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placton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:20 PM
Original message
Liberals Must Make London Political
Yeah, I know, the terrorists bear responsibility and blame for their evil, yada yada yada.

But we must make this political. For one reason: Bush will. We are fools if we think if we just express dismay and condemnation of the perps, the country will appreciate our fine manners. They won't. We need to say this:

1. Bush has lost the war on terror. He's fought 3 battles
-prevent 911: HE LOST
-prevent London: HE LOST
-make Iraq War a succes: HE LOST
We must stress this is Bush's fault. The right is already lying otherwise.

2. Bush has NEVER had a success as president. He promised that the war would be there, not here, as his most recent lie about "Why Iraq is a GOOD War" We have to hammer on the fact that he is ALWAYS wrong: tax cut, the economy, homeland security, foreign policy - you name it.

We must do it now. Because if we don't - the right will define London as a reason they are on the winning side.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
1. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. If not now, when?????
Candlelight vigils are sweet but they will not bring back the dead. It's time to call these bastards into accountability for all our sakes, politics be damned. This is about survival.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. I understand, and welcome to DU...but this approach is not working
The right is already in their "kill all muslims now" mode. It's time we start talking about Bush/Blair as failures. They are.
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tk2kewl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:44 PM
Response to Reply #14
25. I am with you. INCOMPETENCE AND LIES have made the world MORE DANGEROUS
DSM and Plame are the proof, death and destruction are the result
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alarimer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #14
29. Yes
How is this other than a massive failure of the "war on terror"? Bush declared the war following 9/11 (a massive intelligence failure on his administration's part at the least). There have been no successes in this war (I guess it depends on how you define success)- Bin Laden and most of his organization still exist.
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baby_mouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:50 PM
Response to Reply #8
26. There's no point focussing invective on the perpetrators

Their guilt is a given, as are our feelings towwards them.

The politicians who arranged the context for this latest atrocity are supposed to be the people who guide the strategy of nations like USA and UK, they create the conditions under which these things occur. We can't fight the terrorists ourselves directly, that's what the armed services are for. We CAN enlighten all with brains that the current course of action taken by our "leaders" is obviously failing.
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. Right NOW is the time!
There is no better time than the present. :grr:

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placton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. that would be the Tom Daschle approach
be polite, and nice, and lose

Limbaugh and the gang are already making this political
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Mutley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #1
17. I don't see it as stooping to their level.
I see it as telling the truth. The wingnuts are already turning this into a political fight. They are already saying that this is OUR fault for being lax on terrorism. I have heard it. Turn on Hannity, Rush, Fox News. Take a look at www.freerepublic.com They are sitting behind their keyboards right now saying that we are sympathizing with the terrorists. And all of America will believe them if we don't set them straight. They have already made this political; they've been doing it since the moment those bombs went off in London.

We must get the message out immediately that that is bullshit. That this is the fault of Bush's failed policies. This is evidence that the world is not only no safer than before 9/11, but that it is decidedly LESS safe, that Bush's methods of dealing with terrorism ARE NOT WORKING. If we don't start talking about this NOW, then by tomorrow the masses will already have been brainwashed.
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Mutley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #1
19. Dupe -
Edited on Thu Jul-07-05 06:15 PM by mutley_r_us
double post. sorry about that.
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navvet Donating Member (190 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
2. Well thought out
if we don't we will be tarred with the soft on defense and terrorist brush (it's happened before).
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RPM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
3. I agree
it's hard for the families who lost loved ones, but it must be impressed upon persons that this was a result of ** and Blair's failed foreign policies.

if we fail to do so, those who died today will have died in vain.
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SmokingJacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
5. We don't have to make it political -- it IS.
A terrorist bombing is by its nature political.

We just have to make sure our interpretation of events is heard. And I do agree with your interpretation.

But it's not "politicizing."
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Vincardog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
7. Right on another example of aWoL's abject failure in every aspect of his
entire life. What a dismal failure AGAIN
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ms liberty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:25 PM
Response to Original message
9. I agree 100% n/t
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sickinohio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
11. #3 - Prevent Madrid Bombings
HE LOST
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:28 PM
Response to Original message
12. Bush cannot find his way out of a wet paper bag
yes I did send that to my local paper in a letter to the editor
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lildreamer316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
13. Recommended.
Truer words were never spoken However, we can couch it with some COMPASSION.
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ICantBelieve Donating Member (312 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 05:51 PM
Response to Original message
15. No, not "political"
Just speak the truth. Leave the politics out of it. What's the truth? We still haven't caught bin Laden. We're using our resources in Iraq. Iraq is a training ground for new terrorists. This isn't political. It's the truth. Don't make it political. Leave Bush's name out of it.
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jillan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 06:07 PM
Response to Original message
16. I agree with you.
This proves that what he is doing is NOT working.

Al queda is alive and well. And they hate us more now than they did on 9/11.

Our borders are still wide open, as well as our ports.

Talk it up people.
Bush has made us less safe.

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raysr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 06:08 PM
Original message
BUSH=TOTAL FAILURE!!!!!!!!
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edhopper Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 06:08 PM
Response to Original message
18. Yes,
after 9/11 we all said we should support our President and leave politics behind. And he betrayed us and used it politically every time he could. Now we must show how this proves what a failure he has been.
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jillan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 06:15 PM
Response to Original message
20. I agree with you.

This proves that what he is doing is NOT working.

Al queda is alive and well. And they hate us more now than they did on 9/11.

Our borders are still wide open, as well as our ports.

Talk it up people.
Bush has made us less safe.
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raysr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 06:43 PM
Response to Original message
21. BUSH=TOTAL FAILURE!!!!!!!!
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:06 PM
Response to Original message
22. bush* made a HUGE deal ....
Last Tuesday night, bush* made a HUGE deal out of the the fact that there have been NO terrorists attacks since HE invaded Iraq. In fact, he justified the Invasion and Occupation of Iraq on this:

"We brought the fight to the terrorists. We are fighting them in Iraq so we don't have to fight them here"!!! gwbush* June 28 '05

This was the equivalence of his "Bring em On!" taunt.
Well, the terrorists "reached out and touched the Poodle" this morning.
They can easily 'reach out and touch" the USA because bush* (the failure) has squandered over $300 Billion on a useless war in Iraq instead of "protecting America" by strengthening our defenses.

*Homeland Security underfunded

*Ports virtually unprotected

*98% of Containers admitted to USA uninspected

*Cargo Holds of Airliners uninspected

*Nuclear Plants porous ineffective security

*Chem Plants unprotected

*Osama STILL free

*War to destroy Al-Qaeda a FAILURE

WorldWide Terrorism INCREASING!!!!


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ReadTomPaine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:33 PM
Response to Original message
23. Thank you for posting this.
Even here, there are still Bush apologists who want to "give therapy" to the GOP rather than fight them. The RW are sharpening this incident into a knife against us as we speak. Time to take their toys away.

We should have Dems on every TV station and media outlet slamming Bush on this failure 24/7 until we see the cracks start to form. That's a plan that should have been in place for years, waiting for this type of incident to occur as it inevitably would under Bush's criminally negligent handling of our security interests. Slam them harder than they slam us for longer than they can take it. That wouldn't be very hard, either. The GOP has been weak lately, and are never good on defense.

From what I've seen here and elsewhere today however, Democrats are still too happy being comfortably paid losers than winners with hostile political enemies. There are, amazingly, still no guts for a real fight. That's not "strategy" or "congressional comity", it's cowardice and capitulation. The fact staring us in the face is this- we won't prevail in this fight until we want to win more than they do. Simple as that.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:21 PM
Response to Original message
24. I think you must be right.
Our most useful remembrance of those who have been killed by this man and those whose lives have been altered forever to TO STOP THIS.

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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 10:32 PM
Response to Original message
27. It's a mistake to set out to politicize a human tragedy like this.
I know the Bushistas and their wingnut supporters DO politicize such events -- and we should express shock and sorrow and disgust whenever they do.

Events like this are big enough to enter almost everyone's consciousness. If we do a good job telling a coherent and consistent story around most events, people can put this one into the picture themselves.
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scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-08-05 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #27
33. A tsunami is a "human tragedy", a terrorist attack is a POLITICAL act!
Edited on Fri Jul-08-05 02:08 PM by scarletwoman
The tragedy lies in the egregious failures of the bush junta's policies!

sw
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-08-05 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #33
39. It's not a political act for the victims -- it's just a tragedy for them.
Going to a funeral, or lying in the hospital with serious injuries isn't going to predispose most of the directly affected people to discuss underlying political issues.

I completely agree that the Bushista policies are a failure.

And I'm inclined to suspect that events like the London bombing may be closely related to the failure of those policies.

But, only those people already inclined to draw such a connection will draw this one, while those uninclined to draw the connection will simply be alienated by people attempting to draw the connection.

Use other facts to convince people that the policies are immoral, inadequately examined, and poorly executed ...
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nashville_brook Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 11:17 PM
Response to Original message
28. i don't think it's political when someone is driving the wrong way
down a one way street to point them in the right direction.

i don't think it's political to speak the truth on the tragic wrong-headedness of our country's leadership. it's our responsibility. it's the only moral thing to do. people are being killed left and right. it's our responsibility to ferret out the cause and go after THAT CAUSE and leave the spurious resource war behind. it's a matter of survival for everyone.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 11:23 PM
Response to Original message
30. Good point
The time to start is now.

And don't back down or apologize. That's what they expect us to do.
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Mugsy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 11:28 PM
Response to Original message
31. Disturbing.
Sorry, but "politicizing" the London attacks leaves the same bad taste in my mouth as those who sought to "use" 9/11 for political gain.


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scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-08-05 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #31
34. So you'd rather sit back and let the right wing do all the politicizing?
Which, if you've been paying attention, they are already doing in spades.

A terrorist act IS a political act. It is not "politicizing" to point out the truth: That the "War on Terror" is NOT making the world safer.

sw
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DemBeans Donating Member (669 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 11:41 PM
Response to Original message
32. well, we wouldn't be the only ones making it political
I saw a news whore tonight ask a guest if this London attack would help Bush's popularity ratings.

I thought - WTF? Why even talk of using this as a prop to his rapidly falling poll numbers, as though he'd just hit on the slot machines in Vegas? Sick. Sick. Like he did something right here? Almost 40 people dead?

The media is already spinning this for Bush. They've politicized it.
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scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-08-05 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
35. Kicked and recommended!
Excellent post and thread.

It is time to stand up and fight back.

sw
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placton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-08-05 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
36. Thanks to all - events have proven my point!
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ReadTomPaine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-08-05 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
37. Kick.
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cynatnite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-08-05 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
38. And be like the repukes for using 9/11 as a political football????
No Way...No How!!!!
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