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booksenkatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 08:23 AM
Original message
ROTC for elementary school kids?
Yesterday while walking through our community center, my son and I passed by a room filled with little boys dressed in full ROTC regalia, marching in straight columns, with orders called out by drill sergeants. These boys were between 8 and 12, I would guess. Their jackboots echoed on the tiles. It made a chill go down my spine. I seem to remember some sort of organization like this for boys back in the 60s, but this was the first time I'd seen it in all of these years since. Any ideas as to what I was seeing? It was NOT Boy Scouts, of that I am certain.
:scared:

My son (age 5) asked who/what they were. I told him that those boys are pretending to be soldiers, and that perhaps they wanted to be soldiers when they grow up. He said, well, I want to be a doctor, and maybe those soldiers can come to me when they're hurt. I chuckled and said, yeah, maybe. Then he said, "Or maybe they'll just die in the war." Jeez. (I hate this climate in which we're having to raise our son -- it wasn't supposed to be like this. Back when we had him in 1999, things were so different, so optimistic...!)

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Spinzonner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 08:28 AM
Response to Original message
1. Will they be called Bush Youth

and will they train a future Pope ?
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QuettaKid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. where was this? I would like
to find more info on this if possible. I have NEVER heard of ROTC for kids that young.
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booksenkatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 08:50 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. I'm in southeast Michigan -- glorious suburbia (puke)
There was something similar like this for elementary school boys when I was little, back in the 60s in Texas, but I just can't for the life of me remember anything about it. To me, there seems to be a big difference between kids just playing soldier vs. dressing up in full regalia and having a coupla drill sergeants running them through routines. It was jarring, to say the least. (And as a mom, I'm wondering, of course, how my non-violent, liberal son will fit into such a world.) :(

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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #2
11. Hi QuettaKid!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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TornadoTN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 08:52 AM
Response to Original message
4. Interesting
Interesting scenario you describe. I have seen the ROTC start going into Middle Schools and recruiting from 5th grade on up, I would presume for "early entry" or early indoctrination. This happens quite regularly here in the South, some organizations are founded in the private community that are mini-ROTC's, run by parents with the help of the High School ROTC.

I have no problem with the military, nor do I have a problem with ROTC in the High School. We need good military leaders and soliders and ROTC is a good place to start. BUT, I do not support the way they are being run now, which is basically a forced recruitment into the military with shining promises (shall I say, lies?) and other tactics that have turned our schools into recruitment centers. Even Government and Economics teachers in my area have been told to send lists of students who would be good "candidates" for military service to the ROTC department, who then harass the students to join the military. By candidates, I mean students who arent A+, but merely average or below average in academics, poor to middle class family and believe it or not, Christian. Thank you so much, NCLB and the Patriot Act for turning our country into a pseudo-fascist boot camp. I never thought I would be comparing my country to Nazi Germany, but for the love of god, what the hell is happening?
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qazplm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. little bit of stereotyping...
I got interest from Purdue AFROTC and I was an A-/B+ student, black, agnostic, although the poor to middle class fit me lol

I was also involved with recruiting for AFROTC in high schools when I got to Purdue, it was almost a completely cadet run program, with only nominal involvement from the officers (basically just to make sure it wasnt a crappy presentation) and we just set up our thing in a room and showed it to whomever showed up, answered questions and were done.

Now true that was awhile back and things may be different now, just saying that it varies from group to group.
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TornadoTN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 09:23 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. I agree
I'm not saying that it happens all the time, but from personal expierence (my wife is a teacher in the middle school level) and observation, I can tell you that the criteria that they are looking for fit my described profile. In our school system, we had a Government teacher retire because she was not going to turn over any "profiling" information to anyone.

With the armed forces not meeting recruitment standards, It follows that underhanded tactics or saturation tactics will become more and more commonplace.

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booksenkatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 09:07 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. You do have a point, of course
Yes, we do need soldiers and we do need good military leaders. I suppose I get concerned when the military is glorified by young boys -- my cousin's son is 12 and that child absolutely worships the Army. Room full of every kind of G.I. Joe toy, wallpaper, he loves to dress in camo, wear a holster, etc. He can't wait to get to Iraq and he's TWELVE. I guess I worry about my child getting swept up in the fervor of current American life, know what I mean? I just want my kid to play baseball or go swimming or hiking and not have to worry about the hell that is happening all around him until he has to. I'm being Pollyanna, maybe.

I was born in 1960 and grew up seeing Vietnam on TV every night on the news, but I didn't connect with it and I'd just go outside and play. I was very lucky to have a great childhood with few worries, I guess. So I'm wondering how a child is impacted when he finds himself actually connecting with war. Good/bad?
:shrug:

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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #4
12. "believe it or not, Christian"
Where did they get this statistic? Very frightening.
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TornadoTN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Statisticly Speaking
In the Southern United States, especially in my area, the numbers stack up in favor of the above demographic. I can only speak for my county school system, where two government teachers have talked about what type of information was requested (i.e.-do these kids go to church? where at?) of them by recruiters.
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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 09:47 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Still, quite frightening.
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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
5. It's terrifying is what it is
Edited on Tue Apr-26-05 08:59 AM by Horse with no Name
But more than likely the group is the Young Marines.

http://www.youngmarines.com /

I "heard" that this group of children are basically indoctrinated and brainwashed, given money, "cool" clothes, etc.

>>>>snip
About the Young Marines

The Young Marines is a youth education and service program for boys and girls, ages 8 through completion of high school. The Young Marines promotes the mental, moral, and physical development of its members. The program focuses on character building, leadership, and promotes a healthy, drug-free lifestyle. The Young Marines is the focal point for the U.S. Marine Corps' youth Drug Demand Reduction efforts.

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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. From age eight?
Wow. They're just children! *sigh* I think they should wait until high school personally.
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booksenkatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. Found them through your link! That's what they were
The local group HQ's out of the community center... makes sense. I think the boys I saw were mostly 8-10, I was being pretty generous when I threw in "12" in my original post.

I really have mixed feelings about this, but it certainly got my attention hearing those clicking boots marching in perfect time! Maybe I'd feel better if I believed that we were putting those boots to good use, instead of marching them off to places where we don't belong in order to enrich the Bush family.

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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-05 09:53 AM
Response to Original message
15. i am so with you
and in the 60's-70's it was in high school. and i think started as junior. and as much of anything was to be an extracirricular to help into college

i have a 7 and 9

i had no guns. 9/11 happened and the whiole world changed. bush and war and iraq and the news and disgust,...............boys bought gi joes and started playing out.

i am getting more and more of this, but here, feels more they bring it to stillness within themselves. girls use dolls. it all depends how the child does it. i am seeing these tooys as much a healing tool for them, as anything. just a real fucked up world for boys right now. in one way

and the same true for girls in another, medical control, shnorter (arnie) the onslaught of attack from man,....

i mean, really i hear ya. but

i am finding being with boys on all this and talking to them as they go thru it, they are seieng the higher in this stuff. they are seeing the missteps. they are going to be awesome as they grow, because they are gaining insight on how you can do this world in honor and peace and love. so they are not hopeless


they are ok

yours will too. many are
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