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PLAME INDICTMENTS # 15-HIGH CRIMES & MISDEMEANORS -The Tip Of The Iceberg

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:56 AM
Original message
PLAME INDICTMENTS # 15-HIGH CRIMES & MISDEMEANORS -The Tip Of The Iceberg
THE DANGER TO THE CONSTITUTIONAL DEMOCRACY BY Waterman

-snip-

At the time of the American Revolution, the "founding fathers" met in secret. They were almost exclusively from the "upper class," and needed to keep their actions secret from King George. While they may have spoken more openly as individuals, their group efforts were not known to the upper class, including the newspapers of the day.

However, the middle class and the poor spread the word. They were aware of King George's spies, so they spread the word on a democratic underground. It took root -- and grass roots democracy has been the most important part of the foundation for this country ever since. The grass roots are more powerful than those three branches of the federal government.

We're in similar circumstances today. Our president is no more in favor of democracy than old King George was. We have two chances of kicking him out of power. The most obvious is the election in November. But there's also the Plame Indictments.

If there is any life breath in the balance of powers, the legislative and judiciary must do their jobs. This is a criminal outfit. There are now numerous "upper class" people organizing to hold this administration liable for their crimes. It's not just democrats hoping to reclaim the presidency in 2004. It's a wide range of citizens who know that Bush and Cheney intend to fully destroy the constitutional democracy we should enjoy.

You and I aren't meeting in their secret get-togethers. We're that grass-roots democratic power. Our primary job is to continue to educate the public, register voters, and increase participation in those treasures defined by the Bill of Rights. Please work to spread the message about the Plame Indictments. We've seen a preview of the administration's late summer counter-offensive.

Let's expose them as totally offensive.

Thank you,

Waterman


_ _ _ _ _ _ _

PLAME INDICTMENTS - "HIGH CRIMES & MISDEMEANORS- THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG"


These links seem to work better if you open them in "Open In New Window"

Plame Indictments Thread 1
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 2
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 3
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 4
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 5
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 6
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 7
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 8
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 9
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 10
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 11
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 12
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 13
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Plame Indictments Thread 14
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
1. TOLL FREE # TO CONGRESS 1800 839 5276 - use it to tell them
what you think and what you want for this country.


. 1 800 839 5276 TOLL FREE TO CAPITOL HILL


and

www.congress.org - for a directory to ANYBODY on the Hill, AND their local/regional offices.


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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:00 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. A DIRECTORY TO CONTACT ANYBODY IN CONGRESS

www.congress.org - for a directory to ANYBODY on the Hill, AND their

local/regional offices.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Plame Threads in MsWord format : first 12
All 12 can be found here as MSWord ".doc"s:

http://www.aeschatech.com/dumpster/plame /

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. RECAP OF "WHY" PLAME>CHENEY>HALLIBURTON>ILLEGAL WMD TRADE
RECAP OF "WHY" PLAME>CHENEY>HALLIBURTON>ILLEGAL WMD TRADE


robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-25-04 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #52

55. RECAP-PALLAS THEORY OF WHY PLAME>CHENEY>HALLLIBURTON


3. A THEORY ON THE WHY - Plame -> Cheney->Halliburton


repost

A THEORY ON THE WHY - Plame -> Cheney->Halliburton

On my way home today, as I thought about the why the outing of Valerie Plame was necessary, I was so engrossed I drove 4 exits past my exit.

Here's what we know:

1) Valerie Plame was "active in a sting operation involving the trafficking of Weapons of Mass Destruction components"" when her identity was exposed by the White House. It also said" Only a high-ranking official could have had access to the knowledge" that Valerie Plame was a covert CIA agent.

2) Vice President Cheney since 1995 as CEO of Halliburton was fined 1.2 milion dollars for illegal sales of components to Libya which could be used for nuclear purposes. Shortly before becoming Vice President he bitterly assailed US policy against selling such components to Syrria and Iran, which apparently hurt Halliburton's bottom line.

3) There is an investigation of Vice President Cheney in other countries for illegal bribery and various other offenses connected to Halliburton as well as paying amounts to secret Swiss bank accounts

4)The Atomic Energy Commission has said a North American company is one of 20 being investigated for black market sales of WMD materials.

Here's the theory:

Valerie Plame was stopped in her tracks and the biggest treasonous taboo of revealing a CIA sting operation was done because she/it was coming close to discovering even more serious violations of the laws against trading nuclear materials with certain countries by our own Vice President and the Hallibuton company he has awarded billions of US taxpayer dollars to in non-bid contracts after he became VP.

Recently Libya was accused of having WMD components and the US threat
ened to invade unless Quaddaffi gave the WMD components to the US.
Bush 2 was seen on TV this week inspecting the cases of returned materials from Iraq triumphantly. The fact that Quaddafi received these illegal shipments of components from Cheney/Halliburton was not
mentioned in the victory video.

Dick Cheney, even after the Senate Intel Committee, The Atomic Commission and numerous other agencies have said no WMD exist in Iraq,
insists Iraq has WMD even in the last week.

Why? Because Dick Cheney knows he, through an offshore Halliburton company with a PO Box, at some time in the past sold Saddam Hussein WMD or components of WMD. In the same way "they" under Bush 1 adminstration sold Hussein lethal gas which he used, and then attacked him for using it saying he was a threat to the community.

Why do Cheney and Bush insist they must attack Syrria and Iran as the next step in making the world safe and that Syrria and Iran have
WMD? Cheney-Halliburton know that Syrria and Iran have WMD components because Cheney illegally sold the WMD components to Syrria and Iran.

Why did Bush Cheney know that North Korea had WMD and where did they gget the components?

Why were Pakistan and India able to test and develop nuclear weapons undetected by the CIA's "big eye in the sky" or any agency's seismic
discovery? And where did India and Pakistan purchase the components
for WMD which were illegal for any company to sell them?

What was Valerie Plame investigating?


good spooks vs the bad spooks in the FBI and CIA becomes very confusing to most, I think.



Not to add confusion to my "theory " above, but I also thought:

When Saudi Arabia asked Junior and Company to get out of Saudi Arabia
afer we had built a monstrous and expensive base armed with the newest weaponry - one might call it a home base -why would they do that, when they had wanted US to protect them and their oil fields for years???

The reason given for asking us to vacate was to calm the anti-American element. Hmmm. But if they needed our protection from that very element, WHY would they ask their protector to leave.
BECAUSE they "likely" also received WMD from certain parties.

So now, we can guess, the entire Middle East is armed with illegal components of WMD...supplied by whom?hmmm

And I agree with you ROBERTPAULSEN- it's a great racket. Supply them
with the components, collect payment. Shuttle back and forth between
private employment and government employment, selling WMD for your company's bottom line while a private CEO, earning large bonuses and
deferred "payment" plus increased stock option value, go back into government, create a war on those countries who have the WMD you have sold them, then you have created a situation where your company and the other companies you hold stock in, or which belong to your other associates, can supply the army with munitions, destroy the country you have sold WMD to, and then the very same companies who supplied the munitions for destruction, go in and rebuild the country.


So. Now how many times have you profiteered?
1) illegal selling of WMD
2) earn bonus, increase value of stock options
3) Supply Army Munitions on no bid contracts
4) Rebuild the country on no bid contracts



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robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-25-04 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #55

56. PALLAS THEORY - WHY BRIT INTEL WONT SHOW THEIR EVIDENCE


everyone is assuming that the Brit Intel is the same Intel that the
CIA had. (on yellowcake)

You're right about one thing...the intel agencies all share their info.BUT you are forgetting that the French have been investigating CHeney Halliburton illegalities for some time, and Cheney Halliburton
did not sell yellowcake (to our knowledge), they sold equipment that could be used for dual use - and one of the uses was for a nuklar bomb.

So there is nothing to say that the Brit Intel was the same Niger info.In fact it may not be.

WHY would they not share with the world what information they had about Iraq having WMD? And why have they suddenly changed their mindsagain saying it was bogus after all - after insisting for 1 1/2 years they had separate proof of Iraq having WMD?

Theory: because it would cause a great deal of embarrassment to "he who calls himself president of VICE ! !! a-ha!

Could be one of Halliburton's subsidiaries or offshores, whose name and connection was not recognized immediately was in the hands of Brit Intel so they said they had separate verifying proof of WMD in Iraq - only to realize the proof traced back to a company named Halliburton or Brown Root - and so they shut up. (TOP SECRET - CANNOT BE REVEALED, of course while every intel agency in the world knows, but the general public date not know becaue we would hang the perpetrator)

Highly plausible . First they say they have proof of WMD in Iraq.but refuse to show it.......now they suddenly say the proof is bogus - and still refuse to reveal it.



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robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-25-04 03:23 PM
Response to Reply #56

57. H20 THEORY - RECAP


H2O Man (1000+ posts) Sat Jul-17-04 02:01 PM




We know that Valerie Plame was involved in a sting operation involving the components for WMDs. This is verfied in J. Klein's article in Time, 7-5-04. Remember also that when Novak called CI for confirmation of Plame's status -- and Robert NoFacts had told a total stranger on a public street on the day afterWilson's NYT op-ed article that she was a WMD specialist -- the CIA requested that he not only should NOT mention Wilson's wife was an operative with the Agency, but that her name should not ever be printed.

One of the things to keep in mind is that by revealing Plame's identity, it insured that at very least, a half-dozen operatives (American and other-wise) were exposed to the last people on earth that they should have been exposed to. Let's just say, for example, that there was a person who was working in the Pakistan area ... and he had worked in deep cover for over a decade, and was very, very close to accessing information on the sale of not only technology, but also components, that went to Iran .... and he had a known link to Plame .... then he would be dead 24 hours after Novak's article was printed. Further, no one in the USA would be at liberty to discuss the fact that he existed.

You will recall that I've referred to this as high stakes chess. A board game where the removal of one player compromises the safety and value of several others.

Listen: if they wanted to call Wilson's conclusions into question, they could create confusion with a series of bullshit documents from England, etc. They could have said that his was one of three US reports, and that there were the British papers that were still open to question, considering that Wilson had not viewed them. They could have even said, yes, we tend to agree with Wilson.

But they didn't. They had been waiting to reveal information on Plame for some time. The fact that Iran is sharing he focus in the recent days, along with Wilson, is a clue .... a big clue.



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robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-25-04 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #57

58. CALIMARY THEORY RECAP


Pallas180 (1000+ posts) Sat Jul-17-04 05:43 PM


71. I am convinced Valerie Plame was the target, & they thought
they would do a 'Rosenberg' on them. Two for the price of one.
Set them up.Traitors to the country, electric chair, the whole bit.




calimary (1000+ posts) Sat Jul-17-04 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #71

143. That would fit in conveniently with the message they evidently wanted to put out to the intel community: the "do not cheney with us" message. Wilson has, many times, mentioned that what happened to his wife, whether to her directly or indirectly to him, was to seriously discourage others from getting "out of line." Wouldn't that just be the decisive little coup de grace - to "Rosenberg" one or both of them, to put a chill on anybody else who might be getting too dangerously close? If they knew they were not only going to be ruined, but they also faced the electric chair or some other kind of EXTREMELY final punishment, there'd be icicles hanging off all of them before you could say "BOO!"

And for awhile, they've seemed invincible, haven't they? So who would dare...

But things are a lot stickier and more complicated now. Their anticipated free ride is starting to get seriously mucked up as more people know, and talk, and spread out, and start asking questions, and some guy like Fitzgerald gets involved (who couldn't be counted on to be a "good" republi-CON after all. And, as someone else mentioned either here or on Thread 8 - they misunderestimated the internet. They thought we'd all just shut up and go to our corner and suck our thumbs and mope and cower and give up, didn't they? They didn't know we'd (literally, here) go underground...

As Martha Stewart would say - it's a VERY good thing. And it's gaining traction.

Which is what our efforts in all these arenas should do, as well. GAIN TRACTION.






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robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-25-04 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #58

60. ROBERTPAULSEN THEORY HALLI>KHAN-OBL>PLAME>CHENEY


robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Mon Jul-19-04 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #216

234. WHOA!!! Could this be circumstantial evidence of a Khan/Plame link?!


When I first read this article, I decided to post it here because of the dirt it has on a Musharraf/Khan/Bin Laden connection.

A. Q. KHAN & OSAMA BIN LADEN

snip
These accounts of three of the travels of Dr.A.Q.Khan establish conclusively the following facts:

He had kept the Pakistani Foreign Office informed of his travels. The Foreign Office had instructed the Pakistani diplomatic missions in the countries visited by him to accord the due honours of protocol to him.
In all the countries, he was received by officers of the Pakistani diplomatic missions and entertained by the heads of missions.
In Sudan, he was accorded the honours of protocol generally given to a member of the Cabinet and called on the President of the country.
He was accompanied by senior serving scientists of Pakistan's nuclear establishment, who were among those responsible for Pakistan's military nuclear development. They could not have gone abroad and remained absent for days without the knowledge and clearance of the Government.
At least one Lt.Gen. belonging to the Pakistan Army's Medical Corps, who had headed it, and two Brigadiers had accompanied him. They could not have gone and remained away from the country without the knowledge and clearance of the Military Headquarters.
The uranium enriched at KRL, Kahuta, used to come from Africa, mainly Niger. This partly explains the frequent travels of A.Q.Khan to Africa. From the accounts given by the Pakistani author, two intriguing questions arise:

Why did Khan consider it necessary to visit the site of a factory in Sudan, which became the target of US Cruise missile attacks after the explosions outside the US Embassies in Nairobi and Dar-es-Salaam by Al Qaeda in August 1998? The Americans had alleged at that time that this factory belonged to Osama bin Laden and was producing chemicals for weaponisation purposes. Denying this, the Sudanese authorities had claimed that it was producing anti-malaria drugs.
Why was he visiting frequently Timbuktu, which has apparently no importance from the nuclear point of view? Pakistani officials have alleged that he had illegally constructed a hotel there ( Hotel La Colombe?) in the name of his wife. If he was going there to supervise the construction of the hotel, he should have been accompanied by experts in building construction and the hotel industry. No such person accompanied him. He was always accompanied by scientists and Army officers associated with KRL and Tahir Mian, who was helping him in the procurement of centrifuges.
It is reliably learnt from well-placed observers that it also came out during the recent interrogation of the associates of Khan in Pakistan's nuclear establishment that after Osama bin Laden shifted from Khartoum to Afghanistan in 1996, Dr.Khan was also looking after bin Laden's extensive investments in the mining industry in many African countries and that the money invested in the Timbuktu hotel had come from these investments of bin Laden. The Pakistani authorities have reportedly suppressed this information and not shared it with the US.

http://www.kashmirherald.com/featuredarticle/khanandbin ...

Sooooo....

Khan, with the assistance of the Pakistani government and military, looked after bin Laden investments in Africa. Pretty bad on its own merits. But then this sentence caught my eye.


The uranium enriched at KRL, Kahuta, used to come from Africa, mainly Niger. This partly explains the frequent travels of A.Q.Khan to Africa.


What a coincidence. The enriched uranium that Khan had access to came mainly from NIGER!

Now, when Cheney sent Wilson to Niger, wasn't he aware of Plame's WMD "sting operation" in the Middle East?!

No wonder Musharraf had this reaction:

"In one of his statements, he has even blamed the US intelligence agencies for not uncovering this network earlier than October last year and asserted that if they had done so, he would have acted against it even earlier."

I know this is not direct proof of a smoking gun, but I think this information could be an extremely important piece of the puzzle. If the WMD trafficking that Plame's "sting operation" covered is linked to Khan, who got his enriched uranium mainly from Niger, and we can verify Cheney had access to this intelligence, then we are getting even closer to H20 Man and Prouty's big question: why?



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robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-25-04 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #60

62. ROBERTPAULSEN - CHENEY/KHAN TIE: MOTIVE TO OUT PLAME


We all know about the $1.2 million fine Cheney got for selling dual-use components. Going back over some of my old posts, here's another bit of dirt we should all remember:

Cheney helped cover-up Pakistani nuclear proliferation in '89 so US could sell country fighter jets

Tuesday, March 16 2004 @ 04:04 PM Eastern Standard Time
Jason Leopold
When Pakistan's clandestine program involving its top nuclear scientist selling rogue nations, such as Iran and North Korea, blueprints for building an atomic bomb was uncovered last month, the world's leaders waited, with baited breath to see what type of punishment George W. Bush would inflict upon Pakistan's President Pervez Musharaff. Bush has, after all, spent his entire term in office talking tough about countries and dictators that conceal weapons of mass destruction and even tougher on individuals who supply rogue nations and terrorists with the means to build WMD. For all intents and purposes, Pakistan and Musharraf fit that description.

Remember, Bush accused Iraq of harboring a cache of WMD, which was the primary reason he gave for the United States launching a preemptive strike on that country a year ago, and also claimed that Iraq may have given its WMD to al-Qaeda terrorists and/or Syria, weapons that, Bush said, could be used to attack the U.S. Bush, Vice President Dick Cheney and top members of the administration reacted with shock when they found out that Abdul Qadeer Khan, Pakistan's top nuclear scientist, spent the past 15 years selling outlaw nations nuclear technology and equipment. So it was sort of a surprise when Bush, upon finding out about Khan's proliferation of nuclear technology, let Pakistan off with a slap on the wrist. But it was all an act. In fact, it was actually a coverup designed to shield Cheney because he knew about the proliferation for more than a decade and did nothing to stop it.

Like the terrorist attacks on 9-11, the Bush administration had mountains of evidence on Pakistan's sales of nuclear technology and equipment to nations vilified by the U.S.?nations that are considered much more of a threat than Iraq?but turned a blind eye to the threat and allowed it to happen. In 1989, the year Khan first started selling nuclear secrets on the black-market; Richard Barlow, a young intelligence analyst working for the Pentagon prepared a shocking report for Cheney, who was then secretary of defense under the Bush I administration: Pakistan built an atomic bomb and was selling its nuclear equipment to countries the U.S. said was sponsoring terrorism. But Barlow's findings, as reported in a January 2002 story in Mother Jones magazine, were "politically inconvenient."

"A finding that Pakistan possessed a nuclear bomb would have triggered a congressionally mandated cutoff of aid to the country, a key ally in the CIA's efforts to support Afghan rebels fighting a pro-Soviet government. It also would have killed a $1.4-billion sale of F-16 fighter jets to Islamabad," Mother Jones reported. Ironically, Pakistan, critics say, was let off the hook last month so the U.S. could use its borders to hunt for al-Qaeda leader and alleged 9-11 mastermind Osama bin Laden. Cheney dismissed Barlow's report because he desperately wanted to sell Pakistan the F-16 fighter planes. Several months later, a Pentagon official was told by Cheney to downplay Pakistan's nuclear capabilities when he testified on the threat before Congress. Barlow complained to his bosses at the Pentagon and was fired.

http://www.pakistan-facts.com/article.php/2004031621042 ...

That got me thinking about other facts surrounding the Plame scandal. Like the "sting operation involving the trafficking of WMD components". When Khan's operation was exposed, everyone in the loop was caught with their pants down. Musharraf had to pardon Khan because as the father of the Pakistani atomic bomb, he is a national hero. Do you buy that as the real reason? That's like accepting the Bush misadministration's silence over the pardon because Pakistan is our ally in the War on Terror. Right. Reminds me of Michael Corleone in Godfather Part II: "Keep your friends close, but your enemies closer".

My theory is that the sting operation Plame was involved in brought down A.Q. Khan. As far as "trafficking of WMD components" goes, Khan was a pretty huge player. My fear is that Khan was just the tip of the iceberg and that when Plame's operation was derailed, it allowed even bigger fish to swim away where Middle East WMD trafficking is concerned. Remember this about Musharraf:

"His repeatedly-asserted contention has been that after the interception by the intelligence agencies of the US and the UK of a ship in October last year which was found carrying to Libya a clandestine consignment of centrifuges for uranium enrichment got manufactured at the instance of A.Q.Khan by a company in Malaysia with the assistance of a Sri Lankan Muslim, he became aware of the extensive non-proliferation activities of the A.Q.Khan group and immediately acted against them.

According to Musharraf, details of the clandestine travels and proliferation network of A.Q. Khan came to notice during the subsequent investigation. In one of his statements, he has even blamed the US intelligence agencies for not uncovering this network earlier than October last year and asserted that if they had done so, he would have acted against it even earlier

http://www.kashmirherald.com/featuredarticle/khanandbin ...

If Plame was in on this sting, Musharraf certainly had a reason to voice disdain for the US intelligence agencies, and Cheney certainly had a reason to out Plame.



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robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-25-04 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #62

63. Nuclear Walmart: Little Doubt that OBL has dirty bomb -


if you read Robert's post above carefully, you see that
Pakistani scientist Khan was running a Nuclear Walmart.

1)He sold the secrets of the nuclear bomb world wide. This is fact.
2)He had access to yellow cake by his trips to Africa/Niger
3)He was OBL's overseer of finances and properties, with the help
of the secret service ISI of Pakistan.

The ISI of Pakistan was also the supporter and installer of the TAliban in Afghanistan (and current protector/hider of OBL)

When Khan was exposed as the merchant of death ofa ring selling nuclear materials world wide, he was immediately pardoned by
Musharaf, PM of of Pakistan. Pardoned so fast that none of the US
Intel agencies would be able to question him.

WHY? H20 always tells us to ask WHY? Why was Khan immediately pardoned? Because to try him for criminality would have exposed
who gave him nuclear components, what corporations sold illegally,
what country and high officials were involved.

WHERE did Khan get the components which are necessary to set off
a nuclear device?

WHO? do we know who has illegally been selling nuclear dual components?

Some of these answers go back to the administration in 1988 when it
was known that administration gave other countries the miniaturized
nuke W88. Hmmmm. What current officials were in the same administration?

What was the name of the President at the time?



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robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-25-04 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #63

64. Why go to the elaborate scenarios? to stop WMD investigations:


Subject: Why go to the elaborate scenarios: to stop investigations into WMD sales
Message:
Pallas180 (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-18-04 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #59

71. They're not called the Mayberry Machiavellis for nothing - I think

in a way it was the other way around, they weren't after Wilson, they were after Plame. Two for the price of one. Rosenberg them.

Cheney has been in govt since Nixon, that we know of, then Ford.
He's been around a long time with access to top security items.
To recap, we also knew he made at least 10 trips to CI HQ and would
have, could have, pinpointed who was working blackmarket WMD which
would have been of great interest to him. He would also have access
to CI files, would know of or remember Ambassador Wilson. Bingo -
the plot is hatched.

Ask her would her husband be interested in helping? Of course.
Discredit him, expose/discredit her operation and put a stop to her work and the work of the entire spy group/cell she had set up worldwide which MAY have been hot on the trail of Halliburton/Brown Root/et al illegal black market sales of components which could be used for WMD, which as we all know was Valerie's job.

He figures he's home free, no more fines, no discovery of the double dealing, but the Mayberrys call Novak and committ a treasonous act which leads right back to the WH and darth vader.

___________________________________________________________________


Pallas180 (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-18-04 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #102

117. If Pappy gave the mini nuke W88 to China,as widely reported, there is nothing to say Pappy and darth vader didn't give the same or similar components to Khan. And your theory sounds just about right - Khan would have had to be pardoned immediately because not to pardon him, the good FBI would be over there asking him where he got the WMD and the arrow would point right back to the 1988 administration # 1 and/or the current WH.

Another reason why junior sealed Pappy's records.

Nice, huh. It still sounds like treason to me at the highest levels
__________________________________________________________

robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Sun Jul-18-04 11:01 PM
Response to Reply #117

138. Glad you agree!
The extent of treason is pretty scary. Gives me nightmares sometimes. I woke up this morning with the memory of seeing a news report: "Bush prepares for upcoming Iran invasion". That's one nightmare I'm afraid might come true.

But I take comfort in knowing we're all on the side of righteousness in this struggle

Additional edit for this thread: These theories are all different, but as far as I can see, they all fit into a pattern, like different pieces of the same jigsaw puzzle. I look forward to reading more research into these theories, as well as new theories that could give us a fresh perspective on the nature of this crime.


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shraby (1000+ posts) Tue Jul-27-04 12:44 AM
Response to Reply #55

185. There is one more aspect


to the 1-2-3-4

5.The "criminals" re-Enter government from time to time and make sure laws and regulations are such that can be most profitable to them while they and/or their friends and associates are in the private sector.






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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. COMING SOON - CHENEY-HALLIBURTON-RUMSFELD-KHAN-N.KOREA & MORE
stay tuned.....

more illegal doo-doo than could ever be cleaned up from

the 1980 regime to the current regime -

Where did Pakistani Khan (of Nuclear Walmart Is Us) get the nuclear bomb(s)?

You'll love the answer to that one
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PDittie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
5. Thanks for all
that you do, Pallas.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. We recommend: especially reading this:
Wed Jul-28-04 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #5

42. "PLENTY MORE TO SWEAR ABOUT" by Joe Klein

Edited on Wed Jul-28-04 04:14 PM by Pallas180
Sunday, Jun. 27, 2004
Plenty More to Swear About
By JOE KLEIN
The Vulcans a campaign 2000 nickname for George W. Bush's hawkish national security team went Krakatoa last week. Dick Cheney erupted on the Senate floor, deploying the F word against Vermont Democrat Patrick Leahy, who had been belaboring the Vice President over the no-bid deals that Cheney's old company, Halliburton, had scored in Iraq. Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz suffered a meltdown in a House Armed Services Committee hearing, blasting the press for "sitting in Baghdad" and "printing rumors." (He later apologized.) And the White House was forced to acknowledge that Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld had approved, at least for a while, the use of dogs, nudity, stress positions that is, torture against enemy combatants. Indeed, Rumsfeld, who works at a stand-up desk, indicated a desire for at least one more strenuous stress position: "I stand 8-10 hours a day," he scrawled on a memo. "Why is standing limited to 4 hours?"

Presumably the Secretary of Defense doesn't do his standing naked, continuously, in the middle of the night, surrounded by hostile guards and attack dogs. But then, Rumsfeld's blustery testosteronics are at the heart of what has gone wrong with the Bush foreign policy and last week the assorted temper tantrums appeared to be a leading indicator of a gathering summer storm confronting this presidency.


The torture investigation is one of four major defensive battles the Administration is facing. In the weeks to come, the White House will also have to deal with the 9/11 commission's final report, the congressional investigations into the CIA's bungled assessment of Iraq's weapons of mass destruction and a special prosecutor's hunt for the White House leakers who blew the cover of CIA secret operative Valerie Plame. Not only is the Administration defending itself against the Democrats, the investigators and the media. Two other serious, surreptitious and quite possibly unprecedented battles are going on: the intelligence community is at war with the White House, and the uniformed military is at war with the civilian leadership of the Pentagon. The first conflict went public last week with news of the impending publication of Imperial Hubris: Why the West Is Losing the War on Terrorism, a book by an anonymous author who is known to be a senior CIA official and former chief of the agency's Osama bin Laden station. The invasion of Iraq was "an avaricious, premeditated, unprovoked war against a foe who posed no immediate threat," the author writes. "There is nothing that bin Laden could have hoped for more than the American invasion and occupation of Iraq."

Michael Moore couldn't have said it any better and this book was vetted by CIA censors. In fact, the views of Anonymous are an accurate reflection of the opinions I've heard from multiple intelligence sources. The spooks seem to believe that outgoing CIA Director George Tenet was strong-armed by Cheney and Rumsfeld into overassessing Iraq's WMD capacity. This may or may not be true, but it is the conventional wisdom in the intelligence community. Furthermore, there is intense anger over the White House's revealing the identity of Plame, who may have been active in a sting operation involving the trafficking of WMD components. Plame was outed in a White House attempt to discredit the finding of her husband, former Ambassador Joseph Wilson, that there was no evidence that Iraq tried to buy yellowcake uranium from Niger. "Only a very high-ranking official could have had access to the knowledge that Plame was on the payroll" of the CIA, an intelligence source told me.

more...

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/printout/0,8816,11010 ...

I reprint this article that we have been referencing since the first thread because the knowledge of this "sting operation involving the trafficking of WMD components" provides us with clues for a MOTIVE to blow Valerie Plame's cover. Exploring the reasons "why" gives us a clearer understanding of the scope of this treasonous act and leads to the next logical query in any criminal investigation: who benefited?


Here's the $1.2 million link


Maybe RebelYell could send this along with Cheney speech link to Robert Palast. He'd laugh his ass off and spread the word!

A Halliburton Primer
Thursday, July 11, 2002


Following President Bush's demand for more corporate accountability, public interest group Judicial Watch, Inc., filed suit against Vice President Cheney and the Halliburton Company, alleging accounting fraud during Cheney's stewardship of Halliburton in the 1990s. The U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission is also investigating Halliburton's accounting practices.


Judicial Watch Sues Cheney, Halliburton (AP, July 10, 2002)

Following is a brief explanation of Cheney's involvment with Halliburton and the pending lawsuit and SEC investigation.

What is Halliburton Co.?

The Dallas-based Halliburton Company provides products and services to the petroleum and energy industries to aid in the exploration, development and production of natural resources. Halliburton KBR, the company's engineering and construction division, designs, builds and provides additional services for the energy industry, governments and civil infrastructure. Halliburton employs 85,000 people in over 100 countries.

Halliburton came under fire in the early '90s for supplying Libya and Iraq with oil drilling equipment which could be used to detonate nuclear weapons. Halliburton Logging Services, a former subsidiary, was charged with shipping six pulse neutron generators through Italy to Libya. In 1995, the company pled guilty to criminal charges that it violated the U.S. ban on exports to Libya. Halliburton was fined $1.2 million and will pay $2.61 million in civil penalties.

During his chairmanship of Halliburton, Cheney criticized U.S. sanctions against "rogue" nations such as Iran and Libya in a 1998 speech. According to a July 26, 2000, Washington Post story, Cheney complained the sanctions "are nearly always motivated by domestic political pressure, the need for Congress to appeal to some domestic constituency."

On Edit - and there's a little matter of selling to Iraq, Iran, Syrria, Libya, Burma, Pakistan, you name it....under offshore companies, too.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/onpolitics/article ...


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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. PDITTIE, Thanks, I'm just secretary to the grassrooters here, join us caus
Edited on Sat Jul-31-04 12:19 PM by Pallas180
the more the merrier. Luv that picture of Big Dawg

:hi:

And thanks from Koho, Shraby, Me, DEMINNC, Beam Me Up, H20,

Stand Up, Tactical, Calimary,RobertPaulsen, Jelly Bean and all the

guys and gals who have helped this project for the last 14 threads!

One day, I'll make a list of everybody.....but not today :)

LOL
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carols Donating Member (694 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
7. Take Action! Stop the Plame Cover-up!
Dont Let the Bush Administration Sweep the Plame Case Under the Carpet!

Heard much about the Valerie Plame case recently? No? We havent either, and that is a shame because the Bush administrations outing of Valerie Plame might just be their downfall

The neo-con cabal currently illegally occupying the White House has certainly put a lot of time and energy into discrediting Valerie Plame and her husband, Ambassador Joseph Wilson. First, the talking heads delivered the this is just some guy trying to sell a book line. Then they attacked Mr. Wilsons character. And recently, they have unearthed an alleged attempt by Saddam Hussein to actually purchase the much-disputed uranium. The funny thing is, even if Mr. Wilson was just trying to sell a book and even if he turned out to be shadier than an old-time medicine show hawker and even if there really was an attempt to purchase uranium in Nigeriaeven if all this is true, exposing a CIA agent is still TREASON!

Its time we reminded the media and our elected representatives of this fact. Dont let Bushs smoke and mirrors obscure the central issue in this case. Please take action today. It will only take a minute.

See: http://www.legitgov.org/action_plame_073004.html for details regarding this action!

Also posted on Democracy for America blog
http://www.democracyforamerica.com/forums/viewtopic.php...
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Welcome Carol. Nice web work.
:hi:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. 3 MORE "SUGGESTED/GUIDE" LETTERS TO SEND-take yr pick

H20's SUGGESTED LETTER TO MEDIA & CONGRESS

for you to copy or use as a guide to send:
Here's a suggestion ......


Dear _________;

I am writing to express my concerns about on-going efforts to discredit Ambassador Joseph Wilson. In his NYT Op-Ed article "What I Didn't Find In Africa," Wilson exposed a claim by President Bush in his 2003 State of the Union Address to be untrue. Since that time, the White House has been involved in an effort to destroy Wilson's reputation, which included exposing his wife as a CIA operative.

In John Dean's review of Wilson's book (NYT Book Review; 5-23-04; pg9) he documents that two days after the op-ed article ran, journalist Robert Novak was telling people that Wilson's wife Valerie Plame was a CIS "weapons of mass destruction specialist."

Novak exposed Plame's identity in a 7-14-03 column. He sourced his story to two "senior administration officials." These two senior White House officials had lobbied at least six journalists to expose Plame in what Dean calls a "you-hurt-us-we-will-hurt-you warning" to those tempted to expose administration "misinformation."

When Wilson appeared on MSNBC's "Countdown," host Keith Olbermann held up three identical e-mails from the White House. Olbermann explained their intent was to discredit Wilson with their "talking points."

Wilson has noted that Sandy Berger, President Clinton's national security advisor pointed out that since the Bush people never back down, the fact that they had admitted an error after the op-ed article indicated "they must have something more important to protect." (The Politics of Truth, by Wilson; pg4)

Joseph Klein's 7-5-04 article in Time (Plenty More to Swear About; pg 21) reveals that Plame was "active in a sting operation involving the trafficking of WMD components" when her identity was exposed by the White House. "Only a high-ranking official could have had access to the knowledge that Plame was on the pay-roll," an intelligence source told Klein.

There is clearly more to this story than the White House and senate republicans are willing to tell the public. What investigation by Plame needed to be derailed by the White House? I hope that national leaders and the media will focus attention on this important issue.

Sincerely,


____________________________________________________________________

KOHO'S SHORT & SWEET SUGGESTED LETTER TO SEND


Dear_________;

I am writing about the outing of CIA Agent Valerie Plame. It seems that the Grand jury Investigation has wrapped up or will soon, but little has been mentioned of late. What may have been political payback to Joe Wilson for refuting the Niger yellowcake claims in the State of the Union address could have actually made this country a great deal less safe. According to Joseph Klein (Time 7-5-04--Plenty More to Swear About), Plame may have been "active in a sting operation involving the trafficking of WMD components." If this is true (or even a possibility, those responsible must be brought to justice. I submit that underground trafficking of WMD components presents a far more imminent threat to our country than Saddam Hussein did. In my mind this certainly achieves the status of "High Crimes," and I urge you to not let this issue fall by the wayside. The security of our country may have been irretrievably harmed by a few high ranking officials and they must be brought to task.

Sincerely,


_____________________________________________________________________
PALLAS' 'GIVE EM HELL' SUGGESTED LETTER

Dear ____________


Concerning Time magazine's Joe Klein's July 5 article, page 21 revealed that Valerie Plame was "active in a sting operation involving the trafficking of Weapons of Mass Destruction components"" when her identity was exposed by the White House. It also said" Only a high-ranking official could have had access to the knowledge" that Valerie Plame was a covert CIA agent.

1) Our study group has found that Vice President Cheney since 1995 as CEO of Halliburton was fined 1.2 milion dollars for illegal sales of similar components to Libya. Shortly before becoming Vice President he bitterly assailed US policy against selling such components to Syrria and Iran, which apparently hurt Halliburton's bottom line.

2) Our study group has also found that there is an investigation of Vice President Cheney in other countries for illegal bribery and various other offenses connected to Halliburton as well as paying amounts to secret Swiss bank accounts

3)The Atomic Energy Commission has said a North American company is one of 20 being investigated for black market sales of WMD materials.

Our study group suspects there is more to the White House revealing Valerie Plame's covert CIA status since the Republicans refuse to hold investigations on the matter.

Frankly, it would appear to us that possibly Valerie Plame was stopped in her tracks and the CIA sting operation was exposed because it was coming close to discovering another violation of the laws by our own Vice President and the Hallibuton company he has awarded billions of US taxpayer dollars to in non-bid contracts.

There is a question of where the Vice President's and President's loyalty lies: to their Corporate friends and company's bottom line or to the security and wellbeing of the America.n people?

In any case, the exposure of Valerie Plame by the White House was and is treasonous.

The responsibility of the Media and Congress is to expose these wrong doings, investigate and safeguard against this type of occurrence for the American people.

WHY are you not fulfilling your role to me, to my study group, and the rest of the American people in this country and WHEN will you start ?


Sincerely
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Contact Individual Reporters through this site:

Individual Reporters & Newspaper List

forgive me, it's on the drudge rag site, but it's useful

http://www.drudgereport.com /
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #11
100. SEND THESE LETTERS ABOVE-THEY GOTTA KNOW WE'RE WATCHING!
and we're mad as hell and not gonna take it anymore!
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carols Donating Member (694 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #10
18. Thank you! I would of replied sooner but...
my husband was dusting the wires on the back of our hub and router
:-) Guess he dusted a bit too vigorously!
Carol
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Me. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #7
23. Goodie!
Even more people writing letters
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
13. Pappy & Juniors" New World Order" thrills & chills -mostly chills:
"There will be, in the next generation or so, a pharmacological

method of making people love their servitude, and producing

dictatorship without tears, so to speak, producing a kind of

painless concentration camp for entire societies, so that people

will in fact have their liberties taken away from them, but will

rather enjoy it, because they will be distracted from any desire to

rebel by propaganda or brainwashing, or brainwashing enhanced by

pharmacological methods. And this seems to be the final revolution."


Aldous Huxley's lecture to The California Medical School in San Francisco in 1961

(Edit - the one exception is those with the internet available to them, they didn't count on that on 1961)

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Henry Kissinger: A little manipulation should get them ready-911 anyone?
"Today Americans would be outraged if U.N. troops entered Los

Angeles to restore order; tomorrow they will be grateful. This is

especially true if they were told there was an outside threat from

beyond, whether real or promulgated, that threatened our very

existence. It is then that all peoples of the world will plead with

world leaders to deliver them from this evil. The one thing every

man fears is the unknown. When presented with this scenario,

individual rights will be willingly relinquished for the guarantee

of their well being granted to them by their world government."

Henry Kissinger, Speaking at Evian, France, May 21, 1992. Bilderberg

meeting.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. We suggest you google membership of the Trilateral Commission Quote here
And of course Pappy is a member. New World Order, anyone?

"The Trilateralist Commission is international... ...is

intended to be the vehicle for multinational consolidation of the

commercial and banking interests by seizing control of the political

government of the United States. The Trilateralist Commission

represents a skillful, coordinated effort to seize control and

consolidate the four centers of power - political, monetary,

intellectual, and ecclesiastical."


Barry Goldwater (1909-1998) US Senator (R-Arizona), in his book "With No Apologies"
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. And finally a word from Mussolini:
"Fascism should more appropriately be called Corporatism because it

is a merger of State and corporate power."

Benito Mussolini, 1883-1945, Fascist dictator of Italy




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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Does the above give you an idea why this's the most important election of
your lifetime?


check out thread 14 for eyeopeners.

Your country is being controlled by the criminal element that was
convicted in Watergate and Iran-Contra and then pardoned, plus a few
others who got away scott free but are back in power .

Don;t just read it, get on that toll free phone number and call
every Senator and Congresscritter and tell them you're onto them
and you won't let the Constitution of The United States be nullified.

And you're looking for trials for treason of those in power now.

Again, check out thread 14 for a birds eye view of how criminalized
and treasonous the people in this current government are.
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Spiffarino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #16
246. Mussolini was a fake.
Much like our current leaders.

From Thom Hartmann's brilliant article, The Ghost of Vice President Wallace Warns: "It Can Happen Here":

...(VP Henry) Wallace was using the classic definition of the word "fascist" - the definition Mussolini had in mind when he claimed to have invented the word. (It was actually Italian philosopher Giovanni Gentile who wrote the entry in the Encyclopedia Italiana that said: "Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power." Mussolini, however, affixed his name to the entry, and claimed credit for it.)
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #13
22. There is a new twist to this pharmacological
thing..there is a new law coming down the pike that says all Americans will be tested for mental illness starting with the school children and extending to all. Sorry I don't have a link, but it's been discussed on du and I did see the article.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. IMPLANTS anyone? The NewManchurian Candidate -GO SEE IT
speaking of the next advance in pharmacology -

so different from the original...based on today's politics

villain's name is Prentiss - does that sound familiar?

Company that controls the world behind the scenes is
Manchurian Global - invents implants -

The movie is powerful.

(Shraby - yest I saw the article - when are they going to start
tattooing? )

Every mother should fight this - not send the kid to school.

This govt. is out of hand.....each step taken as another abridgement
of rights, until you dont realize what has happened but you've got Nazi Germany. I mean it.
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #26
33. I agree.
If they have a drug that makes people more compliant, what better way to get a large percentage "compliant"?

Education as to what is going on is their enemy as well as the internet is their enemy. We can fight this one with one hand tied behind our backs. Only takes one hand to type even if it has to be spread as an urban legend.<G>
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coeur_de_lion Donating Member (935 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:45 PM
Response to Original message
19. The Case Against George W. Bush (by Ron Reagan)
http://www.esquire.com/cgi-bin/printtool/print.cgi?page...

<<snip>>
It may have been the guy in the hood teetering on the stool, electrodes clamped to his genitals. Or smirking Lynndie England and her leash. Maybe it was the smarmy memos tapped out by soft-fingered lawyers itching to justify such barbarism. The grudging, lunatic retreat of the neocons from their long-standing assertion that Saddam was in cahoots with Osama didn't hurt. Even the Enron audiotapes and their celebration of craven sociopathy likely played a part. As a result of all these displays and countless smaller ones, you could feel, a couple of months back, as summer spread across the country, the ground shifting beneath your feet. Not unlike that scene in The Day After Tomorrow, then in theaters, in which the giant ice shelf splits asunder, this was more a paradigm shift than anything strictly tectonic. No cataclysmic ice age, admittedly, yet something was in the air, and people were inhaling deeply. I began to get calls from friends whose parents had always voted Republican, "but not this time." There was the staid Zbigniew Brzezinski on the staid NewsHour with Jim Lehrer sneering at the "Orwellian language" flowing out of the Pentagon. Word spread through the usual channels that old hands from the days of Bush the Elder were quietly (but not too quietly) appalled by his son's misadventure in Iraq. Suddenly, everywhere you went, a surprising number of folks seemed to have had just about enough of what the Bush administration was dishing out. A fresh age appeared on the horizon, accompanied by the sound of scales falling from people's eyes. It felt something like a demonstration of that highest of American prerogatives and the most deeply cherished American freedom: dissent.
Oddly, even my father's funeral contributed. Throughout that long, stately, overtelevised week in early June, items would appear in the newspaper discussing the Republicans' eagerness to capitalize (subtly, tastefully) on the outpouring of affection for my father and turn it to Bush's advantage for the fall election. The familiar "Heir to Reagan" puffballs were reinflated and loosed over the proceedings like (subtle, tasteful) Mylar balloons. Predictably, this backfired. People were treated to a side-by-side comparisonRonald W. Reagan versus George W. Bushand it's no surprise who suffered for it. Misty-eyed with nostalgia, people set aside old political gripes for a few days and remembered what friend and foe always conceded to Ronald Reagan: He was damned impressive in the role of leader of the free world. A sign in the crowd, spotted during the slow roll to the Capitol rotunda, seemed to sum up the mooda portrait of my father and the words NOW THERE WAS A PRESIDENT.

The comparison underscored something important. And the guy on the stool, Lynndie, and her grinning cohorts, they brought the word: The Bush administration can't be trusted. The parade of Bush officials before various commissions and committeesPaul Wolfowitz, who couldn't quite remember how many young Americans had been sacrificed on the altar of his ideology; John Ashcroft, lip quivering as, for a delicious, fleeting moment, it looked as if Senator Joe Biden might just come over the table at himthese were a continuing reminder. The Enron creeps, tooa reminder of how certain environments and particular habits of mind can erode common decency. People noticed. A tipping point had been reached. The issue of credibility was back on the table. The L-word was in circulation. Not the tired old bromide liberal. That's so 1988. No, this time something much more potent: liar.

Politicians will stretch the truth. They'll exaggerate their accomplishments, paper over their gaffes. Spin has long been the lingua franca of the political realm. But George W. Bush and his administration have taken "normal" mendacity to a startling new level far beyond lies of convenience. On top of the usual massaging of public perception, they traffic in big lies, indulge in any number of symptomatic small lies, and, ultimately, have come to embody dishonesty itself. They are a lie. And people, finally, have started catching on.
<<snip>>

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 02:10 PM
Response to Original message
20. The cat says
kick it!

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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 02:17 PM
Response to Original message
21. Have you guys seen this? Deja Vu: The Ongoing Civil War, and the Bush
The illuminatti thread had a link to a DU thread from last Feb. by thingfish, here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Later in that thread there was a link to the original site for "DejaVu in America: The Ongoing Civil War, and the Bush Family's Role In It."

http://www.winterboy.com/dejavu.html

Tons of info there on all sorts of BFEE dirty dealings. I'm not sure how accurate it all is, I have only had a chance to skim, nor am I sure how relevant it is to this investigation, but I am sure there are some things there that are relevant.
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. Here is a good workup on the BCCI
which will tie into what we have already.

<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph... >
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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. I just came from that thread, I was gonna post a link here
It does tangentially tie in alot of things.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. STEVIET You mean like this:











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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. I've heard of Octafish and Seemslikeadream doing a lotta work on similar
subject.

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #24
32. Madsen: GRAND JURY WILL SOON ISSUE EXPLOSIVE INDICTMENTS
Edited on Sat Jul-31-04 09:20 PM by Pallas180
Dick Cheney is the President of the Senate, on whose hallowed floor he has just told Senator Patrick Leahy (D-VT) to fuck off. This regime is losing control of itself. The supra-governmental long-term plans that illegally drove them into office gave them a false sense of invulnerability. The money powers that make American presidencies had anointed Cheney and crew to run the country, so they could break as many rules, careers, laws, and heads as they chose so long as they delivered the right number of barrels-per-day at the right price. They cant. Having profligately wasted their political capital on torture, budgetary pork, and tax cuts, they have almost nothing left now that theyve failed their sponsors.

In this latest report on the unfolding Plame investigation, Wayne Madsen shows what a long list of CIA people and projects have been compromised by the leak. John Karl Rove Doe and John Dick Cheney Doe seem to have no idea what kind of hibernating grizzly bear theyve been jabbing at. Theyll find out now, because it just woke up. JAH]

June 25, 2004 1600 PDT (FTW) Washington, DC. Well-placed U.S. government sources have revealed that the secret grand jury, led by special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald, will soon issue explosive indictments in the criminal investigation of who leaked the name of Valerie E. Plame, a CIA clandestine agent and wife of former U.S. Ambassador Joe Wilson, to members of the media. On June 24, special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald interviewed President Bush at the White House for 70 minutes, an indication that Fitzgerald's investigation is nearing completion and that indictments may be imminent. Bush was seated with his recently-hired criminal defense attorney, Jim Sharp, during the interview.

U.S. intelligence sources have also said that Fitzgerald's investigation has gone far beyond the mere leaking of Plame's name, itself a violation of the Intelligence Identities Protection Act, but has expanded to look into the exposure of Plame's colleagues who worked under the cover of a CIA firm called Brewster, Jennings & Associates. The "brass plate" CIA proprietary had offices in Boston and Washington, DC. Active since 1994, Brewster-Jennings was instrumental in tracking the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction (WMDs) and had agents or correspondents in a number of countries including Iraq, North Korea, Belarus, Russia, South Africa, Iran, Israel, China, Pakistan, Congo (Kinshasa), India, Taiwan, Libya, Syria, Serbia, and Malaysia. By releasing Valerie Plames name, other agents' non-official covers were blown and the lives of U.S. operatives within foreign governments and businesses may have been placed in danger. Therefore, Fitzgerald's investigation has reportedly been expanded to include the issue of whether members of the staffs of President Bush and Vice President Cheney, Cheney and Bush themselves, the National Security Council, and the Departments of Defense and State, may have violated more serious espionage laws.

In July 2003, the covert operations of Plame and her Brewster-Jennings colleagues were rolled up as a result of the White House leak to columnist Robert Novak and other journalists. Observers believe the White House was retaliating for the report by Wilson that the administration was incorrect when it stated that Iraq was shopping for "yellow cake" uranium in Niger. On behalf of the CIA, Wilson visited Niger prior to the Iraq war and determined that the administration's evidence was based on erroneous information and falsified documents.

The special prosecutor has been focusing on Bush, Cheney, presidential counselor Karl Rove, Cheney's chief of staff Lewis I. ("Scooter") Libby, Cheney assistants David Wurmser and John Hannah, and National Security Council officials Elliott Abrams and Stephen Hadley.

Recently, CIA Director George Tenet and Plame's ultimate boss, Deputy Director of Operations James Pavitt, suddenly resigned within hours of one another. Intelligence sources have said the two have been cooperating with Fitzgerald's investigation of the Plame/Brewster-Jennings leak and the damage to U.S. clandestine operations which globally track the flow of WMDs.

Sensitive CIA operations that were compromised by the leak included companies, government officials, and individuals associated with the nuclear smuggling network of Pakistan's chief nuclear scientist Abdul Qadeer Khan. In addition, the identities of U.S. national and foreign agents working within the headquarters of the International Atomic Energy Agency in Vienna, North Korea's nuclear laboratory in Yongbyon, Pakistan's Kahuta uranium enrichment plant, banks and export companies in Dubai, Islamabad, Moscow, Cape Town, Tel Aviv, Liechtenstein, Cyprus, and Kiev, and Kuala Lumpur, and government agencies in Libya, Pakistan, Malaysia, and Iran were severely compromised. The CIA has reportedly given Fitzgerald highly classified details on the damage done to the CIA's WMD tracking network.

According to Department of Justice insiders, the length of Fitzgerald's 70 minute interview of Bush was significant. Only one other prosecutor's interview of a sitting president lasted as long, that of Iran-contra prosecutor Lawrence Walsh's questioning of the late Ronald Reagan. However, in that case, Walsh concluded after the interview that Reagan actually did not know what had transpired in his administration with respect to the scandal. Todays officials may not be so fortunate.

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/062504_grand_ ...
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #32
34. Fitzgerald going after *ush-Cheney but doesn't look like
he's hit upon the fact that she was exposed to stop
the uncovering of his treasonous sales of WMD.

Well, I guess they feel getting him on one treasonous act
is enough ----but it means the whole cabal from Pappy to
Cheney won't be revealed to the American Public

We have letter writing to do of our theory of why
Cheney exposed Plame -

Do we dare send it to Fitzgerald himself?
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #34
38. With the investigation widened
like it has, it undoubtedly will uncover the Cheney ties. I don't know how it can miss them. Fitzgerald probably has all we've found plus some we can't even imagine. I just find it incredibly hard to wait for the stuff to come out. If he misses what we have, it's time to push it. I wouldn't want to interfere with Fitz and inadvertantly mess him up. The trial will last for several months and we can help fill in missing parts then.

When Kerry gets elected, he still has unfinished business with the BCCI boys and the Iran/Contra bunch..funny thing, many are the same people. Maybe he'd like to tie them all up in the Plame trial which wouldn't be too much of a stretch to nail all of the perps in this one event.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:51 AM
Response to Reply #38
43. Schraby - that's what you,I, we are hoping for, but like FDR they
may not want to admit to the American people just how bad
those who are in control of the govt. now, and who have been
since 1980, are.

I've been reading a lot of stuff other DU'ers linked since 2003.
EEEEwwwww.

like this:

EXCERPT...

"Then in 1989 when the so-called Iraq Gate scandal began to break open, there were Congressional hearings about Bushonian mischief making with Saddam Hussein. But who remembers that now? Many senior Reagan-Bush people were inculpated in a scheme to illegally transfer non-conventional American weapons systems to Saddam."

"When Senator Christopher Dodd's committee attempted to subpoena Saddam Hussein, that subpoena was the only subpoena issued by the Iraq Gate investigating committee that was blocked by the Bush Regime. He was told to keep himself scarce and Saddam kept himself scarce when the Democratically controlled committee was investigating Bushonian involvement in the illicit transfer on non-conventional weapons systems to Iraq. That was when Saddam suddenly went on this holiday someplace in the Caspian Sea."

Al Martin's reference to "Saddam, Watch Out for That Soap" comes from the fact that Enemies of Bush have often died very "conveniently" at very "convenient" times.

"It should also be remembered how CIA doper George Morales supposedly slipped on a bar of soap in prison and was killed when his head hit the floor," Martin reminds his readers. "That was one day before he was due to be released -- when he was going to Washington to testify before the Kerry Committee hearing."

"So Saddam -- remember what happened to the other right wing dictators."

(remember on thread #14 the news that Saddam has had a stroke?)

http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=2


Did you read about Pappy's clean-up wars? former business partners who knew too much.

And about Wackenhut.

Things we've touched on on other threads by finding newspaper articles, but this site wrote it up before all the info was in, apparently before Clinton's admin was over.



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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:17 AM
Response to Reply #43
48. I've read those things
FDR had to walk on eggs to accomplish what he did. Now with so many people knowing what has been going on, Kerry just might be able to blow the whole thing wide open and let the chips fall where they may. That's the only thing that will put people's trust back in the government that has been missing since at least John Kennedy's death. He also needs to open all those files too. Let it all hang out and bring people to justice that are overdue.

(might clean out just a few bad republicans) :evilgrin:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #48
50. Schraby, I'm thinking
that if he tried, he wouldn't live very long.

If he's elected, he's going to be in great danger - immediately.
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hang a left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #38
92. I can't help but wonder if this thing is about to blow and that is why
Kerry plans to lay low in August.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 09:06 PM
Response to Reply #34
144. Hello! Taking a break from American Judas for a couple hours.
I've got everything organized and outlined and soon I'll have the first draft ready, hopefully either tomorrow or Tuesday. I'm posting here because this info from Madsen is definitely going in the paper. Madsen has many of the pieces of the puzzle, but doesn't make it clear to the reader that Fitzgerald is exploring Plame's connection with Khan's Nuclear Walmart.

At least that's what I read into the article from this paragraph:

Sensitive CIA operations that were compromised by the leak included companies, government officials, and individuals associated with the nuclear smuggling network of Pakistan's chief nuclear scientist Abdul Qadeer Khan. In addition, the identities of U.S. national and foreign agents working within the headquarters of the International Atomic Energy Agency in Vienna, North Korea's nuclear laboratory in Yongbyon, Pakistan's Kahuta uranium enrichment plant, banks and export companies in Dubai, Islamabad, Moscow, Cape Town, Tel Aviv, Liechtenstein, Cyprus, and Kiev, and Kuala Lumpur, and government agencies in Libya, Pakistan, Malaysia, and Iran were severely compromised. The CIA has reportedly given Fitzgerald highly classified details on the damage done to the CIA's WMD tracking network.

This tells me Fitzgerald is on the trail that will lead to the truth. This along with the news that he had Powell in for questioning two weeks ago has given me a renewed sense of hope that this investigation has LONG legs!
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #144
146. I read that too and I think
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 09:36 PM by shraby
he is definitely on target. Enough to move the tectonic plates all over the world.

Betcha he caught some relating some untruths, too.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #146
147. That's a good theory for why gathering the indictments is taking so long.
"Betcha he caught some relating some untruths, too."

I bet that when the indictments finally do come out, many of them will be charged with perjury.

Hey, do you know if dimson was under oath when he had that 70 minute talk with Fitzgerald? Could anything he said be used against him?

:bounce:
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:54 PM
Response to Reply #147
157. If I recall, he wasn't.
But that doesn't mean his testimony jibes with the other ones Fitz has.
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kohodog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #32
36. Thanks Pallas!
We'll see how this plays out. I think Fitzgerald sounds like a stand up guy...you've got to be tough to be in his shoes. I can't imagine the pressure!
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 06:57 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. Thanks Steviet, let's check it out & bring over applicable.
:hi:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #21
29. From Steviet: TIMELINE OF CORRUPTION OF AMERICA
ONE: 1701-1900
The founding of Yale University; second President John Adams almost destroys new Republic; racists attempt to destabilize Union, killing President Lincoln and others; first oil wells drilled for kerosene; populist politics weaken stranglehold of industrial trusts; railroad baron E.H. Harriman begins journey to apex of investment world.

TWO: 1900-1920
George W's ancestors: Samuel Bush, Prescott Bush Sr, and George 'Bert' Walker, intersect with E.H. Harriman's railroad empire; Texas discovers big oil; Yale in China; Teddy Roosevelt pushes progressive agenda- also forms the Bureau of Investigation; Prescott Bush lies about military service; WWI demonstrates world dependence on oil; Bushes, Walkers and Harrimans join forces, invest in war weapons; J. Edgar Hoover rises through ranks; Ku Klux Klan re-forms; American citizens embrace anti-immigrant and fascist ideologies; Halliburton incorporates; Iraq gives up the oil; race riots sweep America.

THREE: 1920-1930
WWI allies carve up Middle East; American fascist groups gain in size, popularity; Attorney General Palmer rounds up thousands of European Jews, radicals, progressives; Red Scare; Prescott Bush marries into Walker family fortune; Henry Ford publishes anti-semitic lit; Bush friends Dulles brothers legal counsel to Nazis; Republican Teapot Dome oil scandal; Bush, Walker, Harriman shipping line smuggles German agents, Nazi propaganda, money for bribing American politicians; Union Banking Corp founded by Bush, Harriman, Fritz Thyssen to manage German investment and launder Nazi money; J. Edgar Hoover heads BI; stock market, de-regulated by Republican administrations, collapses under its own corruption.

FOUR: 1931-1939
Brown Brothers, Harriman merge; Un-American Activities committee investigates US fascist groups, Nazi propaganda; Prescott Bush buys into CBS; J. Edgar Hoover manipulates press, politicians, lives the high life; Hitler enters government with legal and financial help from Dulles brothers, Bush/Harriman; after the Reichstag fire, German Constitution and all civil liberties suspended; US radio broadcasts 'Christian Fascism' hatred of Jews, Communism, unions, Roosevelt; Nazi-US commerce coordinated through Bush/Harriman bank UBC; 'deranged loner' shoots at Roosevelt; Socal, later Unocal, obtains exclusive oil concession in Saudi Arabia; Eugenics movement spreads to US; Hitler's plan to 'Germanize' America; Polish government fights Bush/Harriman, Nazi stockholders for control of Poland's largest industry- whose workforce will soon be sent from Auschwitz; young law student Richard Nixon recruited for NY law firms by Dulles brothers and first head of American intelligence Bill Donovan; US German groups boycott Jewish merchants; Congressman LBJ slides lucrative contracts to campaign financiers Brown & Root (later Halliburton); Leo Strauss' neo-con ideologies; Jewish mobsters combat anti-semites; new head of Un-American Activities Committee changes focus, compiles blacklist of liberals, anti-fascists; German-American Nazi camps in small-town America; numerous House Republians use offices to: disseminate pro-Hitler/fascist literature, visit with Nazi propagandists, publicly support Nazi regime while condemning Roosevelt; Hitler invades Poland, ending Bush/Harriman-Poland legal battle.

FIVE: 1940-1944
Britain goes to war against Germany; Roosevelt pressured to stay out of war by pro-Nazi House members; Nixon loves Cuba, United Fruit Co; Nazi Germany manipulates Republican, Democratic party platforms; Henry Ford, Charles Lindberg, Herbert Hoover, future Nixon speechwriter Patrick Buchanan, Gerald Ford, pro-Nazi Silver Shirts and Klansmen- all form America First Committee, attract over a million members; Nixon joins Navy; Brown & Root receives first military contracts; Roosevelt establishes OSS; Harriman becomes Ambassador; Prescott Bush's partner advocates terror-bombing of civilians; Pearl Harbor; 'Yale in China' an intelligence front; Congress investigates House members under pay of Nazis- lead whistle-blower dies in plane crash; Roosevelt seizes three Bush/Harriman/Nazi companies, but US allows Bush/Harriman to hold onto some of their business and/or German stock- Bush likely trading intelligence on Germany for immunity from prosecution; Hoover bails out corrupt ex-FBI Republican bagman, who later dies in plane crash; George Bush Sr uses family connections to become Navy's youngest fighter pilot; United Fruit Co oppresses Guatemala; Joe Kennedy Jr dies in plane crash.

SIX: 1945-1950
US drops the bomb on a Japan trying to surrender; Richard Nixon returns from Navy, connects with Dulles brothers; organized illegal Jewish immigration to Palestine swells Jewish population there; a 'selection committee' of Eastern bankers like Bush/Harriman, California mobsters like Mickey Cohen offer to underwrite a Nixon campaign for Congress; Hoover offers Nixon FBI resources; George Bush Sr works for Dresser Industries (later Halliburton); Truman creates CIA; Big Oil Texans court Hoover; Brown & Root builds offshore oil platforms; Nixon elected after dirtiest campaign in memory, gains national exposure in Alger Hiss trial; Republican politicos, bent on regaining White House, fuel Red Scare with FBI help; Nixon's corrupt pal Joe McCarthy hijacks HUAC for Republican gain in elections; JFK donates to Nixon's campaign, rejects Nixon because of unethical tactics; Harrimans, Bushes begin to drift apart politically and otherwise; Bohemia Grove; George Bush Sr starts oil company; Prescott Bush loses bid for Congress because of Eugenics past; Joe McCarthy big hit in Texas.

SEVEN: 1951-1959
Iran nationalizes oilfields; first Bush in politics wins a special election; Prescott Bush collects $1.5 million from Nazi bank UBC stock, money goes into trust fund; Nixon's funding scandal; Nixon uses TV to spin defense; Allen Dulles leaves Gulf Oil of Latin American, becomes director of CIA; CIA helps overthrow Iranian leader, increases covert action in Latin America; US military overthrows Latin governments hostile to United Fruit Co; B-actor Ronald Reagan an FBI informant; Eisenhower sends special-ops, CIA 'advisors' to Vietnam; Reverend Moon founds a church; US corporations, mobsters own Cuba; Prescott Bush, LBJ serve together on Senate Armed Services Committee; CBS, CIA; McCarthy discredited but 50% of Americans admire him; Howard Hughes exchanges CIA funding for business favors; Lee Harvey Oswald joins Civil Air Patrol; Bush Sr begins offshore drilling, Brown & Root builds platforms; Robert Kennedy busts Nixon's campaign strategist for bribery, attacks organized crime; Hoover spies on civilians, bets on mob horse races, morphs 'Red Scare' into 'Black Menace'; Saddam Hussein joins Ba'ath Party; Manuel Noriega, CIA asset; Texas oil funds Nixon, Johnson; Nixon expected to win '60 Presidential election; Eisenhower warns about military-industrial complex subverting government; Oswald leaves top-secret Marine post- charting U2 flights over USSR- defects to Russia.

EIGHT: 1960-1962
Howard Hughes rents islands to CIA for Cuba invasion training; George Bush Sr has drilling platforms among these islands, begins intelligence career (likely following in Prescott's footsteps) as he business travels Texas, New Orleans, Florida, the Caribbean for Zapata; FBI looks for Oswald impersonator; CIA uses mob to undermine Castro; same mobsters finance Nixon's campaign; JFK wins Presidency by thinnest margin ever, thanks to 100,000 votes delivered by Chicago mobster Sam Giancana; press exposes US plans to invade Cuba- New York Times claims 'Mr. B of the CIA' is in charge; Kennedy vows US will never invade Cuba; Bobby Kennedy publicly embarrasses J. Edgar Hoover; Bay of Pigs invasion fails; JFK fires Allen Dulles, shuts down CIA training camps; Prescott Bush commiserates with Dulles; Brown & Root wins billion dollar Vietnam contract; Kennedys further infuriate radical right-wing oilmen, Hoover, mob; FBI blackmails White House with threat of sex exploit 'leaks'; JFK plans to enforce Hoover's mandatory retirement; civil rights activists face violent social, legal, political resistance; racist Democrats flee to Republican camp; Oswald renews US citizenship, returns unharassed by US intelligence; Halliburton buys Brown & Root.

NINE: 1963- JFK Assassination
JFK negotiates with Russia; Bobby Kennedy busts hundreds of mobsters, goes after Giancana- who delivered in '60 election; Colin Powell in Vietnam; Saddam Hussein tortures individuals on CIA interrogation lists; Kennedy initiates federal investigation of oil tax breaks; televised images of US racist brutality stun world, King accuses FBI of complicity; Kennedy publicly supports civil rights, Voter Act; church bombing kills four black girls; King marches on DC; Colin Powell develops 'overwhelming force' doctrine during search and destroy missions; George Bush Sr wins Chair of Houston Republican Party; JFK gestures peace to Castro; withdraws 1000 advisors from Vietnam, plans all troops home by '65; FBI smears King; US assassinates South Vietnamese leader; JFK removes CIA's covert combat authority; Bush Sr sues Texas Governor John Connally to force new Republican district- where Bush can run unopposed; JFK assassination threat in Miami; Clint Murchison's house party on assassination eve; Kennedy killed in Dallas; TX Governor John Connally (in the middle of Bush's redistricting lawsuit) also shot, cries out, My God, theyre going to kill us all!; Oswald arrested in Howard Hughes' Texas Theater, says he's a patsy, is shot next day by Jack Ruby; Johnson appoints Warren Commission, stopping all investigations; Allen Dulles defacto head of Commission; Hoover tries to block Time magazine from crowning King 'Man of the Year.'

TEN: 1964-1969
Johnson immediately appoints Hoover 'FBI Director for Life'; Bush Sr runs campaigns against civil rights bill, for Cuban invasion; Moon opens US headquarters; Bush pushes escalation of war, nukes; Bush oil drills in Latin America, Middle East- tax evasion charges taint election prospects; Ted Kennedy runs for Senate- plane crash breaks his back, kills two; Nixon campaigns for Bush; Bobby Kennedy runs for NY Senator; Bush mounts greatest campaign spending spree ever, uses Nixon-style dirty tricks; Kennedys win, Bush loses; Warren Commission blames Oswald, no motive; LBJ signs Civil Rights Act; Klan lynches Lemuel Penn; CIA creates Gulf of Tonkin incident; more Vietnam contracts to Halliburton; massive bombing of North Vietnam; Malcom X shot; Bush wins redistricting, campaigns again unchallenged- says "I want conservatism to be sensitive," but mocks civil rights leaders, anti-war protestors; King protests Vietnam war; Eisenhower, others promote Moon; Democrats enact 'progressive tidal wave'- poverty is halved, CEO/worker wage disparity at historic low; Jerry Falwell condemns civil rights, touts segregation as "God's Order;" Republicans appeal to white working class fear, gain 47 House seats; 20-year old Bill Clinton confronts Arkansas racists; CIA experiments; Bush hires advertiser to run campaign, wins election, unprecedented appointment to influential committee; press attacks King's anti-war stance; Colin Powell protects superiors from reports of US atrocities; George W at Yale; Jim Garrison tilts at Warren Commission; DC panics as King plans massive 'poor people's march', vows to camp until legislation passed; Tet offensive exposes White House lie that US is winning war; future Fox News director Roger Ailes Nixon's media strategist; George W enters special Air National Guard unit, despite near-failing scores; Ross Perot, Howard Hughes buy Nixon; Nixon/Kissinger undermine LBJ's Vietnam peace talks before election; King is killed; Bobby Kennedy's Presidential campaign ends with his death; Pentagon Papers; Nixon tries to destroy Ellsberg; Colin Powell works for Nixon, meets mentors Frank Carlucci, Caspar Weinberger.

ELEVEN: 1970-1974
Nixon plans right-biased media; Bush receives Nixon funds but loses Senate race; George W dates Nixon's daughter; Chile nationalizes oil, banking; Nixon appoints Bush UN Ambassador; Richard Cheney Nixon's White House aide; Nixon looks to oust unstable Hoover; Kent State anti-war protestors killed; Bush's oil partner delivers cash to Nixon campaign; Saddam Hussein nationalizes oil; CIA destabilizes Chile, Iraq; Pinochet terrorizes Chile; Bush promotes escalation of Vietnam at UN; candidate George Wallace shot by 'crazy loner,' suspects Nixon; Lucianna Goldberg (later of Monica Lewinsky fame) hired by Nixon as sex spy on McGovern; Nixon sells Lincoln Bedroom overnights; Hoover found dead- buried sans autopsy, Secret Service strips house immediately, top to bottom; burglars arrested in Watergate; military begins drug testing, George W and James Bath suspended for skipping tests; just before elections, outspoken Democrat Hale Boggs disappears in plane crash; press ignores Watergate scandal, Nixon wins re-election; CIA's E. H. Hunt blackmails Nixon over Watergate until wife killed in plane crash; Nixon brags "Bush will do anything for us;" Moon uses call girls to compromise US Senators; Deep Throat warns "everybodys life is in danger;" Bush Sr charged with deflecting Watergate blame; Arab nations form OPEC; young and vocal attorney Hillary Rodham helps Judiciary Committee investigate impeachment; Moon, followers publicly support Nixon in national demonstrations; head of College Republicans, Karl Rove, helps Bush Sr paint Watergate as political witch hunt; White House tapes expose Nixon's guilt; Bush urges Nixon resignation; Gerald Ford is only VP and President to take office without being elected to either; Bush and Nixon blame Watergate on 'liberal media'; Ford pardons Nixon, immediately ending all deeper investigations into Nixon administration crimes; Nixon's fromer Treasury Secretary William Simon sets out to create a right-wing media.

TWELVE: 1975-1979
House investigates US intelligence; Church Committee focuses on CIA assassinations; CIA Director Colby "too cooperative," Donald Rumsfeld has him fired; Ford appoints Bush Sr new CIA Director; CIA obstructs, stalls investigators; Bush Sr handles guns-dope runner Noriega; mobster Sam Giancana killed shortly before testifying; Kissinger invests in West Bank; Chilean economy rebuilt on neo-con free market principles, becomes most unstable in Latin America; CIA acknowledges experiments; 'Squeaky' Fromme tries to kill President Ford; second attempt on Ford's life 17 days later; Dick Cheney now White House Chief of Staff; Saddam Hussein wins UNESCO award for raising Iraq"s literacy rate; Bin Laden construction firm one of largest in Middle East; House Select Committee on Assassinations (HSCA) re-examines JFK, King killings; Church Committee learns hundreds of journalists are CIA assets, Bush won't release names; Bush CIA buys planes from George Jr's Air Guard friend James Bath, finances through corrupt BCCI; Church Committe concludes: "the investigation of the (JFK) assassination was grossly deficient;" Ford, Bush try to bury Pike Committee report, Daniel Schorr leaks it to press; 'Koreagate,' Moon, KCIA; Bush CIA destabilizes Jamaica, tries to kill Bob Marley; Bush CIA think tank spins intelligence showing phony US weapons deficiencies; Bush Sr DUI; Carter wins Presidency, immediately removes Bush from CIA; Congress investigates Moon; gangster Santos Trafficante pleads 5th on all HSCA questions regardng JFK's asassination; George W begins oil company; four of seven Warren Commission counsels express serious doubts about WC Report; George W loses first Congressional race; Oswald benefactor and alleged 'handler' commits suicide by gunshot four hours after HCSA subpoena; former Assistant FBI Director William Sullivan dies of gunshot wound while hunting, shortly before scheduled HSCA testimony; Jimmy Carter applies sanctions against Iraq, takes Noriega off CIA payroll; Iran throws out Shah, takes American hostages; Bush Sr arranges for Iran to hold hostages until after election; Jerry Falwell, other US religious leaders file court briefs in defense of Reverend Moon.

THIRTEEN: 1980-1986
Bush loses bid for Presidential nomination; Reagan reluctantly chooses Bush- whom he doesn't like, trust- as VP; new Gov. Clinton takes on Tyson Inc, other entrenched interests; Clinton appoints African-Americans to administration, addresses institutionalized racism; Iran hostage crisis dooms Carter; Reagan wins election, hostages released minutes later; Reagan funds covert war in Central America; Noriega back on payroll; 'deranged loner' Hinckley shoots, nearly kills Reagan; Hinckley a friend of Neil and George W Bush, had been kicked out of the American Nazi party; Iraq attacks Iran; Reagan army recruiters sent primarily to ghettos; Bush Sr votes to renew chemical weapons tests; Project Democracy begins to collect funds from right-wing donors; Moon publishes ultra-right tabloid Washington Times; Bush Sr chairs task force which deregulates banking industry, leading to S&L meltdowns of late 80s- in which his sons are complicit; Moon convicted of tax fraud, sentenced to prison in CT; BinLaden, Halliburton assist Saudis in military buildup; Congress forbids US tax dollars for CIA missions; US sells bacteria, viruses, retroviruses, fungi to Iraq, China; Bush sons involved in unethical, fraudulent business ventures; Bush buys SAM missiles fom China, provides nuclear/satellite technology- sells to Iran, profits sent to Central American covert actions; Reagan launches propaganda program targeted at Americans; Moon leaves prison, Reagan embraces during White House visit; Jerry Falwell speaks at Moon-sponsored events; Noreiga accuses Oliver North of $5 million dollar rip-off; Prime Minister of Sweden shot to death shortly after rejecting Oliver North weapons deal; Iran-Contra exposed; like Nixon, Bush surrounded by Bay of Pigs-CIA assets.

FOURTEEN: 1986-1989
Independent Kuwait seized by brutal, super-rich al-Sabah family; Colin Powell sends HAWK missiles to Iran, leaving US troops in Europe without; Pat Robertson uses charity to support his diamond, lumber interests; illegal Contra aid, drugs funneled through CIA airport in Mena, AR; pilot DEA informant Barry Seal killed hours before testifying; Averell Harriman dies, wife Pamela funds Democrats; Ross Perot sent after POW's, complains of CIA gun/drug runner interference, VP Bush removes him; Nicaraguan soldiers down American cargo plane full of contra arms- only surviving crew member repeats: "George Bush", confesses he is CIA; Bush sends family attorney to facilitate his release; Republican Special Counsel appointed for Iran-Contra investigation; day before scheduled testimony, CIA Director Casey stricken during routine exam, left unable to communicate- becomes Iran-Contra scapegoat; Carlyle Investment Group formed; FCC scraps Fairness Doctrine; birth of right-wing radio; Colin Powell lies under oath; bin Laden's brother Salem, business partner of Bush Jr and friend James Bath, dies in plane crash; Pan Am 103, part of US drug sting operation, explodes over Scotland; Bush beats Dukakis in vicious racist election; CIA-backed Osama bin Laden drives Russia out of Afghanistan; Exxon Valdez spills oil, never pays $1 in fines; Prescott Bush Jr sells satellites to China; Robert Mueller heads Iran-Contra probe (later runs Bush FBI); George W cons taxpayers over Texas Rangers deal; Little Rock's Stephens Inc is largest investment bank outside Wall Street; founder Jack Stephens deals with Bush family for years, despises Clinton- who sharply curtailed corrupt influence in AR; Bush Sr pardons anti-Castro terrorist; US invades Panama, kills 3000+ civilians but avoids bombing wealthy areas where Prescott Bush has invested in luxury hotels; Bush replaces Noriega with two other drug distributers.

FIFTEEN: 1990-1991
Bush sons get minimal fines in S&L convictions, Republican party pays; Dick Cheney obstructs Nelson Mandela's release, claiming it "bad for US interests;" General Schwartzkopf runs Iraqi invasion computer war games; Kuwait siphons Iraqi oil; Iraq threatens, US assures Iraq it's not involved; Bush Jr sells Harken stocks before they drop, illegally reports four transactions; Bush Jr, Texas Rangers investors convince Arlington to bill taxpayers, fans for new Enron Stadium; then they illegally claim emminent domain, seize 270 acres around ballpark, sell to developers at large profit; media attacks Oliver Stone's JFK a year before release; Bush, Kuwait hire PR firms to sell Gulf War; Bush Sr lies to Saudis about Iraqi threat, cites phony evidence; Bush Sr calls Senator Paul Wellstone "chickenshit"; Rodney King; research report: The more TV people watch, the less they know; and the less people know the more likely they are to back Bush;" US begins heavy bombing in Iraq, loses over 400 troops; White House controls all war coverage; US massacres 10,000+ retreating Iraqis, on the 'Highways of Death'; Bush enourages Kurds, Shi'ites to rise up against Hussein; Powell advises US to not support uprising, leaves Hussein US helicoptors which are used to gas/kill thousands; Bush camp tells Clinton if he runs in '92 he'll never run for anything again; US violates int'l law by sabotaging Iraqi clean water; former US AG charges US with 19 violations of law in Gulf War actions; Saudi Arabia agrees to permanent US presence, infuriating Osama bin Laden.

SIXTEEN: 1991-1993
John Heinz (R-PA), on his way to Medicare fraud hearings, dies in freak plane crash; next day, former TX Senator John Tower, writing about his Iran-Contra experience, dies in plane crash; Condi Rice leaves Bush Srs National Security Council, joins Chevron; Carlyle Group recruits ex-Defense officials; Bush nominates Clarence Thomas to Supreme Court; Anita Hill charges him with sexual harassment, is publicly denigrated; Thomas wins; Danny Casolaro, investigative journalist, is found dead of apparent suicide in Richard Mellon Scaife's office building; CIA admits money link to BCCI; Bush Sr's top fundraisers sued for S&L fraud; Oliver Stone's JFK spurs Congressional creation of Assassination Records Review Board (ARRB); Bush Sr publicly declares Oswald only shooter, refuses to appoint members; Iran-Contra prosecutor finds flaws in Colin Powell's testimony; on Xmas eve, Bush Sr pardons all Iran-Contra figures, dissolving case against himself; Whitewater story released on eve of Democratic primaries; Rodney King cops acquitted, triggering worst race riots in US history; Defense Secretary Dick Cheney plans future 'war zones'; Robert Mueller insists Whitewater continue, Little Rock FBI head defies him, says no evidence to pursue, resigns; on eve of NH primary, Gennifer Flowers sells story of Clinton affair to tabloids; Flowers produces no evidence to prove long-term affair; audio tapes likely doctored; Jesse Helms asks Bush to pardon Pakistani drug smuggler; Bush Sr on payroll of Barrick gold mines, allowing mines on Nevada public land; judges Sentelle, Silberman (later of Monica Lewinsky fame) void convictions of Ollie North, Poindexter; Neil Bush sells Kuwaitis on Enron; Paul Wilcher sends Janet Reno documents about October Surprise, found dead in home; Bush appointee embezzles millions from Travel Office, Repubs object to firings and create 'Travelgate'; Cheney joins Halliburton, deals with terrorist nations; right-wing 'echo chamber' up and running.

SEVENTEEN: A Vast, Right-wing Conspiracy
1970's unkind to Republicans, "never another Watergate"; Clinton the murderer; the politics of personal destruction; Richard Mellon Scaife, 'Justice Jim' Thompson, indicted embezzler Judge Hale; cycle of revenge; American Enterprise Institute; right-wing philanthropy; The Heritage Foundation and the 'kitchen cabinet'; the 'liberal media'; Moon and Christians unite; The Council for National Policy; tabloidesque anti-Clinton videos; political action committees; the language of propaganda; Wednesday morning meetings; sex sells; judicial activism and the Federalist Society; Bohemia Grove; Project For a New American Century (PNAC).

EIGHTEEN: 1993-1998
Racists 'Justice Jim', Sheffield Nelson, embezzler Judge Hale target Clinton; Rush Limbaugh claims Foster murdered; Richard Scaife, American Spectator; George W elected TX Governor; veterans file Gulf War Syndrome lawsuit; Linda Tripp last to see Foster alive; Gingrich takes Congress; Paula Jones, backed by Scaife, Federalist Society, announces sex-harassment suit; Bush Sr's own RTC probe into Whitewater concludes Clintons not guilty; Commerce Secretary Ron Brown dies in plane crash while on Enron trip; TWA 800 crashes during naval missile-defense exercises; Halliburton targets Caspian Sea basin; Clinton pushes investigations into CIA drug trafficking; Unocal, Taliban talk Afghan pipeline; Clinton's omnibus terror bill reduced to uselessness by right; Jesse Helms, Trent Lott openly dismissive of terrorist threats; Ralph Reed, Gary Bauer, other religious right speak at Reverend Moon functions; Alger Hiss outlives Nixon; Bush Sr helps Reverend Moon overcome corruption charges in Argentina, launches another venture; Pat Robertson charity pilots say they fly supplies for diamond mines; Bush Jr decimates Texas' budget surplus; US Supreme Court rules in favor of twice-overturned Paula Jones suit; Clinton blocks Halliburton contracts because of recurring fraud accusations; Rumsfeld, Cheney in Project for the New American Century (PNAC) lobby for regime change in Iraq; government finally admits Gulf War Syndrome link- Bush Jr will later repeal; former sex spy for Nixon helps set up Tripp/Lewinsky; Fox News busted for falsifying news; George W's Texas Housing Dept rife with theft, fraud; 4-year CIA drug trafficking investigation reports 'no evidence,' probe staff director then commits suicide; Taliban hires former CIA director's daughter to improve image in US; Paula Jones accused of mishandling right-wing defense funds; Halliburton in Bosnia, building Bush's Enron stadium in Houston; AOL, with Colin Powell on board, pays the Drudge Report $3000 monthly to sling Republican dirt on Clintons; Drudge receives funds from the RNC and several right-wing foundations also; Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu visits first Reverend Falwell in US, then meets with President Clinton; numerous uncovered adulteries among conservative leaders get little attention from the press.

NINETEEN: 1999-2000
George W executes his 99th prisoner; hides from Dr. King Day celebrants; Halliburton, Shell, help African police shoot protestors; Republicans try to pin Chinese spy secrets on Clinton; George W's Texas record; Enron's only potential for profitability in India is trans-Afghanistan pipeline; re-opening Alger Hiss files after 50 years proves Nixon's deceit; Clinton freezes $300 million in Taliban assets as Bush Sr is courting Taliban for Carlyle Group, Unocal; John Kennedy Jr killed in plane crash; SCI, world's largest funeral conglomerate (and heavy contributors to Bush family) sued; Bush Jr perjures himself in depostition and fires the investigating team; Michael Powell of the FCC fails to recuse himself in the dubious AOL/Time-Warner merger, even though father Colin Powell sits on board, owns stock; St. Martin's Press kills release of Hatfield's Fortunate Son- book asserts Bush Jr's record for cocaine arrests expunged by Texas judge; another suicide connected to a Bush scandal; Halliburton everywhere US military goes, provides poor services- is investigated repeatedly for fraud; millennium terrorist plots at DC and LAX, Amman Radisson in Jordan, a constellation of holy sites in Israel, and USS Sullivan in Yemen are quietly foiled by Clinton administration; Election campaign 2000 begins; Bush Sr and Barbara clean up selling Global Crossing stocks right before scandal; PNAC publishes report calling for imperial America, with pre-emptive war policies, determined to let no other countries match power or dominance; NRA boasts a home in White House after election; USS Cole hit by suicide bombers; Bush ruins McCain in SC with racial, homosexual innuendo; Democrat Mel Carnahan, poised to beat John Ashcroft in MO, is killed in plane crash right before elections; Editor & Publisher magazine finds 2-1 bias in favor of George W among top press publishers, editorial decision-makers- all of whom have petitions before FCC to further de-regulate media; Enron's new enterprises with IBM, Blockbuster Video, AOL; British Ministry of Defence awards Halliburton $1/2 billion dollar contract; Bush campaign plants false stories about Gore falsehoods, position Bush Jr as honest; Bush election team plans to challenge Electoral College in projected loss to Gore; Paul Wellstone survives an assassination attempt in Columbia; Clinton spending on 'domestic terrorism security' jumps from $42 million to $1.5 billion; right before Bush-Gore debate, Arial Sharon commits Muslim sacrilege with armed troops; Clinton-Gore peace progress disappears in another intifadah; Burke's Peerage writes: "Not one Bush family member...was ever working class, middle class, or even upper middle class, ever." Gore's American bloodline includes Thomas Jefferson, Daniel Boone and Englands Edward I- best known as the king who defeated and executed Braveheart.


TWENTY: Election 2000


TWENTY-ONE: 2001, Pre-9/11
CIA briefs Condi Rice on bin Laden threat; George W suspends bin Laden investigations; FAA warns of hijackings; Moon hosts inaugural lunch- Ashcroft speaks, Billy Graham, most major televangelists in attendance; 25,000 protestors line Presidential route, hurling eggs, insults; Bush rehires felons from father's administration; average net worth of Bush cabinet ten times that of Clinton's; Senators Hart, Rudman send urgent anti-terror package to Condi Rice; Enron, others help bankrupt California by manipulating market, meet secretly with VP Cheney; Cheney mocks energy conservationism; Carlyle Group, Donald Rumsfeld meet; Judicial Watch criticizes Bush Sr Carlyle Group role; Bush camp makes Paul Wellstone a priority to beat; J. Baxter warns Ken Lay about Enron irregularities; nuclear sub USS Greenville- Repub donor at helm- sinks Japanese boat, killing nine; Prescott Bush Jr opens US-China Chamber of Commerce, assists George W with spy plane incident; US quietly increases troop strength around Caspian Sea; media targets missing Dem aide Chandra Levy, ignores dead Repub aide found under suspicious circumstances; many indications collected by NSA of possible, imminent terrorist attack; John Ashcroft stops flying commercially; anti-aircraft weapons protect Bush at G8 summit; arresting officers find discredited author of Bush Jr expose' dead by suicide; George W takes August off- receives intelliegence brief on imminent terrorist threat in America; five hundred Arab/Muslim websites crash when FBI raids ISP; in days before 9/11 abnormally high levels of put options purchased on United Air Lines, American Airlines; John O'Neill quits anti-terrorism team as State Dept blocks al Qaida investigations, becomes Security Chief at World Trade Center; on 9/10 Ashcroft refuses FBI. counterterrorism budget increases.

TWENTY-TWO: 9/11- The New Pearl Harbor


TWENTY-THREE: The New World Order
Two days after 9/11 China allowed into World Trade Organization- after fifteen years of unsuccessful attempts; those wierd airline 'put' orders; Patriot Act rammed through Congress with little review; anthrax scare; aiming at Iraq; Carlyle investors reap a series of defense windfalls; problems with the FBI; Michael Powell further de-regulates public airways; US uses news to tie Iraq to anthtrax scare, scientists debunk; Wall Street Journal reveals bin Laden connection to Bush Sr's Carlyle Group; Enron restates its earnings; dead and missing microbiologists; Halliburton gets contracts in Afghanistan and Guantanamo Bay; FBI waits 90 days to 'raid' Enron; largest US defense budget in history; US bombs Afghanistan; Lockheed and the Bushes; Paul Wellstone battles Republican Congress.

TWENTY-FOUR: The New World Order, Part II
Enron corruption exposed, other giants fall; Enron's Baxter dead by suicide week before testimony; Carlyle Group invests in communications; Daniel Pearl kidnapped; Bush uses Sasha Cohen to hawk for Beef Association; senior VP of El Paso Corp, during questioning about El Paso's finances and connection to Enron, dead of gunshot suicide; Turkmenistan, Afghanistan, Pakistan sign agreement on Afghan gas pipeline; Judicial Watch accuses Halliburton of overstating earnings by $445 million under Dick Cheney; states lose their pension to Enron; another SCI 'Funeralgate' in Florida, investigator commits suicide; how Enron/El Paso ripped off CA; Rupert Murdoch pays almost nothing in American taxes; a second panel of acoustical scientists conclude a 2nd gunman shot at the 1963 Kennedy motorcade, to a 96% degree of certainty; European press deflates White House spin on Iraq by exposing PNAC's Rebuilding Americas Defenses, which called for Iraqi invasion before Bush even took office; Wellstone votes against key components of the Bush agenda, including Homeland Security, the Iraqi invasion, ANWR oil drilling, aid to Columbia, subsidies to energy companies, etc, and advocates strenuously against many of Bush's judicial nominees; 20th anniversary of the Washington Times; Wellstone votes against war in Iraq, support for his campaign swells; right before election, Wellstone killed in a plane crash; serious problems with voting machines, inequities in general elections; Florida settles with NAACP for illegally purging tens of thousands of black voters (the names remain off the rolls for the midterm elections, as well). Carlyle Group expands to Europe, Asia.

TWENTY-FIVE: The Future Ain't What it Used to Be
The Saudi-US connection; manufacturing bombs; Carlyle Groups 36% annual rate of return wins investors' Dream Team of the Year award; Clear Channel, with George W business partner Tom Hicks at vice chair, dominates US radio market, uses its clout (and programming like Rush Limbaugh's show) to advance Bush policies; Clear Channel runs pro-war rallies, sponsored by local radio stations, that denigrate progressives and Democrats; Clear Channel gets bigger as FCC continues to de-regulate; Schwarzenegger announces plan to quietly settle Enron, El Paso lawsuits; faith-based strategies a disaster in TX; Bush Sr buys Italian cigarette company; White House admits it has created a 'Shadow Government' to take over underground in emergency, not a single Democrat is involved; WorldCom busted for fraud, then granted large Iraqi contracts; Carlyle Group buys Britain's defense research institute; Human Rights groups charge Shell, Texaco, ExxonMobile, Unocal with abetting muder, rape, intimidation in Nigeria, Burma, etc; more voter machine funny business; Halliburton profits up 40%; born-again Christians in charge of war against Islam; General Tommy Franks predicts suspension of Constitution; US government plan for market allowing traders to bet on likelihood of terror attacks, assassinations and other Middle East events- headed by Iran-Contra felon John Poindexter- nixed after public outcry, then quietly revived by private firm that helped develop it; Wal-Mart destroying American commerce singlehandedly; corporations sending jobs to India; human genome research demonstates a gene-specific weapon can be produced, PNAC calls such a weapon potentially "a politically useful tool."



With thanks to this website:
http://www.winterboy.com/dejavu.html
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:24 AM
Response to Reply #29
42. More than you ever wanted to know -
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LibertyorDeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:12 AM
Response to Reply #29
47. Holy Shit what an amazing & damning chronology.... Wow
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 01:13 AM by LibertyorDeath
Now this is why I love History.

That is an amazing summation of the "CORRUPTION OF AMERICA"

Thank You Pallas180 for Posting this.

It's worse than I thought when you see the Evil laid out like this

all the interconnectedness of it it's surreal to me.



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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:27 AM
Response to Reply #47
52. Hi LIB - yeah. surreal
I'm pretty speechless right now.

Reading and taking it all in myself and putting it up for you
guys.

whoboy.

It's bad. Really bad.

And they're doing it to the U.S. right now.

Prescott Bush and FDR.

If he had only arrested the cabal that tried the coup on him,
the tentacles wouldn't have grown - and this wouldn't be happening
to the U.S. nor all the damage pappy did to the world.

The only good thing is that there are certain guys who were on
the inside who are spilling their guts.

And who's gonna protect them? Wackenhut? hired contractors?
agents?

Ha.
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LibertyorDeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #52
70. "And they're doing it to the U.S. right now"

Yes it's all systems go for BFEE.

I was thinking about how utterly co-opted the mainstream media has become the worse I've seen in my life time it's beyond bad or biased
we are I think in the middle of some (not so stealth media psych-ops) experiment.

I think Faux is the distraction the real media arm of this group is

CNN ("The Most Trusted Name In News")

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LibertyorDeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:58 AM
Response to Reply #29
62. After re-reading this I am convinced that
Paul Wellstone was murdered.

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:09 AM
Response to Reply #62
69. what was he investigating?
what committees was he on?

what was he talking about?
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LibertyorDeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:25 AM
Response to Reply #69
73. Not sure

This may have been enough

"Wellstone votes against key components of the Bush agenda, including Homeland Security, the Iraqi invasion, ANWR oil drilling, aid to Columbia, subsidies to energy companies, etc, and advocates strenuously against many of Bush's judicial nominees; 20th anniversary of the Washington Times; Wellstone votes against war in Iraq, support for his campaign swells;"

Especially this "and advocates strenuously against many of Bush's judicial nominees"
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:55 AM
Response to Reply #73
81. nah, not enough, every democrat would be offed if that was the case.
:)
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-03-04 12:20 AM
Response to Reply #81
248. They're saving that for w's second term.
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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #69
112. From the Deja Vu website:
From Chapter 21:

Published on Tuesday, April 24, 2001 in the Madison Capital Times:
Bush Fears Tenacious, Popular Wellstone
by John Nichols
ST. PAUL- US Senator Paul Wellstone had just finished rousing a crowd of 2,000 trade unionists, farmers, environmentalists and students with a fiery condemnation of George W Bushs free trade policies, and now he had a problem. He couldnt get down the steps of the Minnesota State Capitol here to join the march protesting Bushs Free Trade Area of the Americas scheme.
Wellstone is just too popular with his constituents. He couldnt move in the face of a steady stream of men in Teamsters jackets, farm wives holding newborns, green-haired college kids and Catholic priests approaching to offer variations on the words of a steelworker who told Wellstone, I am so damn proud to be able to say youre my Senator.
Most of them also asked a question: How come Bush hates you so much?
Let there be no doubt as to the identity of George W Bushs least favorite Democratic US Senator. Its Wellstone, the rabble-rousing Progressive who represents not just Minnesota but what remains of the fighting populist spirit of the Upper Midwest.
Elected in 1990 following a grass-roots campaign in which he toured the state on a beat-up school bus, Wellstone was the #1 target in 1996 for Republicans who thought the Senator had doomed himself with a lonely vote against punitive welfare reform legislation. He won re-election with ease that year, proving to both the Republicans and to their whimpering Democratic allies that bashing the poor might not be nearly so smart a political move as Dick Morris thought.
As Wellstone prepares to seek a third term next year, it would be reasonable to assume that he might finally be in for some smooth political sailing. But reasonableness doesnt figure into the calculations of the Bush White House, where the President himself, Vice President Dick Cheney and political commissar Karl Rove practice the politics of vengeance.
The Bushies despise Wellstone, who unlike most Senate Democrats has been fighting spirited battles against the new administrations policies on everything from the environment to the tax cuts for the rich to oil drilling in Alaska to military aid for the Colombia drug-oil war boondoggle. Other Democratic senators who face re-election contests in 2002 are, according to polls, more vulnerable than Wellstone. But the Bush camp has been focusing highest-level attention on Plan Wellstone- its project to silence progressive opposition in Congress and the Senate.

Last Tuesday, as Minnesota House Majority Leader Tim Pawlenty was just hours away from announcing his intention to mount a 2002 Republican challenge to Wellstone, he got an urgent call from Rove asking him to step aside for Bushs preferred candidate, St. Paul Mayor Norm Coleman.
Then, on Wednesday morning, with just 90 minutes to go before his planned announcement, Pawlenty was driving his kids home from a dental appointment. The car phone rang, and Pawlenty found himself talking to Cheney. The vice president told Pawlenty that Bush did not want Coleman- a party-switching former Democrat who chaired the losing Bush presidential campaign in Minnesota- to face a difficult primary contest from a credible Republican.
Pawlenty finally agreed to step aside.
Minnesota is not the only state where the Bush camp is seeking to pick senators. But the level of involvement in the Wellstone race is remarkable. Coleman dropped a planned gubernatorial bid after two White House pressure sessions with Bush. And now that Coleman is leaning toward a Senate race, Bush, Cheney and Rove are pulling out all the stops to make sure they are in charge of the anti-Wellstone effort.
Even Pawlenty, as he was proclaiming himself a team player, admitted that it makes you wonder about the process and the integrity of the process.

http://www.winterboy.com/dejavu21.html

From Chapter 24:

On May 27, The Nation magazine publishes this article about Paul Wellstone and other progressives in government:

Paul Wellstone, Fighter
by JOHN NICHOLS, May 27, 2002 issue
Paul Wellstone is a hunted man. Minnesotas senior senator is not just another Democrat on White House political czar Karl Roves target list, in an election year when the Senate balance of power could be decided by the voters of a single state. Rather, getting rid of Wellstone is a passion for Rove, Dick Cheney, George W. Bush and the special-interest lobbies that fund the most sophisticated political operation ever assembled by a Presidential administration. There are people in the White House who wake up in the morning thinking about how they will defeat Paul Wellstone, a senior Republican aide confides. This one is political and personal for them.
That has made it political and personal for Wellstone. The man who decided to abandon a self-imposed two-term limit on his Senate service at least in part because of his determination to block Bushs conservative agenda wears the target with pride. At a moment when most Democrats are still trying to figure out how to challenge a popular President, the former college wrestler is leaping into the ring. Wellstone is not running for cover; he is running to deliver a message about politics in a state and a nation that he believes to be far more progressive than the readers of political tea leaves in Washington could begin to imagine.
This race is going to be a case study of whether you can maintain liberal, progressive positions and win in this country in 2002, says Wellstone as he campaigns among Laotian immigrants on a sunny spring morning in St. Paul. Were not running a race that asks people to vote for me because, as a Democrat, I will be a little more compassionate, a little better for working families and children and immigrants, than a Republican. We want to draw the lines of distinction. Im saying that there is a big difference between the America the conservatives want and the America I want. He adds, I dont want this to be just about me. This race has to be about basic questions of whether liberals and progressives can flourish in national politics. That means there is a lot more on the line than whether Paul Wellstone wins or loses.

and this:

On October 24, the Boston Globe runs this story:
Wellstone Sets Pace, Declares Support for Action on Corporate Reform
U.S.Newswire, 10/24/2002 09:39
WASHINGTON, Oct. 24 /U.S. Newswire/ -- Senator Paul Wellstone of Minnesota today became the first Member of Congress to support a pledge to work for top to bottom reform of corporations and to provide new tools for federal regulators to protect taxpayers, consumers and investors.
The 12-point pledge is being circulated to all 535 members of the Senate and the House of Representatives by Ralph Nader in an effort to build momentum for major reforms in the wake of the corporate fraud exposed at Enron, WorldCom, Tyco, Adelphi, Arthur Andersen and many other businesses.
Nader commended Senator Wellstone for endorsing the pledge and helping to launch a campaign that he predicted will bring lasting reforms which will diminish or prevent corporate crime and restore more confidence and integrity to the economic system.
It is fitting that Senator Wellstone, who has been at the forefront of the battle against corporate crime, is the charter signer of the pledge, Nader said. Senator Wellstone will be in a position to convert the reform pledges into concrete legislative action when the 108th Congress convenes in January.
The pledge calls for (1) reining in excessive executive pay; (2) strengthening corporate governance; (3) repealing the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995; (4) banning corporate criminals from receiving government contracts; (5) strengthened reforms; (6) stopping corporate tax dodgers and offshore incorporating; (7) regulating derivatives; (8) ending conflicts of interest on Wall Street; (9) expanding disclosure; (10) tracking the extent and cost of corporate crime; (11) protecting financial consumers; and (12) fostering a national discussion and public inquiry/oversight on corporate power.
The full text of the Corporate Reform Survey can be found on the Democracy Rising webpage: http://www.democracyrising.org/survey.pdf


and this:

Progressive Senator Wellstones (D-MN) popularity surges after he votes to oppose the Senate resolution authorizing George Bush to wage war in Iraq. He pulls ahead of his Republican opponent Norm Coleman - heavily supported by Bush- and moves toward a victory that will be an embarrassment to the Bush administration.

and finally this:

On October 25, Senator Paul Wellstone, Minnesota Democrat and outspoken advocate for conservation and environmental protection, is killed in a Minnesota plane crash, along with his wife Sheila, his daughter Marcia, and five others.
Wellstone, 58, had long been a champion for environmental causes and was one of the few remaining unabashed liberals in the Senate.
Locked in a hotly contested campaign race for control of the Senate, the two-term senator was scheduled to debate his opponent, Norm Coleman- hand picked and vigorously supported by President Bush as the most likely candidate to tip the Senate back to Republican control)- that evening.

Wellstones dedication to environmental issues earned him high praise from environmental and conservation groups, particularly for his work protecting public lands and clean air and clean water. Wellstone was also a strong opponent of plans to drill in the Arctic Wildlife National Refuge, and helped kill each Bush Administration move in that direction. Wellstone was also one of the only dissenting voices in Bushs demand for unconditional war powers.
Wellstone helped win federal commitments to increase resources for renewable energy efforts such as biomass, ethanol and wind power. The League of Conservation Voters had given Wellstone perfect scores of 100 on its National Environmental Scorecard in seven of the past 11 years.
Paul Wellstone was an environmental giant, fighting to protect families from toxic pollution, to keep the air we breathe safe, and to keep our lakes and rivers clean, Sierra Club Executive Director Carl Pope said in a prepared statement. In addition to his support for environmental causes, Wellstone was widely known for championing the rights of working men and women and the working poor.
The Senator was also admired for his efforts to clean up elections, make government activities more transparent to the public, and hold corporations accountable for their actions.



Former CIA and NTSB investigator Carol Carmody says shes still puzzled by the course the plane took just before it crashed. The investigators have pieced this much together from the radar records: The pilot radioed ahead for clearance to land. The plane was approaching the airport. Then, in the last few minutes the plane was in the air, it slowed down and started to turn away from the airport. Carmody says the plane was pointed away from the runway when it crashed.
We find the whole turn curious. And were going to have to look carefully at the speeds weve calculated and the distances, she said.
Carmody says the pilot did not radio in to say he was having problems during those last few minutes. Other pilots reported very light icing that day, but nothing severe or threatening. The flaps on Wellstones plane were in the normal position, unlike their positioning had the pilot been experiencing icing problems. Instruments could have failed- on the plane or at the airport. There are other possibilities, but much of the plane was reduced to ashes during the intense fire after the crash- which blazed, quite curiously, for nearly seven hours- making a precise determination that much more difficult.

Carol Carmody, while Vice Chairman of the NTSB, was also the on-the-scene NTSB member at Mel Carnahans plane crash. She is present at the Wellstone crash scene as the Chairman of the NTSB, having been promoted to that position by President George W. Her NTSB biography mentions simply Carol as: serving at the Central Intelligence Agency.

Historically, Democrats are twice as likely to die in air crashes as Republicans. Of 22 air crashes involving state and federal officials since 1970, including one ambassador (Arnold Raphael) and one cabinet official (Ron Brown), fourteen (64 percent) of the air crash victims are members of the Democratic Party and 8 (36 percent) were members of the Republican Party. If the list is limited to only elected members of Congress, the total is eight Democrats and four Republicans. Six of the fatalities occurred during election campaigns. Of those, four are Democrats and two are Republicans, and all four Democrats are in races that affect House majorities.

Sorry to stray off on a tangent. Maybe Wilson and Plame got off easy, huh?

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maryallen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #69
152. Wellstone ...
was investigating the ASBESTOS claims that gobs of people had against a subsidiary of Halliburton.

Can't remember if it was Dresser Industries or Brown & Root. Think it was Dresser. Whichever it was, Halliburton bought the company and their lawsuit liabilites.

Of course, Cheney was looking for ways to end-run the trials/payments.
Don't think it's settled yet.
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:23 AM
Response to Reply #29
85. missing in section four!!
The coup attempt by the elite industrialists on FDR, only foiled by the integrity of US Marine Corps General Smedley Butler who ratted them out rather than be the figurehead of the coup.

This is a serious omission!
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #85
90. HI GrASSWIRE. no - we have Smedley back on thread #6 or bove
it's really worth reading the threads. Some are in Word format
as above and easier to read than going through regular way.

The things we've discovered have made us numb, BUT NOT NUMB ENUF
TO STOP WRITING LETTERS TO EVERY MEDIA OUTLET, HERSH, BLOG, AND
WAXMAN AND 1/2 WAY DECENT CONGRESS CRITTERS.
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #90
142. yeah.....
....but Smedley is not included in the marvelous summary I referenced. The coup attempt absolutely needs to be included in that because that summary is going to get passed everywhere.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 07:52 PM
Response to Original message
31. WAPO- Washington holding its breath if Khan spills all about nuclear help:

Pakistan's Nuclear Hero Defended

By Jefferson Morley
washingtonpost.com Staff Writer
Tuesday, February 3, 2004; 10:18 AM


Online commentators in Pakistan are rallying to the defense of the country's leading nuclear scientists, one of whom has confessed to selling weapons technology to North Korea, Iran and Libya.



Abdul Qadeer Khan, the father of Pakistan's nuclear program, is reportedly under house arrest in connection with a U.S.-backed investigation into the lucrative black market in nuclear weapons technology. Correspondents John Lancaster and Kamran Khan (no relation to the physicist) report in today's Washington Post that Khan has signed a 12-page confession. Khan has also reportedly told investigators that Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf knew about his efforts to help North Koreas nuclear program.

The revelation will likely stoke an already intense debate. While many Pakistanis defend Khan as a national hero, others in the South Asian media see Khan, a flamboyant self-promoter, as the scapegoat of Musharraf and the permissive nonproliferation policies of the U.S. government.

The 67-year old scientist is "being held incommunicado with heavy security around his house," according to the Times of India. The paper's headline suggests that U.S. officials in Washington are not keen to hear Khan recount the story of his nuclear-related activities in the past two decades: "US, Pak dread Khan's Disclosures."

"Washington and Islamabad," says the Delhi-based daily, are "holding their breath" to see if Khan "will spill the beans about Pakistan's official complicity in the spread of nuclear weapons technology."

In Islamabad, the pro-democracy daily The Nation says Khan's detention is "bound to create a wave of puzzled resentment among a populace which has been accustomed to regard him as the father of the national nuclear programme."

"Dr Khan could not have done anything wrong or even inappropriate without the connivance or neglect of those controlling" Pakistan's nuclear program, the editors say.

Another commentator in The Nation wonders why Musharraf has been so cooperative with the U.S. effort to hold Khan accountable.

"Why it is so that the general who shows fists to the opposition in the parliament, has become so nervous that he is not prepared to face the situation and instead seems to have become a part of the international press campaign against Pakistan's nuclear programme."

Dawn, the English-language daily that often gives voice to the Pakistani establishment, reports that opposition political leaders in the country say the sacking of Khan will cause "irreparable damage to the country's integrity."

The press in India, Pakistan's South Asian nuclear rival, turns a critical eye on the U.S. role over three decades. The Times of India goes back to the early 1980s, when Pakistan, like Saddam Hussein's Iraq, was a quietly favored U.S. ally.

As correspondent Syed Saleem Shahzad notes in the Asia Times, the U.S. Congress cleared the way for Pakistan's nuclear program. In 1981 the Congress, under pressure from Ronald Reagan's White House, voted to formally exempt Pakistan from U.S. laws prohibiting aid to any non-nuclear country engaged in illegal procurement of equipment for a nuclear weapons program. The Pakistani government also won a six-year aid package from the United States worth $3.2 billion. Free from the threat of sanctions, Pakistan conducted a cold test at a small-scale nuclear reprocessing plant in 1982. From there, the so-called Islam bomb began to grow.

Pakistan proceeded to spend some $10 billion developing a nuclear arsenal, say the editors of the Times of India. The money came from Libya, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, the United Arab Emirates and the depositors of the BCCI (Bank of Credit and Commerce International), which became notorious in the early 1990s for myriad criminal activities. The bank, say the editors of the Times of India, was founded by a Pakistani and operated freely in the Persian Gulf oil enclave of Dubai. It is inconceivable, they argue, that Western intelligence agencies didn't know all about this black market.

In the early 1990s, Khan began selling his technological prowess to other parties, enabling him to amass substantial properties in Pakistan as well as building a hotel in the African city of Timbuktu, according to numerous reports.

The "fabulous" Hendrina Khan Hotel, named after Khan's Dutch wife, was one of dozens of the scientist's business undertakings investigated by Pakistani intelligence officials, according to the The Indian Express.

Rajesh Mishra, a New Dehli-based defense analyst writing for the Hindustan Times, says the danger of nuclear proliferation Pakistan poses remains "alarmingly high."

"Discoveries that some members of Pakistan's scientific community are under the influence of extreme ideologies further raise the fear of sensitive information, technology or material falling into rogue hands," he writes.

Abdul Qadeer Khan himself once said: "All western countries, including Israel, are not only the enemies of Pakistan but, in fact, of Islam.'"

The Indian daily notes that one leading Pakistani physicist Bashir-uddin Mahmood, had several meetings in August 2001 with Osama bin Laden.

The Indian editors pose some hard questions about the realities of the international nuclear black market.

"Is it possible that the scientists involved in State-managed clandestine deals overreached the arrangement of cooperation? "

"If so, was it a planned move to overlook this extended relationship?"

They answer that question with another question:

"Or was the Pakistan government unable to question the illegitimate affairs within secret arrangements that involved a scientist like Khan?"

In other words, was the United States totally clueless while a Pakistani scientist supplied nuclear technology to Iran and North Korea?
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #31
35. a kick for democracy
:kick:
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:06 AM
Response to Reply #31
66. The secret empire of Dr. Khan
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 02:09 AM by seemslikeadream
The incontrovertible truth is that Pakistan's nuclear programme in every aspect has been, and remains, under the firm and total control of its army at least since 1977; even its navy and air force have little role in it. Its clandestine nature relied on building a black market largely managed by trusted senior army (and ISI) officers and senior scientists in the nuclear establishment. Such people have undoubtedly been under a strong security and intelligence cover as much for their safety as to keep an eye on them. With a flourishing $2 billion-plus annual narcotics trade, and banks like the former Dubai-based Pakistani-owned "Outlaw Bank", the BCCI (Bank of Credit and Commerce International), and the Mehran Bank to manage the black market in narcotics, nuclear trade and tools for terrorism, there was obviously no dearth of unaccounted funds for the purpose. General Aslam Beg, the army chief in the late 1980's who controlled the nuclear programme, later publicly acknowledged receipt of hundreds of crores of unaccounted funds which he passed on to the ISI and President Ghulam Ishaq Khan.
http://www.indianexpress.com/full_story.php?content_id=...

varun
Libya got its nuke blueprints from Pakistan...

..wonder who else has the blueprints...in this black market.

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/04/politics/04NUKE.html

Warhead Blueprints Link Libya Project to Pakistan Figure
By WILLIAM J. BROAD and DAVID E. SANGER

Published: February 4, 2004

WASHINGTON, Feb. 3 Twelve days ago, a 747 aircraft chartered by the United States government landed at Dulles Airport here carrying a single piece of precious cargo: a small box containing warhead designs that American officials believe were sold to Libya by the underground network linked to Abdul Qadeer Khan, the creator of the Pakistani bomb.

The warhead designs were the first hard evidence that the secret network provided its customers with far more than just the technology to turn uranium into bomb fuel. Libyan officials have told investigators that they bought the blueprints from dealers who are part of that network, apparently for more than $50 million. Those blueprints, along with the capability to make enriched uranium, could have given the Libyans all the elements they needed to make a nuclear bomb. What the Libyans purchased, in the words of an American weapons expert who has reviewed the program in detail, was both the kitchen equipment "and the recipes."....

also...

"...The last shipment of those parts to Libya was intercepted in October, which was several years after Washington began pressuring Mr. Musharraf's government to shut down the scientists at the Khan lab...."

OCTOBER??? 2 years after Pakistan became a "frontline ally" of USA in the war against terrorism?

Something is seriously wrong here...

varun
BCCI funded Pakistan's nuclear bomb

http://www.fas.org/irp/congress/1992_rpt/bcci/05foreign...

"...the Pakistani BCCI Foundation was created as a means of sheltering BCCI profits from taxation. In 1981, it received tax-free status while Ishaq Khan was Pakistan's minister of finance. In turn, the foundation received BCCI's profits from Pakistani operations, and then used some of those profits to finance projects the Pakistani government wanted and could not pay for itself. For example, BCCI provided $10 million in grants in the late 1980's to finance an officially "private" science and technology institute named for Pakistani President Ishaq Khan, whose director, A. Qadir Khan, has been closely associated with Pakistan's efforts to build a nuclear bomb. The institute is believed by some experts to be the headquarters for Pakistan's efforts to build an Islamic bomb. In the same period, other BCCI officials were assisting Pakistanis in purchasing nuclear technologies paid for by Pakistani-front companies through BCCI-Canada.(94).."

RainDog

And Bush knew and lied about it
a few quotes...not the article you want, though.

From Outlaw Bank by Beatty and Gwynne.

They include this statement from Sheikh Kamal Adham, former head of Saudi intelligence, bro-in-law of late King Faisal, and shareholder in BCCI and First American Bank, who was speaking to an Arabic audience when admitted, in 1992, that "Pakistan had their own atomic bomb and that Abedi/BCCI had helped them get it.

...Kamal Adham was anticipating...indictment in the U.S. over BCCI fraud.

"So why would he want to call attention to all of this? The Western press aside, the wily old spy master certainly knew the intelligence agencies of the U.S. would pick up his remarks...He may have been sending a message directly to George Bush, reminding the president that Kamal Adham knew far too much to be trifled with.

in perspective...9-91. Morganthau was going after the powerful Saudi as one of the main culprits of the BCCI scandal. Morganthau kept quiet about his intentions to indict Adham AND SHEIKH KHALID BIN MAHFOUZ (in hopes to avoid state department inverventions.)

but when Kamal found out what was happening, he hired the former executive assistant of then White House Chief of Staff John Sununu...who had just (surprise...not) quit to go "private."

This publically brought the Bush administration into the BCCI scandal for the first time.

Beatty and Gwynne learned that Bush's White House was closely monitoring the BCCI investigation, insisting that a administration official sit in on congressional and justice dept. interviews with BCCI witnesses (does this sound familiar to anyone else?? ...the investigation into whistleblowing with Dubya).

some in the FBI complained the FBI probe was spinning its wheels because it was "too political" (again, sound familiar as an excuse to investigate the Bush lies to go to war with Iraq???)...and decisions were being held up in Washington.

A justice dept official complained Washington didn't really want the Atty Gen.'s office to actually return indictments. Washington (Bush) wanted to do an overall package deal, "'where we cut off the hands of a few Pakistanis and paint it as if they were really all the big folks.'"

Beatty and Gwynne go on to note that Bush Sr, lied and claimed he didn't know Adham. (who had been director of the CIA in 1976, WHEN GEORGE BUSH HEADED THE CIA).

The American agency had been "helping to modernize Saudi intelligence during Bush's tenure (oh, no conflict of interest there, huh, Zapata Oil?)

The authors also note that Bush was known as "the Saudi vice president" throughout the middle east. State dept said it was impossible for Bush not to have known Adham because he was the main man in S.A. when you making BIZ DEALS, as well as policy.

when asked about Bush's statement, Adham did not directly deny it, though Saudi's knew Adham's newphew, Sultan bin-Bandar was ambassador to the U.S. and was a frequent guest of Bush.

...but what about the nuclear weapons issue? Reagan, "intent on continuing military aid to Pakistan during the Afghanistan (mujahadeen/Osama bin Laden as Reagan's allies) war, turned a blind eye b/c U.S. law prohibited military aid or sale to nonnuclear countries known to be developing nuclear weapons.

In 88 and 89, Bush danced on the edge of truth about Pakistan, saying it did not "possess a nuclear explosive device" to justify continuing MASSIVE support for Pakistan, b/c Pak, bush said, only had "unassembled components."

As soon as Russia pulled out of Afghanistan, Bush said unassembled components violated the rules and cut off aid.

Beatty and Gwynne, in Time Magazine, were "the first to assert that BCCI was instrumental in Pakistan achieving unofficial Nuclear Club membership.

Via BCCI, Pakistan had received sophisticated American military technology that Congress NEVER AUTHORIZED. Adham's remarks re: an atmomic bomb may have been suggesting that it wouldn't be in the Bush administration's self-interest to probe too deeply into how Pakistan, and BCCI, came to possess such military capacity.

The Sheikh knew that BCCI was "the creation of a real life Dr. No, whose empire brokered ballistic missiles, illicit pharmaceuticals, stolen military secrets, heroin, and hot money, leaving a trail of corruption across two decades and seventy countries. And of all people, Adham had reason to know that the (Bush) White House knew it too, and had known about it for years."

pp 272-77

seemslikeadream
Why no trial for the world's biggest criminal?

Pardon for scientist who sold atom bomb secrets
By Ahmed Rashid in Lahore and Robin Gedye

Pakistan is likely to pardon without trial the father of the country's atomic bomb even though he has confessed to selling nuclear technology to rogue states, a senior government official told the Telegraph yesterday.

Another promised international indignation in the event of pardon. "He is the world's biggest criminal, involved for 27 years in selling nuclear technology. If you let him off with a slap on the wrist, then what kind of message are you sending to others?" he said.

Mr. Khan has let it be known that he is prepared to blow the whistle on the army's involvement. A cabinet minister revealed that Mr. Khan's daughter, a British citizen, had traveled to London with papers that could incriminate generals and other Pakistani leaders, including the former prime ministers Benazir Bhutto and Nawaz Sharif.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/20...

varun
Pakistani nuclear sicentist offers public apology...


...and gets a slap on the wrist..

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=586&e=2 ...

Pakistani Nuclear Scientist Takes the Rap for Leaks
57 minutes ago Add World - Reuters to My Yahoo!

By Mike Collett-White

ISLAMABAD (Reuters) - Top Pakistani scientist and national hero Abdul Qadeer Khan made a dramatic personal apology Wednesday for leaking atomic secrets, the latest twist in a proliferation scandal stretching from Libya to North Korea (news - web sites).

In a somber address on state television, Khan, revered at home as the father of Pakistan's nuclear bomb, absolved the government and fellow scientists of any blame in an apparent bid by all concerned to draw a line under the damaging affair.

Commentators said his confession smacked of a cover-up, possibly part of a wider agreement to spare the powerful military unwanted scrutiny in any trial and allow President Pervez Musharraf to avoid pressure from Islamists and nationalists....

seemslikeadream
Nuclear betrayal apology

But his claim to have arranged it all himself has been met with widespread skepticism.

Western diplomats said the middlemen operated in Germany, Netherlands, Malaysia and United Arab Emirates.

As a direct result of the Pakistani revelations, it was revealed yesterday a Malaysian company controlled by the son of Prime Minister Abdullah Ahmad Badawi was being investigated for possibly supplying machine parts for Libya's nuclear weapons programs.

Malaysian special branch police began the investigation after the CIA in the US and Britain's M16 informed them in November that boxes of machine parts bearing SCOPE's name were found in five containers seized in a ship off Italy in October.
http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,54...


Pakistan pardons rogue nuke scientist

Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf has pardoned a scientist who confessed to leaking nuclear weapons secrets to Iran, Libya and North Korea and says the country will not allow international supervision of its nuclear programme.

Musharraf also said Pakistan would not hand over any documents to the International Atomic Energy Agency, submit to an independent inquiry or allow the United Nations to supervise Pakistan's nuclear programme.

http://www.reuters.co.uk/newsPackageArticle.jhtml?type= ... ion=news

ElBaradei says A.Q.Khan just tip of nuclear iceberg

"Dr.Khan was not working alone," International Atomic Energy Agency chief Mohamed ElBaradei told reporters, adding he had help from people in many countries.

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/CHA530199.htm

Octafish

The bank was used to funnel petrodollars and cocaine cash and arms business monies back to where it would do the most "good" as defined by the BFEE: bribe politicos around the world, arm despots, further enrich the rich, and speed the spread of the nuclear genie. My guess is they plan to hide out in underground kommandbunkers for the bosses and its Armageddon for the rest of us.

Here's the story that ran the other day in India. The thing is full of BFEE Hall of Fame names:

The secret empire of Dr Khan

Pakistans nuclear proliferation poses a tricky challenge

JASJIT SINGH

Dr Abdul Qadeer Khan, the father of Pakistans nuclear weapons programme and the man who relentlessly pursued it through clandestine means and methods for decades, has finally admitted in a written statement that he oversaw its further clandestine spread to at least three other countries. Official Pakistan, which for years insisted that its nuclear weapons programme is tightly controlled and completely secure, is now claiming that nuclear trade has been made into a private enterprise by some of its national heroes! Extensive evidence has emerged in the public domain about detailed plans for enrichment of uranium for bomb making having been transferred from Pakistan to a number of countries along with a new version of a yellow pages directory of networks from Malaysia to Europe and North America for supply of materials and components.

What is of critical importance is not only the worlds most adventurous multinational nuclear proliferation but the reason Khan has put forward for his activities. Pakistani officials are saying that, contrary to earlier assumptions, he did not do so for money, but that he was motivated enough to make other Islamic countries nuclear powers also and reduce pressure on Pakistan. This may be an effort to garner public support from Islamic parties and countries. It also harks back to Bhuttos notion of the Islamic Bomb for its Ummah. The only exception known so far is the supply of nuclear weapon making technology to North Korea for strategic reasons in exchange for long-range ballistic missiles for nuclear weapon delivery.

Islamism has been deepening in Pakistan for three decades. Its concept of strategic depth, especially to its west, led to intervention in Afghanistan to control Kabul through covert Mujahideen operations. Strategic depth made no sense in modern conventional military terms. But in the context of Islamic jihad, as an instrument of politics by other means in Clausewitzean terms, it incorporated deadly logic, especially when the Holy Quran was invoked under General Zia ul-Haq to justify terrorism. To this has been added the strategic depth of an Islamic Bomb whose wherewithal is controlled by Pakistan. One look at the map would show that Pakistans Islamic nuclear mushroom covers the whole of West Asia with what Mansoor Ijaz terms as the North Korean-made missiles armed with a Chinese-made nuclear device assembled in Islamabads nuclear labs whose fuel came from gas centrifuges sold by Pakistans rogue Islamists. Small wonder Al-Qaeda, which received extensive support from Pakistan and its most radical surrogate, the Taliban, boasted it could make a dirty nuclear bomb.

The incontrovertible truth is that Pakistans nuclear programme in every aspect has been, and remains, under the firm and total control of its army at least since 1977; even its navy and air force have little role in it. Its clandestine nature relied on building a black market largely managed by trusted senior army (and ISI) officers and senior scientists in the nuclear establishment. Such people have undoubtedly been under a strong security and intelligence cover as much for their safety as to keep an eye on them. With a flourishing $2 billion-plus annual narcotics trade, and banks like the former Dubai-based Pakistani-owned Outlaw Bank, the BCCI (Bank of Credit and Commerce International), and the Mehran Bank to manage the black market in narcotics, nuclear trade and tools for terrorism, there was obviously no dearth of unaccounted funds for the purpose. General Aslam Beg, the army chief in late 1980s who controlled the nuclear programme, later publicly acknowledged receipt of hundreds of crores of unaccounted funds which he passed on to the ISI and President Ghulam Ishaq Khan.

CONTINUED...
http://www.indianexpress.com/full_story.php?content_id=...


"The problems of the world cannot possibly be solved by skeptics or cynics whose horizons are limited by the obvious realities. We need men who can dream of things that never were." John Fitzgerald Kennedy

Octafish

BFEE Loves Nuclear Proliferation...


... as it gives them an excuse to continue as war party. That enables the ruling elites -- thugs and commies alike -- to lord it over their populatons. And it is truly Big Business -- the biggest there is.

Pakistan investigates BCCI role in sale of nuclear knowhow

Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 06:11 PM CST

Stephen Fidler and Farhan Bokhari

The Pakistani government is examining records of the failed Bank of Credit and Commerce International in its investigation into the role Pakistani scientists may have played in selling nuclear knowhow to Iran, North Korea and Libya. According to bankers, some of whom worked with BCCI before it collapsed in 1991, Pakistani investigators have sought the help of former BCCI employees to try to uncover payments made to scientists connected with Pakistan's nuclear programme. BCCI's role in financing Pakistan's own nuclear efforts has long been the subject of scrutiny. In 1992, a report into BCCI from a US Congressional sub-committee headed by Senator John Kerry, now a leading Democratic presidential contender, said "there is good reason to conclude that BCCI did finance Pakistan's nuclear programme". Though it said the issue deserved further investigation, there was little public follow-through.

This year, however, as evidence has mounted that Pakistani scientists helped the uranium enrichment programmes of Iran, North Korea and Libya, the Pakistani government has launched an investigation. A government spokesman in Islamabad said that anybody found to have passed on secrets would be punished, but denied that the government approved any transfers. At least 11 Pakistani scientists and officials - as well as the so-called father of the Pakistani nuclear bomb, Abdul Qadeer Khan - have been questioned.

BCCI helped the Pakistani government under General Zia ul Haq, the military dictator killed in a 1988 plane crash, to channel payments from the US Central Intelligence Agency to fighters seeking to oust Soviet troops from Afghanistan. Soviet troops withdrew in 1989 but former BCCI officials said the relationship for organising undocumented payments for influential Pakistanis continued until the bank's collapse. One former BCCI banker who said he organised funds transfers on behalf of senior military officers in the Zia regime commented: "I'm not surprised that the Pakistanis are now looking to put together dossiers on some of their scientists receiving payments through BCCI." He said that over the past two months, Pakistani officials had travelled to the Middle East, looking for evidence of nuclear scientists receiving payments through BCCI.

Another former BCCI banker said that establishing payments to Pakistani nuclear scientists through the bank could provide evidence about the so far undocumented role of senior former Pakistani military officers in overseeing the transfer of nuclear knowhow to other countries. The investigation has prompted speculation among western intelligence officials and diplomats over the extent to which General Zia, leader of a frontline anti-communist state, in fact sanctioned the transfer of nuclear knowhow to Iran. In the past four to eight weeks, he said the Pakistani investigators have been seeking evidence of payments made to Mohammad Farooq, one of the nuclear scientists at the centre of the investigation. Pakistani officials are said to have focused on Mr Farooq as a possible contact between the Iranians and Mr Khan.

Continued to source (with loads o' links-n-stuff Pakistani nuclear)...FT archives require $...blm warned me...
http://www.pakistan-facts.com/index.php?topic=wmd-proli...


BCCI and Pakistani Nuclear Hero
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

:hi: everybody

ps

If this planet blows to pieces this year, thank Khan Labs' and Bush

You may never have heard of Khan Laboratories, but if this planet blows to pieces this year, it will be thanks to Khan Labs' creating nuclear warheads for Pakistan's military. Because investigators had been tracking the funding for this so-called "Islamic Bomb" back to Saudi Arabia, under Bush security restrictions, the inquiry was stymied. (The restrictions were lifted, the agent told me without a hint of dark humor, on September 11.)

Noam Chomsky, who read the story on page one of the Times of India, has wondered, "Why wasn't it all over US papers?

.. A top-level CIA operative who spoke with us on condition of strictest anonymity said that, after Bush took office, "There was a major policy shift" at the National Security Agency. Investigators were ordered to "back off" from any inquiries into Saudi Arabian financing of terror networks, especially if they touched on Saudi royals and their retainers. That put the Bin Ladens, a family worth a reported $12 billion and a virtual arm of the Saudi royal household, off limits for investigation.

I probed our CIA contact for specifics of investigations that were hampered by orders to back off of the Saudis. He told us that Khan Laboratories investigation had been effectively put on hold.

http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=312&row=0
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #66
72. Hi DREAM. Thanks- we have Khan connected to
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 02:21 AM by Pallas180
SCOMI and SCOMI connected to Cheney. Components. Remember the quote about components? Halliburton sold dual use components that
could be used for drilling or for triggering a nuke.

duh -

Google is a wonderful thing.

check out our thread 13 and 14...

we have Khan connected to Pappy
and Cheney as Khan's suppliers. pappy when in office, cheney as
Halliburton.

The responsible parties sit in the White House Dream.

They believed in selling everybody - proliferation (illegal blackmarket making money that went straight into Swiss numbered accounts) - stalemates would be formed.

They didn't count on people who think 72 virgins are waiting for them after they are atomized.

Plame was in the non-proliferation group. Job was to find black marketers and stop proliferation of WMD

Our theory is she got onto the illegal selling of components for nukes by our very own thugs.

Therefore they exposed her to stop her investigation.

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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:47 AM
Response to Reply #66
77. Who interfered with John Kerry's
investigation of BCCI...I can't find it but I think I saw it.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:53 AM
Response to Reply #77
80. Scraby - subpoenaed Saddamm didn't show and doper
ci Morales in prison "slipped in the shower and died" the day
before he was going to testify before Kerry's commission.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:48 PM
Response to Original message
37. SIBEL EDMONDS -Must Read -only known interview with Baltimore Chronicle
"The most significant information that we were receiving did not come from counter-terrorism investigations, and I want to emphasize this. It came from counter-intelligence, and certain criminal investigations, and issues that have to do with money laundering operations."

--Sibel Edmonds, former FBI translator

"If they were to do real investigations we would see several significant high level criminal prosecutions in this country. And that is something that they are not going to let out. And, believe me; they will do everything to cover this up."

-Sibel Edmonds, former FBI translator


INTERVIEW:
Former FBI Translator Sibel Edmonds Calls Current 9/11 Investigation Inadequate by Jim Hogue


INTRODUCTION: Sibel Edmonds and Behrooz Sarshar, beginning in December of 2001, began filing reports to their superiors at the FBI. These reports could lead to the collapse of a corrupt power structure that has a stranglehold on the very institutions that are obligated to control it. We cannot excuse these institutions, for while they fiddle, they pass death sentences on their own troops, and on the people of Afghanistan and Iraq.
On April 30th, Sibel Edmonds was my guest for 50 minutes on WGDR radio. What follows is an edited transcript of the interview. The editing is for the sake of a more readable piece.

Sibel Edmonds is a former FBI translator. She blew the whistle on the cover-up of intelligence that names some of the culprits who orchestrated the 9/11 attacks. These culprits are protected by the Justice Department, the State Department, the FBI, the White House and the Senate Judiciary Committee. They are foreign nationals and Americans. Ms. Edmonds is under two gag orders that forbid her to testify in court or mention the names of the people or the countries involved.


THE INTERVIEW
JH: The people who have so far been interviewed on this program have all been authors and researchers, and here we have someone who, for the most part, has first-hand information. Ladies and Gentlemen, your guest is Sibel Edmonds, formerly of the FBI, a translator who joined the FBI shortly after 9/11.
Ms. Edmonds, what I'll do is invite you to tell us whatever you would like--your stint with the FBI--and what the brouhaha with Ashcroft and company is all about.

SE: I started working for the Bureau immediately after 9/11 and I was performing translations for several languages: Farsi, Turkish, and Azerbaijani. And I do have top-secret clearance. And after I started working for the Bureau, most of my translation duties included translations of documents and investigations that actually started way before 9/11. And certain documents were being sent that needed to be re-translated for various reasons, and of course certain documents had to be translated for the first time due to the backlog.

During my work there I came across some very significant issues that I started reporting in December of 2001 to the mid-level management within the FBI. They said to basically leave it alone, because if they were to get into those issues it would end up being a can of worms. And after I didn't see any response from this mid-level bureaucratic management I took it to higher levels all the way up to Dale Watson and Director Mueller. And, again, I was asked not to take this any further and just let it be. And if I didn't do that they would retaliate against me.

At that point, which would be around February 2002, they came and they confiscated my computer, because, they said, they were suspecting that I was communicating with certain Senate members and taking this issue outside the Bureau. And, at that point, I was not. They did not find anything in my computer after they confiscated it. And they asked me to take a polygraph as to the allegations and reports I'd made. I volunteered and I took the polygraph and passed it without a glitch. They have already confirmed this publicly.

In March 2002 I took this issue to the Senate Judiciary Committee and also I filed it with the Department of Justice Inspector General's office. And as per the Senate Judiciary Committee's request the IG started an expedited investigation on these serious issues; and they promised the Senate Judiciary Committee that their report for these investigations would be out by fall 2002 latest. And here we are in April 2004 and this report is not being made public, and they are citing "state privilege" and "national security" for not making this report public.

Three weeks after I went to the Senate Judiciary Committee the Bureau terminated my contract, and they cited "government's convenience." I started working with the Senate Judiciary Committee that was investigating this case, and I appeared before the Inspector General's office for their investigation several times, and I also requested documents regarding these reports under the Freedom of Information Act; and they blocked this by citing again the "state secret privilege" and "national security" refusing to make these documents public.

On October 18th 2002 Attorney General Ashcroft came out personally, in public, asserted this rare "state secret privilege" on everything that had to do with my case. And they cited "diplomatic relations" and certain "foreign relations" that would be "at stake" if I were to take this issue and make it public. And, since then, this has been acting as a gag on my case.

I testified before the <9/11> commission on February 11th 2004, and as I said, I have been waiting for this report that they have been blocking for a year and a half from becoming public. The information I requested under the Freedom of Information Act has been blocked for two years. And I have been campaigning for the past three months trying to get the Senate Judiciary Committee that has the oversight authority and responsibility to start its own public hearings. However, this request is again being blocked. Now they are citing this upcoming election as reason. And here I am.


JH: And it is the Attorney General who is blocking your testimony.

SE: Senator Leahy, on April 8, 2004, sent a very strong letter to Attorney General Ashcroft, citing my case stating that he, Senator Leahy, has been asking questions, and has a lot of issues that have not been addressed, and asking AG Ashcroft to come and provide answers. And AG Ashcroft for the past two years has refused. So he is calling for a public hearing. However, Senator Hatch, who is the Republican Chairman of the Senate, has been a road block. And Senator Grassley went on the record with New York Observer's Gail Sheehy and said that Senator Hatch is blocking this investigation from taking place and for this public hearing to be held by the Senate Judiciary Committee.


JH: So Hatch has the power to keep Leahy and Grassley....

SE: Correct. And now it is becoming a partisan issue. However, I keep reminding them that this issue is not a new issue that has come out for this election. This issue has been in the courts for two years and two months now.


JH: I've watched Hatch perform since the Contra Hearings in the mid 1980s, and I can assure you that for Hatch, everything is a partisan issue. You have a tough one.

SE: We have to remind the people: Congress has the constitutional obligation and public responsibility to oversee these issues and the Department of Justice's operations. That's why they are elected. That's why they are there. That's what they are getting paid for.


JH: Do you think that Leahy and Grassley are going to try to plow ahead with this, or do you think that there is a back door deal with Hatch?

SE: Well....as far as I see, Senator Leahy has been trying, and it's a strong letter that he issued a few weeks ago.

However, I'm very disappointed with Senator Grassley's office and his staff members. They initially were very supportive. But what I am getting from their office every time I call is, "Well this issue is under the Inspector General," and that their hands are tied. And then I press further and ask, "Well, what do you mean, 'our hands are tied'? Who's tying your hands? Untie it. Let's get it untied." They don't have any response. They say, "Well, this issue is very complex, and as you know, it is being investigated." And I'm not seeing any issue being investigated. What I'm seeing is that this issue is being covered up, and relentlessly being covered up, in consideration of "state privilege," which people are calling "the neutron bomb of all privilege."


JH: I can assure you that there are probably thirty issues just like yours that are being covered up. And they are allowing reporters, writers, internet contributors, and journalists from around the world to do these investigations, because they know that most Americans will never hear any of that. But as soon as someone like yourself gets too close to actually finding out who did anything, "state privilege" or something....

SE: "National security" as a classification.


JH: Why that makes us more secure, to let the people guilty of 9/11 run around free is, of course, the question that no one is willing to deal with.

I have a question having to do with "mid-level" management at the FBI. Why do you think that mid-level FBI management would care enough to stop you from doing your job?

SE: This was mainly for the reason of accountability. As you know, and as the chairman for the 9/11 Commission answered during Tim Russert's show: to this day, not a single person has been held accountable. And certain issues, yes, they were due to a certain level of incompetence. But there were certain other issues--you know they keep talking about this "wall," and not having communication. I beg to differ on that, because there are certain instances where the Bureau is being asked by the State Department not to pursue certain investigations or certain people or certain targets of an investigation--simply citing "diplomatic relations." And what happens is, instead of targeting those people who are directly related to these illegal terrorist activities, they just let them walk free.


JH: And they interrogate people who are trying to make voting safe.

SE: And that is hypocritical. I see people detained for simple INS violations. On the other hand I have seen several, several top targets for these investigations of these terrorist activities that were allowed to leave the country--I'm not talking about weeks, I'm talking about months after 9/11.


JH: And there were four major FBI investigations, not counting yours, that were squelched in Phoenix, Minneapolis, Chicago and New York.

SE: Correct.


JH: And yours was even outside of that.

SE: Correct.


JH: So, obviously, we have mid-level FBI people who have been told something. It was the mid-level FBI people who knew enough to squelch many of these investigations before they went further. So how did they know to do that? Can all of them have been incompetent?

SE: No. Absolutely not.


JH: So they got the word down from Mueller, probably.

SE: I cannot confirm that for sure, but I can tell you that there is so much involvement, that if they did let this information out, and if they were to hold real investigations--I'm not talking about this semi-investigation they're holding under this "Joint Inquiry"--the pure show of the 9/11 Commission that has been getting the mass media's attention. If they were to do real investigations we would see several significant high level criminal prosecutions in this country. And that is something that they are not going to let out. And, believe me; they will do everything to cover this up. And I am appalled. I am really surprised. I'm taken back by seeing the mass media's reaction to this. They are the window to our government's operation and what are they doing?


JH: We've been screaming about it for a long time. And it goes on.

SE: And you see many people just turning away from these channels of mass media, and they're just turning in to alternative providers, because they just see what's happening.


JH: I have another question: when the gag order was written, it had to do with "diplomatic relations." Right?

SE: That is what Attorney General Ashcroft cited.


JH: Are you allowed to say that it's the Saudis?

SE: I cannot name any country. And I would emphasize that it's plural. I understand the Saudis have been named because fifteen of the nineteen hijackers were from Saudi Arabia. However, the names of people from other countries, and semi-legit organizations from other countries, to this day, have not been made public.


JH: And the information that you have been gagged on has to do with that specifically.

SE: Correct. And specifically with that and their ties to people here in this country today.


JH: I understand why you can't say anything about this, but there are several books out about the Bush ties to the Saudis and the bin Ladens in particular. And in David Griffin's book, The New Pearl Harbor, there is a very good synopsis of the ISI, which is the Pakistani intelligence service. He shows the direct connections between the CIA, the ISI, and Mohamed Atta. He makes a very convincing case that the Pakistani ISI had been helping to plan 9/11 for a long time.

I don't imagine that you are allowed to say much about that.

SE: You are correct. But I can tell you that the issue, on one side, boils down to money--a lot of money. And it boils down to people and their connections with this money, and that's the portion that, even with this book, has not been mentioned to this day. Because then it starts touching some people in high places.


JH: Can you explain more about what money you are talking about?

"The most significant information that we were receiving did not come from counter-terrorism investigations, and I want to emphasize this. It came from counter-intelligence, and certain criminal investigations, and issues that have to do with money laundering operations."

--Sibel Edmonds, former FBI translator

SE: The most significant information that we were receiving did not come from counter-terrorism investigations, and I want to emphasize this. It came from counter-intelligence, and certain criminal investigations, and issues that have to do with money laundering operations.

You get to a point where it gets very complex, where you have money laundering activities, drug related activities, and terrorist support activities converging at certain points and becoming one. In certain points - and they are separating those portions from just the terrorist activities. And, as I said, they are citing "foreign relations" which is not the case, because we are not talking about only governmental levels. And I keep underlining semi-legit organizations and following the money. When you do that the picture gets grim. It gets really ugly.


....JH: Let me read you a short quote from Dr. Griffin's book, quoting from War and Globalization: The Truth Behind September 11 by Michel Chossudovsky and ask you to comment on it. "...The transfer of money to Atta <$325,000>, in conjunction with the presence of the ISI chief in Washington during the week, the missing link behind 9/11....The evidence confirms that al-Qaeda is supported by Pakistan's ISI (and it is amply documented that) the ISI owes its existence to the CIA."

SE: I cannot comment on that. But I can tell that once, and if, and when this issue gets to be, under real terms, investigated, you will be seeing certain people that we know from this country standing trial; and they will be prosecuted criminally.


JH: Here's a question that you might be able to answer: What is al-Qaeda?

SE: This is a very interesting and complex question. When you think of al-Qaeda, you are not thinking of al-Qaeda in terms of one particular country, or one particular organization. You are looking at this massive movement that stretches to tens and tens of countries. And it involves a lot of sub-organizations and sub-sub-organizations and branches and it's extremely complicated. So to just narrow it down and say al-Qaeda and the Saudis, or to say it's what they had at the camp in Afghanistan, is extremely misleading. And we don't hear the extent of the penetration that this organization and the sub-organizations have throughout the world, throughout their networks and throughout their various activities. It's extremely sophisticated. And then you involve a significant amount of money into this equation. Then things start getting a lot of overlap-- money laundering, and drugs and terrorist activities and their support networks converging in several points. That's what I'm trying to convey without being too specific. And this money travels. And you start trying to go to the root of it and it's getting into somebody's political campaign, and somebody's lobbying. And people don't want to be traced back to this money.


JH: I guess not. This leads me to think of a beef I have with Seymour Hersh that I'd like to bring up with you? Do you know who he is?

SE: Yes.


JH: He seems to presume that the U.S. Intelligence Services want to collect the kind of intelligence that you have been gagged from repeating. I have suggested to him in a letter that there is an alternative to incompetence as to why intelligence doesn't get through to where it is supposed to go. But he's not interested. He doesn't seem to want to take that step.

SE: Not many people are willing to do that.


JH: But there are a lot of people who have laid out the road map.

SE: But people and your listeners have to go further than that. I understand this administration and their anti-transparency, anti-accountability and their corrupt attitudes. But that aside, we are not made of only one branch of government. We are supposed to have a system of checks and balances. And I am saying, how about the other two branches? And putting the pressure on our representatives in the Senate and the Congress, and the court system. They should be counter-acting this corruption, but they are sitting there silent. And they are just an audience, just watching it happen. Senators Leahy and Grassley and Hatch have the obligation to do that. It's not that they can choose not to do it. They don't have that luxury. This needs to be demanded of them. People need to pick up their phones. They need to write to these people and say, "You'd better fulfill your responsibilities."


JH: And you know what Senator Leahy is going to do? He's going to forward his letter, his Senate testimony, on to us to prove how hard he is working.

SE: I saw a reporter the other day who had just spoken to Senator Leahy. And Senator Leahy said that, well...he doesn't know what the next step will be. And it came to the issue of the hearing, and investigating this case, and he basically ended the conversation. And I think that with a little more pressure from us, from you and from your listeners, we can change that.


JH: Some folks up here think of him as Saint Patrick, I'm afraid. Be that as it may, are you aware of the on-line news service, TRUTHOUT?

SE: I've heard of it.


JH: There is an article in the April sixth TRUTHOUT by Paul Sperry from WorldNet Daily about you and one of your colleagues...

SE: Mr. Sarshar?


JH: Behrooz Sarshar.

SE: He is another translator who worked in the same department as I did. Mr. Sarshar wanted to make this information public, however he just wanted to go to the Senate Judiciary Committee and receive their support and protection under the whistleblower protection act. And I facilitated this meeting, and several 9/11 family members and I took Mr. Sarshar to the Senate Judiciary Committee meeting in Senator Grassley's office. Mr. Sarshar provided them with detailed information, however, to this day Senator Grassley has not acted upon that, and he passed the buck to the 9/11 Commission. Next we arranged for a briefing between the 9/11 Commission and Mr. Sarshar, and he went there on February 12th, 2004 and he provided the investigators for the 9/11 Commission, for almost three hours with all the details of the investigation that had to do with the 9/11 terrorist attack. He gave them the names of certain assets used by the Bureau for at least twelve years. He gave them contact information for certain agents who were aware of these issues. And they, themselves, wanted to come and talk about it, but they needed certain protection. Mr. Sarshar provided them with all this information and where to look for these documents etc. and, to this day, the Senate Judiciary Committee and the 9/11 Commission have been passing this buck back and forth.

So, all this information has been sitting in front of them. They have not called any of those witnesses introduced by Mr. Sarshar to them. And during the 9/11 Commission hearing with Director Mueller, none of these questions were asked. In fact they did not have any questions for Director Mueller, and they left it at that And "behind closed doors" has become a black hole for me because I have been in these closed door sessions so many times within the Senate, within the Inspector General's office, within the 9/11 Commission. And whatever information you are providing them behind these closed doors, you know for sure that that information will stay there and will never get out.

That is why we are demanding to have public hearings with the Senate Judiciary Committee on the Senate floor and open to the public.


JH: Do you think the Ellen Mariani case will help any of this?

SE: I have read about her case. But there is another lawsuit: the Motley Rice legal firm that is representing over a thousand family members. They sent me a subpoena to provide them with a deposition. And one day before that deposition took place, the government attorneys intervened and asked the court for a hearing and they quashed this subpoena request. They sent eight heavyweight attorneys from the Department of Justice, and Mr. Ashcroft's right hand. And basically put on this show in front of the judge, saying, "Sibel Edmonds, if you were to provide this information, our national security and our state secret privilege and our foreign relations will be destroyed. Therefore, Your Honor, we want you to quash this subpoena." Motley Rice told the judge that they wanted to ask for information that has already been made public. The government maintained that even though the information was public, it was still classified. And Judge Walton granted their request.


JH: There is some hope coming from statements made by former FBI counterintelligence agent I.C.Smith who thinks that 9/11 would have been stopped, had the FBI been allowed to do its job. He is strongly critical of FBI assistant director Dale Watson.

Do you believe that 9/11 could have been stopped if information like yours had been properly handled?

SE: At the very least, as early as May/June 2001, we could have issued a red code alert to the public, and we would have issued this very urgent warning system, which would, in return, have increased our Airport and INS security. Could we have prevented in 100% certainty? I don't think anything is that certain. However, we would have had a very, very good chance for preventing it. And agent Smith and I, we crossed the same person, because my case has to do with Dale Watson too.


JH: The trouble is: once you make this information public, you mess up the plan. And if one of the investigations from Phoenix, Chicago, New York, or Minneapolis had been followed through, let alone all four, it would have burst the bubble.

SE: Look, Jim, they had those four pieces you mentioned, and far more than that, believe me, far more than that. And that has not been made public. And for them to say that we did not have any specific information is just outrageous. Because what were they waiting for? An affidavit signed by bin Laden?


JH: "Hey Dumb Ass! Coming 9/11!" So their statement that they didn't have the information is outrageous.

SE: And they have been backing off from that. About two weeks before Condoleezza Rice appeared before the 9/11 Commission she made the statement, "We had no specific information." And I told the press that that was an outrageous lie. That was printed on the front page of The Independent and several other papers here. And what she did during the hearing was very interesting. She corrected herself saying, "Well, I made a mistake. I should not have said 'we.' I should say that I personally did not have specific information." And that is exactly what I stated. "We" includes the FBI, and therefore I can tell you with 100% certainty that that is an outrageous lie.

Yet the Commission didn't ask, "Well, who is the rest of this 'we'?"


JH: They don't want to know.

SE: No, they don't want to know. This is the heart of it. The attitude of the Senate members has been "See no evil. Hear no evil. Just let it go." And you can't let that happen. The only people I have seen who have been truly pushing for the truth are the family members. All they have asked for are three things. They want the truth, the facts, the real facts, the straightforward truth. They want accountability. And they want us to improve our security. That's it. They have no other agenda. And now they're smearing their names.


JH: They'll never run out of people to smear. Everybody who talks gets smeared.

SE: I have been given a warning that my turn is coming. I have been waiting for this for two years and two months, Jim. And they have not done it to this day, and they have not even denied anything. But I have been told to expect something to occur soon.


JH: Well, they have to figure out the angle.




CALLER: But, of course, you are trying to spoil our American Dream. We want to dream in peace! What are you doing? Let us sleep!

JH: That's it. That's what they're up to.

CALLER: The depth of that psychology is incredible. It goes from A to Z through our life cycle. It's so disempowering. It's so depressing. Well, thank you for being lunatics out there who are trying to get yourselves shot.

JH: That's okay. Anytime. Just for you. Bye bye.

SE: Even from people from whom I've been receiving support, so many times you run across people who say, "Yeah, it's terrible. I understand. And it's very courageous what you are doing." But you know how this thing is. It's a boat you can't rock. And that is what is allowing these people to take everything this far. We need to stop saying we can't rock this boat when it needs to be rocked. Listen, we pay for this boat. We elect this boat. It's our money that maintains this boat. And we are the ultimate boss here. If this boat or some section of it needs rocking, you bet we have the right and we have the power to do it. And we have the power to demand it. Otherwise we are making ourselves powerless.

JH: And if we don't do it, we don't deserve it.

SE: Correct.


2nd CALLER:

SE: I don't have direct knowledge of it. And I have been trying to stay within what exactly I know--the exact truth--not the conspiracy theories--no exaggerations--everything that I know, that I came across that is well documented where I can say, "Pull out this document; pull out this evidence. Make this document public; make that document public."

However, I have been working with other people who have been trying to address other aspects of this issue.

2nd CALLER: The issue of whether or not they new it was going to happen becomes somewhat moot when you look at the air force stand down. They new it was going to happen. Well, who did it then? There was a show on TUC
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:19 AM
Response to Reply #37
40. The info from Sibel Edmonds
sounds like it ties into what we're working on, too. Wouldn't it be nice if that gets uncovered in the Plame trials? Damn.. Fitzgerald get your butt in gear!
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:59 AM
Response to Reply #40
45. Schraby - I guess we ought to help him get his butt in gear,
anonymously....letters, letters, letters....

but wear rubber gloves when picking up the paper and mailing. :)
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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #45
117. Has anyone tried to contact Sibel Edmonds?
Send her the Waterman Paper and links to these threads?

I'd love to get her perspective!
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TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:08 AM
Response to Original message
39. An Italian in Niger.
Well, not exactly in Niger (or Algiers).

At this DU thread, lockdown picks up part of the linked article for those of us without connectability.

------------------

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

lockdown (53 posts) Sat Jul-31-04 10:16 PM
Response to Original message
1. No subscription but I get the full article..

probably because my IP is in the UK. Four paragraphs pretty much cover it:

The middleman, an Italian who uses the name Giacomo, is a small-time tipster said to have worked for Italy?s armed forces and intelligence services. He says Sismi, the Italian foreign intelligence service, used him to disseminate fake documents purporting to show Saddam had tried to buy uranium for nuclear bombs from Niger.

"I received a call from a former colleague in Sismi," Giacomo said. "I was told a woman in the Niger embassy in Rome had a gift for me. I met her and she gave me documents. Sismi wanted me to pass on the documents but they didn't want anyone to know they had been involved."

He came into possession of a bundle of telexes, letters and contracts that appeared to show Saddam had struck a deal with Niger for 500 tons of uranium ore, enough when refined to make several weapons.

Giacomo said he regretted the hoax but had believed the documents were genuine when he passed them to intelligence contacts and a journalist. The hoax had far-reaching effects. Presenting his dossier on Iraq's weapons in September 2002, Blair accused Saddam of seeking "significant quantities of uranium from Africa".


It also goes on to say the British Government and MI6 claim "independent evidence" of the Niger connection. Ha.


--------------------


I concur with lockdown's assessment: Ha.


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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #39
41. I have read this someplace else
don't remember where tho. Interesting the info was at the Niger Embassy in Rome though. Wonder how it got there?
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:57 AM
Response to Reply #39
44. Hi Tactical...thanks for solving the mystery. Or is it convenient Giacomo
shows up?

On these threads, in addition to Plame, we've been working on stuff
that has been done by other DU'ers a couple of years ago and is archived, but which some of us are just discovering.

Some of it, like the next post on the "agency" is just beyond the pale.

We have a criminal government and have for most of the last century.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:07 AM
Response to Reply #44
46. Tony Soprano Is Us:
A Timeline of CIA Atrocities

By Steve Kangas

The following timeline describes just a few of the hundreds of atrocities and crimes committed by the CIA. (1)

CIA operations follow the same recurring script. First, American business interests abroad are threatened by a popular or democratically elected leader. The people support their leader because he intends to conduct land reform, strengthen unions, redistribute wealth, nationalize foreign-owned industry, and regulate business to protect workers, consumers and the environment.

So, on behalf of American business, and often with their help, the CIA mobilizes the opposition. First it identifies right-wing groups within the country (usually the military), and offers them a deal: "We'll put you in power if you maintain a favorable business climate for us."

The Agency then hires, trains and works with them to overthrow the existing government (usually a democracy). It uses every trick in the book: propaganda, stuffed ballot boxes, purchased elections, extortion, blackmail, sexual intrigue, false stories about opponents in the local media, infiltration and disruption of opposing political parties, kidnapping, beating, torture, intimidation, economic sabotage, death squads and even assassination. These efforts culminate in a military coup, which installs a right-wing dictator. The CIA trains the dictators security apparatus to crack down on the traditional enemies of big business, using interrogation, torture and murder. The victims are said to be "communists," but almost always they are just peasants, liberals, moderates, labor union leaders, political opponents and advocates of free speech and democracy. Widespread human rights abuses follow.

(Uhmmm. It's beginning to look like to me we've not only been G-8'd but we've been cia'd.

This scenario has been repeated so many times that the CIA actually teaches it in a special school, the notorious "School of the Americas." (It opened in Panama but later moved to Fort Benning, Georgia.) Critics have nicknamed it the "School of the Dictators" and "School of the Assassins." Here, the CIA trains Latin American military officers how to conduct coups, including the use of interrogation, torture and murder.

The Association for Responsible Dissent estimates that by 1987, 6 million people had died as a result of CIA covert operations. (2) Former State Department official William Blum correctly calls this an "American Holocaust."

The CIA justifies these actions as part of its war against communism. But most coups do not involve a communist threat. Unlucky nations are targeted for a wide variety of reasons: not only threats to American business interests abroad, but also liberal or even moderate social reforms, political instability, the unwillingness of a leader to carry out Washingtons dictates, and declarations of neutrality in the Cold War. Indeed, nothing has infuriated CIA Directors quite like a nations desire to stay out of the Cold War.

The ironic thing about all this intervention is that it frequently fails to achieve American objectives. Often the newly installed dictator grows comfortable with the security apparatus the CIA has built for him. He becomes an expert at running a police state. And because the dictator knows he cannot be overthrown, he becomes independent and defiant of Washington's will. The CIA then finds it cannot overthrow him, because the police and military are under the dictator's control, afraid to cooperate with American spies for fear of torture and execution. The only two options for the U.S at this point are impotence or war. Examples of this "boomerang effect" include the Shah of Iran, General Noriega and Saddam Hussein. The boomerang effect also explains why the CIA has proven highly successful at overthrowing democracies, but a wretched failure at overthrowing dictatorships.

The following timeline should confirm that the CIA as we know it should be abolished and replaced by a true information-gathering and analysis organization. The CIA cannot be reformed it is institutionally and culturally corrupt.

1929

The culture we lost Secretary of State Henry Stimson refuses to endorse a code-breaking operation, saying, "Gentlemen do not read each others mail."

1941

COI created In preparation for World War II, President Roosevelt creates the Office of Coordinator of Information (COI). General William "Wild Bill" Donovan heads the new intelligence service.

1942

OSS created Roosevelt restructures COI into something more suitable for covert action, the Office of Strategic Services (OSS). Donovan recruits so many of the nations rich and powerful that eventually people joke that "OSS" stands for "Oh, so social!" or "Oh, such snobs!"

1943

Italy Donovan recruits the Catholic Church in Rome to be the center of Anglo-American spy operations in Fascist Italy. This would prove to be one of Americas most enduring intelligence alliances in the Cold War.

1945

OSS is abolished The remaining American information agencies cease covert actions and return to harmless information gathering and analysis.

Operation PAPERCLIP While other American agencies are hunting down Nazi war criminals for arrest, the U.S. intelligence community is smuggling them into America, unpunished, for their use against the Soviets. The most important of these is Reinhard Gehlen, Hitlers master spy who had built up an intelligence network in the Soviet Union. With full U.S. blessing, he creates the "Gehlen Organization," a band of refugee Nazi spies who reactivate their networks in Russia. These include SS intelligence officers Alfred Six and Emil Augsburg (who massacred Jews in the Holocaust), Klaus Barbie (the "Butcher of Lyon"), Otto von Bolschwing (the Holocaust mastermind who worked with Eichmann) and SS Colonel Otto Skorzeny (a personal friend of Hitlers). The Gehlen Organization supplies the U.S. with its only intelligence on the Soviet Union for the next ten years, serving as a bridge between the abolishment of the OSS and the creation of the CIA. However, much of the "intelligence" the former Nazis provide is bogus. Gehlen inflates Soviet military capabilities at a time when Russia is still rebuilding its devastated society, in order to inflate his own importance to the Americans (who might otherwise punish him). In 1948, Gehlen almost convinces the Americans that war is imminent, and the West should make a preemptive strike. In the 50s he produces a fictitious "missile gap." To make matters worse, the Russians have thoroughly penetrated the Gehlen Organization with double agents, undermining the very American security that Gehlen was supposed to protect.

1947

Greece President Truman requests military aid to Greece to support right-wing forces fighting communist rebels. For the rest of the Cold War, Washington and the CIA will back notorious Greek leaders with deplorable human rights records.

CIA created President Truman signs the National Security Act of 1947, creating the Central Intelligence Agency and National Security Council. The CIA is accountable to the president through the NSC there is no democratic or congressional oversight. Its charter allows the CIA to "perform such other functions and duties as the National Security Council may from time to time direct." This loophole opens the door to covert action and dirty tricks.

1948

Covert-action wing created The CIA recreates a covert action wing, innocuously called the Office of Policy Coordination, led by Wall Street lawyer Frank Wisner. According to its secret charter, its responsibilities include "propaganda, economic warfare, preventive direct action, including sabotage, antisabotage, demolition and evacuation procedures; subversion against hostile states, including assistance to underground resistance groups, and support of indigenous anti-communist elements in threatened countries of the free world."

Italy The CIA corrupts democratic elections in Italy, where Italian communists threaten to win the elections. The CIA buys votes, broadcasts propaganda, threatens and beats up opposition leaders, and infiltrates and disrupts their organizations. It works -- the communists are defeated.

1949

Radio Free Europe The CIA creates its first major propaganda outlet, Radio Free Europe. Over the next several decades, its broadcasts are so blatantly false that for a time it is considered illegal to publish transcripts of them in the U.S.

Late 40s

Operation MOCKINGBIRD The CIA begins recruiting American news organizations and journalists to become spies and disseminators of propaganda. The effort is headed by Frank Wisner, Allan Dulles, Richard Helms and Philip Graham. Graham is publisher of The Washington Post, which becomes a major CIA player. Eventually, the CIAs media assets will include ABC, NBC, CBS, Time, Newsweek, Associated Press, United Press International, Reuters, Hearst Newspapers, Scripps-Howard, Copley News Service and more. By the CIAs own admission, at least 25 organizations and 400 journalists will become CIA assets.

1953

Iran CIA overthrows the democratically elected Mohammed Mossadegh in a military coup, after he threatened to nationalize British oil. The CIA replaces him with a dictator, the Shah of Iran, whose secret police, SAVAK, is as brutal as the Gestapo.

Operation MK-ULTRA Inspired by North Koreas brainwashing program, the CIA begins experiments on mind control. The most notorious part of this project involves giving LSD and other drugs to American subjects without their knowledge or against their will, causing several to commit suicide. However, the operation involves far more than this. Funded in part by the Rockefeller and Ford foundations, research includes propaganda, brainwashing, public relations, advertising, hypnosis, and other forms of suggestion.

1954

Guatemala CIA overthrows the democratically elected Jacob Arbenz in a military coup. Arbenz has threatened to nationalize the Rockefeller-owned United Fruit Company, in which CIA Director Allen Dulles also owns stock. Arbenz is replaced with a series of right-wing dictators whose bloodthirsty policies will kill over 100,000 Guatemalans in the next 40 years.

1954-1958

North Vietnam CIA officer Edward Lansdale spends four years trying to overthrow the communist government of North Vietnam, using all the usual dirty tricks. The CIA also attempts to legitimize a tyrannical puppet regime in South Vietnam, headed by Ngo Dinh Diem. These efforts fail to win the hearts and minds of the South Vietnamese because the Diem government is opposed to true democracy, land reform and poverty reduction measures. The CIAs continuing failure results in escalating American intervention, culminating in the Vietnam War.

1956

Hungary Radio Free Europe incites Hungary to revolt by broadcasting Khruschevs Secret Speech, in which he denounced Stalin. It also hints that American aid will help the Hungarians fight. This aid fails to materialize as Hungarians launch a doomed armed revolt, which only invites a major Soviet invasion. The conflict kills 7,000 Soviets and 30,000 Hungarians.

1957-1973

Laos The CIA carries out approximately one coup per year trying to nullify Laos democratic elections. The problem is the Pathet Lao, a leftist group with enough popular support to be a member of any coalition government. In the late 50s, the CIA even creates an "Armee Clandestine" of Asian mercenaries to attack the Pathet Lao. After the CIAs army suffers numerous defeats, the U.S. starts bombing, dropping more bombs on Laos than all the U.S. bombs dropped in World War II. A quarter of all Laotians will eventually become refugees, many living in caves.

1959

Haiti The U.S. military helps "Papa Doc" Duvalier become dictator of Haiti. He creates his own private police force, the "Tonton Macoutes," who terrorize the population with machetes. They will kill over 100,000 during the Duvalier family reign. The U.S. does not protest their dismal human rights record.

1961

The Bay of Pigs The CIA sends 1,500 Cuban exiles to invade Castros Cuba. But "Operation Mongoose" fails, due to poor planning, security and backing. The planners had imagined that the invasion will spark a popular uprising against Castro - which never happens. A promised American air strike also never occurs. This is the CIAs first public setback, causing President Kennedy to fire CIA Director Allen Dulles.

Dominican Republic The CIA assassinates Rafael Trujillo, a murderous dictator Washington has supported since 1930. Trujillos business interests have grown so large (about 60 percent of the economy) that they have begun competing with American business interests.

Ecuador The CIA-backed military forces the democratically elected President Jose Velasco to resign. Vice President Carlos Arosemana replaces him; the CIA fills the now vacant vice presidency with its own man.

Congo (Zaire) The CIA assassinates the democratically elected Patrice Lumumba. However, public support for Lumumbas politics runs so high that the CIA cannot clearly install his opponents in power. Four years of political turmoil follow.

1963

Dominican Republic The CIA overthrows the democratically elected Juan Bosch in a military coup. The CIA installs a repressive, right-wing junta.

Ecuador A CIA-backed military coup overthrows President Arosemana, whose independent (not socialist) policies have become unacceptable to Washington. A military junta assumes command, cancels the 1964 elections, and begins abusing human rights.

1964

Brazil A CIA-backed military coup overthrows the democratically elected government of Joao Goulart. The junta that replaces it will, in the next two decades, become one of the most bloodthirsty in history. General Castelo Branco will create Latin Americas first death squads, or bands of secret police who hunt down "communists" for torture, interrogation and murder. Often these "communists" are no more than Brancos political opponents. Later it is revealed that the CIA trains the death squads.

1965

Indonesia The CIA overthrows the democratically elected Sukarno with a military coup. The CIA has been trying to eliminate Sukarno since 1957, using everything from attempted assassination to sexual intrigue, for nothing more than his declaring neutrality in the Cold War. His successor, General Suharto, will massacre between 500,000 to 1 million civilians accused of being "communist." The CIA supplies the names of countless suspects.

Dominican Republic A popular rebellion breaks out, promising to reinstall Juan Bosch as the countrys elected leader. The revolution is crushed when U.S. Marines land to uphold the military regime by force. The CIA directs everything behind the scenes.

Greece With the CIAs backing, the king removes George Papandreous as prime minister. Papandreous has failed to vigorously support U.S. interests in Greece.

Congo (Zaire) A CIA-backed military coup installs Mobutu Sese Seko as dictator. The hated and repressive Mobutu exploits his desperately poor country for billions.

1966

The Ramparts Affair The radical magazine Ramparts begins a series of unprecedented anti-CIA articles. Among their scoops: the CIA has paid the University of Michigan $25 million dollars to hire "professors" to train South Vietnamese students in covert police methods. MIT and other universities have received similar payments. Ramparts also reveals that the National Students Association is a CIA front. Students are sometimes recruited through blackmail and bribery, including draft deferments.

1967

Greece A CIA-backed military coup overthrows the government two days before the elections. The favorite to win was George Papandreous, the liberal candidate. During the next six years, the "reign of the colonels" backed by the CIA will usher in the widespread use of torture and murder against political opponents. When a Greek ambassador objects to President Johnson about U.S. plans for Cypress, Johnson tells him: "Fuck your parliament and your constitution."

Operation PHEONIX The CIA helps South Vietnamese agents identify and then murder alleged Viet Cong leaders operating in South Vietnamese villages. According to a 1971 congressional report, this operation killed about 20,000 "Viet Cong."

1968

Operation CHAOS The CIA has been illegally spying on American citizens since 1959, but with Operation CHAOS, President Johnson dramatically boosts the effort. CIA agents go undercover as student radicals to spy on and disrupt campus organizations protesting the Vietnam War. They are searching for Russian instigators, which they never find. CHAOS will eventually spy on 7,000 individuals and 1,000 organizations.

Bolivia A CIA-organized military operation captures legendary guerilla Che Guevara. The CIA wants to keep him alive for interrogation, but the Bolivian government executes him to prevent worldwide calls for clemency.

1969

Uruguay The notorious CIA torturer Dan Mitrione arrives in Uruguay, a country torn with political strife. Whereas right-wing forces previously used torture only as a last resort, Mitrione convinces them to use it as a routine, widespread practice. "The precise pain, in the precise place, in the precise amount, for the desired effect," is his motto. The torture techniques he teaches to the death squads rival the Nazis. He eventually becomes so feared that revolutionaries will kidnap and murder him a year later.

1970

Cambodia The CIA overthrows Prince Sahounek, who is highly popular among Cambodians for keeping them out of the Vietnam War. He is replaced by CIA puppet Lon Nol, who immediately throws Cambodian troops into battle. This unpopular move strengthens once minor opposition parties like the Khmer Rouge, which achieves power in 1975 and massacres millions of its own people.

1971

Bolivia After half a decade of CIA-inspired political turmoil, a CIA-backed military coup overthrows the leftist President Juan Torres. In the next two years, dictator Hugo Banzer will have over 2,000 political opponents arrested without trial, then tortured, raped and executed.

Haiti "Papa Doc" Duvalier dies, leaving his 19-year old son "Baby Doc" Duvalier the dictator of Haiti. His son continues his bloody reign with full knowledge of the CIA.

1972

The Case-Zablocki Act Congress passes an act requiring congressional review of executive agreements. In theory, this should make CIA operations more accountable. In fact, it is only marginally effective.

Cambodia Congress votes to cut off CIA funds for its secret war in Cambodia.

Wagergate Break-in President Nixon sends in a team of burglars to wiretap Democratic offices at Watergate. The team members have extensive CIA histories, including James McCord, E. Howard Hunt and five of the Cuban burglars. They work for the Committee to Reelect the President (CREEP), which does dirty work like disrupting Democratic campaigns and laundering Nixons illegal campaign contributions. CREEPs activities are funded and organized by another CIA front, the Mullen Company.

1973

Chile The CIA overthrows and assassinates Salvador Allende, Latin Americas first democratically elected socialist leader. The problems begin when Allende nationalizes American-owned firms in Chile. ITT offers the CIA $1 million for a coup (reportedly refused). The CIA replaces Allende with General Augusto Pinochet, who will torture and murder thousands of his own countrymen in a crackdown on labor leaders and the political left.

CIA begins internal investigations William Colby, the Deputy Director for Operations, orders all CIA personnel to report any and all illegal activities they know about. This information is later reported to Congress.

Watergate Scandal The CIAs main collaborating newspaper in America, The Washington Post, reports Nixons crimes long before any other newspaper takes up the subject. The two reporters, Woodward and Bernstein, make almost no mention of the CIAs many fingerprints all over the scandal. It is later revealed that Woodward was a Naval intelligence briefer to the White House, and knows many important intelligence figures, including General Alexander Haig. His main source, "Deep Throat," is probably one of those.

CIA Director Helms Fired President Nixon fires CIA Director Richard Helms for failing to help cover up the Watergate scandal. Helms and Nixon have always disliked each other. The new CIA director is William Colby, who is relatively more open to CIA reform.

1974

CHAOS exposed Pulitzer prize winning journalist Seymour Hersh publishes a story about Operation CHAOS, the domestic surveillance and infiltration of anti-war and civil rights groups in the U.S. The story sparks national outrage.

Angleton fired Congress holds hearings on the illegal domestic spying efforts of James Jesus Angleton, the CIAs chief of counterintelligence. His efforts included mail-opening campaigns and secret surveillance of war protesters. The hearings result in his dismissal from the CIA.

House clears CIA in Watergate The House of Representatives clears the CIA of any complicity in Nixons Watergate break-in.

The Hughes Ryan Act Congress passes an amendment requiring the president to report nonintelligence CIA operations to the relevant congressional committees in a timely fashion.

1975

Australia The CIA helps topple the democratically elected, left-leaning government of Prime Minister Edward Whitlam. The CIA does this by giving an ultimatum to its Governor-General, John Kerr. Kerr, a longtime CIA collaborator, exercises his constitutional right to dissolve the Whitlam government. The Governor-General is a largely ceremonial position appointed by the Queen; the Prime Minister is democratically elected. The use of this archaic and never-used law stuns the nation.

Angola Eager to demonstrate American military resolve after its defeat in Vietnam, Henry Kissinger launches a CIA-backed war in Angola. Contrary to Kissingers assertions, Angola is a country of little strategic importance and not seriously threatened by communism. The CIA backs the brutal leader of UNITAS, Jonas Savimbi. This polarizes Angolan politics and drives his opponents into the arms of Cuba and the Soviet Union for survival. Congress will cut off funds in 1976, but the CIA is able to run the war off the books until 1984, when funding is legalized again. This entirely pointless war kills over 300,000 Angolans.

"The CIA and the Cult of Intelligence" Victor Marchetti and John Marks publish this whistle-blowing history of CIA crimes and abuses. Marchetti has spent 14 years in the CIA, eventually becoming an executive assistant to the Deputy Director of Intelligence. Marks has spent five years as an intelligence official in the State Department.

"Inside the Company" Philip Agee publishes a diary of his life inside the CIA. Agee has worked in covert operations in Latin America during the 60s, and details the crimes in which he took part.

Congress investigates CIA wrong-doing Public outrage compels Congress to hold hearings on CIA crimes. Senator Frank Church heads the Senate investigation ("The Church Committee"), and Representative Otis Pike heads the House investigation. (Despite a 98 percent incumbency reelection rate, both Church and Pike are defeated in the next elections.) The investigations lead to a number of reforms intended to increase the CIAs accountability to Congress, including the creation of a standing Senate committee on intelligence. However, the reforms prove ineffective, as the Iran/Contra scandal will show. It turns out the CIA can control, deal with or sidestep Congress with ease.

The Rockefeller Commission In an attempt to reduce the damage done by the Church Committee, President Ford creates the "Rockefeller Commission" to whitewash CIA history and propose toothless reforms. The commissions namesake, Vice President Nelson Rockefeller, is himself a major CIA figure. Five of the commissions eight members are also members of the Council on Foreign Relations, a CIA-dominated organization.

1979

Iran The CIA fails to predict the fall of the Shah of Iran, a longtime CIA puppet, and the rise of Muslim fundamentalists who are furious at the CIAs backing of SAVAK, the Shahs bloodthirsty secret police. In revenge, the Muslims take 52 Americans hostage in the U.S. embassy in Tehran.

Afghanistan The Soviets invade Afghanistan. The CIA immediately begins supplying arms to any faction willing to fight the occupying Soviets. Such indiscriminate arming means that when the Soviets leave Afghanistan, civil war will erupt. Also, fanatical Muslim extremists now possess state-of-the-art weaponry. One of these is Sheik Abdel Rahman, who will become involved in the World Trade Center bombing in New York.

El Salvador An idealistic group of young military officers, repulsed by the massacre of the poor, overthrows the right-wing government. However, the U.S. compels the inexperienced officers to include many of the old guard in key positions in their new government. Soon, things are back to "normal" the military government is repressing and killing poor civilian protesters. Many of the young military and civilian reformers, finding themselves powerless, resign in disgust.

Nicaragua Anastasios Samoza II, the CIA-backed dictator, falls. The Marxist Sandinistas take over government, and they are initially popular because of their commitment to land and anti-poverty reform. Samoza had a murderous and hated personal army called the National Guard. Remnants of the Guard will become the Contras, who fight a CIA-backed guerilla war against the Sandinista government throughout the 1980s.

1980

El Salvador The Archbishop of San Salvador, Oscar Romero, pleads with President Carter "Christian to Christian" to stop aiding the military government slaughtering his people. Carter refuses. Shortly afterwards, right-wing leader Roberto DAubuisson has Romero shot through the heart while saying Mass. The country soon dissolves into civil war, with the peasants in the hills fighting against the military government. The CIA and U.S. Armed Forces supply the government with overwhelming military and intelligence superiority. CIA-trained death squads roam the countryside, committing atrocities like that of El Mazote in 1982, where they massacre between 700 and 1000 men, women and children. By 1992, some 63,000 Salvadorans will be killed.

1981

Iran/Contra Begins The CIA begins selling arms to Iran at high prices, using the profits to arm the Contras fighting the Sandinista government in Nicaragua. President Reagan vows that the Sandinistas will be "pressured" until "they say uncle." The CIAs Freedom Fighters Manual disbursed to the Contras includes instruction on economic sabotage, propaganda, extortion, bribery, blackmail, interrogation, torture, murder and political assassination.

1983

Honduras The CIA gives Honduran military officers the Human Resource Exploitation Training Manual 1983, which teaches how to torture people. Honduras notorious "Battalion 316" then uses these techniques, with the CIAs full knowledge, on thousands of leftist dissidents. At least 184 are murdered.

1984

The Boland Amendment The last of a series of Boland Amendments is passed. These amendments have reduced CIA aid to the Contras; the last one cuts it off completely. However, CIA Director William Casey is already prepared to "hand off" the operation to Colonel Oliver North, who illegally continues supplying the Contras through the CIAs informal, secret, and self-financing network. This includes "humanitarian aid" donated by Adolph Coors and William Simon, and military aid funded by Iranian arms sales.

1986

Eugene Hasenfus Nicaragua shoots down a C-123 transport plane carrying military supplies to the Contras. The lone survivor, Eugene Hasenfus, turns out to be a CIA employee, as are the two dead pilots. The airplane belongs to Southern Air Transport, a CIA front. The incident makes a mockery of President Reagans claims that the CIA is not illegally arming the Contras.

Iran/Contra Scandal Although the details have long been known, the Iran/Contra scandal finally captures the medias attention in 1986. Congress holds hearings, and several key figures (like Oliver North) lie under oath to protect the intelligence community. CIA Director William Casey dies of brain cancer before Congress can question him. All reforms enacted by Congress after the scandal are purely cosmetic.

Haiti Rising popular revolt in Haiti means that "Baby Doc" Duvalier will remain "President for Life" only if he has a short one. The U.S., which hates instability in a puppet country, flies the despotic Duvalier to the South of France for a comfortable retirement. The CIA then rigs the upcoming elections in favor of another right-wing military strongman. However, violence keeps the country in political turmoil for another four years. The CIA tries to strengthen the military by creating the National Intelligence Service (SIN), which suppresses popular revolt through torture and assassination.

1989

Panama The U.S. invades Panama to overthrow a dictator of its own making, General Manuel Noriega. Noriega has been on the CIAs payroll since 1966, and has been transporting drugs with the CIAs knowledge since 1972. By the late 80s, Noriegas growing independence and intransigence have angered Washington so out he goes.

1990

Haiti Competing against 10 comparatively wealthy candidates, leftist priest Jean-Bertrand Aristide captures 68 percent of the vote. After only eight months in power, however, the CIA-backed military deposes him. More military dictators brutalize the country, as thousands of Haitian refugees escape the turmoil in barely seaworthy boats. As popular opinion calls for Aristides return, the CIA begins a disinformation campaign painting the courageous priest as mentally unstable.

1991

The Gulf War The U.S. liberates Kuwait from Iraq. But Iraqs dictator, Saddam Hussein, is another creature of the CIA. With U.S. encouragement, Hussein invaded Iran in 1980. During this costly eight-year war, the CIA built up Husseins forces with sophisticated arms, intelligence, training and financial backing. This cemented Husseins power at home, allowing him to crush the many internal rebellions that erupted from time to time, sometimes with poison gas. It also gave him all the military might he needed to conduct further adventurism in Kuwait, for example.

The Fall of the Soviet Union The CIA fails to predict this most important event of the Cold War. This suggests that it has been so busy undermining governments that it hasnt been doing its primary job: gathering and analyzing information. The fall of the Soviet Union also robs the CIA of its reason for existence: fighting communism. This leads some to accuse the CIA of intentionally failing to predict the downfall of the Soviet Union. Curiously, the intelligence communitys budget is not significantly reduced after the demise of communism.

1992

Economic Espionage In the years following the end of the Cold War, the CIA is increasingly used for economic espionage. This involves stealing the technological secrets of competing foreign companies and giving them to American ones. Given the CIAs clear preference for dirty tricks over mere information gathering, the possibility of serious criminal behavior is very great indeed.

1993

Haiti The chaos in Haiti grows so bad that President Clinton has no choice but to remove the Haitian military dictator, Raoul Cedras, on threat of U.S. invasion. The U.S. occupiers do not arrest Haitis military leaders for crimes against humanity, but instead ensure their safety and rich retirements. Aristide is returned to power only after being forced to accept an agenda favorable to the countrys ruling class.

EPILOGUE

In a speech before the CIA celebrating its 50th anniversary, President Clinton said: "By necessity, the American people will never know the full story of your courage."

Clintons is a common defense of the CIA: namely, the American people should stop criticizing the CIA because they dont know what it really does. This, of course, is the heart of the problem in the first place. An agency that is above criticism is also above moral behavior and reform. Its secrecy and lack of accountability allows its corruption to grow unchecked.

Furthermore, Clintons statement is simply untrue. The history of the agency is growing painfully clear, especially with the declassification of historical CIA documents. We may not know the details of specific operations, but we do know, quite well, the general behavior of the CIA. These facts began emerging nearly two decades ago at an ever-quickening pace. Today we have a remarkably accurate and consistent picture, repeated in country after country, and verified from countless different directions.

The CIAs response to this growing knowledge and criticism follows a typical historical pattern. (Indeed, there are remarkable parallels to the Medieval Churchs fight against the Scientific Revolution.) The first journalists and writers to reveal the CIAs criminal behavior were harassed and censored if they were American writers, and tortured and murdered if they were foreigners. (See Philip Agees On the Run for an example of early harassment.) However, over the last two decades the tide of evidence has become overwhelming, and the CIA has found that it does not have enough fingers to plug every hole in the dike. This is especially true in the age of the Internet, where information flows freely among millions of people. Since censorship is impossible, the Agency must now defend itself with apologetics. Clintons "Americans will never know" defense is a prime example.

Another common apologetic is that "the world is filled with unsavory characters, and we must deal with them if we are to protect American interests at all." There are two things wrong with this. First, it ignores the fact that the CIA has regularly spurned alliances with defenders of democracy, free speech and human rights, preferring the company of military dictators and tyrants. The CIA had moral options available to them, but did not take them.

Second, this argument begs several questions. The first is: "Which American interests?" The CIA has courted right-wing dictators because they allow wealthy Americans to exploit the countrys cheap labor and resources. But poor and middle-class Americans pay the price whenever they fight the wars that stem from CIA actions, from Vietnam to the Gulf War to Panama. The second begged question is: "Why should American interests come at the expense of other peoples human rights?"

The CIA should be abolished, its leadership dismissed and its relevant members tried for crimes against humanity. Our intelligence community should be rebuilt from the ground up, with the goal of collecting and analyzing information. As for covert action, there are two moral options. The first one is to eliminate covert action completely. But this gives jitters to people worried about the Adolf Hitlers of the world. So a second option is that we can place covert action under extensive and true democratic oversight. For example, a bipartisan Congressional Committee of 40 members could review and veto all aspects of CIA operations upon a majority or super-majority vote. Which of these two options is best may be the subject of debate, but one thing is clear: like dictatorship, like monarchy, unaccountable covert operations should die like the dinosaurs they are.

Endnotes:

1. All history concerning CIA intervention in foreign countries is summarized from William Blums encyclopedic work, Killing Hope: U.S. Military and CIA Interventions since World War II (Monroe, Maine: Common Courage Press, 1995). Sources for domestic CIA operations come from Jonathan Vankin and John Whalens The 60 Greatest Conspiracies of All Time (Secaucus, N.J.: Citadel Press, 1997).

2. Coleman McCarthy, "The Consequences of Covert Tactics" Washington Post, December 13, 1987.

Copyright 1996 by Steve Kangas. Text can be quoted freely for non-commercial purposes only, with proper attribution.
<http://home.att.net/~Resurgence/CIAtimeline.html >



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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:18 AM
Response to Reply #46
49. JFK stopped a plan by the Joint Chiefs in the 60's to
attack the American people in order to get us to go along with
declaring war on Cuba.

"NORTHWOODS was a strategy proposed by the United States Joint Chiefs of Staff to stage terrorist incidents involving American citizens, including hijacking airliners, to build public support for an invasion of Cuba. The plan was rejected by President John F. Kennedy who then fired the Chairman of the JCS. Heres a very good overview:

OPERATION NORTHWOODS:
US PLANNED FAKE TERROR ATTACKS ON CITIZENS
TO CREATE SUPPORT FOR CUBAN WAR

From BODY OF SECRETS, James Bamford, Doubleday, 2001, p.82 and following. Scanned and edited by NY Transfer News.

...In Lemnitzer's view, the country would be far better off if the generals could take over.

For those military officers who were sitting on the fence, the Kennedy administration's botched Bay of Pigs invasion was the last straw. "The Bay of Pigs fiasco broke the dike," said one report at the time. "President Kennedy was pilloried by the super patriots as a 'no-win' chief . . . The Far Right became a fount of proposals born of frustration and put forward in the name of anti-Communism. . . Active-duty commanders played host to anti-Communist seminars on their bases and attended or addressed Right-wing meetings elsewhere."

Although no one in Congress could have known it at the time, Lemnitzer and the Joint Chiefs had quietly slipped over the edge.

According to secret and long-hidden documents obtained for Body of Secrets, the Joint Chiefs of Staff drew up and approved plans for what may be the most corrupt plan ever created by the U.S. government. In the name of antiCommunism, they proposed launching a secret and bloody war of terrorism against their own country in order to trick the American public into supporting an ill-conceived war they intended to launch against Cuba.

(uhmmmm - is this sounding familiar? - )

CONTINUED

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/northwoods.html
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:38 AM
Response to Reply #49
54. You know
both pappy and nixon flew out of Dallas that morning.

Nixon was working for Coca Cola - a mulit national - and as I
remember the reports they were based in Dallas.

pappy's been around a long time.
as has kissinger
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:52 AM
Response to Reply #49
58. We got our Northwoods, only
it's called WTC.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:58 AM
Response to Reply #58
61. Yeah. I'm thinking definitely the same thing.
(:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:00 AM
Response to Reply #61
64. Maybe we should send
that Northwoods info including the book references to every
member of the 911 commission and Henry Waxman...

AND the 911 widows. They've got the attention of the media
and they're listened to!
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LibertyorDeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:25 AM
Response to Reply #46
51. Could someone explain this to me
I expect this response from Reagan but Carter?

I don't get it "1980

El Salvador The Archbishop of San Salvador, Oscar Romero, pleads with President Carter "Christian to Christian" to stop aiding the military government slaughtering his people. Carter refuses."

Were things, Are things this far gone that Carter did their biding.

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:32 AM
Response to Reply #51
53. LIB I don;t know. Election year? or
afraid he might end up like JFK for interfering with the
real government.

I have a question myself.

Who the hell is running the agency?

Who gives them their orders?

Is it just the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence?

Does anyone here know?
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LibertyorDeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:38 AM
Response to Reply #53
55. It may have gotten to the point where they no longer
take "orders" but will take requests into consideration.

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:48 AM
Response to Reply #55
57. You know what I'm thinking?
The Hague.

The Hague is the only ones who could handle these high up
criminals.

It can't be done in this country.

They have to be handled as war criminals committing atrocities.

The Hague is in Amsterdam, Holland.

World Court...then we have to look at who makes up the World Court.
Probably members of the Trilateal Commission or Council of Foreign
Relations. not too funny joke, huh?

Okay, what would H20 say?

We have the power.
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:46 AM
Response to Reply #46
56. I have just two words
HOLY SHIT!!!
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:57 AM
Response to Reply #56
59. Shraby - beginning to look like
MIHOP, doesn't it?
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:00 AM
Response to Reply #59
63. Yup.
And it will probably never be proved. Not many of the crimes have. Now I know why the Capitol and White House are white...from all the whitewash they've been using for so long.
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:57 AM
Response to Reply #56
60. The Hague is different from
the ICC isn't it? The ICC is made up of a lot of smaller countries also. Maybe that's the place that should take over...of course then they can be intimidated by the CIA.
Actually it won't be done anyplace but within our own government and through the courts. Looks pretty hopeless doesn't it?
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:04 AM
Response to Reply #60
65. They got Pinochet. There's hope.
.

This is the anniversary of Nixongate.

It's possible.

It's just that it's so monstrous, we're in shock.

Numb. Quiet shock.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:07 AM
Response to Reply #65
67. Look at what the French are doing.
It's obvious they've had enough.

As H20 says cheney is top tier..and they're going after him.

the French saved America in the revolution.

They gave us The Statue of Liberty.

Maybe ---- they will be the ones to get it rolling - save us again.
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:08 AM
Response to Reply #65
68. From the bank investigation on Pinochet.
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 02:12 AM by shraby
Maybe some more of the bad actors will get caught up in it. Suppose someone who is going to a Kerry rally would be able to give him the url for this thread?

The French may have let sleeping dogs lie if they hadn't been dissed so bad by Bushco. They have been steadfast allies since forever. Now our people are in trouble, they're helping cause they know we'd do the same for them.
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:17 AM
Response to Reply #68
71. Bushco made the two of the biggest mistakes
ever. One was to try to trash our constitution. The other was to invade Iraq..that exposed the cabal. Those two mistakes put him in hot water from all directions..the people and the cabal. No wonder he looked hang-dog not to long ago.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:30 AM
Response to Reply #71
74. Shraby, truthfully
I think he looked hangdog because of Fitzgerald.

I also think the whole thing is coming out.

Like us googling everything and putting it together.

We're not the only ones.

And you know, whatever is on the net, spreads and spreads.

And then comes out in the site of everybody - usually through

somebody like Hersh.

Boy, I hope he doesn't fly.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:33 AM
Response to Reply #68
75. You mean the Riggs Bank?
of which Jonathan BUSH is heavily involved???

That bank?

yeahhhhh.

Gee, maybe if they freeze those funds, the wh slush fund will be
frozen too.

We have something great going for us.

Tenet and Plame's boss quit the agency.

Vive L'America
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:53 AM
Response to Reply #75
79. Yup, the Riggs bank
if investigated deep enough, it probably took over the operations of the BCCI. All the players will be there.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:57 AM
Response to Reply #79
82. a dimson brother is there.....wherever there's criminality - there
they are.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #75
110. HERE'S THE RIGGS BANK INFO DUMP
WaPo: Allbritton Loses Riggs Bank (front page, day 3)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
BCCI latest update: BoE wins landmark legal priviledge appeal
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
US Wants Shady Bank Moves Reported Faster
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
Bush Vows Probe of Riggs Money-Laundering Allegations (Update1)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
Senate investigators grill Riggs officials
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
Riggs' Controlling Family Could Gross $194 Million in Buyout (Albritton)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...


AND THIS ONE JUST FOR FUN!
A Fantastic Tale Turkey, Drugs, Faustian Alliances & Sibel Edmonds
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

:hi:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #110
113. Thanks Dream - I hear dimson is blocking investigation of Riggs
always the opposite of whatever he says publicly he will do.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #113
130. Have you guys talked about Equatorial Guinea
Zimbabwe or the coup attempt with the mercenaries being jailed. EG is connected to Riggs also.

Like this
President Obiang has ruled his country since 1979
Equatorial Guinea's ministry of information has cautioned local companies offering subscriptions to foreign satellite channels.
It urged them to abstain from broadcasting programmes that could jeopardise national security.

The move comes after the screening of a programme by Spanish television.

It covered an investigation by the US Senate into money the Equatorial Guinean government has allegedly placed in the US-based Riggs bank.
more
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/3911855.stm

I'll get it all if you think you want it here
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #130
131. DREAM -one more ci operation - thanks, we're doing all info on
Plame Wilson leak to cover up proliferation of nuke selling by
Cheney Halliburton Khan pappy dimson cabal- involvement leading
to PNAC -One World Government -kissinger- Trilateral- pappy and -DAvid Rockefeller

and writinng letters to get them jailed ASAP.

We concentrate on WHY - the motivation and it has led us to a lot of
places and people you already are at....

so keep on acomin' with that stuff....we'll use what fits and pass by
what we cant use for the time being....

Thanks bigtime DREAM
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LibertyorDeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:35 AM
Response to Original message
76. I love this place. It helps keep me Sane in an Insane World

I gotta get up early for work.

Good night & Cheers to all the great people at the DU!
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:51 AM
Response to Reply #76
78. Good night, sleep tight and.....
don't let the bedbugs bite. :hi:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:59 AM
Response to Reply #78
83. Me too - gotta say niters all
:hi:
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:04 AM
Response to Reply #83
84. Talk to ya tomorrow Pallas
Night-night. :hi:
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 07:39 AM
Response to Original message
86. Pallas180 there might be something of interest to you here
Carlyle Interested in BAE's Shipbuilding Unit, Telegraph Says
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

WaPo: Allbritton Loses Riggs Bank (front page, day 3)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:09 AM
Response to Reply #86
87. Tenet fired?
I strongly suspect that Tenet was fired. There may be many reasons but one that I feel is relevant to this discussion is the 25 tons of documents regarding Saddam's activities. Ahmed Chalabi has those documents. Tenet was after Chalabi and wanted to expose him him for the con man and traitor that Chalabi is but the Neo Fascists could not afford to have Chalabi bring forth those documents. Chalabi probably told them that even if he was killed that thos docs would surface. Hence, Bush fired Tenet and told him that he had better keep his mouth shut or the Repugs in Congress would indicte him for lying under oath before Congress. Also, Tenet probably knows who leaked V. Plame. The Neo Fascists must also have something on Pavitt, V. Plame's former boss. I believe he was fired also.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:38 AM
Response to Reply #87
89. DISTURBED -looks like Tenet fired, Pavitt quit and they
are both talking to the prosecutor in Plame.

I wouldn't worry about them - if anybody can pull down the
house of dimson - those guys can.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:35 AM
Response to Reply #86
88. DREAM thanks, They have their own army, now their own navy....
they have to be stopped.

another addition to their munitions companies.

Somewhere we made a list of all the Carlyle companies and their
connections, a couple of years ago - it was wither on here or
in Salon Table Talk - archived now......

We really need to find that list. Chuck full of info.
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kohodog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #88
91. Good Morning! Lots to chew on
From last nights postings! Great work everyone.

Some important dots are being connected here and the Sible Edmonds csae seems to be tying in. Ashcroft seems to be a bigger player than I thought.

Why would he recuse himself from Plame and appoint fitzgerald? Seems he would want a patsy in there, but again, there are no indightments yet. I hope Fitz isn't a paper tiger.

If I have time today, I'll do a little snooping on our AG.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #91
95. Good Morning Guys -the threads above are
pretty heavy duty.

Worth reading them all

first reaction is numbing

but keep going.

I'll be in and out today on line....if I don't want another rebellion
at home :)

There are a couple of other threads that have parallel info...
DREAM has been helping us by sending some of her threads over...
so it would be good to look at hers.

There's a thread by Eloriel on "imminent" attack that has her pretty
upset, seems DC has told border guards to "stand down" and just let
whoever wants to come in from Mexico come in...

but they didn't let 53 Fars/Arqabic speaking looking "mexicans" come in - caught em.......

I think that "stand down" may have something to do with Ridge's quitting...

Boy Washington must be a boiling, toiling, and troubling....

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 09:32 AM
Response to Reply #95
96. & Here's a ref back to thread 14
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #86
93. Thanks DREAM - they seem to have forgotten about dimson's
uncle at the bank, Jonathan, Jonathan since 1970


Media_Lies_Daily (1000+ posts) Sat Jul-17-04 11:19 AM
Response to Original message

9. They seem to have forgotten all about Jonathan Bush, FratBoy's uncle....


...who has been associated with Riggs since 1970....

<http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A28396-20 ... >

Excerpt:

"A political Web site written by a Democratic operative drew attention yesterday to the fact that President Bush's uncle, Jonathan J. Bush, is a top executive at Riggs Bank, which this week agreed to pay a record $25 million in civil fines for violations of law intended to thwart money laundering.

Jonathan Bush, who is a major fundraiser for his nephew, was appointed in 2000 to run Riggs Investment Management Co. His association with Riggs began when he headed J. Bush & Co., a New Haven, Conn., company he created in 1970 and built to offer advice on money management."

_________________________________________________________________

see what the web can do?

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #93
94. Here's some on the directos of PNC buying Riggs
Here's history of PNC bank(new Riggs owner)_ but not one word on

Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 09:00 AM by Pallas180
who is on its board of directors...I think that's kinda strange

Bank goes back to 1700's

Black Rock owns PNC:

http://www.blackrock.com/about/news/new_directors_12229 ...

another shell owning shell owning shell


Pittsburgh home of Scaiffe - I wonder if they owned the bank
originally or are part of it...Scaiffe Mellon BAnkk


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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #94
111. Black Rock link broke
please?
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #111
114. DREAM - wow - not broke - they're now asking for personal info
to get in, which they weren't before.......
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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #114
122. I got in
http://www.corporate-ir.net/ireye/ir_site.zhtml?ticker=...

Board of Directors

William O. Albertini
Former Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer, Bell Atlantic Global Wireless, Inc.
William S. Demchak
Vice Chairman and Chief Financial Officer, The PNC Financial Services Group, Inc.
Laurence D. Fink
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, BlackRock, Inc.
Murry S. Gerber
President and Chief Executive Officer, Equitable Resources, Inc.
James Grosfeld
Former Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Pulte Corporation
David H. Komansky
Former Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Merrill Lynch
William C. Mutterperl
Vice Chairman, The PNC Financial Services Group, Inc.
Frank T. Nickell
President and Chief Executive Officer, Kelso & Company
Thomas H. OBrien
Former Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, The PNC Financial Services Group, Inc.
James E. Rohr
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, The PNC Financial Services Group, Inc.
Ralph L. Schlosstein
President, BlackRock, Inc.
Lawrence M. Wagner
President and Chief Executive Officer, The Hillman Company

Managing Directors

Laurence D. Fink *
Chairman & Chief Executive Officer
Ralph L. Schlosstein *
President
Robert S. Kapito *
Vice Chairman
Paul L. Audet *
Chief Financial Officer
Robert P. Connolly, Esq.*
General Counsel
Anne F. Ackerley *

Scott M. Amero *

Keith T. Anderson *

Howard P. Berkowitz*

Peter R. Fisher *

Henry Gabbay, Ph.D. *

Bennett W. Golub, Ph.D. *

Charles S. Hallac *

Michael C. Huebsch *

Kevin Klingert *

J. Richard Kushel *

Albert B. Morillo *

Barbara G. Novick *

Susan L. Wagner *

Gordon Anderson, CA

Wayne J. Archambo, CFA

Hiroyuki Arita

Thomas S. Bain, CISM

Nigel Q.D. Barry

Ara A. Basil

Robert T. Bass

Bartholomew A. Battista

Randolph B. Brown

David E. Byrket, CFA

Katherine S. Cahill

Thomas P. Callan, CFA

Robert E. Capaldi *, CFA

Laurence J. Carolan

J. Stewart Carracher

Scott J. Condron

R. Andrew Damm

John J. Davis

Richard M. Duff III

Joseph Feliciani, Jr.

Thomas M. Fortin

Hugh R. Frater

Jeffrey J. Gary

Yury G. Geyman

Louis J. Gitlin

Robert L. Goldstein

Andrew Gordon

Susan C. Heide, Ph.D.

Frederick Herrmann, CFA

Zion Hilelly

Richard K. Hoerner, CFA

Kevin D. Holt, CFA

Craig Horvath, CFA

Kate L. Jonas

Joseph M. Kochansky

James Kong

Todd E. Kopstein

Woo Fung Kwong

James J. Lillis, CPA

Michael P. Lustig

John A. Massad

Kevin McCafferty, CFA

Allan M. McKenzie, CA

Chris A. Milner

John P. Moran

Matthew P. Mosca

Thomas H. Nevin

Douglas R. Oare, CFA

Brian B. Ostrowe, CFM

Mark D. Paltrowitz

Diane E. Parish

Christina C. Patterson

Glenn L. Perillo, CFA

Andrew J. Phillips

Gerald D. Pucci, Jr.

Peter A. Schwartzman

Joel M. Shaiman

Richard M. Shea

Irwin Scheer, Ph.D.

Stuart Spodek

Brian E. Stack

Robert M. Stein

Mark G. Steinberg

Edward M. Stevens

Ryan D. Stork, CFA

Stephen B. Switzky

Cheryl L. Sylwester, CFA

Scott F. Thiel

Roland E. Villacorta, CFA

Douglas B. Waggoner

Neil D. Wagner

Daniel R. Waltcher

Mark S. Warner, CFA

Alfred Weinberger

Mark J. Williams

Mark D. Winer, Ph.D.

Adam D. Wizon

Sree Sudha Yerneni

William F. Zola

* Management Committee Member
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TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #114
124. Actually, it is an incomplete, or broken, link.
This is the full link:
http://www.blackrock.com/about/news/new_directors_12229...

Here's the story on links at DU. It seems that a few months back, the wizards who run this most excellent site added a new feature to automagically shorten links that are so long that they either distort the post display, or drop off at the end, becoming an invalid link. Before, one had to handle such long links by using HTML to create a text 'cover' for the link, so that the text displayed instead of the link.

The 'autoshortening' feature is very creative and useful (thanx wizards), but one must be careful when 'quoting' such a link onto another post. Rather than doing a simple 'copy' of the displayed part of the link, one should 'copy link address', or whatever your browser calls that, in order to transfer all the link info 'under' the displayed part. You can tell the autoshortened long links by the three dots at the right end of the displayed characters. When the three dots are blue, the link is good and is more than you are seeing displayed. But when the three dots are not blue, it indicates the link text was simply 'copied' and the link will not work as originally intended. Since such a bad link does get you to the site, but refs an incomplete URL there, one often gets the site's default 'page not found' message, or whatever that site wants to give you when a link there does not work, such as a sign-up or registration form in case that relates to the trouble you are having with the link.

Or so I think. :)

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:12 PM
Response to Reply #124
128. Thanks TP=will try next time I have to copy header :)
I dont recognize any of the names, do you?
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Snazzy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #94
139. Other way around--PNC owns Blackrock
In 1999, the firm completed an initial public offering of 14% of its common stock (NYSE: BLK) and as a result, BlackRock employees and the public own approximately 29% of the firm. The PNC Financial Services Group (PNC), retains a 71% stake from its 1995 acquisition of BlackRock.

-----

Worth checking those names though! Had the same idea with Scaife, as you mention Pallas--I didn't see a link however when I looked at PNC people. Supposedly all of the Riggs units that did the money laundering, with exception of wealth management (trusts) are not being acquired by PNC. That's the stuff to watch, who grabs embassy banking and their Florida and foreign locations. No word on that yet.

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #139
143. Snazzy - interesting - Scaiffe has moved an operation "foundation"
to Florida. That can't be good.
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Snazzy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #143
155. any more on that?
For sure these guys are all pals. Just don't see a pay out to Scaife from PNC.

The money part of the Plame nexus hasn't even come close to coming out in a direct fashion. For one thing, I've never seen it reliably confirmed that she was investigating the Saudi's, but I have seen that as conjecture from a couple of different interesting sources. If it was ARAMCO, it would help narrow the focus with seeing how this broken piece of the Octopus, Riggs, might give us a window to the only thing these people care about, buck$.

If we actually knew it was Saudi espionage with Plame, then we might get to spend more time on Mahfouz, Bandar and so on. This wouldn't necessarily be Halliburton but actually closer to Whistleass and Poppy in particular. Which strikes me as very possible. One thing about Halliburton, they sure are hell corrupt, but they gave up a long time ago being secret about it. It's all out in the open. Meantime Saudi connections are more a BFEE trademark thing, and actually need to be secret because the same family friends are also trying to kill us.

Was Plame, like Patrick O'Neil, somebody who needed to be backed off? That might fit my narrow focus on the following the money. And what the heck are Saudi's plans for WMD's? Do they have a nuke maybe? If she was investigating them, wouldn't that be the topic? Could be they were just helping Khan and people like him, but do they or don't they have their own ambition to have a bomb? How come nobody ever talks about that?

Grand Juries are right now investigating Riggs on several fronts, the Saudis and 9/11, Pinochet, and Equatorial Guinea. The money is long gone, moved on, don't know where. But these investigations, though a different track, are really getting at the same thing.

One may unravel the other.

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Snazzy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 03:28 AM
Response to Reply #155
162. Oops, John O'Neil --n/t
:hi:
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
97. Josh Marshall and some details on the Italian forgeries
I haven't followed all these threads (and haven't the heart to go through 14 of them), so apologies is this has already been analysed; but Josh Micah Marshall (www.talkingpoint.com ) has now revealed some of the story he was working on.

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/week_2004_08_...

Briefly; Italian intelligence (SISMI) had an agent inside the nigerien embassy before 2000; in early 2000 they handed her over to an ex-Italian intelligence agent, who they knew had good contacts with other intelligence services and the Italian media. In late 2001 SISMI gave the forged documents to the embassy employee, who then passed them to the 'security consultant'.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #97
98. Muriel thanks, I kinda suspect this is planted by Rumsfeld Psyops
and Marshall taken in - it's a cover for Chalabi, who the cabal
loves and wants to save IMHO
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #98
99. Bobby Kennedy Jr saying on C Span: 6 corps own all 16,000
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 10:54 AM by Pallas180
news outlets in America.

On with Joe Conason and Sid Blumethal and Al FRanken
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TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #97
101. Thanks for pointing to TPM.
But that 'talkingpoint.com' link goes somewhere else; JMM is at http://talkingpointsmemo.com .

And since Josh admits that he et al. are being scooped now, why not speed up his deadline before they are scooped completely? I want NEWS NOW! I'm certain these forgery crimes are not totally extra-territorial in cast and crew.

Gimme eat!

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #101
102. TP - look at this re-post about Ledeen - "moles are us"
Minstrel Boy (1000+ posts) Sun Aug-01-04 11:08 AM


15. Arch neocon Michael Ledeen consulted for Italian military intelligence in the late 1970s, at the height of Italy's "strategy of tension": a campaign of false-flag terrorism designed to discredit the Italian left, waged by the fascist CIA asset Licio Gelli and his P2 lodge.

Ledeen is said to have been an "honorary member" of the lodge. When secret membership roles were published in the early 1980s, Silvio Berlusconi's name was found on it, long before he entered politics.

So, with P2 member Berlusconi in office, and neocon Ledeen's ties to the Italian far right and Italian intelligence, maybe this story comes into focus.

"...terrorism has been Ledeen's bread and butter since at least the late 1970s, when he consulted for Italian military intelligence."
http://www.tompaine.com/feature2.cfm/ID/8249

From Asia Times:

"Ledeen's right-wing Italian connections - including alleged ties to the P2 Masonic Lodge that rocked Italy in the early 1980s - have long been a source of speculation and intrigue, but he returned to Washington in 1981 as "anti-terrorism" advisor to the new secretary of state, Al Haig.

"Over the next several years, Ledeen used his position as consultant to Haig, the Pentagon and the National Security Council under Ronald Reagan to boost the notion of a global terrorist conspiracy based in the Kremlin, whose KGB pulled the strings of all of the world's key terrorist groups, especially in the Middle East."
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/EF26Ak03.html

"In 1980 he entered into a collaboration with Francesco Pazienza, an agent of the Italian secret service (SISMI) and a member of Rome's extreme right-wing Masonic Lodge, P2 (Propaganda Due), headed by the fascist Licio Gelli. In an Italian criminal court in 1985, Pazienza was judged guilty of political manipulation, forgery, and the protection of criminals and terrorists, among other offenses. Indeed, according to the findings of the court, Pazienza falsified information about the Bologna bombing in order to divert attention away from the real (right-wing) terrorists who had staged the attack."
(excerpt from Herman/O'Sullivan's The "Terrorism" Industry, 1989, quoted http://billmon.org/archives/000653.html ).

From Barbara Honegger's October Surprise, more on Ledeen and P2:

"When the Italian police raided (P2 Lodge founder) Gelli's home in March 1981, it was Michael Ledeen who, at the instigation of Alexander Haig and Henry Kissinger, offered to buy the list of 953 P2 members in an apparent attempt to keep it from becoming public. Henry Kissinger had also reportedly sent Ledeen to Italy to try to squash an investigation into his and Haig's involvement in the founding of P2.

"On the morning of August 2, 1980, a massive bomb since linked to Gelli...exploded in the waiting room of the central train station in Bologna, killing 81 people and injuring 200 others. General Santorito, the chief of Italy's military intelligence agency, SISMI, who was also reportedly a member of P2, testified in the wake of the bombing that it had been planned by the British-Swiss-American Montecarlo Comite, P2's "sister" organization based in Monaco. When P2 had come under increasing scrutiny in 1979, grandmaster Licio Gelli had reportedly made his base of operations the Montecarlo Comite.... Not surprisingly, reported members of the Montecarlo Comite are Gelli, Henry Kissinger, Alexander Haig and Michael Ledeen."

More here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...


http://www.paranoidlarry.com / http://www.globalresearch.ca / http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/index.jsp http://www.madcowprod.com / http://www.deepblacklies.co.uk / http://www.ndp.ca / http://xymphora.blogspot.com / "We have now sunk to a depth at which restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men." George Orwell




He's a current contributing editor for National Review


http://www.nationalreview.com/ledeen/ledeen200407261224 ...

_________________________________________________________________

"We have it, in our power, the ability to begin the world anew" -Thomas Paine

It was a think tank war, and he has the biggest tank:
the American Enterprise Institute.



http://www.paranoidlarry.com / http://www.globalresearch.ca / http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/index.jsp http://www.madcowprod.com / http://www.deepblacklies.co.uk / http://www.ndp.ca / http://xymphora.blogspot.com /



"We have now sunk to a depth at which restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men." George Orwell






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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #102
103. BINGO-LIGHTBULB - when the indictments come out


wouldn't it be coincidental if a bombing was planned to push the indictments off the front page....thus avoiding a demand for the impeachment of dimson.

A Rove specialty. Timing is everything

THAT's what they're setting us up for.

Not to coincide with the rethuglican convention, but with the
indictments!
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #102
108. Pallas180 that link not working please let me know were
it's from

Thanks
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #108
109. DREAM -try this link
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 12:16 PM by Pallas180
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

having visited Italy and known many citizens of that country,
not Italo-Americans, but really Italians....

They still love Mussolini - he made the trains run on time...

And since the 70's there has been resurgence of fascism sentiment
under other political names....but they still believe in it.

Makes sense Ledeen would have found a choir there.

BEgins to sound more and more like he actually IS a spy - and not
the U.S.'s
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:51 AM
Response to Reply #101
105. Oops - yes, do as I paste, not as I type
Follow the long URL link to the actual article.

I guess he's tied to the monthly deadline of 'Washington Monthly', since he's cooperating with another journalist; and the TV agreement may be for them to come out at around the same time to support each other.

Yes, you'd think there's more to this than Italian intelligence doing the forgery - that would be the least controversial outcome.
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ramblin_dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:46 AM
Response to Original message
104. CIA Leak Probe: Powell's Grand-Jury Appearance
Newsweek report:

CIA Leak Probe: Powell's Grand-Jury Appearance

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5570006/site/newsweek /

Secretary of State Colin Powell recently testified before a federal grand jury investigating the leak of the identity of CIA covert officer Valerie Plame, NEWSWEEK has learned. Powell's appearance on July 16 is the latest sign the probe being conducted by prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald is highly active and broader than has been publicly known. Sources close to the case say prosecutors were interested in discussions Powell had while with ... George W. Bush on a trip to Africa in July 2003, just before Plame's identity was leaked to columnist Robert Novak.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #104
106. WOW - Ftizgerald is really looking at the dimson.
:bounce:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #106
107. More to theory of burying PLAME Indictment news by"imminent attack" method
What does Code REd - used for imminent attaack mean to you and me?

In other words, the possibility of an impending attack on America by this "outside enemy" has been accepted by the American public; this tacit acceptance has set the stage for the adoption of "the highest threat level": code red alert.

What the US public is not aware of, is that a code red alert suspends civilian government; it triggers a whole series of emergency procedures; it is tantamount to a coup d'etat -- although in many regards the coup d'etat has already taken place under the post-9/11 anti-terrorist legislation and the rigging of the 2000 elections which brought George W. Bush intothe White House.


Preparing for Code Red
Homeland Security (DHS) has in fact been contemplating a code red alert "scenario" -- using Al Qaeda as a pretext -- for more than a year. In May 2003, the DHS conducted a major "anti-terrorist exercise" entitled TOPOFF 2. The latter was described as "the largest and most comprehensive terrorism response and homeland security exercise ever conducted in the United States." The exercise was based on code red assumptions involving a simulated terrorist attack.
See: http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO402A.html . A code red alert, according to the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), would create conditions for the ("temporary" we are told) suspension of the normal functions of civilian government, implying the cancellation or postponement of federal and State elections.

According to FEMA, code red would:

Increase or redirect personnel to address critical emergency needs; Assign emergency response personnel and pre-position and mobilize specially trained teams or resources; monitor, redirect, or constrain transportation systems; and close public and government facilities not critical forcontinuity of essential operations, especially public safety.(FEMA, http://www.fema.gov/pdf/areyouready/security.pdf )

Northern Command would take over. Several functions of civilian administration would be suspended; others could be transferred to the jurisdiction of the military. More generally, the procedure would disrupt government offices, businesses, schools, public services, transportation, etc.

A secret "Shadow Government" under the classified "Continuity of Operations Plan" was installed on September 11, 2001.(See: http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A205842002Feb2... ). Known internally as "Continuity of Government" or COG, the secret shadow government would become functional in the case of a code red alert, redeploying key staff to secret locations.

Code red alert would, according to FEMA, also preclude and repress any form of public gathering or citizens' protest which questions the legitimacy of the emergency procedures and the installation of a police state. The emergency authorities would also exert tight censorship over the media and would no doubt paralyze the alternative news media on the internet.

Code red alert would trigger the "civilian" Homeland Emergency response system. The latteris already in place including DHS Ready.Gov instructions, the Big Brother Citizen Corps, not to mention the USAonWatch or Neighborhood Watch Program which has a mandate to "identify and report suspicious activity in neighbourhoods" across America.


The Role of the Military
What would be the involvement of the Military in a code red emergency situation?

In theory, The Posse Comitatus Act of 1878 prevents the military from intervening in civilian police and judicial functions.

In practice, the Posse Comitatus Act is dead (see Frank Morales at http://globalresearch.ca/articles/MOR309A.html ).
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #107
115. Pallas, you should chip in here
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #115
119. kgfnally - you should chip in here --LOL -
:hi:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #107
118. 12:45 pm sUNDAY - WASH DC JUST MOVED TO ORANGE HIGH LEVEL
GODDAMMIT.
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #118
123. Maybe the indictments are
coming!!! Notice it's Wash. D.C. and not New York.
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coeur_de_lion Donating Member (935 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
116. Powell Testified in CIA Leak Investigation
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20040...


WARSAW (Reuters) - Secretary of State Colin Powell (news - web sites) has spoken to a grand jury probing whether Bush aides leaked the name of a CIA (news - web sites) agent to retaliate against her husband, an Iraq (news - web sites) war critic, the State Department said Sunday.

State Department spokesman Richard Boucher said Powell spoke to the grand jury on July 16 about the case of CIA officer Valerie Plame, whose name surfaced in a piece written by columnist Robert Novak after her husband raised questions in public about the intelligence used to justify the Iraq war.

Boucher declined specific comment on the testimony but he stressed Powell had not talked to Novak about Plame. He said the secretary of state was not a subject of the investigation.

Revealing such classified information is a federal crime punishable by up to 10 years in prison. Connecting the leak to any of President Bush (news - web sites)'s senior aides would be an embarrassment to the president in an election year.

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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #116
120. What did he know, and when did he know it?
"Boucher declined specific comment on the testimony but he stressed Powell had not talked to Novak about Plame. He said the secretary of state was not a subject of the investigation."

To me, this says that perhaps Powell might spill a few beans. SURELY by this point he realizes how deep in Shit River they all are.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:56 PM
Response to Reply #120
125. Powell plays the good soldier forever. he wont spill nuttin, especially
not to a grand jury.

No he does his thing by press leaks
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #116
121. This just gets
interestinger and interestinger.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #121
126. Here ORIGINAL NORTHWOOD DOCUMENTS-our Military plan to attack US citizens
to make American citizens angry enough to support war......

I THINK WE SHOULD MAIL/ FAX THIS TO EVERY CONGRESS PERSON AND SAY WE KNOW! WE KNOW! AND YOU'D BETTER REMOVE THIS ADMINISTRATION OR YOU WILL BE OBSTRUCTING JUSTICE AND DESERVE JAIL TERMS FOR TREASON ALONG WITH THE WHITE HOUSE.


http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/jointchiefs ...

picture of Lemnitzer


Operation Northwoods: The Pentagons Secret Plot to Murder US Citizens to Provoke a War September 13, 2002

General Lyman L. Lemnitzer. Credit: NATO.

On May 1, 2001, ABC News broadcast a chilling revelation: In the early 1960s, America's top military leaders reportedly drafted plans to kill innocent people and commit acts of terrorism in US cities to create public support for a war against Cuba.
http://more.abcnews.go.com/sections/us/dailynews/jointc...

The Pentagons secret Operation Northwoods proposed that the US assassinate Cuban migrs, hijack planes, sink ships, and stage an incident of violent terrorism in US cities. The Joint Chiefs at the time were headed by Army Gen. Lyman L. Lemnitzer.

The Pentagons top brass were even willing to murder US troops, if thats what it took to stampede the country into a war. "We could blow up a US ship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba," they wrote, noting with cold logic that, "casualty lists in US newspapers would cause a helpful wave of national indignation."

The Joint Chiefs even saw the potential death of astronaut John Glenn as an opportunity to falsely provoke a war with Cuba. If Glenns rocket failed to make it safely into orbit, the Pentagon was prepared to falsely accuse Cuba of shooting down Glenns space capsule.

An analysis of Operation Northwood is contained in James Bamfords new book, Body of Secrets (Doubleday) discloses that the plans were approved by the Joint Chiefs of Staff and presented to President Kennedy's Defense Secretary Robert McNamara on March 13, 1962. Lemnitzer argued that Operation Northwoods should be run by the military but McNamara apparently had second thoughts. The civilians in the White House overruled the soldiers in the Pentagon and the plan was rejected. All copies of the memorandum were ordered destroyed. The existence of the plot remained undisclosed for nearly 40 years.

"Although no one in Congress could have known at the time," Bamford writes, "Lemnitzer and the Joint Chiefs had quietly slipped over the edge." Bamford characterized the Joint Chiefs plot as, perhaps the most corrupt plan ever created by the US government." But even after Lemnitzer retired, Bamford charges, the Joint Chiefs continued to plan similar "pretext" operations at least through 1963.

The documents only saw the light of day after the popular success of Oliver Stones 1992 blockbuster film JFK about the Kennedy assassination. Congress passed a law to increase public access to government records related to the assassination. In the process of combing through reams of declassified papers, a single surviving copy of the 15-page memo on Operation Northwoods was discovered.

Particularly disturbing especially in the aftermath of the many unanswered questions surrounding the September 11 terrorist attack is the Pentagons elaborate plan to falsely trigger a war by staging the fake destruction of a civilian commercial jetliner.

The document is reprinted below in its entirety. A PDF version of the actual 15-page document is available at the website of George Washington Universitys National Security Archive project: <www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010430 >



The first page of the 15-page Operation Northwoods terror plot. Credit: The National Security Archives/George Washington University <http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv />.
TOP SECRET SPECIAL HANDLING NOFORN (declassified 2000)
The Joint Chiefs of Staff Washington DC Memorandum for the Secretary of Defense

SUBJECT: Justification for U.S. Military Intervention in Cuba (TS)

JCS to Secretary of War Robert McNamara March 13, 1962

The Joint Chiefs of Staff have considered the attatched memorandum for the chief of Operations, Cuba Project, which responds to a request by that office for brief but precise description of pretexts which would provide justification for US military intervention in Cuba.


The Joint Chiefs of Staff recommend that the proposed memorandum be forwarded as a preliminary submission suitable for planning purproses. It is assumed that there will be similar submissions from other agencies and that these inputs will be used as a basis for developing a time-phased plan. Individual projects can then be considered on a case-by-case basis.


Further, it is assumed that a single agency will be given the primary responsibility for developing military and para-military aspects of the basic plan. It is recommended that this responsibility for both overt and covert military operations be assigned to the Joint Chiefs of Staff.
For the Joint Chiefs of Staff signed: L.L. Limnitzer Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff

Note by the Secretaries to the Joint Chiefs of Staff on Northwoods

Footnoted memorandums:
"Operation Mongoose"
"Instances to Provoke Military Actions in Cuba"
RECOMMENDATIONS:
This paper NOT be forwarded to commanders of specified or unified commands.

This paper NOT be forwarded to US officers assigned to NATO activities.

This paper NOT be forwarded to the Chairman, US Delegation, United Nations Military Staff Committee.

Such a plan would enable a logical buildup of incidents to be combined with other seemingly unrelated events to camoflage the ultimate objective and create the necessary impression of Cuban rashness and irresponsibility on a large scale, directed at other countries in addition to the United States. The desired resultant from the execution of this plan would be to place the United States in the apparent position of suffering defensible grievances.
1. A series of well-coordinated incidents will be planned to take place to give genuine appearance of being done by hostile Cuban forces.

2. Incidents to establish a credible attack:
1. Start rumors (many). Use clandestine radio. 2. Land friendly Cubans in uniform "over-the-fence" to stage attack on the base. 3. Capture Cuban (friendly) sabateurs inside the base. 4. Start riots near the entrance to the base (friendly Cubans). 5. Blow up ammunition inside the base; start fires. 6. Burn aircraft on airbase (sabatage) . 7. Lob morter shells from outsidethe base to inside the base. Some damage to installation. 8. Capture assault teams. 9. Capture militia group which storms the base. 10. Sabotage ship in harbor; large fires -- napthalene . 11. Sink ship near harbor entrance. Conduct funerals for mock-victims.

(b) United States would respond by executing offensive operations.
3. A "Remember the Maine" incident could be arranged in several forms:
We could blow up a US ship and blame Cuba.

We could blow up a drone (unmannded) vessel anywhere in the Cuban waters. The presense of Cuban planes or ships merely investigating the intent of the vessel could be fairly compelling evidence that the ship was taken under attack. The US could follow with an air/sea rescue operation covered by US fighters to "evacuate" remaining members of the non-existant crew. Casualty lists in US newspapers would cause a helpful wave of national indignation.
4. We could develop a Communist Cuba terror campaign in the Miami area, in other Flordia cities and even in Washington. The terror campaign could be pointed at Cuban refugees seeking haven in the United States. We could sink a boatload of Cubans enroute to Florida (real or simulated). We could foster attempts on lives of Cubans in the United States even to the extent of wounding in instances to be widely publicized. Exploding a few bombs in carefully chosen spots. The arrest of Cuban agents and the release of prepared documents substantiating cuban involvement.

5. A "Cuban-based, Castro-supported" filibuster could be simulated against a neighboring Caribbean nation. These efforts can be magnified with additional ones contrived for exposure. "Cuban" B-26 or C-46 type aircraft could make cane-burning raids at night. Soviet Bloc incidiaries could be found. This could be coupled with "Cuban" messages to the Communist underground and "Cuban" shipments of arms which would be found, or intercepted, on the beach.

6. Use of MIG-type aircraft by US pilots could provide additional provocation. Harassment of civil air, attacks on surface shipping, and destruction of US military drone aircraft by MIG type palnes would be useful. An F-86 properly painted would convince air passengers that they saw a Cuban MIG, especially if the pilot of the transport were to announce that fact.

7. Hijacking attampts against US civil air and surface craft should be encouraged.

8. It is possible to create an incident which would demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civilian airliner from the United States.
An aircraft at Eglin AFB would be painted and numbered as an exact duplicate for a civil registered aircraft belonging to a CIA proprietary organization in the Miami area. At a designated time the duplicate would be substituted for the actual civil aircraft and the passengers, all boarded under carefully prepared aliases. The actual registered aircraft would be converted to a drone.

Take off times of the drone aircraft and the actual aircraft will be scheduled to allow a rondevous. From the rondevous point the passenger-carrying aircraft will descend to minimum altitude and go directly to an auxiliary airfield at Eglin AFB where arrangements will have been made to evacuate the passengers and return the aircraft to its original status. Meanwhile the drone aircraft will continue to fly the filed flight plan. The drone will be transmitting on the international distress frequency "MAY DAY" message stating it is under attack by Cuban MIG aircraft. The transmission will be interrupted by the destruction of aircraft which will be triggered by radio signal. This will allow IACO radio stations to tell the US what has happened to the aircraft instead of the US trying to "sell" the incident.
9. It is possible to create an incident that will make it appear that Communist Cuban MIGs have destroyed a USAF aircraft over international waters in an unprovoked attack.
On one such flight, a pre-briefed pilot would fly Tail-end Charlie. While near the Cuban island this pilot would broadcast that he had been jumped by MIGs and was going down. This pilot would then fly at extremely low altitude and land at a secure base, an Eglin auxiliary. The aircraft would be met by the proper people, quickly stored and given a new tail number. The pilot who performed the mission under an alias would resume his proper identity. The pilot and aircraft would then have disappeared.

A submarine or small craft would distribute F-101 parts, parachute, etc. The pilots retuning to Homestead would have a true story as far as they knew. Search ships and aircraft could be dispatched and parts of aircraft found.

It is understood that the Department of State is also preparing suggested courses of action to develope justification for US military intervention in Cuba.



_______________________________________________________

FBI Anthrax Investigator Fingers the CIA
By the Eco-Mole

Not everyone in the FBI is clueless. Don Foster is an FBI forensic linguistics specialist who used his ability to analyze written messages to convict Unabomber Ted Kaczynski and unmasked reporter Joe Klein as the unnamed author of the satirical political novel Primary Colors.

Professor Foster has been on the trail of the anthrax attacker who placed weapons-grade spores in the US mail, killing five, injuring 18 and compelling 35,000 others to take antibiotic countermeasures.

Foster was interviewed by the BBC as part of its August 18 report, The Hunt for the Anthrax Killer. Foster told the BBC that he had only been given four letters to examine and found the task very frustrating. Ordinarily, with the FBI, if theres some documents needed known writings boom, theyre on my desk the next day. Foster told the BBC he feels that the FBI is not getting full and complete co-operation from the US military, CIA and witnesses who might have information about this case.

It is unlikely that Foster will be getting any such cooperation soon for, as he told the BBC, My two suspects both appear to have CIA connections. Both suspects worked for the CIA, the US Army Medical Research Institute of Infectious Diseases, and other top-secret military projects.

As I worked through these documents, it became apparent that USAMRID was ultimately the best place for the FBI to begin looking for a suspect, Foster stated. He told the BBC that the use of the date September 11 and the phrase Death to America was intended to confuse investigators. When an offender gives you some piece of information thats just completely unnecessary and that, in this case, is inaccurate, it becomes immediately suspect. It becomes a statement of Heres what I want to you to believe about this document.

The letter-writer suggested that people exposed to anthrax spores should take penicillin. Penicillin is useless against anthrax and the word was misspelled in such an unconvincing way, it looks like an attempt on the offender to say Hey, dont think Im a scientist; dont think I know anything about antibiotics.

The killer dropped the envelopes in mailboxes near the homes of two former USAMRIID scientists. Only someone with insider information would have known that these researchers would be likely targets for FBI investigators, Foster observed. That suggested the perpetrator was someone whos a little bit higher up the food chain, who would have access to personnel information.
For more information contact:
Contact the websites and resources listed in the above article.


THE-EDGE is a project of Earth Island Institute.

(510) THE-EDGE (843-3343)
E-mail us at gsmith@earthisland.org
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Papa Donating Member (505 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #126
129. That's intersesting
someone whos a little bit higher up the food chain, who would have access to personnel information.

my guess,

The same folks that also had access to personnel records to out Plame.

The same folks that also took cipro before the anthrax arrived in DC.




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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #129
132. this part of Northwoods operation - sound familiar?
2. Incidents to establish a credible attack:
1. Start rumors (many). Use clandestine radio. 2. Land friendly Cubans in uniform "over-the-fence" to stage attack on the base. 3. Capture Cuban (friendly) sabateurs inside the base. 4. Start riots near the entrance to the base (friendly Cubans). 5. Blow up ammunition inside the base; start fires. 6. Burn aircraft on airbase (sabatage) . 7. Lob morter shells from outsidethe base to inside the base. Some damage to installation. 8. Capture assault teams. 9. Capture militia group which storms the base. 10. Sabotage ship in harbor; large fires -- napthalene . 11. Sink ship near harbor entrance. Conduct funerals for mock-victims.

(b) United States would respond by executing offensive operations.
3. A "Remember the Maine" incident could be arranged in several forms:
We could blow up a US ship and blame Cuba.
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-03-04 12:42 AM
Response to Reply #129
250. Actually they took Cipro starting on 9-11! What a cowinkydink.
Edited on Tue Aug-03-04 12:42 AM by Jim Sagle
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NewJeffCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #126
167. great post - I'm waiting for the new Northwoods
I believe JFK was the one that finally nixed the plan. Would a similar plan executed in 2004 be nixed by Bush? I don't think so...

I've been saying this for a while now - I fully expect terror attacks in the United States in September and/or October to be blamed on Iran and/or Syria. It will actually be a new division of the Office of Special Plans, but carefully done allow us to blame Islamic extremists. The corporate massmedia will beat the war drum and tell us that the patriotic thing for us to do is rally 'round our great War President in our time of fear.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #121
127. Operation Mongoose - why does that name sound familiar?.
?
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #127
133. By the way, nutsy dimson - red alert & Full Moon today.
it figures
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #133
134. Pallas...read this and
let me know what your take is on it.

<http://www.public-action.com/911/northwds.html >
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #134
135. Schraby counter psy-ops misdirect - kinda like what was
attempted here with these threads..

basing the whole thing on term "on holiday"...we have canadians
and brits in the pent..and we send our people to live over there
where another countries' expressions are picked up....

I can't tell you how many times people insist I'm not American
because sometimes my phrasing is odd - backwards as if thought
in another language...comes from working in an import=export firm
for years with people who did speak another language and not American.

What do I think of her stuff?

Bulldoody. hee hee hee

What do you think of it?
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #135
136. Cheez, they're making a whole non stop thing on all stations
of this terra alert.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #136
137. kick the cabal
out.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #136
145. Hmm...MIHOP this week?
If so, we know the indictments are on the way.

Hey Pallas, read my response to the Wayne Madsen article you posted above. I think Fitzgerald knows which end is up. We just need to make Madsen connect the dots.

On second thought, we should send letters to both of them!
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #135
138. I'm not sure.
It kinda was like a pooh pooh, but not really. That's why I got a second opinion.<G>
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #138
141. Krugman on Jebby's voting machines:
Fear of Fraud
By PAUL KRUGMAN

Published: July 27, 2004

t's election night, and early returns suggest trouble for the incumbent. Then, mysteriously, the vote count stops and observers from the challenger's campaign see employees of a voting-machine company, one wearing a badge that identifies him as a county official, typing instructions at computers with access to the vote-tabulating software.

When the count resumes, the incumbent pulls ahead. The challenger demands an investigation. But there are no ballots to recount, and election officials allied with the incumbent refuse to release data that could shed light on whether there was tampering with the electronic records.

This isn't a paranoid fantasy. It's a true account of a recent election in Riverside County, Calif., reported by Andrew Gumbel of the British newspaper The Independent. Mr. Gumbel's full-length report, printed in Los Angeles City Beat, makes hair-raising reading not just because it reinforces concerns about touch-screen voting, but also because it shows how easily officials can stonewall after a suspect election.

Some states, worried about the potential for abuse with voting machines that leave no paper trail, have banned their use this November. But Florida, which may well decide the presidential race, is not among those states, and last month state officials rejected a request to allow independent audits of the machines' integrity. A spokesman for Gov. Jeb Bush accused those seeking audits of trying to "undermine voters' confidence," and declared, "The governor has every confidence in the Department of State and the Division of Elections."

Should the public share that confidence? Consider the felon list.

Florida law denies the vote to convicted felons. In 2000 the state hired a firm to purge supposed felons from the list of registered voters; these voters were turned away from the polls. After the election, determined by 537 votes, it became clear that thousands of people had been wrongly disenfranchised. Since those misidentified as felons were disproportionately Democratic-leaning African-Americans, these errors may have put George W. Bush in the White House.

This year, Florida again hired a private company - Accenture, which recently got a homeland security contract worth up to $10 billion - to prepare a felon list. Remembering 2000, journalists sought copies. State officials stonewalled, but a judge eventually ordered the list released.

The Miami Herald quickly discovered that 2,100 citizens who had been granted clemency, restoring their voting rights, were nonetheless on the banned-voter list. Then The Sarasota Herald-Tribune discovered that only 61 of more than 47,000 supposed felons were Hispanic. So the list would have wrongly disenfranchised many legitimate African-American voters, while wrongly enfranchising many Hispanic felons. It escaped nobody's attention that in Florida, Hispanic voters tend to support Republicans.

After first denying any systematic problem, state officials declared it an innocent mistake. They told Accenture to match a list of registered voters to a list of felons, flagging anyone whose name, date of birth and race was the same on both lists. They didn't realize, they said, that this would automatically miss felons who identified themselves as Hispanic because that category exists on voter rolls but not in state criminal records.

But employees of a company that prepared earlier felon lists say that they repeatedly warned state election officials about that very problem.

Let's not be coy. Jeb Bush says he won't allow an independent examination of voting machines because he has "every confidence" in his handpicked election officials. Yet those officials have a history of slipshod performance on other matters related to voting and somehow their errors always end up favoring Republicans. Why should anyone trust their verdict on the integrity of voting machines, when another convenient mistake could deliver a Republican victory in a high-stakes national election?

This shouldn't be a partisan issue. Think about what a tainted election would do to America's sense of itself, and its role in the world. In the face of official stonewalling, doubters probably wouldn't be able to prove one way or the other whether the vote count was distorted - but if the result looked suspicious, most of the world and many Americans would believe the worst. I'll write soon about what can be done in the few weeks that remain, but here's a first step: if Governor Bush cares at all about the future of the nation, as well as his family's political fortunes, he will allow that independent audit.
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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
140. You guys see this thread? Sibel Edmonds & Ray McGovern on radio at 7
Ray McGovern & Sibel Edmonds - intell insiders on the air 7 pm Eastern

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #140
148. Thanks steviet!
I'd love to get a transcript of it!
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #148
150. Hi RP
how goesit?

This has been one heck of a thread of discoveries.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #150
153. One more before I say gnite. Rumsfeld
Edited on Sun Aug-01-04 11:28 PM by Pallas180
These people are seriously mentally ill:


Gail Sheehy writes:

The report, written by the neo-conservative think tank Project for the New American Century, also advocated regime change in China, North Korea, Libya, Syria, and Iran. An unnamed British member of Parliament was quoted as saying of the report: This is a blueprint for U.S. domination--a new world order of their making. The report also complained that the changes it recommended were likely to take a long time, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing eventlike a new Pearl Harbor. In the summer of 2001, when security agencies were regularly warning of a catastrophic attack by Al Qaeda, Defense Secretary Rumsfelds office sponsored a study of ancient empiresMacedonia, Rome, the Mongolsto figure out how they maintained dominance, according to the New York Times.


http://www.motherjones.com/news/update/2004/07/07_400.h...
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Me. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #140
149. Operation Mongoose
Operation Mongoose



" Details of the campaign have been seeping out for years, but now, thanks to the persistent efforts of the Assassinations Record Review Board (ARRB), the full story of secret Mongoose PSYOP is available to the public. The board was created by Congress to oversee the release of documents relating to the murder of President Kennedy. Some of its most significant recent releases have focused on the Defense Department's involvement in Kennedy-era covert action against Cuba."



Operation Mongoose: The Psyop Papers
http://www.parascope.com/ds/articles/mongoosePSYOP.htm

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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:11 PM
Response to Reply #149
151. Thanks ME. I have the impression I read something to do with Op Mongoose w
with reference to this Iraqi war.

What I would love to know is who was on the Joint Chiefs of Staff
with Lemnitzer who came up with the idea of attacking US citizens.

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Me. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #151
154. Well for Starters
He was named supreme allied commander for Nato in '63

and then

Lemnitzer retired from the military in July 1969. In 1975, President Ford appointed Lemnitzer to the Commission on CIA Activities within the United States (aka the Rockefeller Commission) to investigate whether the Central Intelligence Agency had committed acts that violated American laws.

So his circle of acquaintances could include anyone



http://www.campusprogram.com/reference/en/wikipedia/l/l...
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-04 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #154
156. Some of the bunch in our
threads go back to Nixon (or earlier).
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kohodog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #156
159. Hey Everybody, keep your heads up!
Together we (the people) can beat this scourge. Sometimes I feel small and insignificant, but I think that together we can turn things around, but we must increase our tribe.

Keep writing those letters! Talk to your family and friends. It's not too late, and while Kerry may not be the solution, he's a step in the right direction.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 09:32 AM
Response to Reply #154
164. Thanks ME. Odd, he was fired
Edited on Mon Aug-02-04 09:33 AM by Pallas180
by JFK and then turns up Supreme Allied Commander for Nato in 63?

Before or after JFK's death?

Ford's administration had Cheney and Rumsfeld and the rest of the
crew in it.

Nutty Lemnitzer with his ideas of attacking the U.S. was appointed
to investigate CIA.

What a joke. Shows how American citizens are
fooled....and by sealing of records never find out the truth till
25 years later.
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milkyway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 12:01 AM
Response to Original message
158. Joe Wilson said he is pessimistic about the Plame investigation.
He was at a Harvard Book Store book signing on Thursday. A serious blogger, William Kaminsky, recaps what he said and has a long discusssion of it. He also has this very interesting point made by Wilson:

In response to a question along the lines of "How do you think the Fitzgerald probe will turn out?" from the man in front of me in the book-signing line, Ambassador Wilson gave the following interesting analysis tying the success of the Fitzgerald probe to the accusations against Berger:

The long-running FBI investigation into whether Sandy Berger had criminally mishandled classified documents was publicized in order to send the message that if the Fitzgerald grand jury indicts White House officials for blowing my wife's cover, then there will be retaliation by levelling criminal charges against Berger.



----------
http://williamkaminsky.typepad.com/too_many_worlds/2004...


Also, Matthew Yglesias has a bit of commentary on the Plame investigation:

Various things (noted elsewhere) suggest that the Plame inquiry should be coming to a conclusion soon. Joe Wilson told me the other day that he had a lot of confidence in US Attorney Fitzgerald and the FBI guy who was heading up that end of things. He also said that, in his opinion, it might well be impossible to prove the sort of intent that's necessary for a criminal charge and we won't see anything filed. Since, obviously, no one's more riled up about this than Wilson, I think that means no fair crying foul if Fitzgerald wins up not indicting anyone.
----------
http://yglesias.typepad.com/matthew/
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kohodog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 12:10 AM
Response to Reply #158
160. milk, I beg to differ
Berger has been cleared, and according to many reports the investigation has gone far beyond the "outing" of Plame. I'll give you a break for now, but I don't think you've read many of these threads. Spend a few minutes catching up and I think you'll find some interesting stuff.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #160
165. Agreed. Does anyone have an address for Fitzgerald? Its
time, more than time, for us to send the letters at the top
laying out the exposing of Plame to the very possible ulterior motives of Cheney.

Cheney has to go before dimson can be impeached or removed from
office.

That also means sending those letters to the republican senators
and house reps - including Hastert.

These scummies need to know that the American public is on to them.
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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 12:01 PM
Response to Reply #165
175. Here ya go
Patrick J. Fitzgerald
United States Attorney

Phone: (312) 353-5300

US Attorney's Office
219 S. Dearborn St.
Suite 5000
Chicago, IL 60656

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/iln/patrickjfizgerald.html

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/iln/index.html#ContactUs
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spotbird Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #158
169. Those are pretty depressing assessments.
But there is always obstruction of justice, Martha knows all about that.

It's not the crime it's the cover-up.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 10:42 AM
Response to Reply #169
170. SPOTBIRD - Yes, but if we don't communicate to them
by letter and fax that we the American public know about
it; they won't be pushed to indict and bring criminal charges.

Free Fax from ACLU site, you can copy and paste any version of this letter or write your own comments but TAKE ACTION!

http://www.aclu.org/Privacy/Privacy.cfm?ID=11323&c=130


Any version of this might scare the hell out of them:


Dear ____________


Concerning Time magazine's Joe Klein's July 5 article, page 21 revealed that Valerie Plame was "active in a sting operation involving the trafficking of Weapons of Mass Destruction components"" when her identity was exposed by the White House. It also said" Only a high-ranking official could have had access to the knowledge" that Valerie Plame was a covert CIA agent.

1) Our study group has found that Vice President Cheney since 1995 as CEO of Halliburton was fined 1.2 milion dollars for illegal sales of similar components to Libya. Shortly before becoming Vice President he bitterly assailed US policy against selling such components to Syrria and Iran, which apparently hurt Halliburton's bottom line.

2) Our study group has also found that there is an investigation of Vice President Cheney in other countries for illegal bribery and various other offenses connected to Halliburton as well as paying amounts to secret Swiss bank accounts

3)The Atomic Energy Commission has said a North American company is one of 20 being investigated for black market sales of WMD materials.

Our study group suspects there is more to the White House revealing Valerie Plame's covert CIA status since the Republicans refuse to hold investigations on the matter.

Frankly, it would appear to us that possibly Valerie Plame was stopped in her tracks and the CIA sting operation was exposed because it was coming close to discovering another violation of the laws by our own Vice President and the Hallibuton company he has awarded billions of US taxpayer dollars to in non-bid contracts.

There is a question of where the Vice President's and President's loyalty lies: to their Corporate friends and company's bottom line or to the security and wellbeing of the America.n people?

In any case, the exposure of Valerie Plame by the White House was and is treasonous.

The responsibility of the Media and Congress is to expose these wrong doings, investigate, BRING APPLICABLE CRIMINAL CHARGES, and safeguard our country against this type of occurrence .

WHY are you not fulfilling your role to me, to my study group, and the rest of the American people in this country and WHEN will you start ?


Sincerely



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0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #158
178. I've read both links and I don't buy it.
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milkyway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #178
185. The purpose of my post wasn't to disagree with these threads,
it was simply to pass on what two bloggers are reporting that Wilson has said. I hope Wilson is wrong. I've been keeping up with these threads, and tend to agree with most of what's here.

Regarding the credibility of the bloggers, I have been reading Yglesias for a while. He does work for The American Prospect. I find him thoughtful and highly credible. I was unaware of the other blogger, William Kaminsky, until I found Yglesias' link to him. Like Yglesias, he seems very thoughtful and credible.

So assuming that Wilson said what he is reported to have said, we are left with Wilson's pessimistic assessment that it will be difficult to get a conviction. But there has not been much info coming from Fitzgerald's investigation, so Wilson may just be speculating with no more info than anyone else has.

After thinking about it, what Wilson said about Berger does not make any sense to me. He said the bush admin is letting it be known that if their are indictments in the Plame case, then they will go after Berger. But it's not the Dems or any partisan group investigating Plame. It's Fitzgerald, a repug (apparently an honorable one), working under asscroft. The Dems really have nothing to do with this. They weren't involved in Wilson writing his NYT op-ed, or in Novak's decision to out his wife, or in the investigation of it. So I don't understand where Wilson is coming from here.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #185
194. Milkyway..that's the cabal's mode of operation. Smear and threaten
and yes, they did go after SAndy Berger to #1 take attention away from Kerry and make Kerry look bad as well as Berger and Clinton...
the news of Berger came out same time 911 commission report came out

get it...draw attention away from their bad news, by pointing elsewhere.

And Wilson knows them.

If Plame results in indictments, they will dig up some phony crime
on Kerry or Edwards or Clinton's people

The politics of destruction.

See?
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #178
188. What aren't you buying?
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burrowowl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 03:22 AM
Response to Original message
161. Kick
Just got back from Mexico after 10 days. Have a lot of catching up to do.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #161
166. Hi BURROW, welcome back.
vacation?

getting ready to relocate ?

:)

:hi:
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burrowowl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #166
187. To see my Uncle who is 93
How he drove in Mexico DF until 91 I will never know. My Father died in May at 84, the youngest, so now only Beto is left. Then we went to see my grandmother's grave in Cuernavaca. We did stay for 2 1/2 days in DF visiting former haunts, since going to/from the Lago de Guadalupe takes a fews hours each day. I picked up a eco-mag and DF has 354 cars per kilometer of road in DF, I think that only Bangkok is worse than DF.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #161
174. Kick it to kick that treasonous traitor out of the WH
:kick:
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Snazzy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 04:15 AM
Response to Original message
163. Josh Marshall GD/LBN thread links (and kick)
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #163
168. SNAZZY - That's why I think it's Rummy's disinformation operation
Edited on Mon Aug-02-04 09:53 AM by Pallas180
BErlusconi is with the "coalition" - hard right.

Suddenly some little fish says Italian intel gave him the
Niger forgery.

And where did Italian intel get the forgery from ? ? ?

Who and Why would "a" group want the world to believe Saddam
had been seeking elelments to make WMD????

Yeah.

That's why this latest revelation appears to me to be more of
Rummy's cover-up/disinformation/OSP services.

Yeah...your link from LBN is exactly what I'm saying:

"Who wants to bet that this was a personal favor to either aWol or Cheny from Berlusconi."

absolutely.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 10:53 AM
Response to Original message
171. Good Morning you giant brain DU think tank -ers :)
:hi:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 10:55 AM
Response to Original message
172. FREE FAX TO CONGRESS -
Edited on Mon Aug-02-04 11:06 AM by Pallas180
if we don't communicate to them by letter and fax that we the American public know about it; they won't be pushed to indict and bring criminal charges.

Free Fax from ACLU site, you can copy and paste any version of this letter or write your own comments but TAKE ACTION!

http://www.aclu.org/Privacy/Privacy.cfm?ID=11323&c=130

(Be sure to check box with instead of e mail)


Any version of this might scare the hell out of them:


Dear ____________


Concerning Time magazine's Joe Klein's July 5 article, page 21 revealed that Valerie Plame was "active in a sting operation involving the trafficking of Weapons of Mass Destruction components"" when her identity was exposed by the White House. It also said" Only a high-ranking official could have had access to the knowledge" that Valerie Plame was a covert CIA agent.

1) Our study group has found that Vice President Cheney since 1995 as CEO of Halliburton was fined 1.2 milion dollars for illegal sales of similar components to Libya. Shortly before becoming Vice President he bitterly assailed US policy against selling such components to Syrria and Iran, which apparently hurt Halliburton's bottom line.

2) Our study group has also found that there is an investigation of Vice President Cheney in other countries for illegal bribery and various other offenses connected to Halliburton as well as paying amounts to secret Swiss bank accounts

3)The Atomic Energy Commission has said a North American company is one of 20 being investigated for black market sales of WMD materials.

Our study group suspects there is more to the White House revealing Valerie Plame's covert CIA status since the Republicans refuse to hold investigations on the matter.

Frankly, it would appear to us that possibly Valerie Plame was stopped in her tracks and the CIA sting operation was exposed because it was coming close to discovering another violation of the laws by our own Vice President and the Hallibuton company he has awarded billions of US taxpayer dollars to in non-bid contracts.

There is a question of where the Vice President's and President's loyalty lies: to their Corporate friends and company's bottom line or to the security and wellbeing of the America.n people?

In any case, the exposure of Valerie Plame by the White House was and is treasonous.

The responsibility of the Media and Congress is to expose these wrong doings, investigate, BRING APPLICABLE CRIMINAL CHARGES, and safeguard our country against this type of occurrence .

WHY are you not fulfilling your role to me, to my study group, and the rest of the American people in this country and WHEN will you start ?


Sincerely





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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #172
173. FAX CONGRESS - NO PATRIOT - NO LAURENCE SILBERMAN
Edited on Mon Aug-02-04 11:42 AM by Pallas180
That's the far right wing judge that kept Starr on Clinton for
years and years.

That Awol is such a lying sunuvabith.



Free Fax from ACLU site, you can copy and paste any version of this letter or write your own comments but TAKE ACTION!

(BE SURE TO CHECK BOX " LETTER" INSTEAD OF E MAIL, WE DONT THINK THEY READ EMAIL)

http://www.aclu.org/Privacy/Privacy.cfm?ID=11323&c=130
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #173
176. a simple kick
Because Pallas is being nagged ;)

:kick:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #176
177. LOL
:) :hi:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #172
198. Let them know we're
watching


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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 01:01 PM
Response to Original message
179. ZIP CODES OF ALL SENS & REPS & FREE FAX URLS
ZIP CODES & NAMES OF REPS & SENS HERE




http://www.visi.com/juan/congress /



then you can send free fax letter here:

Free Fax from ACLU site, you can copy and paste any letter (after you take out their pre-written one, and write your own comments but TAKE ACTION!

(BE SURE TO CHECK LETTER BOX INSTEAD OF E MAIL, WE DONT THINK THEY
READ EMAIL)


FREE FAX LETTER

http://www.aclu.org/Privacy/Privacy.cfm?ID=11323&c=130


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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #179
180. Pallas,
do you think it's possible that these threads have been read or looked at by Fitzgerald?



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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #180
182. KGF - dont' know - but if we can find a fax or e mail for him
we sure as hell shoudl send one of the letters at the top of
this thread.

If you find it, I'll send it.

Maybe the Chicago Justice Dept might have a listing for him
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #179
181. TOLL FREE NUMBER TO ANYONE IN CONGRESS
Edited on Mon Aug-02-04 01:12 PM by Pallas180
TOLL FREE # TO CONGRESS 1800 839 5276 - use it to tell them


what you think and what you want for this country.

and you dont want any more implementation and nullifying of the
cONSTITUTION BY THE Patriot Act

and you do want Cheney/Halliburton and Bush indicted for treason and selling WMD illegally to Iraq, Syrria, Iran, Saudi, Burma

Why are they not acting to impeach Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld
for all the treasonouse lies to Congress and AMerica?


. 1 800 839 5276 TOLL FREE TO CAPITOL HILL
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 01:21 PM
Response to Original message
183. Good morning!
I'll be in and out today. American Judas coming along slowly but surely. Hoping to have a first draft posted tomorrow.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #183
184. Hi RP - got a whole bunch of addresses for you to send letters
to:

:bounce:
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 02:18 PM
Response to Reply #184
186. Hi Pallas! I see we got Fitzgerald added to the list.
Thanks to steviet. I'm very excited about that!
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Me. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #183
190. RP...Just Curious
Is what you are doing an archive of all the research on these threads?
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 04:36 PM
Response to Reply #190
196. Hi Me!
No, it's more of a focused indictment of the Creepy Veep and his connections with the network of nuclear proliferation. I'd love to read an archive, but I wouldn't want to do it, just focusing on gathering all the info exploring this one angle is taking longer than I thought!

But I think I can promise it will be posted before the 30th anniversary of Nixon's resignation. Hopefully much sooner.
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kohodog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 03:49 PM
Response to Reply #183
192. RP, Thanks for pulling this together
There has been so much info on Kahn and all the other organizations and people I've had a hard time keeping it straight. Can't wait to see the draft!
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 04:39 PM
Response to Reply #192
197. Thanks for the encouragment, kohodog!
Yeah, that's what I'm focusing on. It's starting to come together. Hope you like it!
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 03:00 PM
Response to Original message
189. Write Congress. Write Reporters. Let them know you're livid about Fascists
running this country
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #189
191. What does OBL know about Prudential Financial that we don't?
how come he's after them?

H20 would say WHY?

so lets find out why.
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kohodog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #191
193. IMF, World Bank and the NYSE are all obvious targets.
Why Prudential, Why Citibank? Pallas, I agree with you that some of these supposed targets aren't like the other ones!
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #193
195. look at ownership, subsidiearies. directors...he has a reason
to pick them....the WTC was not just economics...I'm pretty
sure it was symbolic...Rockefeller - Tri-lateral - One World
Govt. - Bankers subjecting the countries to slavery - taking away
their empowerment...I'm pretty sure that has something to do with
it.

"cause they hate our freedom" - yeah. right.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 04:56 PM
Response to Reply #195
199. Citibank is connected with Carlyle.
If terrorists attacked Citibank, that would be like biting the hand that feeds you! But I suppose that they'll make up the lost money by the barrel when they attack Iran in response.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #199
201. RP - wonderperson! Is Citibank the old Chase Manhattan? /Rockefeller?
?
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #201
204. This is info from House of Bush House of Saud.
We've got to find a way to tell Craig Unger about the Plame Threads!

Sorry, I'm having trouble finding the info. All I've found is that Saudi Binladen Group banked with Citigroup. It's busy here at work, but I'll try and find more when I can.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #204
205. Here's a Citigroup-Carlyle connection: KorAm Bank
Citigroup Inc. (NYSE: C)
February 22, 2004

Citigroup to Acquire KorAm Bank for KRW 3.18 Trillion ($2.73 Billion)*

Seoul, Korea and New York, NY Citigroup (NYSE: C) and KorAm Bank (KSE: 016830.KS) today announced that they, together with an investor consortium led by The Carlyle Group and JP Morgan Corsair II, have signed an agreement for the acquisition of KorAm by Citigroup. The terms of the transaction include the acquisition of the consortiums 36.6% stake in KorAm and a tender offer for up to 100% of the remaining shares at a price of KRW 15,500 per share in cash, or a total of KRW 3.18 trillion ($2.73 billion). The price per share represents a 6.7% premium over the average closing price of KorAm stock on the Korean Stock Exchange for the last 30 trading days of KRW 14,530 and a 17.2% premium over the average closing price for the past six months of KRW 13,228. The Board of Directors of Citigroup and KorAm have approved the transaction and the Board of KorAm intends to recommend that shareholders tender their shares to Citigroup. The tender offer will commence as soon as all required regulatory approvals are received, and the transaction is expected to close in the second quarter of 2004.

KorAm is the sixth largest commercial bank in Korea, with 222 domestic branches and total assets of KRW 43.0 trillion ($36.8 billion). The businesses of Citigroup and KorAm, taken together, will create the fifth largest financial business in Korea, based on revenues. Citigroup expects that the transaction would be accretive to its 2004 earnings. The transaction, including the making of the tender offer, is subject to customary conditions, including receipt of all required regulatory approvals, and the successful tender of at least 43.4% of KorAms shares so that together with the 36.6% to be acquired from the consortium, Citigroup will own at least 80% of KorAms outstanding shares.

Korea is a strategic priority for Citigroup, said Sir Deryck Maughan, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Citigroup International. The combination of KorAm and Citigroup will create a leading local bank with global capabilities. Together, we will be able to better serve our clients and contribute to Koreas growth and development. Having established ourselves in Korea in 1967, we are deeply committed to the country, which is one of the fastest growing economies in the world, with a gross domestic product of more than $500 billion and, a projected GDP growth rate of more than 6% in 2004. We see this transaction as part of a broader strategy to provide greater access to Citigroups world-class products and services in attractive and growing markets, while providing new opportunities for employees and superior performance for our shareholders.

Through this transaction, we are providing shareholders attractive value for their investment, customers convenient access to a full array of world class products and services, and employees exciting new opportunities for career development, said Yung-Ku Ha, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of KorAm. Citigroup is an ideal partner, one which is best positioned to maximize synergy between our two companies. It is the worlds premier global financial institution and a strategic investor that has an in-depth understanding of Korea. We look forward to the successful completion of this transaction and to working together with Citigroup to create what I know will be the countrys finest financial institution.

Michael ByungJu Kim, President of Carlyle Asia, said, "The KorAm management team and employees have built a world-class financial institution, creating exceptional value for its customers and shareholders. We at Carlyle, JPMorgan Corsair and the consortium are proud to have made a contribution to the development of KorAm and the banking sector in Korea."

Citigroups decision to acquire KorAm is a significant vote of confidence in the Korean economy, said D.T. Ignacio Jayanti, President of Corsair. This transaction represents a strong validation of the Carlyle-Corsair consortiums investment thesis, and speaks to the potential for private equity to play a constructive role in the restructuring of banking systems globally.




# # #
About KorAm**
KorAm has a deposit base of KRW 25 trillion ($21 billion) and local branch market share of 7.6 percent based on revenue. It services more than 6 million retail banking customers through 222 domestic branches and 471 automatic teller machines. Its client base includes approximately 10% of the affluent population of Korea. KorAms credit card operation services 3.3 million card accounts. KorAms corporate and investment banking businesses services 400 top tier local corporations and more than 5,300 small and mid-size enterprises.

About Citigroup Involvement in Korea**
Citigroup was one of the first foreign banks to establish a presence in Korea. With local assets of KRW 10.4 trillion ($8.9 billion) and KRW 355 billion ($304 million) in revenues, Citigroup Korea serves a broad base of corporate and consumer businesses. Citigroup Korea has 799 employees and 12 consumer branches in 3 cities, as well as a longstanding tradition of active community involvement and support in Korea.

About Citigroup
Citigroup (NYSE: C), the preeminent global financial services company which has 200 million customer accounts and does business in more than 100 countries, provides consumers, corporations, governments and institutions with a broad range of financial products and services, including consumer banking and credit, corporate and investment banking, insurance, securities brokerage, and asset management. Major brand names under Citigroup's trademark red umbrella include Citibank, CitiFinancial, Primerica, Smith Barney, Banamex, and Travelers Life and Annuity. Additional information may be found at www.citigroup.com .

About Carlyle
The Carlyle Group is a global private equity firm with more than $17.5 billion under management. Carlyle invests in buyouts, venture, real estate, high yield, and turnarounds in North America, Europe, and Asia. Since 1987, the firm has invested $10.4 billion of equity in 306 transactions. The Carlyle Group employs more than 500 people in 14 countries. Carlyle Asia Partners is a $750 million fund that makes management-led buyout investments in the Asia-Pacific region. Since 1999, the fund has made several major investments, including Taiwan Broadband Communications, Pacific China Department Stores and Boto International. Visit www.carlyle.com for additional information.

About Corsair
Corsair is a private equity investment partnership established in 1993 in affiliation with J.P. Morgan. The fund invests exclusively in financial institutions worldwide. Previous banking investments include Foreningssparbanken (also known as Swedbank), the largest savings bank in Scandinavia; Unibanco, the third largest Brazilian private sector bank; and Bank Handlowy, the oldest Polish banking institution which Corsair sold to Citigroup in 2000. For more information, visit www.jpmorgan.com/corsair.

Certain statements in this document are forward-looking statements within the meaning of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act. These statements are based on managements current expectations and are subject to uncertainty and changes in circumstances. Actual results may differ materially from those included in these statements due to a variety of factors. More information about these factors is contained in Citigroups filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission.

*U.S. dollar amounts based on KRW 1,167 = U.S. $1.00, the exchange rate as of February 20, 2004.

**KorAm's numbers are under Korean GAAP and Citigroup's are under U.S. GAAP.

http://www.citigroup.com/citigroup/press/2004/040222a.h...

Hmm...Carlyle and Citigroup making bucks off Korea. Wonder if Rumsfeld might be connected with this too?
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RebelYell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #205
206. You know......
older buildings are full of asbestos. If I owned a building full of asbestos, I'd have someone blow it up and collect the insurance money. But that's just my criminal mind.

Remember during 9/11 the EPA said the air was safe to breathe? Wrong......it came out last year that the air in lower Manhattan had 30 times the safe asbestos limit. Actually, I don't think any asbestos in the air is safe. The asbestos in the twin towers was covered over - not removed.

I wouldn't put anything past them.

It took me a while to catch up - great work again!
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #206
207. Hi Reb,
interesting theory. hmmmm
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RebelYell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 07:11 PM
Response to Reply #207
211. Is there a way to find out who
owns the buildings currently under terror watch? Anyone here know anything about real estate?
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 07:48 PM
Response to Reply #205
213. Well, well, well! Donald Rumsfeld connected with Citigroup!
For immediate release
Citigroup Inc, (NYSE symbol: C)
December 7, 2000
Andrea Jung Joins Salomon Smith Barney's
International Advisory Board

New York, NY - Citigroup announced today that Andrea Jung, President and Chief Executive Officer of Avon Products, Inc., has joined the International Advisory Board of Salomon Smith Barney. Avon is the world's leading direct seller of beauty and related products.

Andrea Jung was named President and Chief Executive Officer of Avon Products, Inc. (NYSE: AVP) effective November 4, 1999. She had been President and Chief Operating Officer since July 1, 1998. Jung has been a member of Avon's Board of Directors since January 1998. Since joining Avon in 1994, she held a number of positions concentrating on global marketing, research and development and strategic planning.

Ms. Jung is a graduate of Princeton University and serves on the Board of Directors of the General Electric Company and Catalyst. She is a member of the Princeton University Board of Trustees and was named one of the "50 Most Powerful Women in American Business" from 1998-2000 by Forbes magazine.

Donald Rumsfeld, Chairman of Salomon Smith Barney's International Advisory Board, stated, "We are delighted that Andrea has joined us. She will be a tremendous asset to the Board and we are looking forward to her contributions."

The International Advisory Board is comprised of a number of the world's foremost business, financial, and former government leaders. Working collaboratively, they consult with the company's Investment Banking division on strategic issues related to economics, growth, the political and social environments of principal markets and industries, and overall business development.

The Board is chaired by Mr. Rumsfeld, Chairman of Gilead Sciences, Inc. and former U.S. Secretary of Defense. Its membership includes:

Umberto Agnelli, Chairman of IFIL S.p.A.
Sir Peter Bonfield, Chief Executive of British Telecommunications plc
John L. Clendenin, former Chairman and CEO of BellSouth Corporation
Ralph S. Larsen, Chairman and CEO of Johnson & Johnson
Gran Lindahl, President and CEO of ABB Ltd.
Thomas S. Murphy, former Chairman and CEO of Capital Cities/ABC, Inc.
John S. Reed, former Chairman and Co-CEO of Citigroup Inc.
Robert E. Rubin, Member of the Office of the Chairman and Chairman of the Executive Committee of Citigroup Inc.
Dr. Eisuke Sakakibara, Professor of Keio University and former Vice Minister of Finance for International Affairs in Japan's Ministry of Finance.
Prof. Dr. Ekkehard Schulz, Chairman of the Executive Board of ThyssenKrupp AG
Morris Tabaksblat, Chairman of Reed Elsevier plc, and Former Chairman and CEO of Unilever NV
Sanford I. Weill, Chairman and CEO of Citigroup Inc.
Lorenzo Zambrano, Chairman and CEO of CEMEX, S.A. de C.V.
Alfred M. Zeien, former Chairman and CEO of The Gillette Company


The Advisory Board was formed in May 1999, and will be supplemented with additional members from other geographical areas including Asia, South America, and the emerging countries.


Citigroup's Global Corporate and Investment Bank brings together Citibank, the world's most global corporate bank, and Salomon Smith Barney, a leading global investment bank and securities brokerage firm. Together they provide complete financial solutions to corporations, governments, institutions and individuals in 100 countries. Award-winning businesses include corporate and investment banking services, investment advice, financial planning and commercial insurance products.

Citigroup (NYSE:C), the most global financial services company, provides some 100 million consumers, corporations, governments and institutions in 100 countries with a broad range of financial products and services, including consumer banking and credit, corporate and investment banking, insurance, securities brokerage and asset management. The 1998 merger of Citicorp and Travelers Group brought together such brand names as Citibank, Travelers, Salomon Smith Barney, Commercial Credit (now named CitiFinancial), and Primerica under Citigroup's trademark red umbrella. Additional information may be found at: www.Citigroup.com .

https://www.citigroupgcib.com/data/documents/press12-07...

Notice how he's referred to as a "former US Secretary of Defense". Wonder if he profits off this the same way Cheney profits off Halliburton "unexercised stock options"?
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 07:55 PM
Response to Reply #213
215. Just never know when these weasels
will show up. Still can't find a tie with Prudential tho.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #215
216. Interesting sidenote: Rumsfeld & Weill 2 of the 13 Scariest White Guys!
The 13 Scariest White Guys in America

By Don Hazen, AlterNet
May 29, 2001

Sandy Weill, Chairman of Citigroup


Greed is maybe more understandable in the world of finance. But when legendary dealmaker Sanford I. Weill, Chairman of Citigroup, bought Associates First Capital for 31 billion, he was basically saying there is no money too dirty for him. Associate First Capital is notorious in the field of predatory lending, which takes advantage of unsophisticated homeowners. It has been named in at least 700 lawsuits. As Martin Eakes, founder of Self-Help Credit Union, says, "It's simply unacceptable to have the largest bank in America take over the icon of predatory lending."


Citgroup engages in high-interest lending in low-income communities across the U.S., and has long been a target of protest because of its redlining practices. Citigroup is also financing some of today's greatest environmental horrors, like the destruction of Indonesian rain forests, the Chad-Cameroon oil pipeline and China's Three Gorges dam, which will displace two million people. "Sandy Weill is responsible for immense ecological and human disasters because Citigroup, as a huge global lender, finances so much destruction," says Shannon Wright, Communications Director at the Rain Forest Action Network.


Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense


As the bellicose head of the Defense Department, Donald Rumsfeld is in the position to do massive harm, as he aggressively pushes for a National Missile Defense (NMD) system a redux of the Star Wars boondoggle discredited way back in the Reagan days.


Let's be clear here such a missile defense system won't work, isn't needed and is hugely expensive. However, Rumsfeld needs to push it because it makes his friends and funders at Boeing, Lockheed-Martin, Raytheon, TRW and the other defense companies very happy. (Those four have contributed $7 million to both political parties, spent $32.3 million lobbying, and surprise! have received NMD contracts to the tune of $2 billion per year. Nice return on the dollar.)


But Bush and Co. want a huge new system, which would include a space-based, laser-firing satellite system. The cost: $240 billion. That's pretty expensive for something that won't make us safer but will make defense contractors rich, at the expense of seniors, education, health care, the whole nine yards.

http://www.impeach-bush-now.org/Articles/Rumsfeld/Rumsf...

I'll try to see what I can find on Prudential.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #216
217. Interesting Prudential connection with Chase.
Just looking through the history of Prudential on their site, I came across this small paragraph:

Prudential entered the 1990s with consolidated assets surpassing $100 billion. The decade also saw a changing of the guard when Arthur F. Ryan of Chase Manhattan Bank, became the first individual from outside Prudential to become chairman and chief executive officer.

http://www.prudential.com/productsAndServices/0,1474,in...

Love that Rockefeller Octopus!
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #217
221. You're good! I didn't see that.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #213
230. RP - those director names are ones to save for googling later &
also what the heck is Gilead Sciences...rummy really get around
doesn't he...what happened to that Swiss company he was CEO of

How many companies was he on at one time?
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #230
238. I think the Swiss company was ABB
Edited on Mon Aug-02-04 10:57 PM by shraby
I found Gilead Sciences and can't find Rummy though. I'll keep looking. Gilead is a Biotech firm.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 07:08 PM
Response to Reply #201
210. I think Chase and Citibank are rivals. Citibank became Citigroup in 1998.
Here's a link that had some info on it.

Both Citigroup and Chase claim aristocratic pedigrees. In 1919, Citigroup became the first bank to count $1 billion in assets andaccording to its Web sitebecame the largest commercial bank in the world a decade later. Chase topped $1 billion in 1927. The next yearor so its Web site claimsit became the biggest bank in the nation. In 1930, when Chase merged with the Equitable Trust, Winthrop Aldrichson of Sen. Nelson Aldrich and brother-in-law to John D. Rockefeller Jr.became CEO. In the postwar years, led by Aldrich and then by Cold War wise man John McCloy, Chase became the first bank to enter Germany and Japan. David Rockefeller, Aldrich's nephew, became CEO in 1960 and ran the bank until 1980. (Citi was also run by a Rockefeller in the palmy mid-century decadesCEO James Stillman Rockefeller was a cousin of David.)

Both banks combined haute banque commercial practice with a local retail franchise. But in the 1970s, as Chase foundered, Citibank, then under the leadership of Walter Wriston, ate Chase's lunch. And for much of the 1980s, Citibank ruled the roost.

But in the early '90s, when Citi was laid low by soured loans for real estate and Latin America, Chase continued to grow. It merged with Chemical in 1996 to form New York's largest bank holding company. Citibank ultimately succumbed to the wiles (and Weills) of Travelers Insurance in the groundbreaking 1998 deal that created Citigroup.

http://slate.msn.com/id/2074888/sidebar/2074892 /

So there is a Rockefeller connection, James Stillman Rockefeller, cousin of David. Not sure if there's any current Rockefeller influence.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 07:30 PM
Response to Reply #210
212. Here's a current Citigroup-Rockefeller connection.
July 03,2003
A Marriage of Like Minds: Enterprise, Rockefeller, and Fahra-Joyce Haboucha
by William Baue

Enterprise Global Socially Responsive Fund manager Fahra-Joyce Haboucha considers social and financial issues jointly and prioritizes strong governance and global research.

SocialFunds.com -- The relationship between the Enterprise Global Socially Responsive Fund (ticker: EGSAX) and its fund manager, Fahra-Joyce Haboucha, director of socially responsive investments at Rockefeller & Co., represents a marriage of like-minded philosophies. These synergies, which include the fusion of social and financial analysis, the use of a global research platform, and a long-standing emphasis on strong corporate governance, helps distinguish the fund from its peers.

snip

The fund's top three holdings include Citigroup (C), Wellpoint Health Networks (WLP), and Pfizer (PFE). Ms. Haboucha considered both Citigroup and Pfizer to be reasonably priced, financially sound, and relatively responsible socially and environmentally. She admits that the social and environmental records of these companies are not squeaky clean, but she does not necessarily expect perfection.

http://www.socialfunds.com/news/article.cgi/article1163...

Rockefeller & Co. History-

In 1882 John D. Rockefeller established an office to manage his family's assets, as well as to create and sustain wealth for future generations. The office provided investment management and financial counseling services for the Rockefellers and related organizations. Rockefeller & Co., Inc., the successor to this office, registered as an investment advisor with the Securities and Exchange Commission in 1980.



Over the years, additional services have been added, including the addition in 1985 of The Rockefeller Trust Company, a "limited purpose" trust company chartered by the New York State Banking Department. In 1994, all client services were consolidated under a reorganized Rockefeller & Co. to provide comprehensive investment and wealth management expertise to wealthy families, endowments, foundations, and not-for-profit organizations.



The organization has a wealth of experience developed over time. This breadth of experience has enabled Rockefeller & Co. to produce superior market returns through globally diversified investments in a variety of market cycles.

As an independent privately-owned firm, our energies are entirely focused on ensuring the provision of comprehensive and integrated investment and wealth management services of the highest quality.

http://www.rockco.com/default.asp
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #199
214. Can't find any tie-in
for Prudential.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #214
218. Here's another Prudential-Chase connection.
Form 8-K for PRUDENTIAL FINANCIAL INC


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

29-Jul-2004

Other Events, Financial Statements and Exhibits



ITEM 5. OTHER INFORMATION.
Prudential Financial, Inc. entered into an indenture, dated December 18, 2001,between Prudential Financial and JPMorgan Chase Bank, as trustee, assupplemented by the first supplemental indenture, dated as of December 18, 2001,pursuant to which Prudential Financial previously issued 5.34% Debentures dueNovember 15, 2006 (the "Debentures") to a Delaware trust (the "Trust") inconnection with the initial public offering of 6.75% Equity Security Units (the"Units"). A copy of each of the indenture and the first supplemental indentureis attached hereto as Exhibits 4.27 and 4.28 and is filed with reference to andhereby incorporated by reference into Prudential Financial's shelf RegistrationStatement on Form S-3 (File Nos. 333-104444, 333-104444-01, 333-104444-02).Pursuant to the terms of the Trust, Prudential Financial had dissolved the Trustand distributed the Debentures to the holder of the Units.

JPMorgan Chase Bank is the trustee under the indenture and the firstsupplemental indenture. As required by the terms of the agreements pursuant towhich the Debentures and the Units were issued at the time of PrudentialFinancial's initial public offering, Prudential Financial intends to conduct aremarketing of the Debentures under the above-noted shelf Registration Statementon Form S-3. Accordingly, JPMorgan Chase Bank has filed with the Securities andExchange Commission a Form T-1, as required by Section 305(b)(2) under the TrustIndenture Act of 1939, to qualify the indenture and the first supplementalindenture for purposes of such remarketing under such shelf RegistrationStatement. A copy of the Form T-1 is attached hereto as Exhibit 25.7 and isfiled with reference to and hereby incorporated by reference into theabove-noted shelf Registration Statement of Prudential Financial.


http://biz.yahoo.com/e/040729/pru8-k.html

I'm not a financial whiz, but "indenture" sounds like a pretty strong tie to me.
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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #218
225. Indenture:
2. A written contract or agreement; originally it was in duplicate, the two copies having correspondingly notched edges for identification.

3. a contract binding a person to work for another for a given length of time
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #225
232. meaning they were in business together..
you guys ought to start your own research firm!
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 10:47 PM
Response to Reply #232
237. I'm watching you -smile
Edited on Mon Aug-02-04 10:47 PM by Pallas180





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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 05:51 PM
Response to Original message
200. 200 Kicks to the top!
:kick:
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #200
202. OK I hear you all, but I wont be able to do #16 until later tonite
so just continue til then ok?
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milkyway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 06:04 PM
Response to Original message
203. Video clip of Wilson speaking in Boston is part of the Democracy Now! show
today. Also Robert Byrd and Lila Lipscomb are shown today.

http://www.democracynow.org/
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AlinPA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 07:04 PM
Response to Original message
208. Agree, agree,agree, but we won't hear anything until after the election.
I'm assuming the "report" will come out much later.
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Pallas180 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-02-04 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #208
209. Maybe, maybe not. That's why we're asking each person to fax at
least as many letters a day they can to each of the house reps
and senate guys.

Smack em in the face with the circumstantial evidence and leet them
dig.

The more we call and fax them (at free numbers) the more pressure
we put on them to stand up and show some guts.
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