Dominionists Are Succeeding in Their Quest for National Control and World Power
http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/TheSwiftAdvance...

The Despoiling of America: How George W. Bush became the head of the new American Dominionist Church/State
http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/TheDespoilingOf...

Video on the Christian Reconstructionist Dominionist Theocratic Agenda
http://www.theocracywatch.org/av/video_dominion.ram

The Rise of the Religious Right in the Republican Party
a public information project from TheocracyWatch.org

http://www.theocracywatch.org

The Religious Right - An Anti-American Terrorist Movement
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article8816.ht...

My Predictions for the Post-Roe World as Designed by the Radical Clerics of the Religious Reich


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Syrinx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. Except...
Edited on Wed Jul-20-05 01:22 AM by Syrinx
I don't think Bush is really a Dominionist. He's a corporatist in Dominionist's clothing, though many of his supporters ARE Chrisitian Reconstructionists, which is just as bad, I guess. But I don't think Bush gives a damn about Christ, or anything else except himself.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #14
26. Agree, but..........................
He needs his "base" just like you know who.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Corgigal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:28 AM
Response to Reply #10
16. How is any state going to be able to stop this?
Overseas they already have boats set up so that abortions can be performed in international waters. I bet we get them set up here too. If it becomes a state issue then plenty of women will be traveling across lines and how will a state , with I guess some law enforcement agency going to know who had an abortion? How many more jails do we need to build? Who gets to pay for that?

We don't want to pay for the kids we have in this country now to have a warm place to stay, food and education and now on top of this we get to paid for enforcement? Has any of this republican tax break lovers thought about this?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NAO Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:35 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. The US will consider 'infanticide' grounds for military intervention
to save the unborn who are being massacred by godless infidels in other countries.

It will require enormous military expenditures, with giant contracts going to the defense industry, but it will be 'the price we must pay to do right and defend the weak.'
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Corgigal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:37 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. opps, my bad
Your right. Big bucks could be made for the corporate sponsors. It's all good.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 01:13 AM
Response to Original message
12. they won't do jack shit. abortion is window dressing. this is all about..
taking care of corporate business.

Hillbilly Hitler art:



Blog:



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
paula777 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
19. Sounds about right -
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 03:20 PM
Response to Original message
20. Welcome to DU *Wave*
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
southernleftylady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 03:21 PM
Response to Original message
21. yup
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
22. It is simpler than that
They will allow states to set their own parameters.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
paula777 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 04:05 PM
Response to Reply #22
27. For real? It will be a state issue? Was it like that before Roe?
I don't remember ...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BeHereNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 03:27 PM
Response to Original message
23. Welcome to DU ONTDN
This is the Evangelical vision you know,
a Theocracy- and you are right, they
have been slow and patient in turning
this country into a Facist-Christo dictatorship.
As a DU newcomer, can I recommend you do
some reading about the rise of the dominionists in
America?
They are the tools of the corporatists and
actually think they are in agreement when in
reality, the corporatists simply recognized they would
be useful in destroying America as we have always known it.
http://www.yuricareport.com

The person who runs the Yurica Report web site
has been researching and documenting these
people for nearly three decades.

BHN
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 03:27 PM
Response to Original message
24. Yes, they will most likely carve away at it until we are pre- R. v. W.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Son of California Donating Member (467 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
25. which is why you stand and fight here
and don't wait until later.
FIGHT NOW! While we still have the advantage.
It's early,
we can paint this guy as a weirdo and beat him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
progressoid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 04:42 PM
Response to Original message
28. I think the issue is not how but rather
the issue is, "Dems are going to go along with this". From the local to the national level we need to keep up the pressure on our side not to cave under fundie rhetoric.

They will get away with it if we let them.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AnnInLa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
29. I agree, but think partial-birth abortions will be the first to go
Edited on Wed Jul-20-05 04:49 PM by AnnInLa
the process to a complete ban on abortions inevitably will take a long time, so their bogie-man will stay front and center.

But, watch for birth control to be a target then...of course, several big pharmas will fight that....that should prove interesting.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
StuckinBFE Donating Member (177 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
30. I honestly do not think the majority of America would go along with this
There are people on the side that do not think abortion is correct but still stand by that it should be legal. Plus if RvW was overturned then the republicans will lose some interest of the extreme right(i.e. they will lose some of there funding) because now RvW will not be on the agenda.

Honestly I believe that there would be such a huge backlash in this country if RvW was overturn, I am thinking protest of Vietnam propositions.

My hope is that Bush gets impeached and we can throw all of his judges out, but I don't think it will happen and I am pretty sure legally you can't do that.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Sep 19th 2014, 11:16 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC