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PennyMan Donating Member (231 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 02:49 PM
Original message
Why Is The United States The World Police United Nations Has Nothing To Do
With The Iraq Election Just The United States, Why Do We Think We Are So High And Mighty Why Can't We Work With The United Nations Like We Should, So Other Countries Would Work With Us And Not Hate Us. Why Do We Always Try And Do Everything On Our Own, It Just Upsets Other Countries And Make Them Hate Us Even More.


By the time this column is published, the Iraqi elections will be in full swing. In many ways, this election is extremely crucial as well as noteworthy, as much for its history as its impact. For example, the election is going to be held under the aegis of not the UN, but the United States. Secondly, it is going to give rise to a body of legislators and interested parties who are going to frame a constitution.
Please Read This Article

Here Is The Link
http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/5983_1218328,0043001...
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 02:53 PM
Response to Original message
1. We don't act like the World Police
Unless you're talking about Chicago Police during the reign of Capone.

The US acts like the mob running a global protection racket. If nations don't grant a 'vig' to US business interests, we say, "that's pretty nice country you have there...it would be a shame if anything were to happen to it."

(cf. War is a Racket by Maj. Gen. Smedley Butler.)
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justinsb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 02:53 PM
Response to Original message
2. The US is not the world's police
The US is the only one that decided that and, as it pertains to the situation in Iraq, the US is actually the criminal, not the cop.

http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/IraqComp
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displacedtexan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 02:55 PM
Response to Original message
3. The UN only works if...
member nations want it to work.

Once upon a time, American Statesmen/women were interested in improving the quality of life for everyone on this planet.

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Huckebein the Raven Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Those were the days
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neweurope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Once upon a time... been awhile, hasn't it...
Yor aren't the police, you're the culprit, sorry.


----------------

Remember Fallujah

Bush to The Hague!
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TO Kid Donating Member (565 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 03:09 PM
Response to Original message
6. Look at the UN track record
Rwanda and Sudan come to mind.
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neweurope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. The UN aren't perfect. Unfortunately. And mainly because nations
like the US boycott as much as they can and won't work to make the UN better. So don't complain about the UN. Help to make the UN more useful. The UN are the only chance we have - the world has. And the USA certainly aren't police, they are the villains. AND have been. Not only since Bush!

--------------

Remeber Fallujah

Bush to The Hague!
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TO Kid Donating Member (565 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. There's only one way to make the UN better
Right now the UN is just an old-boys club and cash cow for dictators and mass murderers, financed by the taxpayers in the west. A good start would be to kick out the countries that don't have elected goverments.
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. You can't be kicking people out of the UN
The whole point of it is for there to be a place where ALL nations, nice and nasty alike, have a forum to discuss issues and grievances instead of merely sending in the troops first.

If I were to be asked how to improve the UN, I'd suggest decreasing the power of the permanent members of the Security Council, and increasing the power of the General Assembly, but I know there are many who'd hate that idea.

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neweurope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Yes! Exactly! *Applause*


----------------

Remember Fallujah
Bush to The Hague!
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 05:19 AM
Response to Reply #9
27. *stands to applaud* Hear! Hear!
Well posted.
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candle_bright Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Who gives the most money to the UN? n/t
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neweurope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Not the US :)
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 04:45 PM by neweurope
We're talking about percentage, right?


And even if the US as the richest nation on earth DID give most - which they don't - what, please, would this prove?



------------------

Remember Fallujah

Bush to The Hague!
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candle_bright Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. No
I asked who gave the most money to the UN, and so far you haven't answered.

It's a valid question.
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rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. Okay what percentage of the UN budget is US supplied?
"And even if the US as the richest nation on earth DID give most - which they don't"

We like those link thingies to back up such statements.

Like this one

http://www.globalpolicy.org/finance/tables/inxbuget.htm

Here's 2003-2004

http://www.globalpolicy.org/finance/tables/reg-budget/a...

Back to 2000

http://www.globalpolicy.org/finance/tables/reg-budget/a...

Not surprisingly, UN percentage of contributions went down slightly since Bush took office. What is surprising si that the percenateg went up the last year info is available.

" what, please, would this prove?"

You would have to ask the original poster. But I think he/she took issue with your claims of US boycotting sabotaging the UN. The UN fucks thing up quite nicely on its own.
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candle_bright Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #18
22. Thank you
for digging that up. :)
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neweurope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 03:15 AM
Response to Reply #22
24. But the countries of the EU still pay more... also
it says there "Yet for over a decade, the UN has faced a debilitating financial crisis and it has been forced to cut back on important programs in all areas. Many member states have not paid their full dues and have cut their donations to the UN's voluntary funds."

From a German source: At the end of the year 1998 117 member states had fully payed their dues, the US owed the UN 316 Million Dollars which was 76 % of all debts.
For peace missions the same year 1.594 Million Dollars werent paid; main debtor with 1.001 Million Dollars were again the US (60 % of debts). The US often withholds payments to extort the UN.

I usually try to answer, and if its with Sorry, no link, should have kept my mouth shut. Im giving this answer now :)

My links are usually German which isnt of much use here. Thats an explanation, no excuse - I promise to behave better in the future and not say anything when I dont have a link in English. Also when Im not answering Ive probably gone to bed.

But you didnt answer my question: What does it prove? Do you think that those members that pay most should also have most power in the UN? Thats not exactly the idea behind the UN. If it were so we didnt need the UN at all; we could all just bow to the bully on the block.

I agree that the UN fucked up some things quite nicely. In my opinion mainly because the rich nations of the world time and again abuse their power.

I very much think that the UN has to be reformed. I agree with htuttle who said I'd suggest decreasing the power of the permanent members of the Security Council, and increasing the power of the General Assembly. But in order to become truly effective the member states would have to give up some of their sovereignty. And I really cannot picture this, especially for the USA.
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 05:34 AM
Response to Reply #18
29. Go by the share of GNP and per capita.
15 EU members pay some 36.6 percent of the U.N. budget with 31 percent of the world's gross national product (GNP). By contrast, the United States, is assessed at 25 percent, but has close to 27 percent of the world's economic wealth.

France, for example, is paying 6.5 percent of the budget while its share of the world's GNP is 5.5 percent. France is the fourth-highest payer to the United Nations, after the United States, Japan and Germany.

On a per capita basis, when peacekeeping is included, the gap is wider. The French taxpayer pays an average of $3.85 while the average American is charged $2.40 annually.

Funny how America's always going on about the total amounts being the largest...and not bothering the beautiful mind about the per capita or per GNP issues.

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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 04:55 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. Ted Turner
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candle_bright Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Heh!
Good one. B-)
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rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. LOL..I think Bill Gates is up there too as far as individuals (nt)
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. Gates mostly gives to private charities -- such as his own
Ted Turner paid the back dues the US owed to the UN.

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rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. Gates gives to many worthy cause....
I not a big fan but he has given millions upon millions to WHO for various vaccination programs.

He also bestowed a billion to the United Negro College Fund.

Here's a link to his foundations grants last year

http://www.gatesfoundation.org/Grants/default.htm
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 05:20 AM
Response to Reply #10
28. nice try, lol!
Edited on Sat Jan-29-05 05:24 AM by LynnTheDem
:D
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rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Not perfect? More like wholly ineffective in terms of "world police"
They have done much better dealing with social issues such as healthcare, food, family planning etc etc.
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CJCRANE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #6
20. But
the UN did a reasonable job getting an interim govt together and organising elections in Afghanistan.
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AliciaKeyedUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 04:51 AM
Response to Reply #20
25. But it has all but ignored the genocide in Darfur
The UN is pretty meaningless right now.
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 05:40 AM
Response to Reply #25
30. Not true.
Totally not true.

They can't do a damn thing when the US keeps them blocked. And the US is still "contemplating" whether the UN should take action.

The US has a veto.

The UN is as effective and as ineffective as the US allows them to be.
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AliciaKeyedUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 05:59 AM
Response to Reply #30
31. The UN is ineffective
Darfur is but one example and the US has but one veto. The other vetos also matter. And Kofi could get involved without using the Security Council.
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 06:12 AM
Response to Reply #31
32. One veto is all it takes, lol!
And no he can't get involved with any UN mission w/out the SC.

Well he could if he did a US and just ignored the UN's rules.
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neweurope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 06:23 AM
Response to Reply #30
33. Thanks :)


------------------

Remember Fallujah

Bush to The Hague!
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w4rma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
16. Bush is a unilateralist. He wanted to do all this despite the fact that
the folks at the UN were opposed. They are not involving themselves because they knew it would fail, at the start. In fact, many of them probably were hoping that Bush would go off and do this on his own because I think they were a bit concerned about US power, themselves, and wanted to reign us in (which Republicans have done a grand job of reigning in our power).
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TyeDye75 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-29-05 04:59 AM
Response to Original message
26. The US veto has been obstructing the UN for decades
Its exactly the same as the league of Nations.. without the cooperation of the superpower its doomed to be useless.

What would Woodrow Wilson say if he were alive today...sigh
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