the bornagains ALONE could keep bush in office in 04

[mopaul]

it's true. i saw one of the evangelical scum say it himself on the frontline show 'the jesus factor'. he actually said he had an epiphany years ago conjecturing that the christian conservative vote alone could get a man elected as president. it's true folks, and it could happen in november, cause the truly faithful are truly hypnotized.

bush has them so locked up and brainwashed, he could turn them on us liberals with a snap of his fingers.

[bryant69]

1. Yes and no

I don't think you have properly gauged the dissatisfaction with President Bush by the hardcore fundies. Sure they are with him when it comes to war; but domestically he hasn't been that great.

He doesn't like Gay marriage, but hasn't done anything about it. He voted to increase education spending, which God knows the fundamentalists don't want, he hasn't banned abortions, he hasn't done much in the culture war.

They are going to go with him over Kerry, but many of them, particularly the more extreme, aren't enthusiastic about him.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[mopaul]

3. they think bush is not right wing enough......god help us

what they really wanted was president robertson in the 80's. where the hell would we be now?

[leftyandproud]

6. don't forget...partial birth abortion ban and conservative judges

He has them in his pocket over those two issues already. Proposing the marriage ammendment has sealed the deal. They are a lost cause.

[bryant69]

18. I"m not implying they won't vote for them

Although some will go to the constitution party. But most will vote for Bush. I'm just saying they aren't enthusiastic about it; they aren't going to blindly follow Bush the way they might someone who was more along their lines

Bryant

[murielm99]

2. They could be whistling in the dark.

There are many Christians who loathe them just as much as the secular people do.

[mopaul]

4. but they are such focused and dedicated voters

they are motivated to vote, and they may be the most powerful voting block on the scene.

[Warpy]

14. Even borangains are not monolithic

I know Baptists who were "saved" a long time ago who consider themselves born again and will answer that way on polls. They may be more socially conservative than the rest of us, but they see that Bush has taken the whole thing too far. They realize he is a nutcase.

Last night's Frontline didn't mention LaHaye, the main person behind Idiot's descent into religious lunacy since he's been in office. Those people who underwent religious conversion in their youth have considered this guy and know what he is. They also know he's playing fast and loose with theology and with the bible.

Zealots are passionate people. They are loud, and always make people think their numbers are more numerous than they really are. Even among bornagains who identify themselves that way, they are not the norm. Bush may speak that bornagain language, but many of them know by his actions in office that it is not genuine, and they will vote accordingly.

[NJCher]

5. did you notice how those shots were all middle aged white men?

We tried to watch the whole thing; couldn't. My husband said I can't stand one more shot of bush.


Cher

[mopaul]

7. i didnt' see one black face during the whole show

all over 50 white men under extreme hynosis

[GreenPartyVoter]

8. Don't discount us left-leaning born-agains

There's plenty of us too, but no way will we be voting for $hrub.

Would Jesus love a liberal? You bet!
http://www.geocities.com/greenpartyvoter/liberalchristians.htm

[OpSomBlood]

9. Fundies just talk loud to hide their numbers.

We can't worry about what the 15% or so Kool-Aiders are going to do. We have to reach out to the people who never vote.

There really aren't that many hardcore bornagains, and it is remarkably easy to disprove that Bush is a "good Christian" to those who might be on the fence.

[bleedingheart]

10. I have to agree...they scream a lot so they appear to be numerous

but there really aren't a lot of the kool-aid types.

[seabeyond]

11. i dont buy it, not true

they are a small number. just making themselves look bigger than what they are

[skippysmom]

12. Sadly I think you're right

There are an awful lot of evangelicals in this country, and one of the statistics they cited is that 83% of them voted for Poppy in 1988. I'm sure you'd find similar numbers for *.

Not to mention that they seem to be forming an alliance with conservative Catholics -- something this Catholic is sad to see.

[izzie]

13. It is scary but so far the numbers do not add up.

Well do you know any of these people? And alot who live in the middle of them still vote as they wish and not for Bush. I would say they are a very powerful group but I am not sure if they have not reach their zenith.

[Shopaholic]

16. Southern Baptist here. . .

and I'm as liberal a Democrat as you'd ever want to find. My parents are too. And shock of shocks, my Aunt, who's also been a huge Repug and who is nicknamed "The Church Lady" in our family doesn't plan on voting for Bush in November. She can't stand him!

[HawkerHurricane]

15. I disagree, in part

They cannot, by themselves, decide who is President. HOWEVER, they are so numerous they can decide who is the Republican nominee.

Part of the reason the RNC went after Clinton so hard is that they made a deal with the Religious Reich in 1992 over Buchanan... "Buchanan can't win the general election, vote for Bush and he will win and we'll give you what you want".
Then Clinton won. The Reich was furious, and the RNC had to give them something to prevent them from bolting and forming their own party... they gave them a series of lies about Clinton...

(Note to the True Christians who inhabit this board: The Religious Reich are not Christians, they just say they are. I will always endeavor to keep my posts clear on the difference between the Religious Reich and Christianity)

[Luvpurp]

17. What I don't get

A Christian is a follower of Christ, meaning that they follow the teachings of Christ. What Bush policies are consistent with the teachings of Christ? The Christians that I know (granted they are no born-agains) loathe these guys because they are essentially antithetical to what being a Christian is.

[Az]

19. Whether they have the numbers to do it or not, it is their intent (quotes)

We have enough votes to run the country. And when the people say, "We've had enough," we are going to take over.
-- Pat Robertson

When I said during my presidential bid that I would only bring Christians and Jews into the government, I hit a firestorm. "What do you mean?" the media challenged me. "You're not going to bring atheists into the government? How dare you maintain that those who believe in the Judeo-Christian values are better qualified to govern America than Hindus and Muslims?" My simple answer is, "Yes, they are."
-- Pat Robertson

It's like guerrilla warfare. If you reveal your location, all it does is allow your opponent to improve his artillery bearings. It's better to move quietly, with stealth, under cover of night. You've got two choices: You can wear cammies and shimmy along on your belly, or you can put on a red coat and stand up for everyone to see. It comes down to whether you want to be the British army in the Revolutionary War or the Viet Cong. History tells us which tactic was more effective.
-- Ralph Reed

I want to be invisible. I do guerrilla warfare. I paint my face and travel at night. You don't know it's over until you're in a body bag. You don't know until election night.
-- Ralph Reed

We are now in the process of putting born-again Christians on every school board in America.... A school board with five members needs only three Christians to take complete control of a school district. You can literally own that system and control all personnel, curriculum, materials, textbooks and policies.
-- Robert L. Simonds

We'll take away their power and their money. Money comes from students. We'll break their backs by taking 24 million kids out of the public schools.
-- Robert L. Simonds

I want you to just let a wave of intolerance wash over you. I want you to let a wave of hatred wash over you. Yes, hate is good.... Our goal is a Christian nation. We have a Biblical duty, we are called by God, to conquer this country. We don't want equal time. We don't want pluralism.
-- Randall Terry

When I, or people like me, are running the country, you'd better flee, because we will find you, we will try you, and we'll execute you. I mean every word of it. I will make it part of my mission to see to it that they are tried and executed.
-- Randall Terry

What it is coming down to is who runs the country. It's us against them. It's the good guys versus the bad guys. It's the God-fearing people against the pagans, and some of the pagans are going to church.
-- Randall Terry

You better believe that I want to build a Christian nation, because the only option is a pagan nation. Not that the government can make someone a Christian by decree. A Christian nation would be defined as "We acknowledge God in our body politic, in our communities, that the God of the Bible is our God, and, we acknowledge that His law is supreme."
-- Randall Terry

[robbedvoter]

20. Unless the "born once" show up and vote

I also think that their numbers are vastly exaggerated.

[orwell]

21. Broad Brush

One of my sisters is born again and another is rather religious, although more Catholic than evangelical. Both of them detest Bush.

Maybe we shouldn't paint with such a broad brush here.

O

[Iceburg]

23. Nonsense (religion has nothing to do with it) ... it boils down to this

Those who can't read will vote for bush
Those who can't think will vote for Nader

... Kerry Wins!

[drfemoe]

22. christian conservative vote alone?

Did he notice the Supreme Court ruling in 12/2000? I guess that's the POWER OF PRAYER, eh? HA!