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Brian_Expat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 06:02 AM
Original message
Why all the hatred for DFA members?
DFAers and Mr. Dean himself are supporting Kerry.

Dean went to bat against Nader (despite the accusation that those of us who supported his presidential run were all "Naderites trying to take over the party.")

Dean has been promoting Democrats in tough races all over the country that the DNC (and DLC) had given up for lost. Many of them are now pulling ahead.

If anything, it seems to me that Dean and his organization are SAVING the Democratic Party from defeat. After all the triumphalist political bullshit that certain primary campaigns carried against his supporters (including lots of longtime Democrats), it's possible they could have just quit the party altogether or voted third party.

Instead, they've recommitted to the Democratic Party and for voting (D) this November.

The only people who Dean's group should pose a threat to are Republicans (and Democrats who fear grassroots movements founded and run by people who aren't the wealthy urban elite).
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arcos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 06:16 AM
Response to Original message
1. because Clark dropped out before Dean did...
just kidding, I'm not serious so please don't flame me...

I don't know, I think some people still have a lot of resentment toward Howard Dean, for unknown reasons...
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Brian_Expat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 06:28 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. It's irrational, particularly since. . .
. . . Howard Dean is now going to bat for Kerry FAR MORE than other contenders who dropped out of the race are.

Hell, even Kerry's VP kept up his own campaign until the bitter end, long after Dean conceded and endorsed Kerry.
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JI7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 06:38 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. yes Dean is supporting Kerry but
Dean endorsed Kerry AFTER Edwards dropped out. Edwards in his concession speech gave support to Kerry that day. and maybe it was a sign of what Kerry would do in the future in the future but Kerry's victory speech made it seem as if Edwards had won more than lost.

but all the candidates said they would back whoever won the nomination and i think they all deserve credit for the work they have been doing.
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Brian_Expat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 06:40 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Here's the key. . .
but all the candidates said they would back whoever won the nomination and i think they all deserve credit for the work they have been doing

Yes, but Dean has been doing MORE work than most of the others -- and getting less credit for it. And he and his organization are getting slagged off big-time.
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arcos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 06:56 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. well, when Dean dropped out other candidates were still in the race...
when Edwards dropped out, only Kerry was left... of course he was going to endorse him. Dean waited until the nominee was obvious.
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. what about Kucinich?
"when Edwards dropped out, only Kerry was left."
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MoonGod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:04 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Kucinich gets no respect. (EOM)
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arcos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:45 AM
Response to Reply #6
15. You are right...
Edited on Sun Jul-25-04 07:49 AM by arcos
Kucinich was still a candidate then, however, mathematically Kerry had a lock on the nomination. Kucinich was no longer viable.
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TeacherCreature Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #3
11. THAT is what you are pissed about? LOL
You are pissed that Dean didn't endorse Kerry quick enough? You have to be f**king kidding me. That is the pettiest thing I have read in weeks.
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JI7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:43 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. why don't you try reading the posts
i was responding to brian's post which said dean endorsed kerry long before edwards had. i was correcting him in that he didn't endorse kerry until after. it was not an attack or a criticism it was just about the facts.

i never said i had a problem with when dean endorsed kerry. i never expected dean to or think he should have endorsed kerry until after he had the nomination locked up.
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TeacherCreature Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:48 AM
Response to Reply #13
18. I did read your post
Edited on Sun Jul-25-04 07:55 AM by TeacherCreature
It wasn't clear to me. Glad you cleared that up.
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mandyky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:14 AM
Response to Original message
8. Dean will run in 2008
Deaniacs know it and Dean haters know it. Dean haters are scared of the populist movement Dean is creating. Deaniacs, many of us, still think Dean would have made a better GE candidate than Kerry. Because Dems are so desparate to be rid of shrub they want total lockstep, Deaniacs refuse after a certain point.
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MoonGod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:22 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. Against President Kerry? (EOM)
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mandyky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:24 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Yes, unless Kerry does a REALLY good job
I think Dean might even run as an Independent.
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fujiyama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:39 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. What bullshit
Dean won't run because he's a democrat. He's given his support to Kerry and the big difference was really on the war.

It is very rare that an incumbent president has a primary challenger.

The only reason Dean were to run would be if Kerry really screws up....I don't see that happening, unless Kerry follows the PNAC playbook, goes to war with Syria, Iran, and NK, and puts a draft into place. I know some paranoid Naderites believe that's what Kerry will do, but I don't see any indication that will be the case.

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AntiCoup2K4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #12
27. "I don't see that happening, unless Kerry follows the PNAC playbook,"
I'm no "paranoid Naderite", but when PNAC'ers are writing Kerry's foreign policy, then it's not a good sign.

Looking forward to your support in 2008 :evilgrin:
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arcos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:47 AM
Response to Reply #10
17. I don't think so...
if god forbid, Kerry loses, I really want Dean to run in 2008. But if Kerry wins, I don't think there's a chance in hell Dean will run.
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Orangepeel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #10
26. nonsense. Dean is a Democrat, not an Independent.
He's made that clear many times. He won't run against President Kerry.
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mandyky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #26
28. If Dean can't change our party from within,
he might run as an Independent.
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ScreamingMeemie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #26
29. There are many people so disgusted with the two party non existant
system, that many are willing to help build a viable, strong third option.
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fujiyama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:43 AM
Response to Original message
14. Why does it seem
like this thread is deja vu?

I've seen very few posts (if any) attacking DFA. While there was a lot of bitterness during the primaries, I think most of that has faded. I think most of the posters that may have opposed Dean during the primaries will also admit he's an asset to the party.



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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:45 AM
Response to Original message
16. Dean is walking his talk
When he was ahead, during a debate, he asked if all the candidates would support the winner, and he held up both hands. He has kept his word. I think the point of Democracy for America is to make sure the Democratic Party doesn't forget its progressive wing.
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JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 08:17 AM
Response to Original message
19. Left-over fear Brian
Some here fear Dean, always have and always will.

:shrug:

Julie
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 08:44 AM
Response to Original message
20. I haven't seen any...
Edited on Sun Jul-25-04 08:44 AM by LWolf
but then, I haven't read very far this morning.

I, for one, appreciate the work Dr. Dean and his crew is doing to get Democrats elected at all levels.

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Pepperbelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 08:47 AM
Response to Original message
21. Would somebody please tell my dumb ass what ...
the hell the DFA is?
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SheilaT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 10:10 AM
Response to Reply #21
24. DFA stands for
Democracy For America. It was formerly Dean For America.

www.democracyforamerica.com
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 09:00 AM
Response to Original message
22. Replace McAuliffe with Dean...
McAuliffe needs to go...every few years he makes a brief fleeting point benefiting the dems. Dean has lionized himself in the eyes of citizen democrats and would be the lighting rod for uniting the DNC.

Please someone, make it so...
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RFKHumphreyObama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 10:10 AM
Response to Original message
23. As an avowed Kerry supporter from the beginning
I never had anything against Dean or his supporters personally. I thought that Dean was a wonderful, visionary, progressive and enlightened political figure who helped to re-energize the Democratic Party at a grassroots level and who successfully gave the status quo a much-needed shake up. Even though I thought -and still do think-that Kerry was the best candidate for the Democratic Party presidential nomination-I have never wavered in my respect and admiration for Howard Dean. He is a true visionary, a true patriot and a wonderful spokesman for progressive liberal causes. I hope he plays a significant role in the Democratic Party for years to come

And I love the way he exposed Nader for the self-righteous, sanctimonious, egotistical hypocrite that he is. YOU ROCK HOWARD
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SheilaT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
25. It is the Deaniacs
who are revitalizing the Democratic Party NOT Kerry, Kucinich, or any other supporters.

A LOT of local candidates got into politics this year because of Howard Dean, and we've remained in. I'm one of them. I worked hard for Dean, and when he was trashed by the media and was no longer a viable candidate I remained active, volunteering for some political candidates here and then getting called by the Democratic Party to run for office. I said yes.

At least four other candidates around here were Dean people to begin with. I don't know of any candidates who started as Kucinich or Kerry or Clark or any other candidate's volunteers.

I don't care to speculate if Dean will run again, but I can tell you that he consistently gets a more enthusiastic response from crowds than does Kerry these days.

Yes, the Republican Party was terrified that Dean would win the nomination. And so was the DLC, to be honest. They all want same-old same-old, and they have it.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. AMEN
Just think, what this primary season and the upcoming election would have been like if Howard Dean had not stepped onto the field. At my states convention they asked that all first time convention delegates stand. I would guess that it was in the 60-70 percent range. At least over 50 percent. We had 450 die hard Dean supportes at our state convention as delegates. 75 of them are going on as delegates to national. What other contender that did not make it through the primaries that you can thnik of in this country ever has maintaind such a huge active organization after the candidate dropped out of the race?
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SheilaT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:29 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. In early June
I went to DC for the Take Back America conference and fully half of the people there were Deaniacs. It was incredible. And I think because Dean did not get the nomination, and along the way former Dean supporters moved over to Kerry, the strength of Dean's true support is being underestimated.
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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:32 PM
Response to Original message
32. Who's going after DFA folks? (nt)
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