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Rummy is Toast. Tom Harkin calling for resignation

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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:46 AM
Original message
Rummy is Toast. Tom Harkin calling for resignation
Edited on Thu May-06-04 10:59 AM by opihimoimoi
Cover up not tolerated

Looks like Rummy the Dummys days are limited, first to swallow the sword, he gatta go, the sacrificial goat. those torture scandle calls for a HIGH UP resignation . I not sure if Rummy is enough.

International protocol will call for Bushes Head too. I think.
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:48 AM
Response to Original message
1. I kind of hope they hunker down
He's a major liability to the "re-election" effort now, I think.
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LizW Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
2. Okay with me
But I want more. Rummy already said to the press that they would have to "ask the classifier" who classified the Taguba report. Okie-dokie. Let's ask. Who classified it? Upon what orders? Who gave the orders? And most of all, did Bush know and did he agree with this?
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. Late nite TV, someone said Bush knew.
Sorry I didn't get the name. It was broadcast TV.
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Cerval Donating Member (65 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #8
15. It was General Peter Pace...
...the guy who is 2nd in command in Iraq. We need to keep this story alive or the RW is going to bury it!
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thecrow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #15
44. Here's the LINK Get the word out!
Here's the link... Get the word out!!!http://www.dod.mil/transcripts/2004/tr20040505-1427.htm...
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #8
31. in LA Times - Snotty confronted with it - no notes about W asking ?

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/iraq/la-050604r...
About that time, in January, officials said, Rumsfeld mentioned the prisoner abuse investigation to Bush at a regularly scheduled White House meeting.
At that session, White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan said Wednesday, Bush was satisfied after the defense secretary gave him "a general sense" of the allegations and assured him that "there was an investigation underway."
McClellan said that neither Bush nor White House Chief of Staff Andrew H. Card Jr. could remember the date on which Rumsfeld told the president of the allegations and the ensuing investigation. Di Rita also was unable to specify the date.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #2
13. Good point, I wonder wonder who, who wrote the cover up??
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quinnox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:50 AM
Response to Original message
3. I hope not!
It would take some pressure off Bush if Rumsfeld resigns, and I want this scandal to stay in the news as long as possible.

I think Rumsfeld is too arrogant anyway to resign.
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:50 AM
Response to Original message
4. Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rove, Rice and Powell...
...replace the whole corrupt bunch of them. They are a cancer that must be cut out!
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King_Crimson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 03:46 PM
Response to Reply #4
45. Cut out and put at the end of a rope...
like Hitler's finest were!
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BeatleBoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:50 AM
Response to Original message
5. Just heard on am radio that Rummy...
at the last minute, cancelled his planned speech today in PA (? :shrug:) (Philly? :shrug: )
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City Lights Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. He's sending wolfie.
He's gotta prepare for his appearance before Congress.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #9
19. more like a MIGRANE of the SHOCK AND AWE LEVEL
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #5
12. Hmmmm.
Maybe they're deciding to throw him to the lions?

Wow. That would be new.
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EdGy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
6. you are wrong
Bush is toast.

He is so fucking stubborn I doubt he will fire Rummy, it'll make him look "weak"...

But this is good, because that's the kind of short sighted thinking and stubbornness that is one of the major achilles heel's of this regime.

I hope Rummy stays and helps drag the whole gang down.
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othermeans Donating Member (858 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #6
11. I don't know about that
Like most dictators they tend to send out a sacrificial lamb. Look what happened to Treasury Secretary O'Neill. All he did was contradict Bush on economic policy. Now he's trying to get water for Ghana with an NGO.
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #11
33. Hi othermeans!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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othermeans Donating Member (858 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-07-04 12:32 AM
Response to Reply #33
59. Thanks its great to be with people that really love America
I mean it. You can't believe how many people in the US feel that patriotism is somehow ignoring your government's wrongs. We Demos might disagree among ourselves-but we really do love America and what she can become. Thanks again for the welcome.

"I'm not a member of any organized party. I'm a Democrat." Will Rogers
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #6
22. That would work real nice. They are in the bunker now arguing who will go
first, who will say what, and who will stay.
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stopthegop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
7. I doubt Rumsfeld will resign...
and certainly not Bush (based on current scandal...if it changes, so could any predictions)...

as to international protocol...it matters what people think of it in the US...not if other nations...if international protocol ruled...there would lots of nations with rotating-monthly leadership
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #7
21. do you think if George gave Rumsfeld a blow job
he could be impeached?
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stopthegop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #21
23. probably! eom
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wildwww2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #21
41. Not a chance. Sex scandals of the GOP are buried by Pravda.
GOPer`s are consenting adults. Us liberals on the other hand are not. We are to be prejudged,hassled,and demonized. But for the pukes. The orgy is on man. Bring your plastic sheeting your wesson oil and Unca Dicks duct tape. Because the pundits in this country would not report a word of it. Your free to do what you want if your a rich GOPer. Didn`t Janklow just murder someone with his vehicle and get only 90 days in a luxury jail? I`d have gotten life in prison.
Peace
Wildman
Al Gore is My President
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
10. Hmmm Will he write the next tell-all book?
Doubut it. He'll just find a cushy job on a corporate board somewhere and continue to pull strings along with his Carlyle Group buddies.
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mopaul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:02 AM
Response to Original message
14. nancy pelosi too
it's catchy
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revcarol Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:04 AM
Response to Original message
16. Sen. Warner thinks he's doing great.
no support for resignation from the head of the Armed Pork-Barrel Committee.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:04 AM
Response to Original message
17. Now they want Rummy to Apologize then resign or be fired
Pelosi joins the R call.

Bush is in a quandry, Press smells blood: is hot on the trail
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Cerval Donating Member (65 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:05 AM
Response to Original message
18. Bu$h is saying that...
...he wants Rumsfield to stay publicly, privately is probably another story. :evilgrin:
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. "Privately chastizing" and also "privately attending his party"
Edited on Thu May-06-04 11:10 AM by robbedvoter
deeply burried in the NYT article. No one goes.


Mr. Bush first mentioned the abuse scandal publicly last Friday in the Rose Garden, when he said he shared "deep disgust" about the photographs. That evening, he went to a party at Mr. Rumsfeld's house in the Kalorama section of Washington, where it is not known whether he and his defense secretary talked about the pictures.
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/05/06/politics/06CABI.html?...


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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #20
24. Most likely a scolding.
Bush picked his team and he gatta live with it. Even Carter had his Bert Lance.
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Bandit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:21 AM
Response to Original message
25. Extra Extra read all about it tom Harkin labeled as Enemy Combatant
Never to be heard from again. He was accused of giving aid and comfort to the enemy by questioning the Emperor
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #25
27. Extra Extra*** Rummy Hair Count Loss Goes Ballistic***
Pillow count was 12.7 per morning

Now its 76.8 every morning on his pillow.

Receding Hairline faster than a speeding Tide.

He is on the ropes and is flummoxed.
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Snellius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
26. Bush is too afraid of firing Rummy.
Afraid of Cheney. If anyone in this BFEE is pulled out, the whole fortress of lies will collapse. Fingers will be pointed and the blame will go to the top.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #26
29. One for All and All for One?? Nah, the pressure is catastrophic
Its gonna explode unless one goes.....the sacrificial Goat. They gonna try that, may take a General or 2 as well. In the end, we all hope the House Cards folds ... they were "bluffing" and they gatta go.
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chookie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
28. Rummy, as we know, is the tip of the iceberg
Rumsfeld certainly has *some* serious culpability here, and all along.

But as disturbing as it may sound, he is not the biggest SOB in this administration.

Believe it or not -- there are people in this adminstration who were capable of making Rumsfeld gag -- Most notably Wolfowitz, Perle, and also Rice and Cheney.

Rummy has more in common with Colin Powell than he does with Wolfowitz. He's been following orders to a large extent, and saying things he knew were not true, and several times leaked to the press to reveal his dilemma.

But he is old; he is white; he is a man -- and he is also merely a grey Washington man -- so he is expendable. He's got such a touchy public persona that they are hoping they can make him the scapegoat. I think Rumsfeld is so worn out with the bastards at this point that he is going to tell them, privately, to eat shit, and will resign.

Maybe he will do the right thing and go public with the wider story, and maybe he won't. You can be sure they will turn the Republican Guard on him, and he will be portrayed as an insane old man who lead the brilliant young war president astray.

Look -- they know they need to perform a blood letting to survive, and they are offering us Rumsfeld. Effectively, it's just window-dressing. They want us to THINK they've changed, when what they are really planning to do is go right on with their plan (PNAC plan), and hope we're too stupid to notice.

None of us love Rumsfeld, but I believe in the coming days, we are going to learn that he was just a player -- not one of the prime movers. When it all comes out in the wash, Rummy is going to look a hell of a lot more decent than the others -- specifically Cheney and Rice, and most infamously Wacky Wolfowitz.

(Sorry to be vicious and barbarous, but IF Wolfowitz would have perished in that RPG attack in Bagdad -- this damn war would at least accomplished *something* worthwhile.)

This whole adminstration has got to go. There is no *cancer* on this presidency -- it has been wholly malignant from Day 1.

All we are saying is give impeachment a chance.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #28
30. Luv this post chookie,
You can bet they are fighting each other right now. Bushes anger button has been ON since he saw those photos. Apparently he was given the report but since he don't read, he had to wait for the pictures I guess.

Oh well, the in fighting has begun, they will serve up lamb all in the need to avoid the CROW DISH the chefs got in the kitchen
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #30
37. he said an hour ago at his press thingy with the King...
That he did not see the photos or the report until recently. Someone is lying and me thinks it is the chimpster*.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #37
40. They forgot to put the pictures in the file for him to read
We all know he hates to READ
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loudsue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #28
35. Chookie....that isn't the case at all!
About 8 years ago now, Henry Kissinger....the doctor of death and fascism, commented that Donald Rumsfeld was the most ruthless person he had ever met. He was speaking among friends at the time, but was later quoted, asked about it on a news program, and discussed how he felt....trying to sugar coat it some, but hanging to what he had said.

Donald Rumsfeld is truly, TRULY, the top megalomaniac in this administration. He's worse that even Wolfowitz and Pearle, and worse than Cheney. He HATES Colin Powell, and thinks Powell is weak.

If HENRY KISSINGER thinks someone is the most ruthless person he's ever met....that's as scary as I want to think about without some meds.

My guess is, it was rummy's idea to use the torture rooms, and he mobilized the people necessary to oversee it.

:kick:
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. Interesting how the House of Cards unfolding much to the detriment of
Rummy and Dummy. A classic Week in the annals of America as the Wheels of Reason rolls forward and not vice versa.
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chookie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #35
39. I agree he is culpable
I also believe there is evidence that Rummy authorized the use of torture (although Cheney might have done so). Back in 2001, an "unnamed high administration official" told a reporter that the US was sending detainees to countries for questioning, who, "Let's put it this way, can be very persuasive." Torture was legal in these countries. The way in which it was phrased was classic Rumsfeld speech patterns.

Rumsfeld was also deeply involved in reorganizing the Pentagon in Nov-Dec 2001 -- moving out the military professionals who advised against going into Iraq, and replacing them with people who said Yes to whatever President Bush wanted.

I also know he has a bad rap going back decades.

I am not so confident that he is the top criminal, however. From time to time, Rummy has made statements, or leaked, that he was uncomfortable following some of the orders he was given. He also felt overwhelmed and overshadowed by the influence of Paul Wolfowitz.

I am not saying he is a "Colin Powell" or shares Powell's views on anything-- I am merely suggesting that I suspect Rummy has been following orders (like Powell) to a greater degree than we might suspect, and that he has not been a prime mover. Wolfowitz is the prime mover. Rummy is just an implementator.

Your point is well taken, and I believe you have a valid viewpoint that may well prove to be true, but I think culpability goes higher than he -- and lies more with Rice, and especially Cheney and Wolfowitz. We'll see how things play out.
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bobbieinok Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #39
43. what you say here - R's longterm bad rep/charac ter - needs emphasis
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qwertyMike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
32. ****GATE
I know the suffix "-gate" has been bandied about over every little scandal over the years.

I was a news junkie back when and I followed Watergate from the start. A little 2-bit burgulary brought Nixon down. It all started with sacfificial lambes like Erlichmann, Haldeman, then Dean, Agnew.

It was the cover-up which brought him down not the burgulary.

I smell the same here - events taking on a life of their own


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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #32
34. Would that be the TORTURE GATE???
Could very well be as C Rankin goes for the I word at the House.
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ronnykmarshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 02:26 PM
Response to Original message
38. Just called Rep. Waxman
and my Senators and asked them to call for Rummy to quit.


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ibegurpard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 03:38 PM
Response to Original message
42. I don't want him to quit.
I want the fucker to stay right where he is and those arrogant assholes to go down with him.
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calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #42
57. Yeah. Better the millstone stays around bush's neck for another six
Edited on Thu May-06-04 11:41 PM by calimary
months. What would we get in his place? (Note I said "what" and not "who.") wolfowitz? He's so pure unadulterated PNAC it's horrifying.

But, then again, consider the speculation in Talking Points Memo - where Josh Marshall muses about how bush may decide it's more grief than he wants, because a new Secretary of Defense means confirmation hearings in the Senate - which could be a big, fat headache as all this stuff gets vetted yet again and the partisan crap would be unbelievable.

TalkingPointsMemo

Besides, bush never fires anybody who screws the pooch. He only fires people for telling unfortunate truths. That would NOT include the rummy-meister. I think other posters here who point to rummy's utter arrogance are spot-on. We've certainly seen that. He'd be too proud to resign, probably regarding it as a tacit admission of guilt. And we can't have that, can we?

Let's leave him in place. I'd rather let this boil fester all summer than lance it and let it subside. He's a bigger liability to the bushies just where he is.

Rather amusing, now, too, that bush seems to have painted himself into yet another corner. There's no good way out for him on this, either. No exit strategy. No planning, because all they planned for is flowers to be thrown at them by crowds of grateful, loving, appreciative, welcoming Iraqis. Maybe that's why the torturers were unleashed - no flowers, dammit! And he, too, may view a rumsfeld resignation as a tacit admission of guilt, fault, and a side of mistakes.

Gee, bush, is this how you ran your succession of Texas oil companies (into the ground)? A truly noteworthy CEO, he is.
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Oddman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
46. Ruumy will lose his job
in NOVEMBER!!!


Im sorry . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .that we got caught!
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catmandu57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
47. I wouldn't be suprised if darth turned up dead
We know the bushies are not abouve sweeping away their troubles in this fashion. It would make things much easier if rummy were to expire, but it has to be done in a fasion to remove suspicion, no suicide for darth.
I think the moron* may be afraid of what he knows, hell, snarling dick may be shaking also, if I were rummy I'd be using whatever I have on these people.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #47
48. Like hide the info for insurance? Worst case scenario, reveal secrets from
the grave. Was Rummy, Its a no brainer.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #48
49. Latest flash:: Bush gonna ride it out with Rummy, One for all and All for
One.

Won't work for this Motely Crew.
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calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:42 PM
Response to Reply #47
58. Intriguing that you bring cheney up.
Just where IS "snarling dick" these days? Anybody heard from him lately? Sure seems awfully quiet...
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FlandersFeelds Donating Member (44 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 08:47 PM
Response to Original message
50. Next week this will be old news
One would think after all the so-called scandals that were surefire to take out the admin and fizzled the level of frenzy would be more realistic. Next week it will be something else and it just might be the great Dem hope Kerry.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #50
54. The Irish Tenors sing a song named FLANDERS FEILD
by John McDermott

Beautiful.....


Are you aware of this, gatta be, just asking, lol
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FlandersFeelds Donating Member (44 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #54
55. Oh yes...among others
in derilict sidings the poppies entwine
with cattle trucks lying in wait for the next time
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 11:20 PM
Response to Reply #55
56. Try his WALTZING MATILDA....very moving
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JimT Donating Member (111 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 08:58 PM
Response to Original message
51. they might be afraid...
I don't think they'll dump him. They might be afraid that Rums would turn on them and spill the beans. (of course, they could just ask him to resign and secretly promise him a cushy position with Haliburton and loads of $$$ to keep quiet.)
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 09:03 PM
Response to Original message
52. Hope so, Opi! Got my fingers crossed here. That the pressure will be so
great he resigns and the Chimps says: "He's a Good Man, and I hate to lose him, but he said he needed to resign for the Presidency so I need to "exshept" that..."

If Rummy goes we have a chance to expose the rest of them. If he stays I think we have a long slog.

I'm hoping for good news! Peace :-)'s
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-06-04 10:15 PM
Response to Reply #52
53. I think Rep Rangle is Correct, This is a level where the situation calls
for Big, all the way to the top, whether he knew or not, don matter.


We have Offended on a HUGE SCALE and only a top Guy stepping down to show extreme remorse/regret will suffice as a proper Apology. To not step down, is Insulting, Arrogant, and FoolHardy as it is a means to tone down the Hatred for America. Any attack here will lead to much loss in $$ not to mention lives and property.
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