Does invading Iraq have anything to do how much gas my SUV burns?

[passy]

To be honest * wanted to invade Iraq to gain control of its oil output.
Does it mean that he wanted to make sure buyers of large cars could cheaply fill up their tanks or that his friends in the oil business could get rich?
Maybe both but in any case America's is utterly dependent on cheap oil priced in $.
Are all these young men and women dying in Iraq for no other reason than cheap gas?
Do you feel guilty when you fill up?
It's like junkies who beat up old women to steal their money for just one more fix.
Can America's addiction ever be cured?

[Ninga]

1. I'm sorry I didn't buy a Prius......I really, really, really do feel

like a dirt bag. My vehicle only gets about 17 in the city and I just got it 5 days ago.

I really am sincere when I say I'm sorry. I feel selfish.

[passy]

3. What car did you buy?

And would you have bought had it cost you twice as much to run?

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Misunderestimator]

9. Nice.

:eyes:

[spanone]

13. brilliant logic

[tavalon]

27. We are in the process of buying a Prius

but man, they get you up front with the cost. We won't be saving much money at all. Of course, we're getting it because it's the eco-smart thing to do rather than the cost saving thing to do.

[burythehatchet]

2. Yes

[amazona]

4. they're clearly not dying for CHEAP gas

The point of the war was to create an excuse to inflate the price of gas. Americans and Iraqis are dying so that Exxon-Mobil can post record profits. And this is exactly what we see happening if you scan your financial press -- or just check the cost to fill up your car this weekend. Gas is not cheap, it has just hit another all-time high.

The whole "kick their ass and take their gas" crowd has been spectacularly discredited.

Anyone who believes this war or any war is about providing a cheap commodity to the people has been HAD. That was never anything but a story for the stupid people. And, yes, of course, there are sufficient stupid, unfeeling people who support any policy that will bring down their price for gas as long as it is someone else's kid getting killed in war...but the stupid people are not getting any cheap gas either. Nobody's getting cheap gas. If America is "utterly dependent" on cheap gas -- a doubtful claim, since we seem to be surviving without it -- then we're screwed. Because there isn't any cheap gas now that we have utterly alienated our suppliers in at least two hemispheres.

The conservation movement is a breeding ground of communists
and other subversives. We intend to clean them out,
even if it means rounding up every birdwatcher in the country.
--John Mitchell, US Attorney General 1969-72

[whistle]

5. You burn gas with your SUV, I thought those things just used...

...peanut oil!

I have a mid-sized car that gets 18-20mpg city driving and 25-27mpg highway driving. When gas prices started to skyrocket last year, I made a conscience choice because I could not afford to trade and buy a more fuel efficient vehicle, to cut out all non-essential driving. I went from filling up every week to filling up once every 10 or 11 days. My next move I suppose would be to use the local bus service and leave the car parked in my driveway most of the time. That will involve some major lifestyle changes, which I am most willing to make. At $2.00 plus per gallon, I'm am ready to make the transition, but only if I know that other Americans will follow suit.

In a way, my measures in the past year to curb my gas use by a third it appears has only allowed those who can afford the gas guzzlers to just go right on wasting fuel with indifference and impunity!

[passy]

10. If you were in the UK it would cost you about $6 per gallon.

Would you use your car as much?

[whistle]

22. Relative to my current earnings, not likely if it would cost me....

...three times as much to drive the same distances. There would have to be a major lexicon shift in how I got from here to there and back. However, we are talking about gradual adjustments aren't we? This country before I was even born, made a commitment to structure itself around cheap oil. So every hit requires a major change or adjustment, provided that income remains constant.

When I was a kid, virtually all urban transit systems were abolished within a ten year period (post WWII) and railroad passenger service was lobbied into near oblivion and nationalized in preference of the automobile. UK has the auto as one of several viable choices for individual travel. That's why I feel that the next adjustment to gas price increases in the U.S. can't be just individual decisions, but really has to be shared throughout the society.

The dollar alone can't be the voting medium on a matter that is so critical to this country's future. If that sound's like socialism or worse, so be it. That's why a tax plus fees on interstates and licensing fee increases would make sense.

[passy]

23. The problem is that nobody learned from the 1973 oil crisis

http://www.answers.com/topic/1973-oil-crisis

"But the initial moves toward more efficient automobiles and alternative sources of energy stalled as oil prices fell and memories of gasoline shortages of 1973 faded. The U.S. continues to use energy in amounts out of proportion to its population, U.S. automakers continue to oppose legislation that would force them to increase the fuel efficiency of automobiles (see, e.g., "SUV"), and the U.S. continues to respond to any threat to the supply of oil as a threat to its national security (see, e.g., Persian Gulf War)."

"In thirty year old British government documents released in January 2004, it was revealed that the United States considered invading Saudi Arabia and Kuwait during the crisis and seizing the oil fields in those countries. According to the BBC, other possibilities, such as the replacement of Arab rulers by "more amenable" leaders, or a show of force by "gunboat diplomacy," were rejected as unlikely. "

[CindyDale]

21. What you have been doing is admirable

We need to get some type of pledge going.

Cutting fuel consumption by one-third, as you have done, would be a good start. We could publish guides to help people accomplish this. Those of us who can't cut down on mileage could get new vehicles, for example.

We could get the liberal churches to buy into it, too. I know of one church that asked its membership to cut back on grocery expenses by a certain percentage years ago as part of an effort to fight world hunger. This could be a similar drive.

[Selatius]

7. It's not simply about oil; so many people oversimplify the issue

It is about power and control. All the major issues around this issue are clouded by oil; this is true, however, it goes deeper than this. Oil is only one component of the equation.

Control of Iraq will give the US more leverage to influence everything in the Middle East to the liking of those with vested interests. Not only will it give the US a foothold in the Middle East, it will also have an effect on whether OPEC nations, many members in the Persian Gulf, will switch to Euros or stay with dollars. Also, the war is a perfect opportunity to make money.

Untold billions have gone to private firms in this war. Regardless of whether the US actually withdraws from Iraq in defeat or not, the simple fact is if everything else goes down in flames, certain firms walk away far richer than if there was no war. To them, it's the money that matters, and they got what they want already regardless of what the future has in store for us.

They can retire filthy rich tomorrow behind their guards and high walls and security systems in their large estates, while the rest of the country decays and collapses.

[FreedomAngel82]

11. Sad but true

All you have to do is look at the big-time American corporations and look at who has profited the most since the Iraq war. I remember one time someone asked Bush how we were going to pay for the war and he replied with the money we'll make from their oil. Why else would it be Halliburton over there and not another oil company like Texaco or some other well-known named company? Why else would they have people protect the oil lines and fields? So they can grab it.

[CindyDale]

15. It's about war industries, too

but mostly about oil.

[passy]

16. I oversimplified the issue on purpose.

It makes more sense that way and is a lot more direct.
I avoided the geopolitical issues surrounding the issue to ask a simple question.
What does it take to keep it cheap?
And in comparison to the prices around the world especially in Europe it is extremely, cheap even now.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

19. Well said.

[NomoBreaks]

8. look here please

[WilliamPitt]

12. It's a safe bet

[CindyDale]

14. When we buy gas, we are helping fund projects such as PNAC

through the foundations that have supported them. Here are a couple of examples:

http://www.mediatransparency.org/funders/koch_family_foundations.htm

http://www.mediatransparency.org/funders/scaife_foundations.htm


Does anyone really believe we'd be in the Middle East were it not for oil? That's what gives these people their power, that we are so willing to be deceived.

We need to demand serious planning to end our oil dependence now.

Added:

Here's another link that lists many sources of money for right wing projects:

http://www.mediatransparency.org/stories/apparat.html

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

17. Banish the thought! It's about WMD, er, Terrorism, er...something.

Just ask the Oilman-in-Chief.

[passy]

18. I forgot to mention Afghanistan wasn't there something about a pipeline?

And remind me who did the president of Afghanistan use to work for?

[passy]

20. kick

[pauliedangerously]

24. NO NO NO

You've got it backwards....how much gas your SUV burns is why we invaded Iraq.

[passy]

25. Maybe I should sell it, before no one wants to buy it.

I might buy a Prius next time, I heard that they are really reliable.

[pauliedangerously]

26. I've been eyeballing those myself

I checcked out reviews on the Honda Inspire as well, which gets great gas mileage, but it's not a very good ride. I'm going to wait a little longer. My '91 Accord gets about thirty mpg...I really hate buying gas, not that the price bothers me; it's my concern for the future.