In my rural Texas town Schiavo might be backfiring on the Republicans

[Lone_Star_Dem]

I started wondering last night when I received a late night call from a person in DeLay's district who was upset with what was happening. They are (were?) a DeLay supporter and we'd had a falling out over DeLay before the elections. They ranted on DeLay's involvement in the Schiavo case and went so far as to say I may have been right on some of the things I'd said about DeLay.

Today some of my (Republican) clients began to bring up Schiavo to me and ask my opinion. It's not normal for them to ask my opinion on politics. After the 2000 elections they've learned not to press my buttons. I thought something was fishy but I told them exactly how I felt. I don't think this was something that should have been dealt with by Congress and I think her case is being manipulated to serve a nefarious agenda. The four of my clients who had asked me about it all agreed. They don't think the Federal Government has any right meddling in this matter. They think her husband should be the one to choose just like the courts have already ruled. One elderly gentleman told me this was a big topic of discussion at the local coffee shop this morning. (Here, like many rural towns, if you want to know what's going on you just swing by the coffee shop between 6 and 7AM for your debriefing.) He told me it was about as smart a move as Bush's plans for SS. I know that most of the people here don't support Bush on SS, but to hear Schiavo lumped in as being as foolish was a shock to me. I picked my jaw up off the floor and told him I wasn't happy with Bush's plans for SS either. We went on to chat about SS and I found out he was very well informed on the issue. It seems the coffee shop crew has Bush's number on SS.

I know this is on persons experience and I've only spoken to a few of the local Republicans on this, but if what they are telling me is indicative of most Republicans, this would imply the Right has overplayed their hand on this one. This may just be wishful thinking on my part, I'm not sure.

I just wanted to share this with all of you here at DU. It made me happy and I'm hoping it might please a few of you as well.

[LittleClarkie]

1. A good read, I hope you're right

Recommended.

Loved your comment about the coffeeshop "debriefing."

[sonias]

2. Great report Lone_Star_Dem

Politics is still local. If your rural town coffee shop patrons are seeing through the fog these days, that's great news indeed. Now let’s hope they're letting their congressional slithering snake know that he's just full of it.

Sonia

[bridgit]

3. i don't think repubs can behave in so politically craven...

a fashion while claiming both invisibility & immunity from their own hypocrisy simultaneously, that's my 'imo' if they care to know

[FlemingsGhost]

4. Surely, one thing the brain-dead can identify with: one of their own.

What's even funnier, is Bush couldn't care less about these fools and their opinions. They might as well be ... *gasp* ... DEMOCRATS!

Wake me if any of these geniuses piece THAT together.

[Jane Austin]

5. Rural people are notably practical.

They have to be, or they wouldn't last long.

Delay, Frist, Bush and Co. are trying to play on the country's emotions, and while that tends to work with patriotic issues, I think most practical people see this attempt to protract this poor woman's "life" as sheer nonsense.

[FlemingsGhost]

11. Rural folks, voting Republican, is the antithesis of "practical."

Particularly when most rural populations are lower income.

[Jane Austin]

19. They think they're being practical - -

They see that they need their guns and low taxes.

What they lack is the sophistication to see that the Rethuglicans are just using them.

[Daphne08]

27. I recently moved from a rural area to an urban area, and

I wholeheartedly agree with you!

[Momof1]

24. welcome to my hell

Describes my area perfectly.

Which may explain why Santorum is one of my senators. I think people in this area flat out booed him when he was having his "town meetings"

I think Casey is going to kick his ass.

[FreedomAngel82]

16. I think so too

The patriotism thing worked well for them but this is a family thing. Even the real republicans recognize the marriage and all that. Only the fundies and the neocons are siding with Bush on this. This is just nuts and I'm so glad it's going against them. Yay!

[Jawja]

50. I think Bush and Delay

were not only playing on the country's emotions with this issue, but thought it would be divisive. Instead, a clear majority of the public disagrees with their stance and understands the political pandering and diversion.

I would say they miscalculated and it is backfiring.

Perhaps their "divide and conquer" tactic has been used once too often?

[greenbriar]

6. too bad they didn't

listen to us before they put that fuck back in office

[greenbriar]

too bad they didn't

listen to us before they put that fuck back in office

[napi21]

7. Glad to hear that even Pugs can be logical.

It doesn't happen very often, but even they can be pushed too far.

[liberalhistorian]

8. I think you're onto something

there. Polls are indicating massive disagreement with Congress's actions on this matter, even from many Republicans, and you should have seen some of the emails on CNN this morning from disgusted Republicans. After all, less government is a real philosophy to many republicans in the real world, and they are very upset at Congress's overreaching and pandering. I think they just may have gone too far this time.

[Selatius]

12. Where were these Republicans when we were talking abortion/gay marriage?

Gee, they seem to favor heavy government intrusion and regulation in the bedroom but not in the hospital room.

[FreedomAngel82]

17. Really

It is a bit hypocritical. They want them to stay out of marriage but yet they butt into the same-sex marriage issue. Go figure!

[zipplewrath]

29. It's too close to home

Especially in rural areas, gays are something from somewhere else. Wars are far away. Even gangs, poverty, welfare recipients, crack, are from somewhere else. Alot of issues like abortion are "hidden". People will "leave town" to address these issues and their neighbors will never know. But everyone has parents. Every family either goes through some of this, or knows someone who has.

The right was pandering and thought by cloaking it in some sort of "right to life" vision, they could get away with it. If they have over played in any sense, it is that the vast majority of people, if they were Terri, would want the tube pulled. Furthermore, alot of folks really do see some sort of "sanctity of marriage". Not in the literal sense, but their partners are their primary "guardians" on many issues. This includes with respect to their parents. Alot of folks get married to get out of their homes. Alot of folks get married hoping "not to do it like mom and dad did". This is a family squabble and that's how the vast majority of America sees it.

These are the kinds of issues that the Swift Boat vets will have a hard time moving people on. The issues are to familiar, too well known and understood in personal terms.

I'm dubious there is any real large, long term effect here. But it is part of a smaller "drip drip" of discontent with the current leaderships slavish allegiance to the radical elements of their own party. There are alot of "small government" republicans out there. The fiscal conservatives still exist. There's also the "Teddy Roosevelt Republicans" that actually care about clear air and water. More than a few of them also realize drilling for oil is a fools mission.

If there is any hope that this issue will explode on the leadership, it is in one potential miscalculation. This could easily become an "Elian Gonzales" kinda situation. These folks are down to their last thread. They have a lousy case, and this thing may run through the federal courts pretty quickly. They could be back on Delay's doorstep and then he'll have a problem. They are irrational and they don't take losing well. They may well expect more specific action. And I suspect that the republicans won't be able to give it to them. They may be forced to have their basic hypocrisy exposed and it could lose them their basic support amongst this right to life crowd.

[Tsiyu]

49. Welcome to DU, zipplewrath

Nice post

[sendero]

53. Well said...

.... and welcome to DU.

As is always the case, the "personality" of the right, which helps them gain power, is also their undoing.

They overreach, they start believing they can sell bullshit in a can for $1000, and they are always surprised when they find that their is a stupid-point below which Americans won't go.

Anecdotally, I find very few people who don't see this for what it is, and that is without me saying a word about it

[crispini]

9. Tell your friend in the bugman's district...

MORRISON 06!!!!!!

[Lone_Star_Dem]

14. I'm all over it!

It would appear that some of the seeds of doubt that were spread on DeLay have taken root. I plan on taking full advantage of this. The removal of Tom DeLay is in the better interest of the entire US not just Texas.

[sellitman]

10. My Totally repug boss hates bush the lessers SS plans too.

Shrub is totally losing it. Too bad it couldn't have happened before the selection in November.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

15. I wish he would have lost it before November, too.

Let's focus our sites on 2006 and hope he continues on his self destruction course with the rest of the Republicans following lockstep behind him.

[FreedomAngel82]

18. Maybe they will

They seem really high strung on power and they don't listen to the polls etc. Anything to keep their power and whatnot. It may seem like they've given up but they'll bring something else. They thought this would work but obviously not. We just have to keep reminding them that those who got this into the political arena don't care about the santicty of marriage. If they can get the LGBT community they can get anybody.

[lyonn]

42. "06" is a real biggie

Imagine if we could gain control in either house what a difference it would make. My mouth waters with anticipation. I'm old and want to see changes fairly soon. Ha.

[NEDem]

13. I'm in Nebraska,

I heard the exact same sentiments expressed by the people I work with. I pretty much kept my big mouth shut and listened. This has backfired more than I think any of them thought it could.

[proud_dem]

20. Yes that is great news ....although ..

now that the polls are out and the repukes are not in the winner's circle, I am sure tomorrow morning ..it will be .. Terri who? as the media drops her story like a rock as though she never even exsisted.

[blondeatlast]

51. Terri who? tomorrow--we've found Osama on Friday!

I'm psychic, I swear...

Watch for it

[BrklynLiberal]

21. Maybe, just maybe, they overplayed their hand this time.....?

[Nothing Without Hope]

22. Thank you, LSD (!) - it DOES cheer me

By the way, I'm a proud native Texan as well, though I live in Massanchusetts these days. I'm very familiar with the Texan way of allowing other people to underestimate you, then wham! They don't like being taken for fools, and that is what the Repubs have been doing so blatantly in this case. I think they overplayed their hand at last -- at least that is what I am hoping for.

[tammywammy]

23. I work with some strong republicans,

and they were disgusted with this weekends actions.

[seventythree]

25. I think it depends on what the MSM is going to do, now.

The polls are like off the charts against this machination, depending on how the questions is asked, I've seen numbers near 70%. That piece of garbage Paula Zahn had a piece on Anderson Cooper -- are you ready? -- about a woman who was declared in a persistent vegetative state, had a feeding tube removed, and is perfectly well, now and saying how agonizing it was when they removed the tube and she couldn't tell anyone to feed her. There was nothing that I caught as to how many years ago this was, or how long she had been in a vegetative state, or how she came out of it, or who said she was in it. I about blew a gasket -- get more of that crap, and the country will flip.

[ClarkUSA]

31. No one's ever come out of a persistent vegetative state...

Wasn't that woman on Zahn's show in a coma, which is way different than having brainwaves that are as flat as a pancake like Schiavo's is.

Paula Zahn is a Twinkie who's gotten a few too many surgical "tweaks." Can she ever say anything without smiling?

[seventythree]

33. One had been in a coma, and one

they said had been diagnosed in a persistent vegetative state -- obviously, she was misdiagnosed. That is what disturbed me so much -- there wasn't any other data than the statement and this perfectly normal woman saying she was in agony from not having food put in her tube. I wanted to know how long she had had that diagnosis -- one day? The coma lady just broke out of her coma and started to talk after years -- a totally different situation, as you say, and CNN lumping it all together was trying to slant the issue. I hear Zahn got canceled -- her exit can't be fast enough for me.

[lyonn]

44. They went into detail concerning the

others but not her. That was a deliberately misleading.

[seventythree]

54. my sentiment, exactly

[grace0418]

26. I'll take anything.

I mean it. Absolutely anything that can bring the BushCo Reign of Terror to an end is fine with me. If it's the unbelievably crass and heartless use of Terry Schiavo's plight for political gain that brings them down (even though it's not the worst crime they've committed by a long shot), fine. I'll take it. And Terry could become our paton saint.

[salin]

28. Wonder if this can be used to start questioning on other fronts....

for example, I just read last night that Frist is trying to get Ried to "compromise" - and make.... REFORM of FILIBUSTERS in the senate a new thing. Now I know regular folks don't always get filibuster - but some supported sen "no" helms regular use of filibuster to block clinton nominees... but more important - the question can now be asked...

what happens on other bills that are not well thought out, that don't represent the majority of the public opinion - if one takes away the major tool for more than 200 years for slowing down and forcing more thought/compromise in the senate?

Get them to realize the constant power grabbing being done in order to push through more craziness.

Remember initially the push on SS was to try to get it through (like medicare reform) very quickly - before it could be reviewed. Why - becuase when things move that quickly the details can not be known. Get them to start growing distrustful.

Just a thought. If you could try it out on one of these folks - see how they respond to it - and report back, it would be helpful.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

39. I took your advice and felt out a local Republican on the filibuster issue

Since I didn't take notes I'm paraphrasing for the most part.

I admit to picking a test subject that I expected to be approachable if not agreeable to a political conversation. He's a good friend of the elderly gentleman I mentioned in my first post.

I started off mentioning I'd talked to his friend the day before and what we discussed. I kept mostly to SS knowing it would be an accepted icebreaker and then asked what he knew about the filibuster and if he could offer his views on it. Initially he thought I wasn't clear on what it was and proceeded to explain what he understood it to be. I let him tell me how it's used by the minority party to block nominations they don't approve of. I was satisfied he had a working knowledge and I mentioned my memory of the Republicans using it against Clinton and he chuckled. He went on to say it's a way of keeping absolute power form corrupting absolutely. I then mentioned how the Republicans were threatening to in effect remove it's use now that they were in control. He said it would never happen it goes against good government and wouldn't be allowed. I pressed him and asked him what if it does would you support it? He told me a lame duck president shouldn't be allowed that type of control. He went on to say the day would come when the tables are again turned and the Republicans would need to filibuster. I agreed and told him it appeared to be a short sighted plan. I kept trying to get him to question the direction the current Administration was heading. He would express some displeasure but I felt he wasn't wanting to trash it outright. This was fine with me. I had him thinking and that's exactly what my aim was.

By the time we'd finished talking he was definitely not for abolishing the filibuster. We agreed it could be misused but was necessary all the same to maintain balance in government.

If nothing else he has a new topic for the coffee shop crew tomorrow.

[lawladyprof]

30. I teach in the deep South and that was the consensus of my students

last night. These are all adults.

[goodhue]

32. Yes, it seems they have overplayed

But to what consequence, if any?

[spooked911]

38. Yes, they've already had so many "jumped the shark" moments

[msmcghee]

34. Yes, but this is not a political war we are in.

This is a political forum (mostly) so those here see things mainly in the political dimension. What is happening is much bigger than that.

Our culture is undergoing a Reformation, just like the Protestant Reformation of the middle ages.

The politics is just the way it is being waged at the moment in this country. In Iraq the Reformation is undeway with more conventional "Reformation" tactics. If politics does not provide the "cleansing of evil" and the triumph of their ideology that the Reformation warriors like Delay, Bush, Santorum, etc. require - then other means will be used.

There is no retreating from a Reformation once it has started (it started with Clinton's presidency). They can only go forward until enough misery and death has been delivered to mankind that they get tired of it. We're a long way from there.

Then they'll look around at the terrible death and destruction they caused and say it was the liberals fault - as in "I had to beat my wife to death because she just wouldn't listen".

If politics is war without the guns - you can be sure that the guns are close by and ready for those who are committed to this Reformation and who are in no way ready to lose a significant battle like the Schiavo case.

[Javaman]

35. Several freepers in my office are against it...

I, being one of a few liberals in the office and also being the facilities Manager, have become the odd sounding board for peoples gripes here where I work.
Oddly, the hard core freeps here are pissed off and against morons* and the feds involvement in this Schiavo thing.
When they say,"I don't think the feds should be involved in this".
I respond, "what do you think of bush signing that bill to have the case bumped up to the federal courts?"
They respond, "I don't like it."
I then say, "I find it ironic that for a prez that promotes marriage the way he does, he's taking away the husbands right to make the decision about his wifes welfare."
They usually go silent.
I think their brains are shorting out at the prospect that moron* is flip flopping.
The more stubborn ones, I site the situation of when moron* was governor of Texas, back in 1999, signed the bill saying that the allows the persons guardian or surrogate to make the life-ending decisions on the patients behalf and goes so far to allow the hospital to disconnect the persons life sustaining equipment.
The last person I just brought that up to started to argue with me, but then stopped, when they realized that I was right. I thought their brain was going to short out.
These freepers are amazing. So fucking brainwashed. It appears as they are on life support and are brain dead themselves. So sad.

[CitySky]

36. this is great news

Let's hope everyone remembers their bad feelings about DeLay in '06.

I'd like a scorecard putting Richard Morrison toe-to-toe with the Bug Man on TRUE "Moral Values:"

Issue ...................... Morrison ...... DeLay

poisoning kids with Mercury .. NO .... YES
pay-to-play politics .......... NO ... YES

and so on...

[spooked911]

37. It's brain dead politics. But maybe they can get away with it

if they have the voting machines rigged. All they really care about is their fundie-base-- not coincidentally, I'm sure, the guys who own the voting machine companies are fundies...

[MsTryska]

40. I think you should start swinging by for the debreifings.

might be interesting to put a finger on the pulse of your red neighbors, as well as subtley help the worm turn.

[retread]

41. Two things people have up close and personal experience with

are dying and Social Security. Everyone has "the mother or close relative" who survives with dignity into their old age because of Social Security or at least knows someone who does. Because of this knowledge people can imagine themselves in that position.

Everyone has faced or will face an extremely hard, painful decision about a loved one at the end of their life or knows someone who has. Again, everyone can imagine having to make such a decision.

This time the assault on private lives and well-being is not confined to a minority.

[grannylib]

43. I hope your take on it is right; per the polls I've seen, it follows

across the country. I think Michael Schiavo really struck a chord with most people because this issue DOES hit home and I think people may be in some teeny tiny way waking up to the fact that this sorry-assed bunch of thugs will take over ANY PART OF NORMAL LIFE AS WE KNOW IT ANY DAMN TIME THEY CAN GET AWAY WITH IT!
They have NO damn business in this matter. As Olbermann pointed out the other night, if her eyes were closed, this probably would not be happening. I would add that, if this were not Florida, we might not be seeing this today either. No coincidence at all, in my mind, that Brother Jebbie's state is the staging ground for this, just as it may be for 2008 if another sonofabush decides to campaign for Naked Emperor 2 1/2.

[lyonn]

45. exactly granny

The Jeb angle is excellent. Only W's bro could do what he did.

[DanGough]

46. Over reaching but a diversion

I agree. I think they have grossly miscalculated the reactions of many people. we got to remember though that this thing has been successful in diverting attention away from Social Security, DeLay's ethics problem, etc. Let's not lose focus on the other more important issues.

[jmcon007]

47. I don't believe it's wishful thinking at all.....

I agree with you and are we not seeing the same thing with Social Security and the question of private accounts? I believe they've overplayed their hand with it as well.
I believe true wishful thinking, though, might be that instead of overplaying their hands, maybe people are simply beginning to wake up to what's happening in BushWorld.
Either way, it's encouraging.

[Tsiyu]

48. Very enjoyable post

"debriefing" LOL


Wonderful news. I will sleep better tonight, thinking about the coffee shop crowd stirring the sparks of awareness.

[katinmn]

52. Great! People are starting to see that the Bush/DeLay/Frist

gang are drunk with power.

It appears they have overestimated their position and support.