Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Why does the left side with Islam?

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
 
IranianDemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:10 PM
Original message
Why does the left side with Islam?
This is one thing I have never understood, especially here on DU. If you go around insulting Christianity it seems to be almost acceptable, but if you say anything about Islam you'll be branded as a "bigot" etc.

Is there any sort of philisophical reasoning behind this?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
ulysses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. because most of us are American
and while I neither bash nor agree with bashing any religion as a whole, this country isn't in the control of ignorant conservatives masquerading under the *Islamic* banner.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Enraged American Donating Member (276 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
2. I'm Jewish and I side with constitutional rights
The Christian Right put Bush in power. Islam is Bush's scapegoat. So DU defends the defenseless.
The Christian Right is behind the propaganda.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MariMayans Donating Member (250 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
3. I don't side with "Islam"
I think all the religions are fucked up, but there is a certain familiar ring from the third reich when I see hysteria that a group of people of middle eastern descent are secretly plotting to kill or enslave us all.

I "tolerate" Islam the same way I tolerate all other religions. Like I tolerate morning traffic or some idiot who won't get out of my face even though I don't really want to talk to them.

You would have to get more specific in what "sides with" means.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bpilgrim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:15 PM
Response to Original message
4. ask rush
or hannity :crazy:

peace
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WhoCountsTheVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:16 PM
Response to Original message
5. The left doesn't side with Islam, that's just Republican propaganda
so why are you posting it here?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:16 PM
Response to Original message
6. Thanks for the Right-wing propaganda
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
IranianDemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Hey pal I could be wrong, I never said I was right.
But every time I say something even remotely crtical of Islam, I get flamed to high hell for it. When people do that to christianity, it seems normal.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MariMayans Donating Member (250 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. expand on the thought then..
I have seen some outright leftist idiots who mourned the passing of the "emirate of Afghanistan" as the crushing of some populist movement, but that would be seperate from thinking that the US conduct in that conflict was criminal at times or hypocritical.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wuushew Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Proof?
link?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MariMayans Donating Member (250 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. it was near two years ago
how am I going to link to it?

Tariq Ali goes into a long diatribe about it in "Clash of Fundamentalisms" and is quite caustic about a group of European and American leftists present for Khomeni's return chanting "God is Great" because they thought the people around them didn't really mean to set up a theocracy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wuushew Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:17 PM
Response to Original message
7. Does Islam proselytize?
If not, than as an atheist I will always prefer a secular muslim to a southern baptist.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mandyky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:17 PM
Response to Original message
8. I don't think "we" side with Islam
I think some liberals realize the Palestinians (not all are Islamic) have been getting the short end of the stick. As a result, we see why fundamentalist Islamics are so mad at the US. But side with them? No way. Liberals online have been complaining about the Taliban in Afghanistan and womens' rights issues since the 90's.

I think the left sees any fundamentalist religion as a problem, Christian, Islamic, or any other cult that promotes and us and them mentality, among other things.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Enraged American Donating Member (276 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:20 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. I don't think he was talking about the Taliban
when he mentioned "Islam." I think he meant the more mainstream version of Islam.

Anyways, it's not really an issue for me.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Fatima Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:18 PM
Response to Original message
9. What the hell is this all about?
Edited on Mon Sep-22-03 08:31 PM by Fatima
I am Muslim and I am as big a critic of right wing extremist Islam as you can get here...but if you take a cheap shot at Islam in general I will say something.

And to add, I do not recall bashing you for any comments you have said about Islam.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mikimouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:19 PM
Response to Original message
11. Just my opinion
but I think that most of us would profess some knowledge of Christianity. Familiarity with that religious affiliation brings with it the 'knowledge' of how it is often used as an excuse for marginalizing certain groups, on the basis that Christianity is the only 'true' path to God. I believe that you would find that people who define themselves as 'left' (myself included) would tend to resent attacks on any religion simply based on such a 'religiocentric' bias. This may be an especially sensitive topic since September 11, 2001, because of the general jingoism we have seen directed toward all things Muslim. Again, it is just my opinion. :hippie:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cappurr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:20 PM
Response to Original message
13. Speaking only for myself....
I don't side with Islam. I don't side with any religion. But I can tell you that every religion (Islam Christian and Jewish) has its fanatics. And those people are the problem....not the normal church, synagoge or mosque attending majority.

I DO, however, side with people that are being persecuted. And I think a lot of muslims are being persecuted for their religious beliefs. They are being lumped in with all the fanatics. And the right wing religious groups are the worst. Its no damn wonder that muslims are open to the fanatics who tell them this is the new crusade and they must take up arms for Islam.

And the Israel/Palestinian situation is the core of the resentment.

No matter which side you lean toward in I/P history is pretty clear. The British split up a country with Arabs living in it and gave half of it to create Israel. These people were uprooted from their roots. And it was just to solve a European problem. How can they not feel persecuted?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:32 PM
Response to Reply #13
21. Nice post Cappurr
I was just wondering about you the other day. Glad to see your back, hope everything is alright.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
damnraddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:21 PM
Response to Original message
14. I don't side with Islam.
There is much that is regressive in Islam, as in Christianity, in Judaism, and in secular politics. But Islam is often the target of outrageous attacks, just as Judaism is but especially used to be. In some ways, Islam has replaced Judaism as the target of bigotted attacks -- although Judaism is, of course, still a target. This means that the left, in the role of defending the targets of bigotted attacks, will often be defending Muslims.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EDT Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
16. America is a melting pot-
Edited on Mon Sep-22-03 08:27 PM by EDT
I come here for pro abortion and pro gay issues, but on the "Right" side, I am also
pro freedom to own guns, against smoking laws, against helmet laws, and probably alot
more pro use of military than alot of people here. A tough match for DU or free republic.


One thing I do have is tolerance for all religions, though an atheist, I am angered
at peoples Islam bashing. I guess my rambling point is that I am not a flaming cookie cutter
left winger, but still get mad as hell when I watch the news and see all the Israeli airstrikes
labeled as "retaliatory" and all the Palestinian acts labeled as terrorist bombers.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:28 PM
Response to Original message
18. Why should left or right side against any religion?

What would be the philosophical reasoning behind that?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FlashHarry Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:30 PM
Response to Original message
20. I think your question might be too broad.
Just a thought.

Islam, as Christianity or Judaism, is a religion practiced by millions of individuals. A great many are peaceful, intelligent people. Unfortunately, as is the case with the other revealed religions, a great many are also dangerously extremist in their views. Lumping everyone together is an approach that can be problematic.

Incidentally, insulting Christianity as a whole is a mistake, too, for the same reasons. It does go on here at DU occasionally, but the Mods are pretty quick to clamp down on it.

An Episcopalian is not the same as a Missouri Synod Lutheran. A Lubavitcher Jew is not the same as a Reform Jew. A Wahabi'ist Muslim is not the same as a Shi'ite Muslim (or a Zoroastrian Persian, for that matter--though many wouldn't know the difference.)

Tolerance is a virtue.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:33 PM
Response to Original message
22. I don't side with Islam
...and people I know who are concerned about the fate of the Palestinians don't see that as an issue of Islam, either. It's about human rights, no matter what faith you practice...or if you practice no faith.

As a former member of a Christian group, I bash that group because I vehemently disagree with them, and if you look at the positions of white southern baptists in the history of this country, you will find they have consistently been on what has been shown to be the wrong side of history...particularly segregation.

they were with FDR, but that was an embarrassment, imo, for democrats, just as they are now an embarrassment for true republicans (as opposed to neocons.)

Personally, I too often see religion used as an ideology to promote power for one group over another. the only secular thing which has equaled this is the totalitarian communism of Stalin and Pol Pot, etc.

So I oppose extremism, whether secular or religious.

I think Israel should be able to remain in Israel, but I think Palestinians should also be able to remain. It is the extremists of both sides which prevent this from happening.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sweetheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:33 PM
Response to Original message
23. muhammed was a slave
that would make his intent coming to liberate all slaves from oppression... methinks that is very american... in the totally-dead-real-american myth.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ablbodyed Donating Member (610 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:34 PM
Response to Original message
24. All ORGANIZED religions...
suck. Religion is for cowards, fools and hypocrits. There ARE people who espouse the goodness that Christ preached, but they're few and far between, and NOT ONE OF THEM IS A FUNDAMENTALIST. The true Christians among you will read this and turn the other cheek, ruing the cruelities done to me in the name of Christianity that made me this bitter, while the phonies will revile my views. But it just proves my point.
Organized religion impedes and interfers with true spirituality. The fundamental (and I use the term with full understanding) precept of Judeo-Christian ethos is of a personal relationship with God, one that a person's mind and spirit grapples with. But for Organized religions, that becomes a minor, indeed irritating, aspect. It's the perpetration of the organization and it's advancement that is paramount. I work with religious people and their Christianity consists of throwing a few bucks into a collection plate, and having the ability to maintain a smug look of false piety for an hour a week. The other 167 hours of the week they have ZERO Christian behavior. And they're ALL Republicans.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FlashHarry Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Are you saying all Christians are Republicans?
That just simply isn't true--plus it's pretty insensitive. Welcome to DU--but try to be a little more tolerant, please.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Fatima Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. And a hearty Salaam Aleikum to you, too pal...
Tell me, are you always this intolerant? Because if you knew me, you would likely not call me a coward...or a fool. What a shame.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nothingshocksmeanymore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
26. I think you are seeing what you want to see
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
KG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-03 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. DING, DING, DING!



:)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sun Nov 23rd 2014, 07:22 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC