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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:08 AM
Original message
How do DUers feel about the "Presidential Prayer Team" site?
"Continue to pray for the President as he moves forward into the new term of service, asking God to strengthen him with all wisdom and humility, that priorities and decisions will be pleasing to Him. Pray that the agenda for freedom and democracy outlined in his Inaugural Address will be advanced.

Give thanks for the tremendous witness of Christian faith that permeated all the events of the Inauguration, thanking God for answering prayers for safety and protection. Praise God for the freedom to exercise faith openly in our nation."

You have to visit the link to get the full effect, it's actually an attractive site, you can adopt a troop, etc.

http://www.presidentialprayerteam.org/index.php

I'd like some feedback on how people feel about this, especially whether Christian Democrats think this is appropriate or offensive. I'm curious about whether liberal christians think this site is referencing politics as a religious site or using religion for political purposes.

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Nicholas D Wolfwood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:08 AM
Response to Original message
1. I asked them if they were going to continue if Kerry got elected.
And they said they would. I don't know if that's bullshit or not, but that's the answer, for what it's worth.
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fertilizeonarbusto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:10 AM
Response to Original message
2. Hm
I guess I'll have to redouble the number of pins in my Chimpy voodoo doll... :evilgrin:
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StephanieMarie Donating Member (642 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:10 AM
Response to Original message
3. Maybe they'll pray for true Christian values like
peace, forgiveness, mercy, to poor, the widows, and orphans. Maybe they'll pray him a brain and a conscience.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. They seem to be praying more for people
There is a list of people at the bottom (including ed.sec. Margaret Spellings, that you can pray for). There aren't any requests to pray for Iraq civilians, except with regards to the election going smoothly.
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Bush_Eats_Beef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:27 AM
Response to Reply #4
12. It's another special interest group
The only reason I've never attempted to "look under the hood" and start Googling the founders of this site is that I really, really, really don't care enough to put in that effort.

During the election, I made the comment on DU several times that if Kerry won, you'd see this site pulled down before his inauguration.

I'm a Christian, and this is just one more piece of the "Bush legacy" that I refuse to acknowledge as BEING "Christian." Does it fit George W. Bush's "Yee haw, I'm a spoiled frat boy from Connecticut, but I'm 'a walkin' and I'm 'a talkin' like a movie cowboy" template of "Christianity?" Absolutely.

I personally do not believe that Jesus is telling Bush to bomb the crap out of Iraq on a daily basis. The Blues Brothers may have been on "a mission from God," but George Bush is driven solely by his own delusions of grandeur.

I do not feel compelled to "pray for George W. Bush's agenda."

I don't believe I'll be praying for Condi any time soon.

I remember visiting that site once and they were actually asking people to pray for Wolfowitz. I might consider that one.



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xultar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. That's what I'm sayin! They should pray that Christians show true
Christian like values of what you said.

Brilliant.
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fooj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:23 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. Amen!
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xultar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:14 AM
Response to Original message
5. Prayer isn't a bad thing maybe they are praying for chimpy to resign!
I ain't got no problem with it. Prayer isn't a bad thing. I'd hope they'd be multi denominational and free and open to all religions.
Lord knows Chimpy's dumb ass could stand all the help he can get.
So, if individuals wanna fund a site on their OWN $$$ with no govt dollars then...they can knock themselves out.




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ladjf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:16 AM
Response to Original message
7. When are we going to face up to the fact that public religious activities
are either acts of calculated hypocrisy or symptoms of mental illness?
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xultar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. Constructive input...n/t
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. pretty much all public rituals are based on religion.
But tribal religion.

It's in our DNA.

Government, which used to be called "the church", is when there's two or more tribes trying to live in the same geographic area without killing each other. Nowadays, though, the geographical region is the whole planet.
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ladjf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #9
22. My theory is that all animals have a basic instinct to seek
connections with other individuals. Humans would define this within the area of spiritual experiences. Unfortunately, religion leaders have shrewdly established the concept that religion has the monopoly
on spiritual experience, which in my opinion, is patently incorrect
and misleading. People attend church, seeking connections of a spiritual type and often find it there.

So, I am saying that one enters into the organized religious world and is given some very satisfying results. But, at the same time, church leaders train the followers to disregard objective logic when deciding truths and to substitute that with their favorite word "faith", translated, "believe anything I say but don't listen to any of the non-religious advice". That results in philosophical zombism. When carried to extremes, the afflicted are unable to make adequate survival choices as they face life challenges.
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:23 AM
Response to Original message
11. I find it hysterically funny a lot of the time
Pray for our beloved President bush that his morning toast will be golden just as he likes it.


***

I always wanna post;

STOP WASTING GOD'S TIME with your inane prayers! People are DYING in the tens of thousands just in Iraq! God is TOO BUSY to waste on your silly shit!!!

heh.
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pantouflard Donating Member (184 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:30 AM
Response to Original message
13. As someone with family members on the "prayer team"
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 09:34 AM by pantouflard
I find it offensive. Not the praying part, for prayer in and of itself is important in many religions. But I object to the use of prayer in this self-serving, arrogant way, which is not prayer at all.

I can only speak from my own experience of the xtian right, but that experience is pretty extensive. Many of these people want a "Xtian Nation," and want to spread their narrow-minded beliefs around the world.

To them, Bush's inaugural speech was affirmation of a true Crusade. They see democracy as a doorway to capitalism, and capitalism as a doorway to converting the masses. Money, business, and preaching to the world go hand-in-hand in their world view.

It is VERY significant that they do not pray for Iraqi citizens. They simply do not care. Iraq is a place to begin their Crusade, and they will check it off the list and move on to other nations. They are already operating extensively in China.

Edited to add: Also, praying gives them the illusion that they are involved and doing something to make the world better. But if you talked to these people and asked what they actually DO to help others, they would be stumped. It's basically an excuse for inaction, IMHO.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. it's worse than not caring. Many truly believe God is out to get
Muslims. On the Charles Stanley site, just below a link on the tsunami it says "Pride goeth before a fall, and a haughty spirit before stumbling."

You are so right about the endgame, they really think they are going to convert the muslims. Wow. God knows they've converted millions in the other direction. (I guess thats called di-version.)

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Hugin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:39 AM
Response to Original message
15. I feel like I'm gonna be sick.... ulp! =/ n/t
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tanyev Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
16. I am a Christian.
Edited on Fri Jan-28-05 09:41 AM by tanyev
I never thought of myself as particularly liberal until the Radical Right started hijacking Christianity; since I disagree with virtually everything they hold near and dear, I guess I must be a liberal.

I find the PPT site very offensive. Matthew 6:5 has been cited on DU many times because it is so relevant to this issue. "But when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men." That's what this site is about--being seen to be a "Prayer Warrior" for Our Leader.

Well, they'd better pray hard, because I'm praying too, and I am praying that the truth about this criminal administration will finally explode beyond anybody's power of denial.

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pantouflard Donating Member (184 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:44 AM
Response to Reply #16
18. Just because you are to the left of these folks
doesn't necessarily make you liberal. The are so far to the right, they leave us LOTS of room on both sides!
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. don't worry, we're ALL moderates now.
republicans have swung so far to the right it created a huge vacuum that sucked just about everybody into the middle.
We're just one big happy family now, fighting fundie fascism.
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Hugin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #16
20. Touching post...
Do you agree with my interpretation of the commandment
which says... "Do not use My name in vain"?

I personally don't think that has anything to do with foul
language.

I'm of the mind it says not to ask God to do Your dirty
work.

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tanyev Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #20
24. Good question.
I try not to use foul language (not always successful, especially when Dubya appears on my television), but in the great scheme of things the occasional use of profanity doesn't really seem to have the same weight as the other commandments like do not kill, do not steal, etc.

I would say that a far more egregious use of God's name in vain is what the Religious Right and this administration are doing right now: twisting the teachings of the Bible to enable and justify their own greedy, power-hungry actions.

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Hugin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. So true...
I'm glad you answered my question. =)

Personally, I refrain from profanity to remain pleasing
to my fellow people.

"twisting the teachings of the Bible to enable and justify their own greedy, power-hungry actions."

Do you figure that's a sin?

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4_TN_TITANS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 09:42 AM
Response to Original message
17. witness of Christian faith...
.. of the inauguration???? Anyone who can't see that it was a most "un-Christlike" display of pagentry and excess, doesn't deserve to be called a follower of Christ. That little gathering of the rich and powerful in no way resembled the kind of posse that Christ hung out with. Based on what was in the post I'd say the site is garbage.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 10:21 AM
Response to Original message
21. Let 'em pray all they want.
Just don't let 'em make policy.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:11 AM
Response to Original message
23. I would think it more legitimate if the prayers were
to impeach Bush for war crimes and rehaul our election system to reduce fraud and unfairness so that it would better reflect the will of the people.
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leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
25. You can't tell it's a political ploy??
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madison2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-28-05 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
26. right wing christians don't control who god is or how god acts
and neither does anybody else. The wrong way to think about prayer is to think that we as humans can twist God's arm in any way. We can't. True prayer says "thy will be done", and does not presume to know exactly what that is.

Example: Lord, I give up all my own plans and purposes, all my own desires and hopes, and accept Thy will for my life. I give myself, my life, my all utterly to Thee to be Thine forever. Fill me and seal me with Thy Holy Spirit. Use me as Thou wilt. Send me where Thou wilt. Work out Thy whole will in my life at any cost, now and forever.

Prayer changes the person who prays, so if the Right wants to pray more in the true spirit of prayer I am all for it. If its just pious posturing and hypocrisy, who cares?
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