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Bush WILL use today's tragedy for political gain - We need to discuss it

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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:24 AM
Original message
Bush WILL use today's tragedy for political gain - We need to discuss it

With all due RESPECT to those who have been injured and killed in the 'terrorist attacks' in London and those who feel that we need to hold off discussing it...

We must pay our respects and then immediately try to understand the political ramifications here in America.

Bush will most certainly find a way to use the London Attacks to further stifle free speech and civil rights and give himself more power.

Right now the United States is operating under the status of 'national emergency' and Bush will look for any excuse to call for martial law or push for more 'patriot acts'.

These are difficult times. Our hearts will be with our friends in the UK today...but our minds must be focused on Bush/Cheney/Rove's next move.


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adigal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:27 AM
Response to Original message
1. I just called C-Span and talked about propaganda
I said that it is our policies that are being targeted, not our freedom. I said that the terrorists are not attacking London because of the G8 summit, it is because we are killing innocent civilians and Britain is going back to Afghanistan. They are not attacking our freedoms. The soldier after me said we do NOT kill innocent civilians, we are protecting them. I guess he missed the at least 100,000 dead civilians.
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slor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:46 AM
Response to Reply #1
21. I heard you...good work...
there were some stupid folks calling in...talking about nuking the middle east.
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dogday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:27 AM
Response to Original message
2. Is this the position that the forum took
when Spain's trains were bombed?
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:36 AM
Response to Reply #2
14. We've all been mourning since 9-11...
...and the attacks on London won't be the last. It seems we're in a permanent state of mourning and fear...so much so that many of us just want to hide our heads and let Bush and Blair 'take care of us'.

The problem that hangs over our heads is that the very policies of the US and UK are breeding terrorism.

What else can we do but try to understand what's happening to our world?
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Commie Pinko Dirtbag Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:10 AM
Response to Reply #2
30. Do you think DU is some kind of Politburo?
Forums don't take positions, people do.

And then, as now, positions varied wildly. Which is a good thing.
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:19 AM
Response to Reply #30
36. Thanks for pointing that out...
...we are INDIVIDUALS...not part of some GROUPTHINK that marches in lockstep.

I love the UK and its people. But both of our countries will suffer for this...for a long time beyond the mourning of the dead.

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dogday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:37 AM
Response to Reply #36
41. I did not mean that, but of course
everyone is ready to jump on any word. I meant what happened when Spain was bombed, were there posts asking people to be reverent about posting their theories. I am not trying to group anyone together...
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dogday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:36 AM
Response to Reply #30
40. No, I am asking if people
were asking not to talk about it in deference of respect like they are about London. Don't jump to conclusions please...
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #40
42. On 9-11 and the Spain bombing...
...we tried to show our respect AND discuss the issues at the same time.

We're now in a permanent state of war...put there by a small group of wealthy, connected individuals who are using vast military forces to drop bombs on people that had NOTHING to do with 9-11.

This is not a war on terrorism...but a war of opportunity and profiteering.
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dogday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:46 AM
Response to Reply #42
43. I understand thanks
This war will be getting my son soon in Afghanistan and I know what it is, I just wished he did....
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hexola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:27 AM
Response to Original message
3. I think the best Bush can hope for is to break even...
He's eating words from his recent press conference...
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Sannum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:28 AM
Response to Original message
4. I agree...
The problem with the aftermath of 9/11 was that these things were not discussed out of fear of being seen as "unpatriotic".

He will use this. They have planned for this. We need to be ready.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:30 AM
Response to Original message
5. CNN just said he will speak shortly
and I do agree with you we must be vigilant and speak out.
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hexola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:30 AM
Response to Original message
6. Does this give Blair a mandate to take control of the Iraq war/Terror war?
Could something like that happen...?
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CWebster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:31 AM
Response to Original message
7. Absolutely. nt
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:31 AM
Response to Original message
8. It would be an insult to those who died...
...today and for the last several years...

...to pretend that the 'terrorists' aren't winning this war of attrition.

With these acts of terrorism...they have changed the world and gave opportunities to politicians like Bush to bring totalitarianism/fascism to once-democratic America.

With each attack...freedom dies along with the victims.

We need to mourn for those killed in these attacks...but we have to find a way to stop our governments from provoking and breeding terrorism.

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Murdock Donating Member (315 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:32 AM
Response to Original message
9. I beg of you..
Please, just for today, just for now.. don't do it.

Does anyone have any idea how cold and callused and jaded that this makes us all look?
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:39 AM
Response to Reply #9
16. You want cold and calloused? Wait for Bush's response...
Edited on Thu Jul-07-05 07:39 AM by Q
...and you'll see how fascism works.

I'll pay my respects in my own way and you in yours.

The world is on fire.

It's not time to take a day off.
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Riddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:45 AM
Response to Reply #9
19. And who do you think made us so cold and jaded?????
When you've lost ALL trust in your government and POS running it, it's only human nature to be suspect and skeptical about anything that happens. It didn't used to be that way, but you can thank the Reich Wing of the Republican Party and the knee-pad wearing MSM for making us that way.
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GeekMonkey Donating Member (418 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:48 AM
Response to Reply #9
23. o please
:eyes:
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renaissanceguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #9
32. Would you have said that to dissenters of Hitler?
After all, he used terrorism to maintain power.
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #9
39. And realistic.
Don't forget realistic.
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Bouncy Ball Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #9
47. It does NOT.
It makes us look like people who THINK and TALK about things rather than turn into bleating sheep anytime something like this happens.

Look, I can have sympathy for the people of London, my heart can break over this (and it is), AND I can think and talk about the surrounding issues.

So I guess every single news channel also looks calloused and jaded? Because I've heard PLENTY of political talk regarding this all morning!

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auburngrad82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 09:03 AM
Response to Reply #9
49. Bush should not have redirected troops from Afghanistan to Iraq
We should never have started an unjust war against Iraq. There were not WMD. Afghanistan, however, is the home of Al Qaeda. Since we've pulled the vast majority of our troops from Afghanistan to "spread democracy" the Taliban has retaken about a third of Afghanistan and Al Qaeda is free to perpetrate these attacks against us.

We should have finished the job. Billions of dollars wasted and thousands of lives lost and we are not one iota safer.

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ariellyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:32 AM
Response to Original message
10. Bush needed this. I guess an attack here would have been
too obvious--still he will capitolize on it to try to get his approval ratings out of the toilet.

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meti57b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. Bush will now conflate 9/11, London and Iraq.
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Riddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:47 AM
Response to Reply #12
22. And it comes 10 days after his ineffective speech at Fort Bragg
which failed to rally the support he needed it to. Wonder how long it will be before we hear "I told you so" in some form from the POS?
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renaissanceguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:16 AM
Response to Reply #10
33. Yup. That's exactly what's going on.
Had there been a terror attack here, Bushie wouldn't be able to say he's "keeping us safe." With a terror attack on our only major ally in the world, he can capitalize and divert attention to Iran.

And of course, this is yet another Rovian plot to cover up the trouble Rove and Bushie are in.
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whatever4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:35 AM
Response to Original message
11. I agree
People think we're wrong to discuss Rove. What if it was his idea in the first place, this horrible terrorist act? Is the speculation idle then, if he was the mastermind? And that's only one possibility.

Time to discuss who did it and why is NOW! It is a crime. There are criminals. It was a large and well planned crime; there are MANY criminals. Obviously criminals that didn't LOOK like criminals, since this was done in downtown London. It all makes it extremely political, not an act of god, not a natural tragedy to be mourned.

This is not the time to stop examining motivations and potentially guilty parties.
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:07 AM
Response to Reply #11
27. Let Us Be Clear, Ma'am
Edited on Thu Jul-07-05 08:07 AM by The Magistrate
It is your belief Rove contrived the explosions in the London transit system?
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #27
31. We don't need to provoke discussions...
...about WHO 'contrived the explosions'.

The point is and always has been that BushCo uses these tragedies to their own political advantage and to the detriment of liberty and civil rights.

We've witnessed these things for four years now.

Although there is no way to prove who 'contrived the explosions in London'...it's once again great timing for an administration in trouble and about to be exposed for crimes against the state and people.
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renaissanceguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:17 AM
Response to Reply #27
34. I wouldn't be surprised.
Hitler did it back then. Bushie's cronies can do it now.
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:22 AM
Response to Reply #34
37. Hitler Did Indeed Bomb London, Sir
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Benbow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:36 AM
Response to Original message
13. Yes, he said the war on terror goes on and his resolve
is just the same. Yeah - to quote someone else - nothing exceeds the courage with which we send other people into danger.
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Boo Boo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:37 AM
Response to Original message
15. I'm sure they'll get around to using this to
push for more Patriot Act provisions sooner or later. Seems like the logical thing to do---probably work too.
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bryant69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:39 AM
Response to Original message
17. Should we be focusing on how we can use it?
I'm not joking or being sarcastic. This is a tragedy - but it is a tragedy brought on, in part, by the bad policies of the Bush and Blair regimes. Should we have a strategy for showing how this tragedy exposes the weaknesses of those policies?

Or would such a plan back fire? And, on a different note, is having such a plan morally reprensible?

Bryant
check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:44 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. Nothing ever 'backfires' on the Bush junta...
...because they have made using tragedy an art form. They know how to use people's fears against them. They understand that they can get more of what THEY want when people are busy mourning.

Remember Bush climbing on the bodies of the 9-11 victims and using it for a photo op? This is how callous and heartless these people are....

Our 'strategy' should be awareness. Bush/PNAC were looking for another 'pearl harbor' when 9-11 happened. Coincidence? I don't know. But look at how the world has changed since that time and how politicians have used it to advance their anti-democracy agenda.
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napkinz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:45 AM
Response to Original message
20. Oh no, Bush babble, please no


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Lannes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:53 AM
Response to Original message
24. I just hope this isnt the start of a new wave of attacks..
In Europe and perhaps in the US.

Without getting too political,most of us know what will happen here in the event of another attack.Fait Accompli.I hope The UK wont have to deal with anymore of this although I fear they will.
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:05 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. I think it's clear by now that the...
...'bomb them back into the stone age' approach to terrorism isn't working.

Logically you'd think that an attack like this would show that Bush isn't doing such a great job. But with billions of taxpayer dollars at their disposal...they can spin this any way they want.

We're not fighting terrorism 'over there' in Iraq. Terrorism is NOT a state, nation or country. It's a tactic used by those who don't have armies. Terrorism can't be defeated with military might.

My guess is that terrorism will exist as long as the US has military bases and corporate control of natural resources where they're not wanted.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 07:57 AM
Response to Original message
25. This is going to create a backlash coming from those....
...who believe that the so-called War Against Terror should have been carried out to completion before anything else was contemplated.

Besides, the NeoCons and Herr Busch have lied so often, who's going to believe anything they say about this event?
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:08 AM
Response to Reply #25
28. A lie is the truth until you can prove it's a lie...
...and many still believe their lies because the corporate media has replaced the free press.

BushCo will find a way to use this tragedy to their advantage. Count on it.
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renaissanceguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:18 AM
Response to Reply #28
35. It seems more nowadays
that a lie becomes truth once you repeat it so many times.
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #35
58. Especially if there is no free press...
...to set the record straight.
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jmatthan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:08 AM
Response to Original message
29. Recall what Bush said at Fort Bragg

and attack him on that front.

Jacob Matthan
http://jmpolitics.blogspot.com
Oulu, Finalnd
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:26 AM
Response to Reply #29
38. We have nothing to attack WITH...
...except our minds and words.

Bash me all you want...but we're reliving 1930s Germany. We can either cringe and crawl in a corner...or stay and fight.

You'll never be able to attack BushCo head on. They have too many layers of protection from the government that they own and control.
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mikita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:50 AM
Response to Original message
44. using government logic,
since "terrorists" have now been found in London, are we planning to launch an invasion there as we've done in Afghanistan and Iraq?

:sarcasm:

P.S. By no means trying to undermine what the good people of London are going through... Just so pissed off at all the unnecessary death and destruction worldwide...
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #44
45. This demonstrates that the invasion and occupation of Iraq...
..was nothing more than an unnecessary distraction, needless and wanton killing of thousands of innocent Iraqis and American Soldiers dying for Bush's lies.

Bush isn't fighting terrorism. He's helping them...assisting them in their goal of bringing the US and UK to their knees.

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cquik18 Donating Member (315 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:56 AM
Response to Original message
46. You all also know what this bombing in London means...
1. We WON'T be hearing any more about Judith Miller and Matt Cooper for the rest of the week.

2. We WON'T be hearing about the Army giving Halliburton a $5 BILLION contract AT ALL.

3. We WON'T be hearing about Bush's mishaps and miscues on that bicycle, where he wiped out a Scottish police officer.

4. We WON'T be hearing about Karl Rove and Bob Novak leaking Valerie Plame to Miller and Cooper, nor its legal ramifications.

5. We WON'T be hearing about the missing Navy Seals in Afghanistan, or the military personnel who were shot down trying to rescue them.

6. We WON'T be hearing about the corruption in the Ohio state government, where state funds were used to buy coins and other high-priced doo-dads.

7. We WON'T be hearing about that cow in Texas that came up with Mad Cow disease in November 2004, and only NOW has this info come to light, most likely because the beef industry wanted it covered up. At least Taiwan had enough sense to ban imported American beef...

8. We WON'T be hearing about Capitol Hill trying to push legislation that punishes any state that takes advantage of the Supreme Court ruling on "eminent domain" from a couple of weeks ago.

9. We WON'T be hearing about Florida prosecutors being able to seize some of Rush Limbaugh's medical records in their attempt to nail him on doctor shopping charges.

10. We WON'T be hearing about the riots that occurred in both Scotland and Denmark while Bush was in both countries.The ones in Scotland were particularly nasty!

No, the American Pravda has a new distraction for the American sheeple: All London bombings, ALL THE TIME!

Randi Rhodes said it best: "The news has been cancelled!"

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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #46
51. Coincidence or not...this is the reality of the situation...
Edited on Thu Jul-07-05 10:25 AM by Q
...and we knew it was coming with the 'next attack' anywhere in the world.

Of course this shows Bush to be a LIAR about the world being safer because he deposed Saddam and invaded/occupied Iraq. It also shows that terrorists are SEEKING REVENGE for his insane decision to attack a country that had nothing to do with 9-11...as the real terrorists run free around the world.
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lebkuchen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #46
53. Do you happen to have a pic of point #3?
I've been away.
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cquik18 Donating Member (315 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #53
55. Trying to find pics now....
...no luck so far. :-( Chimpy ain't gonna have his "piture" took of him falling off his bike...The cop should have given him a field sobriety test and charged him with a PUI-Peddling Under the Influence! HAW HAW HAW!!!
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 08:59 AM
Response to Original message
48. I don't know that there is any political advantage in these attacks...
Blair's chickens have come home to roost. He is finally getting rewarded for his support of George Bush with his attack on Iraq. This may highlight the disastrous invasion plan of Iraq, rather than capturing Osama and claiming victory.
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #48
50. The 'advantages'...
Edited on Thu Jul-07-05 10:22 AM by Q
...will be to shore up their agenda. That is...throw more money at the 'war on terror' and Friends of Bush defense contractors and force more 'patriot acts' down our throats in the guise of protecting us.

What better way for the Bush regime to attain more power and control? What better way to coverup their many crimes?

And let's not forget that this puts the next on the 'axis of evil' list in the crosshairs. Bush's 'global war on terrorism' has only just begun.

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lebkuchen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 10:29 AM
Response to Original message
52. Where is Osama? Let's discuss that
now that Chimpy is once again blabbering about how we're going to bring the terrorists to justice.
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #52
56. It's a well-known fact that Bin Laden was a CIA 'operative'...
Edited on Thu Jul-07-05 10:58 AM by Q
...and got out of hand like Rummy's Saddam.

It's rather bitterly ironic that our tax dollars were being used to finance and train these fanatics and now they've come back to bite us and the UK in the ass.

And where is the ANTHRAX KILLER? Seems like that it's to Bush's advantage to allow these killers to run around and threaten than to capture them.
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zanne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 10:31 AM
Response to Original message
54. I agree.
Less emotion, more thinking.
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Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-07-05 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #54
57. LESS EMOTION...MORE THINKING...
...exactly right.

The Bushies WANT US to react with emotion instead of pointing out their failed and dangerous foreign and domestic policies.

They want us to FEAR instead of THINK.
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