What the hay is the difference between individual freedoms and civil

[efhmc]

rights? To me they are the same, in that individual rights feed into civil rights, in a society that values individuals. This is from the zogby poll I took today which asked all these questions about what rights were more important, mainly traditional values (whatever the heck that means) compared to individuals rights and then individuals rights compared to civil rights. Those folks needs to spend some time with people that think instead of listening and reacting to faux news.

[bicentennial_baby]

1. I took that poll too

Those questions were bizarre.

[efhmc]

3. Do you think they think we are clueless and brainless? I always

answered individuals right unless it was civil rights. I hate being manipulated and that is what polls like that are about.

[bicentennial_baby]

6. Same here

I answered the same way...How about those "Protecting America at all costs" vs "Being a Respected member of the world community" ones? I mean, how stupid do they think we are?? :shrug:

[H2O Man]

2. individual rights = individuals

civil rights= a group within a country

human rights= everyone on earth

[efhmc]

4. Thanks, for the explanation, but doesn't one not exist without the other?

[H2O Man]

5. "but doesn't one not exist without the other?"

Interesting question. Let's look at it in terms that might clarify the issue. Suppose, for example, that there was one black citizen in Florida who was registered to vote, but come election day, she found that her registration had been compromised by the local commissioner. His taking her off the voting rolls was not based upon any legal basis. He has violated her individual rights.

Suppose -- and this is hard, but bear with me -- that someone took tens of thousands of voters of the roles in Florida. Again, not on any legal grounds, but because the commissioner knew that black people in Florida tended to vote democrat at a rate of 80%. This is a case of their civil rights being violated.

In 1964 and '65, Malcolm X told black Americans that rather than trying to appeal to the system that was denying them civil rights, they should appeal to the UN/international community on the grounds that their human rights were being denied. This same thinking was involved when some people have advocated having UN inspectors involved in monitoring the Florida elections in 2004.

Does that make it any clearer?