Seems lately we've been rough on the "newbies"

[neomonkey]

It's campaign season, this is the playoffs, we are deciding the next President of the United States. So much is at stake, people are making their choices, many of them have never wet their feet in the wonderful pool of politics before. In fact, I bet a good share of them aren't even sure if they are Democrats or liberal. Perhaps many of our newcomers are experimenting.

That involves expressing thoughts in an "unstructured" way - ie, I think right now we need to cut some slack to those folks who haven't yet accumulated tons of posts like the rest of us.

I think we need to give the newcomers the benefit of the doubt (while obviously keeping a wary eye out for invaders ;))

[AndyTiedye]

1. Some Might even BE Freepers who are Starting to See the Light

[neomonkey]

3. I can remember 1992

That was the year of my transformation from "freeper" to Democrat and unabashed liberal (following a slow three-year process). It's scary business once you start questioning your own beliefs. Rarely do you jump into the new ideology without reservation. The last thing you want at this point is to be slapped down because of your doubts and hesitations.

[gypsyangel]

7. Obviously I'm new

to the place. I've been wondering what the hell a Freeper is... can anyone help?

[neomonkey]

9. Welcome to Democratic Underground

gypsyangel. I hope you enjoy your stay.

A freeper is a term which has fallen into the realm of generic reference to a "mindless right-winger". Perhaps that is a redundant phrase. I'm feeling very intellectual tonight, I'm sure you can see through it :)

[gypsyangel]

11. Thank you very much

for clearing that up for me and I must say, I've been enjoying myself in here since I joined a few days ago. It's so nice to be with like-minded people!

[TexasSissy]

47. Just FYI- "Freeper" isn't necessarily derogatory. They refer to

themselves that way, as is "Freep this poll!"

[grace0418]

53. It comes from FreeRepublic.com a forum similar to DU only

totally right-wing. I'm sure there are many intelligent people on there with whom I just don't see eye to eye, but it sure seems like most are really ignorant, racist, homophobic, xenophobic, etc.

[The Minus World]

10. The Sound of One Hand Clapping

A "Freeper" is any individual who frequents the FreeRepublic message-board to engage in inflammatory, anti-liberal discussion. However, it has been extended in meaning to include politically inarticulate relatives, gun-obsessed sociopaths, religious zealots who identify God with the superficial values of the republican party, and basically anyone with a Bush/Cheney '04 sticker on the back of their pickup truck.

[shraby]

14. Welcome gypsyangel

and MagicalSpork :hi:
May your stay be an enjoyable one..sounds like you two might be made of the "left" stuff. (right didn't sound quite right)

[The Minus World]

36. Hello!

Thanks for the welcome. I've lurked for a while, and it took quite a bit of deliberation before I got the nerve to post here!

[UdoKier]

2. I can't speak for anybody else, but...

I'm not 'rough' on newbies, EXCEPT when they have a picture of "Unfit for Command" in their sig line, or they go on and on about how we really need to look at the GOP's "fair tax" plan, or question how Kerry can possibly "Baloon federal spending AND hike taxes" - as though Kerry has said he would do that.

I generally give people the benefit of the doubt, but some of them are so obvious and so obnoxious, it's pretty hard to sit by and put up with it.

[neomonkey]

6. I think it's possible

to maintain a healthy sense of vigilance while still nurturing the fearful doubters who would tread on our domain.

Many people who may seem less than liberal are merely seeking affirmation. I realize this may strike many as corny and touchy-feely.

I think we really need to keep our eyes open and not jump down the throat of every DUer who says something marginally conservative.

I think the true freeper will eventually show his/her true colors and will be spotted.

[Raster]

79. My favorite is "...the destiny of the white man...."

That one's pretty obvious. Although others are very careful and hiding their true intentions.

[LibertyorDeath]

4. As someone who is always hyper vigilant & looking for freepers

to help Tombstone I am guilty of being rough on "newbies"

Better to be rough on ten Newbies (Not Unnecessarily) than let one Freep through. I think most Newbies understand.

Your not on the deep cover stealth Freeper advance team trying to pave the way for your compatriots. :)

I here by swear I will cut the Newbies slack unless they smell freepish

[neomonkey]

8. Here is my question

Suppose by being rough on those 10 newbies, you scare 2 of them off who would have come to our side? So you spot a freeper early on...eventually, the slime will be spotted by someone. They can only get so far with their ambiguous statement. Eventually they will show their scales.

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

24. You can smell them?

What OS are you using? I knew I should have upgraded....:)

[TahitiNut]

64. It's the Frank Burns Smell-A-Commie Operating System ...

... with a slight modification of the Olfactory Subsystem. :silly:

[LibertyorDeath]

5. .

n\t

[The Minus World]

12. As a newbie myself,

I've got to say that I have not been scared at all to articulate my beliefs here. Of course, I'm not at disagreement with the general consensus here!

[neomonkey]

13. A word to the wise

Exlamation points (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) generally are indicative of freeper mentality.


:donut:

[The Minus World]

15. ...!!!

and... when they dont have any clue... about where to place commas and periods... they pepper their sentences with ellipses... instead of having the humility... to learn how to fix their poor grammar...

[neomonkey]

18. Ha!

I happen to love my ellipses!!!

(They make me sound so much like William F. Buckley)!!!!!

[smirkymonkey]

81. So do I...

And, I do not always check for grammatical accuracy in my posts, just as I don't in my e-mails. I will usually give it a once-over to make sure that it's somewhat coherent, but I don't go through my posts w/ a fine toothed comb.

I have a completely different mind set online than I do in a profeesional or academic situation. It's more "free-association" than "official press release."

However, I always wonder when the spelling, readability and grammar in a post is so atrocious as to make the post barely intelligible.

[neomonkey]

20. Jesus Christ MagicalSpork

I suspected you were being tongue-in-cheek, but now I know it has to be true based on a previous post

We know that, despite the Bush campaign's best efforts to resist, Bush was made to stand behind the podium last night and make his case to the American people. We also know that, despite the Bush campaign's best efforts to deceive the public, 70-80% of polled viewers saw Kerry as being the stronger candidate as a result of that debate. We also know that, if forced to run on the facts alone (not smear campaigns), Kerry would win in an absolute landslide.

This is a scenario that the Bush team saw coming, and even their best efforts could not forestall it. They cannot and will not prevent the truth from seeping through the cracks, not with all the post-debate spin in the world.

This is especially effective for democrats since everyone is waking up to the sickening reality of Bush's incompetence (even republicans) *right before the actual election*. Our president's inconsistency and weakness behind the podium will be fresh in the minds of American voters when they go to their local polling places, and that's exactly what we need.


You trying to tell us something?

[The Minus World]

26. !!!???

No subtext there. Just analyzing things as I see them! Looking back on that post, I didn't mean to imply that Kerry was running on smear campaigns.

The greater gist of that statement was, "Considering the hostile media environment, Kerry has seldom few moments where he can step out of the mold the network-news pundits have created for him, to get his actual views heard."

[unfrigginreal]

30. WOW(unimpressed)!!!

Ain't we, smart!(better than thou)

You're sooooo right, anyone using bad grammer must be a freeper. If they aren't, they should be 'cause they don't measure up to our(your) standards.

[The Minus World]

35. "Fancy-pants Liberal Elitists"

With all due respect to your post count, you surely recognize that I was joking around. Especially since it was in response to a comment made by another 1,000+ poster who mentioned that overuse of exclamation marks is a sign of Freeperdom. Strangely, I don't see you responding negatively to his post - only mine.

Either way, all of this is irrelevant. Feel free to get me banned if you find my posts uninsightful or otherwise offensive.

[unfrigginreal]

40. If you get banned it won't be because of anything that I did

I only alert when a poster isn't afraid to hide their allegiance to Bush. OTOH, I do and will respond negatively to ridiculous generalizations that DO lend credence to the 'Liberal Elitist' label. It's not what I want to see for the Democratic Party, though YMMV.

[sistersofmercy]

54. and...!!!

That's pretty funny. What a marvelous wit you have. Welcome to DU! :hi:

[UdoKier]

82. ....hey...

I love to use ellipses....and I'm...as liberal as anybody else!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[shraby]

16. LOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ellipses is the magical word...they wouldn't know one if it bit them in the ass.

[TahitiNut]

62. Really????????????????????

:silly:

[progressivebydesign]

66. OMG! You're joking about the exclamation points and grammar..

Right?? Has anyone read MY posts??!! They feature lots of ellipses, LOTS of CAPS!!! LOts of exclamation points!! And guess what??? I've been here since 2001!! ANd I'm NOT a freeper!!

[neomonkey]

72. JOKING!

Actually I'm quite the fan of strange punctuation marks. In some ways, they are the predecessors to smilies!

:) :) :( :)

[progressivebydesign]

80. OH good...!!!!!

I'm the absolute WORST when it comes to excessive punctuation! I write like I talk... enthusiastic! I did some writing for tv, and wrote a few (non-sold) screenplays. You learn to write the way people talk, not the way they think. :)

[Gelliebeans]

17. I've been here for a little while

but I have learned from reading previous posts that I had to earn trust (not complaining)so I try to be less radical regarding my views but I do have to say that everyone seems to be really nice here and I finally feel like we are working for a common goal.

[sr_pacifica]

19. well, freeper invasions aside

A newbie recently was put down by a 1000+ poster who happened to not agree the guy. Frankly, I thought the newbie was taking the more liberal stand. But anyway the oldtimer said something to the effect that the newbie's opinion wasn't worth taking seriously because he hadn't made 1000+ posts. I think we lost that one. So, yes, one of you was DEFINITELY rough on the newbie and not for sounding too conservative.

[Kanary]

46. I've seen such stuff myself, sr_pacifica

There are some who come here in order to get their rocks off.

Doesn't matter who their target is...... they just like to have the opportunity to be nasty.

Since so much is allowed here, the ignore button is your friend. :)

Kanary

[SideshowScott]

21. Well as for me i did a WHOLE lot of lurking before jumping in..

This place CAN be a bit intimidateing at times. But im very very happy I did beacuse you guys rock.

[gypsyangel]

22. How many?

How many replies do you have to have in order to post a message? I'm getting frustrated with it!

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

23. You mean to start a thread? They won't tell you

The admins don't like to encourage disruptors by sharing that information, and I suspect they change it from time to time to discourage sock puppets. But you'll probably have enough any time now. Welcome to DU!

[gypsyangel]

25. I'm trying but

they keep tellin me I need to reply to more before I can post anything.

[shraby]

27. All I can say is keep trying.

That's way I did, and lo and behold I did it. Feels good.

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

28. Go to the Lounge and have some fun

It's easy to rack up posts there. Just pick a thread and post:
- I like kitties, too!
- My favorite food is _____.
- I hope you feel better soon.
- Great news, congrats!

Repeat as necessary. :)

[Arancaytar]

32. Re: "Go to the Lounge and have some fun"

Legal spamming...

I don't think I'll do that though. That would be cheating, wouldn't it? ;)

I didn't feel that awfully intimidated myself when I came here yesterday (is the shock still to come?), but that's because I was warned by the Wikipedia entry about DU, and by reading the posting rules when registering.

I've been to discussion boards only to discuss computer games and RPGs before, so the political debating was held in check by the mods (nonetheless quite prolific, since the games were of the sort that attract adolescents with brains, and these inevitably start discussing). Debates are rather interesting there, but almost inevitably degrade into shouting matches (although I'm glad to say there are rational people of both opinions there, so some discussions maintain a reasonable standard), and at that point they're locked.

So you could say I'm used to worse than this. At least here, if someone argues that "homosexuality is WRONG because BUSH and GOD say so!!" they'd probably be banned pretty soon.

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

34. It's not cheating if you really DO like kitties

;) Or if you really do hope someone feels better, or you want to congratulate them. Plus it's a great place to let off steam.

I've participated on enough discussion boards where the main interest is not political to wish that politics were banned permanently from them. (On some boards, they do ban political talk.) It's very disappointing to establish rapport with seemingly smart people who share your interests, only to learn that, politically, they are knuckle-draggers. It colors all other discourse, and ruins the experience - for me, anyway.

Welcome to DU!

[Arancaytar]

38. Re: Welcome to DU!

Thanks! This looks like an enjoyable board already less than 24 hours after I came. :)

> It's very disappointing to establish rapport with seemingly smart people who share your interests, only to learn that, politically, they are knuckle-draggers.

Agreed. Still, occasionally it helps to get to know someone first before debating with them. I know someone who's a very intelligent guy (and that's 'intelligent' as in 'smart','clear-minded', not as in 'Mensa'), who considers himself a compassionate conservative, and who gets annoyed when I say bad stuff about Bush. We've agreed to disagree (he's a year younger than me and thus even less eligible to vote than I am with 17, otherwise I might have continued trying to convince him). We talk about non-political things without any 'coloring' of the discourse, I'm glad to say. ;)

Usually, the people who're impossible to debate with rationally, are generally impossible in other concerns as well.

[hyphenate]

43. It used to be 10 posts

so perhaps they've upped it to twenty. The reason they do it is because there are so many spammers who try to come post a single post about buying drugs online, or adult sites, or whatever the spam of the day is. By making people respond to posts for a certain time, it means they have to be more serious of their intentions on the board, and not just hawking something.

I think it also makes newbies a little more aware of the kind of posts that are made, what forum they're in, and small "quirks" which some posters might have and indicate in their posts. It makes them "listeners" before they can become "talkers."

People have to remember that DU was founded because many of us felt very upset and needed some support when the Repubs stole the 2000 election, and most boards online were conservative minded, instead of offering liberals anything. I know a couple of boards I was at skewered liberals and would laugh about their own machismo in silencing the "Clinton-lovers" and "feminazis" that tried to put their opinions in public places. It wasn't easy finding sanctuary in the midst of all that hatred and false bravado.

[msanthrope]

31. Been a lurker for years---only recently signed on.....n/t

[H3Dakota]

48. Glad to hear that...

I've been lurking here myself for months, just started posting the day of the first debate or so.

[stryker18]

78. I didn't hesitate for a second.

I saw the Top Ten Conservative Idiots first, and I decided that I had to meet the people behind them. So I joined the forum.

[Bunny]

29. Well, when they make comments like this:

"These people who hold these signs, I've noticed, are middle aged or older women, quite unattractive and look as though they've never even had children."

They deserve a smackdown.

gypsyangel (13 posts) Mon Oct-04-04 04:59 AM
Response to Original message

104. I enjoy screaming at the abortion activists who show up at democratic


rallies. My phrase of choice is "Yeah, I think someone's mother could have benefitted from an abortion." These people who hold these signs, I've noticed, are middle aged or older women, quite unattractive and look as though they've never even had children. It's freakishly interesting.

[Robbien]

33. You are right, that is a very nasty post

exactly what you would expect to read over in freeperville. A very bigoted narrow minded attitude.

[sweetheart]

37. running the gauntlet

You're right, to post during this time on DU, is direct action
towards this election, and i've no sympathy whatsoever for someone
who abuses the priviledge to disparage others, paint us all as
stupid, that our objective is comprimised in any way.

Rather i would recommend, that the admins ad an extra popup
dialog before posting, that asks

"There are 30 days until the
election. Does your post reflect considerate intent towards all
of DU in taking back the white house. IF not, please re-edit
your post."

<return to edit> <post message>

[corker]

39. I am new here

I've been a liberal my whole life. Started with the Vietnam War. Atleast we still had some real news back then. I am really sick at what this country has become.




:mad:

[Robbien]

42. Welcome to DU corker. How did you find us?

This is a great place to do a bit of activism, find out the real news and have discussions with people who feel the same as you do about what is happening.

[corker]

44. a friend turned me on to this site

This is a great place to get real news. I read some things on these boards and a few days later it is on the mainstream media...of course they spin the shit out of it..

[progressivebydesign]

69. Welcome!!!

I bemoan the state of our media, daily. I don't know what would be happening right now politically, if it were not for the internet.

[hyphenate]

41. I don't mind newbies asking questions

or being up front about their past election choices and all that. What bothers me is when a "newbie" will suddenly use the forums to say something nasty about Kerry, and something really positive about Bush. We KNOW that they're not on the level when they start that crap. A couple of days ago, Thursday night and Friday most of the day when we were discussing the debate, many freepers tried to do that in making derogatory comments about Kerry. I don't care about newbies admitting that they've been swayed by the right, but confessing that they've managed to fight the brainwashing--that's a positively great scenario, but it's the grumpies who come in and say crap about the Democratic Party nominee that I dislike. They should be banned as soon as they're outed as freepers.

[Dorian Gray]

45. Thanks for that....

Though I'm not exactly new (I've been reading this site for a long time), I am a low-count poster. I've been treated pretty well, with the obnoxious exception every once in awhile. But, that happens on all message baords!

I think your words are nice, but I think that we (the Newbies) should remember to temper our words at the beginning. As we are getting used to this site and the participants, we should really tentively stick our toe into the waters. I only say that because tensions are high, and it's a system that has worked well for me in the past at other message boards.

Slowly easing yourself into the board really helps, and it helps the other posters gain trust in you!

[CornField]

50. Yes, I agree with your post

It is difficult sometimes to be a "semi-newbie." I've made a few posts that I've been thanked for... I've also been "challenged" a couple of times.

I guess it is just par for the course. On the whole, I've enjoyed being a part of DU -- but like anyone else, I don't appreciate my intentions being questioned to drastic extremes.

Honestly, are true trouble makers going to make it to 100 or more posts without showing their true colors? While not impossible, it's highly doubtful. When someone semi-new makes a comment in disagreement with the general (most verbal?) DU population, it may very well be just a disagreement -- not a staged attack on the board or the party. The democratic party is a very diverse group.

While I think we can disagree on certain points, I don't think there's any benefit to the board when DUers immediately attempt to label anyone with a different viewpoint as a FReeper, regardless of that person's post count.

[Boo]

49. This is my first message

[Arancaytar]

51. Re: "It makes them "listeners" before they can become "talkers.""

There's a lot of wisdom in that, communication-wise. There is not a board I have visited in my life (and I've seen dozens, maybe over a hundred boards, large and small, crappy and good) that would not have benefited from this policy (restricting new topics), and yet there was not a single one up to now who implemented it.

I found this forum through browsing Wikipedia at random - There was a reference to DU in one entry, and the name looked intriguing. So here I am. :)

>"exactly what you would expect to read over in freeperville. A very bigoted narrow minded attitude."

Robbien: Not that I don't completely agree with protecting DU's reputation as an open-minded and rational community, but having started out that way one and a half years ago (when I first started posting on boards at all), I hope you can forgive early newbies a few such posts; we learn rapidly, I've found. ;) (Of course, with 29 days still to go, the reputation of this board gains ever more importance, but still: a newbie is a long term investment...)

[immoderate]

59. Welcome aboard, Boo

Great post.

--IMM

[Boo]

84. Believe it or not...

... I found out about this website at the message board of www.ronaldreagan.com, where I am currently being blocked, because of my recent outfalls against the monkey...

It is so refreshing for a European to see that there's actually some intelligent Americans out there.

Trust me, it's comforting...

[progressivebydesign]

68. I like your first post. Welcome!

Non-controversial, succinct, and to the point. :hi:

[newyawker99]

83. Hi Boo!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[hiphopnation]

52. I didn't start posting in great volume here

until I had lurked for almost two years. I sat patiently reading and soaking it all in. The few times that I did post as a newbie I was often knocked on my ass. I expected it though, having read it many times already.

To me it says something about a person who jumps into a political forum and starts blabbing off at the mouth, going out of their way to make it blatantly apparent that they've spent very little time figuring out what the culture is like. There are rules specifically set out but there are also unspoken cultural rules that are adhered to by the site's die-hards. You do pick up on them if you keep your mouth shut for a while and observe what's going on. What's the old axiom "Better to say nothing and have people think you're a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt."??

My $0.02

[grace0418]

55. I'm *fairly* new and I have to say

that people have been, on the whole, extremely nice. I've noticed a few comments (not necessarily directed at me) where long-time members were rolling their eyes at newbie questions. One even said that you should wait for something like two weeks before you post so you don't sound stupid. That struck me as odd, because I figure let's welcome everyone who wants to join! We need everyone we can get to overcome all the cheating and bullying from the GOP and get President Kerry into office. But other than that, most members have been very welcoming. I even got invited to a get-together the first day I joined!

P.S. I didn't wait two weeks to jump in. As you can see, I have over 300 posts and I only joined about a month ago.

[grace0418]

58. Hee hee I didn't even see post 52 above when I wrote my post

so I guess that makes me a fool, huh?

I still disagree, for what it's worth. I think everyone should be able to speak their mind whenever they please. Otherwise it feels like a high school clique, and I don't need relive high school. Just MHO, though.

[Willy Lee]

56. I'm new here also-

and it feels like I'm home! You guys are awesome-

Debbie in Illinois

[neomonkey]

57. This is a good place

By and large I think newbies are treated well.

The thing to keep in mind is that this is a political bulletin board and there will be very opinionated people due to the very nature of this site. Opinionated people tend to be, well, opinionated :)

Welcome newbies.

[Kanary]

74. It's certainly possible to be both opinionated and civil.

Oh, and add considerate to the list.

Really, it *IS* possible.

Kanary

[TahitiNut]

63. Yeah. We are, aren't we?

:silly:

[in_cog_ni_to]

75. Hey, Debbie! Welcome to DU!

:hi: I'm in Illinois too...nice to have you here! DU is a GREAT place. It will save your sanity!

[Tafiti]

60. I must confess...

...it wasn't all that long ago when I identified myself as a Republican (wince). But, hey, give me a break. I'm only 24. Basically, it was a crime of social conditioning, coming from a Pat Robertson-loving Christian conservative family. My dad is a Rush Limbaugh freak, and avid Fox News watcher. Then about half-way through a magnificent (and very expensive) college education, I began to wake up and have been sliding left ever since. I just laugh when my dad talks about those "liberal professors." HAHAHAHAHAHA. Uh, no dad. Actually, it's called reading, you should try it sometime (after you put down A Purpose-Driven Life).
While I don't mean to sound arrogant or stubborn, I can honestly say that, at this point, it's hard for me to even value any opinion espoused by a conservative Republican. The way I see it, they're usually just wrong. Can't help it, that's just how I feel.

[progressivebydesign]

67. Welcome!!

I tell my stepdaugher, who is in jr. high, that it's okay that she has the same fervent political beliefs as we do, and her friends have the same as their parents, at this age. I told her when you get out of high school, and start living your own life, you'll know where your own TRUE political views lie. She will probably continue to be liberal, as we are.. but I leave it open for her to decide when she's lived and read. Her older sister did, and has become even MORE politially leftwing.

Welcome, again. This place is a trip, and an education. I try to look out for the new posters.. keeping the wolves at bay around here.

[in_cog_ni_to]

76. transistor97, Welcome to DU!

:hi: Ans I'm happy you've come over from the "dark side." ;) Great to have you here!

[treading_water]

61. Thanks.

I, for one, appreciate being given the benefit of the doubt. :)

[progressivebydesign]

65. Absolutely! It's been bugging me!

I do try to defend the newbies when I see them attacked here. I swear, it's become like a DU pissing-contest to see who can unmask a disruptor or freeper first! Unfortunately, it's usually an inexperienced, yet sincere new poster that gets the brunt of the competition.

My feeling is that EVERYONE was new here once! I, and others, predate the majority of those that are attacking the newbies. I've been here since 2001, and I don't spend my time trying to out freepers here. I figure if someone is OVERTLY disrupting, they'll be tombstoned right away. But WHY is there such a rush to try and discern "tone of voice" or "intent", or jump all over format issues from a new poster.

The democratic party USED to have a large tent... and though DU is not part of the party, we should try to live here by the values that brought us all together in the first place.

When in doubt.. wait it out!! Be nice to new people!!!! :)

[RebelYell]

70. Newbies are votes too n/t

[Kingofalldems]

71. As a long time lurker and

new member I am glad to be here. Before I signed up I figured out how to spot a freeper, it was sometimes obvious and sometimes not. I was wondering how I could find out if a person was tombstoned, I have looked up some of my suspects and their name didn't come up. Is their a list of tombstoned members somewhere so I can find out if I was right?

[in_cog_ni_to]

77. See that little lady's head right above a post?

click on that and you will get their profile and if they have been tombstoned...you will see a tombstone on their profile. You can't miss it. :7

Welcome to DU, BTW! :hi:

[Texasgal]

73. I am new...

And I have have had nothing but nice experiences here on DU. I guess I don't appear or write like a freeper!