Sensenbrenner wants to repeal 22nd Ammendment, two term limit on President

[Melodybe]

Bush for life! OH FUCK NO!!!!!!

Sensenbrenner says if they pick up the seats in 2006 this will pass and we'll end up with this Dictator for life!

here is the link I was given:

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c109:H.J.RES.24.IH:

Looks legit, but I sure hope someone can debunk this.

[marmar]

1. I don't advocate violence...

But Pig-enbrenner needs his ass kicked! What a demented SOB!?!

:wtf:

[Erika]

4. The GOP had hinted at this earlier

saying that a president would need at least 12 years in office in a war to secure proper protection for the citizens.

[tinrobot]

45. Name one 12 year war in our history...

Times up...

Outside of the Cold War, which really wasn't a war, there are none.

[Obamanaut]

109. Does the US' lengthy involvement in VIetnam count?

French to U.S. Involvement

In May 1945, the Truman administration gave France its approval to resume colonial authority in Indochina, Truman hoping that France would liberalize its rule there. In that part of Indochina called Vietnam, the French were already facing a declared independence. A movement called the Viet Minh, led by Ho Chi Minh, a veteran Communist, had been fighting the Vichy French regime in Vietnam, which was administering Indochina for Japan. And the Viet Minh had been helping the Americans by rescuing downed U.S. airmen. At the end of the war the Viet Minh had committees throughout Vietnam, and Ho Chi Minh announced Vietnam's independence. Most Vietnamese were overjoyed and looked upon the Viet Minh and Ho Chi Minh as heroes. This was the nationalist aspect that U.S. forces in Vietnam would be fighting. In spirit, Vietnam was independent of foreign rule. But the Truman administration and the other Allied powers repeated the policy of the Allied powers at the end of World War I. They ignored the wish of the Vietnamese to be independent. The French tried to force their way back in Vietnam, and a war between the French and the Viet Minh began in December 1946.

The United States helped the French in Vietnam, President Truman doing so for the sake of the fight against communism in Europe and in Indochina. Much of France's efforts to overthrow Ho Chi Minh's government in Vietnam was being financed by the United States, and around 1950 the Viet Minh began to benefit from the coming to power of the communists in China. After North Korea invaded South Korea in 1950, Secretary of State Dean Acheson persuaded Truman to increase U.S. assistance to the French, and the United States recognized France's puppet king in Vietnam, Bao Dai. After Eisenhower took office in 1952, U.S. aid to the French effort in Vietnam increased, and by 1954, U.S. aid amounted to 80 percent of the costs of the French effort.

<more>

http://www.fsmitha.com/h2/ch26.htm

[happyslug]

115. The Revolution and Vietnam

If you go by the time of the British Parliament's Passage of the Intolerable Acts in 1774 (Which lead directly to Lexington and Concord in 1775) and the Paris Peace Treaty of 1783, you are looking at 9 years. Vietnam went from the introduction of US advisors in 1961 to the fall of Saigon in 1975, 14 years.

[Obamanaut]

117. US involved monetarily as far back as Truman, and with advisors

in-country with Eisenhower.

<snip>

No example of our advisory role before 1961, however, is better than the military training of South Vietnam's own Special Forces. The mission of the first American Special Forces in Vietnam was to train fewer than one hundred Vietnamese soldiers. The first training center was in Nha Trang. The Americans arrived from Okinawa in the summer of 1957, and by 1960 they were training more than fifty Ranger units of the Army of the Republic of Vietnam (ARVN). Although this aspect of the advisory experience began in the Eisenhower presidency, it was greatly expanded under the keen interest and direction of President Kennedy later.

<snip> <more>

http://www.richmond.edu/~ebolt/history398/MAAG2.html

[happyslug]

130. I know of the US involvement from 1945 onward in Vietnam

But the official time period is 1961 to 1975. If you go from 1945 to 1975 for Vietnam (with the US Involvement at the end) you have to view the Revolution and the interconnected Indians wars from 1754 (When Washington first attempt to kick out the French from the Ohio Region) to 1821 when the Creek War Ended as one war (Thus lasting 66 years).

[happyslug]

144. List of US Army Campaigns Ribbons for Actions against Native Americans.

http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/reference/iwcmp.htm

List ends the Creek war in 1814, and the Seminole War in 1818. These tend to end the Indian Wars of 1754-1818. I mis-marked 1821 for that is the year Florida was sold by Spain to the US thus ending the protections the Indians had in Florida from the US Army (also ended the protection the Spanish gave to run-a-way slaves who were living in Florida, a different but interrelated situation).

[dbeach]

118. VN WAR WAS FROM 1959 TO 1975

and is officially recogized by the VA as from 2/28/61 to 4/30 /75

the war that of course the DC Occupants supported but avoided

101st airborne 1969 Ashau Valley

Nothing worse than a chikenhawk except a TRAITOR

[Initech]

74. Yeah, which he started!

Without this war, Bush would have been out on his ass in November.

[aquart]

82. Damn. That's what they didn't like last time.

So, are the states pissed off enough yet? They'd have to ratify it, and I just don't see this as being a good time.

[okieinpain]

86. good then bill clinton can run again. but of course I'm sure they

would come up with some bull shit to keep clinton from running.

[Melodybe]

88. Hey, I think that Clinton might be in on it.

I have hoped for a long time that maybe he was better than this, but after all this shit, I'm beginning to think that he has been bought and sold.

[Horse with no Name]

134. Yup

It would only take one word.
"Consecutive".

[fob]

135. FOR the citizens or FROM the citizens?

[Conker]

138. 12 years!?

I can't even stand two terms with that monkey.

[Nothing Without Hope]

145. What an outrageous lie! EXTENDING a failed policy that allowed a war

to start and then drag on for TWELVE YEARS! Oh yeah, that's a FINE idea -

...if you are a WAR PROFITEER!!!

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

2. Why?

Does the idiot think Chimpy would get a third term?

Be careful of what you wish for Senselessbrenner. Bill Clinton might get elected again.

:rofl:

[Melodybe]

6. With Diebold anything is possible!

if they get more seats in 2006, all hope may be lost.

I just hope that this is debunked and soon.

Otherwise I weep for the future.

[BadGimp]

77. Great GOP Mantra:

With Diebold anything is possible!

[KamaAina]

107. More precisely: "With Diebold, all things are possible"

simply substitute "Diebold" for "God" in the motto of...

...wait for it...

OHIO!!!

[daleo]

41. Good point. Clinton would clean his clock.

Even with Diebold.

[AllyCat]

85. No he wouldn't. Clinton could take every vote and Bush would

still win in Dieboldland. All they have to do is a couple of digits of code...change 'em...and viola! Bush elected again, and again, and again.

Clinton will not win.

[daleo]

151. Well, election voting machine rigging is a problem of course

A nice thing about a Clinton run (I think) would be that his poll numbers would outpace Bush by so much in the days before the election, that the fraud would be very obvious, if they still dared to go ahead with one at that point.

If they did go ahead, I don't know what would happen. One would hope that people wouldn't stand for it.

[springhill]

51. Are you kidding me?

Do you really think they would even entertain the idea of they didn't know they would win? They have the machines and that's all they need. They can adjust the vote as they go.

[tavalon]

110. Chimpy wasn't elected for the last two

Why would he need to worry about a third?

Diebold, Diebold, Diebold.

[MzShellG]

142. This could be a part of...

PNAC. Those who abuse power, as this this administration has, would definitely refuse to let it go. Isnt it strange no SERIOUS contenders are coming forth to replace chimp in 2008? Yet the rethugs scream Hillary from every available media outlet. What gives them the right to choose our candidate, anyway? :grr:

[mcctatas]

3. Make's me ashamed to be from Wisconsin...

but wouldn't it be funny if they did pass it and then a DEMOCRAT won in '08??!!

[rodeodance]

132. me too--as this man is getting more dangerous each day.

[Fiona]

5. good

the 22nd amendment is stupid and SHOULD be repealed.

Bush wouldn't win another term, even if he ran.

[nadinbrzezinski]

7. Diebold does not agree

It does not matter who votes but who counts the votes, remember that

[Fiona]

19. yes you're right...

every election will be stolen. Even if Bush is polling at 40%, he'll win. :eyes:

[tavalon]

111. Roll your smily face eyes all you want

With Diebold, Bush could be polling at 30% and amazingly, people will have a change of heart at the polling places.

He sure could "win" again.

[in_cog_ni_to]

123. Exactly! They would, at the last minute, decide on their MORALS again!

:eyes: This is complete BULLSHIT! If there was even an inkling they thought they would lose in '06, this bill would NEVER have been drafted. :grr:

Diebold, ES&S and Sequoia are their friends. Not ours.

[Melodybe]

8. I repeat with Diebold anything is possible!

[0007]

95. That's what I thought the first time.......

[msanthrope]

9. That means the Big Dog could run again. n/t

[Melodybe]

12. What makes you think that Clinton would run again?

He's been real chummy with the scum lately.

don't count on Clinton for a damn thing.

[evlbstrd]

73. I agree.

Move away from the DLC faction of the party. It's just as corporatist as even the moderate Republicans.

You want something to sell to the people?
Health care, secure retirement, a decent standard of living, education opportunity for our children, a clean environment, upon which all of the above depends.

How can you not go further left, raise funds from individuals and small businesses, and eliminate the corporate donations? Dean showed how that can work in the primaries, and he's shaking the up the DLC now. I love it.

The Human Race. 1-----2-----3-----GO!!!!!!!!!!

[mcctatas]

10. Just an afterthought...

didn't the Nazi's and Italian Fascist's try this with less than glowing results?

[Carla in Ca]

78. Yes, the third reich was to last 'one thousand years'

but, mercifully, it only lasted 12 years (but a thousand years worth of damage)

[ima_sinnic]

11. if ever there were a perfect example of the need for the 22nd,

Bush is definitely it.
well, Bush + Diebold.
He didn't win 2000 OR 2004, but with the 1-2 punch of Diebold plus elimination of the 22nd amendment, he's in for life--and totally against the will of the people.

[dchill]

54. Then he can be just like ...

... the man he's secretly envied all his life -

Saddam Hussein. And boy will Dad be jealous.

They'll have to install a LOT more black boxes to beat Saddam's 99%+ of the vote, though.

[elehhhhna]

103. Bravo. Very concise analysis.

[dchill]

152. Thank you.

I believe I did have a momentary peek into Bush's motivation.

[dbeach]

13. no sense in brenner

the front man for neocon imperial dreams

endless bush endless bummer

wanted to post this too glad ya did.THANX

[Melodybe]

14. Is this for real, I mean it says .gov but I pray this is bull shit.

[dbeach]

26. Its real..

the repukes are going for all the stars...

to hell with the commoners and they plan on getting us there in a hurry

9/11 ..patsy act..
natl id

2 stolen elections not to mention that the diebold express most likely sent these cowards to congress

then wellstone complains to darth cheny and hes with JFK and the rest the very next day

I know I know its only coincidences and I need to rest and relax

VN motto in 101st Airborne was :Stay alert
stay alive

worked for me...then VN motto changed to NEVER trust govt...

[shanti]

55. there are two parts to this bill

the other part is about foreigners becoming president. sounds relatively benign, but it's not.

[ikri]

98. two parts to this bill....

Clinton/Springer in 2008?

I know the GOP wants the body builder in chief at some point, but I've always guessed that the idea of a Schwarzenegger vs Springer battle for the presidency/vice-presidency always put them off.

:shrug:

[gtar100]

15. Sensenbrenner is one sick m-f

What a psychotic prick. Greed oozes out this sorry excuse for a human. Just who the hell votes for this guy?

We Won't Get Fooled Again!!

Spread the word about this guy's record throughout his district. I suspect if these people were more aware of Sensenbrenner's record, they'd boot him out.

Just how do you "impeach" a senator?

[AllyCat]

87. Hey y'all! 4 DEMS sponsored the bill with him! In fact, Senseless

brenner is only a co-sponsor. A DEMOCRAT (Hoyer) is the author of said bill.

Just say no to DINO!!

[Erika]

16. I will repeat an ALCU quote

Advocates of intolerance have decided that now is the time to go for it all - a society governed by their interpretation of the Bible - ruled over by theocratic politicians - serviced by faith-based, tax-payer funded institutions - and permeated with a rigid Christian doctrine against which neither citizens nor judges should dare to speak up.

[ElectroPrincess]

17. This is pure insanity! Not even the average Republican wants this

SHIT! We're all (Americans in general) tired of this Neo-Con's Administration's DEATH AND DESTRUCTION RHETORIC ... FEAR ... INTIMIDATION, etc. etc. We're all burned out from the hype. :(

[Roland99]

18. BWA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!

They really just don't give a flying fuck what they do anymore.

ONE PARTY! Totalitarianism for all!

[Melodybe]

21. I'm not laughing.

[tridim]

27. Yep.. They're going for broke now

I wonder what's coming next?

[Guckert]

20. This would be a win win for the Dems. if he tries the party would be

vilified by the public and then Clinton would win... pretty funny stuff. these people are not even trying to hide their power hungry greed.

[NEOBuckeye]

22. I DARE Sensenbrenner to go for it.

When Bush gets routed so badly in 2008 that even Diebold machines won't be able to save his ass, we'll get a Dem President like Gen. Clark in office for 4 consecutive terms, just like FDR, the very reason the Repugs rammed through the 22nd in the first place!

Beware the Law of Unintended Consequences.

[Melodybe]

23. Again with Diebold anything is possible.

Not like our scum sucking POS media would even report it if they did repeal #22.

They have a habit of not reporting the important stuff.

[NEOBuckeye]

34. Let them try. It will lead to the HARD fall of both Bush and the GOP.

Many signs suggest that the country is already going to be in a severe state of economic collapse and depression by 2008/9. A Third Bush term being foisted upon the people in such a time would plunge us into the realm of pre-revolutionary dischord and dissent. Who can say how that would play out? What I can tell you is that it must end one way or another with the liquidation of the entire Republican Party power structure.

[katsy]

24. BWA HA HA HA

sensen is an idiot.

http://www.usconstitution.net/constfaq_a7.html

From the Q & A with link to Amendment Section:

" Q137. "I recently had a debate with a friend of mine. The question was what is required to repeal an Amendment to the Constitution. I told him I thought it would take two-thirds approval of the House and Senate, the President's signature and three-fourths approval of the states. Was I right?"

A. The repeal of any part of the Constitution requires an amendment to the Constitution - this includes the repeal of a previously passed amendment. So, the process is well defined in the Constitution, and is detailed on the Amendment Page. In reading that page, you can see that you were almost right - the biggest mistake you made is that the President is not involved in the amendment process in any way. "



If sensen doesn't get his anger issues under control, he's going to end up bursting a blood vessel.

3/4 of the States??? Oh yeah. Right.

[Hepburn]

25. Well, look at it this way:

THE BIG DAWG COULD RUN AGAIN!!!! :bounce:

[Melodybe]

28. What makes you think he would?

At this point I'm not looking to Clinton for safety.

[Hepburn]

33. I can tell you this...

If I had a choice between Bill Clinton and George Bush on a third term, I think I would certainly choose Bill over George. I just got a kick out of how stupid this proposal by the Repukes is....did they forget that means that Clinton could run again? Sorry I meant it as a joke and a comment on how short sighted they are. I would bet Bill would win.

[Melodybe]

35. Not with Diebold it doesn't

If this is real then it is no laughing matter.

This is a huge fucking deal!

[elehhhhna]

104. Bill sleeps at Old King G's feet. Think about it.

[tavalon]

112. AND LOSE!

With Diebold counting the votes, even the Big Dog would lose.

[Erika]

29. I had a co worker come up to me and say that Bush

has three brothers who could serve for 24 years, and by then, their kids could take the reign. We don't need elections.

[nadinbrzezinski]

31. ask your co worker why not just crown Junior king

then point to him that we are not a country of kings

[Erika]

32. He would have no problem with that

Much like those who wanted George Washington to become king so they didn't have to think about poltics.

[Coastie for Truth]

30. Since I'm a chartered professional engineer in Saskatchewan ... N/T

[Dover]

36. Didn't the Bush Adm. frown on Putins power grab and attempts to

extend his presidency?

[Erika]

38. Bush held Clinton in contempt for being the world's cop

He ridiculed him and said we had to make our own our priorities. I know, it's enough to gag a maggot.

[grace0418]

137. Yes but BushCo's hypocrisy knows NO BOUNDS so that won't

be a problem for him or his brainless followers.

[PittPoliSci]

37. I'd honestly love to see Geo. W run against Bill Clinton.

[Erika]

39. W would be wiped out

if we can even have honest elections anymore.

[PittPoliSci]

40. yeah really!

who knows at that rate!

[Melodybe]

47. HELLO WE HAVEN'T HAD ANY HONEST ELECTIONS IN THE LAST 5 YEARS

Already 80% of our votes are COUNTED by 2 companies Diebold and E&S.

This is terrifying.

[shanti]

57. probably much longer than that

personally, i think it's been going on at a lower level since the 80's. the * family has always been involved too.

btw, did you know that diebold makes atm's? that disturbs me too.

[Melodybe]

59. Oh yeah, my bank uses one.

Scary stuff folks.

Why aren't we in the streets again?

[Melodybe]

43. I'd rather not have to worry about it.

You guys are being really blase about this. I'm terrified you you guys are laughing.

I didn't think it was possible that we would go to war, I didn't think it was possible that Bush could steal another election, I didn't think it was possible that our media could suck this bad, I was wrong.

[PittPoliSci]

49. i don't know...

They can't even amend the constitution on an issue that they have some support for. This is just absurd.

[Melodybe]

44. I'd rather not have to worry about it.

You guys are being really blase about this. I'm terrified and you guys are laughing.

I didn't think it was possible that we would go to war, I didn't think it was possible that Bush could steal another election, I didn't think it was possible that our media could suck this bad, I was wrong.

[JRob]

48. yeah i'd like to see that too... for the shear entertainment.

[fortyfeetunder]

42. I knew it ! I knew it!

I always suspected this would come along. I hope this idea dies QUICK!

[Catch22Dem]

46. That's from February.

Not exactly LBN, but appalling nonetheless.

[Melodybe]

52. So it is real then!!! omfg!

Is this something to look forward too if they steal 2006!?!

[Catch22Dem]

56. Yes it's real, here's a working link, but...

It's old news.

Working Link

[Erika]

62. Bush's oppression of the poor will lead to an uprisisng

Read Dickens, et al. But it won't be by all the illegals Bush has allowed in, or the very poor. It will be led by us who knows how the other side lives. And it won't be pretty. If Bush wants to brag about "bring them on" wait until we "bring it on".

[genieroze]

90. That why I posted it on general discussion.

[JRob]

50. the link is dead...

[Melodybe]

58. Weird, it won't go through from DU.

I tried the link again from the email I got and no problems.

Leave DU and try it.

[genieroze]

89. try this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=3861207&mesg_id=3861207

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GPO's PDF Display Congressional Record References Bill Summary & Status Printer Friendly Display - 1,359 bytes.
Proposing an amendment to the Constitution of the United States to repeal the 22nd amendment to the Constitution. (Introduced in House)

HJ 24 IH

109th CONGRESS

1st Session

H. J. RES. 24

Proposing an amendment to the Constitution of the United States to repeal the 22nd amendment to the Constitution.

IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

February 17, 2005

Mr. HOYER (for himself, Mr. BERMAN, Mr. SENSENBRENNER, Mr. SABO, and Mr. PALLONE) introduced the following joint resolution; which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary

JOINT RESOLUTION

Proposing an amendment to the Constitution of the United States to repeal the 22nd amendment to the Constitution.

Resolved by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled (two-thirds of each House concurring therein), That the following article is proposed as an amendment to the Constitution of the United States, which shall be valid to all intents and purposes as part of the Constitution when ratified by the legislatures of three-fourths of the several States within seven years after the date of its submission for ratification:

`Article --

`The twenty-second article of amendment to the Constitution of the United States is repealed.'.

[StevieM]

53. Let him run. It will give us the chance to beat him again.....

just like we did in 2000.

Steve

[suffragette]

60. gets even weirder

After seeing this, I searched in google a bit and found this piece about Hoyer introducing this bill:

http://democraticwhip.house.gov/media/press.cfm?pressReleaseID=1028

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
February 17, 2005

Hoyer Introduces Bipartisan Bill to Repeal 22nd Amendment

Resolution Would Repeal Two-Term Limit for President, Restore Power to the People

WASHINGTON, DC – House Democratic Whip Steny H. Hoyer (MD) introduced bipartisan legislation today to repeal the 22nd amendment, which states that “No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice.”  Representatives Berman (D-CA), Pallone (D-NJ), Sabo (D-MN) and Sensenbrenner (R-WI) joined Hoyer in sponsoring the resolution.

Representative Hoyer released the following statement regarding the resolution:
“I introduced today a joint resolution to repeal outright the 22nd Amendment to the Constitution.  The 22nd Amendment requires that no person who has served two terms, or who has served more than two years of another President’s term and their own elected term, be permitted to serve another term of office."

There's more there of Hoyer presenting his rationale for doing this.

I distrust anything Sensenbrenner is doing. Why are they doing this with him?

[Melodybe]

61. Cause there is no such thing as two parties

Dean Boxer and Conyers may be real dems but the jury is out on damn near everyone else.

[suffragette]

64. Melodybe, add McDermott to that list

We're glad to be sending him from our WA to the eastern one. :)

[chknltl]

92. 2nd that...and P. Murry too...nt

[bklyncowgirl]

94. Very wierd. Thinking Clinton? Or something a little more venal

Like this sort of little tradeypoo.

Sensenbrenner: Hey Hoyer, you back me on this TOTALLY symbolic 22nd Amendment Bill and the majority will make sure that road improvement project in your district you wanted gets in the final budget bill.

Hoyer: Cool! Gotta have something to show the voters how effective I am. Now someone call my donors in the construction biz and let them know something's in the works. Should be good for at least half a million for my warchest.

OK I may be defaming Mr. Hoyer a little (I don't know if he has a road improvement project) but the Democrats in Congress have been giving away everything for pennies for so long in the spirit of bipartisanship that I don't think some of them would even see the danger in this.

[Rex]

63. Guess it is time for the total takeover.

BBV plus unlimited terms equals a fascist state. Nonsensenbrenner lost his mind eh? He now totally fits into the collection of monsters in the WH.

[Melodybe]

65. Send this to everyone you know. Why haven't we been freaking out!?!

I'm sending it now, I suggest you do the same.

Even the repubs you might know need to see this.

[burrowowl]

66. Needs ratification of

2/3's of the States by 2/3's majority.
ERA has not yet passed and it has been decades! Of course Diebold, Sequoia, etc. machines may make it possible if they call special elections in every state.

[Rex]

67. If they can create a dictatorship

then bet on a special election. I'm sure Arnold would love for this to come about. They will use him as Reagan's replacement.

[katsy]

68. correction..

2/3 approval of the congress and 3/4 of the states.

fat chance this would fly.. especially if they change the requirement that the president must be born in america.

[tuvor]

69. The link works through this URL

From comments at AmericaBLOG:

http://www.haloscan.com/comments/katsiva/111879875729703761/#384107

[Daphne08]

70. Nothing surprises me any longer.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

71. I'd like to repeal Sensenbrenner and the rest of the NeoCons.

[Melodybe]

72. Please either kick or nominate this to keep it from falling down the

memory hole.

[Erika]

75. kick

[NIGHT TRIPPER]

76. I've been saying this here on D.U. for 2 YEARS---- PERMANENT CHIMP

Chimp is NEVER leaving office.
They'd have to drag him out in hancuffs kicking and screaming.

We are ONE terra event away from permanent Chimp-
There WILL be no more presidential elections.
just watch and see.

I'd put money on it--anyone wanna bet?

[Melodybe]

80. What can we do? March? Revolt?

What is the answer?

[NIGHT TRIPPER]

84. protests mean nothing to these criminals

It's going to take an organized "shut down" after they do this.
Kind of a Ghandi strategy.

[ngGale]

79. OMG - What a nightmare!

Please, somebody wake me up!

[Whoa_Nelly]

81. Thank goodness it's not that simple to repeal an amendment

of the constitution. It has to also be ratified by the states. There is a very important and serious set of steps that must be followed before any changes can be made to the constitution.


BTW, Sensenbrenner: Eat Shit!

[Melodybe]

83. When every state is using voting machines, it isn't that hard.

As I said with Diebold anything is possible.

[Zenlitened]

127. That's the key question... how fast could they ram this thing through...

... using all the dirty tricks at their disposal?

:scared:

[Vyan]

91. There's an upside to this...

If they repeal the 22nd, President Clinton can run again!

Vyan

[Old Vet]

93. I just dont see it happening,

Although two-thirds of every state to go to war sounds like a good bill? Die-bold or not, I have to agree though that paper ballots or some trail of votes is cause worth fighting for.

[femme.democratique]

96. Clinton is just as bad as Bush he just hides it behind a facade

stop the Clinton worship, for he too has blood on his hands.

[Pepperbelly]

99. bullshit ...

Double bullshit.

If Clinton were to run again, I would be in his corner immediately. You may disagree, of course, but that is my opinion.

[cornermouse]

97. It wouldn't surprise me at all.

I've kind of been expecting "the people" to demand that Bush gets another term...or two...or three.

[sellitman]

100. 8 years is enough of any President....Dem or Repuke.

The thought of junior until 2012 is unbearable though.

[Tesla]

101. That is the end of the Mayan calandar

kinda a scary thought!!!!

[OrlandoGator]

102. FOUR OF THE SIX ON THE BILL ARE DEMOCRATS!

Guys, why does this story keep popping up here? Is it because Sensenbrenner's name is on it?

[Hubert Flottz]

105. Herr Sensenbrenner wants to make the Chimp Chancellor for...

life! It takes "a lot of work" to build a new 1,000 year Reich!

This is a re-run of 1934 Germany! What a calamity the SCOTUS has brought upon us all...

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

106. Support Bryan Kennedy

He's running against this troglodyte.

www.bk2006.org/

Did I mention that you can contribute on-line?

[Independent_Liberal]

108. Don't let this scare you...

I really doubt this will pass.

[Pryderi]

113. With the rigged voting machines, we could have Bush for 15 more years

[ElsewheresDaughter]

114. this is a Rove "distraction from the issue" tactic....DON"T BITE!

it takes 8 yrs for a Constitional Ammendment to be added....* will be long gone

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

116. Do you understand the constitutional amendment process...

...at all?

[northzax]

125. shh! you're getting in the way of today's

five minutes of rage!

And I personally support the repeal of the 22nd amendment, I think it was a bad idea in the first place.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

133. I wouldn't have supported it...

...in FDR's time, but nowadays the Presidency is a different animal altogether. A lot more power has been concentrated in the office, and a lot of checks have been removed. This has been going on more or less since FDR, and it's part of the reason the amendement was passed in the first place (though not the only or even the largest reason.)

I don't like the idea of any one individual holding power for too long, especially considering the dimished role of political parties in the presidential process in the 2nd half of the 20th century. There needs to be some kind of check on presidential authority, and I can't (for the moment) think of anything better than term limits.

[northzax]

136. I must say that I don't understand whe we term limit

some offices, and not others. If the best answer to the potential problem of president overreach is term-limits (as it may be, practically) then why not term limit the congress as well? get rid of the incentive to have as much prokbarrel spending?

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

150. Because...

...no one member of Congress wields the same amount of power as the President. Even majority leadership in the congress has limited powers compared to the president. The main story of late 20th century American politics is one of transfer of power from the legislative to the executive branch. The executive branch really exists outside of the sphere of party politics at this point. You see many more crossover voters for presidents than you do for congresscritters. It's really not the same ballgame.

[dr.zoidberg]

119. Why the hell is he doing this?

Doesn't Sensenbrenner realize that not only is this move unpopular, but has no chance in hell of passing? I thought politicians were supposed to try to fight winning battles and save irrational bullshit(like banning abortion and banning gay marriages)for presidential elections. Those two things are filed under the promises you have no chance of keeping file. Now, doing this in a non-election year proves that this guy is a fucking moron.

[FlaGranny]

120. Repeal it?

Do you mean that Bill Clinton can run in 2008? Shoe-in?

[Coexist]

121. Sensenbrenner seems to over reach a lot

why is he able to do this? When is he up for re-election again?

[kentuck]

122. Good! We can tear it down and start over.

Because it will be torn down...

[dave123williams]

124. They don't have the votes to ammend the Constitution.

If they want a fight, they'll get a bloody one over this.

[Zenlitened]

126. Duers, raise your hand if you'be been predicting something like this...

... since about September of 2001.

:hi:

[NIGHT TRIPPER]

139. i've been saying it over and over-I coined the term "Permanent Chimp"

read my earlier post on this thread!
Chimp is NEVER leaving----EVER!

[opstachuck]

128. wouldn't apply to Bush -- Hoyer's statement on the House floor...

"Under the resolution I offer today, President Bush would not be eligible to run for a third term. However, the American people would have restored to themselves and future generations an essential democratic privilege to elect who they choose in the future."

here's the whole thing...

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?r109:1:./temp/~r1097sf7T4::

SPEECH OF
HON. STENY H. HOYER
OF MARYLAND
IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
THURSDAY, FEBRUARY 17, 2005
Mr. HOYER. Mr. Speaker, I am introducing today a joint resolution to repeal outright the 22nd Amendment to the Constitution. The 22nd Amendment requires that no person who has served two terms or has served two years of another President's term be permitted to serve another term of office.

The time has come to repeal the 22nd Amendment to the Constitution, and not because of partisan politics. While I am not a
supporter of the current President, I feel there are good public policy reasons for a repeal of this amendment. Under the Constitution as altered by the 22nd Amendment, this must be President George W. Bush's last term even if the American people should want him to continue in office. This is an undemocratic result.

Under the resolution I offer today, President Bush would not be eligible to run for a third term. However, the American people would have restored to themselves and future generations an essential democratic privilege to elect who they choose in the future.
A limitation on the terms that a President could serve was not fully discussed by the Founding Fathers. However, Alexander Hamilton, in Federalist Paper 72, recognized that one important benefit of not having term limits on the President would be:


We do not have to rely on rigid constitutional standards to hold our Presidents accountable. Sufficient power resides in the Congress and the Judiciary to protect our country from tyranny. As the noted attorney and counsel to Presidents, Clark Clifford, said:

I believe we denigrate ourselves as an enlightened people, and our political process as a whole, in imposing on ourselves still further disability to retain tested and trusted leadership. The Congress and the Judiciary are now and will remain free to utilize their own countervailing constitutional power to forestall any executive overreaching.

[Javaman]

129. I predicted this long ago, then the draft will be enacted.

However, the way things are going for moron and his room full of dopes as well as the repukes in congress, it appears as if they have to do some major election fraud and vote fixing to make it happen.

[smoogatz]

131. There's talk of repealing the 22nd amendment every time a Republican wins

a second term. It won't happen--2/3 of both houses would have to approve it, then it would have to be ratified by the legislatures of 3/4 of the states. It would be seen as a mid-term referendum on Bush, and his poll numbers aren't all that great right now--and not likely to recover. He's toast, in other words.

Re the Diebold thing--it's only going to work if the polls going in are basically a dead heat--then you can jigger the vote count by a point or two and not arouse a lot of general suspicion. If the gap in the opinion polls pre-election is, say, five points or more, there's no way even Bushco would be brazen enough to try to Diebold the results.

[WePurrsevere]

140. Yes...

I've been thinking much the same especially about the Diebold thing.

Also... from what I know of Diebolds from DH (retired NCR) they're just PC based (mostly Windows) computers so therefore I would think that they would be subject to the same problems such as glitches, electrical spikes/surges, hacking (if using the Internet to send info), etc... which IMO makes them very unreliable for voting machines.

Might I suggest that if you're worried about the election.. volunteer to help on election day... and bring a cell phone with video capabilities. ;)

[Streetdoc270]

141. Stop the 'GOP wants Chimp for life' crap and look....

There is only ONE repub name on the bill the rest are DEMOCRATS!!!!!
Hoyer is the sponser!

[Edgewater_Joe]

143. That Means BILL Clinton v. Bush - And We Know Who'd Win There, Don't We?

Diebold or no Diebold, The Big Dog would chew up and s**t out Shrub before p**sing on his remains.

And everyone on this board knows it!

[McCamy Taylor]

146. Sensenbrenner in the Service of King George link

http://www.grandtheftelectionohio.com/050613.htm

[Nothing Without Hope]

147. Actually, with *'s ratings so low, they'll probably go with McCain/Jeb:

http://www.workingforchange.com/article.cfm?itemid=19201

I've been watching the amazing pro-McCain media propaganda campaign for some time:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1818584

and, as the linked article suggests, adding Jebbie would get the Bush cartel support. And of course, McCain is such an old man, he might oh-so-conveniently DIE in office, thus leaving the way open for the NEXT Bush president.

But I do think Sensenbrenner's brutish tactics over Conyers' forum as well as this outrageous statement should be used against him in his relection campaign.

[Melodybe]

148. kick

[Mr_Spock]

149. "Sensenbrenner wants to repeal 22nd Ammendment" - this guy is a freak

Idiots like him will ensure the Repukes are voted out of office soon - keep opening your idiot mouth SenselessBrooder...