We AREN'T the reason we lost: Sex is the reason we lost.

[cali]

And mostly homophobia. You know. The homosexual agenda. Teaching sex ed in schools. Hollywood sex. I believe more than anything else, sex lost us this election. It wasn't fraud, (though there was some) It wasn't a bad candidate. It wasn't our lack of issues. It was sex and purported moral issues. Yep. It all boiled down to sex.

[Junkdrawer]

1. Don't forget race...

The dirty little secret of the whole "fundamentalist" movement is that it was founded as a "politically correct" way of opposing forced busing.

[bryant69]

6. How does this work?

I've heard people say it, but it doesn't scan very easily to me. It's possible I just don't have all the details

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[Junkdrawer]

11. Check out: "With God on Our Side; The Rise of the Christian Right"

By William Martin

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0553067494/102-8095407-5084953?v=glance

Long story, but the rise of forced integration and the "Christian" Right are tightly linked. (Christian day schools, home schooling etc.)

[Junkdrawer]

16. PS: Look at the political rise of John Ashcroft in Missouri...

Claim to fame: He stopped forced busing in St. Louis.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/2001-01-25-nceditf.htm

[izzie]

13. My take is race is also in this.

Look at how the nut cases of the fundy's believe. They are not only much like the Middle East nuts but these same beliefs have been around a long time in this country. They put one face out to the public but underground it is a bad group. They just are not main group Christians but real odd ones. Should I bring up the Klan?

[Junkdrawer]

23. Republican racism tends to follow a three step process:

1.) Early on, oppose integration, affirmative action publicly.

2.) Generate politically correct "code words" to hide your agenda (neighborhood schools, anti-quota, etc.)

3.) Rub salt into the wounds by suppressing the minority vote while, at the same time, promoting token minorities to positions of prestige.

[Sperk]

2. I still believe we didn't "lose", it all comes down to diebold

and repug states who do the dirty work (not enough machines, "spoiled ballots", central tablulation of votes, flyers telling people that they can be arrested if they vote and have an outstanding traffic ticket and the like).

The rest is just a cover story. I will, however, concede that too many people fall for the baloney that you talk about. They'll soon realise that all this moral crap won't mean sh*t to them when they can't feed their families. When these "moral judges" start ruling in favor of corporations to get rid of labor laws, safety laws, pension commitments, civil liberties etc., these Bush lovers will come to see that they have been had.

[cali]

4. Don't forget the loosening of environmental laws

that lead to greater pollution which in turn leads to higher death rates amoung the most vulnerable.

[H2O Man]

3. I agree with you

and would add that even more important was the cultureof fear. Be afraid, be very afraid. War! Terror! Red alert! Rape rooms! Kerry lacks Bush's military experience and will risk your children's lives! And the icing on the cake was the Usama bin Laden info-mercial. While I do not think bin Laden is somehow working for Bush, I think that he decided to influence our election because Bush's stupidity is working for radical Islam.

[OneTwentyoNine]

5. Flash:More votes for Kerry in Kansas than Gore and Clinton

And that includes Clinton both times he ran.Kerry got a slightly higher % of the Dem vote than Gore did in 2000.

That moral voting bullshit is being shoved down more throats than the CIA produced "Oswald killed Kennedy" cover story.

If moral voting swung the election it wasn't in Kansas,and this place is about as bad as it gets.

[cali]

8. You're wrong.

Stating that Kerry won with more votes than Gore, leaves out the other half of the equation, that bush won with more votes than anyone in History. In other words, more of the electorate turned out. I don't think that the impact of the marriage amendments which passed overwhelmingly in 11 states can be underestimated.

[OneTwentyoNine]

24. Yeah,whatever...

I get tired of this "crushing victory" for Bush from the moral crowd. BS,three million votes is hardly a crushing victory. If everyone in the US that is Christian and church going REALLY thought Kerry or Democrats are unmoral humans then Bush would have won by a 50% margin not by a couple of points.

The point I'm making is about my home state which is pretty damn Conservative and church going. KERRY GOT MORE VOTES THAN GORE DID,he also had about the same % of votes that a Dem gets in a Presidential election around here dating back 100 years.

Where was the crushing defeat at the hands of Kansas church goer's angry and Kerry and Democrats?? Forget the hype and look at the damn numbers,around here the so called moral majority never surfaced.

David

[lindashaw]

7. I believe you're right. I was (and still am, I suppose) a Deanie.

But here's what I believe: abortion is a woman's right and should be a private matter, but I don't think it should be used as a means of birth control.

I don't want to tell anyone how to conduct their sexuality. But I'm from an old school: sex is a private matter. It isn't a political tool, and it isn't a weapon. Marriage matters should remain in the marriage, not out on the street or in the press.

I don't raise a ruckus about sex in the movies and on television because I simply don't view it. Children who come to my house don't view it. I don't like commercials, so I don't often turn on programs that have them.

Religion is a private matter because it isn't one person's right to judge another person -- whether their religion is right or they are sincere. There must be an inviolate division between church and state.

Hmm, am I still a Democrat?

[masaka___]

9. Stop saying we lost.

We don't know that, yet, and there's strong evidence pointing to the contrary.

[cali]

10. I have yet to see any evidence that Kerry won.

Please tell me what it is. I keep hearing this, but look as I might, I can't find it. And I'm not talking about opinion or exit polls,

[arwalden]

12. Yeah!! Those Damn Stinking Queers And Hollywood Pornographers!!!

And JANET JACKSON! They ruined it!! :eyes:

[Gore1FL]

14. We should run with this

If enough Red Staters can be convicned that Sex is not only awful, but so is procreation, we will havea numebrs advantage forever.

:)

[Bridget Burke]

15. So what do you propose to do about it?

Make the Democrats the party of the New Puritanism? Force the gays back in the closet?

How can you reach anybody who gets so bent out of shape about other people's sexuality that they support an illegal war that has killed thousands? Fuck their "moral values."

[opihimoimoi]

18. The Historians of Tomorrow will have a fit of laughter when they

discuss this period of time and the Shrub in general...

The People will shake their head in wonder as how we can get to the Moon but still be so stupid stupid as to elect a moran.

[cali]

25. Whoa there Bridget.

No, I don't want to turn the dems into the new puritans. Far from it. I don't quite know how to fight this backlash on sexuality, but I did want to point out that I believe it was a huge factor in motivating voters.

[liberalmuse]

17. If they hate sex so much...

I wish they'd stop doing it altogether--for the sake of the survival of the human race. Sex is meant for those who enjoy it, not to procreate bigotted, narrow-minded demon seed.

[Sleepless In NY]

22. cali you are so right! Wish others would see it

for what it is. "Morality" won the election for bush, isn't that what we keep hearing??? The votes that put bush ahead weren't from the bastions of "morality", these people are anything but "moral" in their own lives, rather from states who would rather not have jobs then let the "homos get married".

Brilliant political move putting gay marriage/civil unions on the ballot same day as the presidential election. That was the "November Surprise" for us.

Brought them out of the woodwork. And we are never going to "appeal" to these folks, either, forget it. What we should be doing is ripping apart the "republicans are more moral" myth. But watch, we wont. Very disheartening.

[animuscitizen]

19. Where's Larry Flint when you need him?

He could help expose the sexual secrets of the Rep elected officials. Love the entertaining joy of unmasking of Rep hypocrisy! Many of these losers are prudes only on the outside. They are barely concealing the dark perversions and taboo sexual preferences underneath the deception.

I had fun watching Flint's efforts at exposing Rep sex scandals during the Clinton years.

I agree with your insightful comments about how things "boil down to sex."

[spooky3]

20. Who's buying all those Britney Spears records? Who's listening

to sex fiend Bill O'Reilly?

[greatauntoftriplets]

21. Ever hear of Victor Ashe???

Ex mayor of Knoxville and an old friend of *? It is said that they have spent much quality time together as adults.....